To put it succinctly: A thing is a think.

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 4:34 PM, david buchanan <[email protected]>wrote:

>
> John said to Mark:
> Perhaps I miss this point because I'm just SO verbally oriented, but when
> playing chess or picturing a problem in framing a house, I can see how I'm
> using a spatial reasoning that isn't dependent on words but uses abstract
> things like shapes and relations.  But even here, I'm thinking conceptually
> at least.  For a relation to exist it must involve discrete "things".  And
> that has a verbal component, even if I'm just thinking to myself, "that
> thing over there".  Does that make sense?
>
>
>
> dmb says:
>
> Yes, things and thoughts. It's hard to tell the difference. Maybe there
> isn't any difference, eh? Try this on for size, gents.
>
> From "Pragmatism and Humanism", pages 597-8:
>
> What shall we call a THING anyhow? It seems quite arbitrary, for we carve
> out everything, just as we carve out constellations, to suit our human
> purposes. For me, this whole ‘audience’ is one thing, which grows now
> restless, now attentive. I have no use at present for its individual units,
> so I don’t consider them. So of an ‘army,’ of a ‘nation.’ But in your own
> eyes, ladies and gentlemen, to call you ‘audience’ is an accidental way of
> taking you. The permanently real things for you are your individual persons.
> To an anatomist, again, those persons are but organisms, and the real things
> are the organs. Not the organs, so much as their constituent cells, say the
> histologists; not the cells, but their molecules, say in turn the
> chemists.We break the flux of sensible reality into things, then, at our
> will. We create the subjects of our true as well as of our false
> propositions.We create the predicates also. Many of the predicates of things
> express only the relations of the things to us and to our feelings. Such
> predicates of course are human additions. Caesar crossed the Rubicon, and
> was a menace to Rome’s freedom. He is also an American school-room pest,
> made into one by the reaction of our schoolboys on his writings. The added
> predicate is as true of him as the earlier ones.You see how naturally one
> comes to the humanistic principle: you can’t weed out the human
> contribution. Our nouns and adjectives are all humanized heirlooms, and in
> the theories we build them into, the inner order and arrangement is wholly
> dictated by human considerations, intellectual consistency being one of
> them. Mathematics and logic themselves are fermenting with human
> rearrangements; physics, astronomy and biology follow massive cues of
> preference. We plunge forward into the field of fresh experience with the
> beliefs our ancestors and we have made already; these determine what we
> notice; what we notice determines what we do; what we do again determines
> what we experience; so from one thing to another, altho the stubborn fact
> remains that there IS a sensible flux, what is true of it seems from first
> to last to be largely a matter of our own creation.We build the flux out
> inevitably. The great question is: does it, with our additions, rise or fall
> in value? Are the additions WORTHY or UNWORTHY?
>
>
> dmb continues:
> In Lila, Pirsig quotes the notion that "we are suspended in language" and
> in ZAMM he explains that we all inherit a conceptual reality that has
> evolved over the ages.
>
> ""In our highly complex organic state we advanced organisms respond to our
> environment with an invention of many marvelous analogues. We invent earth
> and heavens, trees, stones and oceans, gods, music, arts, language,
> philosophy, engineering, civilization and science. We call these analogues
> reality. And they are reality. We mesmerize our children in the name of
> truth into knowing that they are reality. We throw anyone who does not
> accept these analogues into an insane asylum. But that which causes us to
> invent the analogues is Quality. Quality is the continuing stimulus which
> our environment puts upon us to create the world in which we live. All of
> it. Every last bit of it." (ZAMM, p251)
> Isn't James saying the same thing when he says, "We plunge forward into the
> field of fresh experience with the beliefs our ancestors and we have made
> already; these determine what we notice; what we notice determines what we
> do; what we do again determines what we experience"? I think so.
>
>
>
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>
>
>
>
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