On Mar 16, 2011, at 4:02 PM, Dan Glover wrote: > Hello everyone > > On Wed, Mar 16, 2011 at 12:54 PM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> On Mar 16, 2011, at 12:40 PM, Dan Glover wrote: >> >>> Hello everyone >>> >>> On Wed, Mar 16, 2011 at 3:14 AM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> >> Marsha: >> That's interesting but I have a very different interpretation of a static >> pattern of value. >> To start with a pattern is not just one occurrence. It is not an >> independent event, >> but, using chair as an example, related to your past history with the >> chair-pattern; >> it also is dependent on immediate sensory experience with the chair, and >> possible >> some future expectation for this chair. > > Dan: > What chair are we talking about? Some mythical magical chair existing > in the same realm as the tree falling in the forest with no one > around? What chair?
Marsha: There is only static patterns of value and dynamic quality. For me 'chair' is a name given to an accumulation of useful value (events) that tends to persist and change in a predictable pattern. > Marsha: > Besides this, it has an interdependence with >> all other chair events both inside and outside the immediate culture and >> with the >> events across all cultures and all languages in all contexts through all >> time. >> In other words, a chair-pattern for me can best be represented by all that >> is >> opposite-from-non-chair. This would likewise hold for the justice-pattern, >> wood-pattern, leg-pattern, or a zebra-pattern. A chair-pattern event could >> not >> encompass the entire pattern, but includes only those bits and pieces that >> are >> significant to the event. > > Dan: > Well, to my mind, the MOQ states that a chair, like anything else, is > composed of patterns of value. What do you mean by > "chair-pattern-event"? I don't recognize that as a viable term within > the MOQ. Marsha: Quality is about experience, process or stream of events. I understand a pattern of value to be an accumulation of useful value (events) that tends to persist and change in a predictable pattern. >> Marsha: >> If the chair-pattern is represented only by the chair you are sitting on, >> then how >> do you recognize it as a chair? > > Dan: > You asked "How are static patterns of value "defined and discrete"? > > I used my chair as an example of a static pattern of value and how it > is defined and discrete. I didn't intend my chair to represent all > chairs... it is an analogy. I recognize it as a chair as I am immersed > in the 21st century Western culture and I know (as I assume you do > too) what an office chair is. I answered you questions to the best of > my ability within the framework of the MOQ, not from my own > perspective. Marsha: My understanding has you overlaying onto your experience the pattern of a chair which allows you to state that you recognized, within your 21 century Western culture, a chair. - You understanding of the MoQ is YOUR perspective. > On a side note, I get the feeling you are playing games here again but > I will give you the benefit of the doubt. For now. Marsha: I presented my understanding of static patterns of value. While I find your rejection interesting, it doesn't change my understanding. Thank you for the gracious "benefit of the doubt." I am NOT playing games, but presenting how I understand static patterns of value, and that is not as a discrete object, but as static patterns of value overlaid on to immediate experience. > Marsha: > Certainly not by some Platonic ideal form, or a >> master-definition found is some encyclopedia or dictionary. For me 'chair' >> is >> a name given to an accumulation of useful value (events) that tends to >> persist >> and change in a predictable pattern. > > Dan: > > I've searched my copy of LILA and found no mention of value events. I > think this is misleading and confusing. I mean events as a series comprising a process/experience. >> .Marsha: >> From my point-of-view, my interpretation makes more sense, so I guess we >> have different concepts of static patterns of value. > > Dan: > > I guess we do have different concepts, but the question is, which is > more in line with the MOQ? Marsha: That sounds like you are looking for an absolute. I am not. I think all static patterns of value, even those in the MoQ, are ever-changing and interdependent, and one might always be able to deepen one's understanding. Many thanks Dan. Regards, Marsha ___ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
