Hi Mark and all, And away we Go!
On 3/5/12 9:39 PM, "118" <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Joe, > > > Sent laboriously from an iPhone, > Mark > > On Mar 5, 2012, at 5:16 PM, Joseph Maurer <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Hi David, >> >> A logic of a metaphysics of DQ/SQ, begs the question: How can an >> indefinable DQ have meaning? > > It doesn't, we create meaning through definitions. The term undefinable is > used so we do not get stuck in the static. Nothing more in my opinion. > >> In SOM S depends on O activity in the definition in existence. S has no >> definition in existence awaiting O's behavior. > > Yes they go together in that paradigm. > >> >> Different activities determine a reality manifesting existence. Evolution, >> a definable activity in existence, is not founded on deniable faith. It >> manifests a logic of activity. > > Yes >> >> The truth of reality in logic for metaphysics is a nightmare of deniability. > > I'm not sure if I would agree. We create truth, we do not deny it. > >> The reality of evolutionary levels in differences for S's manifestations is >> deniable. It awaits an interpretation of the manifestation in action. > > Sure it can be denied through some logical construct. What lies between > subject and object is Intent. Look to intent instead of S or O. That > resolved the issue, for me. > >> Evolution is deniable. No one can give what he doesn't have. Evolution as >> the answer for levels in existence is deniable. Physical logic instead of >> indefinable metaphysics! > > Sure it can be denied, but it can also bring meaning. >> >> Pirsig tweaked S/O metaphysics by changing indescribable S to DQ, an >> indefinable reality. O as SQ remains. > > I think so, the "self" is DQ. It cannot be logically found or described, yet > it exists. >> >> DQ, indefinable reality, has a relationship to existence. DQ is not the same >> as the S of SOM which sucks existence from O. > > I think O sucks existence from S, although I would not put it that way. > >> DQ has a place in indefinable >> existence awaiting valuation not non-existence. SOM and MOQ. DQ/SQ is a >> statement of an indefinable/definable reality. >> >> A statement of metaphysics: the concept of evolution describes reality in >> existential differences as evolution in levels in existence. DQ is >> indefinable levels in existence. Indefinable not unknowable or non-existent! >> >> MOQ, Evolution is not a reality in SOM. S exists independently from O in >> reality. DQ does not depend on SQ for existence. It creates a new paradigm >> DQ/SQ where DQ is indefinable not non-existent, SQ is definable. > > Yes, by your usage of evolution. DQ does not depend on sq. >> >> Imho In MOQ different levels in reality in existence. Evolution has >> meaning. >> >> SOM differs from MOQ in using Object as enabling possibilities in a Subject >> without defining how the subject participates in evolution as a level in >> existence. > > Yes >> >> In SOM freewill, seeks another for further definition in existence. Without >> the other it is not free. It is orphaned in being removed from the >> existence in the subject and highlighted as a special function in relation >> to another instead of being the will of the subject. >> > That makes sense to me. Will is what lies between S and O. > >> In SOM, levels in evolution have no foundation in the existence of the >> subject. They only have meaning in the object and have their meaningful >> relationship to the subject through the object and evolution is meaningless. >> Metaphysics of the known also follow the existence of the subject for unique >> qualities like free will. > > I think this is the distinction between sq and DQ. The levels are a static > presentation and DQ is not dependent on them. >> >> I don't define DQ! While pondering an indefinable existing reality emotions >> shouted look at us! The best of both worlds. > > Cool, you should write poetry. > Mark >> >> Joe >> >> >> On 3/2/12 1:48 PM, "David Harding" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Furthermore, why do you see value in defining the undefinable DQ as >>> 'emotions'? >> >> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
