Just one second here. dmb is professing an idealistic view of pragmatism. He can not get away with this by contending he is simply carrying the party line in terms of philosophies. Pragmatism does not work unless one comes in with an idea of what one wants to work. That one claims to be basing ones view purely on some realm which does not exist (pure experience), is highly un-pragmatic. If indeed pragmatism is opposed to Cartesian duality, then I question the pragmatic position of such opposition. Perhaps these pragmatists are lost in the objective world of reality and have no sense of DQ.
Pragmatism is based on the experiences which we create. Experience doesn't just happen to us, especially if such experience is in the form of a thought. These experiences are far from neutral, since we are the basis for their creation. If you watch a horse run, you will notice that it runs like a horse. A pragmatist will speak from the idealism of pragmatism. There is nothing open for insight in this endeavor. They are steadfast in their belief that their belief is correct, and yet they have nothing tangible except some circular logic, and a misconception on how things work. We are the ones who make things happen, there is no "outside force" which we are monitoring. These pragmatists act as if they are somehow separated from what they experience. If you walk through a haunted house you will see goblins. Pragmatists only see what they want to see, and then claim they are learning through experience. If one develops a good jump shot in basketball he will continue to use it. If the pragmatist develops a good idea in philosophy he will continue to use it. There is nothing practical about it once they become enchanted with their pragmatism. There is no more learning at that point. These pragmatists should embrace the ideas of logical positivism, of Cartesian duality, of platonism and intellectuality, for those things work. Yet they demonstrate themselves to be highly anti-pragmatic. Unfortunately, dmb has gotten sucked into this nonsense. He has been duped by his education. He can no longer see reality since it is all filtered through dogma of one kind or another. He has never explained his position on Quality while he claims to espouse a metaphysics of such. dmb has no idea of Quality, it would seem. I have no idea how he can then claim to be conversant in a metaphysics of such. I suppose he is also very conversant on big wave surfing as well. How about it dmb? Why do you think that MoQ is the best way to describe Quality metaphysically? Give me some reasons, don't just go to your bag of quotes and pretend you are a parrot. If you are professing a metaphysics of Quality, at least pretend to know what this metaphysics is about. Quality has nothing to do with evolution, absolutely nothing! That you would mistake a model for Quality and uphold it as the best metaphysics for this purpose, based on what other people say, just tells me that you have not left the university yet. How about your own metaphysical ideas of Quality? Your honeymoon is over. I am expecting big things, not just philosophology. Anybody can do that with a Google search engine. How about some creative thinking, professor? Cheers, Mark On Sun, Nov 4, 2012 at 8:10 AM, david buchanan <[email protected]>wrote: > > > Ham said:...Pirsig (the author) dearly wants to be identified with the > pragmatism of James and the logical positivists. > > dmb says: > In both cases (for James and Pirsig), pragmatism is opposed to logical > positivism. Pragmatism is also opposed to absolute idealism, Cartesian > dualism, Platonism and vicious intellectualism. > These are just philosophological categories but it really is quite > incorrect to say that Pirsig or James want to be identified as positivists. > Positivism is the epitome of SOM, the number one exemplar of "objective" > truth and scientific amorality. > > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
