[Ron to Marsha] That limit is the good, it is Quality. Quality,use,worth,value is limit.
[Arlo] Yes, this is the point I was trying to make earlier. The "value" of a "static pattern" is the predictability/permanence. My motorcyle's value derives not from the its atoms being in flux but that its permanence enables me to engage in a wide range of activity that would NOT be possible without the 'staticness' or 'stability'. A 'word' has value only so long as it enables us to negotiate/discuss/converse, and while those meanings evolve the value is in the increased agency brought by the 'staticness'. This doesn't deny evolution, and it is not supportive of S/O primacy. [Ron] These limits are not confining they are actually liberating they allow me to break constraints. [Arlo] A much better analogy than freedom/prison is agency/structure (in general, lots of competing ideas on this). I think most structuration theorists see these two as necessarily complimentary, that is that they are not opposing forces, that agency emerges from structure, that 'constraints' are just 'limiting' but also 'liberating'. Somehow this idea has become marginally popular (derives from that SOL stuff, as DMB suggests, I'm pretty sure) that intellect/rationality/reason is something imprisoning that must be rejected. Its as if they read ZMM and saw "romantic quality" as the hero and "classic quality" as the enemy, rather than seeing the unification Pirsig was attempting. Or they read LILA and saw Lila as the hero and Phaedrus as the enemy, rather than the dialogue between them, and are stuck in Lila's assessment of Phaedrus-as-intellect as "A big phony smokestack. That's exactly what he is. He thinks he's so smart. It's all over his face. And he's not smart. He's stupid. He doesn't know anything. He doesn't even know what a hustler is. He doesn't even know how stupid he is." (LILA). Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
