Hi David,
I was thinking more of this:
Sax (1995) notes that lila is an important concept and remains part of ordinary
Hindu life. When he asked Indian people what lila meant, they would often tell
him that “God created the world in the spirit of Lila, like a child who builds
sandcastles and then unattached to his or her creation knocks it down and
builds it again” (p. 3). In Gitanjali, Tagore uses this same image adding "in
truth, in self-willed joy, there is something in common between the lila of
childhood and the works of God” (Sax, p. 3). The notion of lila is also used
to explain human suffering. Mysterious and tragic events are viewed as part of
the mysterious play of the gods. Lila reflects the spontaneous nature of the
Divine, being not entirely predictable. Sax notes that while this concept
could lead to resignation, when it is embraced, it is often regarded as
emancipatory.
( http://cosmicplay.net/Cosmic/Cosmoq/cosmiclila1.html )
Marsha:
Worlds (levels) are built like "sandcastles" and "unattached to his [RMP's]
creation knocks it down and builds it again." RMP reminds us throughout the
text, especially Chapter 5 & Chapter 32, not to become too attached to the
concepts. (Kill all intellectual patterns.) - And in the end, the letting go
of the doll through ritual, the twirling like a child, is emancipatory. But I
DO NOT think that these patterns are unimportant. Play is utterly important,
and it is not valueless. Maybe being adults we have forgotten this. Watch a
young child play. It is intense. It is important. We have forgotten. - In
spite of the false rumors, I very much appreciate static patterns. Without
them there is only a mental white noise.
Marsha
On Jun 23, 2013, at 8:31 AM, David Harding wrote:
>>>> Marsha:
>>>> What may be interesting about Lila is her *recognizing* the social level's
>>>> "naive realism" in the psychological sense: whatever people think being
>>>> what is "real" - reality. This recognition is evident In Chapter 14: "You
>>>> don't see that. It's your questions that make me who I am. If you think I
>>>> 'm an angel then that's what I am. If you think I'm a whore then that's
>>>> what I am. I'm whatever you think." It is insightful, but I doubt that
>>>> it would raise her to the level of a mystic.
>>>
>>> David:
>>> Yes - there is a difference between the insane Lila and the mystics.
>>> While, as you point out, Lila rejects cultural patterns much like a mystic
>>> - she does eventually settle into (insane) static patterns of her own while
>>> a mystic would reject all patterns including their own.
>>>
>>>> Marsha:
>>>> Perhaps if she had demonstrated this insightful understanding throughout
>>>> the book she might have qualified as a mystic, but she clearly did not.
>>>> She lapsed into pronouncing social judgements based on "whatever she
>>>> thought" quite often. If she had demonstrated a consistent non-attachment
>>>> to static patterns (killed them all), she might have risen to that of a
>>>> wise sage. There was no tragic or happy ending to the story, so we are
>>>> free to speculate, or not.
>>>
>>> David:
>>> I agree. However at the end of the book the talking doll makes it pretty
>>> clear that it's doubtful she'll ever work through these patterns and that
>>> Rigel (with his social moralist ego) has her for life.
>>>
>>
>> Marsha:
>> Yes, it doesn't look good for the Lila character. How about the episode
>> between the Captain and the talking doll - the ritual - and his twirling
>> around like a child - casting aside attachment. Freedom. I see the book,
>> LILA, representing the game of life more attuned to the Hindu Goddess as
>> presented in the website.
>>
>
> David:
> As per the website - 'Lila' is the 'spirit' of DQ -
>
> "Coomaraswamy (1941) in his article on Lila, after noting and discussing the
> pervasiveness of play, points out that the actual Sanskrit word lila is of
> post-Vedic origin. He traces lila’s roots, which he contends “must be
> related with lelay, ‘to flare’ or ‘flicker or ‘flame’ ” (p. 99) "
>
> "To support appreciation of the world in a spirit of religious wonder and to
> sustain a joy in living” (Hein, 1987, p. 551). Aurobindo (2000), in The Life
> Divine, teaches that the Divine is “a free artist” who creates real worlds
> and beings, and plays with and in souls in order to “lead them to ever higher
> levels of consciousness”
>
> This is the same sort of stuff as…
>
> ". In a Metaphysics of Quality, however, this light is important because it
> often appears associated with undefined auspiciousness, that is, with Dynamic
> Quality. It signals a Dynamic intrusion upon a static situation. When there
> is a letting go of static patterns the light occurs."
>
> "Dynamic Quality is the pre-intellectual cutting edge of reality, the source
> of all things, completely simple and always new. It was the moral force that
> had motivated the brujo in Zuni. It contains no pattern of fixed rewards and
> punishments. Its only perceived good is freedom and its only perceived evil
> is static quality itself - any pattern of one-sided fixed values that tries
> to contain and kill the ongoing free force of life."
>
> But if all we follow is Dynamic Quality creating new worlds as we go.. then
> what happens?
>
> "In the past Phasdrus' own radical bias caused him to think of Dynamic
> Quality alone and neglect static patterns of quality. Until now he had always
> felt that these static patterns were dead. They have no love. They offer no
> promise of anything. To succumb to them is to succumb to death, since that
> which does not change cannot live. But now he was beginning to see that this
> radical bias weakened his own case. Life can't exist on Dynamic Quality
> alone. It has no staying power. To cling to Dynamic Quality alone apart from
> any static patterns is to cling to chaos."
>
> So I disagree - there is more to the book LILA than the values (listed on the
> website you mentioned) of Dynamic Quality. In fact, a lot of it is about the
> importance of static values as well.. As Paul has said - try reading Chapter
> 13 only focusing on Dynamic Quality.
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