[Joe replies to Ham's definition of metaphysics]:
> How many worlds do you propose beyond the physical world? > Are you proposing relative-absolute division between physics > and metaphysics? > I accept a natural supernatural-division hence a faith based system > for the supernatural. I introduce the periodic table which proposes > only one reality of addition, no metaphysics. IMO One does not > explain everything and metaphysics is not uncreated. Neither is it > hypothetical! Like a Code of Art it is a template or law for evolution. Following the principle of Occam's razor, I see no reason to posit more than one existential reality. Also, as I explained to SA, the scope of Metaphysics "transcends" and "encompasses" experiential existence and the reality beyond. You're the first person I know who has based his philosophy on the periodic table. (Possibly you're a molecular physicist or a chemist.) In my view, all such constructs are man's attempts to prove the order of experiential existence. What man sees as a "template" for universal order or the law of evolution is no more than patterns that appeal to his intellect. [Joe]: > IMO you are using "creation" in two ways. Intuitive logic called > creativity > can only make previously unseen associations in the manifest. Creation > from the unmanifest is the subject of faith. If something is unmanifest it > is > beyond intuitive logic by definition. Dq is unmanifest in relation to > Sq-manifest. > By itself Dq is undefined. It remains undefined though present in the > order > of evolution. Dq as a template, as a law of evolution exists. If order is > created what is its creator or source? The acceptance of levels is > acknowledged as an added dimension. Evolution, dimensionality, may > mask as creation. The entire life of the earth is a dimension I cannot > experience. That dimension is beyond me and the earth has more > possibilities than I do for life. Yet the life of the planet is not > without order. > The Solar system is orderly. Why must I posit a primary source since the > order of the planet is more than I can grasp? I do not want to deny > what is closer to me to dwell on what is farther away. Is Value unmanifest? Is the fact that "dimension is beyond me and the earth has more possibilities than I do for life" not manifest? If you are aware of it, is is manifest to you. The mystery and magnificence of creation is manifest, even if you can't explain it. That's not "faith"; it's your sense of Value in what transcends your understanding. Your suggestion that ultimate reality is "farther away" is also a misconception. Space and time are the mode of experience, so that "near" and "far" are only relative precepts of your reality. Actually, I'm arguing for an "immanent reality", which puts it closer to the self than the solar system or the cat next door. [Joe]: > The beginning of multiplicity is also observation. I deny that I live > as long as the earth or the solar system lives. I agree with your first statement, but I don't understand the relevance on the "lifespan" limitation. [Joe]: > The periodic table assumes that my life and the life of the planet > are the same. Why? Because you are made of the same matter as the planet? > An extended life is simply addition or subtraction. The periodic table > does > not support dimensions. 1 is within a dimension, manifest. 0 is outside of > dimensions, yet it is meaningful as a non thing in its upholding of the > essence > and existence in a manifestation. You are talking about empirical knowledge, not manifestations. Again, the universe is not made of numbers and laws. These are constructs of the human intellect. > Value is outside of dimensions and upholds essence and existence > in a manifestation. Order comes before manifestation and value comes > before order. I do not see sufficient reason to place man in the same > order as the solar system. I don't either. So why are you doing it? > Man evolves to a different destiny from the solar system. Agreed. Yet, you don't appear to be concerned with man's destiny when you ring in the periodic table. What can the periodic table tell us about man's destiny or purpose? > Perhaps a collision with a comet broke the moon away from earth. > The Earth creates organic life as a teat for the starving moon so it > doesn’t go wandering off creating further trouble. This is supposed > to be fun! Let go! Perhaps man needs a teat for the same reason ;-) Thanks for the "fun", Joe. --Ham moq_discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
