I'm lost here; if I said that, it was an error. Empyre is 'about' culture and many other things; it's topic oriented with guest moderators and participants.
- Alan On Tue, Jun 8, 2021 at 11:44 AM Ana Valdés <[email protected]> wrote: > I was a bit puzzled when Alan wrote that -empyre a list where many of us > belong and has participated for more than ten years is about politics. Did > I misread you Alan? That’s the difficulties inherent to have English as > third language :) I feel I sometimes misses nuances and shades. > Because for me, a former political prisoner, everything is political, the > way Furtherfield was created their work to put street art and digital > creation in the first place, etc. This list is for me a political list as > -empyre. They are managed differently but for me it’s a formal difference > not a crucial one. > I should love Netbehaviour to renew itself from bottom up and find in our > own practice and work the tools for a change. But not a cosmetic change but > a change in a deep sense. > If not we risk to do what Burt Lancaster said in il Gatopardo, Lampedusas > great novel and a great movie: > “ We must change something to keep the things as they are”. > > Cheers > Ana > > > > On Tue, 8 Jun 2021 at 06:25, Alan Sondheim via NetBehaviour < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> Hi Ruth, >> >> I think you misunderstand, or I do. For me it is a Commons, absolutely, >> precisely because it's not steered by anyone. Steering is restrictive; it >> becomes something else, you're asserting power, of course, as list owners. >> It's been running fine for everyone I've talked to. I think when you say >> "feel the shape of the community" that also implies perhaps that you want a >> different sort of commons, where you alter that shape. >> >> None of us want to let it go and as far as I can tell, none of us have >> felt we couldn't post or threatened or that we needed guidance or anything >> else. There are lists that have tried that - Poetics, which ultimately >> collapsed; the old Fiction of Philosophy list which I ran and tried to >> structure, and so forth. I can find that sort of thing even on Facebook. >> >> Clearly we have different ideas of the Commons; mine is similar to >> occupy, comes from bottom up; yours is top down. I never meant to imply by >> the way that you should steer the list, just the opposite. >> It has to do with power, and clearly you and Marc have that and are >> dissatisfied with what others find valuable and enjoy, a community from the >> bottom up, and one that's pretty self-regulating. >> >> If you let it go, there's no ceremony, it's a disaster based on your >> decisions, not the members of the list. If it's that you're tired of >> running it, because of technical issues, I'm sure a small group of us could >> take that over; it's not difficult. >> >> Best, Alan, getting increasingly despondent over all of this. And now I >> have a close relative who has cancer, I might drop out. Argh. >> >> >> >> On Tue, Jun 8, 2021 at 4:57 AM Ruth Catlow <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Dear All! >>> >>> Firstly, Alan I also love your posts -the pattern which I think of as an >>> art ping, and the content (when I watch, listen, read it) is a portal into >>> your art practise which I really enjoy and value. >>> >>> I also think that Alan has a point in saying that Marc and I should >>> provide a steer as list owners. I have a few ideas that I will share at the >>> weekend (it's a hardcore project week this week for me). >>> >>> But in the meantime keeping the conversation open is allowing us to see >>> and feel the shape of the community. It has been so useful to hear from >>> Gretta, Patrick, Paul, Ana, Annie, Johannes, Erik and all. More please! We >>> also appreciate various offers from people to contribute financially to the >>> lists upkeep. >>> >>> We regard the value in this list as the strange undefined collective >>> property of everyone who has ever contributed. But as it is currently set >>> up, it is not a Commons. I personally, would like it if it were. >>> We can also consider Annie's suggestion of letting it go. But if that's >>> the way it goes (and this is not what I want) it should certainly not be >>> done casually, rather with the ceremony befitting the splendour of all that >>> has ever occurred here ; ) >>> >>> I do want to reassure you Alan, we will make no sudden moves! The whole >>> point of discussing this now is that it is not an emergency. We just need >>> to work out who "we" are and what "we" want. >>> >>> Warmly >>> Ruth >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Mon, Jun 7, 2021 at 11:48 PM Alan Sondheim via NetBehaviour < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> Hi Everyone, >>>> >>>> I think we need some guidance; both Ruth and Marc seem unhappy with >>>> Netbehaviour as it is. >>>> I'm not sure myself whether to post or not. >>>> Certainly calls could be put out to all the subscribers to indicate >>>> whether they want to continue as such or not. >>>> It's all about "as such or not" I think. Technically, Marc and Ruth are >>>> list-owners, I believe. Ultimately they're responsible for the direction of >>>> the list in the sense that any of us could be unsubscribed at the very >>>> least. >>>> There are times I've had to unsub people and that's always painful, as >>>> would be, at least for us, shutting the list down. >>>> I have no idea what to do. I find the situation hugely depressing. >>>> Netbehaviour may be derailing, certainly as a commons. And the longer this >>>> discussion is drawn out, the worse >>>> things will get, at least that's been my experience. >>>> >>>> Meanwhile I keep writing/performing/worlding, whatever I do. >>>> >>>> Best, whatever that is, >>>> >>>> Alan >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, Jun 7, 2021 at 5:57 PM Johannes Birringer < >>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hello all. shapeshifters! >>>>> >>>>> just watched Alan's video and also realized it may be the last one, as >>>>> he may not be posting his poetic writing and music here, anymore.... >>>>> so I watch it as the last one Alan! thank you.... >>>>> >>>>> The conversations about how we might shift this "net- behavior" and >>>>> become more attuned again to what Ruth and Marc may have imagined - >>>>> "a place for free and open artistic experimentation with networked >>>>> media, and community building" is very intriguing. I just reread the many >>>>> postings here, and am stimulated and confused, loving all the responses, >>>>> disagreeing with some......as it should be. I try to be short; Ruth's >>>>> parables of the forest (and our poor presence as merely "ethnographic >>>>> peculiarities") inspired me: >a campfire in some unmanaged ancient >>>>> woodland...>>......>>The woods around the campfire are full of watchers >>>>> and >>>>> listeners (who knows who??)<< >>>>> >>>>> ...the analogies resonated with me, especially over the last 14 months >>>>> in a pandemic that made me leave academia and spend more time in the >>>>> forest, recording, performing, linking up, in the valley, with my village >>>>> community, inventing new rituals, listening to others and what they >>>>> thought >>>>> the "latende Allmende" (latent commons, as Anna Tsing calls it in her book >>>>> on mushrooms and living in the ruins of capitalism) might be like. No one >>>>> knew exactly, but we talked, and took our masks off.... and walked along >>>>> the river [see pic] >>>>> >>>>> Well.. what is our "latende Allmende" going to be, with other >>>>> (younger) participants? do we know the age and gender of the members who >>>>> post here? i don't, and it never mattered, nor the the number of >>>>> subscribers ("we don't really know much about us") ? 643, 1625? 59? >>>>> is that true? >>>>> >>>>> well, if the commons are evoked, and Furherfield's new director, and >>>>> new policies or strategic aims (inclusivity, intersectionality, link to >>>>> local neighborhood) are mentioned in the organization's remit, now what >>>>> exactly do you want us to do, in our shapeshifting? Have we not actually >>>>> been engaged....learning/contributing "about what it means to aim for a >>>>> commons of diverse cultures in connected physical to digital realms. It >>>>> requires careful planning, partnership building and a lot of production >>>>> work"...... >>>>> >>>>> yes, it does. and we do. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> with warm regards >>>>> Johannes Birringer >>>>> >>>>> ________________________________________ >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> NetBehaviour mailing list >>>> [email protected] >>>> https://lists.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Ruth Catlow >>> she/her >>> Co-founder & Artistic director of Furtherfield & DECAL Decentralised >>> Arts Lab >>> +44 (0) 77370 02879 >>> >>> *I will only agree to speak at events that are racially and gender >>> balanced. >>> >>> **sending thanks >>> <https://www.ovoenergy.com/ovo-newsroom/press-releases/2019/november/think-before-you-thank-if-every-brit-sent-one-less-thank-you-email-a-day-we-would-save-16433-tonnes-of-carbon-a-year-the-same-as-81152-flights-to-madrid.html> >>> in >>> advance >>> >>> *Furtherfield *disrupts and democratises art and technology through >>> exhibitions, >>> labs & debate, for deep exploration, open tools & free thinking. >>> furtherfield.org <http://www.furtherfield.org/> >>> >>> *DECAL* Decentralised Arts Lab is an arts, blockchain & web 3.0 >>> technologies research hub >>> >>> for fairer, more dynamic & connected cultural ecologies & economies now. >>> >>> decal.is <http://www.decal.is> >>> >>> Furtherfield is a Not-for-Profit Company Limited by Guarantee >>> >>> Registered in England and Wales under the Company No.7005205. >>> >>> Registered business address: Carbon Accountancy, 80-83 Long Lane, >>> London, EC1A 9ET >>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/80-83+Long+Lane,+London,+EC1A+9ET?entry=gmail&source=g> >>> . >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> *=====================================================* >> >> *directory http://www.alansondheim.org <http://www.alansondheim.org> tel >> 718-813-3285**email sondheim ut panix.com <http://panix.com>, sondheim >> ut gmail.com <http://gmail.com>* >> *=====================================================* >> _______________________________________________ >> NetBehaviour mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://lists.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour >> > -- > https://anavaldes.wordpress.com/ > www.twitter.com/caravia158 > http://www.scoop.it/t/art-and-activism/ > http://www.scoop.it/t/food-history-and-trivia > http://www.scoop.it/t/urbanism-3-0 > > > > > <http://www.scoop.it/t/postcolonial-mind/> > > cell Sweden +4670-3213370 > cell Uruguay +598-99470758 > > > "When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with > your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you will always > long to return. > — Leonardo da Vinci > -- *=====================================================* *directory http://www.alansondheim.org <http://www.alansondheim.org> tel 718-813-3285**email sondheim ut panix.com <http://panix.com>, sondheim ut gmail.com <http://gmail.com>* *=====================================================*
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