Yeah, NN hardly invented flame wars--or litigation. -- Paul
On Fri, Sep 9, 2011 at 1:59 PM, marc garrett <[email protected]>wrote: > Hi Paul, > > I agree, NN was inventive, with various individuals using her identity - > I also enjoyed the mix of angst & philosophy etc... > > >Of course it got hard to take, and the gradually escalating feuding > >poisoned the list, in the end displacing all the mostly welcome or > >merely irritating posts. > > Well, plenty of people using their own identities can be as equally > distressing, sometimes one imagines that they may be bot themselves ;-) > > wishing you well. > > marc > > > As someone who was on the Cycling74 list for the whole sweep of NN's > > intervention, what strikes me was how variable the messages were. If > > (her) intervention had been purely an effort to spam, NN would have > > been booted immediately. But NN was inventive, frequently a very > > useful contributor, and even the spammy bits were charged with a > > degree of humor: pickled theory generated by a textbot. > > > > Of course it got hard to take, and the gradually escalating feuding > > poisoned the list, in the end displacing all the mostly welcome or > > merely irritating posts. > > > > -- Paul > > > > > > On Fri, Sep 9, 2011 at 12:34 PM, Simon Biggs <[email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > > Who was voting? There was a period, back when NN was active, when > > the Net was smaller and less commercialised. In that context a > > certain sample of users would have known NN and voted for her. > > Nowadays the net is a different universe, dominated by big > > business and government policy. It is only going to be more like > > that. It is the infrastructure of the knowledge economy - and > > government and business have a particular understanding of what > > the term economy means: making money and creating jobs/consumers. > > As I often work at the juncture of academic research (into the > > internet), government policy and commercial development it is > > clear to me that the net's future is nothing like its past - and > > the future is now. > > > > My students have little or no knowledge of the early net. They > > know it through Facebook, Twitter, blogs, BBC, apps and other > > commercial and/or custom portals. They haven't the faintest what > > The Well is, much less Nettime, Thing or 7-11. In the case of 7-11 > > you cannot teach them about it as the archives and other traces > > have been so effectively removed. Only individual artist's > > documentation exists - but that isn't the same. 7-11 was a > > creative community/happening and it would be great to present it > > as it was then, in its entirety. I only have my own archive > > (probably 25% of the material) to show them. > > > > Many of our researchers also have little knowledge of these early > > examples of net culture. Some do (the artists, media nuts, > > anthropologists, etc) but those working between academe and > > industry (which is most) simply aren't interested. They see the > > net as the saviour of TV and publishing. They recognise it is > > fundamentally different - but their response is not to consider > > cultural alternatives but to work out new business models (eg: > > social media means social gaming linked to a network TV series). > > I'm sorry it is like that, but it's how it is. At this point we > > probably need an under-net, and it is possible that list serves > > (like usenet, almost a subject for media archeology) are that. > > > > Ana is right that list serves are dying. The number of people on > > the net has exploded but the numbers using list serves have > > shrunk. Many artistic communities that once communicated via list > > serves have moved to blog, nings or Facebook groups. Google+ > > Circles, despite the failure of Google Wave, are the next > > development. Alan, you make good use of that... > > > > best > > > > Simon > > > > > > On 9 Sep 2011, at 17:48, Alan Sondheim wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > She was actually voted one of the 25 most important women on the > > Net. I > > > had some dealing with her. And everyone I knew, knew her - she > > might have > > > been better known in the US; NATO55 was in a lot of places. > > > > > > On Fri, 9 Sep 2011, Simon Biggs wrote: > > > > > >> Seems to overstate both the worth of turn of the Century > > network culture (we are talking about a few hundred people here on > > a list serve or two) and NN. More like a sub-cultural splinter > > group... Of all the people on the internet I doubt more than 0.01% > > have ever heard of NN. Hardly infamous. > > >> > > >> (but as NN is eternally prescient I am sure I will now be > > burned to a crisp ;) > > >> > > >> best > > >> > > >> Simon > > >> > > >> > > >> On 9 Sep 2011, at 14:25, marc garrett wrote: > > >> > > >>> Netochka Nezvanova. > > >>> > > >>> One of the most famous and infamous EccentricCharacters in > > >>> turn?of?the?21st Century Western artistic NetworkCulture, > Netochka > > >>> Nezvanova (aka N.N., antiorp, integer, Irena Sabine Czubera) > > remains an > > >>> enigma to many. Widely believed to be an IdentityCollective?, > > Netochka > > >>> Nezvanova is a PenName named after the title character in [an > > early > > >>> unfinished Fyodor Dostoevsky novel] whose name means "nameless > > nobody" > > >>> in Russian. The identity always presents itself as female, > > though it may > > >>> not be in reality. Despite the meaning of her moniker, N.N. > > has coveted > > >>> attention and recognition like few others on the Internet. > > >>> > > >>> http://meatballwiki.org/wiki/NetochkaNezvanova > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > >>> NetBehaviour mailing list > > >>> [email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]> > > >>> http://www.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > > >>> > > >> > > >> > > >> Simon Biggs | [email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]> | www.littlepig.org.uk > > <http://www.littlepig.org.uk> > > >> > > >> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> | Edinburgh College > > of Art | University of Edinburgh > > >> www.eca.ac.uk/circle <http://www.eca.ac.uk/circle> | > > www.elmcip.net <http://www.elmcip.net> | www.movingtargets.co.uk > > <http://www.movingtargets.co.uk> > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> NetBehaviour mailing list > > >> [email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]> > > >> http://www.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > > >> > > >> > > > > > > == > > > eyebeam: http://eyebeam.org/blogs/alansondheim/ > > > email archive http://sondheim.rupamsunyata.org/ > > > web http://www.alansondheim.org / cell 347-383-8552 > > <tel:347-383-8552> > > > music: http://www.espdisk.com/alansondheim/ > > > current text http://www.alansondheim.org/re.txt > > > == > > > _______________________________________________ > > > NetBehaviour mailing list > > > [email protected] <mailto: > [email protected]> > > > http://www.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > > > > > > > > > Simon Biggs | [email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]> | www.littlepig.org.uk > > <http://www.littlepig.org.uk> > > > > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> | Edinburgh College of > > Art | University of Edinburgh > > www.eca.ac.uk/circle <http://www.eca.ac.uk/circle> | > > www.elmcip.net <http://www.elmcip.net> | www.movingtargets.co.uk > > <http://www.movingtargets.co.uk> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > NetBehaviour mailing list > > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > > http://www.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > > > > > > > > > > -- > > ----- |(*,+,#,=)(#,=,*,+)(=,#,+,*)(+,*,=,#)| --- > > http://ignotus.com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > NetBehaviour mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://www.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > > _______________________________________________ > NetBehaviour mailing list > [email protected] > http://www.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > -- ----- |(*,+,#,=)(#,=,*,+)(=,#,+,*)(+,*,=,#)| --- http://ignotus.com
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