I say "yes" to all of this, John. So that's one vote "for." kc
On 2/12/13 5:08 PM, John Shutt wrote: > Seeing as there is some ambiguity around licensing, and a decent amount > of CC-BY-SA content on Open Library right now, should I just continue > with my project for the time being? I'm only planning to take the first > paragraphs of Wikipedia articles, not whole pages, and I would add the > appropriate linkback and license information underneath. > > I can see the advantages of releasing all data under CC0, but it would > be a shame to leave out the enormous wealth of content available under > other open licenses. The license terms would be clear to anyone who > wanted to use the descriptions, since the disclaimer would always be > included at the end, and if Open Library wanted to make the licenses > machine-readable later on, it would be easy to find all of the edits > made by my bot. > > Also keep in mind that if someone wants to write a description that's > /better/ than the Wikipedia summary, that could be licensed under CC0. > The Wikipedia summaries would only be added where nobody has written a > description yet. > > John > > On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 1:01 PM, Ben Companjen <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > I totally agree with Tom here. > > I have always believed OL data was released under CC0 (and I hope it > will (continue to) be), mostly because of the message in the edit > form. Theoretically me agreeing to share info with OL under CC0 > doesn't mean that OL must/will share it as CC0 again, but it is the > most prominent licencing agreement. Let's be clear about it, soon. > > I confess that I too have taken a bit of Wikipedia and put in an > author profile (with attribution) - I didn't copy a whole page, but > I don't know if I can call it "fair use" either. > > Ben > > > On 12 February 2013 21:07, Tom Morris <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > I was repeating CC0 without checking (partly because I thought > I'd heard that before). Actually, the edit page *DOES* say CC0 > "By saving a change to this wiki, you agree that your > contribution is given freely to the world under CC0. Yippee!" > What it should probably also say is "and you have the rights > to make this grant." However, that's in conflict with the > license statement below... > > On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 12:36 PM, Karen Coyle <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > The OL "license terms" are the IA "license terms" -- thus: > http://archive.org/about/terms.php > > > The "license" which is linked to from the site itself is at > http://openlibrary.org/developers/licensing and it says, in part: > > "The Internet Archive does not assert any new copyright or other > proprietary rights over any of the material in the Open Library > database. There may be existing rights issues on some > contributions and in some jurisdictions. " > which is, quite frankly, a huge cop out. That effectively says > that no one can use the information because you have no idea > what rights and restrictions apply. The only thing I can guess > is that they either didn't have the CC0 requirement in the early > days or they imported data of dubious provenance early on. > > The only reasonable way to run a shared database like this is > the way Wikipedia, Freebase, etc do it. That is, decide what > your license is going to be, then only accept contributions > which are acceptable under that license. People will still > break the rules, but at least you've made an effort and are covered. > > It is not CC0, because most of the info in OL is not owned > by OL/IA. > Only a rights owner can assign a CC license. > > OL already pulls in descriptions from Wikipedia and sources > them: > http://openlibrary.org/authors/OL29497A/Herman_Melville > > > That was added by hand by user Winnie > http://openlibrary.org/authors/OL29497A/Herman_Melville?m=history > > I believe that this fulfills the "attribution - share alike" > of Wikipedia. > > > I disagree because there is no requirement on downstream > consumers that they also license that text under CC-BY-SA. If > that were allowed you could do "license washing" by taking > licensed text from Wikipedia, pouring it into Open Library and > then taking the OL dump and claiming that there was no license > attached. > > Either the entire database needs a single homogeneous license > that humans can deal with or there needs to be machine readable > licensing information attached to subsets of the data. > > The "we don't know what the license is and you'll need to figure > it out on your own" is useless from the point of view of someone > who wants to reuse the information. > > Tom > > > kc > > On 2/12/13 11:16 AM, Tom Morris wrote: > > On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 1:58 AM, John Shutt > <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > > <mailto:[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>>> wrote: > > > > > > I noticed that a lot of books on Open Library don't have > > descriptions, so I've started working on NondescriptBot > > <https://github.com/pemulis/nondescript-bot>, which > would make it > > easy to pull book summaries from Wikipedia, reformat > them, and add > > them to Open Library. I haven't written any code yet > (except for the > > login, which was adapted from IdentifierBot > > > > <https://github.com/dmontalvo/IdentifierBot/blob/master/fastadder.py>), > > but you can see the basic outline in the comments > > > > <https://github.com/pemulis/nondescript-bot/blob/master/nondescriptbot.py>. > > > > Before I go any further, I want to see if anyone > knows if this bot > > would be okay from a licensing standpoint. Wikipedia > entries are > > licensed under CC-BY-SA > > > > <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Text_of_Creative_Commons_Attribution-ShareAlike_3.0_Unported_License>, > > which requires attribution, while Open Library > content is supposed > > to be licensed under CC0 > > <https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/>, > which waives > > all rights. It's trivial to put a CC-BY-SA disclaimer > at the bottom > > of a description, but I don't know if it's permitted > to add content > > to OL that falls under that license. > > > > > > No, you can't use a copyrightable amount of text which is > CC-BY-SA > > licensed on a CC0 site. Part of the license is that you > need to enforce > > it for sub-licensees & reusers, which there's no way to > do with a CC0 work. > > > > You could paraphrase or reword the description, but > that's clearly not a > > job for a bot. You could also extract a small enough > amount of text > > that it would fall under "fair use" guidelines and then > link back to > > Wikipedia for the full text. If nothing else, links to > Wikipedia would > > be useful (provided that their reliable). > > > > Assuming this bot is allowed, it would be awesome to > get advice and > > pull requests from other developers! I'm coming into > this project > > with very limited knowledge of Python, so I'm sure > there will be > > plenty of places where my code could be improved. > > > > > > I'm happy to help with Python as well as OpenLibrary or > Wikipedia APIs. > > > > Tom > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ol-tech mailing list > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > http://mail.archive.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ol-tech > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send email to > [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ol-tech mailing list > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > http://mail.archive.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ol-tech > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send email to > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ol-tech mailing list > [email protected] > http://mail.archive.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ol-tech > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send email to > [email protected] > -- Karen Coyle [email protected] http://kcoyle.net ph: 1-510-540-7596 m: 1-510-435-8234 skype: kcoylenet _______________________________________________ Ol-tech mailing list [email protected] http://mail.archive.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ol-tech To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send email to [email protected]
