+1 On Fri, Feb 15, 2013 at 8:48 AM, Karen Coyle <[email protected]> wrote:
> I say "yes" to all of this, John. So that's one vote "for." > kc > > On 2/12/13 5:08 PM, John Shutt wrote: > > Seeing as there is some ambiguity around licensing, and a decent amount > > of CC-BY-SA content on Open Library right now, should I just continue > > with my project for the time being? I'm only planning to take the first > > paragraphs of Wikipedia articles, not whole pages, and I would add the > > appropriate linkback and license information underneath. > > > > I can see the advantages of releasing all data under CC0, but it would > > be a shame to leave out the enormous wealth of content available under > > other open licenses. The license terms would be clear to anyone who > > wanted to use the descriptions, since the disclaimer would always be > > included at the end, and if Open Library wanted to make the licenses > > machine-readable later on, it would be easy to find all of the edits > > made by my bot. > > > > Also keep in mind that if someone wants to write a description that's > > /better/ than the Wikipedia summary, that could be licensed under CC0. > > The Wikipedia summaries would only be added where nobody has written a > > description yet. > > > > John > > > > On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 1:01 PM, Ben Companjen <[email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > > I totally agree with Tom here. > > > > I have always believed OL data was released under CC0 (and I hope it > > will (continue to) be), mostly because of the message in the edit > > form. Theoretically me agreeing to share info with OL under CC0 > > doesn't mean that OL must/will share it as CC0 again, but it is the > > most prominent licencing agreement. Let's be clear about it, soon. > > > > I confess that I too have taken a bit of Wikipedia and put in an > > author profile (with attribution) - I didn't copy a whole page, but > > I don't know if I can call it "fair use" either. > > > > Ben > > > > > > On 12 February 2013 21:07, Tom Morris <[email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > > I was repeating CC0 without checking (partly because I thought > > I'd heard that before). Actually, the edit page *DOES* say CC0 > > "By saving a change to this wiki, you agree that your > > contribution is given freely to the world under CC0. Yippee!" > > What it should probably also say is "and you have the rights > > to make this grant." However, that's in conflict with the > > license statement below... > > > > On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 12:36 PM, Karen Coyle <[email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > > > > The OL "license terms" are the IA "license terms" -- thus: > > http://archive.org/about/terms.php > > > > > > The "license" which is linked to from the site itself is at > > http://openlibrary.org/developers/licensing and it says, in > part: > > > > "The Internet Archive does not assert any new copyright or other > > proprietary rights over any of the material in the Open Library > > database. There may be existing rights issues on some > > contributions and in some jurisdictions. " > > which is, quite frankly, a huge cop out. That effectively says > > that no one can use the information because you have no idea > > what rights and restrictions apply. The only thing I can guess > > is that they either didn't have the CC0 requirement in the early > > days or they imported data of dubious provenance early on. > > > > The only reasonable way to run a shared database like this is > > the way Wikipedia, Freebase, etc do it. That is, decide what > > your license is going to be, then only accept contributions > > which are acceptable under that license. People will still > > break the rules, but at least you've made an effort and are > covered. > > > > It is not CC0, because most of the info in OL is not owned > > by OL/IA. > > Only a rights owner can assign a CC license. > > > > OL already pulls in descriptions from Wikipedia and sources > > them: > > http://openlibrary.org/authors/OL29497A/Herman_Melville > > > > > > That was added by hand by user Winnie > > > http://openlibrary.org/authors/OL29497A/Herman_Melville?m=history > > > > I believe that this fulfills the "attribution - share alike" > > of Wikipedia. > > > > > > I disagree because there is no requirement on downstream > > consumers that they also license that text under CC-BY-SA. If > > that were allowed you could do "license washing" by taking > > licensed text from Wikipedia, pouring it into Open Library and > > then taking the OL dump and claiming that there was no license > > attached. > > > > Either the entire database needs a single homogeneous license > > that humans can deal with or there needs to be machine readable > > licensing information attached to subsets of the data. > > > > The "we don't know what the license is and you'll need to figure > > it out on your own" is useless from the point of view of someone > > who wants to reuse the information. > > > > Tom > > > > > > kc > > > > On 2/12/13 11:16 AM, Tom Morris wrote: > > > On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 1:58 AM, John Shutt > > <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > > > <mailto:[email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > I noticed that a lot of books on Open Library don't > have > > > descriptions, so I've started working on > NondescriptBot > > > <https://github.com/pemulis/nondescript-bot>, which > > would make it > > > easy to pull book summaries from Wikipedia, reformat > > them, and add > > > them to Open Library. I haven't written any code yet > > (except for the > > > login, which was adapted from IdentifierBot > > > > > < > https://github.com/dmontalvo/IdentifierBot/blob/master/fastadder.py>), > > > but you can see the basic outline in the comments > > > > > < > https://github.com/pemulis/nondescript-bot/blob/master/nondescriptbot.py>. > > > > > > Before I go any further, I want to see if anyone > > knows if this bot > > > would be okay from a licensing standpoint. Wikipedia > > entries are > > > licensed under CC-BY-SA > > > > > < > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Text_of_Creative_Commons_Attribution-ShareAlike_3.0_Unported_License > >, > > > which requires attribution, while Open Library > > content is supposed > > > to be licensed under CC0 > > > <https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/>, > > which waives > > > all rights. It's trivial to put a CC-BY-SA disclaimer > > at the bottom > > > of a description, but I don't know if it's permitted > > to add content > > > to OL that falls under that license. > > > > > > > > > No, you can't use a copyrightable amount of text which is > > CC-BY-SA > > > licensed on a CC0 site. Part of the license is that you > > need to enforce > > > it for sub-licensees & reusers, which there's no way to > > do with a CC0 work. > > > > > > You could paraphrase or reword the description, but > > that's clearly not a > > > job for a bot. You could also extract a small enough > > amount of text > > > that it would fall under "fair use" guidelines and then > > link back to > > > Wikipedia for the full text. If nothing else, links to > > Wikipedia would > > > be useful (provided that their reliable). > > > > > > Assuming this bot is allowed, it would be awesome to > > get advice and > > > pull requests from other developers! I'm coming into > > this project > > > with very limited knowledge of Python, so I'm sure > > there will be > > > plenty of places where my code could be improved. > > > > > > > > > I'm happy to help with Python as well as OpenLibrary or > > Wikipedia APIs. > > > > > > Tom > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ol-tech mailing list > > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > > http://mail.archive.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ol-tech > > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send email to > > [email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]> > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ol-tech mailing list > > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > > http://mail.archive.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ol-tech > > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send email to > > [email protected] <mailto: > [email protected]> > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ol-tech mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://mail.archive.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ol-tech > > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send email to > [email protected] > > > > -- > Karen Coyle > [email protected] http://kcoyle.net > ph: 1-510-540-7596 > m: 1-510-435-8234 > skype: kcoylenet > _______________________________________________ > Ol-tech mailing list > [email protected] > http://mail.archive.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ol-tech > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send email to > [email protected] > -- -Tom Johnson
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