Art Tevs wrote:
mgb_osg wrote:
Except you can't edit it or create an account on it.
And the wiki link takes you to the front page of the site
Guys, please, don't go offtopic :) Yes, there is a wiki page, however a lot of
new users, which are active on the ML or forum, doesn't read the wikis well as
Gordon wrote already.
What we need is a solution for that problem. I wouldn't like to cutoff forum,
and I think also no of the ~300 users of the forum would also like to make so.
Yes, signal to noise ratio on forums is more then on pure ML only. However, as
some of you has already stated out, this is more or less a social problem then
the engineering one. However, in order to make it better, we require some
strict rules/filters etc for a proper etiquette.
So, what forum moderators could do is to
1. filter out users, with non-appropriate real names - what do we meen by non appropriate names? Is only a first name already appropriate? How about users who would like to keep some kind of anonymization, by using only the first name. Are names with two letters ok, as used by our asian friends, i.e. Li, Xi, ... ? There was already a thread about that, but at the end there was no real, concrete answer to this!
2. Force to use some kind of template, when posting a reply or new topic. This
is already in use and is sometimes used by the users. Template is set as
default message, when posting something. So any user, who see this, should
understand what is this good for.
3. Should user's reply always include a quote of the previous message? I do not
really like such things, because they unnecessary pollute the threads. Yeah,
there is even a pollution from some of the email clients there, which do quote
the message in very strange manner. Which makes the reading very hard. So this
is not only a problem of forum users.
4. Should users be forced to have a signature, which describes him/her somehow
or just have some appropriate name in the signature. What about users which are
using ML only and do not have signatures? Do we also exclude them from the
community?
And please guys, do also think about that not only forum users are responsible
for bad etiquette in our community. What to do with such ML users? I agree with
and understand Robert, however, Robert, you should also understand, that some
of the things just cannot be solved in a programmer way. There are people who
just not able to follow very simple rules and we shouldn't close our community
also to them, I think ;)
One thing keeps coming up... technology will not solve this problem.
On other mailing lists/forums this has been dealt with by aggressive
moderation. In those cases, my first four or five posts always went
into the moderation queue until a moderator let them through. After the
moderators see enough posts from someone to figure out they aren't a
chuckle-head then they get unmoderated access.
It can be expensive in terms of human expense but it definitely keeps
the noise down. Perhaps some group of volunteers who care about
Robert's sanity and keeping the mailing list and forum linked can
volunteer as noob monitors.
I suppose an alternative is to let the readers be selective by marking
clearly in the subject if the message is from the forum. If a thread
gets a lot of posts then it will become more interesting to those who
might otherwise ignore a "[forum]" message.
<shrug> Noob content moderation is still the only truly effective way
if the other issues can be worked out.
-Paul
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