On 2008-Nov-10, at 04:16, Lawrence Sica wrote: > > On Nov 9, 2008, at 10:59 PM, David Cake wrote: > >> At 10:59 AM +0000 8/11/08, Stefano Mori wrote: >>> On 2008-Nov-08, at 03:49, David Cake wrote: >>> >>>> Disliking people for their opinions is not the same as >>>> disliking them for their culture. >>> >>> If I wasn't clear, I think we're agreeing. >> >> No, I don't think we are. Your post implied that >> >>> Although minor caveat, I >>> can dislike certain cultures altogether without it being >>> discrimination, eg. fundie bible rednecks. >> >> See, we don't agree. I think a fundie bible redkneck has to >> actually demonstrate being an objectionable arsehole, just different. >> I certainly think some fundies are decent people, some bible >> believers are decent people, some redknecks are decent people. >> Of course, I'd probably find myself on a different side of >> the political fence on just about everything, but there are certainly >> issues where I could imagine end up being on the same side as well. > > This all assumes that being discriminating is a bad thing. Regarding > fundies, I've met a few. I even worked for one for about three > months. They tend to be assholes by their very nature. You also > don't need to like someone to be aligned on various issues. Liking > has nothing to do with it, it's what is needed at the moment. Many > of these right wing nutosphere extreme types are now claiming that > Obama is not a citizen, or not really black enough to be black. It's > pretty damn stupid and an attempt to de-legitimize what happened on > Nov. 4th.
Well David, I wrote that I could love these people in my heart, but I wouldn't go to their parties. So whilst I can love say, the whites of South Africa who as a culture were racist, or I can love in my heart the tribal kings who pick for themselves a new wife every year, I personally don't like those cultures, and I don't want anything to do with them. Whilst they are not what I'd call objectionable assholes, they are all forming a culture that I really can't stand. And also, they are human beings so they intrinsically deserve love. See the difference? Otherwise like Lawrence says we get into the dilemma that we have to describe a racist apartheid supporter as a descent person. In South Africa I met many people who were descent in the sense that they wanted good things for their family, they helped their community, they prided themselves on sporting achievements and teamwork, and so on-- they were also supporters of a racist system; they didn't want it to end! The culture was asshole by nature. Does supporting a racist system make you descent? Hell no. There is this problem in postmodern academia where it is verboten to label people, and verboten to have judgements about cultures. It is too much, they freak out and think you're being a colonialist or a racist. Stefano _______________________________________________ OSX-Nutters mailing list | [email protected] http://lists.tit-wank.com/mailman/listinfo/osx-nutters List hosted at http://cat5.org/
