" Ifeel that it would be the midwives responsibility to help the
family in this sort of case which would involve some assistance with the
toddler regardless if they had planned to have him there or not."
You know, I find this statement REALLY scary. I dont mean to be picky (
except I am,) and I'm certainly not directing my thoughts at Rhonda ( although
it seems like it), but I really worry about this attitude that seems to be
developing within maternity units. And propagated by misguided managers who
think it's good for business .
I've 'heard' this over and over in the past few years. Not just
verbally, but by suggestion or presumption, or by the idea that midwives are
caring for ' families'. How much more of a load can we hospital midwives
carry? We have to worry about the woman, about the woman being swallowed
by technology and protocol, by corporate management and crazy consumer ideals (
like it being okay to be too posh to push). We're being swallowed by paper work,
doubled up with computer programs and bloody machines everywhere , and somewhere
in the middle of that we're trying desperately to help a woman and her
partner find meaning in their birth.
I said before that I love having children at a birth and I will do
everything that I can to make the little one feel part of the
party, but suggesting that we are responsible for them is just too much.
Rhonda, I know entirely what you are getting at, there are many families I have
met who have brought kids in because they have no support mechanism, and that's
a sad thing in itself. But I dont want to be responsible for the child. I want
to be with the woman. I want to worry about her, and
her only, because if I get it wrong in the hospital system my arse is on the
line.
Oh how I wish I was a homebirthing midwife. It seems a whole lot more
manageable and satisfying.
Robin
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, November 27, 2002 1:34
AM
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: [Children
Present at Births)
Sorry I was only quoting what she had said - 'nurses or nursing
staff did not help her with the tot.
And gee - what was she meant to do? Any ideas! Living
about 3 hours drive away from her parents who were driving down to
help she had 3 close back up child minders and her nighbour had
offered - it was her second child of the 4 so she only had one 2 yr old
and all 3 people were unreachable and the neighbour was out. I
guess she could have left him in the car - perhaps a roasted dead 2 yr
old would be less trouble for the staff.
I feel that it would be the midwives responsibility to help the
family in this sort of case which would involve some assistance
with the toddler regardless if they had planned to have him there or
not.
-------Original
Message-------
Date: Tuesday,
November 26, 2002 23:47:58
Subject: RE:
[ozmidwifery] Re: [Children Present at Births)
Please midwives not nurses, nursing
staff. THE MIDWIFE IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE SAFETY AND WELLBEING OF
MOTHER AND BABY. If anything goes wrong she is responsible, and
ends up in court, and has to live with it. Distractions such
as toddlers running around can affect everyone present. I once cared for
a family where the 3 year old was busy under the bed. I was scared
of him hurting himself and or dismantling the bed [I have one
myself that could dismantle anything with his busy little fingers]. I
agree, a well prepared, lovingly supervised tot is a delight, and I too
love the older children to be involved. The question of the lights
wouldn't have bothered me, I prefer them off. Who was minding the
other kids?
Maureen.
Dear robin,
I can understand this attitude but when the parents have
made every effort to get help and have been unable to contact
anyone (just bad timing rather than bad management) you would
expect some understanding and support from the nursing staff -
not like she could just put off her labour until the babysitter
came home. She was made to feel that she was not meant to
have him there etc as she had not planned it she was also
feeling that he was not meant to be there which made her
uncomfortable.
Also it does not take much effort to help especially with
this woman who basically popped out all of her four boys without
any assistance or complications. I don't know why she went
to the hospital - personally.
4 hours being her longest
labour. No tears, no other complications at all except an
unattended 2yr old who found the light switch.
I did say to her if that was her only complaint out of 4
hospital births then she had "nothing" to complain about!
LOL
Rhonda.
If that was the worst thing to happen to all women we would
all be laughing!
-------Original Message-------
Date: Monday,
November 25, 2002 19:35:40
Subject: Re:
[ozmidwifery] Re: [Children Present at Births)
Rhonda,
with all due respect for your friend, unattended children
at a hospital birth can very stressful for the staff. A lot of
staff will take the attitude that they're not required to look
after the child and wont make an effort. A lot of staff
will get very anxious that such a little one can cause discord
in the delivery room. It's always a problem when parents bring
children in when there's no special support person for child
exclusively. It's not that they're not wanted, far from it, it
just alters the flow of attention off the mother, and that's
always difficult when a midwife is trying to care for the
mother's needs first.
Having said that, I LOVE having kids in, it adds an extra
special dimension to the labour, and I particularly love
having older children with whom you can talk and discuss things
with. The look on their faces is simply fabulous as they take in
an adult version of real life.
Robin
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November
25, 2002 5:46 PM
Subject: RE:
[ozmidwifery] Re: [Children Present at Births)
This reminded me of a woman I know who had not
intended her 2yr old son to be at the birth of her
second child.
When she went into labour she could not get hold of
her back up child care.
So they went to the hospital and hubby had the 2yr
old - trying to call for someone to help.
To cut it short - a fast labour 21/2 hrs with 2 yr
old running about delivery room - turning the lights off
and on while baby was born.
She was shocked that the nurses didn't even assist
with loking after him.
This was about 11 yrs ago but she still
laughs about yeling at her son to "turn the light back
on" between pushing.
He was totally unprepared and a little too
young to be unattended while Dad helped her.
Rhonda
-------Original
Message-------
Date:
Monday, November 25, 2002 14:39:46
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: [Children
Present at Births)
We planned on having out two sons
present at the birth at home of number three, boys
were 3 1/2years and just under two. I showed them the
video of number two being born, water birh at home,
we watched it lots and also some other videos our
midwife lent us. I told them about the noise I might
make and about how not to talk when I was
concentrating on the baby coming out. Likened it to
having to concentrate when driving the car and looking
for a carpark, can't talk much then either. I told
them it might hurt me, but it was a special hurt just
for helping babies to come out. I told them it had to
come out between my legs, a special whole that only
mummies have, boys don't have one. Daddy would be
rubbing my back and helping me and the
baby. Importantly you need to arrange a person/s for
the children, someone they trust and they need to
support your philosophies of childbirth, you
don't want their fear coming into your birth. My
husband wasn't as keen as I was, but he agreed to
take it as it came. I also told them that I might want
to be on my own and they may have to go for a walk or
to grandma's. I acknowledged that this could upset
them and hence affect my labour, but figured I would
allow half an hour extra in labour for this to be
worked through(not scientifically based).Birth can
take a while so children will probably want other
things to do. You have to accept that may not even
like to be there at the time, nothing is set in
concrete. It helps if they are involved with the
pregnancy, attending appointments if in hospital or
helping the midwife if at home. Kids just love the tools
of a midwife, fundal measurements might be a bit out
though if they help. Some good books are "Having a
Baby" by Jenni Overend and also the writer of "Maisie
Mouse" series has one about introducing a new sibling
etc, (sorry don't know the name). Lots of talking,
my youngest wasn't that interested, but the older boy
new all about the placenta and unbilical cord, he
loved the blood and mess. After all my education,
baby decided to enter the world in the middle of
the night and the boys slept right through it all. We
woke the eldest up a couple of hours later to help
cut the cord. Little one didn't wake til usual time.
It was a fast and demanding labour so it was appropriate
that the boys weren't there, I believe I wouldn't
have coped as well, things happen for a reason. My
oldest, now 4 1/4 years thinks I should have another
baby so as our midwife can visit us again and so as
he can be awake to see the birth this time. I love
this, but dad's not to keen. He offered to pay the
midwife just to visit, no baby.
So I don't
think it matters how old other children are, just
prepare them as best you can for the birth and enjoy
the time.
Cheers Megan.
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