Paul, your discussion wasn't civil it was condescending. I made a
comment, you saw fit to correct me twice, repeating yourself as if it
were knowledge from on high,. on cars I have or more properly had,
intimate knowledge of from having disassembled large parts of them. I'm
not angered, I'm annoyed, you don't want to deal with me when I'm angry.
I don't deny your knowledge of automobiles, yet you seem to deny my
experience. It is mine, it was hard won. I've stripped out my share of
spark plug sockets, on soft aluminum heads. Eevery time you do that, it
makes you want to kick yourself. Well at least it makes me want to kick
myself. That, makes me angry.
paul stenquist wrote:
I find it amusing that a civil discussion leaves you so distraught.
Anger management is perhaps in order.
Paul
On Aug 26, 2009, at 12:00 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:
Paul, Have a pissing match with somebody else. I worked on them I
restored them, nothing I have said has contradicted any of the things
you've posted and I dare say that someone, me, who tore down and
rebuilt a couple of four cylinder air cooled power plants, and helped
"drop" and re-install the the engines on a couple of Porsche 911's
and a 912, in trade for brazing work on my personal '72 Geha, (as
well as the "droping" engine on a 356c, I sometimes wonder it that
job ever got finished, but that;s another story), knows something
about the interchangeability of parts between the various models. I
didn't mention the year that the 911 geometry changed but I figured
if you knew anything about them it went without saying. It was a
long time ago. So long ago that it was still possible for a starving
graduate student to dream of owning a late model good condition
Porsche. You are not the only automotive expert on this list. I
don't know much about Detroit Iron, it never much interested me. But
air cooled little Nazi mobiles, I know. I now invoke Godwin's law on
myself and am exiting this thread.
Paul Stenquist wrote:
It wasn't until the 1969 introduction of the B Series 911 that the
geometry of the car changed from that of the early VW bug. The
drivetrain configuration of the first 911 was identical to the 356
that preceded it save for the two extra cylinders. The 912, with a
four banger, was basically a reskined 356. The rear engine and nasty
weight distribution helped make the cars a handful, but the swing
axle rear suspension and the violent camber changes it introduced in
cornering, made them deadly. Fun, but deadly.
Paul
On Aug 26, 2009, at 8:44 AM, P. J. Alling wrote:
ane the first rear engine Porsches were very dangerous cars. If
you removed the spare tire from a VW type 1, you could do wheelies
with a stock 1600cc engine, more than enough to get you in a lot of
trouble. Put a bigger engine in the back, think about it, same
effect. Later Porschs were more or less immune from that problem,
(and I say more or less for a reason, though it was still probably
advisable to leave the spare tire under the hood while driving). I
worked on these cars I hopped up these cars, a Karmen, with an
1800cc, plus a little, was my daily driver for four years. The
911 changed the geometry of the engine and transmission. It didn't
just hang out behind the rear axial, the way it did on a VW type 1
and the Porsche Speedsters, etc.
paul stenquist wrote:
Actually, the engine in the VW is in the same place as the
Porsches relative to the rear axle, and the first rear-engined
Porsches were basically just VWs.
Paul
On Aug 26, 2009, at 1:07 AM, P. J. Alling wrote:
That only works in a Porsche because it's so well balanced.
Don't even try that in an old VW with an over sized engine. With
the entire engine hanging out behind the rear wheels you'll find
out the hard way that it doesn't quite work.
Joseph McAllister wrote:
On Aug 25, 2009, at 20:38 , paul stenquist wrote:
My most critical moment came at Lime Rock where I got a 911
Turbo pointing about 90 degrees off course in the first tight
turn after the end of the straight sweeper. I narrowly saved
it, but the Porsche PR guys weren't impressed.
As you probably know by now, with powerful rear engined cars,
the instinct to get off the gas when things go wrong is the
incorrect thing to do. If the rear end starts to come around on
you, Punch It! Putting the power down transfers the weight to
the rear wheels, making them stick better.
In my mid-engined Porsche, it helped to punch it, but usually
not enough power to pull it off unless you punched it just
before you would have become aware it was going to spin. In
other words, finish your braking before you turn in. Have the
power on as you turn into the corner.
Joseph McAllister
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or drinking; he can ruin himself with gambling. If he does he is
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he may not, he is not a free man any more than a dog.
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