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}John, list: Thanks very much for your post; you seem to understand
quite well what I am pointing out in my focus on 'morphology'
Yes - I agree; the Type is the abstract mediation, operating as that
law/habit....
So-, an input of chemicals will be mediated/transformed by the
laws/Type...into a specific/interpreted set of molecules.
Both the input/mark and the interpreted result are spatiotemporal
and existentially physical.
NO human mind is involved.
And yes, yes, the meaning/Type definitely evolves, adapts, grows
over time. And can split into subsets/Types to enable more complex
adaptation.
As for societies, I view them as compositions of matter [made up of
ecological biomes and population size and economic mode], held
together by conceptual Thirdness. But I think all three categories
are involved..I won't bother the list with these ideas.
Edwina
On Tue 10/04/18 3:46 PM , John F Sowa [email protected] sent:
On 4/10/2018 12:33 PM, Edwina Taborsky wrote:
> I... view 'the Sign' not as an intellectual construct but as
> an actual morphological unit, as an existential spatiotemporal
> unit of matter, formed by Mind, existent within constant relations
> with other Signs/morphological units. So, for me, this Sign is
> itself existential as a crystal, a rock, a spider, a plant, a
> word..and even, a society.
For the basic triad of mark (or tone)/token/type, the mark or tone
is always physical. As an interpreted mark, the token is also
physical,
and the type is some abstract mediation (law, habit...).
From CP 2.302:
> Symbols grow. They come into being by development out of other
signs,
> particularly from icons, or from mixed signs partaking of the
nature
> of icons and symbols. We think only in signs. These mental signs
are
> of mixed nature; the symbol-parts of them are called concepts. If
a
> man makes a new symbol, it is by thoughts involving concepts. So
it
> is only out of symbols that a new symbol can grow. Omne symbolum
de
> symbolo. A symbol, once in being, spreads among the peoples. In
use
> and in experience, its meaning grows. Such words as force, law,
wealth,
> marriage, bear for us very different meanings from those they bore
> to our barbarous ancestors.
The original mark (such as a representation of an icon or a mixture
of letters or phonemes) is something physical. The tokens, which
are marks that have been interpreted by the type, are also physical.
But the meaning (type) grows over time.
For the examples above, I can accept "a crystal, a rock, a spider,
a plant, a word" as sinsigns that I could recognize and name. But
I doubt that I have ever seen a "society".
I believe that societies exist, but I would treat them as roles
that are defined by some kind of Thirdness. For example, you
can recognize a cat just by looking at it. But you can't tell
whether it's a pet or a stray without determining how it's
related to some people.
John
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