On Tue, Sep 13, 2016 at 10:38 AM, Paul Jones <pmjone...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Sep 12, 2016, at 11:32, Pedro Cordeiro <pedronar...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Paul, the role of a secretary is well described here, as I'm sure you > are aware: http://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/membership/#fig-secretary. > > Yes, it's *described* there, but nobody seems to be able to say what > *kind* of secretary is described. Based on the ZendCon meeting summary (the > meeting at which the idea for the role was first raised), it was originally > more "assistive" and "record-keeper" in nature: > > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/php-fig/pxezV88Uk1I/eW3GvtPRCgAJ > > > > ### New FIG Role: Secretary > > > > The secretary role would serve several functions: > > > > - Keeping the website up-to-date, including merging pull requests. > > - GitHub organization administration (assigning people to teams, > removing people > > from teams, etc.). Specifically, this would involve providing editors > and > > coordinators of proposals commit access prior to a proposal being > accepted or > > rejected, and removing commit access once a proposal is complete > (unless a > > member is also involved in other active proposals). > > - Tallying votes. > > - Tracking member project activity, and marking projects as inactive. > > > > The role will be filled by 3 people, to ensure that at least one person > is > > always available in a timely manner. Additionaly, to remove partiality, > the role > > would be restricted to: > > > > - non-voting members of FIG; > > - members not actively involved in a current proposal (i.e., you cannot > be an > > editor of a proposal AND fulfill the role of secretary). > > > > Not discussed: > > > > - duration of service. (i.e., does service terminate after a fixed > duration?) > > - eligility (are secretaries proposed? or do they volunteer?) > > - election (is an entrance vote required?) > > > > Joe Ferguson, who was present, volunteered for the role of Secretary. > And that was used as a basis for the current form of the Secretary: http://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/membership/#fig-secretary The duties of the secretary are clearly laid out, regardless of "what type" of secretary they are. This was a vote that you participated in by a +0 vote. > > But referring to it now as "assistive" and or "record-keeping" role seems > to meet with resistance and defensiveness. > > Since the word "secretary" has multiple meanings, that makes the title > rather ambiguous. In the interest of reducing ambiguity, and making sure > the powers of the role fit an unambiguous title, I would love some > clarification on exactly what *kind* of secretary we have. Is it really the > "assistive/record-keeping" secretary, or is it more like something else? If > so, exactly what "something else" is it like? > > When asking this question to Michael Cullum over the weekend, in an > on-the-record conversation, he replied as follows (in his typical lengthy > fashion): > > > Secretary does not just mean assistant. > > > > The Secretary-General of the UN, or a Secretary of State are leadership > positions; a Parliamentary Secretary is a civil service position which runs > the day-to-day of a government department and is responsible to government, > but is politically impartial; a Parliamentary Private Secretary is an MP > (Member of Parliament, our congressmen) who works with a minister as a > liaison between the minister and backbenchers (MPs who are not part of the > government but are in the majority/government party); a Parliamentary Under > Secretary of State is subordinate to the Secretary of State but is an MP > with a smaller brief that they can focus on, reporting to their SoS; a > Secretary of a club or society is a mix of a leadership position (they are > a club officer and normally considered a very senior one, and the person > legally responsible for the actions of the club or society) but also > administrative duties as you describe; and of course, the way you describe > it, as a PA type role. > > > > The point I'm trying to make is that is is a simple fact that the title > Secretary can mean a huge variety of things, some considerably more > authoritative than that which the role of FIG Secretaries is, some are more > solely administrative (I'd note the term 'Administrator' has very similar > variance in meaning also). You seem to put a lot of value in the naming of > the role; in fact, your last email indicates this is the *most important* > thing to you. Might I ask why? > > > > So I do name the role, and I name it Secretary. If you wish to add other > titles onto this such as Developer Advocate, PR *, Administrative *, > Moderator, Administrator, Social Media *, with * indicating that manager or > assistant could be used interchangeably, then you may if that makes you > feel like you better understand the role. Just like the startup industry, > where titles mean relatively little because they are a small number of > people filling a large number of roles, so everyone in the company calls > themselves a 'Director of XYZ', the same is applicable here. It is not the > title that is necessarily important, but the actions, role and > responsibilities. > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Secretary_of_State > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secretary_of_State_(United_Kingdom) > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permanent_Secretary > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secretary-General_of_the_United_Nations > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parliamentary_Private_Secretary > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parliamentary_Under-Secretary_of_State > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_Secretary_to_the_Sovereign > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_Secretary > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Company_secretary > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secretary_(title) > > https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/master/ > bylaws/003-membership.md#overarching-role > > I admit I am unsettled by the idea that somehow the secretaries are seen > by Michael, who wrote the role description that has been voted in, as > anything even remotely resembling a Secretary-General or a Director. > Certainly that was not the impression I had when I voted +0 on the role; if > I'd had that impression, I'd have voted -1 and raised objections. > > So again, I ask: of those many kinds of secretaries, exactly which one(s) > describe the secretarial role here in FIG? > > > > -- > > Paul M. Jones > http://paul-m-jones.com > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "PHP Framework Interoperability Group" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to php-fig+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to php-fig@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/ > msgid/php-fig/494F53A8-55BC-4931-9C2B-B71D83323E2C%40gmail.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- Chris Tankersley http://ctankersley.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "PHP Framework Interoperability Group" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to php-fig+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to php-fig@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/php-fig/CAL9n4XOjvezHJ0bo8Fj2w9Pr8pViTiut1h4F0NXEPFObBdg5Cw%40mail.gmail.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
