Daniel Kolbo wrote:
> Tony Marston wrote:
>> "Nitsan Bin-Nun" <nit...@binnun.co.il> wrote in message
>> news:d47da0100903220910q7bb66706s6255f0fc89b98...@mail.gmail.com...
>>> Don't forget to attach the message to the list.
>>> Regarding the frameworks, which of them, for your opinion, will take the
>>> fastest time to learn and get into code?
>> Generally speaking if something is fast to learn it is also the first
>> to run out of steam. If it doesn't have more features than you can
>> learn in five minutes the it doesn't have enough features to do
>> anything useful, or with any degree of flexibility.
> Hello,
> I changed the subject because I did not want to steal Nitsan's thread.
> There seem to be a ton of frameworks, one-click installation web
> applications, the latest and greatest wiz-bang applications out there. 
> I find myself extremely reluctant to dig into these code sets.  It seems
> when I do attempt to use one of these pre-coded applications I end up
> eventually wanting to modify the code outside of the original extent of
> the project.  Invariably I get frustrated and end up wishing I initially
> begun the development from scratch.  Employers seem to be wanting me to
> have experience with all kinds of 'gimicky' solutions, but I am
> reluctant to be constantly learning new applications (that i'd prefer to
> rewrite myself).  Am I just being hard headed and reluctant to change,
> or is my stance justified?  I suppose the answer is the middle-path. 
> That is, read some new projects, take the bits I like, leave the bits I
> don't, etc...The problem is this isn't very marketable.  But I suppose,
> the proof is in the pudding.  What a banal way to end an email, eh?
> What are your thoughts in regard to these two forces: wiz-bang
> frameworks vs. raw php development?
> thanks,

Well, to your point and the OPs point, I use CakePHP, which for some
reason the OP wants to get away from.  In my opinion cake doesn't try to
do all things or be all things to all people.  Just like any framework
or class/function library, if you're going to use it you have to learn
it.  For me, Cake is RAD

I'm not a DB guy by trade, but have gotten myself into thinking of the
DB after the site/app functionality.  Then I whip up a DB schema, bake
and I have a strawman working app.  Then I start coding the real
functionality.  I tested qcodo briefly and it seemed very cool, cake but
lighter and primarily using AJAX.  I still like it, but it was way too
light for me at the time, i.e. no classes to do the mundane stuff, which
some call bloat.

I'm not really a Zend fan (because I'm a hobby programmer and not
die-hard OOP/pattern guy), but have been seeing the different code
generation/app layout/ORM maybe generation plans in the Zend_Tool piece.

FWIW, the only mature frameworks that I've seen are CakePHP, Symphony,
and maybe 1 or 2 that I can't remember.  Symphony for me at least is way
too config heavy, Zend is PEAR, just a class libray but with stricter
standards, and some of the others have promise but lack functionality or
don't have a strong developer/community base.

Just my 2 cents... Flame me away...!


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