Do you guys really think PHP should be in computer science curriculum?

In my curriculum (in canada) I learned C/C++, Software Design (database 
architecture and OO Design), SQL, Unix and Networks (OSI, TCP-IP and HTTP 

There was no Perl, Python, PHP, ASP, JSP and even no VB...
I think it's more important to learn Programming than it is to learn PHP. I 
know for a fact that some of our
teachers knew about PHP, but still they decide to teach the class in C. And 
I happy they did.

Now if your school has no PHP server, why don't you suggest and offer to 
install it?
That's what we did, we made it run on a small machine on Linux first than 
with the
help of the university sys admin, we installed it on a Unix server. The sys 
admin is
now very happy to do his web stuff in PHP instead of Perl :)

just my canadien 2 cents... (1.14 cent US ;) )

At 03:46 AM 1/18/2002 -0200, you wrote:
>Francesco Gallarotti wrote:
> >
> > I am a student in a college in NY state. Here we have several servers and
> > dozens of courses on computer science. No server is PHP ready and no course
> > instructor knows anything about PHP. Why do you think this is happening? I
> > really like PHP and I am using it in my personal website to work with some
> > text files and a small database. Why PHP is so not popular in the computer
> > science teaching area?
>IMHO, that is there no marketing effort behind PHP, meaning there is no
>Microsoft nor Sun nor any strong brand behind PHP to advertise it.
>Even in the Open Source world the PHP credit is relative. For instance
>well known publishers on the field like O'Reilly don't seem to care much
>about publishing PHP books. I don't know why.
>O'Reilly seems to give more credit to Perl and Python than to PHP, but
>it is also true that such languages have well organized advocacy groups
>while there seems to be no organized advocacy for PHP at all.
>Also PHP is only known to be adequate for Web programming niche market
>although it can be used as a general purpose programming language. Since
>Computer Science courses are for much more than Web programming,
>colleges do not see PHP as a good bet for the future of their students.
>Unfortunately, in this world when somebody does not know about
>something, what is important is not what that "is" but what "seems to
>be". So humans seem to give more credit to something that appears often
>in many places than something that appears not very much in only one
>place. PHP popularity seems to be limited to what it is advertised for
>which isn't much as I mentioned above.
>So, if you care about PHP credit and consequent success in the Computer
>Science world, what shall you do about it?
>Well, as an individual you may not be able to do much. But I think there
>is plenty of things that can be done to better market PHP so it gets the
>necessary recognition to appear in Computer Science curriculum.
>In the past I made several suggestions to PHP developers in order to
>improve PHP recognition not only in colleges but also in companies that
>are not aware of the capabilities of PHP. If companies are not made
>aware of PHP capabilities, that reduces the chances of employment of
>people like everybody here that would like to keep working on PHP and
>you may be forced by the circumstances to work with other more accepted
>languages in the labour market.
>Unfortunately, my suggestions were not considered seriously, meaning
>either people present then either not agree with the suugestions or
>simply nothing seems to have been done in that direction.
>I don't want to bring back the discussion of the merits of the
>suggestions, but rather to remind them for people that were not present
>or not paying attention to consider them and maybe who knows does
>something about it. So what I suggested was something more os less like
>- Promote contests of PHP applications or components. The Python
>community does this and it seems to be getting the attention of the
>computing media. This leads to an obvious greater exposure of the
>language to the computing community that does not know it while it
>promotes the development of more and better applications and components.
>- Promote a banner exchange/Web ring between all sites that promote PHP
>related materials: articles, components, applications, etc.. This would
>give a greater sense of the wide support that users that adhere to PHP
>may find. Somebody objected because it would be hard to tell which sites
>provide a reasonable level of quality. I think this could be sorted by
>providing a way for users to vote on each of the sites. The results of
>the votes would be shown in the banners to advise about their quality.
>- Seek deals with offline and online computing specialized media to
>assure that PHP gets exposure in the exchange for banner advertisement.
>People that are not aware of PHP often learn from those media. PHP
>exposure could be a space for letting qualified writers write articles
>that would let readers of those media be aware of PHP capabilities
>especially for the people that are not aware of PHP credits because
>those are the most important people that PHP marketing should target
>because you may find many decision makers among them. Decision makers
>often decide whether tecnologies should or not be used in companies or
>included in college curriculum.
>I have more ideias but this is just to illustrate how PHP can be
>marketed without necessarily spending money on the efforts. Of course my
>ideias are not the only ones that would work and not necessarily the
>best. Anybody can bring more ideias but what is really important is that
>something gets done.
>I am crossposting this to php-dev because I think that the most
>important people that can do something about this are there. If you
>don't agree that this topic makes sense in that list, just don't
>follow-up in there.
>Manuel Lemos
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