Ric Sherlock wrote: > Harvey wrote: > > Another thing that I think should be addressed with each primitive is > > WHY you would ever want to use that primitive--what's it good for? > > What's it good in combination with, and why? > > Is the "Common uses" sections of > http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/Vocabulary/greaterthan.#Common%20uses > similar to what you had in mind or did you want something else?
YES!! This is *very* helpful and is the kind of thing I had in mind in my original comments. One of my favorite TV series from many years ago was "Connections". The J Dictionary does exactly what a dictionary is supposed to do: it defines the WHAT, and that's all it does. But words by themselves are useless. What's needed (and I think this project is aiming at least partly in this direction) is a GRAMMAR of J--and I'm talking far broader than the J parser. Natural languages (which are what J is patterned after) consist of both vocabulary and grammar--you need both in order to become fluent in a language. This "J grammar" would show the *connections* between the primitives, how primitives are used, why each primitive is used, how primitives can (and cannot) be combined into "sentences", and so on. That's the kind of thing I'm looking for. I also want to very clearly state that the very strong feelings I voiced about this topic were NEVER intended to personally insult or put down anyone, especially the author and maintainer of the Dictionary, whom I highly regard and respect! I debated long and hard over how strongly I should state the initial reactions I had when I first started learning J. I finally decided that I was reacting to ideas (not people) and that the leading voices in this discussion wanted real reactions of someone when first encountering J. Based on Ken Iverson's writings that I've read, I'm convinced that he did not think APL or J was only for programmers with master's or doctor's degrees in computer science. I'm quite sure that he would advocate the use of these languages by *everyone* (whatever their background or level) because they would help people to better think through problems and find solutions. This is why I keep pushing for simpler, simpler, simpler. However, I certainly understand the need for intermediate and advanced information as well, and I agree that--somehow--there should be some sort of provision for those levels, too. Having programmed since 1975 as both a hobbyist and an entrepreneur, I appreciate the concepts of elegance, succinctness, "doing the seemingly impossible", and the like in both programming and programming examples. I have learned an awful lot from the members of this forum, and I am very grateful! My hope is that this project can significantly reduce the incline of the learning curve for J. Harvey ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
