On 01/21/2013 11:43 AM, Robbie Gemmell wrote:
I don't think that list being separate is the main source of most of the
confusion with proton.


I agree and was not suggesting that it was. I do however think that had past conversations on both the proton and dev lists been more visible then the community as a whole would have a better view of what was happening and any questions would get asked earlier forcing them to be dealt with earlier.

What prompted this thread was the observation that communication was more fragmented than in my view it needed to be, not that this was the cause or solution to any specific point or issue. That is actually something I have felt for a while and not at all specifically with regard to proton. Recent email threads somehow just pushed me from thinking about it to voicing my thoughts out loud.

People have asked roughly the same basic questions
about proton on users@ and proton@ at roughly the same time, which did
indeed mean certain discussion with answers might have only gone to one of
the lists at a time, but the key point for me was that they had to ask
those basic questions on either list in the first place.

We are talking about improving communication, and for me the main problem
is often that information isn't being written down or sent to any of the
lists until someone asks a question requiring it. That question typically
gets met with a [large] email explaining the answer, but much of the time
it should be possible for the response to just be a link to somewhere the
answer is already written down in general, e.g the website, with perhaps
some context-specific additions. Some website update stats would probably
entertaining right about now for example.

I think the website is indeed a problem area for the project. It does tend to get stale and has never been particularly comprehensive. I think the addition of proton (and indeed the move to AMQP 1.0) is a significant enough change that the overall structure needs some thought.

[...]
I think users@ and dev@ should be left as is, and that we potentially just
adjust how we use them slightly.

That is fine with me. I'm really just hoping to nudge more of the conversation emails onto the user list for wider visibility as I think that will be generally beneficial (while not being a panacea for any specific issue or indeed for the need for better communication in general).



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