On Thu, Jun 16, 2016 at 8:52 AM, <[email protected]> wrote: > So today must be the 1000th time in my life where I see a project shoots > down a good summary feedback, making sure the issues are broken out into > pieces and no discussion can take place on the future impacts, and that the > very contribution of a higher-level-then-bug-report feedback is being > handled as offensive, leeching and useless. > > Since it's apparently the 1000th time, I'll put it in your face now. > The answer is "thank you for this feedback". > Noone demands you all sit down and fix anything she wanted, now, for free. > You're being told, in a high-level from the things that will drive away > many of the people who are *not* using Qubes. > That doesn't mean you should / need to act now. You should take the > opportunity to engange and consider the feedback. > If you sat someone down to write it it'd cost you a few 1000 to get it. > > > Please don't think I want to single out Alex I'm replying to, this thread > is full of this unproductive arrogance and this is just the mail that set > me through the roof. > > Am Donnerstag, 16. Juni 2016 08:52:09 UTC+2 schrieb Alex: > > On 06/16/2016 07:26 AM, Drew White wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Thursday, 16 June 2016 03:44:00 UTC+10, jkitt wrote: > > > > > > One of the many benefits of FOSS is that users can contribute - > even > > > if it's just writing tickets on the issue tracker. > > > > > > > > > Exactly, it's an open thing, but these are things that there are > tickets > > > about for some thing. > > > And some things I have notified Qubes-OS of the problem and it's never > > > had a ticket created or been fixed. > > > And some things have had great response and been fixed or had a fix in > > > place for the next release, but not being fixed/patched in that one > release. > > The fact that it's open does not mean that they serve everybody like the > > counter of a McDonald's restaurant. It means that anyone can contribute. > > Trying to shake up a project that gets stuck on the one end ahead of i.e. > coding something that won't work *is* a contribution. It's what a good > manager would do, and it comes free. > > Giving test feedback on UX level is something that one'd need a UX > engineer to do, which is not cheap at all, especially not so if they'd need > to rewire menus and understand hypervisor management. It comes free. > > Pointing out architectural issues in upgrades that could escalate in the > future and listing the factors is priceless, and it comes free. > > So maybe try something else than being offended and shooting down the > feedback that was given. > There's a few nice options: > > - "Yes, some of those issues have given me trouble too" > - "No, to me this has been a rather pain-free thing, it seems I do it > differently than you" > - "Can you work with the GUI designer and give the feedback directly? We > need the rewrite anyway because <things>" > - "You're right about some of the issues, but - this isn't a bugtracker - > can you please make sure there are bugs for *all* of them, and not just > some? You know about them now, we have a few 100 more and can't possibly > keep an eye on all of this. If you need someone to help you, let us know > but please help by doing as much as you can" > - "It seems you're more troubled by the multitude of issues that hurt you, > not by individual ones. We don't have the resources to proactively fight > things like that, and noone can fix them now. But please understand they > are transient and for many of us, it doesn't hurt that much". > Finally also this one: > - "Thank you for writing. I'm sorry to tell you, but what you're listing > just isn't important when you consider the project goals, which are already > sky-high. If the community demands fixing every single scratch, there will > be no project." > Even this would have been better. > - "HAHAHA No" > > I'm sickened by the lack of empathy and thinking and you should stop this, > for the better of the project. > > Florian > > Yes Florian I too am unable to feel empathy either for your post or for Drew one. Being in empathy means sharing feelings. But what I feel is gratefulness for all developers. How can I share grumbles? Too difficult for me. I am sorry. I like proper form and respect even for a bug report. But of course I understand what you mean and you are not wrong either. But no empathy sorry. Fran
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