I believe that God gave us that witch we are to use to the benefit of our brothers and sister. God made us in His image giving us a brain and raw materials, He wants us then to use that technology to help each other.
Dan Moe & Family ----- Original Message ----- From: "julie reemelin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 12:00 AM Subject: Re: [RR] CPR/FA Training Required - Follow up > AED is fast becoming a standard of minimum care lots of churches are > getting them before you decide we do not need the training stop think can > you afford not to have one? Ask do we need anything or just GOD? As a nurse > I think we need every thing that will help ministry verses pulling it down. > Just think Sunday service heart attach pt dies does that help a church? > > Matthew > > > > [Original Message] > > From: Mark W Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Date: 5/29/2003 9:18:44 PM > > Subject: Re: [RR] CPR/FA Training Required - Follow up > > > > > > I would say it is as optional as Ranger Basics. All Commanders including > > Lt. Commanders are encouraged to take Ranger Basics hence the path to > > First Aid and CPR. > > > > The fee for Red Cross First Aid and CPR Training in our area is about > > 45.00 per person. I was able to offer it at about 15.00 per boy and > > 20.00 per leader making a very small amount to cover the overhead. I > > think the 45.00 fee is excluding a lot of trained people. Just think of > > it from a money standpoint. If a average church of 12 leaders went for > > FA /CPR Training it would cost almost 545.00 just for a dozen leaders and > > probably a lunch thrown in. Keeping in mind that it would need to be > > redone every year for CPR and every 3 years for First Aid. That in > > itself is a chunk of change. > > > > I think it would be better served to break it away from being > > outsourced... and make a in house RR training course with certificate. > > Do we need defibulator training? Nope - never saw one except in a > > course. Do we need extreme training like that? I don't think so. We > > need to teach the basics and stress call 911. Saying call EMS will often > > get you a blank stare... call 911 they know right now what that means. > > > > In the past 24 years my experience with CPR and First Aid training is > > they have dumbed it down a bunch. I have taken the course about 6 times > > due to my work requirements. I think we as Royal Ranger Commanders could > > encourage National RR to put together a "Better way" and side step this > > money thing. A Chapter or a few weeks of lessons on this topic would fit > > right in the new modified RR work book. It soul be built in every > > quarter. > > > > My two cents...yours may vary. > > > > Mark Jones, Spfd South Sectional Commander > > > > p.s. In the past two years I facilitated a certified Red Cross Course > > for over a hundred or more RR in our area. I think we as Royal Rangers > > could make something work better for us and our needs. > > > > On Thu, 29 May 2003 07:51:44 -0400 "CmdrPier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > writes: > > > It appears that CPR/FA training is optional, that is, while it is a > > > stated > > > requirement, no one is held back if they don't get the training. > > > > > > After teaching a CPR/FA class last Saturday that was poorly > > > attended, I > > > wondered where our leaders are getting trained - not by me (I teach > > > CPR/FA > > > for our section, and most of the attendees in the last 3 years were > > > non-Rangers). > > > > > > Then I wondered if our leaders are untrained, why would the > > > sponsoring > > > church let them take children and youth into the outdoors without > > > adequate > > > first aid training? Are our churches willing to take that risk? > > > Under the > > > Pennsylvania Good Samaritan laws, it is very difficult to sue > > > someone, who > > > while providing aid, you harm the victim PROVIDED you are acting > > > within the > > > scope of your training. According to the Red Cross, the law is so > > > clear on > > > this that it is difficult to get an attorney to take one of these > > > cases. > > > However, if you provide first aid and you haven't been trained, or > > > you don't > > > have a current card, you risk being sued because under the Good > > > Samaritan > > > laws because the scope of your training is ZERO, which means you do > > > not > > > provide treatment, or you do so at your own risk. > > > > > > Having decided not to provide treatment because of the risk of being > > > sued > > > under the Good Samaritan laws, you and the church are now at risk of > > > being > > > sued by the parents because they entrusted their children to you and > > > the > > > church, and the church did not provide trained leaders. I recall > > > from BLaw > > > that the law uses the "reasonable man" concept. In this case, would > > > a > > > reasonable man assume that an organization taking boys camping, with > > > all the > > > hazards that go with it (use of knives, axes, etc.), would have > > > leaders > > > trained to provide care in the event of injury? I think so. > > > > > > Now if our leaders are trained elsewhere, is that something the > > > sectional > > > leadership should track? Should Royal Rangers require all leaders > > > to have > > > training, if so how do you enforce it? > > > > > > I wonder if the churches and the Royal Ranger hierarchy are aware of > > > this > > > risk? Although our permission slips say we assume no "liability in > > > case of > > > accident or sickness" (full text below), the courts have ruled that > > > you > > > cannot contract away responsibility for your negligence. If the > > > District or > > > National office has reviewed this issue with legal counsel, I'd be > > > curious > > > to know the outcome. > > > > > > I'm thinking that churches should require ALL their workers - > > > volunteer and > > > paid - to have CPR/FA training. > > > > > > Here's the text from our permission slips: > > > While striving to ensure a wholesome, safe, and closely supervised > > > environment for the boys in its care, the Penn-Del District, > > > Southwest > > > Suburban Section, and Outpost 34 Royal Rangers cannot be held liable > > > for any > > > unforeseen and unforeseeable accident or injuries which may occur > > > during the > > > course of any Royal Ranger activity. Responsible leaders, persons, > > > and > > > acting agents transporting on behalf of the Royal Ranger ministry of > > > the > > > Assemblies of God assume no personal liability in case of accident > > > or > > > sickness. > > > > > > Kelvin Pier > > > Outpost 34 > > > Southwest Suburban Section, Penn-Del District > > > > > > > > > _______ > > > > > > > > > List host: http://eBible.org/mpj/ List info: > > > http://eBible.org/rangernet/faq.htm > > > > > > To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe rangernet" to > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > or visit http://eBible.org/subscribe.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > Download a Free Royal Ranger Database. It's packed with goodies and it > > will make record keeping fun! > > Over 25 related databases and 11 years of field experience. Just like > > Salvation it's free! > > http://home.classicnet.net/mjones02/index.html > > > > ________________________________________________________________ > > The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! > > Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! > > Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! > > _______ > > > > > > List host: http://eBible.org/mpj/ List info: > http://eBible.org/rangernet/faq.htm > > > > To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe rangernet" to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > or visit http://eBible.org/subscribe.htm > > > --- julie reemelin > --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] > --- EarthLink: The #1 provider of the Real Internet. > > > _______ > > > List host: http://eBible.org/mpj/ List info: http://eBible.org/rangernet/faq.htm > > To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe rangernet" to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > or visit http://eBible.org/subscribe.htm _______ List host: http://eBible.org/mpj/ List info: http://eBible.org/rangernet/faq.htm To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe rangernet" to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://eBible.org/subscribe.htm
