Re: [RR] Cell Groups

[Mike Burke]

I kind of don't think anyone is disputing what the Lord has done, however if by chance you are in a church that has all of this going on and it makes you uncomfortable, Maybe it's time to be elsewhere?  I went to a huge A/G church that had tons and tons of different things going on. I have seen churches split over who is going to be in control of Rangers and Youth. One of the biggest outposts in my former District did that and it split the congregation. I honestly can say that I sympathize with you to an extent on this though because to me it was frustrating to see everybody going off doing all of these things , talking about what a great time they had then they wanted to know why I wasn't there. Many people at the church wore many hats. I was almost about to be approached and asked to be a deacon in addition to being a commander. I would have had to have declined on the grounds that my being a deacon would have defeated what I set out to do while I was in Rangers.  I'm of the belief that if a person is involved with one ministry he should stick to it, devote his best to it and not cloud the issues with all of the other little things going on. Big churches are like forest fires. Everybody is off doing their own thing and I can say that I honestly see where you are going with your comment on putting the Holy Spirit under a lock and key.  I have seen this too. Everyone gets too wrapped up in what they are doing and it's like God gets left out. It is a social flaw, but I think  to even be able to recognize it puts you one step ahead.   One of the big issues I had was with the LTC and the way it was presented at times appeared to contradict itself somewhat.   All too often on the topic of leading Boys to Christ, the "Only Boys in the A/G" would come out when we were trying to say that it applied to all boys, not just the ones in the A/G. It appeared as if we were trying to upsell the A/G's Agenda over trying to upsell the Kingdom of Heaven of which is clearly and distinctively more important than the Agenda of the A/G. It appeared that the A/G's Agenda was wasn't completely lined up with Heaven's Agenda and seemed like it was trying to extol the A/G over God Himself. I had MAJOR problems with that because I wasn't seeing any humility anywhere. I was seeing that it was saying that the A/G is all that when the Bible says that righteousness is as dirty rags. To me and how I perceived it was blatant and even arrogant.   One thing about me, I'm nobody's "yes man" but the Lord's. I don't find the any of the cell groups I have participated in to specifically be as you have described them.   Iron Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: Mark W Jones To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 8:43 AM Subject: Re: [RR] Cell Groups That is what I am talking about.  I have heard more testimonies about what harm this setup has done to people than the good it has brought.  It's about church growth, its about money. It's about control. It's about keeping people so busy they don't have time for much else.  It's about taking the Holy Ghost putting him in a book and then locking the book away.    I would rather have a church filled with Born Again Saved People who have their faith in Jesus Christ and what he has done for us then a BIG Church that has 10,000 programs, health clubs, bars, rock bands and seldom refer to the gospel as they don't want to offend people  leading these people straight to the gates of hell.  Paul said the Gospel would be an offense.  We are trading the Gospel of Jesus Christ for another gospel that only mentions Him in passing.    Again.  It is very obvious to me what is taking place here.  The devil if he can get one to think they are saved and not be has achieved what he is after. It makes no difference if we spend all our life in church doing great works of Love.  If we try and do it any other way than through our faith in Jesus and what he has done for us the Bible says it won't count. He is the ONLY WAY.      Bringing the ways of the world into the Church to build numbers is not the Gospel of Jesus Christ.  Rick Warrens methods work great in the world, its proven, its a fact.  Doesn't mean we are to take his ways throw some scriptures at it and fill our pews with people who have no clue who Jesus is and what he has done for them.  We by saying this is ok are going to pay a high price when Jesus says I never knew you.   Again. I came out of a works based faith. Jehovah's witnesses do a great job of cell groups, they have removed the Holy Ghost and the Blood of Christ and provide a bunch of literature to keep them busy while the organization is leading millions of people to hell.   I see little difference in the purpose filled life and the methods that  the Jehovah's Witnesses use for control.  To this day I can't have willful association with my own mother due to this cult and their ungodly methods of control.  It angers me that our Denomination would even consider such foolishness.  It's not about numbers it about souls saved.  That's it.    As a telephone man I go daily into crooks and crevasse of the homes of people and see them in the very motion of life. I see how they live I see what they are in the middle of  etc.  A large percentage of the time when I ask them where they go to church they are attending the largest AG church in the city 5000 plus. They go once a week.  The said thing is most don't look, act any different than the guy next door that doesn't go to church.  Their house is full of the same fruit.  Money and control is not God's plan that is the worlds plan.    Mark Jones     On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 18:08:13 -0800 "Jim Hufferd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Mark: The cell groups have been around for over 25 years, pastor Cho in So. Korea uses them and they are the largest church in the world, last I heard.  We used them when I was in the LA area and the church I'm attending uses them.     The cell groups are not the problem, it's the ones that are running them.  They should be picked by the pastor and well gounded in the church and the word.  My pastor hand picks the leaders and then they go through a training program before they ever start.  Then he meets with the leaders from time to time.  He also sets the books they teach from including the Purpose Driven LIfe, which the cell groups all went through twice and he had a series of messages on the book as well.   Jim Hufferd   Download a Free Royal Ranger Database. It's packed with goodies and it will make record keeping fun! Over 31 related databases and 13 years of field experience.   Just like Salvation it's free! http://home.classicnet.net/mjones02/index.html