You can, it's what people have done all along until FME and On2 for
flash live encoder, the down side of a flash app doing your encoding is
that your then stuck with the widely regarded inferior sorensen codec
(H.263) as opposed to On2's VP6 for flash (H.264) codec. Macromedia's
guys must have come to work by dumbo jet the day they signed up with
On2 is all I can say, same goes for NellyMoser (?) come to think of it.
:-)
But seriously guys, it's just not cricket to be discussing ways how to
break EULA's (in spirit and word) on an OS list so in the nicest
possible way, can it. I actually have a feeling that On2 laughed all
the way to the bank when Adobe realised they needed a live encoder and
I think Adobe have been pretty cool releasing a basic encoding solution
F.O.C. taking On2's shafting with dignity and much grace as they pull
up their pants. FMS 2's pricing is FUBAR though, so is On2's Flix 8
Live For Flash ($900 pa ??) so you need to figure if your Red5 app
needs the added video quality from live VP6 encoding or can you make do
with sorensen? If your getting serious traffic then you should have
already recouped enough by using Red5 over FMS2 to be happy enough
paying On2 for a Flix 8 Live license. Chances are that with significant
traffic you could just about recoup the cost of Flix 8 Live on
bandwidth savings alone. I'm not an evangelist for On2 by the way, I've
tried talking to them about licensing the live SDK for an app I needed,
I gave up on them in the end.
Regards
Justin.
Luke Scott wrote:
Question... couldn't you make a flash app with live streaming? (you
can set the frame rate and frame size)
On Aug 5, 2007, at 8:30 AM, Sales Department wrote:
Has it occurred to anyone that maybe it is not in Adobe's best
interest
to allow anyone to use FME for any purpose other than to stream to
FMS?
If I were Adobe, I wouldn't sell FME separately unless the whole world
moved to another platform and I didn't want to be left behind. FME
is a
differentiator - probably one of their last ones too.
Luke Scott wrote:
Why don't they just put a price tag on FME for separate purchase, and
then just include it with FMS?
On Aug 5, 2007, at 7:53 AM, Kevin Towes wrote:
Michael -
The EULA limits FME to stream LIVE content only to FMS, period.
BTW -
FMS funds the development of FME, and if people are using FME
without
FMS, then we may have to consider putting a price tag on FME to
offset
the development and CODEC licensing costs for the next generation
of the
product, what do you think about that solution?
If you can't agree to those terms of the EULA, then I would
recommend
you uninstall, or create a project that produces a live feed to
Red5.
BTW - both the Firebird and Camero are owned by GM (Pontiac and
Cheverolet).
Kev.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of MichaelChan
Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2007 11:24 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Red5] Flash Media Encoder
Kev
I am not a legal profession but please hear my translation based on
what
I see from the licensing provision and point out some weasel word
that
might have no teeth when it comes to push in court and like to hear
your
response.
On Sat, 2007-08-04 at 12:47 -0700, Kevin Towes wrote:
Michael. If you read the EULA you will see the following
definition
in
section 1. I think it's pretty explicit and not ambiguous at all:
"Flash Media Server" means Adobe's proprietary software that
streams
audio, video and data over the Internet and IP networks and can be
used
to create Web-based interactive media applications."
In a legal arena, the combined word of Flash Media Server is
branded as
Adobe solution? or Adobe will named its server as Adobe Flash Media
Server in the real world,
To address the court with reasoning, one will ask how does Adobe
claim
in marketing its product?
Adobe Flash Media Server or Flash Media Server without mentioned the
name.
The language used in the licensing agreement here will consider
broad
coverage but it is somewhat confusing.
I am in no way trying to break licensing agreement but only point
out
the weak point of such provision.
In the developing of advance technology along with rapid changes,
this
provision will be consider to be one of many that will acted against
improvement of advance technologies.
I consider the following in an argument platform.
Many developers used FME in creating AVI or Mpeg2 or media files and
converted it to FLV files for media flash player to play under
the SWF
extension.
Now the flv can be play under the format of FMS platform or RED5
platform, however, the RED5 is not the actual server that holds the
FLV,
but it simply pulls the flv files from a central repository server
that
received media files from other flv producers. My question here :
Where is the break of licensing agreement?
since the FME is only in producing FLV files for FMS, and Red5 is
not
FMS but a server that can broadcast FLV files.
Red5 stated on their site the following:
"Red5 is *not* a replacement for fcs/fms, and is thus not "a FMS."
FME license user produce FLV file using FME, the user deposit the
file
into a repository server which is not a FMS but storage server only,
Now Red5 will pull FLV file from the storage server which can be
produced by other FLV encoders such as MING, Moyea SWF,
It is legal to have a product done by reverse engineering and the
argument here is a reference between Ford and GM (Firebird and
Camero),
the only distinction between the two model is the pointed nose of
Firebird and the flat grill of Camero from looking outside without
looking under the hood and inside, both look the same from outside.
Red5 is a project that will change over time and these changes will
also
provide advance changes to our daily life and might improve some
people
with great impact to their life.
If we pit the Adobe FME licensing agreement compare against the
Microsoft window IE deployment to OEM vendors (United State Supreme
Court ruled that such licensing is consider to be monopolized in
nature.)
Such argument is considered weight heavy to a company who might
considered to be dominate player.
My questions to the Adobe group are in two parts:
1. Where is the break of licensing?
2. Does this licensing fall within the MS case US supreme court
ruling?
You will also see this in section 4.3:
"4.3 General Restrictions. When used for streaming the Encoded
Content
to the Flash Media Server, you may only use the Software to stream
Encoded Content to the Flash Media Server. You may not use the
Software
in any way to create a server, executable, or other program that
will
steam or deliver data and/or content from a client to a server,
from a
server to another server, or from a server to a client. "
Kev.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Michael Chan
Sent: Friday, August 03, 2007 10:30 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Red5] Flash Media Encoder
Kev
Just to be sure that we are not in any way disrespect the software
licensing but to be sure that you are not misleading other in
comply
with some provision that is not specific in nature and it is to
allow
users free to choose of preference.
In this 2.1, Adobe only stated that FME must work in conjunction
with
FMS (Red5 is a FMS) and Adobe did not stated in this published
article
that for whoever use the FME, they must also required to use
"Adobe"
brand FMS, if this article become part or is part of the
distribution
license, and Adobe willing to allow users to use FMS without
specifically required all users registered to use Adobe brand FMS,
therefore it is fair to say Adobe itself knowing some users are
using
Red5 to be the FMS.
If you know some legal cases that Adobe won in the past for such
violation, please provide us with detail or link for such to
support
your comment so this community can benefit.
MC
On Fri, 2007-03-08 at 21:27 -0700, Kevin Towes wrote:
In the quote I sent earlier it states "solely to capture
video...and...
stream the Encoded Content to Flash Media Server". That is the
limit
of the license. So the Adobe FME is meant to stream video only to
FMS. I would encourage the OS community to respect the EULA of
the
Adobe Flash Media Encoder.
Kev.
2. Software License.
2.1 Software License. Subject to the terms and conditions of
this
Agreement, Adobe hereby grants you a non-exclusive, worldwide,
royalty-free license to (a) download, install and use the Software
solely to capture video and/or audio content ("Content"),
encode the
Content into Flash Video Format ("Encoded Content") and record
the
Encoded Content to a FLV File and/or stream the Encoded Content to
Flash Media Server; and (b) make a reasonable number of copies of
the
Documentation solely in connection with use of the Software in
accordance with this Agreement, but no more than the amount
reasonably
necessary. "
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:red5-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Michael Chan
Sent: Friday, August 03, 2007 8:10 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Red5] Flash Media Encoder
Kevin1
I am not sure where the term you mentioned that FME (Adobe) stated
that
it is not allow in Red5, can you please detail your opinion as how
do
you come to this conclusion. As far as I understood in reading
this
along with FME license, it did not specific required FME into any
specific Flash Media server by Adobe.
Please let me know if you have new provision that I am not
aware of.
MC
On Fri, 2007-03-08 at 17:35 -0700, Kevin Towes wrote:
Andrea - You cannot use FME with Red 5 without breaking the
License
agreement of FME (see attached and below).
2. Software License.
2.1 Software License. Subject to the terms and conditions of
this
Agreement, Adobe hereby grants you a non-exclusive, worldwide,
royalty-free license to (a) download, install and use the
Software
solely to capture video and/or audio content ("Content"), encode
the
Content into Flash Video Format ("Encoded Content") and record
the
Encoded Content to a FLV File and/or stream the Encoded
Content to
Flash Media Server; and (b) make a reasonable number of copies of
the
Documentation solely in connection with use of the Software in
accordance with this Agreement, but no more than the amount
reasonably
necessary.
Kevin Towes.
____________________________________________________________________
__
From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:red5-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Andrea :-)
Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2007 4:29 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [Red5] Flash Media Encoder
Hello
i've just Download Flash Media Encoder.
I can use it in Red5 (in some Way) or not?
Sorry, i'm Italian, I Sperak English Just a Little
--
*Andrea*
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