Perhaps it is another aspect of the relatively small size of the S scale market
that there are no more importers with deep pockets who
can bankroll new developments without what too often looks like a ponzi scheme,
taking in money not really as deposits of earnest
commitment to buy but as actual operating capital, and if the deposits slow
down there is insufficient capital to continue the project, leaving the
unwiling investors holding the bag. Overland once did S scale, Sunset, I
believe, did some S scale, PSC did some S scale, but what
seems to be left now are a handful of much smaller specialized S scale
operations. Not a happy situation.
I haven't been burnt, as I have no S scale brass (apart from a few Sn3
locomotives); mostly I have bought some of Don Thompson's
excellent diesels and, finally, one of his 2-8-0's, and my involvement in S
scale is not likely to go much deeper. Although I have not
actually sat down and added up what I've spent so far on S scale, I doubt it
would buy two S scale brass steam locomotives.
A number of years ago some importers started asking for deposits from dealers
to ensure they would actually buy the items when they
arrived; as the price of brass started to climb, more and more of those dealers
started passing along the need for a deposit to potential
customers, since that became a lot of money to tie up (and as numbers of
imports relative to buyers decreased and the lead-time between
starting a project in the Far East and actual delivery for sale increased).
And, truth be told, over the more than fifty years I've been a model
railroader, the lead-time has increased partly because buyers have wanted more
accurate and better-running products, which has meant more research and more
attention to engineering. Especially as the bricks-and-mortar hobby shops and
traditional outlets have been squeezed by
basement sellers and online operations, few now order any high-ticket items
that are going to tie up operating capital in slow-moving inventory. Most of
us now expect to have to put down a deposit with a reliable dealer or directly
with the importer and then wait at least 3-4 years if we expect to be certain
of getting something we want. The problem in all scales comes when the wait is
protracted and the deposit is substantial, not merely a token of good intent.
And what sometimes happens complicates it all if the importer is
undercapitalized and makes even one poor business decision which interrupts his
cash flow, if he develops health problems (since almost all are sole-proprietor
situations) or has other personal issues (and some have even died on us,
mid-project).
Lest I seem to be beating only on S scale, over twenty years ago I placed a
$100 deposit (I was then a dealer in a small way) with Sunset against an O
scale I1 that was supposed to already be in production in Korea. Four or five
years later there was STILL no word on when
they were expected, so I wrote Mort Mann for a refund (by then having college
tuitions to pay--I was also selling off some of my choice
brass). I got an unencouraging reply, suggesting their record-keeping left
something to be desired. Happily, my record-keeping was somewhat better, as I
could send a photocopy of the cancelled check, and I did get my deposit back
(no interest for all the time they had
the use of my money, however). Several years later the I1 did arrive and I
bought one from a dealer.
Jace Kahn
General Manager
Ceres & Canisteo RR Co./Champlain County Traction Co.
> A few conventions ago, (Baltimore perhaps?) John had setup a table
> showing the gondola prototype and a very immense set of drawing for the
> UP version of the engine. I've never seen plans so well executed.
> therefore somebody had put some money into the project. For many of us
> it is a better choice than the USRA style.
>
> When it comes to deposits, I think the fairest way to deal with that
> issue is simply a credit card type deposit. If the project is canceled
> the card isn't run through or in the worse case you can reverse the
> charge. However, an importer should be able to show the credit card
> deposits as a receivable for his purposes.
>
> Bob Werre
> BobWphoto.com
>
>
>
> Ed wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > > I seriously doubt that there will
> > > ever be any refunds from Creyer Gray.
> > > While John B. had good intentions,
> > > he lost his butt.
> > > Bill Winans
> >
> > Something is amiss with this picture. There never was a contract with
> > a builder. There never was a pilot model. There were one or two photos
> > of a detail part or two. Nothing else was ever actually manufactured
> > to the best of my knowledge. So how can a person lose his shirt (or
> > any other part of his anatomy) when tooling or manufacturing never got
> > started? It would seem to me (an innocent bystander for once) that the
> > deposit money should be lurking in an escrow account somewhere waiting
> > to be refunded. Lots of speculation with few facts, but what else is
> > available? Just trying to help out the RRM project. Good luck...Ed L.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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