Re: [DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch

[Go Linux]

On Mon, 10/24/16, aitor_czr  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org, "Adam Borowski" 
 Date: Monday, October 24, 2016, 12:48 PM
 
[cut]
> 
> But one thing is true: there are not many good gtk3-themes at the moment [*].
> 
[cut]
> 
> [*]  Vertex is one of them.
> 



I have found vertex to be buggy.  And it falls over badly on synaptic etc.  
Hope something better appears before needed for ascii . . .

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch

[Go Linux]

On Wed, 10/19/16, Robert Storey  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Wednesday, October 19, 2016, 8:10 AM
> 
> Hi all,
>   
> I think this idea of having a Clearlooks option is fine. It would be a nice 
> feature to boast about for the next > release (version 8.1?).
> 



Perhaps you didn't understand my comment about Clearlooks. Basically it's a 
dead project so hardly anything to boast about.  It does not play well with 
gtk3 apps so windows are not styled consistently.  Clearlooks-Phenix fixes most 
of those problems in Jessie and even has an openbox option!  But who knows if 
it will work in ascii because gtk3 is turning into an unholy mess that keeps 
breaking window themes.  The alternatives I've looked at are not promising. 
Gnome wants to have their 'branded' style consistent without user 
intervention/choice so I think some of this is on purpose.  But synaptic (and a 
few other gnome apps) are handy to have around and it would be nice to have 
them look and function properly.  Even Clearlooks-Phenix may totally fail in 
ascii.  I haven't ventured there yet (and am not looking forward to it) . . .

golinux


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Re: [DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 10/18/16, Steve Litt <sl...@troubleshooters.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, October 18, 2016, 12:40 PM
 
On Tue, 18 Oct 2016 14:30:52 + (UTC)
Go Linux <goli...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> Here's a suggestion . . .
>>
>> Why don't you roll your own low vision-friendly Refracta! 
>>

> That ain't a half bad idea!

OK.  Let's get to it!

>>
>> That would be so easy to do with refractasnapshot
>>

> I'll need guidance with refractasnapshot.

http://www.ibiblio.org/refracta/documents.html

>>
>> after you've made the appropriate changes
>>

> Yeah, that was my next question. Changes to what? Where do I start in
> making this theme?

Change the wallpaper/background by right clicking on the desktop.  Fonts, etc. 
from Menu > Settings > Appearance

>>
>> and way more efficient than us trying to figure
>> out what would and wouldn't work.   
>>

> Yeah, I could do it in a day, which is way quicker than a back and
> forth via IRC.

Time will tell.

>>
>> Don't know if fsr has room to
>> host it himself but he could surely provide prominent links to it on
>> the Refracta website, forum and sourceforge.
>>

> Well wait. This thing is only relevant if, at boot, the person can
> choose it. If it's hosted elsewhere, and the user must navigate through
> an interface he can't see in order to download it, it's not worth doing.
>

Anybody interested in refracta would be made aware of a low-vision friendly 
edition and where to download it.  And as fsr mentioned, perhaps it could be 
included in the main iso as another user.  Only problem I see with that is that 
refracta is pared down to fit on a cd so there might not be room to do it that 
way.

> 
> Remember, this is like a buried shovel. The user must read in order to
> use my theme, and must use my theme to read.
> 

See above.  Potential users will READ before they download so will know how and 
where to get what they need.

> 
> Does Refracta ship with a factory direct, untweaked clearlooks? That
> might be a good place to start.
> 

Both Devuan and Refracta use a customized Clearlooks-Phenix theme.  Clearlooks 
is not GTK3 friendly and these days GTK3 support is really needed.  
Clearlooks-Phenix was the best compromise.

>
> And I'll need your help on this, because I don't know which files and
> variables change which properties. I'll just ask you on #debianfork.
> 

That should get you started.

> 
> Thanks,
> 
> SteveT
> 

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Re: [DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch

[Go Linux]

On Mon, 10/17/16, Steve Litt  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Monday, October 17, 2016, 7:14 PM
>  
>  A COUPLE OTHER REFRACTA SUGGESTIONS
>  
>  The Refracta I installed on the laptop was very hostile to those with
>  bad vision. It had this garish mostly orange and some black background
>  that camouflaged any desktop icons and even terminals. The terminals
>  were set to some low contrast thing like #aa on #00, with small
>  fonts, and transparency. Imagine how hard it was to read anything when
>  the garish background obscured the tiny, low contrast writing on the
>  terminal.
>  
>  Pretty is nice, but pretty is a luxury for the well-sighted. Those of
>  us with lousy vision hugely prioritize legibility, which is usually a
>  direct tradeoff with pretty. There are times I can't read pretty enough
>  to configure it to legibility.
>  
>  So I'd suggest a second theme for Refracta, either selectible at boot,
>  or runnable by a click on the top left desktop icon (remember, the user
>  might not be seeing the icon clearly enough to read it). The legibility
>  theme should feature:
>  
>  * No background image. Just a straight #006600 color, no gradient.
>  
>  * Terminal coloration either #00 on #ff or #ff on #00.
>Yeah, that gives some people headaches, but those of us with bad
>vision can't even use the less contrasty stuff.
>  
>  * Big font for the terminals. Big enough that an 80x25 terminal
>emulator should occupy considerably more than 1/4 of the monitor
>area. Consider bold fonts. Ugly, but more readable to the
>less-sighted.
>  
>  * No friggin transparency!
>  
>  * Window border width of 2px instead of 1px, colored very noticibly,
>especially for the active window (I use #00 for the active window
>border and #66 for the inactive window border). No silly
>gradients on the titlebar: legibility for the poorly sighted demands
>a solid block recognizeable as such.
>  
>  * Window title bar font big, similar to what I described for the
>terminal emulator font, and very contrasty with the window title bar
>background color.
>  
>  * Active window's titlebar *VERY* noticible at a moment's glance. My
>active titlebar has a background of #DD and foreground #CC.
>I'm not color blind, but if I were, I might prefer something like
>#00 on #FF. Ugly to most of us, but to a poorly-sighted
>colorblind person this would be a saving grace.
>  
>  As you read this, it will sound horribly ugly to you, but please
>  remember it will be used by very few. Most people will use the standard
>  theme. The only purpose of this alternate theme is to help those whose
>  vision is so bad they can't afford pretty. And please remember, unless
>  this alternate theme is either default or dead-bang easy and intuitive
>  to get to, the poorly sighted person will not have the visual acuity to
>  navigate the standard theme enough to make their computer legible.
>  
>  Thanks,
>  
>  SteveT
>  

Here's a suggestion . . . 

Why don't you roll your own low vision-friendly Refracta!  That would be so 
easy to do with refractasnapshot after you've made the appropriate changes and 
way more efficient than us trying to figure out what would and wouldn't work.   
Don't know if fsr has room to host it himself but he could surely provide 
prominent links to it on the Refracta website, forum and sourceforge.

Cheers!

golinux

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[DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch

[Go Linux]

FYI . . . Refracta 8.0 gets a nice review on Distrowatch

http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20161017#refracta

Way to go fsmithred!

golinux
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[DNG] A chromium "wontfix" webcam video bug

[Go Linux]

This is a bit off-topic but I wanted to record it here should anyone else run 
across this bug that chrome/chromium devs have intentionally inflicted on their 
users.

This saga began when I purchased my first webcam - a Logitech C270 - a few 
weeks ago. It took a little fiddling with .asoundrc to get the audio working - 
thanks archwiki! After that tweak, everything seemed to work.  Cheese was good. 
 Hangouts worked just fine on FF.  But nothing would activate video on 
meet.jit.si (or hangouts) on chromium even though the settings correctly 
identified the camera and it was definitely "live".

I finally connected with one of the devs on freenode#jitsi. At first he was 
stumped.  But then he suggested I try appending #config.resolution=360 to the 
meet.jit.si url.  

Bingo! Reducing the resolution allowed the camera to function even though it 
had the capability for 720p.

He pointed me to this old chrome/chromium wontfix bug:

https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=399939#c22

Note this bug also prevents hangouts from working on chromium and the above 
hack didn't work for me.  So much for backwards compatibility . . .

Would be nice if the jitsi folks added the hack into their code but I'm not 
holding my breath.  These days google is pretty much of a lost cause . . .

golinux
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[DNG] The systemd debate in pictures

[Go Linux]

Ran across this a few days ago.  The TC was deaf and blind to the concerns 
raised about systemd.  Then they tried to shut us down with a big stick.  Steve 
Litt . . . do you recognize Strong-arm Don?  Enjoy! And have a good laugh!!

http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/three_monkeys.jpg

golinux
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Re: [DNG] hplip need systemd

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 10/4/16, Rick Moen  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] hplip need systemd
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, October 4, 2016, 2:51 PM
 
Quoting Bardot J??r??me (bardot.jer...@gmail.com):
>> 
>> I don't know if you know but hplip need policykit and therefore systemd.
>> 
> 
> You don't need _package_ HPLIP.  You just need printer-driver-hpcups and
> printer-driver-hpijs.  Package hplip is an omnibus desktop-oriented
> packaging of the HPIJS and HPLIP drivers, and therefore includes
> GNOME-dependency hooks.
> 



Indeed, cups does print.  But it doesn't have perks of the HP device manager 
that lets you clean/align and check the status of the cartridges etc. At least 
I haven't found that in cups.  So I'm keeping my good ol' squeeze around that 
has hplip installed so I access those functions should I ever need them.

Related tip . . . my black cartridge dried out a few months ago.  I found a 
youtube video that offered several suggestions how to get it working again.  I 
chose to soak the head in warm distilled water for a few hours.  It worked!! 
And that cartridge is still functioning months later.

golinux

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[DNG] Firefox nightly [now] requires Pulse Audio

[Go Linux]

I hope that someone will be able to devise a way to keep alsa a viable 
alternative. You can read the sad news here . . .

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=20=130028

golinux
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Re: [DNG] On talk.do and Web forums

[Go Linux]

Maybe someone else has something to say?  Especially if you revel in beating a 
dead horse . . .

-
On Wed, 9/28/16, hellekin  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG] On talk.do and Web forums
 To: "dng" 
 Date: Wednesday, September 28, 2016, 3:08 AM
>  
> On IRC #devuan:  hellekin: Can we PLEASE move on from
> Discourse.  Very few people are using it and those who are loathe it for
> the most part.  It's holding back Devuan's community growth!
> 

I left that message on #devuan-www not #devuan

> 
> Let me state it one last time, by email, so that it can be read by
> everyone and we can have a discussion about it, instead of a persistent
> and frankly annoying counter-productive attitude regarding talk.devuan.org.
> 
> No, we're not moving on from Discourse.
> 

And there you have it.

> 
> Yes, very few people are using it.
> 

That should tell you something.

> 
> Yes, *some* people insist on loathing it, and although I have tried to
> address every single of their arguments, they keep coming at it without
> even trying (e.g., to *not* use the Web after their account is
> registered.)  Maybe there's some missing documentation about how to use
> Discourse as a mailing list only.
> 

Personally, I don't want to mix ML apples with forum oranges.  

> 
> I don't think anybody here as much to say against mailing list apart
> from the well-known issues:
>

[blah, blah why discourse is so amazing]

>
> So, I understand that Discourse is not for everyone, its web interface
> requires some heavy Javascript that can be slow, and it doesn't look
> like you would like, and certainly not like any forum out there, where
> you just sit and shout.  But you need to understand that:
> 
> 1) we're thinking of a *tool* towards a *goal*: knowledge management
> 2) it can be *used by email* (as a mailing list, requiring very few
> interaction with the Web at all)
> 3) nothing prevents anyone from *setting up another forum software*
> 

Sigh . . . As someone discussing talk.do on another forum nicely summed up:

". . .  the forum design over there is a bit perplexing given the philosophy 
that gave birth to Devuan in the first place."

How did we get from KISS to bloated, Fisher-Price SNS in a heartbeat?

> 
> Which brings me to the last argument: "It's holding back Devuan's
> community growth!"
> 
> Really, golinux, do you think it does?  FriendsOfDevuan has a wiki that
> is mentioned in the official documentation page on
> devuan.org/os/documentation while it's not operated by the VUA, so be my
> guest and make a popular forum that will help grow the Devuan community.
> I think the two objectives are orthogonal, and certainly not incompatible.
> 

I don't see multiplicity of forums/blogs as a solution to the deficiencies of 
an 'official' forum.

> 
> I know you've been arguing the talk.do was a threat to the mailing
> lists.  
> 

FTR, I don't 'argue'.  I do express opinions however . . .  At one point I 
thought dng might be going byebye once the forum was available.  It didn't and 
I'm happy about that (though lately nothing has been happening there either).  

> 
> Yet, officially, DNG has been replaced by devuan-discuss and
> devuan-announce mailing lists, which see seldom traffic so far.
> 

Which again says something.

> 
> That means we're not in an univocal world where "the VUA decide" and "the
> community follows".  
> 

We're not?

> 

[snip]

> 
> With Devuan we're trying to give another take on what an universal OS
> means, and for that we want to have a compact set of tools that enables
> more diversity in the expression of what is, how to make, and who makes
> "a distro". *In my opinion*, talk.do has an important role to play in
> this strategy, as does the devuan-sdk, and Amprolla and build
> automation, etc.  But I certainly do not support the idea that my
> opinion is the only valid one.  I'd rather not have *another* forum
> software under devuan.org to avoid dissipating energies.  But I
> certainly cannot prevent the community from deciding that my vision is
> moot and go on setting up something that may eventually replace it.
> Devuan is not Python: there's no one-true-way here.
> 

But it seems 'your vision' = the one true 'official' Devuan forum and that is 
non-negotiable.

The ship will either sail or sink.  It is a process that only time will sort 
out.  I surrender . . .

:)

golinux


> 
> <3
> 
> ==
> hk
> 
> P.S.: I'm tempted to post this to devuan-discuss and talk.do, but hey,
> let's not cross-post :)
> 
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Re: [DNG] eudev [was: vdev]

[Go Linux]

On Wed, 8/24/16, Brad Campbell  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] eudev [was: vdev]
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Wednesday, August 24, 2016, 1:55 AM
 
> On 24/08/16 13:57, Steve Litt wrote:
>> On Wed, 24 Aug 2016 11:37:53 +0800
>> Brad Campbell  wrote:
>>
>>> On 24/08/16 11:13, Steve Litt wrote:

[snip]


 These saboteurs just won't quit. It's our job to get out the word so
 bus1 fares no better than kdbus, because Lennart bragged about his
 plans when he gets the kernel to enforce use of systemd.
>>>
>>> I'm not worried. Mantra from get-go has been "Don't break userspace".
>>> If there is a valid use-case for a feature there will be plenty of
>>> opposition to it's removal.
>>
>> [snip]
>>>
>>> If bus1 really has technical merit, can demonstrate it solves real
>>> problems and has all its shortcomings addressed there is no reason it
>>> shouldn't be integrated into the kernel. They can't then just go and
>>> remove netlink to spite non-systemd users. It has an existing
>>> userspace and other use cases.
>>
>> Assuming by "they" you mean the Lennart and the Redhats, they already
>> have an established pattern and practice of breaking user space. If you
>> mean the kernel developers, they won't be the ones breaking userspace,
>> but a kernel-included bus1 will act very much like the firmware chips
>> they put into toner cartridges just so you won't buy competing toner.
> 
> I'm not entirely sure you understand what I mean by "break userspace".
> It is entirely in the context of the kernel and its interface with
> userspace and absolutely nothing to do with userspace itself. It means
> they can't just go and rip bits out of the kernel that mean *our*
> userspace won't run on it. I don't care what they do with *their* userspace.
> 
>> We're way past the point of thinking the world is a technocracy.
>>
>> Edbarx said it best: "attempting to remove systemd from SID is more
>> like attempting to remove the DNA from living cells expecting them not
>> to die."
>>
>> That sounds very much like breaking userspace to me.
> 
> No, again you have the wrong end of the "userspace". You refer to
> distributions, and I don't care what those distributions do, what they
> break or which init they use. What I care passionately about is ensuring
> that stuff that runs right now continues to run on newer kernels. Oddly
> enough, history has shown that's generally what Linus appears to care
> about also.
> 
> It takes *years* of notice and warning for features to be marked
> deprecated, and then years for them to be removed. *If* during those
> years we discover that our device manager is going to cease to function,
> we have several years to figure out a solution and get it implemented
> and tested. That's a BIG *IF*.
> 
> Don't Panic.
> 

Apropos of this discussion . . . there is a new troll on FDN ramping up the 
rhetoric.  It is revisionist history in action!  Number one on his list speaks 
volumes:

1. systemd users don't care about compatibility to other NIXes in the same way 
that BSD doesn't care about compatibility to us or our licenses. There hasn't 
been 100% POSIX in ages.

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?p=623008#p623008

golinux

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Re: [DNG] eudev [was: vdev]

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 8/23/16, Steve Litt  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] eudev [was: vdev]
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, August 23, 2016, 5:10 PM
 
>> On Sun, 8/21/16, Daniel Reurich  wrote:
>>
>>  Subject: Re: [DNG] eudev [was: vdev]
>>  To: dng@lists.dyne.org
>>  Date: Sunday, August 21, 2016, 3:08 PM
>> >>
>> >> He guys,
>> >>
>> >> I've been at work for a week or so and today I looked at the DNG
>> >> list for the latest activities around vdev, but there has almost
>> >> been no activity on vdev as far as I can see. OTOH, last week I
>> >> tested eudev on a separate partition and that seems to work quite
>> >> well. 
>> >
>> > You are mistaken, there has been lots of activity around vdev and
>> > making it installable.
>> >   
>> >>
>> >> I think it might be a good idea to leave vdev for what it is and
>> >> to switch to eudev. It is moreorless maintained (the latest change
>> >> is two weeks ago) and it works well. We should not reinvent the
>> >> wheel IMHO. And as there has been no response from the original
>> >> vdev author, I think it's better to package eudev for Devuan and
>> >> to make it available for Jessie and Ascii. The latest version is
>> >> 3.2. 
>> >
>> > Well quite frankly you don't get to make that call.  Eudev is just a
>> > hack that from what I gather is isolating the systemd-udev changes
>> > and bringing them in to eudev.  IMHO that is less sustainable then
>> > vdev because it relies on developers from systemd to play nice with
>> > udev and not deprecate features that don't serve systemd's needs.
>> > At the end of the day, I consider eudev as at best marginally
>> > better the eudev, but still far to closely coupled with systemd to
>> > be useful in the medium to long term.
>> >
>> > With regards to vdev, I'm sure if Jude didn't come back, others
>> > would pick up his work and progress it, as is happening now around
>> > packaging it.  I think it rather disingenuous of you to imply it's
>> > a dead project whilst claiming that eudev, the re-animated zombie
>> > of systemd-udev as a better and only option.  It's not better, and
>> > it's not the only option either.
>> >
>> > Whilst I respect the work to package eudev and having it as an
>> > option in Devuan, I will personally very loudly push back on any
>> > attempt to derail alternatives such as vdev - unless those
>> > alternative are demonstrably built on the same flawed design
>> > principles as systemd.
>> >
>> > Daniel.
>> > 
>>
>> 
>>
>> I agree that relying on anything connected to udev will likely not be
>> sustainable in the long term.  I was reminded of this just today in a
>> private discussion I'm having with someone over at FDN . . . yes, I
>> still hang out there to advocate for non-systemd Linux.  S/he posted
>> this link which finally pushed them over the edge and away from the
>> path that Debian has taken:
>>
>> https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2014-May/019657.html
>> 
> By the way, when did Linux OK kdbus?
> 
> SteveT
> 


I don't think they have.  That was Lennart's wishful thinking.   Wasn't it 
around that time that Kay Sievers tried and Linus boxed him hard upside the 
head and sent him packing?  

golinux

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Re: [DNG] eudev [was: vdev]

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 8/21/16, Daniel Reurich  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] eudev [was: vdev]
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Sunday, August 21, 2016, 3:08 PM
>>
>> He guys,
>>
>> I've been at work for a week or so and today I looked at the DNG list
>> for the latest activities around vdev, but there has almost been no
>> activity on vdev as far as I can see. OTOH, last week I tested eudev on
>> a separate partition and that seems to work quite well.
> 
> You are mistaken, there has been lots of activity around vdev and making
> it installable.
> 
>>
>> I think it might be a good idea to leave vdev for what it is and
>> to switch to eudev. It is moreorless maintained (the latest change is
>> two weeks ago) and it works well. We should not reinvent the wheel IMHO.
>> And as there has been no response from the original vdev author, I think
>> it's better to package eudev for Devuan and to make it available for
>> Jessie and Ascii. The latest version is 3.2.
> 
> Well quite frankly you don't get to make that call.  Eudev is just a
> hack that from what I gather is isolating the systemd-udev changes and
> bringing them in to eudev.  IMHO that is less sustainable then vdev
> because it relies on developers from systemd to play nice with udev and
> not deprecate features that don't serve systemd's needs.  At the end of
> the day, I consider eudev as at best marginally better the eudev, but
> still far to closely coupled with systemd to be useful in the medium to
> long term.
> 
> With regards to vdev, I'm sure if Jude didn't come back, others would
> pick up his work and progress it, as is happening now around packaging
> it.  I think it rather disingenuous of you to imply it's a dead project
> whilst claiming that eudev, the re-animated zombie of systemd-udev as a
> better and only option.  It's not better, and it's not the only option
> either.
> 
> Whilst I respect the work to package eudev and having it as an option in
> Devuan, I will personally very loudly push back on any attempt to derail
> alternatives such as vdev - unless those alternative are demonstrably
> built on the same flawed design principles as systemd.
> 
> Daniel.
>



I agree that relying on anything connected to udev will likely not be 
sustainable in the long term.  I was reminded of this just today in a private 
discussion I'm having with someone over at FDN . . . yes, I still hang out 
there to advocate for non-systemd Linux.  S/he posted this link which finally 
pushed them over the edge and away from the path that Debian has taken:

https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2014-May/019657.html

I remember that from the time it was written and heated discussions were 
swirling on FDN and debian-user.  Let it be a reminder to all of you also.

Now that I finally have qemu up and running (thanks to fsmithred), I'll be 
happy to test any vdev isos from aitor and hope that many of you will do the 
same.  It's time to buckle down and get serious . . . 

golinux 
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Re: [DNG] How bad would it be to require Python3?

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 8/21/16, Steve Litt  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] How bad would it be to require Python3?
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Sunday, August 21, 2016, 10:34 AM
 
On Sun, 21 Aug 2016 09:34:17 -0400
fsmithred  wrote:

> On 08/21/2016 02:57 AM, Steve Litt wrote:
>
> >> What do you mean by "default"?  There is no default (other than
> >> between versions of python 2 and between versions of python 3),
> >> these two are fully coinstallable,   
> >
> > When you do a plain vanilla, follow every default installation of
> > Devuan, which gets installed:
> >
> > 1. Python 2?
> > 2. Python 3?
> > 3. Python 2 and 3?
> > 4. Neither?
> >
> >   
>
>
> You get both python2.7 and python3.4 with the default desktop install
> of devuan beta. I guess the default version would be the one that
> /usr/bin/python points to, which is currently 2.7.

I'm gonna ask a dumb and repetitive question, just so I don't make a
dumb and messy mistake...

In the preceding paragraph, do you mean that both 2.whatever and
3.whatever are **installed on the disk and ready to run** when you
install Devuan and agree with all the defaults during installation?

Thanks,

SteveT



Why don't you just install a vanilla devuan to see what you'd get.  That way 
you'd know for sure.  ;)

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Distrowatch Devuan poll do-over

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 8/19/16, fsmithred <fsmith...@gmail.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Distrowatch Devuan poll do-over
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, August 19, 2016, 1:06 PM

On 08/19/2016 01:31 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
>> On Fri, 19 Aug 2016 13:55:49 +0000 (UTC)
>> Go Linux <goli...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Fri, 8/19/16, Adam Borowski <kilob...@angband.pl> wrote:
>>
>>> What's the point of a poll that's stuffed with votes from one side?
>>>   
>>
>>> What's the point of any poll or election?  I imagine that would
>>> depend whether you agree with those doing the 'stuffing'.  ;)  Why
>>> shouldn't it be those of us supporting Devuan?
>>>
>>> golinux
>>
>> Well said!
>>
>> Whether it's intentional sabotage or ballot stuffing, I'm a lot more
>> likely to retain a high sense of dignity and ethics if my opponents are
>> playing by the rules.
>>
>> Or, as one of the characters in "Lucifer's Hammer" says toward the end
>> of the book, "A society adopts the ethics they can afford."
>>
>> SteveT
>>
 ___

> For anyone who's interested in the results before they got wiped, what I
> recall is that around half said they would never try it, a quarter said
> they'd try it later.
> 
> Among those who had tried it, three times as many said it was ready than
> said it needed a lot of work. And those who said in needed a little work
> were between the other two groups.
> 
> For raw numbers, the only one I remember is that 12 said it was ready. I'm
> a little slow with math, so I'll stop here.
> 
> -fsr

That last number was at least 120 - maybe a typo?   My click was #70!

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Distrowatch Devuan poll do-over

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 8/19/16, Adam Borowski <kilob...@angband.pl> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Distrowatch Devuan poll do-over
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, August 19, 2016, 2:13 AM
 
On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 01:21:24AM +0000, Go Linux wrote:

>> The Distrowatch poll posted by Jim Murphy a few days ago - 
>> https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20160816.141551.cded4448.en.html - 
>> went sideways this morning.  It was archived with results from another 
>> unrelated poll.  I emailed to let them know and suddenly the odometer was 
>> back to zero and there were about 15 votes.  So looks like they managed to 
>> 'lose' the original data.
>>
>> Time to go click again:
>>
>>  http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20160815#poll
>>
>> Polls may not be important but still . . .
> 
> 
> What's the point of a poll that's stuffed with votes from one side?
> 


What's the point of any poll or election?  I imagine that would depend whether 
you agree with those doing the 'stuffing'.  ;)  Why shouldn't it be those of us 
supporting Devuan?

golinux
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[DNG] Distrowatch Devuan poll do-over

[Go Linux]

The Distrowatch poll posted by Jim Murphy a few days ago - 
https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20160816.141551.cded4448.en.html - went 
sideways this morning.  It was archived with results from another unrelated 
poll.  I emailed to let them know and suddenly the odometer was back to zero 
and there were about 15 votes.  So looks like they managed to 'lose' the 
original data.

Time to go click again:

 http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20160815#poll

Polls may not be important but still . . .

golinux
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Re: [DNG] vdev - udev is a dead end

[Go Linux]

On Wed, 8/10/16, richard lucassen  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] vdev - udev is a dead end
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Wednesday, August 10, 2016, 11:35 AM
 
 On Wed, 10 Aug 2016
 16:59:58 +0100
 Simon Hobson 
 wrote:
 
 > How long before he decides that Grub needs "improving" ?
 
 How long before he decides that the kernel needs "improving"?
 
 -- 
 richard lucassen
 http://contact.xaq.nl/
 


Isn't that what Kay Sievers' kdbus was all about?

golinux
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[DNG] Security news about TCP weakness

[Go Linux]

For those of you so inclined.  Is this important, old news or just academic 
posturing?  

golinux

--

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/08/160809143253.htm

Serious security threat to many Internet users highlighted

Communications involving Linux and Android systems can be compromised quickly, 
easily and from anywhere

Date:August 9, 2016
Source:University of California - Riverside
Summary:Researchers have identified a weakness in the Transmission Control 
Protocol of all Linux operating systems since late 2012 that enables attackers 
to hijack users' internet communications completely remotely. 
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Re: [DNG] vdev

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 8/9/16, richard lucassen  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] vdev
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, August 9, 2016, 2:14 PM
 
On Tue, 9 Aug 2016 20:56:56 +0200
aitor_czr  wrote:

> Some *postinst* and *postrm* files are needed in the packaging, and
> i'm working on that.

I installed the i386 packages, but these do not work quite well. It
works, but permissions and ownerships are not set correctly.

OTOH it seems to work well in a separate /mnt/vdev-test/ directory when
running vdevd from a "git clone" and after running a "make -C vdevd".
The i386 library packages are working ok, so no need to install these
from git.

The only thing that I had to correct is some entries in the
example/vdevd.conf. The "actions" dir e.g. is in the example dir and not
the build dir as stated in the conf file.

After running:

build/sbin/vdevd -v2 -c example/vdevd.conf \
-l /var/log/vdev/vdevd.log /mnt/vdev-test/

the /mnt/vdev-test/ directory is populated with AFAICS the right
devices and the right permissions/ownerships. When adding a usb stick,
I get a /mnt/vdev-test/sdb1 which can be mounted in one or another
directory.

So, at a first glance it seems to work for the moment in a separate
device directory.

Oh, BTW, when packaging vdevd, I'd opt for the /etc/vdev/ dir and not
the /usr/etc/vdev/ dir. Another thing is that the /run/vdev/ directory
does not exist and that the pid file could not be initialized. When
telling vdevd.conf to create /run/vdevd.pid it works fine.

Maybe it's an idea to first create a vdevd-shadow package which creates
a /dev/shadow/ directory and creates devices in that directory while
udev is still doing its job. I don't know if this is possible (I think
it is) and it might be much more attractive for many people to test
vdevd. Switching to vdevd instead of udevd might be too risky for many
folks. Especially when you don't want to run the risk for a bricked
device.

Just my 2 cts. Keep up the good work :)

R.



Hi Richard . . .

I have just forwarded this post to Jude and encouraged him to drop in to DNG 
more often.  Another way to help move the project along would be to open an 
issue under vdev in git.

https://git.devuan.org/unsystemd/vdev

Your experiments with vdev are most welcome.  Thank you!

golinux

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Re: [DNG] SystemD's brownie points over non-systemd OSs.

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 8/7/16, Adam Borowski  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] SystemD's brownie points over non-systemd OSs.
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Sunday, August 7, 2016, 9:42 PM
 
On Sun, Aug 07, 2016 at 06:31:10PM +0200, Edward Bartolo wrote:
>> http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=16=621842#p621842
>>
>> Excuse me for the topic title. But the above link at first looked like
>> some inherent advantage in using SystemD. However, after a little
>> reflection, a couple of minutes, it seems there are actually no extra
>> brownie-points in using SystemD.
>>
>> This *appears* like an advantage SystemD users have over non-systemd
>> users. But if Devuan allows the use of virtualisation software, the
>> same can be achieved without requiring any sort of benediction
>> SystemD.
>>
>> virtualbox is the Devuan 64 bit repository. So, the above is not an
>> advantage but another way to make a cup of tea rather than the known
>> ways.
>
> virtualbox is _not_ an equivalent.  What virtualbox and qemu-kvm, or
proprietary vmware and MS Hyper-V, do, is full machine virtualization.
You put an entire operating system inside, with its own kernel, and it
can be anything, even Windows or SCO ClosedServer if you fancy so.
> 
systemd-nspawn is a worse clone of lxc which in turn is a worse remake
of vserver and openvz.  These run using host's kernel.
> 
The difference between these two is mostly in efficiency and memory use.
While for most devices (network, disk) the cost of full virtualization
isn't significant (but always noticeable), the memory needs are MASSIVE.
With OS-level virtualization, it costs you only for processes that are
running.  That's around 100KB for init (obvious snide skipped), 1.1MB
for rsyslogd, perhaps 380KB for sshd if you dislike "vserver exec" or
"lxc-attach" and that's it.  Anything more are daemons that do productive
work.  It's not uncommon to put 400ish vservers on a single physical
machine in production[1], or tens of thousands to prove a point.  And on
a load spike, any vserver can take most of the machine's memory and
resources (of course, if others stay mostly quiet at that time), which
works wonders if you do maintenance serially.
On the other hand, full-machine virtualization costs you the max of assigned
memory to that system, at all time. 
> 
systemd-nspawn, lxc and docker[2] are built upon chroot+unshare+cgroups+
seccomp.  The purposes of those are:
* chroot: separating the filesystem
* unshare: separating namespaces.  Of note are the mount namespace (a
  container can have mounts of its own), hostname, network (containers
  have their own IPs, routing tables, etc), user (you get to be root inside
  yet can't break the rest)
* cgroups: resource limiting: caps and fair share of CPU/memory/IO/etc
* seccomp: syscalls which could harm the rest of the system are vetoed
> 
You can try playing with those on your own.  Especially "unshare -n"
(read the manpage) is fun!
> 
But for a whole package, use lxc.  It will configure all of the above for
you.  systemd-nspawn is merely a NIH copy of it.
> 

> [1]. Depends on what your customers do, obviously.
> [2]. Docker is mostly about what you put _inside_ the container, but can
manage them on its own.
> 


I posted a link to this response at the FDN link posted above.  This was the 
response from the author of the howto:

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?p=621972#p621972

He concludes:

". . . I would prefer to use the systemd-supplied components (systemd-boot, 
systemd-networkd, systemd-resolved, etc) wherever available as I believe this 
offers a more cohesive, UNIX-like working environment."

That would depend on your definition of a 'UNIX-like working environment' IMO.

golinux





 
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Re: [DNG] IRC Channel

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 8/5/16, KatolaZ <kato...@freaknet.org> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] IRC Channel
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, August 5, 2016, 3:42 AM
 
On Fri, Aug 05, 2016 at 02:21:36AM +0000, Go Linux wrote:

[cut]

>>
>> When I set it to connect via ssl, it just sat there working but never 
>> connected.  Maybe I need to open a port?  Or maybe . . . if it works don't 
>> try to fix it.  ;)
>>
>
> I think you have to register your nick in order to be able to connect
> via SSL on freenode. You might find relevant info here:
> 
>   https://freenode.net/kb/answer/registration
> 

> My2Cents
> 
> KatolaZ
> 



Thanks but I am already registered and cloaked.  That's one of the first things 
my mentors advised me to do.  :)

golinux
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Re: [DNG] IRC Channel

[Go Linux]

On Wed, 8/3/16, Rick Moen <r...@linuxmafia.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] IRC Channel
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Wednesday, August 3, 2016, 6:33 PM
 
Quoting Go Linux (goli...@yahoo.com):

> @KatolaZ - Did not know about using port  so I got to learn
> something too!  Now I need to figure out where to make that setting .
> . . there are so many things I don;t know . . .

For irssi and many other IRC clients, port number can be specified as a
command-line option, and equivalently in the configuration file where you
define how to connect to various IRC networks/hosts.

If you have no other preference, I'll put in a good word for irssi.



I use xchat. What can I say, it works.  (Wish my typing did.)  No config file 
but there was an option to "use SSL for all the servers on this network 
(freenode)" and I ticked it.  I guess that's it.  It's been a long day . . . 

golinux
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Re: [DNG] IRC Channel

[Go Linux]

On Wed, 8/3/16, aitor_czr  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] IRC Channel
 To: "KatolaZ" , "dng" 
 Date: Wednesday, August 3, 2016, 7:59 AM
  
>> Aitor, according to the screenshot, you are connected to "DALnet",
>> which is the wrong network. You should connect to to the freenode
>> network:
>>
>> host: irc.freenode.org
>> port: 6667 (or  if you want to use SSL - recommended)
>>
>> then once you are in, join the channel "#devuan" and/or
>> #debianfork.
>>
>> Since you said you are an IRC novice, I guess you might find this
>> tutorial useful:
>>
>>   http://www.irchelp.org/irchelp/irctutorial.html
>>
>>
> My2Cents
>>>
>> KatolaZ
>
> Thanks for the link :)
> 
>   Aitor.
> 



@aitor - All the info needed is also on the devuan website at:

https://devuan.org/os/community#internet-relay-chat

Hope to see you there soon

@KatolaZ - Did not know about using port  so I got to learn something too!  
Now I need to figure out where to make that setting . . . there are so many 
things I don;t know . . .

golinux

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Re: [DNG] Bad website CSS: was Devuan Sticker Poll

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 7/30/16, Steve Litt  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG] Bad website CSS: was Devuan Sticker Poll
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Saturday, July 30, 2016, 1:10 PM
 
On Sat, 30 Jul 2016 12:14:44 +0100
Rainer Weikusat  wrote:

>> hellekin  writes:

>> > https://talk.devuan.org/t/devuan-merchandise/177/2?u=hellekin

> When I render the preceding on my computer with my (fairly large font)
> settings, the line spacing is so narrow that the top of many letters
> touch the bottoms of the letters above them. It's *very* hard to read.
> I find this same insanely narrow line spacing on many devuan.org pages.
> 
> Here's a screenshot:
> 
> http://a3b3.com/stuff/devuan_org_compressed_lines.png
> 
> SteveT



I think that is a pale moon failure because with nosquint on iceweasel/ff 
there's no overlap:

http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/font-spacing.png

golinux


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Re: [DNG] Bug#832508: O: systemd-shim -- SysVinit shim for systemd

[Go Linux]

Regarding https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=832508 on the 
demise of systemd-shim.  Posting here because it's unlikely many will see a 
post to devuan-discuss (if it ever gets approved).

golinux

--

Message #10 received at 832...@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox, reply):
From: "Iain R. Learmonth" 
To: Martin Pitt , 832...@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#832508: O: systemd-shim -- SysVinit shim for systemd
Date: Tue, 26 Jul 2016 15:33:43 +0100

Hi,

On 26/07/16 10:09, Martin Pitt wrote:
> Package: wnpp
> 
> Neither Steve nor I still have any interest in maintaining
> systemd-shim. Debian's default init system is systemd, Ubuntu supports
> nothing else any more (and does not even have systemd-shim any more),
> upstart is gone from both Debian and Ubuntu, so the only use case for
> it right now is running Debian with SysVinit (in particular, on
> non-Linux flavors).

Just a suggestion, but maybe ping a Devuan mailing list. If those guys
are interested in continuing to support sysvinit then maybe they would
be happy to take this.

I'd much prefer to see efforts within Debian that can benefit a wider
community than hacks patched on top that only benefit a smaller group.

Thanks,
Iain.


Message #15 received at 832...@bugs.debian.org (full text, mbox, reply):
From: Martin Pitt 
To: "Iain R. Learmonth" 
Cc: 832...@bugs.debian.org
Subject: Re: Bug#832508: O: systemd-shim -- SysVinit shim for systemd
Date: Tue, 26 Jul 2016 16:47:51 +0200

Hello Iain,

Iain R. Learmonth [2016-07-26 15:33 +0100]:
> Just a suggestion, but maybe ping a Devuan mailing list.

Good idea, I sent it to
https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/list/devuan-discuss.en.html
(might take a bit to appear, I'm not subscribed).

Martin

-- 
Martin Pitt| http://www.piware.de
Ubuntu Developer (www.ubuntu.com)  | Debian Developer  (www.debian.org)








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Re: [DNG] Ugly, ugly news

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 7/26/16, Rick Moen  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Ugly, ugly news
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, July 26, 2016, 4:09 AM
 
Quoting Simon Walter (si...@gikaku.com):

> Did the Debian leadership do a poll to find out what their users
> wanted and who were their typical users?

To the based of my recollection, no.

[snip]



This is a must read on the politics and votes that ensured a systemd future for 
debian:

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=20=120652

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Gtk-theme for Devuan

[Go Linux]

Response inline.


On Sun, 7/24/16, aitor_czr <aitor_...@gnuinos.org> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Gtk-theme for Devuan
 To: "Go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>, Dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Sunday, July 24, 2016, 5:28 AM
 
> Hi Golinux,

> On 07/24/2016 10:08 AM, <emnin...@riseup.net>  wrote:
>> Am Sat, 23 Jul 2016 19:32:34 +
>> schrieb Go Linux<goli...@yahoo.com>:
>>
>>> >Vertex messes with the size and spacing on the panel icons too.  And
>>> >the white inactive titlebar is just too gtk3ish for my taste. It
>>> >blends with the white BG on pages so I have a hard time finding where
>>> >the apps are on the page.  I also see macish circle control buttons
>>> >on the pdf reader. UGH! And the PDF reader slider is about 1/8 inch
>>> >wide.  That's got to be a gtk3 "improvement".  There is also some
>>> >blue around check-box choices.  And I just noticed that the input bar
>>> >on xchat is now dark green
>> As far as i see, i do not have those problems with vertex (but i use
>> vertex-dark!). May be that's due to the fact, i use JWM (?). For
>> sure, Vertex has problems with gtk3 but as far as i see they are less
>> than others (Clearlook for example!)
>>
>> I do not find Xchat, but in Hexchat, my input line is dark, with white
>> foreground (fonts) - as i would expect it, using a dark theme.
> 
> The pdf reader slider's wide is inherent to the application. Surelly, it
> will happen also with other applications like file-roller and some
> pop-up windows. They are prefabricated tools (probably in PyGtk),
> developed for gnome. And their appearance is horrible independently of
> the used gtk-theme.
> 

Not true!  Just look at the screenies. The sliders and controls in Vertex and 
OSX-Breeze are completely different! So that has to be in the vertex/osx-breeze 
css.  

> 
> Nonetheless, there is no solution for that, just make it less ugly :(
> 

Yes there is either rebuild vertex/osx-breeze or use a different theme.

> 
> However, the circle control buttons can be customized :) They are
> located in gtk-3.0/assets:
> 
> titlebutton.png
> titlebut...@2.png
> titlebutton-close-prelight.png
> titlebutton-close-preli...@2.png
> etc...
> 

I want to start from a theme that works best for my use case.  Of course each 
one of us has different preferences/needs.  Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy has no 
rendering issues on my Devuan XFCE.  I have not yet found another theme that 
doesn't have more problems than it's worth to try to fix.

I suspect emninger's issues are due to the WM he's using.

If anyone following this thread has an interest in the warts that I found for 
both Vertex and OSX-Breeze (I'm sure there are more) in about 5 minutes, you 
can download these screenies: 

http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/screenies.zip

Of course the landscape is always changing and undoubtedly the future will 
bring challenges that will be harder to work around (more SNS and unneeded 
complexity).

golinux 

> 
> Cheers,
> 
>Aitor.
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Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 7/23/16, Robert Storey  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Saturday, July 23, 2016, 10:02 AM
 
golinux said:

>> Thanks for reminding me about reisuo/b. Is reisuo/b really enabled on devuan 
>> by 
>> default?  Seems like I tried it a while back and it didn't work.  So I 
>> checked 
>> /etc/sysctl.conf and the line needed wasn't there (neither was there any 
>> other
>> uncommented line).  So my question is . . . if reisuo/b is enabled by 
>> default in 
>> devuan is it located elsewhere and does kernel.sysrq = 1 work for both 
>> reisuo and 
>> reisub?  Or are they different?  (A quick search has me thinking that one 
>> line works 
>> for both.)
>
> Hi golinux,
> 
> Alt-reisub/o seems to be working for me, and I didn't do anything to enable 
> it.
> 
> If you look in /etc/sysctl.d there is a file README.sysctl which basically 
> says you can create and name config files in this directory just about 
> anything. Here are the notes which I've kept for Ubuntu from back in the 
> pre-systemd days:
> 
> -
> 
> open sysctl.d using 'open as root'
> edit 10-magic-sysrq.conf
> comment out the ridiculous default, replace it with the code to allow all 
> sensible 'magic' keys
> ("1 - enable all functions of sysrq". You might like to give it extra 
> thought. I don't.)
> CODE: SELECT ALL
> #kernel.sysrq = 127
> kernel.sysrq = 1
> 
> save it, and remember to come out of elevated priviledges.
> 



Thanks, Robert . . .

I was grokking your suggestion till I got to the Ubuntu notes. The only file in 
the sysctl.d on Devuan is the README.sysctl.  And grep couldn't find 
10-magic-sysrq.conf so I just put the needed line into sysctl.conf.  I haven't 
tested it but reisub/o should be good to go now.

Cheers!

golinux

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Re: [DNG] Gtk-theme for Devuan

[Go Linux]

Author: emnin...@riseup.net
Date: 2016-07-23 15:46 -500
To: dng
Subject: Re: [DNG] Gtk-theme for Devuan

Am Sat, 23 Jul 2016 19:32:34 + schrieb :

>> I'm comparing OSX-Breeze, GTX and Vertex.
>>
>> IMO, Vertex is best.
>>
>>Aitor.
>>
>
> +1
> 
> If you're interested. i adapted vertex dark, as far as i could, to the
> devuan style guidelines. If you'd like, i could pass it to you. 
> 

---

emninger . . . I've been trying to catch you on IRC and git for some time. The 
dark purpy color in your theme - #3B3B4A - is too blue.  Try something like 
#423B4A instead.

I found the dark theme very disorienting so didn't spend much time checking out 
inconsistencies like I did with aitor's offerings.  Not sure whether the 
problems I saw are in the theme or in the coding of the apps themselves.  There 
may be a way to fix those things in the theme but that would take drilling down 
deep into the code.  If/when I finally get around to that I'll start from the 
original themes to make sure the errors weren't introduced with your individual 
theming.

golinux

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Re: [DNG] Gtk-theme for Devuan

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 7/23/16, aitor_czr <aitor_...@gnuinos.org> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Gtk-theme for Devuan
 To: "Go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>, Dng@lists.dyne.org, Dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Saturday, July 23, 2016, 11:10 AM

Hi again,

On 07/23/2016 02:00 PM, aitor_czr wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I'm working on a flat theme for Devuan, which uses the green theme of
> the init freedom logo:
>
> http://gnuinos.org/Devuan-Green/
>
> It's based on the OSX-Breeze, and seems to be homogeneus. But the theme
> still needs more changes.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Aitor.

What about this other one, based on Vertex:

http://gnuinos.org/Devuan-Green-Vertex/

The purple theme is haromious with the init freedom logo's colour. They
are the same colours used in the website.

100% purpy would be boring :)

I still have to change the blue assets and the borders...

Cheers,

   Aitor.



I really appreciate the work you've put into these.  emninger had previously 
shared a Vertex purpy so I was aware of that theme.  I had a very quick look at 
both of your contributions and found the following.

In addition to the colors of the assets, I found the OSX-Breeze grays are way 
too dark. This theme also reduces the size of the panel icons - I suspect it's 
a border issue.  In addition there are some rollover color problems - a blue 
rollover on the synaptic column options and in thunar, white on white rollovers 
on the menu bar.  PDF reader has an immutable charcoal title bar.  Ugly.

Vertex messes with the size and spacing on the panel icons too.  And the white 
inactive titlebar is just too gtk3ish for my taste. It blends with the white BG 
on pages so I have a hard time finding where the apps are on the page.  I also 
see macish circle control buttons on the pdf reader. UGH! And the PDF reader 
slider is about 1/8 inch wide.  That's got to be a gtk3 "improvement".  There 
is also some blue around check-box choices.  And I just noticed that the input 
bar on xchat is now dark green 

So still a lot of warts that need to be cleaned up.  And there are undoubtedly 
many more waiting to be discovered.

As to colors . . . for each release there will be a primany/signature color - 
purpy for jessie and then there are secondary/ accent colors like leafy.  Of 
course they are harmonious but their dominance or recessiveness defines the 
look of each release.  We are planning to have the website colors change to 
reflect the primary desktop color for each new release too.

Cheers!

golinux





 
 
 
 
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Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

[Go Linux]

On Thu, 7/21/16, Robert Storey  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Thursday, July 21, 2016, 6:51 AM
> 
> For "halt," there are always magic keys, as long as that's not disabled by 
> the sysadmin...
> 
> Alt-SysRq reisuo
> 
> I definitely like the idea that this is enabled by default in Devuan. I 
> actually use it quite a lot.
> 
> cheers,
> Robert
> 



Thanks for reminding me about reisuo/b. Is reisuo/b really enabled on devuan by 
default?  Seems like I tried it a while back and it didn't work.  So I checked 
/etc/sysctl.conf and the line needed wasn't there (neither was there any other 
uncommented line).  So my question is . . . if reisuo/b is enabled by default 
in devuan is it located elsewhere and does kernel.sysrq = 1 work for both 
reisuo and reisub?  Or are they different?  (A quick search has me thinking 
that one line works for both.)

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Flexible software (Was: F1 and special usernames on the login screen)

[Go Linux]

On Thu, 7/21/16, Simon Walter  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Flexible software (Was: F1 and special usernames on the 
login screen)
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Thursday, July 21, 2016, 7:29 PM
 
On 07/20/2016 05:19 AM, Tomasz Torcz wrote:
>> On Tue, Jul 19, 2016 at 09:57:41PM +0200, Jaromil wrote:
>>> On Tue, 19 Jul 2016, Simon Walter wrote:
>>>
 Since this is Devuan (something about veteran *unix* admins, and
 coming from Debian - the *universal* OS), I would not have expected
 Devuan's fans and users to be so close minded.
>>>
>>> I think anyone here should stop taking conversations in DNG as
>>> representative of Devuan. Please note that even those who denigrated
>>> our efforts, names the shitdevuansays hooligans, have done so. I know
>>> the gmane title for the list is misleading (this is not the "devuan
>>> development" list), yet we have not choosen that title for it nor have
>>> never declared this to be a place representative of devuan.
>>>
>>> Devuan has official channels for communication and people who are
>>> appointed to such a communication. As one of them let me say that,
>>> since many here read and run code, I recommend taking the actual
>>> software as the best means of communicating what Devuan is about.
>>
>>   Could you point us to those proper Devuan channels?  Some of us
>> are genuinely interested in challenges when developing the distribution,
>> and getting to know the ways Devuan developers solved those challenges.
>>   Signal to noise ratio is very low here, for each one email with solid
>> technicalities there are at least dozen useless emails.  I would
>> happily leave dng if I could read archives of real development list.
>>
> 
> Are these correct?
> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devuan-announce
> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devuan-discuss
> 


Yes, those are two other ML.  devuan-announce is strictly for announcements.

devuan-discuss is an email interface with the Devuan discourse forum.  There is 
very little activity to date.

There are the IRC channels but they also wander quite a bit as does DNG.

I personally find that the DNG ML has more technical discussion than any of the 
other options.

golinux


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Re: [DNG] Inform DNG users their email has been moved.

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 7/19/16, Edward Bartolo  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Inform DNG users their email has been moved.
 To: "Simon Walter" , "dng" 
 Date: Tuesday, July 19, 2016, 1:31 AM
>  
>   You have been banned from my mail.
>   
>   Thanks for proving who you are and what your intention is.
>   That proves your "advice" is not reliable to be listened to.
>   
>   Adios, and go find some other victim to troll.
>  



Edward, I doubt that anybody cares.  You can ban me too.  You are only a victim 
because you CHOOSE to be according to the novella that you are playing out in 
YOUR OWN MIND!  It must be a living hell to go through life with those filters 
coloring the world around you.  I have supported you over the years but am no 
longer going to be a co-dependent to your folly.  I wish you peace and 
liberation from the prison you have created for yourself.  Perhaps you can find 
some solace in your lovely garden or with your newest, bestest four-legged 
friend.  When you figure things out, I will welcome you back to the real world 
with joy!

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 7/16/16, Steve Litt <sl...@troubleshooters.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Saturday, July 16, 2016, 9:24 AM
 
On Sat, 16 Jul 2016 13:25:58 + (UTC)

Go Linux <goli...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>>
>> Actually this is the place where slim issues are being posted.  ;)
>>
>> https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/slim/issues
>>
>> golinux
> 
> 
> Cool, I just added, at the preceding URL, the request for special login
> names being enumerated on the login screen.
> 
> SteveT
> 


Note to anyone wanting to play with adding text to the Slim login screen . . . 

On my machine, the purpy slim theme is located at 
/usr/share/slim/themes/devuan-curve/slim.theme

There is one description error # background.png is 50x50 leafy green square.  
It should be 
# background.png is 50x50 purpy square.  The hex is correct.

Everything entered on the panel is in pixels and absolute position.

I don't know how to get it into git if I can get this working here.  I'm gonna 
try to figure that out over the next couple of days.  Or I could pass it on to 
someone who is already fluent in git.  :)  Or maybe someone else will figure it 
out before me.  (I'm old and slow counting down to 74 in a few days . . . )

golinux




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Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 7/16/16, Jaromil  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Saturday, July 16, 2016, 4:03 AM
 
On Sat, 16 Jul 2016, Robert Storey wrote:

>>should I report it here:
>>[1]https://git.devuan.org/devuan/slim/issues
>>  
>  
>  yes! that's the place where we hope everyone here will note down the
>  results of conversations on bugs. The mailinglist is not really good
>  for archiving those. and the task of archiving should be distributed
>  
>  also please note you don't need any knowledge of Git to file issues.
>  
>  thanks!!
>  



Actually this is the place where slim issues are being posted.  ;)

https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/slim/issues

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Slow network startup [was: Systemd discussion on the Samba mailing list]

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 7/15/16, Emiliano Marini  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Systemd discussion on the Samba mailing list
 To: "Simon Hobson" 
 Cc: "dng" 
 Date: Friday, July 15, 2016, 6:24 PM
>  
>  Well, either case is embarrasing. If the network is up after the user 
> logins, that's ridiculous, even Windows start his services before the login 
> screen. If NM, thus the network, is *slow* to start, that's  worse! Isn't 
> supposed systemd would speed up the boot process?
>  
>


My Devuan wired network takes maybe 10-15 seconds to come up after I come out 
of suspend.  What's up with that.  It was always ready on Squeeze and Wheezy.  
Now I twiddle my thumbs and wait until wicd wakes up. It's really annoying . . 
. 

Any ideas why it's doing that?

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 7/15/16, Robert Storey  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, July 15, 2016, 8:34 PM
>  
> I think I understand the issue well enough to sum it up nicely, so if no one 
> objects, should I just go ahead and file a bug report? If we're about to dump 
> Slim for lxdm or lightdm or whatever, I needn't bother, but if we plan to 
> keep Slim for release 1.0, I'd like to see the issue addressed. Looks like an 
> easy enough thing to fix - all we need is to change the login screen graphic 
> to document the available > options. I think I can write up the proposed 
> documentation change myself and then submit it.
> 
> I have not yet used Devuan's bug reporting system - I just looked at the site 
> now and I signed up for > a git account. This this is a Slim issue, should I 
> report it here:
> 
> https://git.devuan.org/devuan/slim/issues
> 
> Please tell me if I'm doing this right. If no objections within next 24 
> hours, I'll proceed.
> 
> Thank you, and apologies for my inexperience with git.
> 
> cheers,
> Robert
> 



Hi Robert,

Thanks for offering to help.   I hadn't seen Dima's slim project before.  This 
is the one that I've worked on with hellekin:

https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/slim/issues

It took me a while to find it.  There was just an upgrade to gitlab and now I'm 
lost again

It won't let me edit in place like I can in editors.  Instead it said it 
downloaded something but damned if I can find it.  Maybe someone can point me 
where to look.

git is a real challenge.  And IIRC placement of elements on the slim login 
screen is also.  Good luck!  

golinux
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[DNG] ML archive oddities and annoyances

[Go Linux]

A day or so ago, when I clicked on my bookmark for the DNG archives it was not 
going to the dng archives but to some other weird place and I had a terrible 
time finding my way back.  I finally figured it out this morning.  My trusty 
DNG link that has been working since the exodus declaration had been hijacked 
by devuan-discuss - the webmail interface to discourse.  I had not signed up 
for that feature and want nothing to do with it yet there it was.  The only way 
I could get a reliable link to dng was through the search function.  This seems 
to be working atm:

https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/search/20380101.00.@ml:dng.en.html

I don't know whether the hijack was an intentional ploy to drive people to the 
discourse forum or just a linkage mis-step.  In any case, you might want to 
check out how the mail sever is set up because this was really, REALLY annoying.

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 7/15/16, Robert Storey <robert.sto...@gmail.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, July 15, 2016, 12:30 AM
 
Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)

> Robert Storey <robert.sto...@gmail.com>
>> Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2016 04:04:59 +0000 (UTC)
>> From: Go Linux <goli...@yahoo.com>
>>
>>>From /usr/share/doc/slim/README :
>>
>>Special usernames (commands configurable in the config file):
>>- console: start console login
>>- exit: exit SLiM
>>- halt: halt the system
>>- reboot: reboot the system
>
> Hi golinux,
>
> Thank you for this, it's useful information. However, just like the issue on 
> using F1 to scroll through available
> window managers, the above isn't obvious and is easily missed (after all, I 
> missed it). True, I'm not the geekiest
> Linux user alive, but I'm not a novice either.
>
> So I think it would be nice if there was a little "Help" box stuck in the 
> graphic login screen which contained all of
> the above info. It wouldn't have to be very intrusive, but there is enough 
> screen real estate to accommodate it, I think.
>
> Should I be filing a bug report to push this issue? Hardly seems like a true 
> "bug," but I do think it's important.

Hmm...I should have actually tried those commands before I shot off my mouth. 
Now I see more problems...

The commands "console" and "exit" work, in the sense that you'll get a console 
from where you can log in, though I see no advantage in that. You could use 
Ctrl-Alt-F2 though F6 to do the same thing (and Ctrl-Alt F7 to get back to the 
original login desktop). You still have to log in first before you can reboot 
or shutdown.

The commands "halt" and "reboot" do not seem to work. SLIM asks me for a 
password for user "halt" and user "reboot" which is less than useful, since no 
such users exist.

There is an error in file /usr/share/doc/slim/README, it says:

CONFIGURATION
/usr/etc/slim.conf is the main configuration file.

Of course, that should say:
/etc/slim.conf is the main configuration file.

best regards,
Robert



Obviously, I didn't try what was suggested in the readme . . . don't like to 
reboot or even logout.  I'm hoping that someone with more chops than I have 
should be able to get those commands working.

I suggest you file an issue under the slim package and assign it to hellekin.

And I totally agree that there should be some text suggestions on the login 
screen perhaps to a revised README if nothing else.

golinux 

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Re: [DNG] Larcenous mail threads.

[Go Linux]

On Thu, 7/14/16, Edward Bartolo  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Larcenous mail threads.
 To: "dng" 
 Date: Thursday, July 14, 2016, 11:43 PM
 
 Hi,
 
 <<
 About choice of language. I read there are 191 undefined
 behaviors in the C99 standard, which means an equal number
 of tarpits waiting for the cognitively difficient coder.
 >>



And the source of that quote is . . .   I looked on the archives and only 
found your two posts titled "Larcenous mail threads" (though I might have 
missed something) . . .  Note that I am not reading the thread on C code

golinux




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Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (Steve Litt)

[Go Linux]

On Thu, 7/14/16, Robert Storey  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (Steve Litt)
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Thursday, July 14, 2016, 10:33 PM
 

On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 22:39:34 -0400
Steve Litt  wrote:

>> Golinux told me that to change the window manager, when on the login
>> screen, you repeatedly press F1 to cycle through the installed window
>> managers. I confirm this, and will document it.
>>
>> However, I think somebody from Devuan should add to the login window's
>> graphic (the stylized lightgreen and darkergreen Login graphic) the
>> string "Press F1 to switch window managers." Today's computers should
>> be discoverable, and this is just too easy not to do. I'd do it myself
>> but I don't know which graphic, and probably my modification would be
>> an aesthetic step backward.
>
> Thanks for posting this, it's an issue I wanted to raise but glad someone 
> else brought it up first.
> 
> I've got a couple of other issues with the login screen that I was going to 
> bring up, and now is as > good a time as any...
> 
> If there is some other option for reboot/shutdown, I can't think of it at the 
> moment.
> 



From /usr/share/doc/slim/README :

Special usernames (commands configurable in the config file):
- console: start console login
- exit: exit SLiM
- halt: halt the system
- reboot: reboot the system


golinux


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Re: [DNG] Need for documentation

[Go Linux]

On Thu, 7/14/16, Steve Litt  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Need for documentation
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Thursday, July 14, 2016, 9:07 AM
 
On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 17:33:26 +1200
Daniel Reurich  wrote:

> On 14/07/16 17:27, Steve Litt wrote:
> > On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 22:39:34 -0400
> > Steve Litt  wrote:
> >   
> >> Hi all,
> >>
> >> When installing, you get to pick which window manager you want.
> >> Trouble is, there's no obvious way to change your window manager
> >> after the fact. Somebody needs to document how to do this, and keep
> >> the document in an obvious place, with a link from the top of our
> >> documentation tree. 
> >
> > Golinux told me that to change the window manager, when on the login
> > screen, you repeatedly press F1 to cycle through the installed
> > window managers. I confirm this, and will document it.
> >
> > However, I think somebody from Devuan should add to the login
> > window's graphic (the stylized lightgreen and darkergreen Login
> > graphic) the string "Press F1 to switch window managers." Today's
> > computers should be discoverable, and this is just too easy not to
> > do. I'd do it myself but I don't know which graphic, and probably
> > my modification would be an aesthetic step backward.
> >   
> File a bug against desktop-base and slim packages and I'll try to make
> sure we do that on both

Thanks Daniel,

How do I file a bug against desktop-base and slim packages?

Thanks,

SteveT



https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/desktop-base/issues

https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/slim/issues

As to modification . . . that is hellekin's domain and Daniel could do it too 
(others too).  If you open an issue that will be a reminder to do it before the 
next release

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Need for documentation

[Go Linux]

On Thu, 7/14/16, Steve Litt  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Need for documentation
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Thursday, July 14, 2016, 12:27 AM
 
On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 22:39:34 -0400
Steve Litt  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> When installing, you get to pick which window manager you want.
> Trouble is, there's no obvious way to change your window manager
> after the fact. Somebody needs to document how to do this, and keep
> the document in an obvious place, with a link from the top of our
> documentation tree.

Golinux told me that to change the window manager, when on the login
screen, you repeatedly press F1 to cycle through the installed window
managers. I confirm this, and will document it.

However, I think somebody from Devuan should add to the login window's
graphic (the stylized lightgreen and darkergreen Login graphic) the
string "Press F1 to switch window managers." Today's computers should
be discoverable, and this is just too easy not to do. I'd do it myself
but I don't know which graphic, and probably my modification would be
an aesthetic step backward.

Thanks,

SteveT



The "stylized lightgreen and darkergreen Login graphic" went bye-bye a long 
time ago.  It should be a nice purpy just like the desktop.  Do you have the 
latest desktop-base installed?

golinux

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[DNG] OT: PHP help needed

[Go Linux]

I have a misbehaving file on a blog that I have no idea how to fix . . . other 
than removing the widget that's screwing up.  :( The error that pops up starts 
like this "Strict Standards: Only variables should be passed by reference in 
*path-to-file* on line 302  If there are any PHP wizards on this forum, please 
contact me OFF-LIST for the details.

Have posted to the blog's forum but it looks kind of dead in there . . .

Thanks,

golinux
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Re: [DNG] package request

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 6/10/16, Hendrik Boom  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] package request
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, June 10, 2016, 10:10 AM
 
On Fri, Jun 10, 2016 at 04:57:06PM +0200, emnin...@riseup.net wrote:
> Am Fri, 10 Jun 2016 14:36:05 +
> schrieb dng-requ...@lists.dyne.org:
>
> > > Would it be possible to package palemoon for devuan? 
> >
> > Are there a reasons for that?
> >
> > I use palemoon myself on Devuan. Just downloaded their bundle and
> > opened in /opt/palemoon, set the bin in PATH and ready for use. It
> > also notices me for upstream updates.
> >
> > I'm open to debate, but personally incline (for this and other
> > packages) to concentrate on the maintanance of a *core*, *base* Devuan
> > system and leave to individuals and downstream maintain a bigger set
> > of packages for specific uses.
>
> Hi Jaromil!
>
> Yes - and no ;)
>
> If i succeed in my attempt with jwm, i'd like to set palemoon as
> default browser; it's a bit hard if there is no package ...
>
> But for sure, it's correct what you say about keeping the core packages
> as small as possible. OTOH, i for one, would not mind if
> icewease/firefox would be substituted even in core by palemoon ... ;)
> (It's what i did, individually; after havin tried for a while both in
> parallel).
>
> Thanks in any case for your effort & cheers!
> ___
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> Dng@lists.dyne.org
> https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

I cannot ue chrome on the web any more, because it is no longer
supported on my 32-bit devuan system.  It still runs, but is a
security risk without security patches.  Except, of course, on html
files I build myself on the local system -- I just don't put in popups
or ads or malware.

I use mathjax to display mathematics.  It is acceptable on chrome, and
on midori.

It is ridiculously slow on iceweasel.  Not only that, but
after it desplays my equations (it's a long document, bot just a small
note) it keeps blanking the screen and restoring it for a randoom
amount of time.

It's even *fast* on midori.  I don't know about palemoon.

The main problems I've had with midori is that I haven't figured out
how to get it to import bookmarks from iceweasel of chrome, and I can't
figure out how to get is to sort local directories into alphabetical
order -- almost any reasonable alphaet would do.

If palemoon acts reasonably with mathjax, I'd be happy to welcome it
to the fold.

-- hendrik



I use palemoon sometimes.  I actually run it (and tor) from my /user directory. 
 The problem with ANY browser other than FF/Iceweasel is the lack of addons - I 
use about 25.  (Chrome is the worst at this.) Palemoon has some of them 
available but not all.  And they may be disappearing from the FF repos as their 
engine moves to a different incompatible platform. Quite a while ago, chillfan 
and I discussed rescuing some addons and he even started such a project on git. 
 I wouldn't mind seeing palemoon in the devuan repos because I suspect that 
eventually FF will become unusable (for me at least).  Steve Pusser packaged 
palemoon for antiX quite a while ago so maybe we could get it from there?

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Devuan (f)art

[Go Linux]

On Thu, 6/2/16, KatolaZ <kato...@freaknet.org> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Devuan (f)art
 To: "Go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>
 Cc: "hellekin" <helle...@dyne.org>, "KatolaZ" <kato...@freaknet.org>, 
dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Thursday, June 2, 2016, 9:49 AM
 
 On Thu, Jun 02, 2016 at 02:39:44PM +, Go Linux wrote:

[cut]

>
> 
>
> Yes, that is an improvement but the proportions are still off.  Both swooshes 
> are too elongated and hellekin's version looks 'pregnant with that bump on 
> the RH side.  I stared at KatolaZ's version of the logo for some time but 
> could never see Devuan in it.  Sorry.
>

Sorry for the silly question, but you are using fixed-size fonts,

right?

HND

KatolaZ



Ah, no I'm not.  That's how much I know about ascii art.  

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Devuan (f)art

[Go Linux]

On Thu, 6/2/16, KatolaZ  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Devuan (f)art
 To: "hellekin" 
 Cc: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Thursday, June 2, 2016, 7:49 AM
 
 On Thu, Jun 02, 2016 at
 11:49:55AM +, hellekin wrote:
 
 [cut]
 
On Thu, Jun 02, 2016 at 11:49:55AM +, hellekin wrote:

[cut]

>
> I tried this before, indeed the result needs tweaking.  The screenfetch
> entry for Devuan looks pretty good already:
>
> hellekin@raiz
>  ..,,;;;::;,..   OS: Devuan 1.0 jessie
>  `':ddd;:,.  Kernel: x86_64 Linux 4.5.0-2-amd64
>`'dPPd:,. Uptime: 1d 1h 25m
>`:b$$b`.  Packages: 3519
>   'P$$$d`Shell: zsh 5.0.7
>.$`   Resolution: 1366x768
>;$P   WM: Xfwm4
> .:P$$`   WM Theme: Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy
> .,:b$$$;'CPU: Intel Core i5-3320M CPU @ 4x...
>.,:dPb:'  GPU: Mesa DRI Intel(R) Ivybridge...
> .,:;db$$Pd'` RAM: 1471MiB / 4611MiB
>,db$$b:'`
>   :b:'`
>`$bd:''`
>  `'''`
>

That's awesome :) (sorry for the small editing on the right-hand side...)

HND

KatolaZ



Yes, that is an improvement but the proportions are still off.  Both swooshes 
are too elongated and hellekin's version looks 'pregnant with that bump on the 
RH side.  I stared at KatolaZ's version of the logo for some time but could 
never see Devuan in it.  Sorry.

golinux

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Re: [DNG] What's the correct place for backgrounds, wallpapers etc.

[Go Linux]

On Wed, 6/1/16, hellekin  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] What's the correct place for backgrounds, wallpapers etc.
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Wednesday, June 1, 2016, 1:23 AM
 
> You may also install desktop themes in your user's $HOME: ~/.themes/foo
> 
 ==
 hk



True but then root apps like synaptic and gparted won't be themed properly.  To 
work across the board themes should go into /usr/share/themes.  ;)

golinux

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Re: [DNG] Purple theme for slim

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 5/29/16, Steve Litt  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Purple theme for slim
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Sunday, May 29, 2016, 1:19 PM
> 
> I just looked at the preceding-referenced URL, and it looks to me like
> the highlighted text is hard to read for someone with bad vision. Is
> there any way you can make the text color a little brighter so it
> contrasts more with the purple text background?
> 



Hi Steve,

I just remembered that I also modified the Xfce theme for purpy.  The colors 
are flat so the contrast might be better than on a gradient.   It will work 
with gtk2 and gtk3 but unfortunately, there is no openbox theme.  So depending 
on your setup, it might not be useful to you.  You can get it here:

http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/Xfce-purpy.zip

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Purple theme for slim

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 5/29/16, aitor_czr <aitor_...@gnuinos.org> wrote:

 Subject: Re: Purple theme for slim
 To: "Go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>
 Cc: "Daniel Reurich" <dan...@centurion.net.nz>, "hellekin" 
<helle...@dyne.org>, "dng" <dng@lists.dyne.org>
 Date: Sunday, May 29, 2016, 1:48 PM
 
 El 29/05/16 a las 20:31, Go Linux escribió:
> On Sun, 5/29/16, aitor_czr <aitor_...@gnuinos.org> wrote:
>
>  Subject: Re: Purple theme for slim
>  To: "Go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>
>  Cc: "Daniel Reurich" <dan...@centurion.net.nz>, "hellekin" 
> <helle...@dyne.org>, "dng" <dng@lists.dyne.org>
>  Date: Sunday, May 29, 2016, 12:50 PM
>  
> Hi Golinux,
>
> El 29/05/16 a las 18:10, Go Linux escribió:
>> On Sun, 5/29/16, aitor_czr <aitor_...@gnuinos.org> wrote:
>>
>>  Subject: Purple theme for slim
>>  To: "Daniel Reurich" <dan...@centurion.net.nz>, "hellekin" 
>> <helle...@dyne.org>, "go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>, "dng" 
>> <dng@lists.dyne.org>
>>  Date: Sunday, May 29, 2016, 9:33 AM
>>  
>>  Hi all,
>>
>>> Today i've been working in the purple (neutral) theme for slim, using 
>>> inkscape.
>>>
>>> I didn't test it because i can't reboot my system. Still building the 
>>> kernel... This is my 5º attempt.
>>>
>>> Yes, i'm a bit obstinate, but there were some udeb packages with common 
>>> modules *.ko, etc...
>>>
>>> Here you are the changed files in "slim/debian/devuan-curve":
>>>
>>> http://gnuinos.org/slim/
>>>
>>> HYLI [*]
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>>   Aitor.
>>>
>>> [*] Hope you like it :)
>>>
>> 
>>
>> Thank you for taking this on Aitor!  I'm not going to test it because it is 
>> not purpy (looks like rocky)!  Please refer to 
>> http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/default_desktop.png to capture purpy colors 
>> for the swoosh, background and text. Also the edges of the font and swoosh 
>> are not smooth.  I have no idea how to fix that but may at least try to 
>> tweak the colors myself later today.
>>
>> golinux
> Definitely, graphical design is not my best virtue [*]
>
> I just uploaded the new files with the purpy theme, but i don't like it very 
> much. It looks pixelated. They don't seem vectorial images.
>
>
> http://gnuinos.org/slim/
>
> Cheers,
>
>   Aitor.
>
>
> [*] I'm not Caravaggio :)
>
> 
>
> Thanks!  That's much better!!  I'm on squeeze atm but will test when I get 
> back to devuan.
>
> Caravaggio . . . that's a name I haven't thought of for decades! I'm not 
> either but I am a rainbow :)
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zphAHMPtu4g
>
> golinux

I improved it. Now it looks nice :)


http://gnuinos.org/slim/

Cheers,

  Aitor.



Aitor . . . Finally got back to devuan.  The login is lovely!  Thank you for 
doing this.  It definitely needs to replace leafy in the default settings for 
beta2.

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Purple theme for slim

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 5/29/16, aitor_czr <aitor_...@gnuinos.org> wrote:

 Subject: Re: Purple theme for slim
 To: "Go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>
 Cc: "Daniel Reurich" <dan...@centurion.net.nz>, "hellekin" 
<helle...@dyne.org>, "dng" <dng@lists.dyne.org>
 Date: Sunday, May 29, 2016, 12:50 PM
 
Hi Golinux,

El 29/05/16 a las 18:10, Go Linux escribió:
> On Sun, 5/29/16, aitor_czr <aitor_...@gnuinos.org> wrote:
>
>  Subject: Purple theme for slim
>  To: "Daniel Reurich" <dan...@centurion.net.nz>, "hellekin" 
> <helle...@dyne.org>, "go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>, "dng" 
> <dng@lists.dyne.org>
>  Date: Sunday, May 29, 2016, 9:33 AM
>  
>  Hi all,
>
>> Today i've been working in the purple (neutral) theme for slim, using 
>> inkscape.
>>
>> I didn't test it because i can't reboot my system. Still building the 
>> kernel... This is my 5º attempt.
>>
>> Yes, i'm a bit obstinate, but there were some udeb packages with common 
>> modules *.ko, etc...
>>
>> Here you are the changed files in "slim/debian/devuan-curve":
>>
>> http://gnuinos.org/slim/
>>
>> HYLI [*]
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>>   Aitor.
>>
>> [*] Hope you like it :)
>>
> 
>
> Thank you for taking this on Aitor!  I'm not going to test it because it is 
> not purpy (looks like rocky)!  Please refer to 
> http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/default_desktop.png to capture purpy colors for 
> the swoosh, background and text. Also the edges of the font and swoosh are 
> not smooth.  I have no idea how to fix that but may at least try to tweak the 
> colors myself later today.
>
> golinux

Definitely, graphical design is not my best virtue [*]

I just uploaded the new files with the purpy theme, but i don't like it very 
much. It looks pixelated. They don't seem vectorial images.


http://gnuinos.org/slim/

Cheers,

  Aitor.


[*] I'm not Caravaggio :)



Thanks!  That's much better!!  I'm on squeeze atm but will test when I get back 
to devuan.

Caravaggio . . . that's a name I haven't thought of for decades! I'm not either 
but I am a rainbow :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zphAHMPtu4g

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Purple theme for slim

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 5/29/16, aitor_czr <aitor_...@gnuinos.org> wrote:

 Subject: Purple theme for slim
 To: "Daniel Reurich" <dan...@centurion.net.nz>, "hellekin" 
<helle...@dyne.org>, "go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>, "dng" <dng@lists.dyne.org>
 Date: Sunday, May 29, 2016, 9:33 AM
 
 Hi all,

> Today i've been working in the purple (neutral) theme for slim, using 
> inkscape.
> 
> I didn't test it because i can't reboot my system. Still building the 
> kernel... This is my 5º attempt.
> 
> Yes, i'm a bit obstinate, but there were some udeb packages with common 
> modules *.ko, etc...
> 
> Here you are the changed files in "slim/debian/devuan-curve":
> 
> http://gnuinos.org/slim/
> 
> HYLI [*]
> 
> Cheers,
> 
>   Aitor.
> 
> [*] Hope you like it :)
> 



Thank you for taking this on Aitor!  I'm not going to test it because it is not 
purpy (looks like rocky)!  Please refer to 
http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/default_desktop.png to capture purpy colors for 
the swoosh, background and text. Also the edges of the font and swoosh are not 
smooth.  I have no idea how to fix that but may at least try to tweak the 
colors myself later today.

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Artistic decisions - keyboard mappings

[Go Linux]

Hi Joel,

I wouldn't exactly call you suggestions 'artistic'.  Maybe slightly 'sadistic'? 
 :)

On Wed, 5/18/16, Joel Roth  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG] Artistic decisions - keyboard mappings
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Wednesday, May 18, 2016, 7:13 PM
> 
> I wonder if Devuan community is ready to support action on
> other scourges of the linux on personal computer ecosystem.
> 

A judgment of 'scourge' is very subjective.
 
>  I am thinking specifically of three key mapping bugaboos:
>  
> 1) CAPSLOCK key under console and X, should be mapped to Control
> 
>This mapping is compatible with most server
>administrators preferences, prevents capslock-related mode
>problems in vim.
>  

I never have and probably never will use vim so makes no diff to me . . . 
unless this suggestion would screw something else up.

>  
>  2) Terminate X via Ctrl-Alt-Backspace
>  
>  Seems like an easy, useful, historic way to kill a malfunctioning X.
> 

My X has not misbehaved since trying to configure an Nvidia card on squeeze 
years ago.  But never know when this might come in handy.

> 
> 3) Disable Print key
> 
>  All my uses have been unintentional. Does anyone use it deliberately?
> 

Yes! I have it mapped to launch screenshots and use it often!

> 
> My other wishlist items are:
> 
> 4) No display manager by default
> 
>  I think the community shouldn't coocoon naive users from
>  the console.  yada, yada
> 

I may be naive but I can go on happily for days without opening a terminal and 
weeks/months without getting into the console.  Being a lousy typist, I much 
prefer point and click but can do the nerdy stuff if needed (and only if 
needed).  ;)

Which brings up a question . . . is REISUB enabled by default in devuan?

golinux

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Re: [DNG] Dng Digest, Vol 20, Issue 83

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 5/15/16, Irrwahn  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Dng Digest, Vol 20, Issue 83
 To: "dng" 
 Date: Sunday, May 15, 2016, 12:43 PM
 
P.S.:
Is it just my mail client messing things up, or is the threading
in DNG badly borked as of lately for other readers too?



This thread as been borked from the git-go because of the Dng Digest subject.  
A reminder to digest readers . . . please change the subject line to that of 
the particular thread to which you are responding.

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Unofficial Devuan live images

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 5/15/16, Edward Bartolo  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Unofficial Devuan live images
 To: "KatolaZ" 
 Cc: "dng" 
 Date: Sunday, May 15, 2016, 10:39 AM
 
> Hi,
> 
> When I tried to install Devuan 64 bit on a Pentium Dual Core, 3 GB
> DDR2, I couldn't get past the disk partitioner as it assumed I was
> using LVM. I never used LVM because it unnecessarily adds another
> layer of complexity that I deem not necessary on a family computer.
> This means, I always use plain ext4 partitions for my installations.
> 
> I had to bypass the serious issue by using Debian Jessie 64
> installation iso instead.
> 
> I am reposting as nobody actually reported any feedback on this issue.
> 
> Edward
> 



It's not clear exactly which iso were you trying to install.  One from the 
Devuan repos or the refracta unofficial live iso (which is the subject of this 
thread)?  Could you please clarify?  Thanks.

golinux





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Re: [DNG] Some questions re the devuan release

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 5/14/16, . fsmithred  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Some questions re the devuan release
 To: emnin...@riseup.net
 Cc: "dng" 
 Date: Saturday, May 14, 2016, 10:58 AM
 
> 
> Stick with the repos that are in sources.list plus backports if
> you need it.
> 

Excellent advice.  That said, I have also used dmo and antix repos once or 
twice but very carefully.

>  
>  Yes, you can compile a package from source, but any time I've done
>  this, I do not run 'make-install' so that system files don't get replaced. 
> It's better to create your
>  own debian package. I'm having touble searching forums.debian.net right now, 
> but in the howto 
>  section, there are some explanations of how to create a debian package from 
> source. If you do
>  that, the package manager will be aware of what you installed.
> 

fsr . . .are you thinking of Soul Singin's "HowTo Build a Package from Source 
the Smart Way?"

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=16=38976

golinux
 
 
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Re: [DNG] Some questions re the devuan release

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 5/14/16, emnin...@riseup.net  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Some questions re the devuan release
 To: ". fsmithred" 
 Cc: "dng" 
 Date: Saturday, May 14, 2016, 10:04 AM
 
>
> 
> Ceni, you can get from launchpad ubuntu or via aptosid (as .deb
> packages).
> 
> 

All debs are not created equal.  Grabbing debs from random distros is so 
not-a-good-idea:

https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian#Don.27t_make_a_FrankenDebian

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=20=114130

golinux


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Re: [DNG] but I lose it once I log in

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 5/13/16, Hendrik Boom <hend...@topoi.pooq.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] but I lose it once I log in
 To: "Go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>
 Date: Friday, May 13, 2016, 9:34 PM
 
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 10:11:16PM +, Go Linux wrote:
> On Fri, 5/13/16, Hendrik Boom <hend...@topoi.pooq.com> wrote:
>
>  Subject: Re: [DNG] but I lose it once I log in
>  To: dng@lists.dyne.org
>  Date: Friday, May 13, 2016, 2:06 PM
> 
>> On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 02:17:50PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
>> > On Fri, 13 May 2016 10:37:20 -0400
>> > Hendrik Boom <hend...@topoi.pooq.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > On Thu, May 12, 2016 at 09:40:04PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
>> >> > > Hi all,
>> >> > >
>> >> > > I just installed the beta, in a VM, using the x64 DVD iso.
>> >> > >
>> >> > > In my opinion, the user interface was very pleasing. The faded
>> >> > > purple is very relaxing. The fonts are all crisp and clear, even in
>> >> > > a tiny VM. And I **LOVE** the fact that the titlebar of the focused
>> >> > > window is an extremely different color than those without focus.
>> >> > > I'm a production man, and appreciate knowing at the quickest glance
>> >> > > which window has focus.
>> >> > >
>> >> > > Great job on the UI.
>> >> > >
>> >> > > SteveT
>> >> >
>> >> > Yes that's a nice colour I see at start-up.  I wouldn't mind having
>> >> > it after I log in.
>> >> >
>> >> > But once things are going -- I use xfce -- I have a brighgt
>> >> > yellow-green screen.   I seem to have nno way t change it.  I can
>> >> > use Applicatinos Menu -> settings to change the settings, and
>> >> > they'rre still there the next time I adjust settings, but the seem to
>> >> > have no effect on the actual screen.
>> >>
>> >> Yes. That nauseating rotten mustard color occurs on the login screen.
>> >> On LXDE, it disappears and is replaced by the colors I described
>> >> earlier in this thread. So the Xfce implementation fails to load the
>> >> desktop graphic. Probably it's missing a command in ~/.xinitrc or its
>> >> equivalent for display managers.
>> >
>> > I'm getting light purple on the login screen, but not in xfce.  Could
>> > it xfce is still depending on an systemd-ism that isn't there in
>> > order to talk to itself?
>> >
>> 
>>
>> Do you have the purpy background(s) in /use/share/backgrounds?  You can get 
>> them here:
>>
>> https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/desktop-base/tree/master/backgrounds
>>
>> Then select the one that best fits you screen size from the desktop settings.

> All I have in /usr/share/backgrounds is an xfce directory.  It has
> only one background, which *is* one of the backgrounds that the xfce
> settings tool offers me.  Even when I pick it I instead get a plain green
> background, which is *not* on the list of offered backgrounds.
> 
> Even when I ask for a solid single-colout and specify the colour, it
> ignores me and instead gives me a solid green background.
> 
> So it looks as the problem lies elsewhere.  Once I get the background
> to conform to the settings tool, perhaps it will be time to find and
> install purpy.
> 
> My guess is that xfce is relying on some other tool to set the
> background colour, and that other tool isn't there.
> 
> 
> -- hendrik
> 



Something is fubared for sure.  Setting backgrounds has always worked ootb for 
me on Xfce even when they were in various locations. Why don't you boot the 
refracta unofficial-devuan-live iso and see if you can change the bg there: 

https://sourceforge.net/projects/refracta/files/unofficial_devuan_live/

If that works, it's something specific to your setup.

golinux



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Re: [DNG] but I lose it once I log in

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 5/13/16, Hendrik Boom  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] but I lose it once I log in
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, May 13, 2016, 2:06 PM
 
On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 02:17:50PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> On Fri, 13 May 2016 10:37:20 -0400
> Hendrik Boom  wrote:
>
> > On Thu, May 12, 2016 at 09:40:04PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
>> > > Hi all,
>> > >
>> > > I just installed the beta, in a VM, using the x64 DVD iso.
>> > >
>> > > In my opinion, the user interface was very pleasing. The faded
>> > > purple is very relaxing. The fonts are all crisp and clear, even in
>> > > a tiny VM. And I **LOVE** the fact that the titlebar of the focused
>> > > window is an extremely different color than those without focus.
>> > > I'm a production man, and appreciate knowing at the quickest glance
>> > > which window has focus.
>> > >
>> > > Great job on the UI.
>> > >
>> > > SteveT 
>> >
>> > Yes that's a nice colour I see at start-up.  I wouldn't mind having
>> > it after I log in.
>> >
>> > But once things are going -- I use xfce -- I have a brighgt
>> > yellow-green screen.   I seem to have nno way t change it.  I can
>> > use Applicatinos Menu -> settings to change the settings, and
>> > they'rre still there the next time I adjust settings, but the seem to
>> > have no effect on the actual screen.
>>
>> Yes. That nauseating rotten mustard color occurs on the login screen.
>> On LXDE, it disappears and is replaced by the colors I described
>> earlier in this thread. So the Xfce implementation fails to load the
>> desktop graphic. Probably it's missing a command in ~/.xinitrc or its
>> equivalent for display managers.
>
> I'm getting light purple on the login screen, but not in xfce.  Could
> it xfce is still depending on an systemd-ism that isn't there in
> order to talk to itself?
> 


Do you have the purpy background(s) in /use/share/backgrounds?  You can get 
them here:

https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/desktop-base/tree/master/backgrounds

Then select the one that best fits you screen size from the desktop settings.

golinux


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Re: [DNG] Unofficial Devuan live images

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 5/8/16, Joel Roth  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Unofficial Devuan live images
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Sunday, May 8, 2016, 7:45 PM
 
Hi,

Piggybacking onto this thread, I'd like to have a live
distro to demo for friends who are still bombarded with
hateful Windows popups. Ideally with heavy-weight apps such
as libreoffice, firefox, thunderbird.  And I'd like to write
it to a USB drive, or SD card.

I'm aware of Knoppix, and open to any other less heavy
assemblages.

Appreciate any suggestions.

Thanks,

-- 
Joel Roth



Hi Joel,

Did you download the iso and give it a spin?  Or at least look at the pkg list? 
 It has 2 of the three items you mentioned - libreoffice and iceweasel 
(firefox).  I have copied the pkg list below FYI.

You might also want to check out refracta2usb.  Check with fsr if it is 
compatible with the Devuan iso:

http://www.ibiblio.org/refracta/docs/readme.refracta2usb.txt


golinux


acl
acpi
acpi-support-base
acpid
adduser
adwaita-icon-theme
alsa-base
alsa-utils
anacron
apt
apt-listchanges
apt-utils
aptitude
aptitude-common
aptitude-doc-en
aspell
aspell-en
at
at-spi2-core
avahi-daemon
base-files
base-passwd
bash
bash-completion
bc
bind9-host
bsd-mailx
bsdmainutils
bsdutils
busybox
bzip2
ca-certificates
ca-certificates-java
coinor-libcbc3
coinor-libcgl1
coinor-libclp1
coinor-libcoinmp1:i386
coinor-libcoinutils3
coinor-libosi1
colord
colord-data
console-setup
console-setup-linux
consolekit
coreutils
cpio
cpp
cpp-4.9
crda
cron
cups
cups-browsed
cups-bsd
cups-client
cups-common
cups-core-drivers
cups-daemon
cups-filters
cups-filters-core-drivers
cups-pk-helper
cups-ppdc
cups-server-common
dash
dbus
dbus-x11
dc
dconf-gsettings-backend:i386
dconf-service
debconf
debconf-i18n
debian-archive-keyring
debian-faq
debianutils
default-jre
default-jre-headless
desktop-base
desktop-file-utils
devuan-baseconf
devuan-keyring
dh-python
dictionaries-common
diffutils
discover
discover-data
dmidecode
dmsetup
dnsutils
doc-debian
docbook-xml
docutils-common
docutils-doc
dosfstools
dpkg
e2fslibs:i386
e2fsprogs
eject
emacsen-common
espeak-data:i386
ethtool
evince-common
evince-gtk
exfalso
exim4
exim4-base
exim4-config
exim4-daemon-light
exo-utils
file
findutils
firebird2.5-common
firebird2.5-common-doc
firebird2.5-server-common
fontconfig
fontconfig-config
fonts-dejavu
fonts-dejavu-core
fonts-dejavu-extra
fonts-droid
fonts-freefont-ttf
fonts-liberation
fonts-opensymbol
fonts-sil-gentium
fonts-sil-gentium-basic
foomatic-db-compressed-ppds
foomatic-db-engine
ftp
fuse
gcc-4.8-base:i386
gcc-4.9-base:i386
gconf-service
gconf2
gconf2-common
gcr
gdebi-core
gdisk
geoip-database
gettext-base
ghostscript
gimp
gimp-data
gir1.2-atk-1.0
gir1.2-atspi-2.0
gir1.2-freedesktop:i386
gir1.2-gdkpixbuf-2.0
gir1.2-glib-2.0:i386
gir1.2-gnomekeyring-1.0
gir1.2-gst-plugins-base-1.0
gir1.2-gstreamer-1.0
gir1.2-gtk-3.0:i386
gir1.2-gtksource-3.0:i386
gir1.2-keybinder-3.0
gir1.2-notify-0.7
gir1.2-packagekitglib-1.0
gir1.2-pango-1.0:i386
gir1.2-wnck-3.0:i386
gksu
glib-networking:i386
glib-networking-common
glib-networking-services
gnome-icon-theme
gnome-icon-theme-symbolic
gnome-keyring
gnome-mime-data
gnome-orca
gnupg
gnupg-agent
gnupg2
gpgv
grep
groff-base
grub-common
grub-pc
grub-pc-bin
grub2-common
gsettings-desktop-schemas
gsfonts
gstreamer0.10-alsa:i386
gstreamer0.10-plugins-base:i386
gstreamer1.0-libav:i386
gstreamer1.0-plugins-base:i386
gstreamer1.0-plugins-good:i386
gstreamer1.0-plugins-ugly:i386
gstreamer1.0-x:i386
gtk2-engines:i386
gtk2-engines-xfce
gtk3-engines-xfce
gvfs:i386
gvfs-common
gvfs-daemons
gvfs-libs:i386
gzip
hddtemp
hdparm
hicolor-icon-theme
host
hostname
hp-ppd
hplip
hplip-data
hunspell-en-us
hyphen-en-us
i965-va-driver:i386
iamerican
ibritish
iceweasel
ienglish-common
ifupdown
info
init
init-system-helpers
initramfs-tools
initscripts
insserv
install-info
installation-report
iproute2
iptables
iputils-ping
isc-dhcp-client
isc-dhcp-common
iso-codes
isolinux
ispell
iw
java-common
javascript-common
kbd
keyboard-configuration
klibc-utils
kmod
krb5-locales
laptop-detect
less
liba52-0.7.4
libaa1:i386
libaacs0:i386
libabw-0.1-1
libacl1:i386
libalgorithm-c3-perl
libamd2.3.1:i386
libao-common
libao4
libapt-inst1.5:i386
libapt-pkg4.12:i386
libarchive-extract-perl
libarchive13:i386
libart-2.0-2:i386
libasound2:i386
libasound2-data
libasound2-plugins:i386
libaspell15:i386
libasprintf0c2:i386
libass5:i386
libassuan0:i386
libasyncns0:i386
libatasmart4:i386
libatk-adaptor:i386
libatk-bridge2.0-0:i386
libatk-wrapper-java
libatk-wrapper-java-jni:i386
libatk1.0-0:i386
libatk1.0-data
libatspi2.0-0:i386
libattr1:i386
libaudio2:i386
libaudit-common
libaudit1:i386
libauthen-sasl-perl
libavahi-client3:i386
libavahi-common-data:i386
libavahi-common3:i386
libavahi-core7:i386
libavahi-glib1:i386
libavc1394-0:i386
libavcodec56:i386
libavformat56:i386
libavresample2:i386
libavutil54:i386
libbabl-0.1-0:i386
libbasicusageenvironment0
libbind9-90
libblas-common
libblas3

[DNG] Purpy theme with dark titlebar

[Go Linux]

For my own desktop that uses only a gradient, I created a darker titlebar for 
the purpy theme.

Screenshot: http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/dark-titlebar-sm.png

zip: http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy-dark.zip

IIRC the only changes made were to the xfwm4 directory so you should just be 
able to switch that out in the other purpy theme.  But just to be sure, I 
zipped the whole thing.

Remember in xfce you need to change:

1. Menu > Settings > Appearance > Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy (or 
Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy-dark)

2. Menu > Settings > Window Manager > Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy (or 
Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy-dark)

And it needs to be in /usr/share/themes (not /home/user/.themes/) if you want 
gtk3 root apps like synaptic to be purpy too.

Enjoy!

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Unofficial Devuan live images

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 5/7/16, Jim Murphy  wrote:

On Sat, 5/7/16, Jim Murphy  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Unofficial Devuan live images
 To: "parazyd" , "dng" 
 Date: Saturday, May 7, 2016, 2:33 PM
 
 On Sat, May 7, 2016 at 1:53 PM, parazyd  wrote:
> On Sat, 07 May 2016, fsmithred wrote:
>
>> If someone want to see what Devuan-Jessie beta looks like without
>> installing it, I made some live isos. I expect that there will eventually
>> be an official Devuan-Live, but this is not it. HTH.
>>
>> https://sourceforge.net/projects/refracta/files/unofficial_devuan_live/
>>
>> [snip]
>
> Nice!
>
> Care to share any scripts or the workflow you have for creating such
> ISOs?


>You might want to start a couple of levels up from the files.

>https://sourceforge.net/projects/refracta/
>
> I'm still looking into this myself, but refracta AFAIKT is a set of tools that
> generate a live cd named, what else, retracta.  There is a link to the
> refracta Web
> Site there.  I'm sure fsmithred could offer more info, but this may
> give you a start.
>
> Jim



OK.  I found the latest refractasnapshot 9.3.3 here:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/refracta/files/testing/

(Downloading now)

I've been using this software for years.  It's amazing!!

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Unofficial Devuan live images

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 5/7/16, parazyd  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Unofficial Devuan live images
 To: "fsmithred" 
 Cc: "dng" 
 Date: Saturday, May 7, 2016, 1:53 PM
 
 On Sat, 07 May 2016, fsmithred wrote:


> If someone want to see what Devuan-Jessie beta looks like without
> installing it, I made some live isos. I expect that there will eventually
> be an official Devuan-Live, but this is not it. HTH.
>
> https://sourceforge.net/projects/refracta/files/unofficial_devuan_live/

>
> [snip]

Nice!

Care to share any scripts or the workflow you have for creating such
ISOs?

-- 
~ parazyd
0333 7671 FDE7 5BB6 A85E  C91F B876 CB44 FA1B 0274



refractasnapshot and refractainstaller

http://www.ibiblio.org/refracta/documents.html

https://sourceforge.net/projects/refracta/files/tools/

Earlier today fsr suggested I use the 9.3.3 version to make a snap of Devuan.  
Not quite sure where it is on SF.

golinux

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Re: [DNG] Why I was away.

[Go Linux]

This is all warm and fuzzy but very OT.   Please take your "therapy" off-list.  
Or better yet, get comfortable enough with yourself that a four-legged crutch 
isn't necessary to give meaning to your existence.

golinux
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[DNG] CORRECTION to purpy desktop theme

[Go Linux]

I just realized (with horror!) that the files in git for the purpy theme are 
incomplete and inaccurate.  The correct version can be downloaded from here:

http://www.saynotogmos.org/ss/Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy.zip

If I could figure out how to use git I would upload them myself but alas I am 
at someone else's mercy.  Maybe someday I'll figure it out.

Apologies for the inconvenience to those who can appreciate properly integrated 
desktop graphics . . .

golinux

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Re: [DNG] Default purpy desktop theme

[Go Linux]

On Wed, 5/4/16, fsmithred <fsmith...@gmail.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Default purpy desktop theme
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Wednesday, May 4, 2016, 11:13 AM
 
On 05/04/2016 11:20 AM, Go Linux wrote:

> Evidently the default purpy desktop graphics didn't make it into the beta.  
> :(  You can find the purpy wallpaper here (among all the others):
>
> https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/desktop-base/tree/master/backgrounds
>
> And it looks like the purpy window manager theme is here:
>
> https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/clearlooks-phenix-purpy-theme/tree/master
>
> Put the following elements into a directory named Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy:
>
> index.theme
> gtk-3.0
> gtk-2.0
> openbox-3
> metacity-1
> xfwm4
>
> Then put that directory in /usr/share/themes/ .
>
> You will also need to change two settings in Xfce:
>
> 1. Menu > Settings > Appearance > Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy
>
> 2. Menu > Settings > Window Manager > Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy
>
> Hopefully all this will be integrated by beta2.
>
> Enjoy the purpiness!
>
> golinux

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>

@golinux: It looks nice!

@everyone else: the following goes in the gtk-2.0 files to get rid of the
giant icons in the popups on the desktop items (The ones that jump up and
practically bite you when you hover a desktop icon.)

--- cut

style "xfdesktop-icon-view" {
XfdesktopIconView::label-alpha = 0
XfdesktopIconView::selected-label-alpha = 0
XfdesktopIconView::tooltip-size = 0
base[NORMAL] = "#00"
base[SELECTED] = "#94928d"
base[ACTIVE] = "#b5b3ac"
fg[NORMAL] = "#ff"
fg[SELECTED] = "#ff"
fg[ACTIVE] = "#ff" }

# xfce4 stuff
widget_class "*XfdesktopIconView*" style "xfdesktop-icon-view"

--- cut



For those unfamiliar with theming, these lines go at the very end of the purpy 
gtk-2.0/gtkrc file.

Or if you'd like to get rid of the gigantic pops globally put that into a 
.gtkrc-2.0 file in you home directory.  Depending on the theme and wallpaper, 
you may need to tweak some of the alpha and color settings.

golinux

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[DNG] Default purpy desktop theme

[Go Linux]

Evidently the default purpy desktop graphics didn't make it into the beta.  :(  
You can find the purpy wallpaper here (among all the others):

https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/desktop-base/tree/master/backgrounds

And it looks like the purpy window manager theme is here:

https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/clearlooks-phenix-purpy-theme/tree/master

Put the following elements into a directory named Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy:

index.theme
gtk-3.0
gtk-2.0
openbox-3
metacity-1
xfwm4

Then put that directory in /usr/share/themes/ .

You will also need to change two settings in Xfce:

1. Menu > Settings > Appearance > Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy

2. Menu > Settings > Window Manager > Clearlooks-Phenix-purpy

Hopefully all this will be integrated by beta2.

Enjoy the purpiness!

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Duplicate sources.list entry

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 5/3/16, Ozi Traveller <ozitravel...@gmail.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Duplicate sources.list entry
 To: "Go Linux" <goli...@yahoo.com>, "dng" <dng@lists.dyne.org>
 Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 8:15 PM
On Wed, May 4, 2016 at 10:28 AM, Go Linux <goli...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>> I just upgraded some packages and got this error:
>>
>>   W: Duplicate sources.list entry http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/merged/ 
>> jessie/main i386 Packages 
>> >>(/var/lib/apt/lists/auto.mirror.devuan.org_merged_dists_jessie_main_binary-i386_Packages)
>>
>>   Hoping someone can translate.  Don't know if it's something local or a 
>> duplication at the source.
>>
>>   golinux
> 
> 
> 
> There could be sources.list file in these folders that overlap.
> /etc/apt
> /etc/apt/sources.list.d
> 



Thanks Ozi Traveller.

I found this in /etc/apt/sources.list.d: 

# autogenerated by devuan-baseconf
# decomment following lines to  enable the developers devuan repository
deb http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/merged/ jessie main 
# deb-src http://packages.devuan.org/devuan/ jessie main 


I guess I should comment out that one line.

Since I didn't have this error before upgrading to the beta, I assume it is 
something that occurred during that process.  You might want to look into it 
Centurion_Dan.

golinux

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[DNG] Duplicate sources.list entry

[Go Linux]

I just upgraded some packages and got this error:

W: Duplicate sources.list entry http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/merged/ 
jessie/main i386 Packages 
(/var/lib/apt/lists/auto.mirror.devuan.org_merged_dists_jessie_main_binary-i386_Packages)

Hoping someone can translate.  Don't know if it's something local or a 
duplication at the source.

golinux
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Re: [DNG] another instance of packages.devuan

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 5/3/16, Hendrik Boom  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG] another instance of packages.devuan
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 3:36 PM
> 
>  I noticed in
>   
>  https://talk.devuan.org/t/migrating-from-debian-to-a-minimalist-devuan/181
>   
>   that it recommends deb lines like
>   
>   deb http://packages.devuan.org/merged jessie main
>   
>   and
>   
>   deb http://packages.devuan.org/merged jessie-updates main
> 
>  Shall I change them to auto.mirror.devuan.org?
> 
>   Or does that require special privileges? I've only just signed on
>   there and I'm rated a rank newbie.
>   
>   -- hendrik



I just made the changes.  Please double check that there are no errors.

golinux
 
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Re: [DNG] another instance of packages.devuan

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 5/3/16, Hendrik Boom  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG] another instance of packages.devuan
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 3:36 PM
>  
>  I noticed in
>   
>  https://talk.devuan.org/t/migrating-from-debian-to-a-minimalist-devuan/181
>   
>   that it recommends deb lines like
>   
>   deb http://packages.devuan.org/merged jessie main
>   
>   and
>   
>   deb http://packages.devuan.org/merged jessie-updates main
>  
>  Shall I change them to auto.mirror.devuan.org?
>  
>   Or does that require special privileges? I've only just signed on 
>   there and I'm rated a rank newbie.
>   
>   -- hendrik



I have admin privs on discourse and found a way to edit other people's posts.  
Can't do it atm but will later if no one else gets to it before me.

golinux


 
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Re: [DNG] OpenRC and Devuan (and Windows)

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 5/3/16, Mitt Green  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] OpenRC and Devuan
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 1:51 AM

>> The current init system is old. Ancient.
>> We should all agree on it. Devuan is looking
>> for a new init system that is not systemd and my
>> personal choice for this task from now on is
>> Gentoo's OpenRC.
‎>
> Unix is old. Ancient. We should all agree on it.
> Devuan is looking for a new base system that
> is not Unix and my personal choice for this
> task from now is Microsoft's Windows.
> 



Mitt's response reminded me of a post that was made to the forum earlier today 
in the topic "Windows explained to Devuan supporters" at 
https://talk.devuan.org/t/windows-explained-to-devuan-supporters/139/10 :



Linux = Pen testing
Windows = everything else

There are no advantages in using any linux distros other than pen testing and 
that it can be installed on a USB key(and I think that's very cool). Even 
Software Defined Radio (SDR) with maybe the exception of GMS intercepting and 
decoding, has more development under Windows. Night and day. One works 
extremely well on all PCs and permits the User to actually be productive and do 
things. The other one is a clunky Windows wannabe with a couple of specialized 
advantages that most don't care about. So..

YES
I like its functionality, its popularity(more software dev and hardware 
support), its clarity and ease of use.
The only thing wrong with my Windows is its lack of pen testing capability, and 
that is why I'm here (KL2 using Debian8 and now looking for an alternative with 
Dev-one as a base), otherwise I would >> n e v e r << bother with anything 
linux, life is too short



I'll spare you my personal thoughts on this evaluation of Linux but looking 
forward to all of yours.  :)

golinux




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Re: [DNG] cloud

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 4/30/16, Hughe Chung  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] cloud
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Saturday, April 30, 2016, 8:33 PM
 
>How about cloudnine?



How about Stratos.  A reference to Star Trek episode the 'Cloud Minders'.

golinux
 
 
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Re: [DNG] Devuan Security Repo (was Re: invalid security certificate)

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 4/30/16, Don Wright  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Devuan Security Repo (was Re: invalid security  
certificate)
 To: "dng" 
 Date: Saturday, April 30, 2016, 3:25 PM
Daniel Reurich wrote:

>We now have jessie-security and ascii-security repositories available on
>our mirrors
>
>deb http(s)://.mirror.devuan.org/merged jessie-security main
>[contrib] [non-free]


Would someone speak to the differences between auto.mirror.devuan.org
and auto.mirrors.devuan.org? The first is being used in this discussion,
while the second is used on https://devuan.org/ in the main page.

I resolve them as:
auto.mirror.devuan.org. 300 IN  CNAME   packages.devuan.org.
packages.devuan.org.1800IN  A   46.105.191.77

auto.mirrors.devuan.org. 300IN  CNAME   www.devuan.org.
www.devuan.org. 600 IN  A   46.105.191.76




 Bingo!  I removed the 's' on mirrors and it worked!!  Thank you!  I'll correct 
that on the site asap!!

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Devuan Security Repo (was Re: invalid security certificate)

[Go Linux]

On Sat, 4/30/16, Daniel Reurich  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Devuan Security Repo (was Re: invalid security  
certificate)
 To: "dev1fanboy" , "dng@lists.dyne.org" 

 Date: Saturday, April 30, 2016, 6:12 AM
 
We now have jessie-security and ascii-security repositories available on
our mirrors

deb http(s)://.mirror.devuan.org/merged jessie-security main
[contrib] [non-free]

If you've installed from the beta image the security repo stanza should
already be in your /etc/apt/sources.list

Thanks go to Franco (nextime) Lanza for the big push in working with me
to get this up and running.

Regards,
Daniel.



I reconfigured my sources.list as per instructions on the site:

deb http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org/merged jessie  main
deb http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org/merged jessie-updates  main
deb http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org/merged jessie-security main

And I'm getting:

# apt-get update
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie InRelease
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-updates InRelease
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-security InRelease
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie Release.gpg
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-updates Release.gpg
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-security Release.gpg
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie Release
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-updates Release
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-security Release
Err http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie/main i386 Packages
  404  Not Found [IP: 2001:41d0:8:2c55::a1 80]
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie/main Translation-en_US
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie/main Translation-en
Err http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-updates/main i386 Packages
  404  Not Found [IP: 2001:41d0:8:2c55::a1 80]
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-updates/main Translation-en_US
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-updates/main Translation-en
Err http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-security/main i386 Packages
  404  Not Found [IP: 2001:41d0:8:2c55::a1 80]
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-security/main Translation-en_US
Ign http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org jessie-security/main Translation-en
W: Failed to fetch 
http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org/merged/dists/jessie/main/binary-i386/Packages  
404  Not Found [IP: 2001:41d0:8:2c55::a1 80]

W: Failed to fetch 
http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org/merged/dists/jessie-updates/main/binary-i386/Packages
  404  Not Found [IP: 2001:41d0:8:2c55::a1 80]

W: Failed to fetch 
http://auto.mirrors.devuan.org/merged/dists/jessie-security/main/binary-i386/Packages
  404  Not Found [IP: 2001:41d0:8:2c55::a1 80]

E: Some index files failed to download. They have been ignored, or old ones 
used instead.

What am I doing wrong?  Probably overlooked something basic . . .

golinux




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Re: [DNG] mounting an android phone as usb storage

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 4/29/16, fuumind  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG] mounting an android phone as usb storage
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, April 29, 2016, 9:26 AM
 
> I'm trying to connect my android
>  phone to my devuan laptop as a USB storage device but it
>  aint working. Connecting an ordinary USB storage device
>  automounts and triggers a popup in pcmanfm.
> 
> dmesg says it has detected the device and lsusb shows an
> entry as well but I can't seem to find a device in /dev.
> 
> What should I be looking for?
 
 /fuumind



This may or may not be relevant but . . . when I connect my Canon camera on 
Devuan I have to mount it from the device column in Thunar.  If your phone is 
listed there, give it a try.  Or try mounting it the old-fashioned way . . .  ;)

golinux


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Re: [DNG] Devuan Jessie - beta release announcement

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 4/29/16, Harald Arnesen  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Devuan Jessie - beta release announcement
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, April 29, 2016, 7:07 AM
 
>> Veteran Unix Admins [2016-04-29 13:32]:

>> Debian GNU+Linux is a fork of Debian without systemd, on its way to
  ^^
>> become much more than that. This Beta release marks an important
>> milestone towards the sustainability and the continuation of Devuan as
>> an universal base distribution.
>> -- 
>> Hilsen Harald



Oops . . .  This announcement definitely should have been passed by some 
proofreaders.  It is a little ragged and really could have used a cleanup for 
spelling and ESL issues.  There are those of us who are here to do that but 
this is the first I've seen it.  So much for 'team' effort . . .

golinux

PS.  Apologies for being annoyed at this less than perfect unveiling of the 
Beta.
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Re: [DNG] dist upgrade from alpha4 to beta

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 4/29/16, Noel Torres  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] dist upgrade from alpha4 to beta
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, April 29, 2016, 7:26 AM
 
Haines Brown  escribió:
>>
>> In my alpha 4 sources.list I have:
>>
>>   deb http://packages.devuan.org/merged jessie main non-free contrib
>>
>> However, if the beta is jessie, then I should already be at beta
>> level. That is, a simple aptitude update/safe upgrade would be all I
>> need to do, rather than a dist-upgrade. Is that so?
>
> Yes
> 
> Regards
> 
> me



I actually did a dist-upgrade.  All is running just fine but libsystemd0 is 
still installed!  What's with that?

golinux


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Re: [DNG] For all you automounter programmers

[Go Linux]

On Thu, 4/28/16, Rob Owens  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] For all you automounter programmers
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Thursday, April 28, 2016, 9:44 AM
 
- Original Message -
> From: "Steve Litt" 

> Do you happen to know a corresponding utility to read/write the label
> on an ext4 formatted thumb drive partition?
>
e2label /dev/sdXY my_label



Steve, I know it's a tool you probably wouldn't use but labels can also be 
created with gparted.

golinux


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Re: [DNG] M$ Linux-frendly

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 4/22/16, Simon Walter <si...@gikaku.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] M$ Linux-frendly
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Friday, April 22, 2016, 9:28 PM
 
On 04/23/2016 10:54 AM, Go Linux wrote:

> On Fri, 4/22/16, Simon Walter <si...@gikaku.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> What is the reason people use CentOS? It's in the name and Cpanel is 
>>> evidence.
>>>
>>
>>
>> I think that people use Centos to avoid the cost of an expensive support 
>> contract with Redhat.
>>
>>

>
>But still have the cozy feeling that they are using an "enterprise"
>product. CentOS = Community enterprise OS.
>




Because Centos IS Redhat without the paid support ie a "free' community 
version.  Nearly all the hosting companies I've done business with have used 
Centos.

>
> Why would you want to use RedHat anyway? 
>

For me it was just a matter of circumstances.  Back @2005  the geeks at the 
local LUG were using it.  They had an "installfest" and that's what got put on 
a hand-me-down  machine alongside Winblows 98.  Those were blissful days of a 
sane Gnome2 desktop and a customizable usplash login screen.  Ubuntu hadn't 
arrived yet  and Lennart was still in 'diapers' with only sugarplum dreams of 
Lendows . . .  sigh . . .

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Re: [DNG] M$ Linux-frendly

[Go Linux]

On Fri, 4/22/16, Simon Walter  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] M$ Linux-frendly
 To: "dng@lists.dyne.org" 
 Date: Friday, April 22, 2016, 8:16 PM
 
[cut]

>
> What is the reason people use CentOS? It's in the name and Cpanel is evidence.
>

[cut]





I think that people use Centos to avoid the cost of an expensive support 
contract with Redhat.

golinux
 

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Re: [DNG] What do we want for ascii ?

[Go Linux]

On Wed, 4/20/16, BohwaZ  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] What do we want for ascii ?
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Wednesday, April 20, 2016, 7:51 AM
 
 Le Tue, 19 Apr 2016 19:45:39 +0200, Didier Kryn  a
écrit :

> Le 19/04/2016 15:41, BohwaZ a écrit :
> > > For Skype you can use apulse (like this: $ apulse skype) which wraps
> > > calls to PulseAudio directly to Alsa without requiring any PA
> > > component. It works well.
> >
> >  Sure I will try this! Not only Skype requires pulse, but it
> > wants the 32-bit version of it. If apluse can run 64-bit, it will
> > remove a lot of mess. Thanks.
> 
> I use https://github.com/i-rinat/apulse
> 
> There is a debian package which contains two binaries (by
> Nikolay Romanov, but I can't seem to find the package anymore?):
> 
> This program provides the PulseAudio emulation for ALSA.
> Usage:
>  $ apulse32  [parameters] - for 32-bit programs
>   $ apulse64  [parameters] - for 64-bit programs
> 
> There's other packages out there but didn't try them.
> 
> -- 
> BohwaZ
> 



This is not the first time apulse has been discussed on this list. There was 
talk of packaging apluse for Devuan last year but that conversation has been 
lost in time.  Perhaps adding apulse to Devuan will be reconsidered once the 
beta is out.  I would certainly like pulseaudio and it's libs out of my system.

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Devuan Web A11y

[Go Linux]

On Wed, 4/20/16, Svante Signell  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] Devuan Web A11y
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Wednesday, April 20, 2016, 9:38 AM
 
On Tue, 2016-04-19 at 04:29 +, hellekin wrote:
> For the Devuan Web we tried to take accessibility into account. If you
> have a11y issues with https://beta.devuan.org, please report to

Nice page, next would be to populate the links with content, right?



Perhaps you would like to provide some content for those pages?

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Re: [DNG] What do we want for ascii ?

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 4/19/16, Hendrik Boom  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] What do we want for ascii ?
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, April 19, 2016, 8:32 AM
 
On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 02:17:43PM +0900, Simon Walter wrote:
> On 04/18/2016 07:13 PM, Noel Torres wrote:
> >* our own bug reporting system
> >
>
> Hi all,
>
> I am a bit surprised there is no bug tracker and some other architecture.
>
> I would like to help make this a reality. Who is "in charge" of that
> and who decides this kind of thing?

More to the point, what is being used s a bug tracker now?  Something
on github, maybe?

-- hendrik



To report a bug, open an issue under the appropriate project in Devuan's gitlab 
(not github) at https://git.devuan.org/.  You will need to register to do so.

golinux
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Re: [DNG] What do we want for ascii ?

[Go Linux]

On Mon, 4/18/16, Didier Kryn  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] What do we want for ascii ?
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Monday, April 18, 2016, 9:31 AM
 
Le 18/04/2016 12:13, Noel Torres a écrit :

> >My Excel macros are a bit slow today (Yes, I said Excel, I use that at
>> work) so I started wondering...
>>
>> What do we (the DNG people) want for ascii ?
>>
>> My list starts as this:
>> * full init freedom, that is, all init methods being equally supported
>> (sysv, upstart, systemd) and nothing depending on any of them.
>> * our own bug reporting system
>> * a method for dividing Devuan in "cases" or "eggs" that do not
>> interfere with each other. E.g. the KDE egg, the LibreOffice egg, the
>> multimedia egg... maybe tasks with steroids?
>> * a rock-solid server platform for all architectures
>> * a sufficiently solid desktop and laptop platform for most usual
>> architectures
>> * Long Term Support for server whit a method for fast updating certain
>> packages (like virus lists)
>>
>> What do YOU want for ascii ?
>>
>> Regards

> All of this seems very attractive. At the moment I just see one
> point which is still a nightmare and is not in your list: the sound system.
>
> Could it be possible to work out a setup of the sound system simple
> enough for the random admin to understand  how it works and make
> educated choices? Eg some set up which would not use Pulse, except for
> those apps which exclusively want it, like Skype.
> 
> Do you seriously consider it possible to keep systemd in one of
> these eggs?  
> 
>Any news of s6? I'm afraid Laurent has leaved the list, either
> because he didn't like our disussions or because he was upset by his
> emails from dynamic address being rejected. 
> 
> Cheers.
>Didier
> 



This is putting the cart before the horse IMO.  It would be nice to get the 
beta out the door before focusing on ascii.   Any chance some of that energy 
could be directed towards the beta release?

golinux

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Re: [DNG] Fw: Beginning of the End for Wheezy [sigh!]

[Go Linux]

Do you know that debian-u...@lists.debian.org allows non-registered users to 
post to their lists?  I've been checking that  list for followups to this post. 
 Was hoping to see some of your responses there but it seems I'm the only one 
who sent to there. Perhaps some late responders will consider copying to -user 
also.  

golinux
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Re: [DNG] Systemd criciticized for malfunctioning OS

[Go Linux]

On Sun, 4/17/16, Edward Bartolo  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG] Systemd criciticized for malfunctioning OS
 To: "dng" 
 Date: Sunday, April 17, 2016, 5:21 AM
 
> Hi,
> 
> http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=30=613376#wrap
> 
> This post is from a forum member who used to combat for systemd
> ridiculing critics of systemd. Just read his post especially the
> closing part, I cannot believe what I read!
> 
> Criticism of systemd is not only the result of political disagreement
> but also the result of using a complex collection of executables at
> the core the operating system that is not WELL DEBUGGED and some even
> claim, that it is also not well designed.
> 
> Edward
> 



Here's another "one of those systemd thingies" I stumbled across this morning:

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?p=613205#p613205

It's their choice to put up with it . . .

golinux
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Re: [DNG] suspend

[Go Linux]

On Wed, 4/13/16, Steve Litt  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] suspend
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Wednesday, April 13, 2016, 10:23 AM
 
On Wed, 13 Apr 2016 08:04:40 + (UTC)
Trond Arild Ydersbond  wrote:

>>
>> I wonder if two new lists could be helpful, in addition to what is
>> planned:
>>
>>
>> 1. dng-oppftopic  - for the rants, systemd general stuff,
>> debian-related, public discussions
>>
>>about Linux etc etc
>> 2. dng-users- for support, discussion of more special issues, toy
>> projects that
>>
>>are not necessarily very significant for devuan as a whole etc.
>>
>> Then it would be easier to filter on a per topic, rather than per
>> user basis?
>>
>> Trond
>
> Splitting a mailing list greatly reduces its power as a meeting of the
> minds. 
>



I would prefer that the number of lists be kept to a minimum.  I don't think 
it's healthy to have a community split up into too many separate rooms. My 2 
cents.

golinux

PS  Trond's yahoo account is another one that doesn't get delivered here (and 
likely elsewhere).
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Re: [DNG] suspend

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 4/12/16, Jaromil  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] suspend
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, April 12, 2016, 12:17 PM
 
> dear Rainer,

On Tue, 12 Apr 2016, Rainer Weikusat wrote:
>> Ehh ... you do realize that - for as long as people [...]

> I don't understand the origin of your frustration nor appreciate the
> fact you are driving ad-personam attacks here, this being the main
> reason why I'm writing this on-list.
> 
> What puzzles me is: why you keep being here and well among the top
> posters? if you have such a low opinion of this place, please then
> just leave and don't waste your time with us. or do you think that
> Devuan must be somehow "liberated"... from its own people?!
> 
> I say this because the contributions and reports of the people you are
> aggressing, who are active both on and off this list, are absolutely
> valuable for the development of Devuan. Also in the past you aggressed
> other people who are contributing or even just when they were starting
> to contribute.
> 
> So now please stop doing this, consider leaving this place and think
> better about the origin of all this aggressivity, I suspect it may
> improve everyone's perception of your attempts to participate.
> 
> ciao
> 



There is a good reason that I have had Rainer's posts filtered directly to 
delete for many months.  So none of this kerfuffle reached my inbox.  Others 
can of course do the same so Rainer can rant in a cone of silence.

golinux


 
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Re: [DNG] suspend

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 4/12/16, Boruch Baum  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] suspend
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, April 12, 2016, 2:38 AM

No polkit but I did find these in /var/log/dpkg.log :

policykit-1:i386 0.105-9+devuan1

policykit-1-gnome:i386 0.105-2

golinux

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Re: [DNG] suspend

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 4/12/16, Boruch Baum  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] suspend
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, April 12, 2016, 2:38 AM
 
> I'm assuming that when you installed devuan, you asked the installer to
> install a desktop environment. 
> 

Yes, XFCE took care of everything.  However, at the time of the install - 
November 2/3 - the logout functions weren't working properly here either via 
the gui but did in terminal.  Centurion_Dan had to tweak upower.  I installed 
his fix on December 21.  You can read the #devuan discussion here starting in 
early December:

https://botbot.me/freenode/devuan/search/?q=upower 

> 
> 1] You didn't get an error message, which tells me devuan installed
> polkit on your system. The next question is why.
> 
> 1.1] Could you look at the result of running the following:
> 
>   head -qn1 /var/log/dpkg.log*
> 

That command threw up gibberish in terminal but I looked at the archive for the 
original install, searched for polkit and it wasn't there.   Only these pkgs 
were installed:

libpolkit-gobject-1-0:i386 0.105-9+devuan1
libpolkit-agent-1-0:i386 0.105-9+devuan1
libpolkit-agent-1-0:i386 0.105-9+devuan1

> 
>  grep -hm1 polkit /var/log/dpkg.log*
>

No output.

>  
>  2] There shouldn't be more than one authorization agent operating. At
>  best, it's confusing to administer, and at worst could freeze a system.
>  

Interesting.  Since I have some Mate pkgs installed I do have mate-polkit and 
mate-polkit-common installed.

hth,

golinux
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Re: [DNG] suspend

[Go Linux]

On Mon, 4/11/16, Boruch Baum <boruch_b...@gmx.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] suspend
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Monday, April 11, 2016, 11:48 PM
 
 On 04/11/2016 09:40 PM, Go Linux wrote:


>>> On Mon, 4/11/16, Boruch Baum <boruch_b...@gmx.com> wrote:
>>> Upon adding a GUI on top of a pre-existing cli-only install of
>>> devuan-alpha-4, the functionality of suspend, hibernate, switch-users,
>>> shutdown and restart were unavailable to the desktop user.
>>>

[snip]

>>>
>>> I don't yet have a working solution for 'switch-users', 'shutdown', or
>>> 'restart'.
>>
>> 
>>
>> Installing upower and libupower-glib1 from the devuan repos got the
>> whole shebang working for me from the xfce panel and/or main menu. I
>> suspect that xfce4-power-manager also has something to do with it.
> 
> 
> My installed versions for upower, libupower-glib1:amd64, and
> libupower-glib1:amd64 are all 1:0.9.23-2+devuan1.2
>
> The polkit actions:
> org.freedesktop.consolekit.system.stop
> org.freedesktop.consolekit.system.restart
>   org.freedesktop.consolekit.stop-multiple-users
>   org.freedesktop.consolekit.system.restart-multiple-users
> seem to be those that would control the remaining issues, and the
> installed version of consolekit is 0.4.6-5, from:
> us.mirror.devuan.org_merged_dists_jessie_main_binary-amd64_Packages
> 
> Do you get any ouput from running?:
> find /etc/polkit-1/localauthority -type f -print -exec cat '{}' \;
> 
> If so, could you post it?
> 

That command didn't spit out a thing.  Note that I am on 32 bit devuan if that 
might make a difference.

golinux
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Re: [DNG] suspend

[Go Linux]

On Mon, 4/11/16, Boruch Baum  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG] suspend
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Monday, April 11, 2016, 6:53 PM
 
> Upon adding a GUI on top of a pre-existing cli-only install of
devuan-alpha-4, the functionality of suspend, hibernate, switch-users,
shutdown and restart were unavailable to the desktop user.

> The easy solution for suspend and hibernate is to create a pkla file in
folder /etc/polkit-1/localauthority/50-local.d with contents:

> [Allow locally logged in members of group 'power' to put the hardware in
suspend mode]
Identity=unix-user:*
Action=org.freedesktop.upower.suspend
ResultAny=no
ResultInactive=yes
ResultActive=yes

> [Allow locally logged in members of group 'power' to put the hardware in
hibernate mode]
Identity=unix-user:*
Action=org.freedesktop.upower.hibernate
ResultAny=no
ResultInactive=yes
ResultActive=yes

> The more complex solution is to create a group 'power', add desktop
users to that group, and then create the above file, but replacing
'unix-user:*' with unix-group:power'.

> I don't yet have a working solution for 'switch-users', 'shutdown', or
'restart'.



Installing upower and libupower-glib1 from the devuan repos got the whole 
shebang working for me from the xfce panel and/or main menu.  I suspect that 
xfce4-power-manager also has something to do with it.

golinux

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Re: [DNG] Raspberry Pi 2 image

[Go Linux]

On Mon, 4/11/16, aitor_czr  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG]  Raspberry Pi 2 image
 To: "parazyd" , dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Monday, April 11, 2016, 1:31 PM
   
  Hi parazyd,
 
 On 04/11/16
 10:51, parazyd 
 wrote:

>> you can login as root with credentials "root:porcoddio"   
 
>   Thanks, downloading it...
 
>For security reasons, i changed the password to "salaamalekum"



I'm not getting the obsession with the password.  And why the second was more 
'secure'.  Good grief! It's publicly available on the internet!!

golinux
 
     
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Re: [DNG] Download iso 32bit devuan alpha2 or higher(based installation without network)

[Go Linux]

On Thu, 3/31/16, Ismael L. Donis Garcia  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG] Download iso 32bit devuan alpha2 or higher(based installation   
without network)
 To: "Lista de Devuan" 
 Date: Thursday, March 31, 2016, 11:47 AM
 
 Where can I find a devuan 32 bit iso
 alpha2 or higher than the minimum 
 system is installed without access to the network?
 
 if alpha4 better
 
 Someone could provide me a link to the download if you have
 it built?
 
 I want to keep trying at home where I do not have internet
 access.
 
 From now thanks
  
  | ISMAEL |
   



You might want to give Refracta based on devuan jessie a try.  fsmithred talks 
about it here in answer to a question similar to yours:

http://refracta.freeforums.org/2016-02-23-iso-packages-t560.html#p5336

golinux

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Re: [DNG] files.devuan.org not working

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 3/29/16, Linux O'Beardly  wrote:

 Subject: Re: [DNG] files.devuan.org not working
 To: "Jaromil" 
 Cc: "dng" 
 Date: Tuesday, March 29, 2016, 6:01 PM
 
Do we know when this will be fixed? It's really hard to spread the gospel of 
Devuan if my disciples can't get to the source of enlightenment.

Linux O'Beardly
@LinuxOBeardly
http://o.beard.ly
linux.obear...@gmail.com



This link is informative:

https://community.letsencrypt.org/t/rate-limits-for-lets-encrypt/6769

Seems there should be a way to work this out with Let's Encrypt.   I don't know 
much about certificates but I do know a thing or two about consumer action . . 
.   ;)

golinux

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Re: [DNG] installer messes up swap partition on multi-boot

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 3/22/16, Daniel Reurich  wrote:

> 
> Given that suspend2disk uses
> the swap volume I'd recommend never using the same swap space for
> different linux systems anyway in a multi-boot setup.
> 



Now I'm confused.  I thought that suspend used RAM and hibernate used swap. Oh 
wait . . .  suspend2disk isn't even in the devuan repos.  Now I'm really 
confused.  Aside from that, I have shared swap partitions in the past.  I had 
no idea that was a nono.  Learn something new everyday (if you're lucky).

golinux


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Re: [DNG] audio died again AND GOT RESURRECTED.

[Go Linux]

On Tue, 3/22/16, Hendrik Boom  wrote:
 Subject: Re: [DNG] audio died again AND GOT RESURRECTED.
 To: "Joel Roth" , dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Tuesday, March 22, 2016, 6:14 PM
 
 On Tue, Mar 22, 2016 at 12:57:02PM
 -1000, Joel Roth wrote:
 >> Hi Hendrik,
 >> 
 >> It's worth verifying that you don't have pulse audio
 >> installed.
 >> 
 >> dpkg -l pulseaudio
 >>
 >>

 > That was enough.  I ued aptitude to remove it, and it
 >  also took out
 >  pulseaudio-module-x11. 
 > 
 >  Oh, I did an
 > 
 >     alsactl init
 > 
 > afterward just in case alsa needed initialization.
 > 
 > Now it works nicely.



Here's hoping that the beta will NOT install pulseaudio by default.  Pretty 
please?

golinux





 
 -- hendrik
 
 > 
 > Then, you can fiddle with alsamixer or aumix and raise
 > all the settings to full.  This is the most likely
 issue.
 > 
 > If you have multiple sound cards, make sure to use 
 > the -c argument.
 >  
 > The choice of kernels could also make a difference,
 > but AFAIK, all recent kernels have ALSA drivers for 
 > typical builtin soundcards.
 > 
 > cheers,
 > 
 > Joel
 > 
 > > -- hendrik
 > > 
 > > ___
 > > Dng mailing list
 > > Dng@lists.dyne.org
 > > https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
 > 
 > -- 
 > Joel Roth
 >   
 > 
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Re: [DNG] Installer 'Firmware' partition

[Go Linux]

On Mon, 3/21/16, Boruch Baum  wrote:

 Subject: [DNG] Installer 'Firmware' partition
 To: dng@lists.dyne.org
 Date: Monday, March 21, 2016, 3:51 PM

>  
> This is another nice touch in the installer, and its a shame that its
> insufficiently documented, so I'd like to suggest that some text be
> added to an installer window to let users know.
> 



Perhaps you'd like to write up some documentation to better guide users on 
their quest to install Devuan?

golinux
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