Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Bill Prince 
In our area? Crap. There is not enough SNR, or even just good ol' S to get
any decent bandwidth through.

-bp

On Tue, Apr 4, 2017 at 10:38 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

> How does the newer 900 MHz stuff get along with redwoods?
>
> *From:* Bill Prince
> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 04, 2017 11:37 AM
> *To:* Motorola III
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>
> There are at least a couple ways to do a "hybrid" system, depending on the
> situation.
>
> One is getting service to a remote community that is buried in trees. Use
> microwave to get to the neighborhood, and fiber to get around the
> neighborhood.
>
> The second is a neighborhood that isn't so "remote, and doesn't have that
> many trees. Use fiber to get to the neighborhood, and wireless to get the
> service around the neighborhood.
>
> We have a few neighborhood that are buried within a grove of 300' (plus)
> redwood trees. Impossible to get any decent kind of wireless service in
> those.
>
> However, we also have some of the second variety.
>
> -bp
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 4, 2017 at 10:10 AM, Adam Moffett <dmmoff...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm thinking you put the AP on the utility pole.
>>
>>
>> -- Original Message --
>> From: "Mitch Koep" <af...@abwisp.com>
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Sent: 4/4/2017 12:18:42 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>>
>> What happens if the house with AP quits service??
>>>
>>> You loose the rest that are connected ??
>>>
>>> Tried that did not go well LOL
>>>
>>> So now use power poles or small pipe masts (30 to 40')
>>>
>>>
>>> On 04/04/2017 11:08 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>>>
>>>> Well, Utah...
>>>>
>>>> Like to hear reports from the rainy states.
>>>>
>>>> 60 GHz is .19" wavelength or about .095" half wave or .0475" quarter
>>>> wave.
>>>>
>>>> Rain drops can get up to .150" So they fall in the ranges of quarter to
>>>> full wave length sizes.
>>>>
>>>> Moreover they will serve as miniature dielectric lenses.  And then
>>>> there is oxygen absorption and water absorption.
>>>> Even CO2, and fog causes problems.
>>>>
>>>> But should be noise free and you can certainly reuse frequencies all
>>>> over because it will not go far enough to interfere if done right.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -Original Message- From: Brett A Mansfield
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:59 AM
>>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>>>>
>>>> I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in
>>>> the rain. I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been rain,
>>>> but not heavy rain since I installed this link.
>>>>
>>>> Thank you,
>>>> Brett A Mansfield
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what
>>>>> kid of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals at 
>>>>> the
>>>>> AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at their home with
>>>>> the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I asked them if it stays up
>>>>> during rain and snow.  They claimed it did.  Assuming the path was a
>>>>> quarter mile or less.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
>>>>> To: 'af@afmug.com'
>>>>> Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>>>>>
>>>>> Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?
>>>>>
>>>>> Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or
>>>>> near to the neighborhoods.
>>>>>
>>>>> What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and
>>>>> small business customers?
>>>>>
>>>>> Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for
>>>>> sale/ready for use?
>>>>>
>>>>> Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber
>>>>> and LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thoughts?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> -- Mitch Koep
>>>
>>> A Better Wireless
>>> 218-851-8689 cell
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
> --
> --
> bp
> part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
>



-- 
--
bp
part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Chuck McCown 
How does the newer 900 MHz stuff get along with redwoods?

From: Bill Prince 
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 11:37 AM
To: Motorola III 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

There are at least a couple ways to do a "hybrid" system, depending on the 
situation. 

One is getting service to a remote community that is buried in trees. Use 
microwave to get to the neighborhood, and fiber to get around the neighborhood.

The second is a neighborhood that isn't so "remote, and doesn't have that many 
trees. Use fiber to get to the neighborhood, and wireless to get the service 
around the neighborhood.

We have a few neighborhood that are buried within a grove of 300' (plus) 
redwood trees. Impossible to get any decent kind of wireless service in those.

However, we also have some of the second variety.

-bp


On Tue, Apr 4, 2017 at 10:10 AM, Adam Moffett <dmmoff...@gmail.com> wrote:

  I'm thinking you put the AP on the utility pole.


  -- Original Message --
  From: "Mitch Koep" <af...@abwisp.com>
  To: af@afmug.com
  Sent: 4/4/2017 12:18:42 PM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless


What happens if the house with AP quits service??

You loose the rest that are connected ??

Tried that did not go well LOL

So now use power poles or small pipe masts (30 to 40')


On 04/04/2017 11:08 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  Well, Utah...

  Like to hear reports from the rainy states.

  60 GHz is .19" wavelength or about .095" half wave or .0475" quarter wave.

  Rain drops can get up to .150" So they fall in the ranges of quarter to 
full wave length sizes.

  Moreover they will serve as miniature dielectric lenses.  And then there 
is oxygen absorption and water absorption.
  Even CO2, and fog causes problems.

  But should be noise free and you can certainly reuse frequencies all over 
because it will not go far enough to interfere if done right.


  -Original Message- From: Brett A Mansfield
  Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:59 AM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

  I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in the 
rain. I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been rain, but not 
heavy rain since I installed this link.

  Thank you,
  Brett A Mansfield


On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what 
kid of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals at the 
AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at their home with the 
millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I asked them if it stays up during 
rain and snow.  They claimed it did.  Assuming the path was a quarter mile or 
less.

-Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
    To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?

Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or 
near to the neighborhoods.

What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small 
business customers?

Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for 
sale/ready for use?

Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber 
and LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?

Thoughts?





-- Mitch Koep

A Better Wireless
218-851-8689 cell








-- 

--

bp

part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Bill Prince 
There are at least a couple ways to do a "hybrid" system, depending on the
situation.

One is getting service to a remote community that is buried in trees. Use
microwave to get to the neighborhood, and fiber to get around the
neighborhood.

The second is a neighborhood that isn't so "remote, and doesn't have that
many trees. Use fiber to get to the neighborhood, and wireless to get the
service around the neighborhood.

We have a few neighborhood that are buried within a grove of 300' (plus)
redwood trees. Impossible to get any decent kind of wireless service in
those.

However, we also have some of the second variety.

-bp


On Tue, Apr 4, 2017 at 10:10 AM, Adam Moffett <dmmoff...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm thinking you put the AP on the utility pole.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Mitch Koep" <af...@abwisp.com>
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: 4/4/2017 12:18:42 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>
> What happens if the house with AP quits service??
>>
>> You loose the rest that are connected ??
>>
>> Tried that did not go well LOL
>>
>> So now use power poles or small pipe masts (30 to 40')
>>
>>
>> On 04/04/2017 11:08 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>>
>>> Well, Utah...
>>>
>>> Like to hear reports from the rainy states.
>>>
>>> 60 GHz is .19" wavelength or about .095" half wave or .0475" quarter
>>> wave.
>>>
>>> Rain drops can get up to .150" So they fall in the ranges of quarter to
>>> full wave length sizes.
>>>
>>> Moreover they will serve as miniature dielectric lenses.  And then there
>>> is oxygen absorption and water absorption.
>>> Even CO2, and fog causes problems.
>>>
>>> But should be noise free and you can certainly reuse frequencies all
>>> over because it will not go far enough to interfere if done right.
>>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message- From: Brett A Mansfield
>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:59 AM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>>>
>>> I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in
>>> the rain. I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been rain,
>>> but not heavy rain since I installed this link.
>>>
>>> Thank you,
>>> Brett A Mansfield
>>>
>>> On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what
>>>> kid of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals at the
>>>> AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at their home with
>>>> the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I asked them if it stays up
>>>> during rain and snow.  They claimed it did.  Assuming the path was a
>>>> quarter mile or less.
>>>>
>>>> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
>>>> To: 'af@afmug.com'
>>>> Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>>>>
>>>> Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?
>>>>
>>>> Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or
>>>> near to the neighborhoods.
>>>>
>>>> What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small
>>>> business customers?
>>>>
>>>> Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for
>>>> sale/ready for use?
>>>>
>>>> Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber
>>>> and LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?
>>>>
>>>> Thoughts?
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> -- Mitch Koep
>>
>> A Better Wireless
>> 218-851-8689 cell
>>
>>
>


-- 
--
bp
part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Adam Moffett 
I don't know about your power company, but ours has two attachment 
application processesone for lines and one for antennas.  So at 
least around here it's something that's been thought of.
Putting in your own pole is also pretty cheap if it's a normal 
heightlike a 50 footer (42' AGL).  The breaking point here is either 
60 or 70'I can't remember.  After a certain length we need a permit 
from the DOT to transport it and a crane to install it.


I think like Mitch I'm also biased against putting stuff on houses.  I 
just see too many ways for it to go sideways.



-- Original Message --
From: "Sterling Jacobson" <sterl...@avative.net>
To: "af@afmug.com" <af@afmug.com>
Sent: 4/4/2017 1:19:30 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless


Yeah, some high point not on residential property I guess.

We don't have a lot of utility poles in some areas, so this is going to 
be a challenge.


I don't like maintaining tower infrastructure, so some sort of deal 
with the power company for pole space or with the city or HOA for space 
and power is probably best.


I remember our most troublesome 'towers' were the ones on private 
property.


-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 11:10 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

I'm thinking you put the AP on the utility pole.


-- Original Message --
From: "Mitch Koep" <af...@abwisp.com>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 4/4/2017 12:18:42 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless


What happens if the house with AP quits service??

You loose the rest that are connected ??

Tried that did not go well LOL

So now use power poles or small pipe masts (30 to 40')


On 04/04/2017 11:08 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Well, Utah...

Like to hear reports from the rainy states.

60 GHz is .19" wavelength or about .095" half wave or .0475" quarter
wave.

Rain drops can get up to .150" So they fall in the ranges of quarter
to full wave length sizes.

Moreover they will serve as miniature dielectric lenses.  And then
there is oxygen absorption and water absorption.
Even CO2, and fog causes problems.

But should be noise free and you can certainly reuse frequencies all
over because it will not go far enough to interfere if done right.


-Original Message- From: Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:59 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in
the rain. I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been
rain, but not heavy rain since I installed this link.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield


On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what
kid of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals
at the AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at
their home with the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I
asked them if it stays up during rain and snow.  They claimed it 
did.

  Assuming the path was a quarter mile or less.

-Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?

Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in
or near to the neighborhoods.

What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and
small business customers?

Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for
sale/ready for use?

Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with
fiber and LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?

Thoughts?





-- Mitch Koep

A Better Wireless
218-851-8689 cell

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Chuck McCown 

Street lights?
There is even a special adapter that can take power from the photocell 
socket.


-Original Message- 
From: Sterling Jacobson

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 11:19 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Yeah, some high point not on residential property I guess.

We don't have a lot of utility poles in some areas, so this is going to be a 
challenge.


I don't like maintaining tower infrastructure, so some sort of deal with the 
power company for pole space or with the city or HOA for space and power is 
probably best.


I remember our most troublesome 'towers' were the ones on private property.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 11:10 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

I'm thinking you put the AP on the utility pole.


-- Original Message --
From: "Mitch Koep" <af...@abwisp.com>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 4/4/2017 12:18:42 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless


What happens if the house with AP quits service??

You loose the rest that are connected ??

Tried that did not go well LOL

So now use power poles or small pipe masts (30 to 40')


On 04/04/2017 11:08 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Well, Utah...

Like to hear reports from the rainy states.

60 GHz is .19" wavelength or about .095" half wave or .0475" quarter
wave.

Rain drops can get up to .150" So they fall in the ranges of quarter
to full wave length sizes.

Moreover they will serve as miniature dielectric lenses.  And then
there is oxygen absorption and water absorption.
Even CO2, and fog causes problems.

But should be noise free and you can certainly reuse frequencies all
over because it will not go far enough to interfere if done right.


-Original Message- From: Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:59 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in
the rain. I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been
rain, but not heavy rain since I installed this link.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield


On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what
kid of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals
at the AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at
their home with the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I
asked them if it stays up during rain and snow.  They claimed it did.
 Assuming the path was a quarter mile or less.

-Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?

Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in
or near to the neighborhoods.

What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and
small business customers?

Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for
sale/ready for use?

Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with
fiber and LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?

Thoughts?





-- Mitch Koep

A Better Wireless
218-851-8689 cell

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Sterling Jacobson 
Yeah, some high point not on residential property I guess.

We don't have a lot of utility poles in some areas, so this is going to be a 
challenge.

I don't like maintaining tower infrastructure, so some sort of deal with the 
power company for pole space or with the city or HOA for space and power is 
probably best.

I remember our most troublesome 'towers' were the ones on private property.

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 11:10 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

I'm thinking you put the AP on the utility pole.


-- Original Message --
From: "Mitch Koep" <af...@abwisp.com>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 4/4/2017 12:18:42 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

>What happens if the house with AP quits service??
>
>You loose the rest that are connected ??
>
>Tried that did not go well LOL
>
>So now use power poles or small pipe masts (30 to 40')
>
>
>On 04/04/2017 11:08 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>>Well, Utah...
>>
>>Like to hear reports from the rainy states.
>>
>>60 GHz is .19" wavelength or about .095" half wave or .0475" quarter 
>>wave.
>>
>>Rain drops can get up to .150" So they fall in the ranges of quarter 
>>to full wave length sizes.
>>
>>Moreover they will serve as miniature dielectric lenses.  And then 
>>there is oxygen absorption and water absorption.
>>Even CO2, and fog causes problems.
>>
>>But should be noise free and you can certainly reuse frequencies all 
>>over because it will not go far enough to interfere if done right.
>>
>>
>>-Original Message- From: Brett A Mansfield
>>Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:59 AM
>>To: af@afmug.com
>>Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>>
>>I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in 
>>the rain. I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been 
>>rain, but not heavy rain since I installed this link.
>>
>>Thank you,
>>Brett A Mansfield
>>
>>>On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what 
>>>kid of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals 
>>>at the AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at 
>>>their home with the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I 
>>>asked them if it stays up during rain and snow.  They claimed it did.
>>>  Assuming the path was a quarter mile or less.
>>>
>>>-Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>>>Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
>>>To: 'af@afmug.com'
>>>Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>>>
>>>Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?
>>>
>>>Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in 
>>>or near to the neighborhoods.
>>>
>>>What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and 
>>>small business customers?
>>>
>>>Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for 
>>>sale/ready for use?
>>>
>>>Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with 
>>>fiber and LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?
>>>
>>>Thoughts?
>>
>>
>
>-- Mitch Koep
>
>A Better Wireless
>218-851-8689 cell
>

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Adam Moffett 

I'm thinking you put the AP on the utility pole.


-- Original Message --
From: "Mitch Koep" <af...@abwisp.com>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 4/4/2017 12:18:42 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless


What happens if the house with AP quits service??

You loose the rest that are connected ??

Tried that did not go well LOL

So now use power poles or small pipe masts (30 to 40')


On 04/04/2017 11:08 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Well, Utah...

Like to hear reports from the rainy states.

60 GHz is .19" wavelength or about .095" half wave or .0475" quarter 
wave.


Rain drops can get up to .150" So they fall in the ranges of quarter 
to full wave length sizes.


Moreover they will serve as miniature dielectric lenses.  And then 
there is oxygen absorption and water absorption.

Even CO2, and fog causes problems.

But should be noise free and you can certainly reuse frequencies all 
over because it will not go far enough to interfere if done right.



-Original Message- From: Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:59 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in 
the rain. I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been 
rain, but not heavy rain since I installed this link.


Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield


On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what 
kid of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals 
at the AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at 
their home with the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I 
asked them if it stays up during rain and snow.  They claimed it did. 
 Assuming the path was a quarter mile or less.


-Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?

Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in 
or near to the neighborhoods.


What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and 
small business customers?


Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for 
sale/ready for use?


Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with 
fiber and LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?


Thoughts?





-- Mitch Koep

A Better Wireless
218-851-8689 cell

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Jaime Solorza 
Siklu has a webinar on PMP product line this week I think

Jaime Solorza
Wireless Systems Architect
915-861-1390

On Tue, Apr 4, 2017 at 10:32 AM, Super WISP <superw...@wavonline.com> wrote:

> Siklu is coming out with a 60GHz option at the end of April or early May.
>
>
> Mark Chamerlik
> Strategic Account Manager-East
> WAV, Inc. | We make the Internet work
> O: 630-818-1004 | C: 815-822-4490
> ma...@wavonline.com
>
>
> For additional assistance please contact: insidesa...@wavonline.com
>
>
> This message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to
> which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged,
> confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the reader
> of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent
> responsible for delivery of the message to the intended recipient, you are
> hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this
> communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this
> communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone at
> 630-818-1000.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson
> Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 10:47 AM
> To: 'af@afmug.com'
> Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>
> Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?
>
> Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or
> near to the neighborhoods.
>
> What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small
> business customers?
>
> Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready
> for use?
>
> Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber and
> LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?
>
> Thoughts?
>
> --
>
> This email has been scanned for spam and viruses by Proofpoint Essentials.
> Visit the following link to report this email as spam:
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>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Gino Villarini 
Yeap, but ill go urban/city  more density=more customers

On 4/4/17, 11:47 AM, "Af on behalf of Sterling Jacobson"



Gino Villarini


President
Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

[cid:aeronet-logo_310cfc3e-6691-4f69-bd49-b37b834b9238.png]

 wrote:

>Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?
>
>Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or
>near to the neighborhoods.
>
>What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small
>business customers?
>
>Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready
>for use?
>
>Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber
>and LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?
>
>Thoughts?

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Super WISP 
Siklu is coming out with a 60GHz option at the end of April or early May.


Mark Chamerlik
Strategic Account Manager-East
WAV, Inc. | We make the Internet work
O: 630-818-1004 | C: 815-822-4490
ma...@wavonline.com   
  

For additional assistance please contact: insidesa...@wavonline.com


This message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which 
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-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, April 4, 2017 10:47 AM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?

Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or near to 
the neighborhoods.

What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small 
business customers?

Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready for 
use?

Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber and LOS 
to everyone else and deploy PtMP?

Thoughts?

--

This email has been scanned for spam and viruses by Proofpoint Essentials. 
Visit the following link to report this email as spam:
https://us4.proofpointessentials.com/index01.php?mod_id_option=gitem_id91320841-ygu8MZOT0Fu7_address=perwisp%40wavonline.com=

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Jon Langeler 
One advantage of fiber is also less electronics in the mix. 60ghz might be a 
good option to get the neighborhood hooked up quickly however. 

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Apr 4, 2017, at 11:47 AM, Sterling Jacobson  wrote:
> 
> Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?
> 
> Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or near 
> to the neighborhoods.
> 
> What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small 
> business customers?
> 
> Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready for 
> use?
> 
> Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber and 
> LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?
> 
> Thoughts?

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Chuck McCown 
Keep building fiber.  Call it Gogol fiber.  Or perhaps Googolplex fiber. 
Millinillion fiber.


-Original Message- 
From: Chuck McCown

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 10:08 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Well, Utah...

Like to hear reports from the rainy states.

60 GHz is .19" wavelength or about .095" half wave or .0475" quarter wave.

Rain drops can get up to .150" So they fall in the ranges of quarter to full
wave length sizes.

Moreover they will serve as miniature dielectric lenses.  And then there is
oxygen absorption and water absorption.
Even CO2, and fog causes problems.

But should be noise free and you can certainly reuse frequencies all over
because it will not go far enough to interfere if done right.


-Original Message- 
From: Brett A Mansfield

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:59 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in the
rain. I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been rain, but not
heavy rain since I installed this link.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield


On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what kid 
of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals at the 
AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at their home with 
the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I asked them if it stays up 
during rain and snow.  They claimed it did.  Assuming the path was a 
quarter mile or less.


-Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?

Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or 
near to the neighborhoods.


What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small 
business customers?


Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready 
for use?


Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber and 
LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?


Thoughts?

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Mitch Koep 

What happens if the house with AP quits service??

You loose the rest that are connected ??

Tried that did not go well LOL

So now use power poles or small pipe masts (30 to 40')


On 04/04/2017 11:08 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Well, Utah...

Like to hear reports from the rainy states.

60 GHz is .19" wavelength or about .095" half wave or .0475" quarter 
wave.


Rain drops can get up to .150" So they fall in the ranges of quarter 
to full wave length sizes.


Moreover they will serve as miniature dielectric lenses.  And then 
there is oxygen absorption and water absorption.

Even CO2, and fog causes problems.

But should be noise free and you can certainly reuse frequencies all 
over because it will not go far enough to interfere if done right.



-Original Message- From: Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:59 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in 
the rain. I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been 
rain, but not heavy rain since I installed this link.


Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield


On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what 
kid of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals 
at the AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at 
their home with the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I 
asked them if it stays up during rain and snow.  They claimed it 
did.  Assuming the path was a quarter mile or less.


-Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?

Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in 
or near to the neighborhoods.


What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and 
small business customers?


Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for 
sale/ready for use?


Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with 
fiber and LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?


Thoughts?





--
Mitch Koep

A Better Wireless
218-851-8689 cell

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Chuck McCown 

Well, Utah...

Like to hear reports from the rainy states.

60 GHz is .19" wavelength or about .095" half wave or .0475" quarter wave.

Rain drops can get up to .150" So they fall in the ranges of quarter to full 
wave length sizes.


Moreover they will serve as miniature dielectric lenses.  And then there is 
oxygen absorption and water absorption.

Even CO2, and fog causes problems.

But should be noise free and you can certainly reuse frequencies all over 
because it will not go far enough to interfere if done right.



-Original Message- 
From: Brett A Mansfield

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:59 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in the 
rain. I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been rain, but not 
heavy rain since I installed this link.


Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield


On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what kid 
of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals at the 
AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at their home with 
the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I asked them if it stays up 
during rain and snow.  They claimed it did.  Assuming the path was a 
quarter mile or less.


-Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?

Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or 
near to the neighborhoods.


What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small 
business customers?


Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready 
for use?


Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber and 
LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?


Thoughts?

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Brett A Mansfield 
I have an Ignitenet PtP link that is half a mile that doesn't fade in the rain. 
I'm sure it will if it gets really heavy. There has been rain, but not heavy 
rain since I installed this link.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

> On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:
> 
> Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what kid of 
> radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals at the 
> AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at their home with the 
> millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I asked them if it stays up during 
> rain and snow.  They claimed it did.  Assuming the path was a quarter mile or 
> less.
> 
> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
> To: 'af@afmug.com'
> Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
> 
> Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?
> 
> Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or near 
> to the neighborhoods.
> 
> What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small 
> business customers?
> 
> Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready for 
> use?
> 
> Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber and 
> LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?
> 
> Thoughts?

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Mathew Howard 
Ignitenet would probably be the best option for doing this, at this point.

On Tue, Apr 4, 2017 at 10:52 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

> Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what kid
> of radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals at the
> AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at their home with
> the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I asked them if it stays up
> during rain and snow.  They claimed it did.  Assuming the path was a
> quarter mile or less.
>
> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
> Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
> To: 'af@afmug.com'
> Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless
>
>
> Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?
>
> Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or
> near to the neighborhoods.
>
> What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small
> business customers?
>
> Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready
> for use?
>
> Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber and
> LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?
>
> Thoughts?
>

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Brett A Mansfield 
There are the Ignitenet 60GHz radios. They are great! I can show you how I am 
setting a new deployment of them very soon. It limits how many APs are 
required. I'm able to get a consistent 900Mb over PtMP.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

> On Apr 4, 2017, at 9:47 AM, Sterling Jacobson  wrote:
> 
> Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?
> 
> Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or near 
> to the neighborhoods.
> 
> What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small 
> business customers?
> 
> Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready for 
> use?
> 
> Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber and 
> LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?
> 
> Thoughts?

Re: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Chuck McCown 
Vivint and Google are both saying they are doing this.  No idea what kid of 
radios they are using.  I talked to a couple of Vivint locals at the 
AnimalFarm show.  They both claim to be getting 1 Gbps at their home with 
the millimeter radio.  I think it was 60 GHz.  I asked them if it stays up 
during rain and snow.  They claimed it did.  Assuming the path was a quarter 
mile or less.


-Original Message- 
From: Sterling Jacobson

Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2017 9:47 AM
To: 'af@afmug.com'
Subject: [AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?

Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or near 
to the neighborhoods.


What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small 
business customers?


Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready for 
use?


Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber and 
LOS to everyone else and deploy PtMP?


Thoughts?

[AFMUG] Current state of Hybrid Fiber/Wireless

2017-04-04 Thread Sterling Jacobson 
Where are we with this concept as a WISP industry?

Let's say I have $200k to invest and already have mainline fiber in or near to 
the neighborhoods.

What equipment do I buy to get the best speeds to residential and small 
business customers?

Is there equipment in the 60GHz or similar bands that are for sale/ready for 
use?

Is the topology still to connect a house or two in the area with fiber and LOS 
to everyone else and deploy PtMP?

Thoughts?