Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Inguz and Room EQ Wizard (REW)
cliveb wrote:
> I'm currently on holiday so without access to my LMS machine, but when I
> get back (next Wednesday) can post my own custom-convert file that
> implements parametric EQ. It was even set up based on an REW run, so it
> should show exactly how it's done for your use case.
I expect those interested may have already figured it out by now, but as
promised here is my own custom-convert.conf file that implements
parametric EQ with SOX:
Code:
flc flc * b8:27:eb:e0:f9:75
# FT:{START=--skip=%t}U:{END=--until=%v}
[flac] -dcs $START$ $END$ -- $FILE$ | [sox] -q --multi-threaded
--no-clobber -t wav - -t flac -C 0 - equalizer 54.3 2.831q -19.2 equalizer 71.1
3.982q +9.0 equalizer 75.2 7.677q -5.4 equalizer 89.3 11.271q -5.5 equalizer
148 13.429q -13.3 equalizer 202 5.0q -6.2 equalizer 225 5.0q +6.3
There are 7 filters here, as calculated by REW. The MAC address is of
course to limit the filtering to apply only to the player in the room
that the filters are for.
NB. I only use FLAC in my library. If you need to process other formats,
you'll need extra entries for each codec. I decided that it was too much
bother to do that, so I transcoded the few non-FLAC files I had into
FLAC to sidestep the issue.
Having an example of a known working file might help, especially the
stuff in the #FT line and the way that FLAC is invoked. This is all to
do with making sure that seek operations while playing files work, and
the filtering continues to operate after a seek. It's explained in an
earlier thread here:
https://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?114806-Digital-Room-Correction-with-the-HiFiBerry-DSP-card=1043836=1#post1043836
Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-(
House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro) ->
Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Inguz and Room EQ Wizard (REW)
Zombie wrote: > Do you have a simple cookbook to "just" set up filtering? I have > searched but in vain. I'm currently on holiday so without access to my LMS machine, but when I get back (next Wednesday) can post my own custom-convert file that implements parametric EQ. It was even set up based on an REW run, so it should show exactly how it's done for your use case. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=116683 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Inguz and Room EQ Wizard (REW)
foxesden wrote: > I am working on a replacement for Inguz and parametric EQ is high on the > list. I wanted to get the plugin working as intended first, and having > done that I have stripped back the code and am nearly at the point where > I can start working on new features. > > Being able to import from REW and maybe EAPO files would be useful. If you want parametric EQ, no need for any plugins. Just set up a custom-convert.conf file in LMS with appropriate filtering using SOX. You don't need a lot of horsepower; my LMS runs on a Raspberry Pi 3 and it works just fine. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=116683 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Inguz EQ/DRC
artatgray wrote: > > Because the EQ adjustments are subtle, I need a log to verify that > InguzEQ is doing its thing properly. > > How would I go about producing it? > I realise this is a somewhat flippant comment, but it has to be said: If the EQ is subtle enough that you can't tell by listening, do you really need to know? And in that case do you really need DRC? Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=109921 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction and Bass Artefacts
ralphy wrote: > Yes there is a pcp-sox.tcz extension for picoreplayer. It's used for > the streamer and is available to install separately from the extensions > section in the webgui main tab. This is interesting. I am currently running SOX filters in LMS, using a MAC address to target the specific player. It's working fine, but running the filters on the player itself seems like a more elegant solution that I'd like to try. I wasn't aware it was possible until I saw your post. Is there any documentation about how to configure the pcp-sox extension once it's loaded? Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114824 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction with the HiFiBerry DSP card
cliveb wrote:
>
> Then I saw this in the default convert.conf file:
> >
Code:
> >
> flc flc transcode *
> # FT:{START=--skip=%t}U:{END=--until=%v}D:{RESAMPLE=-r %d}
> [flac] -dcs $START$ $END$ -- $FILE$ | [sox] -q -t wav - -t flac -C 0
$RESAMPLE$ -
>
> >
> I tried adding the line *# FT:{START=--skip=%t}U:{END=--until=%v}* to
> my custom-convert entry, but then whenever I tried seeking, it
> restarted the song.
>
> Does anyone understand enough about this to explain exactly what needs
> to be put into the custom-convert file so that the rule continues to
> be used after a seek?
OK, I think I've sorted this out so will post my findings here in case
it helps anyone else.
My mistake was not understanding what's going on in the default
convert.conf file. All I did was add the #FT line to my custom file. It
looks as if when you seek during playback, LMS starts a whole new
decoding operation, and expects the conversion rule to cope with
starting at the seek position. Of course the rule in my file didn't have
anything in it to define where to begin, and so the song started again
from the start.
As far as I can tell, there isn't an option in sox to start at a
specific place in the file, so we have to run a flac decode starting at
the seek position and pipe its output through sox to re-encode to flac
and do any other processing required - in my case the EQ for room
correction.
So my custom convert file ended up as:
Code:
flc flc * b8:27:eb:e0:f9:75
# FT:{START=--skip=%t}U:{END=--until=%v}
[flac] -dcs $START$ $END$ -- $FILE$ | [sox] -q --multi-threaded
--no-clobber -t wav - -t flac -C 0 - equalizer 54.3 2.831q -19.2 equalizer 71.1
3.982q +9.0 equalizer 75.2 7.677q -5.4 equalizer 89.3 11.271q -5.5 equalizer
148 13.429q -13.3 equalizer 202 5.0q -6.2 equalizer 225 5.0q +6.3
The mac address is there so the EQ is only applied to the relevant
player, of course, and the various equalizer settings are for the room
that player is in.
>From the tests I've done so far, the seeking now works properly, and the
room EQ is maintained after a seek.
Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-(
House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro) ->
Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction with the HiFiBerry DSP card
BoxOfCables wrote:
> I meant to update that thread too...
>
> It turns out there is a quirk with that rule, if you seek to a point in
> a track it doesn't apply. I've found it quite a useful way of A/B
> testing the EQ settings - play a song (the filters are applied), then
> use the time control to scrub back to near the beginning and the rule
> doesn't invoke, so you hear the song without the EQ.
>
> It can be fixed by adding "# T" (without the quote marks) as a second
> line in the rule (according to the docs, have to admit I've not
> personally tested it).
Sorry to reopen this thread, but I just revisited it to get some info
and saw your comment about the filtering not working after a seek. I
don't generally seek so hadn't noticed, but after seeing your comment I
decided to check, and sure enough the EQ stops after a seek.
I tried adding the #T, but that appeared to just break the transcode
rule completely. (No EQ applied in at any time).
Then I saw this in the default convert.conf file:
Code:
flc flc transcode *
# FT:{START=--skip=%t}U:{END=--until=%v}D:{RESAMPLE=-r %d}
[flac] -dcs $START$ $END$ -- $FILE$ | [sox] -q -t wav - -t flac -C 0
$RESAMPLE$ -
I tried adding the line *# FT:{START=--skip=%t}U:{END=--until=%v}* to my
custom-convert entry, but then whenever I tried seeking, it restarted
the song.
(Incidentally, looking at the rule in the default convert.conf, and
checking what processes are running on the LMS server, I suspect that
what happens when you seek is that the custom-convert rule is abandoned
and the transcode rule in the default file gets used).
Does anyone understand enough about this to explain exactly what needs
to be put into the custom-convert file so that the rule continues to be
used after a seek?
Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-(
House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro) ->
Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction with the HiFiBerry DSP card
vco1 wrote: > I'm plaanning on going the same route: Hifiberry Digi2 (Pro) + DSP > Add-on foor room correction. But your post confuses me a bit if it's > working fine with Squeezeplayer or not. Especially since you mention > "Also, their (experimental) room correction feature didn't work for me." > But you end with "This is just a heads-up that it does all work rather > well". > > Would like to get more details. More in particular if the combo Pi4 + > Hifiberry Digi2 (Pro) and DSP add-on is working for (simple) digital > room correction. As slartibartfast pointed out, there's another relevant thread here: https://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?114824-Digital-Room-Correction-and-Bass-Artefacts. But here's a quick summary of what I discovered: 1. To set up the filters in the DSP card, you need to boot your RPi into HiFiBerryOS. Then you can manually add the filters required. 2. HiFiBerryOS does include Squeezelite, which would seem to imply that you can just run your RPi under HiFiBerryOS and use it as an LMS player. However, the version of Squeezelite they use is very old and I found that it was very unreliable. Therefore once the filters are loaded into the DSP card, you need to reboot the RPi into some other appropriate OS such as piCorePlayer, and the filters remain active. 3. To figure out what filters you need, HiFiBerryOS has a room correction facility, but I found that it simply didn't work, so I used REW to calculate the filters instead. I opened a thread on the HiFiBerry community about this (https://support.hifiberry.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/4403146814737-HiFiBerryOS-Room-Correction) and some others reported the same issue - that it didn't work with the Digi2Pro+DSP combination. The latest posting on that thread suggests that there's an experimental new release that fixes the issue with their room correction facility. Having said all this, in the end I do NOT recommend using the DSP card for room correction. When I had the filters active, they produced some weird bass artefacts, sounding a bit like turntable rumble. It was fairly subtle, but once you've heard it, you can't ignore it. As is discussed in the other thread linked above, it's a simple matter to set up a custom convert file in LMS to apply the required filters using SOX, and this approach doesn't produce those weird bass artefacts. I had initially thought that the RPi3 I use as my LMS server wouldn't have enough CPU power to run the filters, but it turns out not to be an issue. If you've not yet bought the DSP card, don't bother. I have since sold mine on eBay. The Digi2Pro itself is a perfectly fine SPDIF interface for the RPi, but note that there are other similar cards available from other vendors. And if you have a USB capable DAC, then you don't need one at all. I should have updated this thread with these conclusions, and I apologise for failing to do so. Consider this reply to be that update! Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114806 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction and Bass Artefacts
OK, latest news on this. I set up the appropriate equalizer settings in custom-convert.conf and am happy to report that: 1. They work - the bass response is smoothed out as required. Not quite perfect yet, but I can try a bit of fine tuning. 2. Re-encoding to FLAC works just fine. The peak CPU usage on the RPi3 I've seen is about 25%, and that is only during the initial phase when playback is starting up. Once it's going, CPU usage typically sits around the 3% - 5% mark. With re-encode compression level set to 0, there is no significant latency. So I probably won't bother messing about trying to stream PCM. 3. Most importantly of all: there are no audible bass artefacts. Hooray! It would seem that the filtering code used by the HiFiBerry DSP card must have some kind of flaw which is responsible. I did wonder if perhaps the card itself had a hardware fault, but when the card is installed and all filters disabled, the bass artefacts disappear. So it has to be something to do with the filter processing. Anyway, all is now well without the DSP card installed and I'm a happy bunny. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114824 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction and Bass Artefacts
BoxOfCables wrote: > > You could try directly uploading it, rather than updating pCP as a first > course of action. Name the file "custom-convert.conf" and put it in > "/usr/local/slimserver" (it doesn't need any special permissions). Then > restart LMS and see. OK, I gave that a go and it worked. So now I'll try applying the filters to see what happens, and if that works will experiment with not bothering to re-encode to FLAC and just stream PCM. Many thanks for your help. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114824 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction and Bass Artefacts
OK, have hit a problem. I created a simple custom convert file using Notepad just to test that it works, but got this error message when attempting to upload it: Code: [ERROR] Invalid file format, must be a text file" Thinking perhaps it might be due to Windows using CR/LF for newline, I removed the CR characters using a hex editor and tried again, but with the same result. Any ideas? Here is the full content of the file I was trying to upload: Code: flc flc * * [sox] -q --multi-threaded --no-clobber -t flac $FILE$ -t flac - remix 1 0 Are there any header lines I need to include? (The "invalid file format" messsage would seem to suggest it's nothing to do with the content, but a more fundamental issue). I'm using an old pCP (v4.1.0), if that's relevant. Was hoping not to have to upgrade, but will if it's required. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114824 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction and Bass Artefacts
BoxOfCables wrote: > I've also done some more tweaking and found limiting the flac > compression level to zero helps a lot with the initial delay, it's now > pretty much imperceptable. Thanks again. Would it reduce any delay even further by not re-encoding to FLAC, and just stream the output as PCM? My understanding is that FLAC decodes really easily but uses quite a lot of CPU to encode. Not bothering to re-encode might also reduce the load on the RPi3. All my players are connected via gigabit wired ethernet, so I don't need to worry about network bandwidth. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114824 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction and Bass Artefacts
BoxOfCables wrote: > You need to create a text file (you can use Notepad etc.) containing the > something like the following (this will become "custom-convert.conf" on > the server): > [snip] > Excellent - many thanks. That all looks very straighforward, and I already have the REW filter settings. It will interesting to see if the filters used by SOX produce bass artefacts like those on the HiFiBerry DSP card. If they don't, the DSP card will be going on eBay! Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114824 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction and Bass Artefacts
BoxOfCables wrote: > ... I've discovered that it's pretty simple to implement the filters > through SoX which can be done with a file upload through piCorePlayer > web interface. Even a lowly pi3B can cope with running the filters > without issue. Do you have any links to guidance for doing this? I'd always assumed that my Pi3 LMS server wouldn't have the necessary grunt to run DRC filters, but now you've reassured me I'd like to give it a try. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114824 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Cleaning Vinyl
Heuer wrote: > [I]"[COLOR=#55][FONT=]The Loricraft Professional Record Cleaner > is based on the work of the late Percy Wilson, Technical Editor of the > Gramophone Magazine in England. A prototype (handmade) machine was > demonstrated at the Buxton Hi-Fi show in the 1960s and generated much > attention for its ability to thoroughly clean a record. OK, thanks. I guess it's possible that Loricraft and Keith Monks both took their inspiration from Percy's original design. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=115093 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Cleaning Vinyl
Heuer wrote: > I use a Loricraft PRC3 cleaning machine which I have owned for about 20 > years. I have cleaned every album in my collection with it and also use > it on new vinyl to remove the mould release agents they use. Distilled > water works well but I have experimented with various cleaning fluids. > Great machine, very effective and transforms listening to vinyl, even > stuff I have owned since the 1960's. > [image: https://i.imgur.com/M8Aaqsn.jpg] I'd not heard of that one, but from the picture it looks very similar in operation to the original Keith Monks machine, with the spool of thread guiding the vacuum pickup. I wonder who copied who? The Keith Monks has been around for at least 45 years - I can remember getting some LPs cleaned on one at a HiFi dealer when I was a teenager. doctor_big wrote: > My home brew cleaning solution is 3/4 distilled water, 1/4 isopropyl > alcohol and a drop or two of Kodak Photo flow. > Cheap and effective for my VPI Cyclone machine. That's pretty much the same formula that I used with my Moth RCM II. (I've now finished all my vinyl transfers, so the Moth has been sold). Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=115093 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Cleaning Vinyl
Jeff07971 wrote: > Apparently ultrasonic cleaning is the new gold standard > https://degritter.com/ Interesting. Ultrasonic cleaning is used in a variety of other scenarios, so I guess it could work very well on LPs. I do wonder whether ultrasonics are going to be able to shift dried on gunge (especially using only distilled water) but I'm certainly not going to attempt to judge without any first hand experience. I note that towards the end of the page they offer bottles of surfactant to "improve the cleaning even more". Maybe they discovered that pure water isn't enough in some cases? Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=115093 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Cleaning Vinyl
Anyone who is serious about cleaning their vinyl properly should be
looking at a vacuum device, such as a VPI, Nitty-Gritty, Moth or
Pro-Ject.
Not cheap, but the best way to clean vinyl.
The gold standard always used to be the Keith Monks device - but it cost
thousands. I see there's a cheaper one now available ("Prodigy") which
appears to operate in a similar fashion, but I don't know anything about
it.
Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-(
House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2
Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction and Bass Artefacts
foxesden wrote: > Hi, > > Most of your filters are attenuating the bass but filter 2 > > Filter 2: ON PK Fc71.1 Hz Gain 9.0 dB Q 3.982 > > is adding a lot of gain in between filter 1 and 3 which are attenuating > bass. > > Filter 1: ON PK Fc54.3 Hz Gain -19.2 dB Q 2.831 > Filter 2: ON PK Fc71.1 Hz Gain 9.0 dB Q 3.982 > Filter 3: ON PK Fc75.2 Hz Gain -5.4 dB Q 7.677 > > So is the intention to boost this frequency. If it is then it will only > target very specific frequency and possibly give a weird effect. I would > suggest lowering this value and see if it gets rid of the artefacts. All these filter settings were what REW calculated based on the room measurement, so that's how I set them up. But I agree that they are a bit weird. 9dB of gain just 4Hz away from 5.4dB of cut does seem pretty strange. I have tried removing filter 2 and slightly reducing the amount of attenuation on the neighbouring filters - we'll see how that goes. I'm beginning to wonder if I'm in danger of getting trapped in a cycle of fiddling around trying to find the best compromise. Having to keep swapping between HiFiBerryOS to set up the filters and piCorePlayer to properly audition the results is a pain in the rear. Just listening to music would be a better use of my time. At the moment, the low level bass grumbling caused by the DSP room correction is more annoying than the lumpy response of the room. Wouldn't surprise me if I end up removing the DSP card completely and just accepting the bass nodes in the room! Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: piCorePlayer(RPi2/HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro/HiFiBerry DSP) -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114824 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction and Bass Artefacts
Having set up DRC using a RPi with HiFiBerry DIGI2 Pro + DSP card, I have an issue. When setting it up (having used REW to calculate the required filters), I was of course using source material with significant bass content to audition the results, and pleased with the way it tamed the bass humps in the room. But once I started listening in earnest, noticed some curious low frequency artefacts during quiet moments, a kind of grumbling that varies in amplitude. The closest analogy I can give is that it sounds a bit like turntable rumble. Thinking I might be imagining it, I tried playing something while toggling the filters on & off, and the artefacts are definitely only present when the filters are active. It's quite subtle and only at very low frequencies. I can't hear it on (admittedly inexpensive) headphones, only on my active Meridian speakers. The filters are fairly extreme, with some significant gain settings and high Q: Code: Filter 1: ON PK Fc54.3 Hz Gain -19.2 dB Q 2.831 Filter 2: ON PK Fc71.1 Hz Gain 9.0 dB Q 3.982 Filter 3: ON PK Fc75.2 Hz Gain -5.4 dB Q 7.677 Filter 4: ON PK Fc89.3 Hz Gain -5.5 dB Q 11.271 Filter 5: ON PK Fc 148 Hz Gain -13.3 dB Q 13.429 Filter 6: ON PK Fc 202 Hz Gain -6.2 dB Q 5.000 Filter 7: ON PK Fc 225 Hz Gain 6.3 dB Q 5.000 My question for the experts here is whether these kind of grumbling low frequency artefacts are a known issue with DRC. Perhaps they are to be expected with such extreme filtering? Maybe the code that HiFiBerry uses to implement the filters isn't as good as it ought to be? I'm in a bit of a quandary: with the filters turned on, the bass response is nice and smooth, but now I've heard those artefacts, they are impossible to ignore. With the filters turned off, the bass has some pretty obvious humps that I would like tamed. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: SBR SPDIF out -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114824 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Tube amplifier
schoeppi wrote: > > What kind of squeezebox do you like to connect? If you have a touch or a > Transporter no DAC is needed, a Classic does not have a DAC included so > either also a external DAC is needed or the amp has to be able to do > digital to analog conversion. I don't have anything to say about tube amps, but I will just point out that all Squeezeboxes (including the Classic) do have DACs and analogue outputs, so schoeppi's advice about needing a DAC is not actually correct. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: SBR SPDIF out -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114820 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Digital Room Correction with the HiFiBerry DSP card
I've long been vaguely interested in experimenting with DRC, but whenever I read about Inguz it looked a bit daunting. Added to that, my LMS runs on a Raspberry Pi 3, so there's no chance of doing the necessary processing at the server end. I seem to recall some discussions here about whether the HiFiBerry DSP cards could be used for this purpose. (Sorry, but I've done some forum searches and couldn't find the thread, but am pretty sure I'm not imagining it). So I've been experimenting with HiFiBerry's Raspberry Pi DIGI2 Pro SPDIF card and DSP add-on board. I can confirm that it's fairly straightforward to load the necessary filters into the DSP card, and when you reboot the Pi using another operating system (eg. piCorePlayer), the filters are still active. I would assume that the same would be true if you use the HiFiBerry DAC+DSP or Beocreate card instead. (I use the SPDIF card because I have Meridian active speakers with digital inputs, so didn't need a DAC). What I did find is that some of the facilities provided by the HiFiBerryOS seem a bit unreliable. In particular, they use an old version of Squeezelite that has problems with delays and failure to pause/seek, so my initial plan to run HiFiBerryOS as my Squeezelite player didn't work out. Also, their (experimental) room correction feature didn't work for me. I ended up using Room EQ Wizard to calculate the required filters, then added those filters manually using HiFiBerryOS's parametric EQ page. After adding the filters, you need to go to the DSP Programs page and instruct it to store the settings in the DSP card. Once that is done, you can shut down HiFiBerryOS and reboot into piCorePlayer. This is just a heads-up that it does all work rather well, but if anyone wants some more details, let me know. Until recently: Transporter -> ATC SCM100A, now sold :-( House move forced change to: SBR SPDIF out -> Meridian 218 -> Meridian M6 cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114806 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Best server solution for sound quality?
I have two bits of advice for the OP: 1. If the hard disks that store your music are in the listening room, then a switch to SSD might conceivably improve SQ by removing some background noise. 2. Do a sighted comparison of different LMS setups to find out the difference in SQ. Then do it again as a blind ABX test. You may very well have a "Road to Damascus" moment. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114616 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 1959 report on audiophiles
Paul Webster wrote: > I don't imagine that a speaker from 1958 is going to sound fantastic There's an exception to every rule. Quad ESL57 Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114360 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] USB Cables
slartibartfast wrote: > I take your point about Virgin tech support. Don't get me started on Virgin. I was with them at the previous house. The service itself was generally good, but when it came to giving them notice it was impossible to contact them. On hold on the phone for over an hour before giving up. On hold on their online chat for 100 mins before giving up. Raised a complaint which took them 2 weeks to respond to, informing me that I should phone them to give notice! In the end I just cancelled the direct debit and replied to the complaints dept that if they want their so-called "superhub" back they better email me. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114088 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] USB Cables
Grumpy Bob wrote: > I ditched BT for Zen some years ago, largely because of the uselessness > of their tech support. Been happy with Zen, and their tech support is > great, only had to use it for issues to do with web hosting. > I've just moved house and as a test of which ISP to go for decided to try calling their tech support numbers and see how quickly they answered. Zen picked up after a few seconds. In that time BT, Virgin or Sky would still be taking you through their initial menu options and disclaimers about "high levels of calls leading to delays" (is there ever a time when they're NOT in that state?) before even getting into the on-hold queue. NB. Other high quality ISPs are available, eg. Andrews & Arnold have a stellar reputation. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=114088 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] BlueSound or Innuos better than a Touch?
garym wrote: > According to his signature, something like these, active version: > ATC SCM100A > > http://atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/loudspeakers/classic-series/scm100-2/ I can confirm that. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=113335 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] BlueSound or Innuos better than a Touch?
amey01 wrote: > > If you have a pair of B 802D up front, and are driving them with a > little Schiit integrated and DAC, you're not going to have the same > sounding system as someone who has them with a Ypsilon SET100 or > Technical Brain TBP-Zero. (there's a couple of boutique amplifiers which > sound wonderful). This is a wind-up, right? You can't possibly think anyone will take you seriously when you start wittering on about $200k tube amps. Maybe you are just having a laugh and your sense of humour isn't coming across. If not, I won't engage with you again. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=113335 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] BlueSound or Innuos better than a Touch?
amey01 wrote: > Where do I start? > It does depend on how small or high end you call boutique though. > To save an argument on competently designed electronics (your previous > post), Ill concentrate on speakers - is that okay? > Ive heard all these and they sound mind-snappingly good. > > 1. Sanders Sound (Innersound) 10c electrostatics > 2. Lansche Audio Corona > 3. Avantgarde Trio G1 > 4. Apogee Scintilla refurbished by Graz > 5. Quad ESL 57s in original condition (maybe not boutique back in the > day, but certainly are now) When I mentioned "boutique" gear I was primarily thinking of electronics. There are some weird and wonderful DACs and amplifiers out there that cost a fortune and perform no better than mainstream stuff at 1/10th the price. Speakers are a very personal thing. They all have their own character and will dominate the sound of a system. That's why I said in my original post that the only way to get any meaningful improvement is to change the speakers, and that it might cost a lot of money. (Then you pointed out that room treatment is another avenue to explore, and of course you are correct). The point I was trying to make is that changing electronics these days isn't going to achieve anything of significance. (As for the speakers you mention, I've only heard the Apogee and ESL57. Both sounded great in their own way). Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=113335 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] BlueSound or Innuos better than a Touch?
amey01 wrote: > > And better again - will be spending some effort on the room. Treatment > and placement as two key areas that affect performance more than > anything else. (but of course that takes time, effort, research and > knowledge - it is by no means as easy as handing someone some of your > $$$ and walking off with a grin). > Agreed - room treatments can yield good results. amey01 wrote: > > Hi-fi shops can (that's -can-, not "do") give invaluable advice. And > boutique gear can be absolutely fantastic! I'm having a hard time thinking of any boutique gear that performs well and is value for money. Any suggestions? Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=113335 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] BlueSound or Innuos better than a Touch?
Is your friend actually dissatisfied with the sound he's getting? Or is this another case of upgraditis - wondering if improvements can be made? If he genuinely wants better sound: 1. Stop talking to HiFi dealers, especially high-end ones who sell boutique gear. 2. In terms of raw sound quality, pretty much all competently designed solid state electronics these days has capabilities that exceed the limits of human hearing. Streamers, DACs, amplifiers, they are all pretty much commodity items. (NB. I'm not including operational functionality here; obviously different systems behave in their own ways. And of course some devices just look & feel nice, which is a perfectly acceptable reason to prefer one over another). 3. The B CM9's are good speakers, for sure, but they are hardly state of the art. Genuine improvements will come from getting better speakers. It might cost a lot of money, but you have to face reality. Changing electronics is cheaper, but achieves virtually nothing. FWIW, I was cured of HiFi upgraditis once I bought a pair of speakers that did everything I could ask of them and my system started playing music instead of audio. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=113335 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB3 Spectral analysis shows +9dB at 30Hz on phono and coax outputs
I don't know how to interpret the screen shots you've included. What are the two plots? Is the top plot the waveform and the bottom plot the spectral analysis? What is the difference between the red and green traces? If the bottom plot is a frequency analysis, and you're using pink noise, then why is it flat above about 200Hz? Pink noise is *supposed* to have a falling spectral content with rising frequency, eg. this digitally generated pink noise in CoolEdit2000: 30413 As for why the phono & coax outputs are different to the 3.5mm headphone output, my guess is that it's the headphone output that is "wrong", since it passes through an additional headphone amp which is probably not of the highest quality. The coax output in particular should not be any different to the data in the source file, because when using a digital output on a squeezebox all it's doing is converting the TCP/IP data stream into SPDIF without any processing. +---+ |Filename: New-1.png| |Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=30413| +---+ Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=112265 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] How to drive separate amp - XLR, IR blaster, used AV receiver question
The obvious first question to ask is: why are you thinking of doing this? Is there something about the sound using your Onkyo AV receiver that you find lacking? Keep in mind that modern solid-state electronics (if competently designed and built) are all pretty much of a quality that is more than adequate. And also bear in mind that the kind of electronics that are NOT competently designed and built tend to come from small-scale boutique manufacturers. In other words, chances are that your Onkyo receiver is more than up to the task. Given that your current setup works well from an operational viewpoint, changing it might just buy you a lot of hassle for no benefit. If you are determined to buy a separate power amp, then XLR inputs are not really a problem. It's perfectly possible to drive balanced inputs from unbalanced outputs - you just won't get the common-mode noise rejection and ground-plane isolation benefits. But whether those benefits are relevant in a domestic application is debatable in any case, so I wouldn't worry about it. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=112052 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Optimal Volume Level with SB Touch
Reality Check Time. Agonising over where it's best to apply volume control is basically a waste of time and effort. An audio playback system has a fixed amount of gain. It also has a fixed amount of noise. For any given desired listening level, you need to reduce the signal level such that the fixed amount of gain gets you the playback volume you want. While lowering the input level reduces the playback volume of the wanted signal, it doesn't reduce the noise, which remains fixed. It really doesn't matter whether you reduce the input signal level in the digital or analogue domain. The result to all intents and purposes is exactly the same - as you turn down the volume, the S/N ratio gets worse. If you reduce the volume digitally, the least significant bits of resolution (ie. lowest level of detail) disappear into the digital quantisation noise. If you reduce it in the analogue domain, you also lose the lowest level of detail, which disappears into the analogue noise floor. The only difference is that by attenuating digitally, the intrinsic noise of the DAC becomes more significant, which doesn't happen if you keep the digital signal at 100% and instead increase the analogue attenuation. BUT: the linearity and noise floor of any modern competent DAC is so low it's really just academic. The noise in the rest of the system will swamp it. You'll never actually hear the difference under normal listening conditions. So in conclusion: unless you've got an insane amount of gain in the system, you won't hear a difference between digital and analogue volume control. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=111714 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] levitating turntable
Paul Webster wrote: > The answer is from the designer. > https://thevinylfactory.com/features/levitating-turntable-mag-lev-interview/ When I first heard about this turntable (probably a year or so back), my immediate thought was "isn't the magnetic drive system going to interfere with the pickup cartridge?". I note with interest that in the designer's responses to questions in the above link, he states that they use "blocking material" (whatever that might be) which means that _most_ MM cartridges are unaffected. He also admits that MC cartridges _are_ affected for the time being. I can't help thinking that this levitating turntable is little more than an interesting exercise in what can be achieved, rather than having any practical advantage for day-to-day vinyl playback. The limitations of the medium itself far outweigh any shortcomings in the manner by which the platter is rotated. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=110693 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter newbie
user181 wrote: > I somewhat wish I had bought a unit with the TransNav knob, but I don't > know that I'll miss it that much I've had a Transporter since 2006, and in all that time I think I may have used the knob perhaps half a dozen times, and then only out of idle curiosity. user181 wrote: > I welcome any tips and advice anyone can share for maintaining this > product. As well as the spare display you say you've already bought, it might be sensible to have a spare of one of the internal power supplies, which are known to be a possible point of failure. Mine needed to be replaced after about 10 years. They are a simple drop-in replacement. I don't know where you're based; here in the UK they can be sourced here: https://www.rapidonline.com/powerpax-uk-sw3376-mini-open-frame-psu-5vdc-2-3a-85-2251 Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=110310 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] BLIND TEST INVITE: Do digital audio players sound different?
Archimago wrote: > Folks the Listener Results are out :-). Had a read of them and no surprises - most people finding it difficult to tell any significant difference. What I found most interesting was the demographic split. The younger participants found the track with less dynamic range to be the most revealing, while the older ones picked the tracks with more dynamic range. The youngsters also seemed to slightly prefer the iPhone whereas the oldies liked the Oppo and Sony players. To me this seems to indicate that what you grow up with is a greater factor in perceived quality than the intrinsic character of the sound. Nurture more significant than nature, as it were. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=110104 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB3 Picking up a Garbled Radio Static?
Be methodical about diagnosing this. 1. Plug the SB3 into a different line level input on the Marantz. (Anything other than the phono input will do, eg the tape input). Static gone? Fault is the particular input on the Marantz. Otherwise... 2. Try a different RCA cable to connect the SB3 to the Marantz. Static gone? Fault is in the cable. Otherwise... 3. Try a different source component (eg. CD player, DVD player, etc) using the Monster Cable into the same input of the Marantz. Static gone? Fault is in the SB3. Otherwise... 4. Fault is in the Marantz. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=109754 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] arnyk RIP
He hadn't posted in here for a while, but thought I would pass on the sad news that Arnold B. Krueger (known here as arnyk) passed away last Thursday (3rd May). I'm sure many of us will remember that his debating style could get a bit combative, but he was always genuinely trying to educate by passing on the benefit of his extensive experience. Despite the fact I had a few run-ins with him, I will miss his contributions - they were always worth reading, even when they made my blood boil! RIP Arny. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=109027 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Dilemma
One big problem with the Transcriptors turntable was its lack of support for the LP. When it was designed LPs were a decent thickness, but after the oil crises of the early 70s they got a lot thinner and couldn't support their own weight without flexing. All in all, an interesting piece of art, but a debatable piece of engineering. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=108834 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Dilemma
Golden Earring wrote: > You reckon that low output MC cartridges *generally* sound better than > high output ones: would you carry that generalisation so far as to > include my original 1980s Koetsu Rosewood Signature, or would you need > to hear it first to make up your mind? Of course, it's -not- perfect > (neither am I, wouldn't that be awful? :D ), but it IS very musical! I didn't say they sound *better*, just that they have more "boogie factor". They appear to give a more dynamic sound (in the sense of what an audiophile might call "faster"), but I'm not sure it is necessarily better in an objective sense - it could be some kind of distortion that happens to give the impression of more dynamics. My gut feeling is that a high end MM like a Shure V15 or similar is probably a more neutral transducer. I've never heard a Koetsu, for the very practical reason that I didn't want to in case it made me need to afford to buy one. But IIRC, Koetsu cartridges share a lot of design features with the Supex ones, and I do remember them being a little more refined and less "in your face" than things like Dynavectors and Linn MCs. Golden Earring wrote: > It might be cheaper to replace your discs than to BUY a professional > cleaning machine! Even fresh out of the bag brand-new LPs can have mold release agent that is worth removing. And apart from the Keith Monks (which is thousands to buy), vacuum cleaners can be had for a few hundred. They are the only *really* effective way to clean LPs. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=108834 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Dilemma
Been away in Australia for a few weeks so late to this thread. Thought I'd offer my take on it. Vinyl LP technology is outdated, seriously flawed and quite frankly a bit of a dog's dinner. And yet - it can sound bloody marvelous. Go figure. My personal opinion is that it's because human hearing is sufficiently poor that even LP can be adequate. (I know Arny wouldn't agree). Bottom line : mastering quality is more important than the delivery medium. If the best master is only available on LP, then the LP will give the most enjoyable listening experience. As for the debate over cartridge types, I generally found that low output MC types gave more "boogie factor" than MM or high output MCs. Quite possibly less accurate than a decent Shure model, but in the context of vinyl, accuracy isn't really the point. And finally, if you're serious about vinyl, do yourself a favour and get a vacuum cleaning machine such as a Nitty Gritty, VPI or Moth. Or a Keith Monks if you're very rich. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=108834 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] I need a new turntable. Suggestions.
slartibartfast wrote: > ... and all my vinyl is under the bed To fit under a typical bed, the LPs are going to have to be laid flat. This is NOT A GOOD IDEA - storing LPs flat (and piled up on top of one another) tends to make them warp. LP records should be stored vertically, ideally with a small amount of side pressure. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=104038 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] What sort of quality do people get when they download so-called "Hi Rez"
Davesworld wrote: > I know this is long and sounding like a rant. Well - yes, it does sound like a rant. And while most of your points are basically true, it seems a bit like a stream of consciousness diatribe. To a non-believer, it will sound like a bunch of opinions stated as fact, and that's not going to convince anyone. I'd like to address a few points. Davesworld wrote: > Many are fooled by the engineering representation of a sampled sine wave > that shows a stair step effect, this effect does not exist in > reproduction. It has never been seen on a scope or otherwise. For an in-depth explanation of the reasons why (and lots of other digital audio fundamental truths), see Monty's excellent video: https://xiph.org/video/vid2.shtml - this is the sort of hard evidence you need to present to people who believe otherwise. Davesworld wrote: > > The Fatal Impact from the eponymous Dead Can Dance album that I > purchased as a download. The red sections are where the clipping > occurred. > Your screen shot showing the clipping is from Audacity, which is known to have a flawed clipping detection algorithm. PCM samples of N bits range in value from -(2^(n-1)) to +(2^(n-1)-1). A solitary sample at -(2^(n-1)) is NOT necessarily a clip, but Audacity will tell you it is. I'm not saying that the Dead Can Dance file doesn't have clipping, but the Audacity screen shot is not proof that it does. Davesworld wrote: > I do prefer jitter to be under 10ms though given a choice. I sincerely hope that is a typo and you meant to say 10ns! Davesworld wrote: > I'm sure someone has done tests where they induce varying degrees of > jitter while test subjects listen. Indeed they have: Benjamin & Gannon. Theoretical and audible effects of jitter on digital audio quality. 105th AES Convention, 1998 Jitter added to digital signal between transport and DAC with a hardware device. Conclusions: uncorrelated jitter inaudible below 10nS rms on pure tones; uncorrelated jitter inaudible below 20nS rms on music signal Ashihara, Kiryu et al. Detection threshold for distortions due to jitter on digital audio. Acoust. Sci. & Tech. 26, 1 (2005) Jitter simulated in the digital domain. Conclusions: uncorrelated jitter inaudible below 250nS on music signal. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=108499 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] NAS > Transporter > Amp which final connection?
terryd wrote: > Thanks Gary. > > I am thinking that the answer is "yes" and I will pull the cabinet out > and take a look coupled with trying to read through the mammoth manual. > > > Thanks again for the prompt reply - Terry > > p.s. it sounds pretty good at the moment, but you know what it is like, > you want every last drop of performance before you can settle down and > enjoy it... It doesn't matter whether or not your Yamaha amp re-digitises an analogue signal. Nor does it matter what anyone here says about which is better. All that matters is what sounds good to you - and only you can figure that out. Try it both ways and pick the one you like best. End Of. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=108091 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Buying a transporter these days
Antoniop wrote: > Then, we're coming back to my point : Should I buy a transporter, that I > could use as the digital source and the DAC, or use a SBT as a digital > source with a recent external DAC I am a long-time user of the Transporter, and am very happy with it. It sounds fabulous. BUT: if it ever dies, I will not be looking to replace it. The TP is a legacy product that still performs well, but there are cheaper alternatives easily available these days. A Raspberry Pi running Squeezelite feeding a decent external DAC will provide equally good sound quality. The only reason I can think of why anyone would want to get a TP these days would be if they happen to like its look. And regarding the "knob or no knob" question: the knob is a great big white elephant and serves no purpose in day-to-day use. BUT: The blanking plug on the TP SE looks like a cheap piece of plastic, and frankly I think it spoils the look. (But bear in mind I've only seen photos of the TP SE, never seen one in the flesh). So if you're going to buy a TP for the aesthetics (and IMO there is no other reason to get one), then you need one with the knob, otherwise the aesthetics are ruined. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107946 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] HIGHRESAUDIO to stop offering MQA
drmatt wrote: > I don't think the word "fraud" should be on anyone's lips. Misguided, > naive, weak minded, arguable, but let's not overstate things. I generally follow the principle "do not ascribe to malice that which can be explained by incompetence". But frankly I don't think Bob Stuart is incompetent enough to actually believe this MQA hogwash - he does have a fairly illustrious engineering background, after all. So in this case, yes, I really do think what's going on is tantamount to fraud. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107118 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] HIGHRESAUDIO to stop offering MQA
After everything I've seen emerge about MQA, it's becoming increasingly clear that it is a cynical attempt to extract more cash from punters through FUD. The people who have built this system almost certainly know full well that it's all a bunch of smoke and mirrors. And they also know that if you present the right kind of pseudo-science to the right kind of audiophile and then get them to do a sighted comparison, they will hear an improvement due to their expectations based on the hoodwinkery they've been exposed to. This is just blatent, shameful scamming of the public. If they were in the financial or pharmaceutical industry they'd probably be a in jail by now. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107118 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Problems with GUI for Linux LMS after latest Windows 10 update
Golden Earring wrote: > I've got your drift - this looks like another rainy Monday exercise. > I'll try it before switching browsers as per Clive's suggestion. With respect, this doesn't make sense. 1. You've changed nothing in LMS, and hence its web server will be delivering the same HTML to the client. 2. You've updated your client PC, which almost certainly included a change to the client browser (assuming you're using the Microsoft browser). 3. The logical conclusion is that it's the browser update that is responsible for the change in behaviour, and trying a different browser is the simplest way to confirm this. Uninstalling and reinstalling LMS on a NAS is going to be a heck of a lot more work than just trying a different browser, especially since logic suggests that there's unlikely to be anything wrong with LMS. I strongly urge you to try the alternative browser option first. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107473 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Problems with GUI for Linux LMS after latest Windows 10 update
Before you go doing anything drastic like changing your LMS... A Win 10 update could easily have amended the Microsoft browser, so the obvious thing to try first is to install a different browser such as Firefox or Chrome and see whether the LMS web interace works on that. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107473 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Unused Transporter SE's on eBay.com
Golden Earring wrote: > Don't hold your breath - my oldest one which is badged "Slim Devices" > (Silver, with knob obviously) which I bought off a geezer in Soho > through fleaBay in 2009 (& probably dates from 2006-ish) sounded just as > good as an unused SE I bought from San Jose, CA a couple of months back > when I was checking the new one out. Yep. My Slim Devices branded TP is still going strong. I bought it in December 2006. Don't get me wrong - I don't want it to die, but if it does I won't try and replace it with another TP - there are now cheaper alternatives that will work just as well. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107045 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Unused Transporter SE's on eBay.com
Golden Earring wrote: > I've not had the de-gaussing noise issue either (I haven't played with > my knob much, I was warned off that sort of thing as an adolescent > :rolleyes: ), but would I be correct in assuming that it would have > affected the analogue rather than the digital processing stages in the > Transporter? Since it never happened to me I don't know for sure, but my understanding was that it was just a mechanical noise and it didn't affect the audio outputs. The owner would be sitting quietly without the TP even playing and they'd hear a "brrr" as the knob de-gaussed. Golden Earring wrote: > I can't remember how much cheaper than the original the Transporter SE > (without the TransNav gizmo) was at launch in the UK, have you any > recollection of that? Sorry, no I don't recall the price of the SE in the UK. Whatever it was, I clearly didn't think it was cheap enough to warrant buying one! My feeling is that, nice as it was and still is, the TP is now a bit anachronistic. If and when mine dies, it will be replaced with a Raspberry Pi / HiFiBerry DIGI+ / External DAC with balanced outputs. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107045 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Unused Transporter SE's on eBay.com
Golden Earring wrote: > As a piece of ergonomic design it's very clever. As the only mechanical > component of a now unsupported unit it is an obvious potential failure > point - nevertheless, the knob on the (then Slim Devices branded) > Transporter I own which probably dates from 2005/6 (I bought it s/hand > in 2009) still works perfectly. As Dave says, the TP doesn't need the knob. I think I may have used the knob on mine a couple of times just out of curiosity. The TP works just fine via any of the other interface mechanisms (IR remote, Duet controller, iPhone/Android apps, browser, etc). Perhaps Dave's knob and mine still work simply because they haven't been used. (Cue sniggering from the back). Actually, I don't know if the knob on my TP still works because I can't remember the last time I touched it. Whether it's ergonomically clever is a matter of opinion. I think the force feedback feels a bit weird, and the need to press one of the many buttons on the front panel first to select what it controls makes the whole interface seems a bit cobbled. It also baffles me why it doesn't default to volume control, and why if you switch it to volume control it then automatically reverts back to the default (I forget what the default is, TBH). But one thing thing that I feel isn't open to debate is the fact that including it in the first place was a folly. It's not needed, is probably the most most expensive single component on the device, and presumably the code needed to operate it takes up precious memory in the firmware that could have been put to better use. It was also the source of irritating intermittent de-gaussing noises for some users (although that never affected me - perhaps because I didn't use it and so it didn't need de-gaussing?) Remove it and its associated buttons from the front panel and the TP could have been considerably cheaper. (But then I guess making it cheap would have defeated the object of positioning the TP as an audiophile device). Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107045 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Hifiberry Digi+Pro + RPi3?
Julf wrote: > That would make sense, except that the OP states "I thought that RPi3 > with Digi+Pro would eliminate the connection of the SBT to the server > (RPi3) over the network. Thus, giving me better sound?", so it is all > about the network, not the connection to the DAC. OK, sorry I missed the bit about the OP thinking that eliminating the network link between player and server might improve the sound - which of course it won't. I was responding to iPhone's statement about having a DAC sitting on top of an unshielded RPi. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107443 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] External DAC on Transporter: best output option
kidstypike wrote: > Compact cassettes :mad: > > Head cleaning cassettes > Head demagnetizers > Splicing kits > Breaking out the tab so you couldn't accidentally record over > Taping up the hole so you *could* record over > Rewinding with a Bic biro > > Any more? Pre-recorded cassettes that: 1. Messed around with album running order to equalise the side lengths and save on tape and if that didn't save enough tape: 2. Split a track across two sides to further save on tape and if THAT didn't save enough tape: 3. Truncate a track to save yet more tape G Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106519 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] External DAC on Transporter: best output option
Golden Earring wrote: > I happily accept all the above criticisms of LP's > > Mahler [] I don't think that he would have been impressed by the > quality of recorded music on LP, but I should imagine that he would have > been astonished that it was possible to do it at all. On the contrary, I suspect that if Mahler had heard a good vinyl LP of his music being played through a decent system, he would have been spellbound. Golden Earring wrote: > You know the old gag about the singing dog: it's not that the singing is > good, it's that it happens at all that's remarkable. Your post carries an undercurrent that implies that vinyl LP is pretty ropey but it was the best we had at the time, and that the fact it works at all is the most remarkable thing about it. But let's be realistic. Despite its technical flaws and limitations, vinyl LPs can sound absolutely fabulous. Some of my most enjoyable listening experiences have been from vinyl LPs. A small but not insignificant proportion of my FLAC collection is needle drops. Musical excellence transcends the delivery medium. We know that the LP system is a complete dog's dinner compared to CD, and yet it can give just as much enjoyment. I think this probably says more about the limitations of the human auditory system than it does about the engineering achievement. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106519 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] External DAC on Transporter: best output option
Golden Earring wrote: > The album did hit #1 on both sides of the Atlantic Of course it hit #1 because of the reputation of its personnel, not because of its content. I recall being totally underwhelmed by it, despite having enjoyed a lot of Cream's output. Blind Faith was a classic example of a manufactured supergroup that failed to deliver. Golden Earring wrote: > so some efforts may have been made to preserve the master tapes: > nevertheless, they would have been >30 years old by 2001 & 45 years old > by 2014, which is a considerable age for an inherently unstable medium. I doubt it. Record companies have a history of treating their inventory with utter disregard. Amazing when you think that the master tapes are their core assests. It wouldn't surprise me if most early generation copy masters of historic recordings that come to light are in the hands of individuals who were not employees of the record company itself but around the recording sessions and "liberated" a personal copy. A 45 year old early generation copy tape that's been hidden away by someone close to the artist is going to yield a better source than a later generation copy tape that's been slung in the record company's storage facility, even if the latter is 15 years younger. Or of course it could simply be that the 2001 release was prepared less competently than the 2014 release, as you hypothesise :) Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106519 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] External DAC on Transporter: best output option
Golden Earring wrote: > This may be the point: that the 2001 "re-master", for all its extra > tracks, may simply be a poor transcription of the original master > sound. > > Since the 2014 version sounds much more musical to my ears (albeit > stupidly labelled as Hi-Res), I can live with that suggestion unless > someone can come up with any other explanation. Have you considered the possibility that the 2001 and 2014 releases are sourced from different analogue master tapes? It may very well be that an earlier generation analogue master with less losses was discovered between the 2001 and 2014 releases. This seems to me to be the simplest and most likely explanation for the differences you hear. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106519 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] External DAC on Transporter: best output option
Vansloneker wrote: > My two cents on the initial question External DAC on Transporter: best > output option > > 1st AES/EBU because it's the professional standard and more important > has balanced outputs. This minimizes loss on the connection. Not true. The AES/EBU standard was intoduced as a fudge so that studios could use their existing stock of XLR cables for digital signals. Sean Adams (designer of the Transporter) has stated in the past that SPDIF over BNC is the best option. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106519 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Intona USB thing
Golden Earring wrote: > There is of course also the problem of trying to control the correct > alignment of the stylus in the groove when using a tangential arm, the > effect of which is magnified as the radius of the groove reduces. Tangential arms are in principle not a problem, because they are supposed to *always* be perfectly aligned. It's pivoted arms that suffer from compromised geometry. But a properly aligned pivoted arm should have zero tracking error at two points on an LP side, with the maximum error about half way across. So the tracking error at the end of a side isn't any more significant than at other points. Golden Earring wrote: > I do know that it was common practice to use an advance monitoring head > to detect the amplitude of the next few bars of music, and to use this > to adjust the groove spacing dynamically as the master disc was cut: > this is why you can "see" the loud & quiet passages when you look almost > any large-scale classical music LP. Of course it's not just classical LPs; you can easily see the loud and quiet sections on any LP. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106914 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Intona USB thing
Golden Earring wrote: > > 2. Why do CD's, DVD's & Blu-Ray discs play from the inner available > radius outwards, when LP's (& 78's) work from the outside available > radius inwards? I presume that there is some engineering/practical > benefit from this inversion? While I don't know for sure, there are some obvious reasons that make engineering sense: 1. Optical discs: these spin at fairly high rates and any imbalance that causes wobbling can make life harder for the laser pickup servos. The degree of wobble will be much smaller at the centre of the disc. Unless the disc is long (ie. 70+ mins), starting at the centre means there is less liklihood of laser tracking failure. 2. Analogue records: distortion is greater towards the centre of the disc, because the constant angular rotation speed means that there is less linear space to contain the cut waveform. So it makes sense to start the cut towards the outer edge, so the minimum amount of the cut occupies the area where the distortion is greatest. Of course if you can calculate exactly how much space will be needed for the side, you could start the cut at the appropriate position so that the end of the side is close to the outer edge. And when you consider that many works (especially classical) tend to climax at the end, this would make sense - the most complex part of the waveform would be located where the distortion is at its lowest. (In fact I have a vague recollection that there have been records cut that way in the past). Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106914 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] External DAC on Transporter: best output option
Golden Earring wrote: > The designer claims that this happens as the unit "burns-in" (audiophile > myth) so I must be suffering from his subliminal suggestion... Of course the beauty with so-called burn-in is that it's impossible to ABX. You can't ABX two samples of a device - one burned in and the other not - because of course there could be sample variation between the two. So the audiofools just love it and hold dearly to the concept. I wonder if Arny knows of a scientific method to show that burn-in doesn't happen? Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106519 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Intona USB thing
Julf wrote: > Do children make a lot of noise when they get scared? Children tend to make a lot of noise when they are playing as well as wanting attention. Making a lot of noise it likely to attract the bloodthirsty predator of which we speak - which then sneaks up on you. By the time you see it and get scared (and stop making noise), it's too late and you are lunch. So my basic hypothesis is that because children have a habit of making noise, chances are that humans were not generally on the menu for sabre tooths. But it's only a hunch. I'm not a qualified evolutionary biologist. And I did add a smiley, for the benefit of those unable to recognise a light-hearted comment. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106914 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Intona USB thing
arnyk wrote: > Our hearing systems have evolved to maximize sensitivity to potential > existential threats such as large bloodthirsty predators... People are always banging on about how evolution has operated to protect humans from predators, but it has always struck me as a somewhat lazy assumption. If avoiding bloodthirsty predators was so important to the survival of the human race, why hasn't natural selection eliminated the gene(s) that cause children to make a lot of noise? :) Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106914 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] External DAC on Transporter: best output option
Golden Earring wrote: > Hi Clive. > > Is there any chance I could tempt you to join Chris & myself for the > Great Experiment? My diary is pretty full. Once you've settled on a date let me know by PM and I will be able to say whether I can make it. PS. I'm abroad on a golfing holiday for a week from this afternoon, so won't be able to respond until I get back. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106519 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] External DAC on Transporter: best output option
Julf wrote: > ... and great venues such as Paradiso (an old church, and way too small > for major acts, but they still do it because... well.. it is Paradiso). Smaller venues are much better than big ones. My favourite here in the UK is The Stables at Milton Keynes. Saw Kayak at the Paradiso a few years back (Pim Koopman tribute concert). Fabulous show. Kayak are quite possibly the greatest unknown prog act around, and are certainly the only band my wife & I would go to the trouble of travelling abroad to see. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106519 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] HIGHRESAUDIO to stop offering MQA
ralphpnj wrote: > ... however the earth doesn't have time to wait around for that moment > of truth to appear. Actually the Earth *does* have plenty of time to deal with it. It's the human race that doesn't. If we stuff up the global climate enough to wipe out mankind (and possibly take out some other innocent bystanding species with us), the Earth will shrug its shoulders and recover. And if it were sentient (which of course it isn't just in case anyone thinks otherwise), it would probably think "good riddance". Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107118 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] HIGHRESAUDIO to stop offering MQA
arnyk wrote: > Today, there is no lack of software availability. There are dozens for > Windows and Google Play Store shows at least 2 that even run on > commodity and high end cell phones. Yet, accounts of their use are like > hen's teeth on the web. They are highly convincing, especially when the > audiophile uses them to do their own tests. But, people have got to > actually use them. Audiophiles aren't going to use ABX tests, because so-called high end audio operates much like religions: it requires faith over and above rational analysis. Consider a devout Christian/Muslim/Jew/etc who is offered the chance to take a test that will prove beyond any doubt the existence or otherwise of God. They're not going to take that test, because it puts at risk their investment in a belief system. Audiophiles who buy in to the snake oil ideas are in pretty much the same position. And of course they have a get out clause: the high priests of audiophilia tell them that ABX tests are inherently flawed, so they have a rational (to them) reason not to take them. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107118 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Unused Transporter SE's on eBay.com
Golden Earring wrote: > I'm using the Transporter to feed the new DAC. There aren't many digital > sources with pro-grade balanced outputs and word clock inputs. You do realise that AES balanced digital I/O was just a kludge to enable studios to use their existing stock of XLR cables? The designer of the Transporter (Sean Adams) has stated that the BNC SPDIF output is actually superior. Just a heads up in case you're interested. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=107045 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Is 24bit/44.1kHz high resolution or marketing BS?
Wombat wrote: > When we are at it. > Remember all the talk about the secret vinyl masters they use but give > us shitty compressed PCM? > Even knowledgeable people argue the DR numbers come only from the vinyl > process and seldom from other masters. > Now that Bob's MQA is around mustn't all these releases have the high DR > numbers of vinyl? Threads over at Hydrogen Audio have revealed that the better DR numbers from vinyl are in fact an artefact of the (necessary) EQ applied when vinyl is cut. (Not talking about RIAA, just the general stuff needed to make vinyl playback work, such as monoing the bass, removal of very low bass, tweaking the treble, etc). If you apply the same EQ to a CD rip, the DR magically goes up. A lot of (most?) modern vinyl is sourced from the same hypercompressed master as the CD. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106935 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Is 24bit/44.1kHz high resolution or marketing BS?
arnyk wrote: > Vinyl has dynamic range equivalent to only about 12 bits resolution... On a good day and with a following wind, maybe :-) IME typical vinyl is equivalent to more like 10 or 11 bits. Julf wrote: > Yes and no. You don't need even 16 bits for *storing* the recording of > your vinyl, but 24 bits (well, maybe 20 in reality) gives you some extra > dynamic range in case you get the levels wrong. Since even the best vinyl struggles to achieve 12 bits of dynamic range, that's 24dB of potential headroom. Although that does assume a 16 bit ADC linear down to the LSB, so let's be generous and lop off a couple of bits. That still leaves us 12dB of headroom when setting recording levels. If anyone can't operate within those generous limits, perhaps they should find another hobby. One possible argument for doing the initial recording at 24 bit would be so you can avoid any possible accumulation of quantisation errors during post-recording DSP (eg. EQ, filtering, etc). To which I would respond that vinyl has such enormous levels of background noise that you can probably afford to make several DSP passes without even bothering to dither and the accumulated rounding errors would still be way below the level of the (faithfully recorded) vinyl surface noise. d6jg: stick with the Behringer (a UCA 202 or 222, I presume?) Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106935 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter SE does not play from digital inputs
jazzman53 wrote: > Yes, I selected from the "digital inputs" menu. Apologies, I appear not to have made myself clear. I was talking about making sure you've plugged the cables into the digital input sockets on the back of the TP, and not inadvertantly plugged them into the digital output sockets. I know it sounds like a daft thing to suggest, but we can all have senior moments! Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106893 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter SE does not play from digital inputs
garym wrote: > 3. Silliest thing of all, for my Transporter Digital inputs, I have to > select in the menu which of the inputs it uses: BNC, RCA, Optical and > balanced AES. You've selected the right one when trying to play? Even sillier: is the OP 100% sure he's connecting to the TP's digital inputs and not the digital outputs? (My first thought was that he should check the digital I/O daughter board is connected internally, but I see Wombat has already mentioned that) Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106893 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Plugin for 432Hz adjustment
tcutting wrote: > > Quote from "https://attunedvibrations.com/432hz/": > > > > > > In April 2008 Dutch journalist Richard Huisken founded the back to 432 > > Hz committee, claiming that this original tuning was used in ancient > > cultures and is found on antique instruments like the Stradivarius > > violin.> > > I don't understand this. A Stradivarius violin still has tuning pegs, so you can tune it to whatever pitch you like: A=440, A=432, or even A=456 if you want. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106891 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Software Updates
I'm a great believer in "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". Ever since in my day job a Windows update destroyed an Oracle client stack, I have been very wary of blindly accepting whatever updates software vendors deem "useful". (I'm sure there's a whole host of people who were not pleased when their Win7 system automatically "updated" to Win10). My Squeezebox Server machine is running SBS 7.6.1 (which was built in August 2011) on an ancient version of Fedora 14. It does everything I need, and runs flawlessly. It never accesses the Internet and sits behind a NAT router, so there are no security issues to worry about. Why would I want to risk an update destabilising it? Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106572 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] worth a read
mlsstl wrote: > Back-to-back and level-matched, I never could tell the difference > between direct playback of the LP and the unedited digital copy. To me, > that says that the commonly ascribed differences between the LP and > commercial CD releases has far more to do with processing/mastering > decisions than anything inherent to the storage format. Sorry, but what you have just said doesn't make sense. The fact that a faithful digital recording of an LP sounds exactly the same as the LP is no surprise. But comparing a digital recording of an LP to the LP is not the same as comparing a commercial CD release to the LP. They are bound to sound different, even if the mastering is exactly the same, for the simple reason that the LP format inevitably introduces a variety of distortions and extra noise. There's a widely held belief that LPs are cut from different masters than CDs (and that the LP master is somehow superior, eg. less dynamic range compression). While this is true in some cases, a large proportion of modern LP releases are cut from exactly the same hypercompressed and clipped master that the CD is made from. Any difference in sound between the two is down to the format (and if you happen to prefer the LP, that's fine). Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106560 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] worth a read
drmatt wrote: > Actually scrub that, I'd be OK if everyone just agreed to stop mastering > digital music to the compression death zone once and for all, > apologised, and went back and remastered all that great music that has > been rendered unlistenable. Unfortunately that isn't going to be possible for a lot of recordings. The incompetent mastering we've been subjected to for the last 20 or so years has taught a whole generation of artists and producers that music is supposed to sound like that. And so they have made their initial recordings and mixdown with excessive compression and clipping. The damage is done at step one, before the mastering engineer ever gets his hands on the stuff. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106560 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] MPD / Squeezelite Comparo
edwardthern wrote: > > I used a Jesse Lite for both running on a RaspberryPi3. > > RPI #1 = Squeezelite with no other tweaks. Playing RedBook CD material > on Flac. Power supply was a standard wallwart. > RPI #2 = MPD with no other tweaks. Playing the exact same Flac files. > Standard wallwart. > > Both connected to identical Dac's at the same time [AudioGD Ref 7 (one > borrowed)] which in turn are connected to a AudioGD Master1 Preamp, then > to a AudioGD Master3 amp. Speakers are Dynaudio. OK, so you used: - two different (nominally identical) RPIs - two different (nominally identical) DACs - two different (nominally producing the same data output) software players And you hear a difference. Why do you conclude that the difference must be due to the software players? Why not due to sample variations in the DACs? Why not due to sample variations in the RPIs? Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106537 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Bought a New Dac but had a problem
edwardthern wrote: > YES it finally cameand YES it does sound better than the old > Digi+.according to my exceptional hearing. So you already had an old DIGI+ but have bought a newer one and have come on here to tell us that it sounds better? Excellent fishing, sir, but you'd reel in a bigger catch if you posted your findings at Hydrogen Audio. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106459 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Bought a New Dac but had a problem
Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, my understanding is that OP ordered a DAC+ but HiFiBerry sent a DIGI+ instead. And sending it back to Switzerland for a refund is a lot of hassle. I agree that this is not really acceptable. Given how cheap this device is, I agree that the simplest solution would be for HiFiBerry to just say that the OP can keep the DIGI+ and send him a DAC+. Then he would be on here telling us how wonderful their customer service is, and that's got to be worth much more to them than the cost of a DIGI+. That said, we live in a world where corporations sometimes screw up and their procedures get in the way of fixing things. If you accept that this happens rather than fight against it, stress levels are significantly reduced. Yes, it's wrong that they get away with their mistake, but life it too short to let it gnaw away at you. Isn't the simplest thing to do in this case to just stick the unwanted DIGI+ on eBay and recover some of your loss? [As an aside, given that the OP is the guy who keeps telling us how wonderful his hearing is and that cheap gear sounds lousy, it strikes me that a DIGI+ is exactly the right device for him, so he can hook up his RPi to a "decent" DAC instead of using the cheap (and therefore rubbish) DAC+.] Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106459 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter vs Airdac or mdac
mikecbetts wrote: > Correct - these days I just use Spotify, CDs or LPs. > Spotify premium with extreme quality - still not brilliant, but sound > through my set-up is actually not bad. > That's why I wondered if a new DAC would improve things still further... The TP is a desirable niche product that's in demand by its target customer base. So if you don't use yours as a Squeezebox, and if it's in great condition, the obvious thing to do is to sell it and replace it with a DAC that should cost you less than you get for the TP. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106435 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Managing Loudness in a Music Library
drmatt wrote: > If you have both MP3GAIN and REPLAYGAIN tags then they may well be > fighting each other. The latter will be used and applied by LMS, the > former will represent the real adjustment made to the audio data. But > once the audio data is adjusted you don't want LMS to apply any gain > adjustment.. Provided the replaygain tags are calculated AFTER the mp3gain processing has been done, there shouldn't be a problem. Mp3gain uses the replaygain algorithm to calculate the adjustments it makes, so in principle after mp3gain has been applied, any subsequently calculated replaygain tags should be close to 0db. (That said, mp3gain only works in 1.5dB steps, so there will still be some minor residual adjustments). And finally, a comment about mp3gain. Many posts on this thread have stated that mp3gain changes the actual audio data. It doesn't. What it does do is amend the playback level header on every mp3 frame - this is the thing that tells the mp3 decoder what level to set the output of the frame. Mp3gain also (optionally) adds undo tags that it can use to reset the playback level headers on the mp3 frames back to their original values. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106423 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] The McGurk Effect - interesting illusion how what you see can affect what you hear
Here's another interesting one, regarding "satanic backwards lyrics". Check out from 5:20 to 8:00. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYTlN6wjcvQ Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106385 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] free upgrade for linux LMS users
drmatt wrote: > Ok, it seems cp is too dumb to not write. I don't see how there's anything dumb about this. The whole point of Unix is that it's built from lots of uncomplicated components (that you might like to classify as "dumb"), and it's the way you combine them that results in "clever" outcomes. cp has no knowledge of what /dev/null is. As far as cp is concerned, it's copying a file there, and it's the operating system's device handler that knows /dev/null is special and to just chuck away all data piped to it. Imagine how tiresome it would be for application developers if every program had to independently recognise the special case of its output being sent to /dev/null. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106375 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Study finds ...
Mnyb wrote: > The part I would like most for hifi would be records mixed for a defined > listening level I don't see how that can work. Different people like to listen to their music at very different levels. One man's "too quiet" is another lady's "TURN IT DOWN!!" (well, in my house, anyway :-) Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105816 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Study finds ...
drmatt wrote: > But like all hypotheses, you only need to find -one- person who can > consistently tell the difference and you have disproved the theory that > "no-one can tell the difference"... And the crucial word here is *consistently*. If you run a trial with 20 people, it is statisically very likely that one of them will "pass the test". What then needs to be done is to repeat the test and have *the same person* pass the test again. If they don't, it's just a standard case of regression to the mean. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105816 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Study finds ...
Paul Webster wrote: > Me too. > > Fancy a trip down to Mile End Road for a chat with the authors? When were you there? I was at QMC between 1975 and 1978, studying Computer Science. (Well, I started trying to do physics, but the maths got too hard :-) Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105816 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interconnects and Power leads. Snake Oil?
toby10 wrote: > I'm curious if your solar install is active or passive? I assume it is > the simpler system of just generating power to be sold/added on the grid > (that was my proposed system)? Or are you actually using your own > generated power yourself (which usually involves batteries and a lot > more complicated system) where you are augmenting your grid needs with > your own generated power? I do use some of the power that is generated, but it does not involve any storage. My system has an inverter to convert the DC to mains AC. If I happen to be using electricity while it's generated, the solar panels provide it. Power is only bought from the grid to top up any extra the house needs over what the panels are generating. If the panels generate any excess, it is exported back to the grid. The power company pays a very generous amount for what the panels generate, regardless of whether I use it or it's exported to the grid. It also pays a nominal amount for any that is exported, and since I don't have an export meter, it is assumed that 50% of generation is exported. All domestic solar panel systems installed under the "feed in tariff" scheme in the UK work like this (although some installations do have export meters). The power companies are obliged by the government to support the scheme, and the money it costs them is obtained by a "renewables surcharge" on the power bills. So in effect, people without solar panel systems are subsidising those who have them. It's another disgraceful example of taking from the poor and giving to the rich, all driven by a daft EU regulation. (Before anyone jumps to the conclusion that I'm anti-EU: I'm not. Like most other people I know I'm very upset about the result of the referendum). Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105775 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interconnects and Power leads. Snake Oil?
toby10 wrote: > Until charging times are greatly improved battery fuel will remain a > niche product. Hopefully battery tech will vastly improve as drmatt > said, but that is many years down the road at best. I am very pessimistic about recharge times ever getting short enough. Not because of limitations in battery technology, but because of the practical limits of how much power you can feed in during recharging. 200 miles range requires about 50kWh - that's not going to change, because electric motors are already staggeringly efficient. If you want to charge 50kWh in, say, 5 minutes, you need to feed in power at 600kW (assuming 100% efficiency). I can't see how that can ever be viable. toby10 wrote: > My business is industrial chemicals (specifically polymers). In that case I'd imagine you probably would agree with something I heard a long time ago: "oil is too valuable to burn". Re. your solar panel adventure. Here in the UK the government has an incentive for home owners to install them, but it's driven by EU targets on increasing renewable generation and seems to make little logical sense. Sometimes "green dogma politics" ends up causing environmental damage. I took advantage of the deal and have a 4kW system on my (thankfully unshaded) roof, and have recovered about 65% of the upfront cost in the first 4 years. But I have to admit that I did it out of economic greed rather than environmental concern. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105775 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interconnects and Power leads. Snake Oil?
toby10 wrote: > BIG if indeed > Hydrogen vs gas was just another comparison of the bad idea. Ok, lets > talk renewable energy generation. Being optimistic it takes at least 3 > times the energy to produce equal miles driven compared to current > battery fuel. So that's 3 times MORE solar panels, 3 times MORE wind > turbines, 3 times MORE hydroelectric dams, 3 times MORE (pick your > energy generation method) to drive the same miles compared to current > battery fuel. As batteries continue to improve this divide will only > widen. > > If you want to be efficient with what green energy you produce and use, > hydrogen fuel is a fools game. OK, you've convinced me that hydrogen perhaps isn't the solution. But I still see recharge times as a deal breaker for pure electric cars (which from other posts of yours I get the feeling you might agree about). I cannot see any prospect of ever being able to charge up batteries fast enough. So: what would you suggest is a viable alternative to petroleum for powering personal transport? It's a problem that has to be solved. BTW, re. renewable energy generation: I'm skeptical that wind/wave/tidal/hydro/geothermal can ever deliver enough. Possibly solar in some parts of the world (but certainly not the UK!) As far as I can see, fusion is the only realistic solution, but it's still a long way off. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105775 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interconnects and Power leads. Snake Oil?
toby10 wrote: > Now you have huge amounts of highly compressed hydrogen flowing through > pipelines, on tanker trucks, over rail, all delivered to every street > corner to (again) sit in highly compressed underground tanks. With > today's crazies/terrorist all over the planet I can just imagine them > exploiting that already volatile mix. To say nothing of the potential > environmental issues should these tanks leak/puncture, whether it be > sabotage or just an honest ps.:) OK, I can't comment on the vulnerability of hydrogen in pipelines, but I have seen film of a compressed cylinder of hydrogen being shot with an armour-piercing bullet. Result: well, not a lot, really. The tank didn't explode, all that happened was a small blue flame burning slowly out of the bullet hole. FYI, I live 6 miles from the Buncefield oil storage depot which exploded back in 2005. It destroyed the building where my wife worked, and had it happened during office hours rather than 6am on a Sunday, I would now be a widower. My feeling is that the storage of gasoline is probably less safe than hydrogen. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105775 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interconnects and Power leads. Snake Oil?
toby10 wrote: > Manufacturing, production, storage, distribution, usage, > transportation... not one category is better than battery technology, > and that aint sayin' much. :) > > One quick example: assuming you solved the first 5 (meaning those are > at least carbon and cost neutral to gasoline and/or electric batteries) > lets just look at the last one. > Using the latest high capacity (high compression) hydrogen storage tank > technology (extremely expensive tanker trucks) it would take 3 tanker > trucks of hydrogen to deliver the same miles driven as a single tanker > truck of gasoline. Or put another way, one tanker truck of gasoline can > fill 900 gasoline cars (est) vs the same size hydrogen tanker truck can > only fill 300 hydrogen cars (est), assuming both types of cars are > driving the same miles. So you're comparing hydrogen to gasoline. I hadn't realised the goalposts had been moved. OF COURSE gasoline is a far more convenient energy source than hydrogen. But I thought we were looking for a practical renewable alternative. I was simply comparing the feasibility of hydrogen v. pure electric. If (and it's a big IF) we can solve the problem of renewable energy production, then the costs of hydrogen production are not really the issue, and we're left only with the practicalities of usage. But then again, I suppose if we had effectively limitlless renewable energy, we could use it to manufacture gasoline... Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105775 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interconnects and Power leads. Snake Oil?
pablolie wrote: > I know plenty of people with Teslas here in the Bay Area. > *_Except_for_one,_they_are_all_second_cars_*. Precisely the point I was making earlier. Electric cars are only suitable for short journeys. Perhaps it's different in the US to the UK. Over here a lot of households have just one car, which needs to be capable of long trips as well as commuting and shopping. toby10 wrote: > Hydrogen cars are essentially just electric cars using a different fuel > (hydrogen instead of batteries). Yes. toby10 wrote: > The one advantage to hydrogen over batteries is refueling time. Quite so. And my point is that in practical terms this is a deal breaker. The circumstance when you need to refuel the car quickly is when you're on a long trip, and you simply can't afford to wait around for half an hour every 90 mins. toby10 wrote: > But every other aspect of hydrogen as a vehicle fuel source is a big > negative. Obviously there is an additional stage of inefficiency involved when electricity is used to make hydrogen which doesn't apply to pure electric cars. But we need to solve the generic problem of energy supply regardless (fusion, anyone?), and if we do that, this issue isn't really a problem. Apart from that, what other problems does hydrogen have? Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105775 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interconnects and Power leads. Snake Oil?
drmatt wrote: > The Tesla supercharger network genuinely means you can grab a coffee and > cake and get a 150-200 mile range boost while you wait. Yes it's not > instant but nor is it Nissan Leaf 8hrs charge either. It's also free, as > a nice sweetener.. I still think far too much effort is being spent on small incremental improvements to a fundamentally unworkable model. According to Tesla, their Supercharger adds 170 miles range in 30 minutes. Sure, it's much better than charging at home, but it's still WAY too slow for making decent progress on a long journey. (I like the way that Tesla say it's an opportunity to grab a cup of coffee while I wait - as if I'd want to drink yet another cup of overpriced Starbucks dishwater every time I fill up). Unfortunately companies have invested a great deal of money into electric vehicles, so it'll be some time before they admit defeat and switch to something workable, like fuel cells. drmatt wrote: > Fuel cells and/or hot swap batteries would be a great concept, but we're > a way off either of those being on the road. You can buy a Toyota Mirai now. Unfortunately it's over 60 grand - about 10k more than a Tesla S. But it does refuel in 3 minutes - if you could find anywere to buy the hydrogen (which you can't, of course). drmatt wrote: > Just getting to the point of having ONE standard motorway fast charger > would be good enough and they can't even agree on that... This gets to the heart of the problem - building the refuelling infrastructure. Neither is yet in place, so it strikes me that we should aim to deploy the more practical option - which is hydrogen. Unfortunately an infrastructure for recharging electric vehicles is already growing - driven by the motor industry's stupid decision to back the wrong horse - so the chances are that fuel cell technology will be held back for a while yet. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105775 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interconnects and Power leads. Snake Oil?
Mnyb wrote: > OT If I could afford a model s I would get one , just waiting to see > what model 3 or other electrical cars will be at in a couple of years .. > IMO I think fossil fuel cars is the new CRT TV I would not buy one new > it's worth 50$ on eBay in a couple of years . > I think we are at the brink of a paradigm shift regarding cars . We have all grown up expecting to pull into a filling station and be on our way in a few minutes. So the paradigm shift needed for electric cars to become mainstream is the discovery of some way to recharge them very quickly. And that isn't ever going to happen: the Tesla S battery pack is 60kWh, so if you want to recharge that in, say, 5 mins, you need to feed it at 720 kW (assuming 100% efficiency) - utterly unrealistic. I see only two practical alternatives to the internal combustion engine: 1. All the manufacturers of electric vehicles standardise on a quick-swap battery pack design so that you can arrive at a filling station and exchange your empty battery pack for a pre-charged one. 2. Hydrogen-powered fuel cells. (This one gets my vote) Both options require a massive investment in new equipment at filling stations. It's going to be a long, slow process. In the meantime, electric cars will be limited to things like commuting and shopping. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105775 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Study finds ...
Having now downloaded and read the paper, I am concerned about the criteria used to select which studies were included in the meta-analysis. Unless I've missed something, all I can see is that studies were selected based on the comparison methodology - ie. the manner in which the redbook and hi-res material was compared. Nowhere did I see any mention that studies would only be considered where the redbook material had been downsampled from the hi-res. Any comparison which does not obtain its sources in this manner is flawed and should not be included in any meta-analysis. This is such a fundamental criteria that the fact it is not mentioned seems a little suspicious. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105816 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Study finds ...
utgg wrote: > Full paper is freely available here: http://www.aes.org/journal/ Thanks for the pointer. As Arny says, it's unusual to be able to freely download AES papers - so I had naively assumed it wouldn't be easily available. I will download and study it. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105816 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Study finds ...
Paul Webster wrote: > Just pointing out the pigeons to the cats. > http://eecs.qmul.ac.uk/news/view/people-can-hear-the-difference-in-high-resolution-audio-study-finds As an alumnus of Queen Mary, I hesitate to call into question their statement. But the claims they are reporting go against a large number of studies that have time and again shown no ability to discriminate between redbook and "hi-res" under properly controlled conditions. Nowhere in QMC's synopsis does it mention whether this meta-analysis was careful to include only those studies which used the same masterings in level matched double blind comparisons. Unless the hi-res master is downsampled to redbook for the purposes of the comparison, all bets are off. Anyone have any more details about this study? Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105816 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interconnects and Power leads. Snake Oil?
drmatt wrote: > The UK is not awash with good priced electrical stores. You want decent quality sensibly priced cables in the UK? Try here: http://www.kenable.co.uk/ Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105775 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 16bit versus 24bit versus dynamic range
arnyk wrote: > If I had a nickel for every concert with "Electronic Augmentation" where > hum and noise from guitar amplifiers and hastily erected portable PA > systems are clearly audible throughout the concert That menacing hum and hiss before the gig starts is an integral part of any self-respecting rock concert - it adds to the anticipation. A guitar amp that doesn't hum and hiss should only be used for jazz. Transporter -> ATC SCM100A cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=105717 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
