[Aus-soaring] BORING
I went flying on the weekend... www.facebook.com/W3Racing Had a great weekend soaring at Kingaroy, weather was 8500' under SCT CU. The task was a 3hr AAT on Sunday, which was very appropriate great fun! I jagged a day win out of it, flying with Trottski's Dad. The start as it turned out was probably the best timing for the task, though soft until we crossed the Bunyas. The strengths heights then picked up. Dad had the fastest 1st leg, picking the conditions well above the rest. Averaging 138kph to Chinchilla for memory! Sadly he fell in a hole before turning for the 2nd sector. My run as it turned out was just even safe, which gave me the speed. Nothing eventful happened on leg 2, except that it appeared to be softer from the recent rains. Leg 3, POW! A humming street set up for us, Lisa cored 7-8kts to base, then proceeded at some crazy LD for well over 100km! I joined the street later, covering 65km at 215kph :) The fun was about to stop begin though. I left the street at base, throttled back extended glide at 80kts. The CU's quickly deteriorated, providing only 3kts to get home on. Lisa cored 2kts 15km Nth of Durong from 1000' AGL, would've been character building out there if it weren't for the beautiful airstrip below us! From looking at being 4 min under time, to 5min over time, I came in for the day win at 126kph. Great fun for a day in March! Cheers, WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING at BSS
Very boring day at Beverley Soaring Society on Saturday 9th Nov, 2013. At least 8 club and private gliders went out and completed 300 km tasks. Lift was still working to 9,000' AMSL at 1650 hours WST (no daylight saving here in WA). Great (boring) day had by all. Thanks to all who helped out to make the day possible. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Hi Mike,
Thank God - He used it you know, for communicating with Moses - that you did
not use SLATE as your medium!
Thanks for the translation.
Gary
- Original Message -
From: Mike Timbrell
To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.'
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2013 4:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
G’day Gary,
I knew I should never have used that heavy paper in those hypothetical exams!
BTW, the text is Italian. “There is half a sea between saying doing.”
mike
From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net
[mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of
gstev...@bigpond.com
Sent: Thursday, 7 March 2013 11:15 PM
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Hi Tim,
Roaming hands are common worldwide, but the Romans are now gone, and except
for specialists - have you read the ultimate text (The Specialist), on dunny
building by the way? - {another example of lost knowledge}, so is the Latin
language! Thank God for google fish, but I am a bit confused as to what ear I
should put it in.
Your post reminds me of one (possibly hypothetical), way of grading exam
papers. Find a building higher than one storey, go to the head of the stairs,
and then toss all exam papers into the ether. They will all come to earth, and
it is then a simple matter to grade the papers. The ones that go furthest get
the highest mark, and the ones that land closest to the stairs get the lowest
mark. Warning: Please be aware that sometimes bullshit baffles brains! In
essence, it is a bit like scoring a glider competition really!
Thanks for your recent advice on using flarm for logging gold and silver
badge flights. I had a nice flight - was it only yesterday?
The wheel turns. Hope your own Wednesday flight was good value?
Gary
- Original Message -
From: Tim Shirley
To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.'
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2013 9:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
The best handicap system I have heard of for gliding (admittedly
theroretical) worked like this.
1. At the start of the competition each pilot nominates the value of
his or her glider. These valuations are made public.
2. The handicaps are then based on the pilots valuation according to
some fairly simple formula – the lower value, the more favourable the handicap
of course.
3. The he pilot signs a guarantee that they will sell the glider to
anyone who comes up with the valuation figure, at the end of the competition.
That should sort out the problem quite nicely I think. Anyone interested
in a cheap JS1 that just won the Nationals? J
And, for those who have posted on this topic without ever having organised,
scored or handicapped a gliding competition, or in fact have done anything here
except bitch about those that do, there are a few words just under my signature
below. Google translator will soon tell you why they are relevant to you.
Do it yourselves next time.
Cheers
Tim
Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare
From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net
[mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of
gstev...@bigpond.com
Sent: Thursday, 7 March 2013 20:41
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Peter,
That is an interesting suggestion! I wonder if it could be practically (and
fairly), done?
Re poor task setting, I tend to think that your objection 'having to
start early/finish late is actually as a general principle, just the opposite
- at a National level and probably a State level too, this is what good tasking
should be all about! In general, the task setting at most competitions, on most
reasonably soarable days, is far too conservative. {Everybody, please carefully
note those two provisos - most reasonably!}
Having said that, I tend to agree with your last paragraph, which then gets
back to the question I raised in my first paragraph above.
The points noted by Matthew Scutter, in his email below, are all reasonable
too. Emilis Prelgauskas in a recent posting on this site, talked (amongst other
things), about some of the problems facing the gliding movement in this
country, including a gradual loss of knowledge held collectively by the
membership, and knowledge (mostly), lost to the current Board and those
administrating the GFA system. Once upon a time - I think it was just around
the time of the introduction of computers into gliding scoring - a guy called
Murray Evans (Murray-Evans?), came up with a system that related everybody's
performance back to their glider
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Peter,
That is an interesting suggestion! I wonder if it could be practically (and
fairly), done?
Re poor task setting, I tend to think that your objection 'having to start
early/finish late is actually as a general principle, just the opposite - at a
National level and probably a State level too, this is what good tasking should
be all about! In general, the task setting at most competitions, on most
reasonably soarable days, is far too conservative. {Everybody, please carefully
note those two provisos - most reasonably!}
Having said that, I tend to agree with your last paragraph, which then gets
back to the question I raised in my first paragraph above.
The points noted by Matthew Scutter, in his email below, are all reasonable
too. Emilis Prelgauskas in a recent posting on this site, talked (amongst other
things), about some of the problems facing the gliding movement in this
country, including a gradual loss of knowledge held collectively by the
membership, and knowledge (mostly), lost to the current Board and those
administrating the GFA system. Once upon a time - I think it was just around
the time of the introduction of computers into gliding scoring - a guy called
Murray Evans (Murray-Evans?), came up with a system that related everybody's
performance back to their glider polar, and the results for the day were then
corrected. The system was tried once, and promptly abandoned, as being
unworkable - which was fair enough at the time. The first and possibly major
problem then, was obtaining realistic polars, for the gliders competing. Number
crunching (laughable today), was also a problem, as I recall. In my view, it
might now prove profitable to revisit the principles of the ME concept, and
check their workability in the current hi-tek environment.
Ann Woolf - given the tremendous (mind boggling?) - work that you have done on
compiling the electronic AG data base - could I please call upon you to put the
article(s?), that appeared in Australian Gliding, on this web site, for the
perusal and comment of a latter generation of glider pilots?
Gary
- Original Message -
From: nimb...@internode.on.net
To: aus-soaring
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2013 6:00 PM
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
How about letting the previous generation 20m gliders fly in 15m class where
the handicaps are much closer as compared to current generation open class.
The other factor that gives the higher performance gliders an advantage over
the previous generation gliders when there is a large handicap spread is poor
task setting.
This occurs when racing tasks are set that force the lower performance
gliders to fly in weaker conditions by having to start early or finish later.
Where there is a significant spread in handicaps then racing tasks should not
be set.
Regards
Peter
Sent from my HTC smartphone
- Reply message -
From: Matthew Scutter yellowplant...@gmail.com
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Date: Thu, Mar 7, 2013 12:29
Ron,
Because the handicaps have practical limitations as gliders have
different performance characteristics in different weather, which
handicaps can't take into account.
The handicaps are probably fair for a Cirrus and an ASG29 on a 3kt
day, but they certainly aren't on a 12kt day.
This seems to be the general consensus - in normal weather, the
handicaps are close to the technical optimum, but in strong weather
the higher performance gliders have an advantage.
Technical ways to 'solve' this have been postulated for years,
different handicaps for different weather etc, all of which sounds to
me like too much work.
How we solve it now is grouping the gliders in relatively similar
performance classes.
If higher performance gliders have an advantage in stronger weather,
it makes sense they should not be able to come 'down' a class and fly
with lower performance gliders.
Whether it should work the other way depends on whether you believe
that lower performance gliders have an edge in weaker weather.
Personally I think the lower performance gliders do have an edge in
survival weather, but that is almost entirely negated because we get
less weak weather than strong, and we don't set tasks in survival
weather (how often is a day cancelled for being too strong? ;) )
I think the cause of this discussion is that while STD class is mostly
populated with top-of-the-line STD class ships, 15M class is largely
previous generation gliders - so many STD class pilots (particularly
those in previous generation STD class gliders, myself included), feel
we're flying closer to our 'effective' performance class in 15M.
tldr; The system is a 'good enough' compromise.
-matthew
On Thu, Mar 7, 2013 at 12:01 PM, Ron resand...@gmail.com wrote:
I think you missed the point
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
The best handicap system I have heard of for gliding (admittedly theroretical)
worked like this.
1. At the start of the competition each pilot nominates the value of his
or her glider. These valuations are made public.
2. The handicaps are then based on the pilots valuation according to some
fairly simple formula – the lower value, the more favourable the handicap of
course.
3. The he pilot signs a guarantee that they will sell the glider to
anyone who comes up with the valuation figure, at the end of the competition.
That should sort out the problem quite nicely I think. Anyone interested in a
cheap JS1 that just won the Nationals? J
And, for those who have posted on this topic without ever having organised,
scored or handicapped a gliding competition, or in fact have done anything here
except bitch about those that do, there are a few words just under my signature
below. Google translator will soon tell you why they are relevant to you.
Do it yourselves next time.
Cheers
Tim
Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare
From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net
[mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of
gstev...@bigpond.com
Sent: Thursday, 7 March 2013 20:41
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Peter,
That is an interesting suggestion! I wonder if it could be practically (and
fairly), done?
Re poor task setting, I tend to think that your objection 'having to start
early/finish late is actually as a general principle, just the opposite - at a
National level and probably a State level too, this is what good tasking should
be all about! In general, the task setting at most competitions, on most
reasonably soarable days, is far too conservative. {Everybody, please carefully
note those two provisos - most reasonably!}
Having said that, I tend to agree with your last paragraph, which then gets
back to the question I raised in my first paragraph above.
The points noted by Matthew Scutter, in his email below, are all reasonable
too. Emilis Prelgauskas in a recent posting on this site, talked (amongst other
things), about some of the problems facing the gliding movement in this
country, including a gradual loss of knowledge held collectively by the
membership, and knowledge (mostly), lost to the current Board and those
administrating the GFA system. Once upon a time - I think it was just around
the time of the introduction of computers into gliding scoring - a guy called
Murray Evans (Murray-Evans?), came up with a system that related everybody's
performance back to their glider polar, and the results for the day were then
corrected. The system was tried once, and promptly abandoned, as being
unworkable - which was fair enough at the time. The first and possibly major
problem then, was obtaining realistic polars, for the gliders competing. Number
crunching (laughable today), was also a problem, as I recall. In my view, it
might now prove profitable to revisit the principles of the ME concept, and
check their workability in the current hi-tek environment.
Ann Woolf - given the tremendous (mind boggling?) - work that you have done on
compiling the electronic AG data base - could I please call upon you to put the
article(s?), that appeared in Australian Gliding, on this web site, for the
perusal and comment of a latter generation of glider pilots?
Gary
- Original Message -
From: nimb...@internode.on.net
To: aus-soaring mailto:aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2013 6:00 PM
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
How about letting the previous generation 20m gliders fly in 15m class where
the handicaps are much closer as compared to current generation open class.
The other factor that gives the higher performance gliders an advantage over
the previous generation gliders when there is a large handicap spread is poor
task setting.
This occurs when racing tasks are set that force the lower performance gliders
to fly in weaker conditions by having to start early or finish later. Where
there is a significant spread in handicaps then racing tasks should not be set.
Regards
Peter
Sent from my HTC smartphone
- Reply message -
From: Matthew Scutter yellowplant...@gmail.com
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Date: Thu, Mar 7, 2013 12:29
Ron,
Because the handicaps have practical limitations as gliders have
different performance characteristics in different weather, which
handicaps can't take into account.
The handicaps are probably fair for a Cirrus and an ASG29 on a 3kt
day, but they certainly aren't on a 12kt day.
This seems to be the general consensus - in normal weather, the
handicaps are close to the technical optimum, but in strong weather
the higher performance gliders have
[Aus-soaring] Boring
Tim you the best scorer in Australia perhaps the world The Libelle 301 is the best sports class glider in the world sorry 201 owners. As far as winning it takes money, luck, natural ability and practice I always hope to taxi after landing as if you cant you crashed. The news group is a lot of chest beating and hot air of late perhaps the season was crap again! I suggest 20 gliders same make same instruments and same weight same task same day same place not so boring each GFA member has a right to fly 5 days winners from 20 weeks fly it off on week 21 of summer season winner gets to beat chest. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Hi Tim,
Roaming hands are common worldwide, but the Romans are now gone, and except for
specialists - have you read the ultimate text (The Specialist), on dunny
building by the way? - {another example of lost knowledge}, so is the Latin
language! Thank God for google fish, but I am a bit confused as to what ear I
should put it in.
Your post reminds me of one (possibly hypothetical), way of grading exam
papers. Find a building higher than one storey, go to the head of the stairs,
and then toss all exam papers into the ether. They will all come to earth, and
it is then a simple matter to grade the papers. The ones that go furthest get
the highest mark, and the ones that land closest to the stairs get the lowest
mark. Warning: Please be aware that sometimes bullshit baffles brains! In
essence, it is a bit like scoring a glider competition really!
Thanks for your recent advice on using flarm for logging gold and silver badge
flights. I had a nice flight - was it only yesterday?
The wheel turns. Hope your own Wednesday flight was good value?
Gary
- Original Message -
From: Tim Shirley
To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.'
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2013 9:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
The best handicap system I have heard of for gliding (admittedly
theroretical) worked like this.
1. At the start of the competition each pilot nominates the value of
his or her glider. These valuations are made public.
2. The handicaps are then based on the pilots valuation according to
some fairly simple formula – the lower value, the more favourable the handicap
of course.
3. The he pilot signs a guarantee that they will sell the glider to
anyone who comes up with the valuation figure, at the end of the competition.
That should sort out the problem quite nicely I think. Anyone interested in
a cheap JS1 that just won the Nationals? J
And, for those who have posted on this topic without ever having organised,
scored or handicapped a gliding competition, or in fact have done anything here
except bitch about those that do, there are a few words just under my signature
below. Google translator will soon tell you why they are relevant to you.
Do it yourselves next time.
Cheers
Tim
Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare
From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net
[mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of
gstev...@bigpond.com
Sent: Thursday, 7 March 2013 20:41
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Peter,
That is an interesting suggestion! I wonder if it could be practically (and
fairly), done?
Re poor task setting, I tend to think that your objection 'having to start
early/finish late is actually as a general principle, just the opposite - at a
National level and probably a State level too, this is what good tasking should
be all about! In general, the task setting at most competitions, on most
reasonably soarable days, is far too conservative. {Everybody, please carefully
note those two provisos - most reasonably!}
Having said that, I tend to agree with your last paragraph, which then gets
back to the question I raised in my first paragraph above.
The points noted by Matthew Scutter, in his email below, are all reasonable
too. Emilis Prelgauskas in a recent posting on this site, talked (amongst other
things), about some of the problems facing the gliding movement in this
country, including a gradual loss of knowledge held collectively by the
membership, and knowledge (mostly), lost to the current Board and those
administrating the GFA system. Once upon a time - I think it was just around
the time of the introduction of computers into gliding scoring - a guy called
Murray Evans (Murray-Evans?), came up with a system that related everybody's
performance back to their glider polar, and the results for the day were then
corrected. The system was tried once, and promptly abandoned, as being
unworkable - which was fair enough at the time. The first and possibly major
problem then, was obtaining realistic polars, for the gliders competing. Number
crunching (laughable today), was also a problem, as I recall. In my view, it
might now prove profitable to revisit the principles of the ME concept, and
check their workability in the current hi-tek environment.
Ann Woolf - given the tremendous (mind boggling?) - work that you have done
on compiling the electronic AG data base - could I please call upon you to put
the article(s?), that appeared in Australian Gliding, on this web site, for
the perusal and comment of a latter generation of glider pilots?
Gary
- Original Message -
From: nimb...@internode.on.net
To: aus-soaring
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2013 6:00 PM
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
G’day Gary,
I knew I should never have used that heavy paper in those hypothetical exams!
BTW, the text is Italian. “There is half a sea between saying doing.”
mike
From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net
[mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of
gstev...@bigpond.com
Sent: Thursday, 7 March 2013 11:15 PM
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Hi Tim,
Roaming hands are common worldwide, but the Romans are now gone, and except for
specialists - have you read the ultimate text (The Specialist), on dunny
building by the way? - {another example of lost knowledge}, so is the Latin
language! Thank God for google fish, but I am a bit confused as to what ear I
should put it in.
Your post reminds me of one (possibly hypothetical), way of grading exam
papers. Find a building higher than one storey, go to the head of the stairs,
and then toss all exam papers into the ether. They will all come to earth, and
it is then a simple matter to grade the papers. The ones that go furthest get
the highest mark, and the ones that land closest to the stairs get the lowest
mark. Warning: Please be aware that sometimes bullshit baffles brains! In
essence, it is a bit like scoring a glider competition really!
Thanks for your recent advice on using flarm for logging gold and silver badge
flights. I had a nice flight - was it only yesterday?
The wheel turns. Hope your own Wednesday flight was good value?
Gary
- Original Message -
From: Tim Shirley mailto:tshir...@internode.on.net
To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.'
mailto:aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2013 9:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
The best handicap system I have heard of for gliding (admittedly theroretical)
worked like this.
1. At the start of the competition each pilot nominates the value of his
or her glider. These valuations are made public.
2. The handicaps are then based on the pilots valuation according to some
fairly simple formula – the lower value, the more favourable the handicap of
course.
3. The he pilot signs a guarantee that they will sell the glider to
anyone who comes up with the valuation figure, at the end of the competition.
That should sort out the problem quite nicely I think. Anyone interested in a
cheap JS1 that just won the Nationals? J
And, for those who have posted on this topic without ever having organised,
scored or handicapped a gliding competition, or in fact have done anything here
except bitch about those that do, there are a few words just under my signature
below. Google translator will soon tell you why they are relevant to you.
Do it yourselves next time.
Cheers
Tim
Tra dire e fare c’è mezzo il mare
From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net
[mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of
gstev...@bigpond.com
Sent: Thursday, 7 March 2013 20:41
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Peter,
That is an interesting suggestion! I wonder if it could be practically (and
fairly), done?
Re poor task setting, I tend to think that your objection 'having to start
early/finish late is actually as a general principle, just the opposite - at a
National level and probably a State level too, this is what good tasking should
be all about! In general, the task setting at most competitions, on most
reasonably soarable days, is far too conservative. {Everybody, please carefully
note those two provisos - most reasonably!}
Having said that, I tend to agree with your last paragraph, which then gets
back to the question I raised in my first paragraph above.
The points noted by Matthew Scutter, in his email below, are all reasonable
too. Emilis Prelgauskas in a recent posting on this site, talked (amongst other
things), about some of the problems facing the gliding movement in this
country, including a gradual loss of knowledge held collectively by the
membership, and knowledge (mostly), lost to the current Board and those
administrating the GFA system. Once upon a time - I think it was just around
the time of the introduction of computers into gliding scoring - a guy called
Murray Evans (Murray-Evans?), came up with a system that related everybody's
performance back to their glider polar, and the results for the day were then
corrected. The system was tried once, and promptly abandoned, as being
unworkable - which was fair enough at the time. The first and possibly major
problem then, was obtaining realistic polars, for the gliders competing. Number
crunching (laughable today), was also a problem, as I recall. In my view, it
might now prove profitable to revisit the principles of the ME concept, and
check their workability in the current hi-tek
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Ron, It is because they have flaps, of course! However if you invert the question, Standard Class gliders may fly in 15 m (Racing) Class. Gary - Original Message - From: Ron Sanders To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 1:23 AM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Dear Adam, i agree with you!! And i note that there was not one reply to your far more interesting posted questionif the handicaps are so good why aren't fifteen metre flapped gliders allowed in Standard class? The priorities are not in the right order. RS On 5 March 2013 20:16, Adam Woolley go_soar...@hotmail.com wrote: I went soaring today (well a circuit), it was awesome! WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2240 / Virus Database: 2641/5651 - Release Date: 03/05/13 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
It's a subject we're not going to win, but as you know - STD class gliders have flexibility of flying both classes, but racing gliders are limited to just one (at the MCN) class. The handicaps are fair, yeah? So there's no advantage to be in a racing glider while competing in STD class. Yet it's not allowed. I know the reasoning, but still..! As many will know, often when you compare the classes at the same comp - STD class always seems to have the higher average day winning speeds. Perhaps because its more competitive in STD pilots have to push themselves harder? The alternative... My thinking (will submit to the handicap committee for review) is have a 1.00 glider for each class (like the golden old days, where there were no h/c), then discourage gliders who shouldn't be in that particular class with a slightly unfavorable h/c. Eg, an LS4 could be 1.03 in 15m class, rather than 1.04 as it is in STD class atm. My guess though, that this will never be implemented - so I'll keep my opinion as to why it won't happen to myself :) Strepla, WPP On 07/03/2013, at 8:48, gstev...@bigpond.com wrote: Ron, It is because they have flaps, of course! However if you invert the question, Standard Class gliders may fly in 15 m (Racing) Class. Gary - Original Message - From: Ron Sanders To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 1:23 AM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Dear Adam, i agree with you!! And i note that there was not one reply to your far more interesting posted questionif the handicaps are so good why aren't fifteen metreflapped gliders allowed in Standard class? The priorities are not in the right order. RS On 5 March 2013 20:16, Adam Woolley go_soar...@hotmail.com wrote: I went soaring today (well a circuit), it was awesome! WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2240 / Virus Database: 2641/5651 - Release Date: 03/05/13 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Continuing on with the example, in STD class, the LS4 would keep its 1.04 handicap - as it's competing in the class that it should be. WPP On 07/03/2013, at 8:48, gstev...@bigpond.com wrote: Ron, It is because they have flaps, of course! However if you invert the question, Standard Class gliders may fly in 15 m (Racing) Class. Gary - Original Message - From: Ron Sanders To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 1:23 AM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Dear Adam, i agree with you!! And i note that there was not one reply to your far more interesting posted questionif the handicaps are so good why aren't fifteen metreflapped gliders allowed in Standard class? The priorities are not in the right order. RS On 5 March 2013 20:16, Adam Woolley go_soar...@hotmail.com wrote: I went soaring today (well a circuit), it was awesome! WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2240 / Virus Database: 2641/5651 - Release Date: 03/05/13 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
At 08:48 AM 7/03/2013, you wrote: Ron, It is because they have flaps, of course! However if you invert the question, Standard Class gliders may fly in 15 m (Racing) Class. Gary Clean miss of the point again, Gary. Have a think about it. Mike ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
I think you missed the point . If the handicaps are so good what does it matter whether the span in 100 metres or if it has flaps? Ron On 07/03/2013, at 6:48, gstev...@bigpond.com wrote: Ron, It is because they have flaps, of course! However if you invert the question, Standard Class gliders may fly in 15 m (Racing) Class. Gary - Original Message - From: Ron Sanders To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 1:23 AM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Dear Adam, i agree with you!! And i note that there was not one reply to your far more interesting posted questionif the handicaps are so good why aren't fifteen metre flapped gliders allowed in Standard class? The priorities are not in the right order. RS On 5 March 2013 20:16, Adam Woolley go_soar...@hotmail.com wrote: I went soaring today (well a circuit), it was awesome! WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2240 / Virus Database: 2641/5651 - Release Date: 03/05/13 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Who said the handicaps were so good? Regarding CLASSES, any glider which fits is fine. Tom___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Ron, Because the handicaps have practical limitations as gliders have different performance characteristics in different weather, which handicaps can't take into account. The handicaps are probably fair for a Cirrus and an ASG29 on a 3kt day, but they certainly aren't on a 12kt day. This seems to be the general consensus - in normal weather, the handicaps are close to the technical optimum, but in strong weather the higher performance gliders have an advantage. Technical ways to 'solve' this have been postulated for years, different handicaps for different weather etc, all of which sounds to me like too much work. How we solve it now is grouping the gliders in relatively similar performance classes. If higher performance gliders have an advantage in stronger weather, it makes sense they should not be able to come 'down' a class and fly with lower performance gliders. Whether it should work the other way depends on whether you believe that lower performance gliders have an edge in weaker weather. Personally I think the lower performance gliders do have an edge in survival weather, but that is almost entirely negated because we get less weak weather than strong, and we don't set tasks in survival weather (how often is a day cancelled for being too strong? ;) ) I think the cause of this discussion is that while STD class is mostly populated with top-of-the-line STD class ships, 15M class is largely previous generation gliders - so many STD class pilots (particularly those in previous generation STD class gliders, myself included), feel we're flying closer to our 'effective' performance class in 15M. tldr; The system is a 'good enough' compromise. -matthew On Thu, Mar 7, 2013 at 12:01 PM, Ron resand...@gmail.com wrote: I think you missed the point . If the handicaps are so good what does it matter whether the span in 100 metres or if it has flaps? Ron On 07/03/2013, at 6:48, gstev...@bigpond.com wrote: Ron, It is because they have flaps, of course! However if you invert the question, Standard Class gliders may fly in 15 m (Racing) Class. Gary - Original Message - From: Ron Sanders To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 1:23 AM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Dear Adam, i agree with you!! And i note that there was not one reply to your far more interesting posted questionif the handicaps are so good why aren't fifteen metre flapped gliders allowed in Standard class? The priorities are not in the right order. RS On 5 March 2013 20:16, Adam Woolley go_soar...@hotmail.com wrote: I went soaring today (well a circuit), it was awesome! WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2240 / Virus Database: 2641/5651 - Release Date: 03/05/13 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Adam you are right in all counts. It won't be implemented either Ron On 07/03/2013, at 7:40, Adam Woolley go_soar...@hotmail.com wrote: It's a subject we're not going to win, but as you know - STD class gliders have flexibility of flying both classes, but racing gliders are limited to just one (at the MCN) class. The handicaps are fair, yeah? So there's no advantage to be in a racing glider while competing in STD class. Yet it's not allowed. I know the reasoning, but still..! As many will know, often when you compare the classes at the same comp - STD class always seems to have the higher average day winning speeds. Perhaps because its more competitive in STD pilots have to push themselves harder? The alternative... My thinking (will submit to the handicap committee for review) is have a 1.00 glider for each class (like the golden old days, where there were no h/c), then discourage gliders who shouldn't be in that particular class with a slightly unfavorable h/c. Eg, an LS4 could be 1.03 in 15m class, rather than 1.04 as it is in STD class atm. My guess though, that this will never be implemented - so I'll keep my opinion as to why it won't happen to myself :) Strepla, WPP On 07/03/2013, at 8:48, gstev...@bigpond.com wrote: Ron, It is because they have flaps, of course! However if you invert the question, Standard Class gliders may fly in 15 m (Racing) Class. Gary - Original Message - From: Ron Sanders To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 1:23 AM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Dear Adam, i agree with you!! And i note that there was not one reply to your far more interesting posted questionif the handicaps are so good why aren't fifteen metre flapped gliders allowed in Standard class? The priorities are not in the right order. RS On 5 March 2013 20:16, Adam Woolley go_soar...@hotmail.com wrote: I went soaring today (well a circuit), it was awesome! WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2240 / Virus Database: 2641/5651 - Release Date: 03/05/13 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
How about letting the previous generation 20m gliders fly in 15m class where the handicaps are much closer as compared to current generation open class. The other factor that gives the higher performance gliders an advantage over the previous generation gliders when there is a large handicap spread is poor task setting. This occurs when racing tasks are set that force the lower performance gliders to fly in weaker conditions by having to start early or finish later. Where there is a significant spread in handicaps then racing tasks should not be set. Regards Peter Sent from my HTC smartphone - Reply message - From: Matthew Scutter yellowplant...@gmail.com To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Date: Thu, Mar 7, 2013 12:29 Ron, Because the handicaps have practical limitations as gliders have different performance characteristics in different weather, which handicaps can't take into account. The handicaps are probably fair for a Cirrus and an ASG29 on a 3kt day, but they certainly aren't on a 12kt day. This seems to be the general consensus - in normal weather, the handicaps are close to the technical optimum, but in strong weather the higher performance gliders have an advantage. Technical ways to 'solve' this have been postulated for years, different handicaps for different weather etc, all of which sounds to me like too much work. How we solve it now is grouping the gliders in relatively similar performance classes. If higher performance gliders have an advantage in stronger weather, it makes sense they should not be able to come 'down' a class and fly with lower performance gliders. Whether it should work the other way depends on whether you believe that lower performance gliders have an edge in weaker weather. Personally I think the lower performance gliders do have an edge in survival weather, but that is almost entirely negated because we get less weak weather than strong, and we don't set tasks in survival weather (how often is a day cancelled for being too strong? ;) ) I think the cause of this discussion is that while STD class is mostly populated with top-of-the-line STD class ships, 15M class is largely previous generation gliders - so many STD class pilots (particularly those in previous generation STD class gliders, myself included), feel we're flying closer to our 'effective' performance class in 15M. tldr; The system is a 'good enough' compromise. -matthew On Thu, Mar 7, 2013 at 12:01 PM, Ron resand...@gmail.com wrote: I think you missed the point . If the handicaps are so good what does it matter whether the span in 100 metres or if it has flaps? Ron On 07/03/2013, at 6:48, gstev...@bigpond.com wrote: Ron, It is because they have flaps, of course! However if you invert the question, Standard Class gliders may fly in 15 m (Racing) Class. Gary - Original Message - From: Ron Sanders To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2013 1:23 AM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Dear Adam, i agree with you!! And i note that there was not one reply to your far more interesting posted questionif the handicaps are so good why aren't fifteen metre flapped gliders allowed in Standard class? The priorities are not in the right order. RS On 5 March 2013 20:16, Adam Woolley go_soar...@hotmail.com wrote: I went soaring today (well a circuit), it was awesome! WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2240 / Virus Database: 2641/5651 - Release Date: 03/05/13 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http
[Aus-soaring] Boring
I went soaring today (well a circuit), it was awesome! WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Dear Adam, i agree with you!! And i note that there was not one reply to your far more interesting posted questionif the handicaps are so good why aren't fifteen metre flapped gliders allowed in Standard class? The priorities are not in the right order. RS On 5 March 2013 20:16, Adam Woolley go_soar...@hotmail.com wrote: I went soaring today (well a circuit), it was awesome! WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
On 5/03/2013 10:16 PM, Adam Woolley wrote: I went soaring today (well a circuit), it was awesome! WPP ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring Did you put it on OLC I want to see it! FQA ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING: Qld States, Day 3
http://www.onlinecontest.org/olc-2.0/gliding/flightinfo.html?dsId=2763102 www.facebook.com/W3Racing Day winner, just! Kingaroy pilots winning both tasks at the QLD States today :) Stats for the day... 276km at 107.72km/hr; 5.7kts (17%); 51:1 for 22.4km glides at an average interthermal speed of 136km/hr (73kts); lost only 207ft in centering thermals, my best ever! 15km extra in deviations. Best climb: 7.2kts for 2400'; Best glide: 60:1 for 46km; Final Glide: 46km from 1,250' below glide :) Sadly work called, now at home off to bed. Great day, lots of fun - looking forward to the Nationals next week :) Thanks to the organisers and the team @ DDSC, I've had a really great time there - very friendly and relaxed State Champs, the catering superb, top job - just sorry I can't be there to finish what I had started. SeeYou, WPP___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING: Qld States, Day 1
http://www.onlinecontest.org/olc-2.0/gliding/flightinfo.html?dsId=2760644 Stats for the day, 185km @ 82.01km/hr; 3.4kts (31%); 33:1 for 12.1km glides @ 124km/hr inter thermal speed. Deviating 10 extra kilometers on task (maybe the reason I didn't go faster, as it was basically a blue day) www.facebook.com/W3Racing www.tinyurl.com/W3Tracking (for the comp this week) Arrived at the QLD States this morning, rigged, registered, loaded waypoints airspace, got to the grid, organised myself some more - two minutes prior to hooking on, I was ready... ...for a safe flight, but not a focused fast flight. The task committee set a brilliant task, a fixed one in what was expected to be dicey weather. I parked myself on the back of the grid, as I knew I needed every minute to get ready for flight. This was a disadvantage, as todays climb around the a/f were weak. What was required was to sit in 2kts, be patient then depart HIGH. I managed to make it to base at 13:41 and set off in an up cycle - happy about that. First leg, flew a nice line to the 1st TP while doing my own thing. The TP approaching, I planned to be low then climb high back into the course on the 2nd leg. I judged that a climb just after the TP where one other competitor was just pulling into, would slow me down - ie, to miss each other in the centering process, and climb efficiently. I pushed on, hindsight - not a good idea really, as it would've been a reasonable climb for the time in the task. So I pushed on, spent the first half of the task bumbling along in weak climbs to try and find the right one. All between 1-2,000'AGL, but always moving along. Thankfully I picked the lower levels 'pattern of the day' easily. Every farmhouse that had a green field or dam surrounded by black ploughed fields worked. 3.3kt for 3,500' - I'm back on my way. From here on in, it was fairly straight forward. I'm happy with my final glide today, leaving on a zero glide (3.0MC) to build it up to 700 above, before 30km from home, poling it over for a nice straight in approach. What will tomorrow bring? ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING: Qld States, Day 2
http://www.onlinecontest.org/olc-2.0/gliding/flightinfo.html?dsId=2762650 www.facebook.com/W3Racing www.tinyurl.com/W3Tracking Stats for the day... 307.7km @ 95.64km/hr; 4.5kts (23%); 45:1 for 16.3km glides @ an average cruise speed of 131km/hr; Extra 17km covered in deviations (weakness appearing??) Weather, varying. Weak and reasonable height pre-start. First leg, reasonable under CU. 2nd leg, higher bases and stronger climbs. 3rd leg, streeting. 4th leg, lowering bases and approaching sea-breeze and convergence - moving into strong winds below 2000' AGL to make approaches fun to watch! I was very happy with my planned start time, though dissapointed how I executed it. Started ~300' to low, then took a weak climb soon after to figure out whether I really wanted to start. Stupid, lost 1/2kph there for sure. Once on the way though, it was reasonably straight forward. The 2nd leg, indescicive all the way. The problem, the large scrub area to cross. Far right saw better CU's and a line of them, but would take me wayyy out of the sector, the left was nothing spectacular, and direct had nice CU's though patchy. I after lots of moving around, I forced myself to take the direct route. Thanks to the ClearNav's final glide ring (aka the omeba?), I was confident to make the dash. 4.8kt climbs were the reward, though I was still slow due to the cross-headwind and the terrain (not being able to drive low). The 3rd leg, was started from the blue with a tidy little climb - then it was onto a highway of CU's to max out the NE sector. All the time, keeping my eye on home, I think I can do it! Run home, 100km. Three routings. Left towards the convergence, but some good but patchy CU's approaching - including a blue hole which potentially could put me on the deck. Direct, fair and reasonable. Far FAR right, higher bases, sun on the ground, and finish from 90* to track - but this @ the time, might be the only way to finish the task... I decide to go to the convergence. The first few climbs and glides were good until I read my note: Win by not losing. So I took a 45* turn off course to the center, rewarded with a nice climb to near base. Now 30* back to the convergence, rewarded with reasonable climbs and cruises. Leaving for home on a 3kt MC and 700 over. Once around the back of the sea-breeze, it was smooth. Bump up the speed.. Looking ahead though, I was still keen to be conservative. So I asked for the QNH the wind. I lost 100' in the QNH change and the wind was far stronger on the ground, than at alt. Slow down boy! Once at the eye-ball stage of the final glide, I started to lose out big time. I knew I could make the finish line - but how much speed would I cross the boundary fence? In the end, plenty 70kts - I'm home! What will tomorrow bring? ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING: Qld States, Day 2
No link to the scores on the comp website but go to http://www.soaringspot.com/gq2012/results/ ROSS From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Adam Woolley Sent: Monday, 1 October 2012 7:00 PM To: Aus Soaring Subject: [Aus-soaring] BORING: Qld States, Day 2 http://www.onlinecontest.org/olc-2.0/gliding/flightinfo.html?dsId=2762650 www.facebook.com/W3Racing www.tinyurl.com/W3Tracking Stats for the day... 307.7km @ 95.64km/hr; 4.5kts (23%); 45:1 for 16.3km glides @ an average cruise speed of 131km/hr; Extra 17km covered in deviations (weakness appearing??) Weather, varying. Weak and reasonable height pre-start. First leg, reasonable under CU. 2nd leg, higher bases and stronger climbs. 3rd leg, streeting. 4th leg, lowering bases and approaching sea-breeze and convergence - moving into strong winds below 2000' AGL to make approaches fun to watch! I was very happy with my planned start time, though dissapointed how I executed it. Started ~300' to low, then took a weak climb soon after to figure out whether I really wanted to start. Stupid, lost 1/2kph there for sure. Once on the way though, it was reasonably straight forward. The 2nd leg, indescicive all the way. The problem, the large scrub area to cross. Far right saw better CU's and a line of them, but would take me wayyy out of the sector, the left was nothing spectacular, and direct had nice CU's though patchy. I after lots of moving around, I forced myself to take the direct route. Thanks to the ClearNav's final glide ring (aka the omeba?), I was confident to make the dash. 4.8kt climbs were the reward, though I was still slow due to the cross-headwind and the terrain (not being able to drive low). The 3rd leg, was started from the blue with a tidy little climb - then it was onto a highway of CU's to max out the NE sector. All the time, keeping my eye on home, I think I can do it! Run home, 100km. Three routings. Left towards the convergence, but some good but patchy CU's approaching - including a blue hole which potentially could put me on the deck. Direct, fair and reasonable. Far FAR right, higher bases, sun on the ground, and finish from 90* to track - but this @ the time, might be the only way to finish the task... I decide to go to the convergence. The first few climbs and glides were good until I read my note: Win by not losing. So I took a 45* turn off course to the center, rewarded with a nice climb to near base. Now 30* back to the convergence, rewarded with reasonable climbs and cruises. Leaving for home on a 3kt MC and 700 over. Once around the back of the sea-breeze, it was smooth. Bump up the speed.. Looking ahead though, I was still keen to be conservative. So I asked for the QNH the wind. I lost 100' in the QNH change and the wind was far stronger on the ground, than at alt. Slow down boy! Once at the eye-ball stage of the final glide, I started to lose out big time. I knew I could make the finish line - but how much speed would I cross the boundary fence? In the end, plenty 70kts - I'm home! What will tomorrow bring? ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING: Qld States, Day 2
Go! Adam Go! Great write ups nice decision making processes. Well done, keep it up and good luck. Simon ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Good on you Adam. Think just how much better that Cirrus will go with the new skid on . Sent them today, snail mail. Patch - Original Message - From: Adam Woolley go_soar...@hotmail.com To: Aus-Soaring aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Monday, 17 September, 2012 6:48:45 AM (GMT+1000) Auto-Detected Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Wow. Just wow. What a great weekend. Just epic soaring conditions. Amazing camaraderie many more hooked new JAG's! Both days sporting average climbs of 5kts to 8,000'QNH under CU filled skies. Saturday the 15th September. With the sky looking soarable from 09:30 , both James 'Dutters' Dutschke, Lisa Turner and I looked skyward while preparing our gliders madly. James arriving from BNE requiring a rig of his newly acquired Open Libelle. Lisa just going with the flow I think, and myself finishing up the weighing of W3 to finalise the Form2. We finally get airborne with a declared task of Tansey - Ban Ban X - Kingaroy. Which was later modified in flight to return home via Kumbia to give a total task length of 240km. Ivan being the gentleman he is, decided to return from his task to race around ours - calling before start 8kt climbs around to 7,000' for memory. Weak climbs in the Kingaroy area though, we were slow to climb. 2kts was all that was around, so slowly we spiralled to the wisps. All together in the start cylinder we naturally set off at 13:05 (!). Both of the first two climbs, 4.5kts we ease into the task nicely. All talking together on routing options, we decided to overfly Wondai and link up to a highway (street) to the first turn. The smiles fast growing, the speeds pushing up. 89:1 for a 34km glide at 75kts - before coring 7.5kts for a 1000'. Around the 1st turn, we take a detour to top up before heading into the slightly higher countryside. Before bouncing along with a couple of 5kt climbs. Dutters, Lisa and I all working nicely together. All sharing the lead and picking nice climbs. Around the 2nd turn, we take a slightly more curious approach. The sky in the Ban Ban area has some spread out. Once we're up and running though, we come up to a big decision point. Lots of discussion, conversing with Ivan up ahead - we somehow managed to split up, due to some miscommunication I suppose. Lisa and I down the Kingaroy valley, Dutters going direct into the lighter CU. We note the time, it's time to slow down and be a little more cautious. We all manage to link back up together approaching Kumbia, working nice lines of energy in the potentially approaching sea breeze. Onto final glide, easy. Thanks very much to Lisa whom provided some valuable coaching advice during the flight, had a great time! W3's stats for the day: 240km @ 111.03km/hr; 5.1kt (20%) climbs; 41:1 for 16.4km glides at an average cruise speed of 77kts. Flying 5km extra in task deviations. Sunday the 16th September. Learning from yesterday, and looking at XCSkies - I thought the day would be soarable from 09:30 . With 9 or more gliders making it to the grid at 09:25 - it was sure to be a good day. The task planned on the grid, thanks to HK BB - was a fantastic one for the today. Though with the sky we saw, we could've gone anywhere and had a ball. 8kt climbs around (if you jagged one) with 8,000' under CU. I launched first at 10am , with Dutters, Rhys Porter Lisa Turner soon to follow - I'd climbed easily to 4,500' in 2kts. The whole local area was peppered with small CU, each of them were working. Once we were all up together, there wasn't going to be any waiting around for the big wings (VIT, HK, BB). The task: Cecil City - Chinchilla - Murgon - Kingaroy = 406km The first leg was rather pleasant and uneventful, crossing the bunya's with ease. Up ahead from Bell onwards, the sky over Dalby to Cecil city looks like it's going to rain! Staying high, we use the energy lines where we can - running the downwind edge of the clouds. James and I take one weak climb to stay connected, before putting the running shoes back on. Lisa had taken a route more Dalby way, cruising along nicely I saw. Turning for Chinchilla, across wind now. There were no real classic streeting options to go for, so just one cloud after another. I made an error, chasing some CU's to the west of track - before finally getting into the lower height bands again and having to diverge back towards the original direct track (out landing options to allow me to drive low if need be). Dutters and I had gotten split up prior to the 1st turn, so I radioed to him that it'd be best to race down the direct track. We manage to get back together overhead Kogan, was great to see you off my wingtip then mate! Sadly though, it wasn't to last, after just 5 minutes of cruising we were separated enough to have to fly our own races for a while. I jagged a 7.9kt climb just around the Chinchilla turn, before blasting off at cloud base. From here
[Aus-soaring] Boring
Wow. Just wow. What a great weekend. Just epic soaring conditions. Amazing camaraderie many more hooked new JAG's! Both days sporting average climbs of 5kts to 8,000'QNH under CU filled skies. Saturday the 15th September. With the sky looking soarable from 09:30, both James 'Dutters' Dutschke, Lisa Turner and I looked skyward while preparing our gliders madly. James arriving from BNE requiring a rig of his newly acquired Open Libelle. Lisa just going with the flow I think, and myself finishing up the weighing of W3 to finalise the Form2. We finally get airborne with a declared task of Tansey - Ban Ban X - Kingaroy. Which was later modified in flight to return home via Kumbia to give a total task length of 240km. Ivan being the gentleman he is, decided to return from his task to race around ours - calling before start 8kt climbs around to 7,000' for memory. Weak climbs in the Kingaroy area though, we were slow to climb. 2kts was all that was around, so slowly we spiralled to the wisps. All together in the start cylinder we naturally set off at 13:05(!). Both of the first two climbs, 4.5kts we ease into the task nicely. All talking together on routing options, we decided to overfly Wondai and link up to a highway (street) to the first turn. The smiles fast growing, the speeds pushing up. 89:1 for a 34km glide at 75kts - before coring 7.5kts for a 1000'. Around the 1st turn, we take a detour to top up before heading into the slightly higher countryside. Before bouncing along with a couple of 5kt climbs. Dutters, Lisa and I all working nicely together. All sharing the lead and picking nice climbs. Around the 2nd turn, we take a slightly more curious approach. The sky in the Ban Ban area has some spread out. Once we're up and running though, we come up to a big decision point. Lots of discussion, conversing with Ivan up ahead - we somehow managed to split up, due to some miscommunication I suppose. Lisa and I down the Kingaroy valley, Dutters going direct into the lighter CU. We note the time, it's time to slow down and be a little more cautious. We all manage to link back up together approaching Kumbia, working nice lines of energy in the potentially approaching sea breeze. Onto final glide, easy. Thanks very much to Lisa whom provided some valuable coaching advice during the flight, had a great time! W3's stats for the day: 240km @ 111.03km/hr; 5.1kt (20%) climbs; 41:1 for 16.4km glides at an average cruise speed of 77kts. Flying 5km extra in task deviations. Sunday the 16th September. Learning from yesterday, and looking at XCSkies - I thought the day would be soarable from 09:30. With 9 or more gliders making it to the grid at 09:25 - it was sure to be a good day. The task planned on the grid, thanks to HK BB - was a fantastic one for the today. Though with the sky we saw, we could've gone anywhere and had a ball. 8kt climbs around (if you jagged one) with 8,000' under CU. I launched first at 10am, with Dutters, Rhys Porter Lisa Turner soon to follow - I'd climbed easily to 4,500' in 2kts. The whole local area was peppered with small CU, each of them were working. Once we were all up together, there wasn't going to be any waiting around for the big wings (VIT, HK, BB). The task: Cecil City - Chinchilla - Murgon - Kingaroy = 406km The first leg was rather pleasant and uneventful, crossing the bunya's with ease. Up ahead from Bell onwards, the sky over Dalby to Cecil city looks like it's going to rain! Staying high, we use the energy lines where we can - running the downwind edge of the clouds. James and I take one weak climb to stay connected, before putting the running shoes back on. Lisa had taken a route more Dalby way, cruising along nicely I saw. Turning for Chinchilla, across wind now. There were no real classic streeting options to go for, so just one cloud after another. I made an error, chasing some CU's to the west of track - before finally getting into the lower height bands again and having to diverge back towards the original direct track (out landing options to allow me to drive low if need be). Dutters and I had gotten split up prior to the 1st turn, so I radioed to him that it'd be best to race down the direct track. We manage to get back together overhead Kogan, was great to see you off my wingtip then mate! Sadly though, it wasn't to last, after just 5 minutes of cruising we were separated enough to have to fly our own races for a while. I jagged a 7.9kt climb just around the Chinchilla turn, before blasting off at cloud base. From here, is where the fun really began. Long streets were starting to line up, the key - get nice climbs just before connection and it was all systems go. Miss the first climb, things could've got interesting. Why? The terrain wasn't to friendly. Thankfully it was all in our favour, as we bounced along close to base - linking some nice
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
Video of the fun had on the weekend: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxoVHG1vuT0 Cheers, WPP On 2012-07-02 01:40:05 + Bernie Sue size...@iprimus.com.au wrote: How nice to have a flying report on this forum, especially during winter. Thanks Adam. -Original Message- From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Adam Woolley Sent: Sunday, 1 July 2012 6:39 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] BORING G'day All, Thought I'd put a boring report together of my weekend soaring activity in the KING-A-ROY area. Saturday was a non-rostered tug pilot day, thankfully though with a few phone calls we were lucky enough to get a launch at 1300 - not one launch, but 5 of them for the hungry pilots that wouldn't accept no gliding for an answer. Thanks DMF! I spoke with Colin's passengers (who took to the sky in the DUO) afterwards, they had a ball enjoyed an evening out at the club, before checking out the area on four wheels on Sunday. Conditions saw an average of 2kt climbs around the area, even though they were regular enough under very lightly spaced wisps - I didn't venture outside of glide. Partly because the paddocks were quite wet in areas, fine elsewhere. I flew alongside Simon Don up to heights of 6,500' - thanks for the company. W3 is performing well, though with everything so well sealed, it's blowing out the high pressure air out the wing-gap seals = strategically placed vent required? I landed in the smooth conditions at 1530 after climbing in a weak climb earlier - great to be airborne again after 10wks off! I received a phone call from the Trotters saying that they'll be up on Sunday, I naturally responded 'great, the weather is looking better for an XC flight'. In the end, jagged that one - it was much better than forecast! We launched at 1140 into weak conditions under a CU filled sky. Thankfully after a 1/2hr, conditions improved stayed that way. Declared task of Kumbia, Murgon home. Thankfully mother nature took it's place set up an epic street that we couldn't resist! I asked the Trotters what their goal was for the day, they responded with 'just to pay particular attention to having fun, working on communications'. We promptly abandoned the task to fly what looked like a great line. It was. All three of us in close proximity, cruising down the line, just playing. My first L/D was 167:1 for 50km, before running into a 7.1kt climb for 1100'. From there after we turned around, all of us flying 78km at a staggering 277:1 ! We were joined by Colin Simon on this street, turning for Murgon approx 11km to the SE of Nanango. Off the freight train into regular XC conditions. The paddocks below we're like lakes, thankfully the climbs were still there - working 4kts to the North. Overhead Murgon the Trotters got the jump, climbing in a nice 5kt climb. I was close by, but slow to react persisting with my 3kt climb to long. We decided to keep tracking North on the track line towards Windera, before pulling the pin approx 15km from the turn. Changing gears now, we start topping up in weaker climbs taking bigger deviations as we enter areas of uncertainty blue holes. Lisa surging ahead now, picked up a climb over head Woroolin to get a marginal final glide in. Pete had a slightly better run landed quite a number of minutes ahead. I took a similar route to Lisa, though topped up over Wondai in a weak climb for the same marginal glide - knew I was home as I crossed the 7km point! All in all a great winters day, 211km at 89.8kph; 3.7kt climbs (17%); 64:1 for 21.7km glides at 60kts. Movie to follow in a few days! Where we're you? WPP P.S. off to Moresby for the first time on Tuesday, to start my induction into Air Niugini. To date, I've passed my ground school F100 sim training. Let the next part of my adventure begin, hopefully it brings as much gliding in the coming season as it did last!! ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
So that's what a cloud street looks like. It's been so wet down here (NSW Central Coast) I got excited about 1 knot to 2500 in the blue a few weeks back. Arie On 2/07/2012 5:32 PM, Adam Woolley wrote: Video of the fun had on the weekend: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxoVHG1vuT0 Cheers, WPP On 2012-07-02 01:40:05 + Bernie Sue size...@iprimus.com.au wrote: How nice to have a flying report on this forum, especially during winter. Thanks Adam. -Original Message- From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Adam Woolley Sent: Sunday, 1 July 2012 6:39 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] BORING G'day All, Thought I'd put a boring report together of my weekend soaring activity in the KING-A-ROY area. Saturday was a non-rostered tug pilot day, thankfully though with a few phone calls we were lucky enough to get a launch at 1300 - not one launch, but 5 of them for the hungry pilots that wouldn't accept no gliding for an answer. Thanks DMF! I spoke with Colin's passengers (who took to the sky in the DUO) afterwards, they had a ball enjoyed an evening out at the club, before checking out the area on four wheels on Sunday. Conditions saw an average of 2kt climbs around the area, even though they were regular enough under very lightly spaced wisps - I didn't venture outside of glide. Partly because the paddocks were quite wet in areas, fine elsewhere. I flew alongside Simon Don up to heights of 6,500' - thanks for the company. W3 is performing well, though with everything so well sealed, it's blowing out the high pressure air out the wing-gap seals = strategically placed vent required? I landed in the smooth conditions at 1530 after climbing in a weak climb earlier - great to be airborne again after 10wks off! I received a phone call from the Trotters saying that they'll be up on Sunday, I naturally responded 'great, the weather is looking better for an XC flight'. In the end, jagged that one - it was much better than forecast! We launched at 1140 into weak conditions under a CU filled sky. Thankfully after a 1/2hr, conditions improved stayed that way. Declared task of Kumbia, Murgon home. Thankfully mother nature took it's place set up an epic street that we couldn't resist! I asked the Trotters what their goal was for the day, they responded with 'just to pay particular attention to having fun, working on communications'. We promptly abandoned the task to fly what looked like a great line. It was. All three of us in close proximity, cruising down the line, just playing. My first L/D was 167:1 for 50km, before running into a 7.1kt climb for 1100'. From there after we turned around, all of us flying 78km at a staggering 277:1 ! We were joined by Colin Simon on this street, turning for Murgon approx 11km to the SE of Nanango. Off the freight train into regular XC conditions. The paddocks below we're like lakes, thankfully the climbs were still there - working 4kts to the North. Overhead Murgon the Trotters got the jump, climbing in a nice 5kt climb. I was close by, but slow to react persisting with my 3kt climb to long. We decided to keep tracking North on the track line towards Windera, before pulling the pin approx 15km from the turn. Changing gears now, we start topping up in weaker climbs taking bigger deviations as we enter areas of uncertainty blue holes. Lisa surging ahead now, picked up a climb over head Woroolin to get a marginal final glide in. Pete had a slightly better run landed quite a number of minutes ahead. I took a similar route to Lisa, though topped up over Wondai in a weak climb for the same marginal glide - knew I was home as I crossed the 7km point! All in all a great winters day, 211km at 89.8kph; 3.7kt climbs (17%); 64:1 for 21.7km glides at 60kts. Movie to follow in a few days! Where we're you? WPP P.S. off to Moresby for the first time on Tuesday, to start my induction into Air Niugini. To date, I've passed my ground school F100 sim training. Let the next part of my adventure begin, hopefully it brings as much gliding in the coming season as it did last!! ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
[Aus-soaring] BORING
G'day All, Thought I'd put a boring report together of my weekend soaring activity in the KING-A-ROY area. Saturday was a non-rostered tug pilot day, thankfully though with a few phone calls we were lucky enough to get a launch at 1300 - not one launch, but 5 of them for the hungry pilots that wouldn't accept no gliding for an answer. Thanks DMF! I spoke with Colin's passengers (who took to the sky in the DUO) afterwards, they had a ball enjoyed an evening out at the club, before checking out the area on four wheels on Sunday. Conditions saw an average of 2kt climbs around the area, even though they were regular enough under very lightly spaced wisps - I didn't venture outside of glide. Partly because the paddocks were quite wet in areas, fine elsewhere. I flew alongside Simon Don up to heights of 6,500' - thanks for the company. W3 is performing well, though with everything so well sealed, it's blowing out the high pressure air out the wing-gap seals = strategically placed vent required? I landed in the smooth conditions at 1530 after climbing in a weak climb earlier - great to be airborne again after 10wks off! I received a phone call from the Trotters saying that they'll be up on Sunday, I naturally responded 'great, the weather is looking better for an XC flight'. In the end, jagged that one - it was much better than forecast! We launched at 1140 into weak conditions under a CU filled sky. Thankfully after a 1/2hr, conditions improved stayed that way. Declared task of Kumbia, Murgon home. Thankfully mother nature took it's place set up an epic street that we couldn't resist! I asked the Trotters what their goal was for the day, they responded with 'just to pay particular attention to having fun, working on communications'. We promptly abandoned the task to fly what looked like a great line. It was. All three of us in close proximity, cruising down the line, just playing. My first L/D was 167:1 for 50km, before running into a 7.1kt climb for 1100'. From there after we turned around, all of us flying 78km at a staggering 277:1 ! We were joined by Colin Simon on this street, turning for Murgon approx 11km to the SE of Nanango. Off the freight train into regular XC conditions. The paddocks below we're like lakes, thankfully the climbs were still there - working 4kts to the North. Overhead Murgon the Trotters got the jump, climbing in a nice 5kt climb. I was close by, but slow to react persisting with my 3kt climb to long. We decided to keep tracking North on the track line towards Windera, before pulling the pin approx 15km from the turn. Changing gears now, we start topping up in weaker climbs taking bigger deviations as we enter areas of uncertainty blue holes. Lisa surging ahead now, picked up a climb over head Woroolin to get a marginal final glide in. Pete had a slightly better run landed quite a number of minutes ahead. I took a similar route to Lisa, though topped up over Wondai in a weak climb for the same marginal glide - knew I was home as I crossed the 7km point! All in all a great winters day, 211km at 89.8kph; 3.7kt climbs (17%); 64:1 for 21.7km glides at 60kts. Movie to follow in a few days! Where we're you? WPP P.S. off to Moresby for the first time on Tuesday, to start my induction into Air Niugini. To date, I've passed my ground school F100 sim training. Let the next part of my adventure begin, hopefully it brings as much gliding in the coming season as it did last!! ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
How nice to have a flying report on this forum, especially during winter. Thanks Adam. -Original Message- From: aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net [mailto:aus-soaring-boun...@lists.internode.on.net] On Behalf Of Adam Woolley Sent: Sunday, 1 July 2012 6:39 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] BORING G'day All, Thought I'd put a boring report together of my weekend soaring activity in the KING-A-ROY area. Saturday was a non-rostered tug pilot day, thankfully though with a few phone calls we were lucky enough to get a launch at 1300 - not one launch, but 5 of them for the hungry pilots that wouldn't accept no gliding for an answer. Thanks DMF! I spoke with Colin's passengers (who took to the sky in the DUO) afterwards, they had a ball enjoyed an evening out at the club, before checking out the area on four wheels on Sunday. Conditions saw an average of 2kt climbs around the area, even though they were regular enough under very lightly spaced wisps - I didn't venture outside of glide. Partly because the paddocks were quite wet in areas, fine elsewhere. I flew alongside Simon Don up to heights of 6,500' - thanks for the company. W3 is performing well, though with everything so well sealed, it's blowing out the high pressure air out the wing-gap seals = strategically placed vent required? I landed in the smooth conditions at 1530 after climbing in a weak climb earlier - great to be airborne again after 10wks off! I received a phone call from the Trotters saying that they'll be up on Sunday, I naturally responded 'great, the weather is looking better for an XC flight'. In the end, jagged that one - it was much better than forecast! We launched at 1140 into weak conditions under a CU filled sky. Thankfully after a 1/2hr, conditions improved stayed that way. Declared task of Kumbia, Murgon home. Thankfully mother nature took it's place set up an epic street that we couldn't resist! I asked the Trotters what their goal was for the day, they responded with 'just to pay particular attention to having fun, working on communications'. We promptly abandoned the task to fly what looked like a great line. It was. All three of us in close proximity, cruising down the line, just playing. My first L/D was 167:1 for 50km, before running into a 7.1kt climb for 1100'. From there after we turned around, all of us flying 78km at a staggering 277:1 ! We were joined by Colin Simon on this street, turning for Murgon approx 11km to the SE of Nanango. Off the freight train into regular XC conditions. The paddocks below we're like lakes, thankfully the climbs were still there - working 4kts to the North. Overhead Murgon the Trotters got the jump, climbing in a nice 5kt climb. I was close by, but slow to react persisting with my 3kt climb to long. We decided to keep tracking North on the track line towards Windera, before pulling the pin approx 15km from the turn. Changing gears now, we start topping up in weaker climbs taking bigger deviations as we enter areas of uncertainty blue holes. Lisa surging ahead now, picked up a climb over head Woroolin to get a marginal final glide in. Pete had a slightly better run landed quite a number of minutes ahead. I took a similar route to Lisa, though topped up over Wondai in a weak climb for the same marginal glide - knew I was home as I crossed the 7km point! All in all a great winters day, 211km at 89.8kph; 3.7kt climbs (17%); 64:1 for 21.7km glides at 60kts. Movie to follow in a few days! Where we're you? WPP P.S. off to Moresby for the first time on Tuesday, to start my induction into Air Niugini. To date, I've passed my ground school F100 sim training. Let the next part of my adventure begin, hopefully it brings as much gliding in the coming season as it did last!! ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
At 06:39 PM 1/07/2012, you wrote: W3 is performing well, though with everything so well sealed, it's blowing out the high pressure air out the wing-gap seals = strategically placed vent required? I have a mold for a JS1 style vent if you want to make yourself one. No little wing thingy for it yet but that will be done around the end of July. Mike Borgelt Instruments - design manufacture of quality soaring instrumentation since 1978 www.borgeltinstruments.com tel: 07 4635 5784 overseas: int+61-7-4635 5784 mob: 042835 5784: int+61-42835 5784 P O Box 4607, Toowoomba East, QLD 4350, Australia ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
Went gliding on Saturday 11th Sep. at Beverley, WA Nice lift under Cu's/SCu to 5,000'. Fun had by all. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
Despite the big wet on the East coast, we had a lovely sunny autumn's day at BSS on Saturday 25th. (Rain during the non flying days would be very welcome). Climbs to 5,000' were acheived in rapidly cycling thermals (ok; nothing like the Bunyan wave). Training flights were being carried out. We had four AEFs as well. Everyone had a fun time. Thanks to all who helped out to make the day possible in all their various roles. Michael ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
After the explosions settled down, he stuck his head above the parapet. He surveyed the scorched earth before him and declared: I went gliding last Saturday at BSS. I did emergency procedures with a trainee. I sent someone solo. I flew an Air Experience Flight. But not all in the same flight though. He sat down. Smiled to himself and thought, Gee, that was fun. Must do it again sometime soon... ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Well it was just one of those days really, spent some time in the Oly going around, up and down, and covered a bit of country, best height was 3,200 feet. regards JR - Original Message - Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Hey JR, I spent the best 10 minutes of my life in the LS 3 a, and didn't even get back to the launch point. Ended up on the cross strip. I decided it might be better to just put it away. Spent even more great times cleaning the shortwing GRX of all the dust from the last few months that have dumped on it. I mean it just doesn't get any better does it? I took the DG 300 to Di's birthday and we are both very much in the VERY VERY GOOD books. Rigged, it looks fantastic. There is only one small problem, when she sits in it she dissappears. Phil could have saved thousands by just getting a half scale one. Keep having as much fun as you can and keep practicing for next rally. cheers Patch - Original Message - From: JR jma99...@bigpond.net.au To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Sunday, January 25, 2009 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Well it was just one of those days really, spent some time in the Oly going around, up and down, and covered a bit of country, best height was 3,200 feet. regards JR - Original Message - Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Never mind the good books, where's the bloody cheque book ?I had a ball today, you shoulda been here.. JR - Original Message - From: Patching patch...@westnet.com.au To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Sunday, January 25, 2009 8:31 PM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Hey JR, I spent the best 10 minutes of my life in the LS 3 a, and didn't even get back to the launch point. Ended up on the cross strip. I decided it might be better to just put it away. Spent even more great times cleaning the shortwing GRX of all the dust from the last few months that have dumped on it. I mean it just doesn't get any better does it? I took the DG 300 to Di's birthday and we are both very much in the VERY VERY GOOD books. Rigged, it looks fantastic. There is only one small problem, when she sits in it she dissappears. Phil could have saved thousands by just getting a half scale one. Keep having as much fun as you can and keep practicing for next rally. cheers Patch - Original Message - From: JR jma99...@bigpond.net.au To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Sunday, January 25, 2009 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Well it was just one of those days really, spent some time in the Oly going around, up and down, and covered a bit of country, best height was 3,200 feet. regards JR - Original Message - Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
At Beverley Soaring Society last Saturday. Lovely streeting lift to 5,500' AMSL (limited by cloudbase). Strong post frontal wind out of the WSW. Had a 75min flight in the DG1000, took my nephew for an introductory flight, had him thermalling (in a fashion) by the end of the flight. Had difficulty coming down due to the strong lift. Much fun had by all. Many thanks to all those who helped run the day. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
Hello Brian At the Beverley Soaring Society, we have a comprehensive Access program we commissioned about 14 years ago. Its had the odd refinement over the years and works well. Members flight and account information is also posted to our web site. Members can look at from many years ago up to recent data. We are in the process of implementing an Excel front end for direct input of flight information on the airfield. Currently, input to Access is done by our logkeeper using our written log sheets. The transfer of data from the daily Excel file to the Access system will still be done by our logkeeper. Excel is the most suitable as a front-end for use on the airfield. However, Access is much more suitable for storing the data and assigning costs to members accounts. The access system has been set up to satisfy our particular way of doing things. Let me know if you would like to look further at what we have. Regards Greg Beecroft _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian and Karen Sent: Tuesday, 19 June 2007 7:08 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff At Boonah we have been using the Gliding Club Computer Program for some time to track our members flying accounts. The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly setout and only available as a text file. We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel, that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website. Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task, has anyone out there already done this..? Regards Brian Gilby Boonah Club No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/07 3:02 PM ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
Hi Brian I believe we at Waikerie have been looking at some software from WA RTO/S James Cooper who works with Quicken and has developed a customised for gliding Version of quicken. Someone on the group would have his contact details, or they should be available on the GFA website Regards Dave L _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian and Karen Sent: Tuesday, 19 June 2007 8:38 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff At Boonah we have been using the Gliding Club Computer Program for some time to track our members flying accounts. The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly setout and only available as a text file. We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel, that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website. Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task, has anyone out there already done this..? Regards Brian Gilby Boonah Club No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/07 3:02 PM ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
I will tell you one thing an hour meter and air switch is the best way bar none to do a maintance release. In old days at Keepit I would land old Berg after last flight and before the tail was turned around I could have the hours written up (I would guess the no of launches and was usually correct +/- one flight and some days gliders were doing 20 to 35 flights) - The crap these days of entering things into computer and maybe 1 hour later the data is available for writing up the MR - Hour meter/air switch is the only way to go for Maintance Release Ian M - Original Message - From: erich wittstock To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 1:13 PM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff Dear boring club members I thought that I am the only one thinking about this but no! Now, here is a real challenge: There are clubs out there that are using commercial accounting packages i.e. Quick(en)Books, MYOB etc. How do those clubs take care of pilot's logs and glider logs? We are required to keep track of flight movements as per MOSP: 14.1.11 Keeping of records. All clubs must compile and keep such logbooks, flight records and time sheets as will enable an accurate record of the club's flying operations to be maintained. These records must be made available to the RTO/Ops or the CTO/Ops on request. There are a few of free-ware versions of gliding club software packages available - unfortunately most of them are in German - which makes them useless. Respectable clubs are entering data on-the-go on a laptop on the flight line - a simple double click enters take/off and landing time. Pilot's names / glider rego's etc are selected from drop down menus... Could our QLD gliding branch or even the GFA come up with a decent program / plug-in (QB, MYOB) / spreadsheet / database for everyone to use. Even the tax department is providing a free version which is usable. The Gliding Club Computer Program is quite ok but a bit dated. I have seen a prototype of the on-line booking system. It looks like to me that we all need a record system for log books, an accounting system and maybe on-line booking system. Would it be effective to do this as a combined effort for every club in Australia? That would free up more members to recruit and keep member retention up. If Ian Perkins should read this how about it? all the best Erich (a useless treasurer...) On 6/19/07, Brian and Karen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At Boonah we have been using the Gliding Club Computer Program for some time to track our members flying accounts. The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly setout and only available as a text file. We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel, that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website. Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task, has anyone out there already done this..? Regards Brian Gilby Boonah Club No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/07 3:02 PM ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.1/857 - Release Date: 6/20/2007 2:18 PM ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
At Boonah we have been using the “Gliding Club Computer Program” for some time to track our members flying accounts. The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly setout and only available as a text file. We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel, that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website. Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task, has anyone out there already done this..? Regards Brian Gilby Boonah Club No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/07 3:02 PM ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
Hi Brian, Contact me offline Dave Shorter email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Note - no au in address) 11 Lighthouse Crescent Emerald Beach NSW 2456 Ph/Fax: (02)6656 1979 - Original Message - From: Brian and Karen To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2007 9:07 PM Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff At Boonah we have been using the “Gliding Club Computer Program” for some time to track our members flying accounts. The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly setout and only available as a text file. We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel, that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website. Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task, has anyone out there already done this..? Regards Brian Gilby Boonah Club No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/07 3:02 PM -- ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring E-mail message checked by PC Tools Spyware Doctor (5.0.0.186) Database version: 5.07530 http://www.pctools.com/spyware-doctor/ ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
Be careful of database size with Access! The older version ('95?) only
was stable to 1GB then became notoriously unreliable. M/soft proudly
announced that they'd doubled the stability size in later versions to
2GB, carefully omitting that each record was double the size of the
previous version...
Brian and Karen wrote:
At Boonah we have been using the “Gliding Club Computer Program” for
some time to track our members flying accounts.
The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly
setout and only available as a text file.
We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel,
that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website.
Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task,
has anyone out there already done this..?
Regards
Brian Gilby
Boonah Club
--
Regards,
..
--\ __ /--
\(..)/
-;\/;-
::
--::--
//..\\
VVVV
'//||\\`
''``
Peregrine!
Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground, and miss.
--- Ford Prefect
___
Aus-soaring mailing list
Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
To check or change subscription details, visit:
http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
Interesting! However Peter, are you in a position to estimate/guesstimate
the data base size required for an application such as Brian is suggesting -
assuming say a base load case of 100 members?
Gary
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of PTB
Sent: Tuesday, 19 June 2007 9:47 PM
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
Be careful of database size with Access! The older version ('95?) only
was stable to 1GB then became notoriously unreliable. M/soft proudly
announced that they'd doubled the stability size in later versions to
2GB, carefully omitting that each record was double the size of the
previous version...
Brian and Karen wrote:
At Boonah we have been using the “Gliding Club Computer Program” for
some time to track our members flying accounts.
The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly
setout and only available as a text file.
We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel,
that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website.
Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task,
has anyone out there already done this..?
Regards
Brian Gilby
Boonah Club
--
Regards,
..
--\ __ /--
\(..)/
-;\/;-
::
--::--
//..\\
VVVV
'//||\\`
''``
Peregrine!
Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground, and miss.
--- Ford Prefect
___
Aus-soaring mailing list
Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
To check or change subscription details, visit:
http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/2007
3:02 PM
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/2007
3:02 PM
___
Aus-soaring mailing list
Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net
To check or change subscription details, visit:
http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
And me Cheers Derek (02) 9342 8241 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian and Karen Sent: Tuesday, 19 June 2007 9:08 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff At Boonah we have been using the Gliding Club Computer Program for some time to track our members flying accounts. The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly setout and only available as a text file. We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel, that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website. Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task, has anyone out there already done this..? Regards Brian Gilby Boonah Club No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/07 3:02 PM ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
We have been using a logging program I wrote in Access since 1996. It has over 32,000 flights in it to date with no stability problems -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian and Karen Sent: Tuesday, 19 June 2007 9:08 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff At Boonah we have been using the Gliding Club Computer Program for some time to track our members flying accounts. The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly setout and only available as a text file. We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel, that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website. Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task, has anyone out there already done this..? Regards Brian Gilby Boonah Club No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/07 3:02 PM ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
Brian, Can you contact me off line -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian and Karen Sent: Tuesday, 19 June 2007 9:08 PM To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff At Boonah we have been using the Gliding Club Computer Program for some time to track our members flying accounts. The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly setout and only available as a text file. We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel, that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website. Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task, has anyone out there already done this..? Regards Brian Gilby Boonah Club No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/07 3:02 PM ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Admin Stuff
Dear boring club members I thought that I am the only one thinking about this but no! Now, here is a real challenge: There are clubs out there that are using commercial accounting packages i.e. Quick(en)Books, MYOB etc. How do those clubs take care of pilot's logs and glider logs? We are required to keep track of flight movements as per MOSP: 14.1.11 Keeping of records. All clubs must compile and keep such logbooks, flight records and time sheets as will enable an accurate record of the club's flying operations to be maintained. These records must be made available to the RTO/Ops or the CTO/Ops on request. There are a few of free-ware versions of gliding club software packages available - unfortunately most of them are in German - which makes them useless. Respectable clubs are entering data on-the-go on a laptop on the flight line - a simple double click enters take/off and landing time. Pilot's names / glider rego's etc are selected from drop down menus... Could our QLD gliding branch or even the GFA come up with a decent program / plug-in (QB, MYOB) / spreadsheet / database for everyone to use. Even the tax department is providing a free version which is usable. The Gliding Club Computer Program is quite ok but a bit dated. I have seen a prototype of the on-line booking system. It looks like to me that we all need a record system for log books, an accounting system and maybe on-line booking system. Would it be effective to do this as a combined effort for every club in Australia? That would free up more members to recruit and keep member retention up. If Ian Perkins should read this how about it? all the best Erich (a useless treasurer...) On 6/19/07, Brian and Karen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At Boonah we have been using the Gliding Club Computer Program for some time to track our members flying accounts. The program runs OK, but the members accounts reports are very poorly setout and only available as a text file. We were going to write a new program based around Access or Excel, that would allow use to upload logs/accounts to our website. Before we over commit ourselves to this involved and frustrating task, has anyone out there already done this..? Regards Brian Gilby Boonah Club No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.9.0/853 - Release Date: 18/06/07 3:02 PM ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] boring
Went for a blast in the fox today, the fog didn't lift until 12:30 in the afternoon, and it was back in here at 16:30 short day but a lot of fun. regards JR - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 10:24 AM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] one man rigging aid Laurie McKinly at Benalla makes these. Terry alan dean writes: Hi, I am in the market for a one man rigging aid for my LS3. I am trying to source one from Oz. Does anyone have any idea's. Cheers Alan. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] Boring
Vintage Glider Rally Boring There were 18 vintage gliders at Bordertown, plus the Bordertown gliders,and a Luton Minor and Tiger Moth'We flew everyday, a total of 288 launches. 3,137.6 Kms. were flown. heights of 11,000 feet were achieved by those who had oxygen,did I mention we flew everyday from the 7th. to the 14th. Yee Harr, its so great to be alive Regards JR Olympia Fabulous Soaring Squad Original Message - ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
Controversial topic follows... Beverley Soaring Society Sunday 27th Nov 2005. Thunderstorms went through overnight. Greeted with a strong easterly, used RWY 08. Wind dropped off. Lift to 4,000' initially. Moved to RWY 34. Day improving. Lift to at least 6,000', strong sink around too. Daryl McKay and Andrew Huggins jumped the fence and did at least 200 km's (best climbs to 9,000' near Cunderdin). Moved to RWY 16, although the wind aloft (above 3,000' AMSL) was from the north! It was a hot, crispy day. The entire club fleet was flying. Everyone had their fill. Thanks to all who helped out. M.T. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING Sunday 23rd Oct at BSS
A tuggy's perspective of Sunday 23rd Oct at Beverley Soaring Society, WA. 34 tows requiring 210 minutes flying time (I was a busy lad). The talented Mr. Eckey visited and was running a coaching course, with small lead and follow tasks set. Blue day with lift to 4,500' that broke through to 6,000' later on. Thanks to all the helpers, Roll on summer Michael Texler ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
WA had a public holiday yesterday (26th Sep. 2005). One word summary of spring-time gliding at Beverley Soaring Society: LOVELY The day started up at around midday and closed down around 4.30 pm. Lift to 6,800' (cloudbase) although the best lift worked to 6,000'. Fairly strong NW wind at altitude. The ASK-21, Puchacz, Single Astir, Std. Jantar plus WUM and ZU were airborne. Come on Summer ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
BSS Sunday, 28 Aug, 2005. Started wet and raining, wind NW. Swung to SW, showers stopped. Cloudbase 2,500' to 3,000'. Operated from RWY 26. Flew the Puch for my Annual Flight Review. Then there were some check flights. Then flew by myself in the Puch, nice to fly something that spins properly ;-) Then we packed up and went home early. Michael T. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
Beverley soaring society, Sun, June 19. Good day despite all the recent rain. Who says that gliding is a summer sport? Initially windy from WSW. Using RWY 26. 16 flights. Longest flight, 58 minutes (came down through choice). Thermals to cloudbase at 3,700'. Yours truly was the tug pilot all day. The first tow of the day was a memorabl one to 7,000' to drop Kevin Saunders off to Cunderdin (he was flying GCWA's Blanik back home after it was kindly loaned to BSS for instructor training). It was lovely and smooth above the clouds. To give you an idea of the wind, it took 10 minutes to get to the drop off point above Greenhills silo, but almost 20 minutes to get back to Beverley). M.T. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
He's gone so native that he has also ended up the other side of the emu fence and the various rabbit proof fences!! Redmond - Original Message - From: Mark Newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Monday, 30 May 2005 11:00 Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING Texler, Michael wrote: Beverley Soaring Society, Out west on the correct side of the dog proof fence. You've gone native, haven't you? - mark :-) I tried an internal modem,[EMAIL PROTECTED] but it hurt when I walked. Mark Newton - Voice: +61-4-1620-2223 - Fax: +61-8-82231777 - ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
those avgas powered thermals are pretty handy on a non soarable day. ;) - Original Message - From: Texler, Michael [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Monday, May 30, 2005 11:13 AM Subject: [Aus-soaring] BORING Beverley Soaring Society, Out west on the correct side of the dog proof fence. Sun 29th May 2005 Temp mid 20's, lovely sunny day. Inversion at 2,000'. Nothing really soarable. In excess of 25 flights. Nice and smooth conditions, great day for trainees. The Cunderdin GCWA Blanik arrived (Ian few it) and we were dismayed, how could it get to BSS on such a non-soarable day. The secret was a 7,000' aerotow! Thanks to everyone who helped out. M.T. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
Beverley Soaring Society, Out west on the correct side of the dog proof fence. Sun 29th May 2005 Temp mid 20's, lovely sunny day. Inversion at 2,000'. Nothing really soarable. In excess of 25 flights. Nice and smooth conditions, great day for trainees. The Cunderdin GCWA Blanik arrived (Ian few it) and we were dismayed, how could it get to BSS on such a non-soarable day. The secret was a 7,000' aerotow! Thanks to everyone who helped out. M.T. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
You lucky lucky bugga, on the bright side, at least you were flying.JR - Original Message - From: simon holding [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Sunday, May 22, 2005 11:41 AM Subject: RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring Alice Springs - clear day - 7000' - and stuck in the back of the '28 all day. Fun is best. Simon -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Sent: Sunday, 22 May 2005 10:06 AM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Fun is the key to ecstasy, Regards JR - Original Message - From: Ashford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 7:25 PM Subject: RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring I would have said it died at 0.6 kt but as long as you had fun. Regards John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Sent: Saturday, 21 May 2005 7:40 PM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring I only said the day died, I did not say what caused the day to die..!JR - Original Message - From: Ashford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 7:10 PM Subject: RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring As I recall 1500hrs in Milicent would have been sunset at this time of year. Regards John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Sent: Saturday, 21 May 2005 7:27 PM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Not bad at Millicent, cloudbase was only 2400, but had fun anyway.6 knot climbs, day died at around 1500 hours. regards JR - Original Message - From: John Parncutt [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 5:54 PM Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Great day at Bacchus Marsh today! starting with some early wave (I missed out but our early starting CFI had a good flight). Then after lunch the CU's started popping with cloud base at 4500 and good 5 to 6 knot climbs. Of course those who read the lousy forecast or who only fly during the summer months missed out on a great day. John parncutt VMFG ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.14 - Release Date: 20/05/2005 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.14 - Release Date: 20/05/2005 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring at Balak' ...
Terry Neumann wrote: stared with the despair and disbelief at the now empty bottle. Yes, it was a right-royal tragedy that will take therapy to overcome. I will be suggesting to the committee that nothing short of a Royal Commission will be satisfactory to sort out how this could possibly have happened. At least Bert is off to Thailand for his therapy. Hic' Leigh Bunting Colonel Light Gardens South Australia Open Windows and let the bugs in ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring at Balak' ...
Depends whether it was core or non core. Ian P. Kookaburra Precision Soaring Team - Original Message - From: Leigh Bunting [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Sunday, May 22, 2005 10:25 PM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring at Balak' ... Terry Neumann wrote: stared with the despair and disbelief at the now empty bottle. Yes, it was a right-royal tragedy that will take therapy to overcome. I will be suggesting to the committee that nothing short of a Royal Commission will be satisfactory to sort out how this could possibly have happened. At least Bert is off to Thailand for his therapy. Hic' Leigh Bunting Colonel Light Gardens South Australia Open Windows and let the bugs in ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring
I would have said it died at 0.6 kt but as long as you had fun. Regards John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Sent: Saturday, 21 May 2005 7:40 PM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring I only said the day died, I did not say what caused the day to die..!JR - Original Message - From: Ashford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 7:10 PM Subject: RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring As I recall 1500hrs in Milicent would have been sunset at this time of year. Regards John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Sent: Saturday, 21 May 2005 7:27 PM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Not bad at Millicent, cloudbase was only 2400, but had fun anyway.6 knot climbs, day died at around 1500 hours. regards JR - Original Message - From: John Parncutt [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 5:54 PM Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Great day at Bacchus Marsh today! starting with some early wave (I missed out but our early starting CFI had a good flight). Then after lunch the CU's started popping with cloud base at 4500 and good 5 to 6 knot climbs. Of course those who read the lousy forecast or who only fly during the summer months missed out on a great day. John parncutt VMFG ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.14 - Release Date: 20/05/2005 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.14 - Release Date: 20/05/2005 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Fun is the key to ecstasy, Regards JR - Original Message - From: Ashford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 7:25 PM Subject: RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring I would have said it died at 0.6 kt but as long as you had fun. Regards John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Sent: Saturday, 21 May 2005 7:40 PM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring I only said the day died, I did not say what caused the day to die..!JR - Original Message - From: Ashford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 7:10 PM Subject: RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring As I recall 1500hrs in Milicent would have been sunset at this time of year. Regards John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Sent: Saturday, 21 May 2005 7:27 PM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Not bad at Millicent, cloudbase was only 2400, but had fun anyway.6 knot climbs, day died at around 1500 hours. regards JR - Original Message - From: John Parncutt [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 5:54 PM Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Great day at Bacchus Marsh today! starting with some early wave (I missed out but our early starting CFI had a good flight). Then after lunch the CU's started popping with cloud base at 4500 and good 5 to 6 knot climbs. Of course those who read the lousy forecast or who only fly during the summer months missed out on a great day. John parncutt VMFG ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.14 - Release Date: 20/05/2005 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.14 - Release Date: 20/05/2005 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring
Alice Springs - clear day - 7000' - and stuck in the back of the '28 all day. Fun is best. Simon -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Sent: Sunday, 22 May 2005 10:06 AM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Fun is the key to ecstasy, Regards JR - Original Message - From: Ashford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 7:25 PM Subject: RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring I would have said it died at 0.6 kt but as long as you had fun. Regards John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Sent: Saturday, 21 May 2005 7:40 PM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring I only said the day died, I did not say what caused the day to die..!JR - Original Message - From: Ashford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 7:10 PM Subject: RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring As I recall 1500hrs in Milicent would have been sunset at this time of year. Regards John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Sent: Saturday, 21 May 2005 7:27 PM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring Not bad at Millicent, cloudbase was only 2400, but had fun anyway.6 knot climbs, day died at around 1500 hours. regards JR - Original Message - From: John Parncutt [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 5:54 PM Subject: [Aus-soaring] Boring Great day at Bacchus Marsh today! starting with some early wave (I missed out but our early starting CFI had a good flight). Then after lunch the CU's started popping with cloud base at 4500 and good 5 to 6 knot climbs. Of course those who read the lousy forecast or who only fly during the summer months missed out on a great day. John parncutt VMFG ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.14 - Release Date: 20/05/2005 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.14 - Release Date: 20/05/2005 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] Boring at Balak' ...
Saturday did not look promising at Balaklava. High cloud covered the sky, the exact wind direction was to remain a matter of ongoing conjecture until the sea breeze arrived later and sorted it out. We had to rig both the 21's after their visit to the Copper Coast the previous weekend. It was revealed that ZBG had a flat front tyre. The tube was beyond human repair so a new one was fitted. It was then discovered that the newly inflated tyre would not fit back in the wheel well, so it had to be deflated, installed and then re-inflated. Just as well we have an air compressor in almost every hangar. This would have been a good time to call it all off and open the bar. When we eventually got to flying, lift was hard to find and circuits became the norm - some being extended slightly in very broken and weak lift. After a couple of mutuals, I was offered a solo adventure in ZBG. I accepted the last minute request from Bert Heath to come along for the ride, after all, we would surely be back after about 8 minutes at best. Expecting the obvious, we agreed that I would do the launch and he would do the rest. We were in for a pleasant surprise; Bert found a modest thermal over the edge of Whitwarta and patiently worked 1.2 knots on the trusty Borgelt averager to around 3,000 feet. I managed to extract a further 600 feet from the remnants, and we spent the rest of the time just flying around the countryside at 42 kts watching the lesser mortals doing circuits below. The flight lasted some 54 minutes. Delightful! Other club members shared in our joy and happiness upon our triumphant return with generous and animated reproductions of Churchill's famous victory salute . We reciprocated in like spirit. Leigh completed his work on the Grunau ( the main one) and did a couple of test flights, and we were all feeling quite happy with the way it had all turned out. The day was to finish badly however In laying the cable for the last flight, we managed the mother of all tangles on the winch drum. The flight was abandoned and the best part of an hour was spent sorting out the mess before darkness promised to add a new dimension to the tragedy. Lessons were learned from this. The consensus was that it was probably the worst tangle most of us could remember in the past twenty or thirty years. (I should perhaps mention that there was a brief discussion about simply putting the winch back in the shed and leaving it for the Sunday crew to sort it out, but chivalry and honour prevailed ... ) Alas, things were to get even worse After the first round of drinks, it was discovered to the extreme horror of those involved that the supply of Bundy had run out, and there was no more to be found!!! Some were struck dumb by the implications of this discovery. Too shocked to be able to either to speak or act they stared with the despair and disbelief at the now empty bottle. Others gave vent to their anguish with loud blood curdling howls of dismay which will surely haunt those who were there for days, perhaps years to come. Right terrible it were. These were grown men too. As I took my leave (there are advantages in being a beer drinker) the Bundy boys were busily calculating just how the remaining measure of the precious fluid might be equitably divided amongst those devotees who remained. They may still be discussing in fine detail just how this might be done. An interesting day from every point of view. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
Beverley Soaring Society, Saturday, April 30 Grey overacast. 17 Flights, before the rain set in, occasionally less than 1 octa cloud at 1,500 AGL, very pretty to tow above. No lift. Training flights and check rides. Josh Went solo, Liz Suthers did some more solo flying after a check ride, Ross converted to the Twin Astir I. Your's truly did the towplane warm up flight (500' circuit, fun). Did the conversion flight with Ross in the Twin I. Flew with Liz is the ASK 21. I then did some tow plane flying. Thanks to Dave Wellington for instructing Josh and sending him solo. Thanks to Phil for doing most of the towing earlier in the day. I had heaps of fun, it was great to be flying. I am grateful to warm welcome extended to me as a new member and instructor at BSS. ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING an explanation
The recent thread about BORING was hilarious. I don't know if I can lay claim the title (can anyone else?), but it was in response to some particularly heated discussions on aus-soaring at the end of 2000 and early 2001. The discussions became more personal, white hot and less related to gliding activity. So I gathered that actually talking about the day's flying was quite BORING in comparison to these incandescently hot invectives appearing on aus-soaring at the time. Yes the title BORING was meant to be ironic. Having a title BORING [Tongue in cheek reference to actually how much fun gliding is] was too long. I might experiment with other titles if people think that BORING is too boring (perhaps others such as, DUSTY, HOT, GRIMY, DRY, WET, OFITTH, FUN) ;-) ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
RE: [Aus-soaring] BORING REPORT - A Stinker of a Day
I'll second Marks comments. I was heading in the other direction, although I doubt either he or I could of picked the others car on the opposite side of the road. I called it 'Brown Out', with significant stretches of the road with visibility down to a few meters as an entire paddocks worth of dust, grass (and perhaps rabbits and small sheep) engulfed the road (but no sign of Dorothy or the wicked witch of the west). You could only stop and wait or crawl along following the left hand white line (praying that some insane bastard didn't ram you from behind whilst doing some stupid speed). Fortunately Justine and I ended up in a bit of a convoy crawling along (except for the crazy truck driver at the rear who wanted to overtake everyone) and playing follow the leader. Still very scary seeing the car in front disappear completely from view even though he is only a few car lengths in front. People the following morning reported at least one car had left the road at speed and clobbered a tree. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Newton Sent: Sunday, 3 April 2005 2:32 PM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING REPORT - A Stinker of a Day The dust intensified through the evening: Driving back to Adelaide after dark was like driving through brown fog, with tumbleweeds jumping chaotically across the road at 50km/h and the occasional drift of even heavier dust that cut visibility to zero for a few seconds. I definitely wasn't driving in VMC. - mark I tried an internal modem,[EMAIL PROTECTED] but it hurt when I walked. Mark Newton - Voice: +61-4-1620-2223 - Fax: +61-8-82231777 - ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
RE: [Aus-soaring] BORING REPORT - A Stinker of a Day
Title: RE: [Aus-soaring] BORING REPORT - A Stinker of a Day -Original Message- From: Mark Newton I was dumb enough to spend the day instructing: circuits in 36 deg temperatures. Wow. Awe-inspiring. Should do it more often. Not. Been there, done that. For a change (?) on Saturday I was in the tug. 22 launches at about 35 degrees all day. Not noticeably cooler at the top of the launch either. An interesting day nonetheless! Phil Ritchie and Richard Skinner both pushed out to Burra (100km to the north) which took them a couple of hours each. As Leigh noted in his email, about 60kts headwind and neither of them needed to thermal on the way back. Both were limited to 8500' and Phil reported one 12 knot thermal (shortly after leaving an 8 knot one!). We gave up winch ops at about 5:15pm when the winch driver reported that he wasn't prepared to perform any more launches because he couldn't see the glider at the top of the launch At about the same time ASC also packed up and went inside. Once again, it wasn't so much the wind, but the muck in the air which had been there all day began to close in on the airfield. Regards SWK ** This email and any file attachments are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please tell us immediately by return email and delete the document. The information in this email expresses the opinion of the author and does not necessarily represent the views of ETSA Utilities. ** ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING REPORTS
Bragging On Recent Interesting Nearby Gliding. BORING Reports can now be submitted without connotation. A bad day gliding always beats a good day working, tell us all about em, I reckon. Wayne Carter [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free, probably, but I wouldnt trust it if I were you, as you just never know Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.859 / Virus Database: 585 - Release Date: 14/02/2005 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING REPORT - A Stinker of a Day
In our part of SA, yesterday was a stinker. The wind at ground level was knocking on 25kts. The sky was brown and the temp was in the high 30's. Not many turned up at Whitwarta - surprise, surprise! I had the first winch launch which topped out at 2000' AGL in the K21. Although I signaled for less speed than the 60kts I was getting, I wasn't to know that the winch driver had the drum stopped. Solo, I like the speed at the low end of the range. The biggest surprise was actually finding some workable lift after release. Bloody hard to work but on occasion showing 5kts on the averager. With the horrendous drift , working anything less than 4kts was pointless. Poking the nose into wind, the K21 had Grunau performance in still air. With the thermals strung out pencil thin, it was easier just to float through them at minimal airspeed with the nose into wind, unless there was a good core that was anything like workable. However, I managed to wind up to the inversion level at 6200 QNH. What a weird sight. I can't ever recall anything similar. The mostly cirrus covered sky above was the usual brilliant blue, however from the inversion level down it was like being inside a brown tube. There was no horizon. While below, vis. was reduced in dust, there was up to 40km vis. in directions where the paddocks were'nt airborne. Bernard and Eric in th ASH25, actually managed to push a 100km upwind. They had wind of 57kph on the nose. Our other K21 eventually got to Snowtown, deciding not to stop at the bank. None of us needed to thermal to get home. It sounded like conditions were somewhat different east of the Mt Lofty ranges. Anyone from Barossa/AUGC/Waikerie like to fill us in? -- Leigh Bunting Colonel Light Gardens South Australia Open Windows and let the bugs in ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING REPORT - A Stinker of a Day
Leigh Bunting wrote: It sounded like conditions were somewhat different east of the Mt Lofty ranges. Anyone from Barossa/AUGC/Waikerie like to fill us in? The wind was about the same, but it didn't start to get badly dusty until late afternoon. I was dumb enough to spend the day instructing: circuits in 36 deg temperatures. Wow. Awe-inspiring. Should do it more often. Not. My longest flight was ten minutes when one of our recently solo pilots in a checkflight found a weak thermal and stayed in it until we both decided we'd drifted too far downwind. Derek Spencer took an AEF in our Motorfalke for 40 minutes, exploring some of the lift coming off the ranges (out of reach of a winch launch). When he got back he decided to repeat the attempt with one of the club's Boomerang syndicate owners, and by motoring over to Truro they managed to catch the frontal lift from the cool change which they rode until they were at 8000' over The Gums. Bastards. By that time visibility had become pretty crap, and they had to follow the Sturt Highway to find the airfield. We gave up winch ops at about 5:15pm when the winch driver reported that he wasn't prepared to perform any more launches because he couldn't see the glider at the top of the launch well enough to discern speed signals due to the layer of dust. The dust intensified through the evening: Driving back to Adelaide after dark was like driving through brown fog, with tumbleweeds jumping chaotically across the road at 50km/h and the occasional drift of even heavier dust that cut visibility to zero for a few seconds. I definitely wasn't driving in VMC. - mark I tried an internal modem,[EMAIL PROTECTED] but it hurt when I walked. Mark Newton - Voice: +61-4-1620-2223 - Fax: +61-8-82231777 - ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
Simon Hackett wrote: the simple metric of taking the hull value and dividing by 1000 to get the effective hourly rate works quite well. Hmmm. So I bought my Grunau Baby (airworthy, including trailer) in the early '70s for $600. What 's that work out to - - 60 cents per hour. :-D Of course there has been some expenditure in the last 30 years, especially the last 5 years, but it still works out at $15/hour and I still have a truck load of fun. -- Leigh Bunting Colonel Light Gardens South Australia Open Windows and let the bugs in ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
RE: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
By any measure Mike you underestimate the costs of owning your own glider. Try to get to grips with the following: 1. Red Wright wrote in Soaring April 1964 A letter to Editor and it is reprinted in Joe Lincolns book On Quiet Wings page 51 onwards about he got caught up in the simple, inexpensive recreation of soaring to which he had transitioned from being a 6000 hour power pilot. After training costs, he got to fly solo and subsequently to progress he had of course to buy his own glider which he duly did. He lists the costs of training and then the costs of obtaining his glider and operating it, including all that 'must have' instrumentation. (Borgelt Instruments being not yet around at the time to sever you from your hard earned dollars in trade for the magical wonder instrument, there were nevertheless many other instrument makers practicing that art on the hapless likes of Red Wright.) After a while of solo operations comes the time where he has to get into contest flying to progress in the sport. He lists the costs of doing this. Contests aren't cheap in the USA if you have to pay someone else to tow your glider across continent while you remain working. (Our WA troops can relate to that.) So the contest bills add up and the costs per hour keeps climbing. At the competitive level of soaring you need to practice and fly the good days from your home site, so you have to take time off mid week because of course the best weather doesn't always coincide with the weekend. As an operator of a business this leads him to be out flying midweek when he should be tending the customers, and so on one deal, being away flying, he looses $66,000 of one customers business. He works out his ultimate cost for 125 hours soaring as totalling $96.164.84, ie $12.82 per minute. At that time it cost aparently $12 per minute to run a Boeing 707, but he doesn't want the conclusion drawn from this that soaring is an expensive sport by comparison. Red's article is an utterly delightful read (at least in my terms). 2. Closer to home. If I had bought Westpac shares in 1993 instead of my Janus CT I would now have around about 4 times capital appreciation on the shares, ie $600,000 (excluding dividends) from my original $160,000. Even after capital gains tax the increase would pay for almost unlimited hours at Tocumwal rates. Hmmm, and I used to think I was a rational person in owning my own glider. Definitely I have been away with the fairies. Roger Druce -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Borgelt Sent: Thursday, 10 March 2005 10:01 AM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring inAustralia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California At 03:05 PM 9/03/05 +1030, you wrote: Definitely one of the more memorable experiences of my North American trip. Also the most expensive flying I've ever done: that 2-hour flight cost US$200, including glider hire, instructor hire and tow-plane charter. I think the Australian system really has it all over the US system when it comes to the *cost* of flying; god knows how much it costs for a novice pilot to receive training over there when the instructor adds $60 per hour to the price of the flight. Given the same equipment and the a generally similar taxation regime the cost of flying is about the same everywhere. It really is just a question of who pays?. US$100ph is about A$130 currently. Take a look at Aero club charges for a C172 with instructor some time. You had a cheap flight! I know a bloke with a Discus 2. Say A$130,000. That's A$6500 at 5% which you can get easily from a bank. Actually you can get 6% right now. Insurance is A$5000. At 100 hours a year thats A$115 per hour right there without tows. Say 30 at A$30 per tow for another A$900 and about A$1000 for GFA, airworthiness fees and maintenance. A$13400 per annum so A$134 per hour for 100 hours a year. Even if he pays top marginal tax rate on the A$6500 it still ends up at A$100 per hour or more. We haven't even talked about depreciation. As for the novice pilot, the way to do it in the US is to learn to fly in a power plane(it's cheaper) and do a two day glider conversion later. Most of the US glider pilots I know have a power licence for this reason. Mike ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
RE: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
At 12:02 AM 11/03/05 +1100, you wrote: By any measure Mike you underestimate the costs of owning your own glider. Having owned at least one at a time since 1972 I know you are right! My post was a response to the most expensive flying where for US$200 Mark Newton had a unique, exciting and unexpected adventure. If anyone thinks that club flying is much ceaper just remember that there are fewer than 3 glider pilots per glider in Oz. Mike Borgelt Instruments - manufacturers of quality soaring instruments phone Int'l + 61 746 355784 fax Int'l + 61 746 358796 cellphone Int'l + 61 428 355784 Int'l + 61 429 355784 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] website: www.borgeltinstruments.com ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
Yes, but you would have bought OneTel and HIH instead... On 11/03/2005, at 12:02 AM, Roger Druce wrote: 2. Closer to home. If I had bought Westpac shares in 1993 instead of my Janus CT I would now have around about 4 times capital appreciation on the shares, ie $600,000 (excluding dividends) from my original $160,000. Even after capital gains tax the increase would pay for almost unlimited hours at Tocumwal rates. Hmmm, and I used to think I was a rational person in owning my own glider. Definitely I have been away with the fairies. Roger Druce ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
Careful Roger. Ian P. Kookaburra Precision Soaring Team - Original Message - From: Roger Druce [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.' aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Friday, March 11, 2005 12:02 AM Subject: RE: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California By any measure Mike you underestimate the costs of owning your own glider. Try to get to grips with the following: 1. Red Wright wrote in Soaring April 1964 A letter to Editor and it is reprinted in Joe Lincolns book On Quiet Wings page 51 onwards about he got caught up in the simple, inexpensive recreation of soaring to which he had transitioned from being a 6000 hour power pilot. After training costs, he got to fly solo and subsequently to progress he had of course to buy his own glider which he duly did. He lists the costs of training and then the costs of obtaining his glider and operating it, including all that 'must have' instrumentation. (Borgelt Instruments being not yet around at the time to sever you from your hard earned dollars in trade for the magical wonder instrument, there were nevertheless many other instrument makers practicing that art on the hapless likes of Red Wright.) After a while of solo operations comes the time where he has to get into contest flying to progress in the sport. He lists the costs of doing this. Contests aren't cheap in the USA if you have to pay someone else to tow your glider across continent while you remain working. (Our WA troops can relate to that.) So the contest bills add up and the costs per hour keeps climbing. At the competitive level of soaring you need to practice and fly the good days from your home site, so you have to take time off mid week because of course the best weather doesn't always coincide with the weekend. As an operator of a business this leads him to be out flying midweek when he should be tending the customers, and so on one deal, being away flying, he looses $66,000 of one customers business. He works out his ultimate cost for 125 hours soaring as totalling $96.164.84, ie $12.82 per minute. At that time it cost aparently $12 per minute to run a Boeing 707, but he doesn't want the conclusion drawn from this that soaring is an expensive sport by comparison. Red's article is an utterly delightful read (at least in my terms). 2. Closer to home. If I had bought Westpac shares in 1993 instead of my Janus CT I would now have around about 4 times capital appreciation on the shares, ie $600,000 (excluding dividends) from my original $160,000. Even after capital gains tax the increase would pay for almost unlimited hours at Tocumwal rates. Hmmm, and I used to think I was a rational person in owning my own glider. Definitely I have been away with the fairies. Roger Druce -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Borgelt Sent: Thursday, 10 March 2005 10:01 AM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring inAustralia. Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California At 03:05 PM 9/03/05 +1030, you wrote: Definitely one of the more memorable experiences of my North American trip. Also the most expensive flying I've ever done: that 2-hour flight cost US$200, including glider hire, instructor hire and tow-plane charter. I think the Australian system really has it all over the US system when it comes to the *cost* of flying; god knows how much it costs for a novice pilot to receive training over there when the instructor adds $60 per hour to the price of the flight. Given the same equipment and the a generally similar taxation regime the cost of flying is about the same everywhere. It really is just a question of who pays?. US$100ph is about A$130 currently. Take a look at Aero club charges for a C172 with instructor some time. You had a cheap flight! I know a bloke with a Discus 2. Say A$130,000. That's A$6500 at 5% which you can get easily from a bank. Actually you can get 6% right now. Insurance is A$5000. At 100 hours a year thats A$115 per hour right there without tows. Say 30 at A$30 per tow for another A$900 and about A$1000 for GFA, airworthiness fees and maintenance. A$13400 per annum so A$134 per hour for 100 hours a year. Even if he pays top marginal tax rate on the A$6500 it still ends up at A$100 per hour or more. We haven't even talked about depreciation. As for the novice pilot, the way to do it in the US is to learn to fly in a power plane(it's cheaper) and do a two day glider conversion later. Most of the US glider pilots I know have a power licence for this reason. Mike ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.6.2 - Release Date: 4/03/2005
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
Leigh, Thats the trouble with people who buy these things and then try to put a dollar cost on the sport. If I even thought about calculating the costs on my fleet I would have to factor in the fun. I reckon I would end up in the positive. We all should. Cheers all Ian P. Kookaburra Precision Soaring Team. - Original Message - From: Leigh Bunting [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2005 10:17 PM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California Simon Hackett wrote: the simple metric of taking the hull value and dividing by 1000 to get the effective hourly rate works quite well. Hmmm. So I bought my Grunau Baby (airworthy, including trailer) in the early '70s for $600. What 's that work out to - - 60 cents per hour. :-D Of course there has been some expenditure in the last 30 years, especially the last 5 years, but it still works out at $15/hour and I still have a truck load of fun. -- Leigh Bunting Colonel Light Gardens South Australia Open Windows and let the bugs in ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.6.2 - Release Date: 4/03/2005 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
Mark Newton wrote on his web-site: In the US, gliders are routinely left outside tied-down all year 'round. Most of the fleet at the Great Western Soaring School are either tied down or kept in their trailers. There were only two small hangars that I could see on the site. Sacrilege! :-) PeterS - Original Message - From: Boyd Munro [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2005 4:52 PM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California Mark, thank you for sharing this wonderful story with us. I rather liked the detailed explanation of one gets what one pays for, and the best bit was the innovative method of de-icing. Boyd Munro - Original Message - From: Mark Newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2005 4:35 AM Subject: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California Internode sent me to the US to set up our international gateway networks last month. I took a week and a half of leave at the end of it (why waste it when someone else paid the airfares? :-) and took the opportunity to do a bit of touring around the Western USA and British Columbia in Canada. My flight back to Australia was scheduled to leave LAX at 11:15pm on Saturday, and I didn't really want to spend the last day of my trip touring around a horrible stinking hole in the ground like Los Angeles. So I visited the Great Plains Soaring School at Crystalaire Airport about 80 miles North of LA, introduced myself to instructor Dale Masters and went for a fly. The weather was crap: a grey cloud blanket at 3000' AGL and pretty cold temperatures left little hope for thermals, and Dale and I were both expecting a circuit (but I wanted to do it anyway: I wasn't going to visit North America without logging at least ONE flight in a foreign country). So off we went, in high-tow behind an old Pawnee with a retractable tow-rope, aerotowing towards the mountains. We towed towards a bright-looking bit of cloud, and on the way it got a bit rough... and rougher... and rougher... then silky smooth. Hey! We found wave! So my circuit turned into 1h 55m in ridge and wave lift to 9800' soaring among snow-covered peaks in a DG-500 while the cloud slowly cleared into 3 octas of Cu and 1 octa of Lennies (!), with some aerobatics to come back down to pattern altitude at the end of the flight. http://slash.dotat.org/~newton/gallery/us-gliding/ Dale said he's been wave flying in these mountains for years, but he'd never found this particular wave system before. So it was a novel flight for both of us. Definitely one of the more memorable experiences of my North American trip. Also the most expensive flying I've ever done: that 2-hour flight cost US$200, including glider hire, instructor hire and tow-plane charter. I think the Australian system really has it all over the US system when it comes to the *cost* of flying; god knows how much it costs for a novice pilot to receive training over there when the instructor adds $60 per hour to the price of the flight. Having said that, Crystalaire is a commercial op, not a club, and that definitely affects the cost. I ended up going there because (a) it's the closest gliding operation to LA, with all the others at least 2.5 hours away, and (b) the non-commercial ops that I phoned during the week weren't sure if they'd be open due to the weather (the clubs at Tehachapi and California City had cancelled their weekend meetings due to the wintery weather forecast). I really didn't want to spend 2.5 hours on my last day in the US driving to an airfield only to find that it was closed and I'd have to spend 2.5 hours driving back again. In retrospect, considering the quality of the flight I had at Crystalaire, that was an excellent decision! If you're in the LA area, Crystalaire is about 1.5 hours North of LAX Airport. Take the northbound I-405 then use the I-5 to the northbound CA-14 to Palmdale. 29 miles up that road is an off-ramp to the Pearblossom Highway through Littlerock. Crystalaire is on 165th St East. Tell Dale I sent you :-) http://maps.google.com/maps?q=from%3A%20lax%20to%3A%2032810%20165th%20St%20E%2C%20Llano%2C%20CA%2093544ll=34.707031%2C-118.128684spn=1.109375%2C1.500993hl=en Finally: I can't close off without passing on thanks to Reg Moore and Bob Hall, who provided advice before I left on the path of least resistance for getting my flying credentials recognized in the US while I was away. As it happened I only had enough time to go flying once, so it wasn't worth the pain of going down the path towards getting a US license, but the fact that there were people there who could answer questions about that kind of thing was really good. The GFA has some great resources if you take the trouble to ask around. - mark I tried
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
At 03:05 PM 9/03/05 +1030, you wrote: Definitely one of the more memorable experiences of my North American trip. Also the most expensive flying I've ever done: that 2-hour flight cost US$200, including glider hire, instructor hire and tow-plane charter. I think the Australian system really has it all over the US system when it comes to the *cost* of flying; god knows how much it costs for a novice pilot to receive training over there when the instructor adds $60 per hour to the price of the flight. Given the same equipment and the a generally similar taxation regime the cost of flying is about the same everywhere. It really is just a question of who pays?. US$100ph is about A$130 currently. Take a look at Aero club charges for a C172 with instructor some time. You had a cheap flight! I know a bloke with a Discus 2. Say A$130,000. That's A$6500 at 5% which you can get easily from a bank. Actually you can get 6% right now. Insurance is A$5000. At 100 hours a year thats A$115 per hour right there without tows. Say 30 at A$30 per tow for another A$900 and about A$1000 for GFA, airworthiness fees and maintenance. A$13400 per annum so A$134 per hour for 100 hours a year. Even if he pays top marginal tax rate on the A$6500 it still ends up at A$100 per hour or more. We haven't even talked about depreciation. As for the novice pilot, the way to do it in the US is to learn to fly in a power plane(it's cheaper) and do a two day glider conversion later. Most of the US glider pilots I know have a power licence for this reason. Mike Borgelt Instruments - manufacturers of quality soaring instruments phone Int'l + 61 746 355784 fax Int'l + 61 746 358796 cellphone Int'l + 61 428 355784 Int'l + 61 429 355784 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] website: www.borgeltinstruments.com ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
Mike Borgelt wrote: I know a bloke with a Discus 2. Say A$130,000. That's [...] I tried the same calculations with my Stemme S10-VT once. I already had such a spreadsheet set up which had been used for my old SF-25C Motorfalke. So I plugged in the hull value of my S10-VT. At that point the spreadsheet columns turned into those '''s which mean you need to widen the columns because the numbers are too big to fit :) I just quietly put the spreadsheet away and realised that those calculations were just not going to stop me from indulging in my own aviation decisions, because I'd already made the decision to own the thing, whatever the numbers said (and in gliding, clearly, I'm not alone in that attitude - or a lot of us wouldn't be bothering). On the general notion of figuring out a notional hiring rate for gliders at typical 'glider' utilisations (circa 100 hrs/year for a private one), I have found that the simple metric of taking the hull value and dividing by 1000 to get the effective hourly rate works quite well. Taking your Discus example (because my Stemme example would just frighten the horses), that means $130,000 hull value - $130 per hour - which is consistent with your calculations. Obviously those numbers improve with higher utilisations, but the more expensive the glider, the more likely its going to peak around 100-150 per year because its probably a private aircraft, not a club one. (I have flown about 140 hours in my Stemme in the last 12 months). Cheers, Simon ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
RE: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
Simon says (sorry, couln't resist...) ...I just quietly put the spreadsheet away and realised that those calculations were just not going to stop me from indulging in my own aviation decisions, because I'd already made the decision to own the thing, whatever the numbers said (and in gliding, clearly, I'm not alone in that attitude - or a lot of us wouldn't be bothering). Cheers, Simon Exactly right Simon. If we ran our lives on economic analysis, we'd all be sitting around bored to pieces but financially well off. If you want to do it, and you can afford to do it (and it's legal and does no harm to anyone...), then go enjoy. That's all the justification you need. Allan Armistead ph (02) 6249 6470, fax (02) 6249 6555, mobile 0413 013 911 PO Box 908, Dickson ACT 2602, Australia When once you have tasted flight, you will always walk with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you always will be. Leonardo da Vinci, 1452-1519 BEGIN:VCARD VERSION:2.1 N:Armistead;Allan FN:Allan Armistead ORG:Allan Armistead Consulting International TEL;WORK;VOICE:(02) 6249-6470 TEL;HOME;VOICE:(02) 6249-6470 TEL;CELL;VOICE:0413 013 911 TEL;WORK;FAX:(02) 6249-6555 ADR;WORK:;;PO Box 908;DICKSON;ACT;2602;Australia LABEL;WORK;ENCODING=QUOTED-PRINTABLE:PO Box 908=0D=0ADICKSON, ACT 2602=0D=0AAustralia EMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:[EMAIL PROTECTED] REV:20020314T051104Z END:VCARD ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING in California
Internode sent me to the US to set up our international gateway networks last month. I took a week and a half of leave at the end of it (why waste it when someone else paid the airfares? :-) and took the opportunity to do a bit of touring around the Western USA and British Columbia in Canada. My flight back to Australia was scheduled to leave LAX at 11:15pm on Saturday, and I didn't really want to spend the last day of my trip touring around a horrible stinking hole in the ground like Los Angeles. So I visited the Great Plains Soaring School at Crystalaire Airport about 80 miles North of LA, introduced myself to instructor Dale Masters and went for a fly. The weather was crap: a grey cloud blanket at 3000' AGL and pretty cold temperatures left little hope for thermals, and Dale and I were both expecting a circuit (but I wanted to do it anyway: I wasn't going to visit North America without logging at least ONE flight in a foreign country). So off we went, in high-tow behind an old Pawnee with a retractable tow-rope, aerotowing towards the mountains. We towed towards a bright-looking bit of cloud, and on the way it got a bit rough... and rougher... and rougher... then silky smooth. Hey! We found wave! So my circuit turned into 1h 55m in ridge and wave lift to 9800' soaring among snow-covered peaks in a DG-500 while the cloud slowly cleared into 3 octas of Cu and 1 octa of Lennies (!), with some aerobatics to come back down to pattern altitude at the end of the flight. http://slash.dotat.org/~newton/gallery/us-gliding/ Dale said he's been wave flying in these mountains for years, but he'd never found this particular wave system before. So it was a novel flight for both of us. Definitely one of the more memorable experiences of my North American trip. Also the most expensive flying I've ever done: that 2-hour flight cost US$200, including glider hire, instructor hire and tow-plane charter. I think the Australian system really has it all over the US system when it comes to the *cost* of flying; god knows how much it costs for a novice pilot to receive training over there when the instructor adds $60 per hour to the price of the flight. Having said that, Crystalaire is a commercial op, not a club, and that definitely affects the cost. I ended up going there because (a) it's the closest gliding operation to LA, with all the others at least 2.5 hours away, and (b) the non-commercial ops that I phoned during the week weren't sure if they'd be open due to the weather (the clubs at Tehachapi and California City had cancelled their weekend meetings due to the wintery weather forecast). I really didn't want to spend 2.5 hours on my last day in the US driving to an airfield only to find that it was closed and I'd have to spend 2.5 hours driving back again. In retrospect, considering the quality of the flight I had at Crystalaire, that was an excellent decision! If you're in the LA area, Crystalaire is about 1.5 hours North of LAX Airport. Take the northbound I-405 then use the I-5 to the northbound CA-14 to Palmdale. 29 miles up that road is an off-ramp to the Pearblossom Highway through Littlerock. Crystalaire is on 165th St East. Tell Dale I sent you :-) http://maps.google.com/maps?q=from%3A%20lax%20to%3A%2032810%20165th%20St%20E%2C%20Llano%2C%20CA%2093544ll=34.707031%2C-118.128684spn=1.109375%2C1.500993hl=en Finally: I can't close off without passing on thanks to Reg Moore and Bob Hall, who provided advice before I left on the path of least resistance for getting my flying credentials recognized in the US while I was away. As it happened I only had enough time to go flying once, so it wasn't worth the pain of going down the path towards getting a US license, but the fact that there were people there who could answer questions about that kind of thing was really good. The GFA has some great resources if you take the trouble to ask around. - mark I tried an internal modem,[EMAIL PROTECTED] but it hurt when I walked. Mark Newton - Voice: +61-4-1620-2223 - Fax: +61-8-82231777 - ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California
Mark, thank you for sharing this wonderful story with us. I rather liked the detailed explanation of one gets what one pays for, and the best bit was the innovative method of de-icing. Boyd Munro - Original Message - From: Mark Newton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2005 4:35 AM Subject: [Aus-soaring] BORING in California Internode sent me to the US to set up our international gateway networks last month. I took a week and a half of leave at the end of it (why waste it when someone else paid the airfares? :-) and took the opportunity to do a bit of touring around the Western USA and British Columbia in Canada. My flight back to Australia was scheduled to leave LAX at 11:15pm on Saturday, and I didn't really want to spend the last day of my trip touring around a horrible stinking hole in the ground like Los Angeles. So I visited the Great Plains Soaring School at Crystalaire Airport about 80 miles North of LA, introduced myself to instructor Dale Masters and went for a fly. The weather was crap: a grey cloud blanket at 3000' AGL and pretty cold temperatures left little hope for thermals, and Dale and I were both expecting a circuit (but I wanted to do it anyway: I wasn't going to visit North America without logging at least ONE flight in a foreign country). So off we went, in high-tow behind an old Pawnee with a retractable tow-rope, aerotowing towards the mountains. We towed towards a bright-looking bit of cloud, and on the way it got a bit rough... and rougher... and rougher... then silky smooth. Hey! We found wave! So my circuit turned into 1h 55m in ridge and wave lift to 9800' soaring among snow-covered peaks in a DG-500 while the cloud slowly cleared into 3 octas of Cu and 1 octa of Lennies (!), with some aerobatics to come back down to pattern altitude at the end of the flight. http://slash.dotat.org/~newton/gallery/us-gliding/ Dale said he's been wave flying in these mountains for years, but he'd never found this particular wave system before. So it was a novel flight for both of us. Definitely one of the more memorable experiences of my North American trip. Also the most expensive flying I've ever done: that 2-hour flight cost US$200, including glider hire, instructor hire and tow-plane charter. I think the Australian system really has it all over the US system when it comes to the *cost* of flying; god knows how much it costs for a novice pilot to receive training over there when the instructor adds $60 per hour to the price of the flight. Having said that, Crystalaire is a commercial op, not a club, and that definitely affects the cost. I ended up going there because (a) it's the closest gliding operation to LA, with all the others at least 2.5 hours away, and (b) the non-commercial ops that I phoned during the week weren't sure if they'd be open due to the weather (the clubs at Tehachapi and California City had cancelled their weekend meetings due to the wintery weather forecast). I really didn't want to spend 2.5 hours on my last day in the US driving to an airfield only to find that it was closed and I'd have to spend 2.5 hours driving back again. In retrospect, considering the quality of the flight I had at Crystalaire, that was an excellent decision! If you're in the LA area, Crystalaire is about 1.5 hours North of LAX Airport. Take the northbound I-405 then use the I-5 to the northbound CA-14 to Palmdale. 29 miles up that road is an off-ramp to the Pearblossom Highway through Littlerock. Crystalaire is on 165th St East. Tell Dale I sent you :-) http://maps.google.com/maps?q=from%3A%20lax%20to%3A%2032810%20165th%20St%20E%2C%20Llano%2C%20CA%2093544ll=34.707031%2C-118.128684spn=1.109375%2C1.500993hl=en Finally: I can't close off without passing on thanks to Reg Moore and Bob Hall, who provided advice before I left on the path of least resistance for getting my flying credentials recognized in the US while I was away. As it happened I only had enough time to go flying once, so it wasn't worth the pain of going down the path towards getting a US license, but the fact that there were people there who could answer questions about that kind of thing was really good. The GFA has some great resources if you take the trouble to ask around. - mark I tried an internal modem,[EMAIL PROTECTED] but it hurt when I walked. Mark Newton - Voice: +61-4-1620-2223 - Fax: +61-8-82231777 - ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check
[Aus-soaring] Boring
Saturday was giving 6 knots to 8,500 at Port Augusta. Sunday was a slight improvement to somewhere above 9,000 (I was flying the concrete swan and by the time we thermalled 9000' I decided it was time to go hunting). Afraid I just used it for instructional purposes out around Quorn/Wilmington and to attempt to take photos straight down the Northern Power station stack! Saturday the thermals worked most of the day. Sunday they were wiped out by the sea breeze soon after 1600. Redmond ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
Saturday was giving 6 knots to 8,500 at Port Augusta. Sunday was a slight improvement to somewhere above 9,000 (I was flying the concrete swan and by the time we thermalled 9000' I decided it was time to go hunting). Afraid I just used it for instructional purposes out around Quorn/Wilmington and to attempt to take photos straight down the Northern Power station stack! Saturday the thermals worked most of the day. Sunday they were wiped out by the sea breeze soon after 1600. Redmond ** - Original Message - From: Pete Siddall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, 17 October 2004 8:20 Subject: [Aus-soaring] BORING Sunday started at Renmark with two gliders waiting to be rigged, but we didn't have enough people for that until lunchtime. Amid the usual calls of It's not engaged. Move it IN, and Hurry up, it's heavy I started hearing things like Wow, look at that sky. Some rapid glider preparation happened, and the first launch was at 2:20pm, Jim doing the evaluation flight on the Blanik. My launch was next, in the Hornet. I released into a changeable 3-4 knot thermal and clambered up, after a while spotting the Blanik above me. That can't be allowed to happen, but I couldn't get up to him. By persisting, some time after Jim had gone away I made it almost to 12,000 feet. Right, done that, nobody else wants the glider, so where now? I cruised off to the south-west, following clouds around a blue hole, and after a while I was at Wunkar topping up to 11,000. That was the last worthwhile climb I found, but it was enough to glide to Veitch and back to Renmark in still air, having done 120+ km. In a bit less time, David Campain had got to 10,000, and done Taplan - Lake Victoria - Renmark, 182 km, while evaluating the Mosquito. His best climb was an average 8.3 knots. I didn't find anything that good. It was a very pleasant afternoon. Anyone who had made a whole day of it could have done some reasonable distance. Any other stories? -- ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
Sunday started at Renmark with two gliders waiting to be rigged, but we didn't have enough people for that until lunchtime. Amid the usual calls of It's not engaged. Move it IN, and Hurry up, it's heavy I started hearing things like Wow, look at that sky. Some rapid glider preparation happened, and the first launch was at 2:20pm, Jim doing the evaluation flight on the Blanik. My launch was next, in the Hornet. I released into a changeable 3-4 knot thermal and clambered up, after a while spotting the Blanik above me. That can't be allowed to happen, but I couldn't get up to him. By persisting, some time after Jim had gone away I made it almost to 12,000 feet. Right, done that, nobody else wants the glider, so where now? I cruised off to the south-west, following clouds around a blue hole, and after a while I was at Wunkar topping up to 11,000. That was the last worthwhile climb I found, but it was enough to glide to Veitch and back to Renmark in still air, having done 120+ km. In a bit less time, David Campain had got to 10,000, and done Taplan - Lake Victoria - Renmark, 182 km, while evaluating the Mosquito. His best climb was an average 8.3 knots. I didn't find anything that good. It was a very pleasant afternoon. Anyone who had made a whole day of it could have done some reasonable distance. Any other stories? -- ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] Boring
Saturday was giving 6 knots to 8,500 at Port Augusta. Sunday was a slight improvement to somewhere above 9,000 (I was flying the concrete swan and by the time we thermalled 9000' I decided it was time to go hunting). Afraid I just used it for instructional purposes out around Quorn/Wilmington and to attempt to take photos straight down the Northern Power station stack! Saturday the thermals worked most of the day. Sunday they were wiped out by the sea breeze soon after 1600. Redmond ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
Well Greg, you chose the wrong day. On Sunday I finished off the Form 2 on the 13, had her rigged and ready to do the evaluation flight at 14:30 and did a very enjoyable hour of evaluating the old girl in climbs to 4 kts and the compulsory fun in between. Rgds - Rolf From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.[EMAIL PROTECTED] CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2004 11:46:04 +1000 I had a nice 28 minute flight in the Ventus GFN at Adelaide Soaring Club (ASC) at Gawler yesterday. Meanwhile on the Darling Downs the entire fleet and most of the private gliders were also airborne on Sunday. 9000 ft QNH and 8 - 10 kts was there for the taking with only the occasional minor annoyance of having to skirt or fly through a bit of rain. Grumble, all I got on Saturday at Bacchus Marsh was 26 minutes in the club's Jantar Standard 2. It just didn't want to stay in the air for some reason. Greg O'Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring _ FREE* Month of Movies with FOXTEL Digital: http://adsfac.net/link.asp?cc=FXT002.7542.0 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
Michael Texler wrote: I'm sure those on the aus-soaring list who are parents can identify with the above situation. All too true, I'm afraid. -- Leigh Bunting Colonel Light Gardens South Australia Open Windows and let the bugs in ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
RE: [Aus-soaring] BORING
I had a great weekend at AUGC's Lochiel airfield, even though the weather was very pleasant but with little convection happening Anyone not familiar with our club should have a look at www.augc.on.net Being a student club we have lots of keen young people which makes it a fun club to be in; Did some instructing and converted two of our 20 year old pilots to the Pik and another to the Standard Libelle, it's great to see these people having so much fun gliding. All they spoke about in the car on the way home was their next weekends flying! Cheers David -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 20 September 2004 11:16 AM To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING I had a nice 28 minute flight in the Ventus GFN at Adelaide Soaring Club (ASC) at Gawler yesterday. Meanwhile on the Darling Downs the entire fleet and most of the private gliders were also airborne on Sunday. 9000 ft QNH and 8 - 10 kts was there for the taking with only the occasional minor annoyance of having to skirt or fly through a bit of rain. Grumble, all I got on Saturday at Bacchus Marsh was 26 minutes in the club's Jantar Standard 2. It just didn't want to stay in the air for some reason. Greg O'Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
You are doing the easy part Michael. Hoping they come home alive is harder. With your job, yadda yadda, I know. Chris McDonnell - Original Message - From: Leigh Bunting [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 20 September 2004 10:13 PM Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING Michael Texler wrote: I'm sure those on the aus-soaring list who are parents can identify with the above situation. All too true, I'm afraid. -- Leigh Bunting Colonel Light Gardens South Australia Open Windows and let the bugs in ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] BORING
I had a nice 28 minute flight in the Ventus GFN at Adelaide Soaring Club (ASC) at Gawler yesterday. Lift was weak, and I boated around 2,000' AMSL and came down through choice. The entire ASC fleet was airborne at one stage! Due to the arrival of my daughter 3 months ago, I have had to curtail my instructional and towing responsibilities because I cannot commit to being away from home for a whole day (my wife would only see me for one day per week!). Now I am flying to keep current, and I am fortunate that I can do this at ASC. I'm sure those on the aus-soaring list who are parents can identify with the above situation. Michael T. P.S. I showed my wife and daughter the Ventus. You can never start too early with getting the kids interested! ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
I had a nice 28 minute flight in the Ventus GFN at Adelaide Soaring Club(ASC) at Gawler yesterday. Meanwhile on the Darling Downs the entire fleet and most of the privategliders were also airborne on Sunday. 9000 ft QNH and 8 - 10 kts was there for the taking with onlythe occasional minor annoyance of having to skirt or fly through a bit of rain. Alice and I cruised out to Chinchilla and then back for some local soaring beforelanding early so that we could de-rig her in preparation for Robert taking her to Kingaroy next week. Brian --Brian Wade Personal Computer ConceptsControl SPAM with MailWasher Pro Uniform Timehttp://www.uniformtime.com.au PO Box 114 INDOOROOPILLY QLD 4068Ph: 07 3371 2944 Fax: 07 3870 4103 ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] BORING
I had a nice 28 minute flight in the Ventus GFN at Adelaide Soaring Club (ASC) at Gawler yesterday. Meanwhile on the Darling Downs the entire fleet and most of the private gliders were also airborne on Sunday. 9000 ft QNH and 8 - 10 kts was there for the taking with only the occasional minor annoyance of having to skirt or fly through a bit of rain. Grumble, all I got on Saturday at Bacchus Marsh was 26 minutes in the club's Jantar Standard 2. It just didn't want to stay in the air for some reason. Greg O'Sullivan [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Boring report from Ireland
Ron Fox wrote: Hullo all from Dublin. This email should be printed, framed and put in every Australian gliding club house as a reminder how good we have it here. -- Leigh Bunting Colonel Light Gardens South Australia Open Windows and let the bugs in ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] Boring report from Ireland
Hullo all from Dublin. I have the pleasure of working in Ireland over what they called the summer... Top temperature has been 22C - on the rare occasions that the sun is out long enough to cause convection. Mostly it hovers around 15 - 18C. I think 4 days without rain is officially a drought. The Dublin Gliding Club is near Naas, 50kms WSW of Dublin at 500ft ASL. Civil airspace is 4500' but military restrictions usually only allow operations to 3000'. Thats OK because cloud base is usually around 2500 ASL. The strip is green and undulating over the brow of hill. It is more like golf course than an airfield, only the bunkers are missing but they are probably buried under the 2 feet of grass either side of the strip - winter silage feed crop. Thermals are challenging for a mediocre Aussie pilot, narrow, weak and far between. The outlanding sites look as big as my front lawn. I will never complain about Bacchus Marsh in the winter again! I take my hat off to the gallant band of glider pilots here, they run a good club and are keen. They have mastered the conditions and turn in some respectable flights. They claim a 50k flight here is the equivalent of a 300k in summer in OZ and I have to agree. I can't wait for the cold, dark and wetter Irish winter to see what challenging flying is all about - not. So all of you in QLD and NT, pray that you don't get transferred to Ireland. Mind you the Guinness is great! Cheers Ron Fox VMFG Dublin, Ireland. www.dublinglidingclub.ie ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
RE: [Aus-soaring] Boring Report
At 03:00 PM 23/07/04 +1000, you wrote: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859- 1; is needed. queenslanders aren't really parochial - this IS the best place to live. rob izatt Yeah, I don't want to live in Australia again. Mike Borgelt Instruments - manufacturers of quality soaring instruments phone Int'l + 61 746 355784 fax Int'l + 61 746 358796 cellphone Int'l + 61 428 355784 Int'l + 61 429 355784 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] website: www.borgeltinstruments.com ___ Aus-soaring mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
