subject:"Anyone interested in Railo hosting\?"

Just a tiny hint is this...

http://www.markdrew.co.uk/blog/index.cfm/2006/11/27/Comparing-Component-speed-on-different-CFML-engines

Greetings / Grüsse
Gert Franz
Customer Care
Railo Technologies GmbH
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.railo.ch

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Robertson-Ravo, Neil (RX) schrieb:
 Interesting, surely you should get Adobe to change ColdFusion to be as fast
 as Railo (though I haven't seen or used Railo so I would have take your work
 that it is faster!)




 This e-mail is from Reed Exhibitions (Gateway House, 28 The Quadrant,
 Richmond, Surrey, TW9 1DN, United Kingdom), a division of Reed Business,
 Registered in England, Number 678540.  It contains information which is
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 intended recipient(s).  If you are not the intended recipient(s) please note
 that any form of distribution, copying or use of this communication or the
 information in it is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.  If you have
 received this communication in error please return it to the sender or call
 our switchboard on +44 (0) 20 89107910.  The opinions expressed within this
 communication are not necessarily those expressed by Reed Exhibitions. 
 Visit our website at http://www.reedexpo.com

 -Original Message-
 From: Gert Franz
 To: CF-Talk
 Sent: Wed Feb 07 07:42:18 2007
 Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 Hi Neil,

 i can easily post why this is:

 Railo, for a good reason which I will post down below does not support 
 the following.

 1: cfset a = structNew()
 2: cfset a[sub.subkey] = John
 3: cfset b = a.sub.subkey --- this throwhs an error

 since a does not contain a key named sub. It just contains a key named 
 sub.subkey. And all the texts in CFFM are defined like this. So I had 
 to write a function for converting the keys into real structs.
 In fact in the above code in line 2 the statement does not insert a key 
 named sub in the struct a and in the key sub a subkey named 
 subkey. The struct really contains a struct with one single key named 
 sub.subkey. You can easily check this by dumping it out in CFMX.

 In order for our blog to work I adapted CFFM for Raymond Camden's blog 
 as well, which did not work out of the box as well since it contained 
 some syntax errors which Railo mentions and MX ignores.

 Now for the reason why Railo does not support this: performance.
 The checking for subkeys in a struct has to be done at every single 
 access to a struct variable. This slows down performance. Maybe this is 
 one of the reasons why structs are many times faster in Railo than in CFMX.

 Greetings / Grüsse
 Gert Franz
 Customer Care
 Railo Technologies GmbH
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 www.railo.ch

 Join our Mailing List / Treten Sie unserer Mailingliste bei:
 deutsch: http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/railo/
 english: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/railo_talk/



 Robertson-Ravo, Neil (RX) schrieb:
   
 for CFFM because CFFM out of the box doesn't work with Railo.

 Who's fault is that? Does CFFM work on ColdFusion and BD with no changes?
 Surely if it is CFML then it should be Adobe based CFML as the benchmark,
 guide.

 N






 This e-mail is from Reed Exhibitions (Gateway House, 28 The Quadrant,
 Richmond, Surrey, TW9 1DN, United Kingdom), a division of Reed Business,
 Registered in England, Number 678540.  It contains information which is
 confidential and may also be privileged.  It is for the exclusive use of
 
 the
   
 intended recipient(s).  If you are not the intended recipient(s) please
 
 note
   
 that any form of distribution, copying or use of this communication or the
 information in it is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.  If you have
 received this communication in error please return it to the sender or
 
 call
   
 our switchboard on +44 (0) 20 89107910.  The opinions expressed within
 
 this
   
 communication are not necessarily those expressed by Reed Exhibitions. 
 Visit our website at http://www.reedexpo.com

 -Original Message-
 From: Rick Root
 To: CF-Talk
 Sent: Wed Feb 07 04:03:21 2007
 Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 On 2/6/07, Dale Fraser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   
 
 I agree, unless your giving it away, I wouldn't pay for hosting on
 anything
 other than the official product, I only stand to loose stuff and gain
 nothing.
 
   
 I recommend Bluedragon hosting for some of my clients who get VPS accounts
 at VivioTech, but only because BlueDragon 6.2 is almost completely
 compatible with CFMX 6.1 - and most of the stuff I write for the open
 
 source
   
 world, I try to make compatible with Bluedragon - and it's not that
 difficult.

 As for Railo... I've never worked with it, but I know that Gert has sent
 
 me
   
 changes for CFFM because CFFM out of the box doesn't work

Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Well, this is by no means an indicator of how well or bad CF/Railo performs
on the whole with components/structures, there are far too many factors not
accounted for and in the authors own words, should be taken with a pinch of
salt and are not scientific.

For one, it was on a Mac and I doubt anyone runs a production site on their
MacBook!






 


This e-mail is from Reed Exhibitions (Gateway House, 28 The Quadrant,
Richmond, Surrey, TW9 1DN, United Kingdom), a division of Reed Business,
Registered in England, Number 678540.  It contains information which is
confidential and may also be privileged.  It is for the exclusive use of the
intended recipient(s).  If you are not the intended recipient(s) please note
that any form of distribution, copying or use of this communication or the
information in it is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.  If you have
received this communication in error please return it to the sender or call
our switchboard on +44 (0) 20 89107910.  The opinions expressed within this
communication are not necessarily those expressed by Reed Exhibitions. 
Visit our website at http://www.reedexpo.com

-Original Message-
From: Gert Franz
To: CF-Talk
Sent: Wed Feb 07 08:06:43 2007
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Just a tiny hint is this...

http://www.markdrew.co.uk/blog/index.cfm/2006/11/27/Comparing-Component-spee
d-on-different-CFML-engines

Greetings / Grüsse
Gert Franz
Customer Care
Railo Technologies GmbH
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.railo.ch

Join our Mailing List / Treten Sie unserer Mailingliste bei:
deutsch: http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/railo/
english: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/railo_talk/



Robertson-Ravo, Neil (RX) schrieb:
 Interesting, surely you should get Adobe to change ColdFusion to be as
fast
 as Railo (though I haven't seen or used Railo so I would have take your
work
 that it is faster!)




 This e-mail is from Reed Exhibitions (Gateway House, 28 The Quadrant,
 Richmond, Surrey, TW9 1DN, United Kingdom), a division of Reed Business,
 Registered in England, Number 678540.  It contains information which is
 confidential and may also be privileged.  It is for the exclusive use of
the
 intended recipient(s).  If you are not the intended recipient(s) please
note
 that any form of distribution, copying or use of this communication or the
 information in it is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.  If you have
 received this communication in error please return it to the sender or
call
 our switchboard on +44 (0) 20 89107910.  The opinions expressed within
this
 communication are not necessarily those expressed by Reed Exhibitions. 
 Visit our website at http://www.reedexpo.com

 -Original Message-
 From: Gert Franz
 To: CF-Talk
 Sent: Wed Feb 07 07:42:18 2007
 Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 Hi Neil,

 i can easily post why this is:

 Railo, for a good reason which I will post down below does not support 
 the following.

 1: cfset a = structNew()
 2: cfset a[sub.subkey] = John
 3: cfset b = a.sub.subkey --- this throwhs an error

 since a does not contain a key named sub. It just contains a key named 
 sub.subkey. And all the texts in CFFM are defined like this. So I had 
 to write a function for converting the keys into real structs.
 In fact in the above code in line 2 the statement does not insert a key 
 named sub in the struct a and in the key sub a subkey named 
 subkey. The struct really contains a struct with one single key named 
 sub.subkey. You can easily check this by dumping it out in CFMX.

 In order for our blog to work I adapted CFFM for Raymond Camden's blog 
 as well, which did not work out of the box as well since it contained 
 some syntax errors which Railo mentions and MX ignores.

 Now for the reason why Railo does not support this: performance.
 The checking for subkeys in a struct has to be done at every single 
 access to a struct variable. This slows down performance. Maybe this is 
 one of the reasons why structs are many times faster in Railo than in
CFMX.

 Greetings / Grüsse
 Gert Franz
 Customer Care
 Railo Technologies GmbH
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 www.railo.ch

 Join our Mailing List / Treten Sie unserer Mailingliste bei:
 deutsch: http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/railo/
 english: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/railo_talk/



 Robertson-Ravo, Neil (RX) schrieb:
   
 for CFFM because CFFM out of the box doesn't work with Railo.

 Who's fault is that? Does CFFM work on ColdFusion and BD with no changes?
 Surely if it is CFML then it should be Adobe based CFML as the benchmark,
 guide.

 N






 This e-mail is from Reed Exhibitions (Gateway House, 28 The Quadrant,
 Richmond, Surrey, TW9 1DN, United Kingdom), a division of Reed Business,
 Registered in England, Number 678540.  It contains information which is
 confidential and may also be privileged.  It is for the exclusive use of
 
 the
   
 intended recipient(s).  If you are not the intended recipient(s) please
 
 note

Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Hi Dale,

here my comments to your concerns:

1. security
Railo does not claim to be absolutely secure in terms of weaknesses or
security holes. Nor do we claim to be more secure than other engines in
this terms. But just give me your thoughts about these matters:
How do you prevent users from different webs in one instance of:
- accessing other datasources (without having different db-users etc)
- accessing all mappings
- accessing all customtags
- accessing all cfx-tags
- allowing some webs to access the file system and others not
- allowing some users to use java objects and others not
this is the type of security i addressed.

2. performance
I agree on that. I just compared Railo to the existing engines. And we
will look for ways of improving performance if MX8 is faster than Railo 1.1

3. pricing
I do not know what pricing you relate. Since the enterprise version is
much cheaper than the ones of BD and MX. For those who just need the
professional version it is the same. And there in addition is the free
community version.
And yes, we can argue about the features. In fact i see it the other way
round. But in addition I have to say that, since I am from Railo :-)

Gert

Dale Fraser wrote:
1. Security
Says Who? Once you have a decent sized user base with people testing for
security weaknesses, I really don't see how you can claim this. Just because
you and your limited user base hasn't found security holes doesn't mean they
don't exist. I also bet that almost every CFer in here will say that
Coldfusion is very secure, I've never had any issues.

2. Performance
What's that saying on stats, CF8 is supposed to be much faster again so lets
do a comparison in a few months.

3. Pricing
Seriously, I looked at the pricing, it aint all that great, just like BD's
if it was significantly less expensive you might have a case, but it's
marginally less expensive with less features.

Regards
Dale Fraser

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Yes Neil, you are absolutely right. That's what I wrote myself in the 
comments. Tests have to be done by independent companies and in addition 
they have to test a lot of stuff, not only on single issue. And I can 
not publish such a test as well since an independent company is objective.

I would encourage such a test, but I won't do it myself. My quote about 
performance is just something our customers and as well we seem to see.


Robertson-Ravo, Neil (RX) schrieb:
 Well, this is by no means an indicator of how well or bad CF/Railo performs
 on the whole with components/structures, there are far too many factors not
 accounted for and in the authors own words, should be taken with a pinch of
 salt and are not scientific.

 For one, it was on a Mac and I doubt anyone runs a production site on their
 MacBook!
   

~|
Upgrade to Adobe ColdFusion MX7 
Experience Flex 2  MX7 integration  create powerful cross-platform RIAs 
http:http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;56760587;14748456;a?http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/flex2/?sdid=LVNU

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Indeed, so if I said ColdFusion was faster than Railo at everything then
there would be just as much basis in that - this is my point.  I am not
putting Railo down in any way, I will never use it, but to say it is faster
just on observation is just wrong unless backed up by proper tests and
metrics.






This e-mail is from Reed Exhibitions (Gateway House, 28 The Quadrant,
Richmond, Surrey, TW9 1DN, United Kingdom), a division of Reed Business,
Registered in England, Number 678540.  It contains information which is
confidential and may also be privileged.  It is for the exclusive use of the
intended recipient(s).  If you are not the intended recipient(s) please note
that any form of distribution, copying or use of this communication or the
information in it is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.  If you have
received this communication in error please return it to the sender or call
our switchboard on +44 (0) 20 89107910.  The opinions expressed within this
communication are not necessarily those expressed by Reed Exhibitions. 
Visit our website at http://www.reedexpo.com

-Original Message-
From: Gert Franz
To: CF-Talk
Sent: Wed Feb 07 08:58:45 2007
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Yes Neil, you are absolutely right. That's what I wrote myself in the 
comments. Tests have to be done by independent companies and in addition 
they have to test a lot of stuff, not only on single issue. And I can 
not publish such a test as well since an independent company is objective.

I would encourage such a test, but I won't do it myself. My quote about 
performance is just something our customers and as well we seem to see.


Robertson-Ravo, Neil (RX) schrieb:
 Well, this is by no means an indicator of how well or bad CF/Railo
performs
 on the whole with components/structures, there are far too many factors
not
 accounted for and in the authors own words, should be taken with a pinch
of
 salt and are not scientific.

 For one, it was on a Mac and I doubt anyone runs a production site on
their
 MacBook!
   



~|
Upgrade to Adobe ColdFusion MX7 
Experience Flex 2  MX7 integration  create powerful cross-platform RIAs 
http:http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;56760587;14748456;a?http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/flex2/?sdid=LVNU

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Dale Fraser

Hey gert,

All those items you list are only relevant to hosting providers, most users
don't do this, a very small percentage. I use it in a corporate environment
on our production servers for our use, so not only do I have any experience
with those items, I have no interest.

I was however impressed with the compatibility list, seems very complete for
version 1.1. The way I read it you support cfc's cfdocument and almost
everything other that the listed exception, a very good start.

One battle you will have is convincing people to spend any money with a
company and product that is almost unheard of, I have no such issues
convincing businesses to spend 10k on Adobe products however.

Regards
Dale Fraser
 

-Original Message-
From: Gert Franz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, 7 February 2007 7:51 PM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Hi Dale,

here my comments to your concerns:

1. security
Railo does not claim to be absolutely secure in terms of weaknesses or 
security holes. Nor do we claim to be more secure than other engines in 
this terms. But just give me your thoughts about these matters:
How do you prevent users from different webs in one instance of:
- accessing other datasources (without having different db-users etc)
- accessing all mappings
- accessing all customtags
- accessing all cfx-tags
- allowing some webs to access the file system and others not
- allowing some users to use java objects and others not
this is the type of security i addressed.

2. performance
I agree on that. I just compared Railo to the existing engines. And we 
will look for ways of improving performance if MX8 is faster than Railo 1.1

3. pricing
I do not know what pricing you relate. Since the enterprise version is 
much cheaper than the ones of BD and MX. For those who just need the 
professional version it is the same. And there in addition is the free 
community version.
And yes, we can argue about the features. In fact i see it the other way 
round. But in addition I have to say that, since I am from Railo :-)

Gert

Dale Fraser wrote:
 1. Security
 Says Who? Once you have a decent sized user base with people testing for
 security weaknesses, I really don't see how you can claim this. Just
because
 you and your limited user base hasn't found security holes doesn't mean
they
 don't exist. I also bet that almost every CFer in here will say that
 Coldfusion is very secure, I've never had any issues.

 2. Performance
 What's that saying on stats, CF8 is supposed to be much faster again so
lets
 do a comparison in a few months.

 3. Pricing
 Seriously, I looked at the pricing, it aint all that great, just like BD's
 if it was significantly less expensive you might have a case, but it's
 marginally less expensive with less features.

 Regards
 Dale Fraser
  

   



~|
Upgrade to Adobe ColdFusion MX7 
Experience Flex 2  MX7 integration  create powerful cross-platform RIAs 
http:http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;56760587;14748456;a?http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/flex2/?sdid=LVNU

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Well Dale, the question was about hosting :-)

Railo will make it's way. I'm sure, but it will take time...

Gert

Dale Fraser schrieb:
Hey gert,

All those items you list are only relevant to hosting providers, most users
don't do this, a very small percentage. I use it in a corporate environment
on our production servers for our use, so not only do I have any experience
with those items, I have no interest.

I was however impressed with the compatibility list, seems very complete for
version 1.1. The way I read it you support cfc's cfdocument and almost
everything other that the listed exception, a very good start.

One battle you will have is convincing people to spend any money with a
company and product that is almost unheard of, I have no such issues
convincing businesses to spend 10k on Adobe products however.

Regards
Dale Fraser

-Original Message-
From: Gert Franz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, 7 February 2007 7:51 PM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Hi Dale,

here my comments to your concerns:

2. performance
I agree on that. I just compared Railo to the existing engines. And we
will look for ways of improving performance if MX8 is faster than Railo 1.1

Gert

Dale Fraser wrote:

1. Security
Says Who? Once you have a decent sized user base with people testing for
security weaknesses, I really don't see how you can claim this. Just

because

you and your limited user base hasn't found security holes doesn't mean

they

don't exist. I also bet that almost every CFer in here will say that
Coldfusion is very secure, I've never had any issues.

2. Performance
What's that saying on stats, CF8 is supposed to be much faster again so

lets

do a comparison in a few months.

Regards
Dale Fraser

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

I hope somewhen you will revert the statement I will never use it :-)

Why don't you observe it yoursef?

Robertson-Ravo, Neil (RX) schrieb:
Indeed, so if I said ColdFusion was faster than Railo at everything then
there would be just as much basis in that - this is my point. I am not
putting Railo down in any way, I will never use it, but to say it is faster
just on observation is just wrong unless backed up by proper tests and
metrics.

-Original Message-
From: Gert Franz
To: CF-Talk
Sent: Wed Feb 07 08:58:45 2007
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Yes Neil, you are absolutely right. That's what I wrote myself in the
comments. Tests have to be done by independent companies and in addition
they have to test a lot of stuff, not only on single issue. And I can
not publish such a test as well since an independent company is objective.

I would encourage such a test, but I won't do it myself. My quote about
performance is just something our customers and as well we seem to see.

Robertson-Ravo, Neil (RX) schrieb:

Well, this is by no means an indicator of how well or bad CF/Railo

performs

on the whole with components/structures, there are far too many factors

not

accounted for and in the authors own words, should be taken with a pinch

salt and are not scientific.

For one, it was on a Mac and I doubt anyone runs a production site on

their

MacBook!

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Lol, mainly due the fact that as a company we would never move from
ColdFusion (too much corporate issues). We looked at BD.NET when we thought
we would use more .NET stuff but in the end, there was no need to move and
far too much risk.







This e-mail is from Reed Exhibitions (Gateway House, 28 The Quadrant,
Richmond, Surrey, TW9 1DN, United Kingdom), a division of Reed Business,
Registered in England, Number 678540.  It contains information which is
confidential and may also be privileged.  It is for the exclusive use of the
intended recipient(s).  If you are not the intended recipient(s) please note
that any form of distribution, copying or use of this communication or the
information in it is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.  If you have
received this communication in error please return it to the sender or call
our switchboard on +44 (0) 20 89107910.  The opinions expressed within this
communication are not necessarily those expressed by Reed Exhibitions. 
Visit our website at http://www.reedexpo.com

-Original Message-
From: Gert Franz
To: CF-Talk
Sent: Wed Feb 07 09:18:35 2007
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

I hope somewhen you will revert the statement I will never use it :-)

Why don't you observe it yoursef?

Robertson-Ravo, Neil (RX) schrieb:
 Indeed, so if I said ColdFusion was faster than Railo at everything then
 there would be just as much basis in that - this is my point.  I am not
 putting Railo down in any way, I will never use it, but to say it is
faster
 just on observation is just wrong unless backed up by proper tests and
 metrics.






 This e-mail is from Reed Exhibitions (Gateway House, 28 The Quadrant,
 Richmond, Surrey, TW9 1DN, United Kingdom), a division of Reed Business,
 Registered in England, Number 678540.  It contains information which is
 confidential and may also be privileged.  It is for the exclusive use of
the
 intended recipient(s).  If you are not the intended recipient(s) please
note
 that any form of distribution, copying or use of this communication or the
 information in it is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.  If you have
 received this communication in error please return it to the sender or
call
 our switchboard on +44 (0) 20 89107910.  The opinions expressed within
this
 communication are not necessarily those expressed by Reed Exhibitions. 
 Visit our website at http://www.reedexpo.com

 -Original Message-
 From: Gert Franz
 To: CF-Talk
 Sent: Wed Feb 07 08:58:45 2007
 Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 Yes Neil, you are absolutely right. That's what I wrote myself in the 
 comments. Tests have to be done by independent companies and in addition 
 they have to test a lot of stuff, not only on single issue. And I can 
 not publish such a test as well since an independent company is objective.

 I would encourage such a test, but I won't do it myself. My quote about 
 performance is just something our customers and as well we seem to see.


 Robertson-Ravo, Neil (RX) schrieb:
   
 Well, this is by no means an indicator of how well or bad CF/Railo
 
 performs
   
 on the whole with components/structures, there are far too many factors
 
 not
   
 accounted for and in the authors own words, should be taken with a pinch
 
 of
   
 salt and are not scientific.

 For one, it was on a Mac and I doubt anyone runs a production site on
 
 their
   
 MacBook!
   
 



 



~|
Upgrade to Adobe ColdFusion MX7 
Experience Flex 2  MX7 integration  create powerful cross-platform RIAs 
http:http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;56760587;14748456;a?http://www.adobe.com/products/coldfusion/flex2/?sdid=LVNU

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Jochem van Dieten

Gert Franz said:

I don't care about security as long as my part in the whole picture is
far from the weakest link. And realistically, every CFML runtime is
far from the weakest link: users are.

- performance

I don't care. I really don't. No CFML runtime is magically going to
make a database faster. No CFML runtime is magically going to make a
remote webservice faster. And those are the types of resources I have
performance issues with.

- price

Not an issue in the market segment I work most of the time.

But that is not to say that Railo doesn't have good stuff. The one
thing that really stands out is the concept of a site that
immediately is a security container for file access. Perfect for
shared hosting. I love it. I have even asked Macromedia to copy it.
But is simply not relevant in my current work.

I think that once Railo 1.1 is out I will put it in the buildfarm
again so our applications run automatic regression tests against it. I
like having applications that work on more then one runtime so if it
is feasible, I will keep an eye open for portability issues. But
realistically, I think that it will be years before anything we work
with will be deployed on Railo even if we officially support it.

Jochem

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

On 2/7/07, Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi Neil,

 i can easily post why this is:

 Railo, for a good reason which I will post down below does not support
 the following.

 1: cfset a = structNew()
 2: cfset a[sub.subkey] = John
 3: cfset b = a.sub.subkey --- this throwhs an error



(For the record, that code wasn't written by me, it was in a really old
version of a resource bundle cfc I used... nonetheless, the code works fine
in Bluedragon and CFMX with no changes)

rick

 --
 I'm not certified, but I have been told that I'm certifiable...
 Visit http://www.opensourcecf.com today!


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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
interesting...


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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

That indeed was and is true. But since changes could be easily be made, 
I don't agree to change the behaviour of Railo in order to support this 
syntax and loose performance in exchange.

Gert

Rick Root schrieb:
 On 2/7/07, Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   
 Hi Neil,

 i can easily post why this is:

 Railo, for a good reason which I will post down below does not support
 the following.

 1: cfset a = structNew()
 2: cfset a[sub.subkey] = John
 3: cfset b = a.sub.subkey --- this throwhs an error
 



 (For the record, that code wasn't written by me, it was in a really old
 version of a resource bundle cfc I used... nonetheless, the code works fine
 in Bluedragon and CFMX with no changes)

 rick

   
 --
 I'm not certified, but I have been told that I'm certifiable...
 Visit http://www.opensourcecf.com today!
 


 

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

why? what's the difference between open source and free?


Rick Root schrieb:
 For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
 interesting...


 

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Jim Wright

Rick Root wrote:
 For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
 interesting...
 

The combination of a open source  shared hosting optimized CF runtime 
is where I see some possibilities.  Perhaps if one of the big hosting 
companies (HMS or GoDaddy seem like likely candidates), would put some 
resources into developing such a beast, it might have a chance.  I'm not 
sure the community at large has enough momentum to develop a general 
purpose alternative to CF or BD.  It seems like another CF product, be 
it commercial or open source, Railo or Smith, would need to fill some 
niche...and being shared hosting optimized would probably be the most 
likely candidate.  I believe Railo has a good start in this area...not 
sure about Smith.

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread James Holmes

Not much when you have a decompiler on hand :-) Oops, did I say that out loud?

On 2/7/07, Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 why? what's the difference between open source and free?


 Rick Root schrieb:
  For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
  interesting...
 
 
 

 

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community helping
to develop the project,  so bug fixes and features are done in record time
instead of waiting on a few developers to bring you the things that you
need the most. Why has mySql done so well? Gee I will answer that myself.
MySql offers an open source product and were able to grow their client base
while at the same time having the people that downloaded their software also
develop their software and reduce their costs. Free and closed source simply
means that we have to wait for you to implemnt things and that it takes
longer for community acceptance.

Doug B.




- Original Message - 
From: Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 7:15 AM
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?


 why? what's the difference between open source and free?


 Rick Root schrieb:
  For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
  interesting...
 
 
 

 

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

lol ;)

Doug B.
- Original Message - 
From: James Holmes [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 7:28 AM
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?


 Not much when you have a decompiler on hand :-) Oops, did I say that out
loud?

 On 2/7/07, Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  why? what's the difference between open source and free?
 
 
  Rick Root schrieb:
   For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
   interesting...
  
  
  
 
 

 

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Rey Bango

Hah! h4x0r! ;o)

Rey...

James Holmes wrote:
 Not much when you have a decompiler on hand :-) Oops, did I say that out loud?
 
 On 2/7/07, Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 why? what's the difference between open source and free?


 Rick Root schrieb:
 For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
 interesting...




 
 

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Jochem van Dieten

Doug Brown said:
 A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community
 helping to develop the project,

Really? Look at that thread about the Smith project. How many people
have said they would actually help?

Jochem




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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Jim Wright

Doug Brown wrote:
 MySql offers an open source product and were able to grow their client base
 while at the same time having the people that downloaded their software also
 develop their software and reduce their costs. Free and closed source simply
 means that we have to wait for you to implemnt things and that it takes
 longer for community acceptance.
 

I think the part about having the people that download the software also 
develop it is not accurate.  If you look at mysql's site and their own 
description of their community, there isn't a lot of mention of 
development.
http://dev.mysql.com/guilds/
Note that the Developers Guild only has 8 members...and it refers to 
development other than the core product development.  My guess is that 
all of the core development of MySQL is done by a MySQL-AB employee.

Having an open source community probably can reduce costs...most likely 
in marketing (all those people in the writers, speakers and experts 
Guilds) and QA.  But my impression of most open source projects is that 
the actual development is done by a very small number of developers, 
perhaps a similar size team to a commercial product, and that 
implementing new features and bug fixes...in general...works on a 
similar timeline as a commercial product.


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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Well I think it has to become open source before all the offerings come
piling in. I am sure the bandwagon did not get full for mySql until it was
opensourced. Could be wrong though :/

Doug B.
- Original Message - 
From: Jochem van Dieten [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 7:51 AM
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 Doug Brown said:
  A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community
  helping to develop the project,

 Really? Look at that thread about the Smith project. How many people
 have said they would actually help?

 Jochem

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

How many people on this list are actually proficient in Java?  Most CF
people don't have a CS background, and a few who do, are probably too busy
to help out.  

I know some Java, and although I'm fairly busy, I would like to lend a hand.
Where do I sign up?

Russ

 -Original Message-
 From: Jochem van Dieten [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 9:51 AM
 To: CF-Talk
 Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?
 
 Doug Brown said:
  A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community
  helping to develop the project,
 
 Really? Look at that thread about the Smith project. How many people
 have said they would actually help?
 
 Jochem
 
 
 
 
 

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Turetsky, Seth

Most CF people don't have a CS background
Where did you get this info from? 

-Original Message-
From: Russ [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 9:59 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

How many people on this list are actually proficient in Java?  Most CF people 
don't have a CS background, and a few who do, are probably too busy to help 
out.  

I know some Java, and although I'm fairly busy, I would like to lend a hand.
Where do I sign up?

Russ

 -Original Message-
 From: Jochem van Dieten [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 9:51 AM
 To: CF-Talk
 Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 Doug Brown said:
  A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community 
  helping to develop the project,

 Really? Look at that thread about the Smith project. How many people 
 have said they would actually help?

 Jochem

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Jim,

You might be right, but I also think that if something is open source that
the people with the right skill set could very well push along the
development of project. Say Joe Blow has been a java developer for ten years
and also uses coldfusion, he could very well implement new features and bug
fixes that the core dev team did not have time for and allow them to work on
other areas. Now depending on how many Joes are out there would decide how
fast a product progresses.

Doug B.
- Original Message - 
From: Jim Wright [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 7:58 AM
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?


 Doug Brown wrote:
  MySql offers an open source product and were able to grow their client
base
  while at the same time having the people that downloaded their software
also
  develop their software and reduce their costs. Free and closed source
simply
  means that we have to wait for you to implemnt things and that it takes
  longer for community acceptance.
 

 I think the part about having the people that download the software also
 develop it is not accurate.  If you look at mysql's site and their own
 description of their community, there isn't a lot of mention of
 development.
 http://dev.mysql.com/guilds/
 Note that the Developers Guild only has 8 members...and it refers to
 development other than the core product development.  My guess is that
 all of the core development of MySQL is done by a MySQL-AB employee.

 Having an open source community probably can reduce costs...most likely
 in marketing (all those people in the writers, speakers and experts
 Guilds) and QA.  But my impression of most open source projects is that
 the actual development is done by a very small number of developers,
 perhaps a similar size team to a commercial product, and that
 implementing new features and bug fixes...in general...works on a
 similar timeline as a commercial product.


 

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Don't get me wrong, I do not have anything against open source. BUT we
are yet to small and I don't think that the community will dig into our
tens of thousands of lines of code first to understand it and second to
fix it. If Adobe would do it, then this would be different.
If we open source Railo and we would be faster in some cases than other
vendors, they could easily adapt our code

And just like James posted. If you have a decompiler etc. it is already
open source.

Greetings / Grüsse
Gert Franz
Customer Care
Railo Technologies GmbH
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.railo.ch

Join our Mailing List / Treten Sie unserer Mailingliste bei:
deutsch: http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/railo/
english: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/railo_talk/

Doug Brown schrieb:
A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community helping
to develop the project, so bug fixes and features are done in record time
instead of waiting on a few developers to bring you the things that you
need the most. Why has mySql done so well? Gee I will answer that myself.
MySql offers an open source product and were able to grow their client base
while at the same time having the people that downloaded their software also
develop their software and reduce their costs. Free and closed source simply
means that we have to wait for you to implemnt things and that it takes
longer for community acceptance.

Doug B.

- Original Message -
From: Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 7:15 AM
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

why? what's the difference between open source and free?

Rick Root schrieb:

For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
interesting...

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Just in general working and talking with CF people and at conferences. It
seems to me that because CF is so easy to learn, a lot of the people using
it are coming from non CS backgrounds. Now it might be just people I'm
coming in contact with, but that's been my experience.

Can we maybe set up a poll somewhere and test out this hypothesis?

Russ

-Original Message-
From: Turetsky, Seth [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 10:11 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Most CF people don't have a CS background
Where did you get this info from?

-Original Message-
From: Russ [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 9:59 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

How many people on this list are actually proficient in Java? Most CF
people don't have a CS background, and a few who do, are probably too busy
to help out.

I know some Java, and although I'm fairly busy, I would like to lend a
hand.
Where do I sign up?

Russ

-Original Message-
From: Jochem van Dieten [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 9:51 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Doug Brown said:
A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community
helping to develop the project,

Really? Look at that thread about the Smith project. How many people
have said they would actually help?

Jochem

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

If we open source Railo and we would be faster in some cases than other
vendors, they could easily adapt our code

Sure they could adopt your code and make their product faster, but they
would also still be charging a wholloping price for their product.

Doug B.


- Original Message - 
From: Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 8:17 AM
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?


 Don't get me wrong, I do not have anything against open source. BUT we
 are yet to small and I don't think that the community will dig into our
 tens of thousands of lines of code first to understand it and second to
 fix it. If Adobe would do it, then this would be different.
 If we open source Railo and we would be faster in some cases than other
 vendors, they could easily adapt our code

 And just like James posted. If you have a decompiler etc. it is already
 open source.

 Greetings / Grüsse
 Gert Franz
 Customer Care
 Railo Technologies GmbH
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 www.railo.ch

 Join our Mailing List / Treten Sie unserer Mailingliste bei:
 deutsch: http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/railo/
 english: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/railo_talk/



 Doug Brown schrieb:
  A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community
helping
  to develop the project,  so bug fixes and features are done in record
time
  instead of waiting on a few developers to bring you the things that
you
  need the most. Why has mySql done so well? Gee I will answer that
myself.
  MySql offers an open source product and were able to grow their client
base
  while at the same time having the people that downloaded their software
also
  develop their software and reduce their costs. Free and closed source
simply
  means that we have to wait for you to implemnt things and that it takes
  longer for community acceptance.
 
  Doug B.
 
 
 
 
  - Original Message - 
  From: Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
  Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 7:15 AM
  Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?
 
 
 
  why? what's the difference between open source and free?
 
 
  Rick Root schrieb:
 
  For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
  interesting...
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

 

~|
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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Just a side note, or question...What reasons do people think that asp/php
has the stronghold on web development, and what can be done to make CF just
as popular?

A. Better performing code
B. Cheaper development
C. Cheaper hosting
D. Other (Explain)


Doug


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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

That's my point...

Thanks Doug...

Doug Brown schrieb:
If we open source Railo and we would be faster in some cases than other
vendors, they could easily adapt our code

Sure they could adopt your code and make their product faster, but they
would also still be charging a wholloping price for their product.

Doug B.

- Original Message -
From: Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 8:17 AM
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

And just like James posted. If you have a decompiler etc. it is already
open source.

Greetings / Grüsse
Gert Franz
Customer Care
Railo Technologies GmbH
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.railo.ch

Join our Mailing List / Treten Sie unserer Mailingliste bei:
deutsch: http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/railo/
english: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/railo_talk/

Doug Brown schrieb:

A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community

helping

to develop the project, so bug fixes and features are done in record

time

instead of waiting on a few developers to bring you the things that

you

need the most. Why has mySql done so well? Gee I will answer that

myself.

MySql offers an open source product and were able to grow their client

base

while at the same time having the people that downloaded their software

also

develop their software and reduce their costs. Free and closed source

simply

means that we have to wait for you to implemnt things and that it takes
longer for community acceptance.

Doug B.

- Original Message -
From: Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 7:15 AM
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

why? what's the difference between open source and free?

Rick Root schrieb:

For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
interesting...

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

I did not make your point :) You have to have some sort of niche in order to
get your product to be seen as a viable solution/alternative. Who cares if
Adobe adopts some of your code if they are still charging $6000 per cpu for
enterprise licensing. Your product would be open source and you could still
have a enterprise edition that you charge for albeit at a lower price.

Doug B.



- Original Message - 
From: Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 8:32 AM
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?


 That's my point...

 Thanks Doug...

 Doug Brown schrieb:
  If we open source Railo and we would be faster in some cases than
other
  vendors, they could easily adapt our code
 
 
  Sure they could adopt your code and make their product faster, but they
  would also still be charging a wholloping price for their product.
 
  Doug B.
 
 
  - Original Message - 
  From: Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
  Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 8:17 AM
  Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?
 
 
 
  Don't get me wrong, I do not have anything against open source. BUT we
  are yet to small and I don't think that the community will dig into our
  tens of thousands of lines of code first to understand it and second to
  fix it. If Adobe would do it, then this would be different.
  If we open source Railo and we would be faster in some cases than other
  vendors, they could easily adapt our code
 
  And just like James posted. If you have a decompiler etc. it is already
  open source.
 
  Greetings / Grüsse
  Gert Franz
  Customer Care
  Railo Technologies GmbH
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  www.railo.ch
 
  Join our Mailing List / Treten Sie unserer Mailingliste bei:
  deutsch: http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/railo/
  english: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/railo_talk/
 
 
 
  Doug Brown schrieb:
 
  A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community
 
  helping
 
  to develop the project,  so bug fixes and features are done in record
 
  time
 
  instead of waiting on a few developers to bring you the things that
 
  you
 
  need the most. Why has mySql done so well? Gee I will answer that
 
  myself.
 
  MySql offers an open source product and were able to grow their client
 
  base
 
  while at the same time having the people that downloaded their
software
 
  also
 
  develop their software and reduce their costs. Free and closed source
 
  simply
 
  means that we have to wait for you to implemnt things and that it
takes
  longer for community acceptance.
 
  Doug B.
 
 
 
 
  - Original Message - 
  From: Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
  Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 7:15 AM
  Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?
 
 
 
 
  why? what's the difference between open source and free?
 
 
  Rick Root schrieb:
 
 
  For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be
  interesting...
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

 

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Turetsky, Seth

That would be an interesting poll, would prove if I wasted a lot of money 
getting my cs degree :) 
I think it would be useful to see of the percentages, who works for a company 
or does contractor work

-Original Message-
From: Russ [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 10:16 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Just in general working and talking with CF people and at conferences.  It 
seems to me that because CF is so easy to learn, a lot of the people using it 
are coming from non CS backgrounds.  Now it might be just people I'm coming in 
contact with, but that's been my experience.  

Can we maybe set up a poll somewhere and test out this hypothesis?  

Russ

 -Original Message-
 From: Turetsky, Seth [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 10:11 AM
 To: CF-Talk
 Subject: RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 Most CF people don't have a CS background
 Where did you get this info from?

 -Original Message-
 From: Russ [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 9:59 AM
 To: CF-Talk
 Subject: RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 How many people on this list are actually proficient in Java?  Most CF 
 people don't have a CS background, and a few who do, are probably too 
 busy to help out.

 I know some Java, and although I'm fairly busy, I would like to lend a 
 hand.
 Where do I sign up?

 Russ

  -Original Message-
  From: Jochem van Dieten [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 9:51 AM
  To: CF-Talk
  Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

  Doug Brown said:
   A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire 
   community helping to develop the project,

  Really? Look at that thread about the Smith project. How many people 
  have said they would actually help?

  Jochem

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

I think ASP/PHP do have cheaper hosting, and the whole selling point is that
it's free. The fact that it will take longer to develop an app is not
immediately clear, and neither is that fact that ASP/PHP code is more
complicated and therefore will have more bugs.

ASP also probably performs better then CF. From what I hear, Bluedragon
..NET performs better then CF, and doesn't have the memory problems that CF
does.

Also if you want to have any sort of load balanced environment, I believe
ASP has it built in somewhere (haven't really looked into it), and it's
free, while for CF you have to shell out $12000 (2 Enterprise Licenses).
Even if you have a fairly low traffic site, but you would like to have a
load balanced environment, it's going to cost you a lot of money to get
there. (If you need session replication at least). Also, from what I've
been told, session replication doesn't work reliably with CF, although I
have not experienced problems myself.

Another issue is that it doesn't scale easily. Not that CF can't scale, but
if I have an a CF App that cost me $x to develop, and a ASP.NET app that
cost me $2x to develop, if I need to scale it out with multiple servers, at
some point the cost of the licenses for the new servers outweigh the cost of
developing the app in the first place. The fact that you can run CF on
linux and forego windows licensing costs offsets this somewhat, but there's
still a significant difference. This is most likely why MySpace is moving
towards .NET.

I don't think PHP has any sort of session management, so it's not even a
contender in the enterprise world.

Personally, I don't know PHP or ASP.NET, but I should probably start
learning them.

Russ

-Original Message-
From: Doug Brown [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 10:30 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Just a side note, or question...What reasons do people think that asp/php
has the stronghold on web development, and what can be done to make CF
just
as popular?

A. Better performing code
B. Cheaper development
C. Cheaper hosting
D. Other (Explain)

Doug

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Open source means you're offering up the source code for anyone to modify.
It also means that when someone modifies your source code, they have to give
it back to the community (you) for others to use. 

-Original Message-
From: Gert Franz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 8:16 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

why? what's the difference between open source and free?

Rick Root schrieb:
 For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be 
 interesting...

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Eric Haskins

and neither is that fact that ASP/PHP code is more
complicated and therefore will have more bugs.

I find the opposite Russ coming from PHP to CF Cf is alot more verbose than
PHP. I am learning CF as I work for a CF shop FullTime as a Web Systems
Developer. Cant speak for ASP

I don't think PHP has any sort of session management, so it's not even a
contender in the enterprise world.

Can you elaborate on this?? I use session vars all the time in php. I have
done apps for Verizon that are php.

Eric

On 2/7/07, Russ [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

I think ASP/PHP do have cheaper hosting, and the whole selling point is
that
it's free. The fact that it will take longer to develop an app is not
immediately clear, and neither is that fact that ASP/PHP code is more
complicated and therefore will have more bugs.

ASP also probably performs better then CF. From what I hear, Bluedragon
..NET performs better then CF, and doesn't have the memory problems that
CF
does.

Another issue is that it doesn't scale easily. Not that CF can't scale,
but
if I have an a CF App that cost me $x to develop, and a ASP.NET app that
cost me $2x to develop, if I need to scale it out with multiple servers,
at
some point the cost of the licenses for the new servers outweigh the cost
of
developing the app in the first place. The fact that you can run CF on
linux and forego windows licensing costs offsets this somewhat, but
there's
still a significant difference. This is most likely why MySpace is moving
towards .NET.

I don't think PHP has any sort of session management, so it's not even a
contender in the enterprise world.

Personally, I don't know PHP or ASP.NET, but I should probably start
learning them.

Russ

-Original Message-
From: Doug Brown [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 10:30 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Just a side note, or question...What reasons do people think that
asp/php
has the stronghold on web development, and what can be done to make CF
just
as popular?

A. Better performing code
B. Cheaper development
C. Cheaper hosting
D. Other (Explain)

Doug

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

But that's the thing Gert...

If you DO open source it, nothing would change on your end except that
people who WANT to get involved COULD get involved. So even if no one
decided to help out, you wouldn't be losing anything. And you never
know...people could jump on board and Railo could get a serious jump start. 

-Original Message-
From: Gert Franz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 9:17 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Don't get me wrong, I do not have anything against open source. BUT we are
yet to small and I don't think that the community will dig into our tens of
thousands of lines of code first to understand it and second to fix it. If
Adobe would do it, then this would be different.
If we open source Railo and we would be faster in some cases than other
vendors, they could easily adapt our code

And just like James posted. If you have a decompiler etc. it is already open
source.

Greetings / Grüsse
Gert Franz
Customer Care
Railo Technologies GmbH
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.railo.ch

Join our Mailing List / Treten Sie unserer Mailingliste bei:
deutsch: http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/railo/
english: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/railo_talk/



Doug Brown schrieb:
 A huge difference!! Number one is that you have the entire community 
 helping to develop the project,  so bug fixes and features are done in 
 record time instead of waiting on a few developers to bring you the 
 things that you need the most. Why has mySql done so well? Gee I will
answer that myself.
 MySql offers an open source product and were able to grow their client 
 base while at the same time having the people that downloaded their 
 software also develop their software and reduce their costs. Free and 
 closed source simply means that we have to wait for you to implemnt 
 things and that it takes longer for community acceptance.

 Doug B.




 - Original Message -
 From: Gert Franz [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: CF-Talk cf-talk@houseoffusion.com
 Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 7:15 AM
 Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?


   
 why? what's the difference between open source and free?


 Rick Root schrieb:
 
 For what it's worth, if Railo went open source.. now *THAT* would be 
 interesting...



   
 

 



~|
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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

I think that cost is one of the biggest issues. Every other programmer I've
spoken with about CF thinks that you have to BUY the server just to host a
single CF site. It's like they don't even realize that there might be CF
based hosting companies.

I also think that while there's a decent amount of KICKING CF projects,
there needs to be WAY more, and they need to be way better publicized. Look
at the stuff that 37 Signals is doing. They're totally piggybacking on the
popularity of Rails and offering up this fantastic software that just works.

-Original Message-
From: Doug Brown [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 9:30 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Just a side note, or question...What reasons do people think that asp/php
has the stronghold on web development, and what can be done to make CF just
as popular?

A. Better performing code
B. Cheaper development
C. Cheaper hosting
D. Other (Explain)


Doug




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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Jochem van Dieten

Andy Matthews said:
 Open source means you're offering up the source code for anyone to
 modify. It also means that when someone modifies your source code,
 they have to give it back to the community (you) for others to use.

No it doesn't. Even the most viral licenses for software only require
you to publish your modifications when you distribute a derived work.
And the licenses that are not copyleft do not require any source code
distribution at all.

Jochem




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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread John Paul Ashenfelter

I also think that while there's a decent amount of KICKING CF projects,
there needs to be WAY more, and they need to be way better publicized. Look
at the stuff that 37 Signals is doing. They're totally piggybacking on the
popularity of Rails and offering up this fantastic software that just works.

Well, since the guys at 37Signals *created* Rails, it's not a suprise
they're piggybacking on it. One of their big talks is about extracting
Rails (the framework) from Basecamp (the product). Hype serves them on
both sides of the coin -- pushing their framework and their product(s)
built on it.

And as apparently will be my mission in the CF world, I'll just remind you

Rails = framework
Ruby = language

I'd still say *ruby* is not as popular or well known as *rails* is,
and that Ruby is probably comparable in popularity to CF in that it's
*way* behind languages like C#, Java, and PHP. Of course *Rails* is
probably one of the bigger *frameworks*, right up there with Struts.

And finally, it doesn't take a *lot* of kicking ColdFusion sites to
get it hyped -- it takes 1 popular, kicking, hyped site. There's a
*lot* of Rails sites, but Basecamp is the one most folks know. CF
needs a similar exemplar, but it will take the whole package of CF and
a framework, etc -- the CF frameworks need a lot more work before they
compare to what's hyped about Rails. Flex is far more likely to be
able to generate hype IMHO.

--
John Paul Ashenfelter
CTO/Transitionpoint
(blog) http://www.ashenfelter.com
(email) [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Okay...thanks for correcting me Jochem. I didn't realize the difference. 

-Original Message-
From: Jochem van Dieten [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 10:39 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Andy Matthews said:
 Open source means you're offering up the source code for anyone to 
 modify. It also means that when someone modifies your source code, 
 they have to give it back to the community (you) for others to use.

No it doesn't. Even the most viral licenses for software only require you to
publish your modifications when you distribute a derived work.
And the licenses that are not copyleft do not require any source code
distribution at all.

Jochem

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread John Paul Ashenfelter

On 2/7/07, Eric Haskins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
and neither is that fact that ASP/PHP code is more
complicated and therefore will have more bugs.

That's a fairly ridiculous assertion -- first of all that one specific
language is more complicated than another and second that complexity =
bugs. One could makes all sorts of similar unsupported arguments that
we've all heard:

PHP is less prone to bugs because it's open
PHP is more prone to bugs because it's open
ASP is more prone to bugs because it's on Windows
etc, etc

Some of the most common bugs I've seen in web apps I've dealt with
(commercial, open souce, and inhouse) tend to be simple user error
like not checking parameters for type/content (eg SQL injection).
Other common errors are off-by-one errors in loops and simply bad
logic. Few programming languages prevent a developer from doing
something dumb that causes a bug.

I find the opposite Russ coming from PHP to CF Cf is alot more verbose than
PHP. I am learning CF as I work for a CF shop FullTime as a Web Systems
Developer. Cant speak for ASP

I don't think PHP has any sort of session management, so it's not even a
contender in the enterprise world.

Can you elaborate on this?? I use session vars all the time in php. I have
done apps for Verizon that are php.

The assertions CF folks make about open source always just make me cringe.

Of *course* PHP has session management, and quite frankly some far
more sophisticated options including session clustering that actually
works under load (eg memcached) as opposed to the JRun session
clustering that has known issues with performance thanks to what it's
doing with JINI and who knows what else. Plus you've got more options
about where you store the session (eg files on the server instead of
database or memory directly).

rant
In the past few days, I've seen far too many posts that didn't even
take the time to Wikipedia/google/whatever before making assertions
about open source licenses, the capabilities of languages they've
never used, or even verify or source statments that were the truth.

Please check your facts, even just briefly before you post. Or save as
a draft, come back an hour later, and still see if you want to post
it.
/rant

Send your complaints about the rant to /dev/null :)
--
John Paul Ashenfelter
CTO/Transitionpoint
(blog) http://www.ashenfelter.com
(email) [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Jordan Michaels

Russ wrote:
I don't think PHP has any sort of session management, so it's not even a
contender in the enterprise world.

Personally, I don't know PHP or ASP.NET, but I should probably start
learning them.

Don't take this the wrong way Russ, but if you don't know PHP, how do
you justify talking about it's feature set? Even more so, you then take
that baseless and false feature set comment and use it to justify a
comment about PHP's presence in the enterprise - something which you are
clearly not at all acquainted with. It would be wise of you to consider
your words before you make broad, unfounded, and completely false
statements about something you admittedly do not know about.

For the record, PHP does indeed have session management, and I know
several enterprise-level companies who rely on it heavily.

Warm regards,
Jordan Michaels
Vivio Technologies
http://www.viviotech.net/
Blue Dragon Alliance Member
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Russ wrote:
I think ASP/PHP do have cheaper hosting, and the whole selling point is that
it's free. The fact that it will take longer to develop an app is not
immediately clear, and neither is that fact that ASP/PHP code is more
complicated and therefore will have more bugs.

ASP also probably performs better then CF. From what I hear, Bluedragon
..NET performs better then CF, and doesn't have the memory problems that CF
does.

I don't think PHP has any sort of session management, so it's not even a
contender in the enterprise world.

Personally, I don't know PHP or ASP.NET, but I should probably start
learning them.

Russ

-Original Message-
From: Doug Brown [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 10:30 AM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Just a side note, or question...What reasons do people think that asp/php
has the stronghold on web development, and what can be done to make CF
just
as popular?

A. Better performing code
B. Cheaper development
C. Cheaper hosting
D. Other (Explain)

Doug

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

-Original Message-
From: John Paul Ashenfelter [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 12:28 PM
To: CF-Talk
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

On 2/7/07, Eric Haskins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
and neither is that fact that ASP/PHP code is more
complicated and therefore will have more bugs.

PHP is less prone to bugs because it's open
PHP is more prone to bugs because it's open
ASP is more prone to bugs because it's on Windows
etc, etc

I find the opposite Russ coming from PHP to CF Cf is alot more verbose
than
PHP. I am learning CF as I work for a CF shop FullTime as a Web Systems
Developer. Cant speak for ASP

I don't think anyone is saying that PHP is more or less prone to bugs
because it's open. PHP (the language) has its own bugs/CF has it's own, but
I wasn't talking about the bugs in the language itself. I was talking about
bugs in the code. CF is so simple, that a lot of non-technical people learn
it and are able to create fairly bug free sites.

As I've admitted, I am not very familiar with PHP/ASP, but I do believe that
CF does prevent inexperienced developers from making mistakes. I don't
think I've seen working SQL injection code for CF and MS SQL to date, but I
could be wrong... CF auto escapes the query for you, so that the risk of
SQL Injection is greatly reduced, if not eliminated.

I haven't worked with PHP/ASP, but from the code samples, I looked at, they
both seem to be more verbose, and nothing comes even close to the simplicity
of the CFQUERY tag.
sarcasmI don't know about you guys, but personally, I love storing my
database usernames and passwords in my code. /sarcasm

Now I'm not sure if PHP/ASP have any facilities that let you abstract the
connection information (ASP might through windows datasources, but they're
more difficult to create).

I don't think PHP has any sort of session management, so it's not even
a
contender in the enterprise world.

Can you elaborate on this?? I use session vars all the time in php. I
have
done apps for Verizon that are php.

The assertions CF folks make about open source always just make me cringe.

Please check your facts, even just briefly before you post. Or save as
a draft, come back an hour later, and still see if you want to post
it.
/rant

I'm sorry I didn't do my research, but I did mention that I don't have a lot
of experience with PHP/ASP. Nice to know that PHP has good session
clustering...

I think one of the nice things about this list, is if you say something
that's not true, someone will call you on it.

Plus If I feel that CF is better, and that PHP and ASP don't come close,
that it must be true. And that's the truthiness of it.

Russ

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

On 2/7/07, Andy Matthews [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Open source means you're offering up the source code for anyone to modify.
 It also means that when someone modifies your source code, they have to
 give
 it back to the community (you) for others to use.


Depends on the license.  I use the BSD license.  There are no requirments
that modifications come back to me for inclusion.  Heck, someone could take
CFFM, making some mods, encrypt it and sell it.  (RabidCFFM, anyone?) ...
under the BSD license, they could do that as long s they included my
original license file in the distribution.

rick


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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 -Original Message-
 From: Jordan Michaels [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 12:40 PM
 To: CF-Talk
 Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 Russ wrote:
  I don't think PHP has any sort of session management, so it's not even a
  contender in the enterprise world.

  Personally, I don't know PHP or ASP.NET, but I should probably start
  learning them.

 Don't take this the wrong way Russ, but if you don't know PHP, how do
 you justify talking about it's feature set? Even more so, you then take
 that baseless and false feature set comment and use it to justify a
 comment about PHP's presence in the enterprise - something which you are
 clearly not at all acquainted with. It would be wise of you to consider
 your words before you make broad, unfounded, and completely false
 statements about something you admittedly do not know about.

 For the record, PHP does indeed have session management, and I know
 several enterprise-level companies who rely on it heavily.

I said I don't think that PHP has session management, and I expected someone
on this list to correct me if I was wrong.  You and John did, and I thank
you for that. 

Russ

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread John Paul Ashenfelter

I was talking about bugs in code too -- SQL injection, XSS, bad logic,
etc. And I'd argue personally and professionally using dozens of sites
I've been hired to work on as a basis, that since CF *is* so simple,
it's more likely that there are deadly bugs in the code -- even now,
years into the existence of CF, I see CFQUERY without CFQUERYPARAM
around form or url variables. I also see plenty of files uploaded to
web accessible directories through web forms. Wow, it sure was easy
for the developer to add the capability to hose both the database and
the entire server with those bugs respectively. Does that happen in
other languages, sure. But easy doesn't mean a thing about bug-free.

As I've admitted, I am not very familiar with PHP/ASP, but I do believe that
CF does prevent inexperienced developers from making mistakes.

Not one bit. There's no automatic type checking. There's no automatic
database parameterization. There's no few options for input validation
and cleansing built in, etc etc. I'm not arguing that those things are
required by a language, but I *am* disputing the assertion that
because CF is easy that it prevents inexperienced developers from
making mistakes.

Truthfully, I'd be more inclined to argue that languages like Java and
Python _prevent_ inexperienced developers from making mistakes because
many inexperienced developers simply don't understand them :)

I don't
think I've seen working SQL injection code for CF and MS SQL to date, but I
could be wrong... CF auto escapes the query for you, so that the risk of
SQL Injection is greatly reduced, if not eliminated.

That's ridiculous. CF autoescapes quotes -- that's got *nothing* to do
with SQL injection. And it's *easy* to demonstrate it in CF -- here's
one from DevNet to get you started
http://www.adobe.com/devnet/coldfusion/articles/cfqueryparam.html

Plus If I feel that CF is better, and that PHP and ASP don't come close,
that it must be true. And that's the truthiness of it.

I appreciate and respect your right to your beliefs -- unfortunately I
believe that you shouldn't propose that your ideas or beliefs are
facts when it is clear that 30s of google would show them inaccurate.
It wastes time, bandwidth, and adds data to the collective mailing
list to sort through to get to the real, useful stuff. Unlike this
message :)

--
John Paul Ashenfelter
CTO/Transitionpoint
(blog) http://www.ashenfelter.com
(email) [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Dave Watts

This has been my experience as well. CF makes development easier - bad
development as well as good development.

That's ridiculous. CF autoescapes quotes -- that's got
*nothing* to do with SQL injection. And it's *easy* to
demonstrate it in CF -- here's one from DevNet to get you
started
http://www.adobe.com/devnet/coldfusion/articles/cfqueryparam.html

Escaping quotes does make SQL injection a little harder, but far from
impossible.

Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
http://www.figleaf.com/

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

On 2/7/07, Dave Watts [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 Escaping quotes does make SQL injection a little harder, but far from
 impossible.



cfparam name=url.id default=0; delete from myTable;
cfquery ... 
select * from myTable where id=#url.id#
/cfquery

If I'm not mistaken - that would only work in SQL Server, right?

cuz only SQL server lets you pass through multiple queries all at once.

Rick


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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Dave Watts

 cfparam name=url.id default=0; delete from myTable; 
 cfquery ...  select * from myTable where id=#url.id# /cfquery
 
 If I'm not mistaken - that would only work in SQL Server, right?
 
 cuz only SQL server lets you pass through multiple queries 
 all at once.

Well, it's a bit more complicated than that. The ability to batch SQL
commands depends on database drivers, not the actual database, I think.
Also, not all SQL injection attacks rely on SQL batching - some involve
causing database errors, some involve comments, etc. Google second-order
SQL injection for more info.

Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
http://www.figleaf.com/

Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta,
Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location.
Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information!


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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Yikes, wasn't expecting this big a response! (If only it was full of people
saying YES!)

Matt Quackenbush wrote:
At the risk of sounding like a complete [EMAIL PROTECTED]!, why would
anyone want to go
backwards and use Railo? I mean, it's still not even compatible with CF
MX. I'm sure I speak for an extremely high percentage of CFers out there
when I say, Thank God we're not in the pre-MX days anymore! (For those
who never were in the pre-MX days, trust me, you're happy about it.)

There are plenty of reasons to use Railo, but before I get into that, can you
give an example of an important CFMX feature that Railo lacks?

It doesn't support cfapplet, but I never use cfapplet and can't see me ever
wanting to. Ditto cfcache, cfchart, cfgrid, cfreport, cftree.

If you're someone that requires those tags then maybe Railo isn't for you, but
it certainly isn't a pre-MX compiler!

Now, getting back to why would anyone want to move forwards onto Railo, I've
created an entry on my weblog to cover five features I like that Railo has over
CFMX.
- cfdump/eval
- cffile/info
- cfloop/file
- Array/Struct/Query creation
- Resources
You can read the full thing here:
http://blog.bpsite.net/index.php/Why%20Railo.html?itemid=24

If these plus the things Gert went into are not enough to convince you that
Railo is not simply a viable option, but also a serious contender, then I'm
happy to go on and on about all the great things which Railo has to offer -
just say the word. ;)

Dale Fraser wrote:
All those items you list are only relevant to hosting providers,

Just wanted to highlight this point, because Railo is good for hosting.
With CF shared hosting, users don't have Administrator access, and often have
to ask their hosts for datasources.
Railo Enterprise comes with an overall server Admin, AND a seperate Admin for
each webroot.

If this wasn't the case, I wouldn't be asking here if people wanted Railo CFML
hosting - I'd be going to my photography club and asking if anyone wanted photo
hosting instead.

Doug Brown wrote:
Just a side note, or question...What reasons do people think that asp/php has
the stronghold on web development
ASP - because it's Microsoft.
PHP - because it's free, and an improvement over CGI/Perl.

and what can be done to make CF just as popular?

A. Better performing code
B. Cheaper development
C. Cheaper hosting
D. Other (Explain)

A: Yup. (Railo!)
B: Yup. (Railo!)
C: Yup. (Railo! ...well, if I get enough interest to go ahead :P )
D:
Okay, there are a few repeated things that I encounter when trying to promote
CF in the past:
1) Many people don't believe it's a proper language. They think it's a
lightweight markup language, not a fully-featured powerful scripting language.
2) The tags put people off. For some reason people seem to like ambiguous
C-style curly brackets, and the starting-with-cf bit isn't popular.
3) Because of the tags, it's often perceived that CFML must be mixed in with
HTML.
4) The price - many (most?) people in the CF world aren't even aware of
Railo/BlueDragon/Smith, so trying to point out to non-CFers that there are low
price and free solutions often doesn't get anywhere.

To make it popular, these need to be countered, along with re-affirming the
main benefits.

Someone with Flash skills should make a viral promotional meme thingy that does
this, and then CF can take over the world! *insert hysterical laughter*

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Will you be waiting for version 1.1?

I believe that will be very close to Adobe CF 7

I'll be going with the latest stable release. Whether that starts of being 1.1 
depends on how soon that is released and how long it takes to get myself sorted.

If I'm ready before 1.1 then I'll start with 1.0 and upgrade when it becomes 
available.

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

 You can read the full thing here: http://blog.bpsite.net/index.
 php/Why%20Railo.html?itemid=24

Ooops, URL got chopped. Should be everything inside the brackets...
[ http://blog.bpsite.net/index.php/Why%20Railo.html?itemid=24 ]

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RE: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

2007-02-07 Thread Dave Watts

 There are plenty of reasons to use Railo, but before I get 
 into that, can you give an example of an important CFMX 
 feature that Railo lacks?

Flash Remoting?
Event Gateway?
Recordsets from stored procedures?

Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
http://www.figleaf.com/

Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Flash Remoting?
Not sure I consider that an /important/ feature myself.
Eitherway, I think its fair to say that CFMX is always going to be best option 
for anyone doing Flash/Flex integration stuff.

Event Gateway?
Ok, but one could argue that this is also absent from CFMX standard.

Recordsets from stored procedures?
Fair enough.
Not something I've needed in my personal stuff, but we do use them at work, and 
it'd probably be a pain trying to solve it without cfstoredproc.


 There are plenty of reasons to use Railo, but before I get 
 into that, can you give an example of an important CFMX 
 feature that Railo lacks?

Flash Remoting?
Event Gateway?
Recordsets from stored procedures?

Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
http://www.figleaf.com/

Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta,
Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location.
Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information!

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Flash Remoting
is supported by Railo 1.0. But only the calls to .cfm files. A AMF
Filter is included. Railo 1.1

Event gateways:
we won't implement this feature yet. We need to leave arguments for
others :-)

Recordsets from stored procedures:
In 1.0 it is possible to call stored procedures in cfquery. Railo 1.1
will support cfstoredproc*

What about the others?

struct(), array(), query(), arrayfind(), dump(), cfdump eval=, cfadmin
Server and web administrator?

I know we still have work to do. But we will...

Gert

Dave Watts schrieb:
There are plenty of reasons to use Railo, but before I get
into that, can you give an example of an important CFMX
feature that Railo lacks?

Flash Remoting?
Event Gateway?
Recordsets from stored procedures?

Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
http://www.figleaf.com/

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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Sorry Railo 1.1 will support calls to .cfc's as well...


Gert Franz schrieb:
 Flash Remoting
 is supported by Railo 1.0. But only the calls to .cfm files. A AMF 
 Filter is included. Railo 1.1

 Event gateways:
 we won't implement this feature yet. We need to leave arguments for 
 others :-)

 Recordsets from stored procedures:
 In 1.0 it is possible to call stored procedures in cfquery. Railo 1.1 
 will support cfstoredproc*


 What about the others?

 struct(), array(), query(), arrayfind(), dump(), cfdump eval=, cfadmin
 Server and web administrator?

 I know we still have work to do. But we will...

 Gert

   


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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Indeed, and you always will as in all reality it will be Adobe who define
the CFML language (albeit not official) and any competing engine will
always be behind that set.  Of course there are times when new systems
provide additional functionality but any one expecting CFML will expect the
the base minimum which ColdFusion provides I would think.



   




 
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-Original Message-
From: Gert Franz
To: CF-Talk
Sent: Wed Feb 07 22:52:30 2007
Subject: Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?

Flash Remoting
is supported by Railo 1.0. But only the calls to .cfm files. A AMF 
Filter is included. Railo 1.1

Event gateways:
we won't implement this feature yet. We need to leave arguments for 
others :-)

Recordsets from stored procedures:
In 1.0 it is possible to call stored procedures in cfquery. Railo 1.1 
will support cfstoredproc*


What about the others?

struct(), array(), query(), arrayfind(), dump(), cfdump eval=, cfadmin
Server and web administrator?

I know we still have work to do. But we will...

Gert

Dave Watts schrieb:
 There are plenty of reasons to use Railo, but before I get 
 into that, can you give an example of an important CFMX 
 feature that Railo lacks?
 

 Flash Remoting?
 Event Gateway?
 Recordsets from stored procedures?

 Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
 http://www.figleaf.com/

 Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
 instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta,
 Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location.
 Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information!


 



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Re: Anyone interested in Railo hosting?