Re: Back to the Project

2016-10-15 Thread Guy Waterval 
Hi Raphael,

Happy to see you again here.

Regards
-- 
gw


2016-10-16 3:17 GMT+02:00 Raphael Bircher :

> Hi there
>
> I'm honest, I'm a bit surprised by this project. Some weeks there was
> rumors, that the project is dead, and some weeks later you put out the new
> version. I know exactly what it takes to release a new version of AOO. So
> congratulation to you guys.
>
> Well, i have not so much time as in the past. I have a realy important
> project (nothing to do with Computers). But I will do some contributions.
> BTW. The moast viewed Video on my YouTube Channel is one about Apache
> OpenOffice.
>
> For the people how don't know me. I'm a OpenOffice community member since
> late 2005 and a initial committer of Apache OpenOffice in 2011. I stepped
> back from the Apache OpenOffice PMC at the beginning of 2015. Since then I
> was silent. My main focus was on QA. What I do next, we will see. ;-) FYI I
> switched OS. I'm now on Windows 10 and not an OS X.
>
> Regards Raphael
>
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
>
>

Back to the Project

2016-10-15 Thread Raphael Bircher 

Hi there

I'm honest, I'm a bit surprised by this project. Some weeks there was 
rumors, that the project is dead, and some weeks later you put out the 
new version. I know exactly what it takes to release a new version of 
AOO. So congratulation to you guys.


Well, i have not so much time as in the past. I have a realy important 
project (nothing to do with Computers). But I will do some 
contributions. BTW. The moast viewed Video on my YouTube Channel is one 
about Apache OpenOffice.


For the people how don't know me. I'm a OpenOffice community member 
since late 2005 and a initial committer of Apache OpenOffice in 2011. I 
stepped back from the Apache OpenOffice PMC at the beginning of 2015. 
Since then I was silent. My main focus was on QA. What I do next, we 
will see. ;-) FYI I switched OS. I'm now on Windows 10 and not an OS X.


Regards Raphael


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Re: Congratulations for all efforts of the past! Note from a user

2016-10-15 Thread Marcus 

Am 10/15/2016 02:56 PM, schrieb fzieg...@freenet.de:


I was encouraged to leave my aoo forum post directly in the dev mailing list so 
that you all can read what I wanted to express. I am not a software developper 
in any sense--only a user.

Dear developers,
there may be little positive feedback for your work, I guess. So I created an 
account for the forum (and now subscribed temporarily to dev@aoo) to leave a 
big THANK YOU!

The  first version I used must have been something like StarOffice 4.3, the  
first I owned was SO 5.2, and then I shifted to OpenOffice(.org) when it  
introduced the XML file formats. So I am a convinced and longterm user  since 
then and hardly ever regretted my decision.

OpenOffice  gave me the possibility to mostly do what I wanted to (with writer, 
 base, calc, impress and draw - in that historic order) in an efficient  way, 
and the only thing I don't like is, that it always tends towards following  MS 
Office although it already was better in many ways. I understand that it is  
crucial to get as many users as possible, so I acknowledge the decisions  
towards MS Office.

What I like most is the long term usability  and stability, and I do not only 
keep my office files from more than 10  years ago, I also use and re-use them. 
And if one crashed in the past, I nearly  always could recover them by opening 
the zip bundle with an (hex) editor.

By that, I  enjoyed the progress in LibreOffice, but didn't really need it. 
Although  I switched to LibreOffice on some machines, I am always glad that 
there  is OpenOffice, too. In my eyes, it is the more stable and efficient  
branch of the project. This year it was my fallback tool and salvation  in a 
book project that I started with LO Writer;   I first invested hours to get my 
pictures back to the place they  belonged to when they got more and more (as 
others did decades before  with MS Word) and then had to give up as it didn't 
open the file anymore  without crashing. Apache OpenOffice (standard and 
portable) solved the problem. It got a nice book, by  the way, for our church 
jubilee.

So if you get the software  maintained, I will probably continue to use 
OpenOffice for another 20  years. And I won't switch to DTP software (Scribus) 
for the next book  project neither like I regularly do for magazines, brochures 
etc.

OpenOffice is a great, great software, even if it didn't evolve much in the 
last years! (maybe even: because..)   Powerful enough for both private and 
standard business use.

Keep patience and persistance!

A very satisfied and content user


thank you very much for your many kind words. We are happy to have 
satisfied users like you. It's not often that we are seeing users with 
such a long history dedicated to OpenOffice and its previous applications.


Thanks again and much fun and success with the new release.

Marcus


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Re: openoffice programming

2016-10-15 Thread Simon P. Lucy 
If you seriously want to redevelop OO then you need to rearchitect and
replace in an incremental fashion.
Don't try and convert code or even translate, instead concentrate on the
features and replace using a micro architecture.

S

On 14 Oct 2016 12:48,  wrote:

> I have a suggestion that Apache should write OpenOffice using Java and
> Netbeans platform.
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
>

Re: [How to Cook a Release]

2016-10-15 Thread Marcus 

Am 10/15/2016 08:28 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

Marcus wrote:

https://projects.apache.org/project.html?openoffice

I've updated the data and also published the webpage but the project's
webpage [2] is still showing the 4.1.2 data. Does it take some hours to
show the new data?


Yes, most data on the "projects" subsite are only updated on cron jobs.
Anyway, I see 4.1.3 listed correctly now.


great, I've documented this detail.

Marcus


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Re: [How to Cook a Release]

2016-10-15 Thread Andrea Pescetti 

Marcus wrote:

https://projects.apache.org/project.html?openoffice

I've updated the data and also published the webpage but the project's
webpage [2] is still showing the 4.1.2 data. Does it take some hours to
show the new data?


Yes, most data on the "projects" subsite are only updated on cron jobs. 
Anyway, I see 4.1.3 listed correctly now.


Regards,
  Andrea.

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Re: openoffice programming

2016-10-15 Thread Damjan Jovanovic 
On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 4:17 PM, Alex Suk  wrote:

> Damjan Jovanovic wrote
> > But even at a rate of rewriting 1000 lines per day in Java, it would take
> > 1 days, which is about 28 man years, to rewrite OpenOffice's 10
> > million
> > lines of code...
>
> I am no programmer but this is very interesting!
> Do 10M lines in C++ convert to 10M lines in Java? Is it a 1:1 conversion?
> Are there successful examples similar in magnitude to AOO in the software
> world of such code rewrites from language A to language B? How did they
> make
> it?
> Is it possible to reduce the 10M lines for conversion by for example
> omitting Draw and Base from the suite?
> Can this conversion be performed in a modular way?
> Many thanks for answering.
>
>
Some language constructs only allow 1 expression. For example both C++ and
Java require 1 expression as the while loop condition. If the conversion
generated more expressions in Java than there were in C++, there would be
the serious issue of having to modify surrounding code to evaluate these
expressions, so their results can combine into 1 while loop condition
expression.

There are places where Java must use multiple expressions where C++ had 1,
for example because Java's bit shift operators on int only shift by the
lowest 5 bits, while C++'s shift by the entire value (it's "undefined
behaviour" to shift beyond the first operand size according to the
specification, but I follow actual GCC and Clang behaviour on amd64). So 1
<< 128 overflows to 0 in C++, but remains 1 in Java.
 x << y in C++ would have to translate into this in Java:
(y & ~0x1f) == 0 ? (x << y) : 0
which can't be done like that, as y is evaluated twice, with potential side
effects: if the expression was 5 << i++, i would be incremented twice. We
thus have to make a copy of y and evaluate the copy. This would be an extra
statement that has to be added somewhere. So far I've dealt with that by
compiling such expressions into calls to helper methods like
Integers.shiftLeft(), which make copies of the parameters and operate on
those copies, thus keeping the conversion 1:1.

I am not sure what can be omitted. After all you can draw in a spreadsheet,
and you can import database data.

Yes, at least some of the conversion could be done module-at-a-time for
modules that are only accessed through UNO.

Damjan

Re: openoffice programming

2016-10-15 Thread Andrew Douglas Pitonyak 

On 10/15/2016 10:17 AM, Alex Suk wrote:

Damjan Jovanovic wrote

But even at a rate of rewriting 1000 lines per day in Java, it would take
1 days, which is about 28 man years, to rewrite OpenOffice's 10
million
lines of code...

Do 10M lines in C++ convert to 10M lines in Java? Is it a 1:1 conversion?


An automated transformation will almost always be close to a 1:1 
conversion because that is easier to do.


Regardless, it is a tricky business and difficult to get it right. It is 
difficult to do the conversion, and even the clean-up after the 
conversion is tricky business.



Are there successful examples similar in magnitude to AOO in the software
world of such code rewrites from language A to language B? How did they make
it?
Is it possible to reduce the 10M lines for conversion by for example
omitting Draw and Base from the suite?
Can this conversion be performed in a modular way?
Many thanks for answering.


--
Andrew Pitonyak
My Macro Document: http://www.pitonyak.org/AndrewMacro.odt
Info:  http://www.pitonyak.org/oo.php


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Re: openoffice programming

2016-10-15 Thread Alex Suk 
Damjan Jovanovic wrote
> But even at a rate of rewriting 1000 lines per day in Java, it would take
> 1 days, which is about 28 man years, to rewrite OpenOffice's 10
> million
> lines of code...

I am no programmer but this is very interesting!
Do 10M lines in C++ convert to 10M lines in Java? Is it a 1:1 conversion?
Are there successful examples similar in magnitude to AOO in the software
world of such code rewrites from language A to language B? How did they make
it?
Is it possible to reduce the 10M lines for conversion by for example
omitting Draw and Base from the suite?
Can this conversion be performed in a modular way? 
Many thanks for answering.



--
View this message in context: 
http://openoffice.2283327.n4.nabble.com/openoffice-programming-tp4683649p4683681.html
Sent from the Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Re: 4.1.4_release_blocker requested: [Issue 127147] RAT scan reports some files (automatically created at build time) that need to be added to exclude list

2016-10-15 Thread Andrea Pescetti 

Marcus wrote:

Of course I would to the fix first in trunk and locally before
committing to the new AOO414 branch.


Just to be clear on what is expected in general: bugs are normally fixed 
in trunk (and, if a discussion is needed on whether they should be fixed 
-not this case- it happens on Bugzilla or the dev list); only then they 
should be flagged as blockers and then the patch, depending on whether 
it applies without changes or not, is merged or ported to AOO414.


So fixing it in trunk is still useful regardless of the AOO414 branch, 
and you can just go ahead with this, don't worry!


Regards,
  Andrea.

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Congratulations for all efforts of the past! Note from a user

2016-10-15 Thread fziegler 
Hi,
I was encouraged to leave my aoo forum post directly in the dev mailing list so 
that you all can read what I wanted to express. I am not a software developper 
in any sense--only a user.
 
Dear developers,
there may be little positive feedback for your work, I guess. So I created an 
account for the forum (and now subscribed temporarily to dev@aoo) to leave a 
big THANK YOU!   

The  first version I used must have been something like StarOffice 4.3, the  
first I owned was SO 5.2, and then I shifted to OpenOffice(.org) when it  
introduced the XML file formats. So I am a convinced and longterm user  since 
then and hardly ever regretted my decision. 

OpenOffice  gave me the possibility to mostly do what I wanted to (with writer, 
 base, calc, impress and draw - in that historic order) in an efficient  way, 
and the only thing I don't like is, that it always tends towards following  MS 
Office although it already was better in many ways. I understand that it is  
crucial to get as many users as possible, so I acknowledge the decisions  
towards MS Office.

What I like most is the long term usability  and stability, and I do not only 
keep my office files from more than 10  years ago, I also use and re-use them. 
And if one crashed in the past, I nearly  always could recover them by opening 
the zip bundle with an (hex) editor.

By that, I  enjoyed the progress in LibreOffice, but didn't really need it. 
Although  I switched to LibreOffice on some machines, I am always glad that 
there  is OpenOffice, too. In my eyes, it is the more stable and efficient  
branch of the project. This year it was my fallback tool and salvation  in a 
book project that I started with LO Writer;   I first invested hours to get my 
pictures back to the place they  belonged to when they got more and more (as 
others did decades before  with MS Word) and then had to give up as it didn't 
open the file anymore  without crashing. Apache OpenOffice (standard and 
portable) solved the problem. It got a nice book, by  the way, for our church 
jubilee.

So if you get the software  maintained, I will probably continue to use 
OpenOffice for another 20  years. And I won't switch to DTP software (Scribus) 
for the next book  project neither like I regularly do for magazines, brochures 
etc.

OpenOffice is a great, great software, even if it didn't evolve much in the 
last years! (maybe even: because..)   Powerful enough for both private and 
standard business use.

Keep patience and persistance!   

A very satisfied and content user


---
Die Bundesliga hat begonnen! Alle Tore, alle Ergebnisse, alle News: Pocket Liga 
jetzt im AppStore oder Google Play Store herunterladen - kostenlos!

Re: 4.1.4_release_blocker requested: [Issue 127147] RAT scan reports some files (automatically created at build time) that need to be added to exclude list

2016-10-15 Thread Marcus 

Am 09/29/2016 08:01 PM, schrieb Marcus:

Am 09/29/2016 08:00 PM, schrieb bugzi...@apache.org:

Marcus has asked for 4.1.4_release_blocker:
Issue 127147: RAT scan reports some files (automatically created at
build time)
that need to be added to exclude list
https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=127147


@Ariel:
As you are now the release mananger for 4.1.4, I'm writting to you.

I would like to fix this issue:

Then we have a clean and green RAT scan report.
The risk is totally low as it is no code change but in the build tools only.

Of course I would to the fix first in trunk and locally before 
committing to the new AOO414 branch.


Thanks

Marcus


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Re: Writing up the release process

2016-10-15 Thread Marcus 

Am 10/14/2016 09:01 AM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:

Keith N. McKenna wrote:

Pedro wrote:

Currently version 4.1.2 still reports that it "is up to date"

I have added the your comment to the cwiki document. The change to the
update script is usually done several days after the formal Release
announcement so as to minimize the load on the mirrors.


I confirm this is the case. I plan to update script data during the
weekend.


+1

In the past we have waited a longer time (IMHO 1 -2 weeks). But to get 
the good news out to the world fast, I would do an except here.


Marcus


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Re: [RELEASE COOKBOOK] Adding and structuring the content

2016-10-15 Thread Marcus 

Am 10/15/2016 10:44 AM, schrieb Patricia Shanahan:


On 10/15/2016 1:43 AM, Marcus wrote:

Am 10/14/2016 12:11 AM, schrieb Keith N. McKenna:

Marcus wrote:

Am 10/13/2016 09:34 PM, schrieb Keith N. McKenna:


https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/How+to+Cook+a+Release



You just need to add some text. Don't care about formatting or
order. We
will do this later when everything (hopefully ;-) ) is there.

Hey, it's a great idea when you would coordinate the creation of this
cookbook. Then you learn more about the whole process, can add
opinions
from your point of view, etc.

What do you think?

Great. Thanks Marcus.


just to let you know:
I've added a lot of stuff and added also some structure and formatting.
But just to not loose the overview. ;-)

Of course this doesn't mean that this structure has to be used. We are
still free to change where it is necessary or looks better.


I'm doing a little editing right now, and it looks good to me at least
as an interim structure.


great, for the moment I'm done.

Marcus

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Re: [RELEASE COOKBOOK] Adding and structuring the content

2016-10-15 Thread Marcus 

Am 10/15/2016 11:18 AM, schrieb Jörg Schmidt:


I can see that the English press release is to be published in the blog.

questions:
--
1. Is it really only published there? Is there no press distributor(*) at the 
ASF?

(*) in german: "Presseverteiler"


I pretty sure it was not only a blog post but also a mail to several 
press agencies and similar recipients.


This is managed by Sally as current ASF press representative. To be sure 
you can ask her to get the answer you want. AFAIK we don't know these 
details.



2. Where will the translated press releases be published?
Imho:
in the wiki and they should be linked to the local pages (for example 
http://www.openoffice.org/en/)


It depends on what we want. But the work done for the 4.1.3 
announcements seems to me a good step forward to a solution.


Marcus


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Re: [RELEASE COOKBOOK] Adding and structuring the content

2016-10-15 Thread Jörg Schmidt 

I can see that the English press release is to be published in the blog.

questions:
--
1. Is it really only published there? Is there no press distributor(*) at the 
ASF?

(*) in german: "Presseverteiler" 


2. Where will the translated press releases be published?
Imho: 
in the wiki and they should be linked to the local pages (for example 
http://www.openoffice.org/en/)


Jörg



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Re: This can not be true

2016-10-15 Thread Jörg Schmidt 
> From: Patricia Shanahan [mailto:p...@acm.org] 

> I have started a Wiki page on "How to Cook a Release", 
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/How+to+Co
> ok+a+Release, 
> so that we will know everything that needs to be done and how 
> to do it. 
> That should reduce the risk of something important getting 
> missed. I'm 
> adding a section on Translations.

yes I see. That's right so

> What documents, other than the release notes and the press release, 
> should be translated?

At the moment I know nothing more


Jörg


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Re: [RELEASE COOKBOOK] Adding and structuring the content

2016-10-15 Thread Patricia Shanahan 


On 10/15/2016 1:43 AM, Marcus wrote:

Am 10/14/2016 12:11 AM, schrieb Keith N. McKenna:

Marcus wrote:

Am 10/13/2016 09:34 PM, schrieb Keith N. McKenna:


https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/How+to+Cook+a+Release


You just need to add some text. Don't care about formatting or
order. We
will do this later when everything (hopefully ;-) ) is there.

Hey, it's a great idea when you would coordinate the creation of this
cookbook. Then you learn more about the whole process, can add
opinions
from your point of view, etc.

What do you think?

Great. Thanks Marcus.


just to let you know:
I've added a lot of stuff and added also some structure and formatting.
But just to not loose the overview. ;-)

Of course this doesn't mean that this structure has to be used. We are
still free to change where it is necessary or looks better.


I'm doing a little editing right now, and it looks good to me at least 
as an interim structure.



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[RELEASE COOKBOOK] Adding and structuring the content

2016-10-15 Thread Marcus 

Am 10/14/2016 12:11 AM, schrieb Keith N. McKenna:

Marcus wrote:

Am 10/13/2016 09:34 PM, schrieb Keith N. McKenna:


https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/How+to+Cook+a+Release

You just need to add some text. Don't care about formatting or order. We
will do this later when everything (hopefully ;-) ) is there.

Hey, it's a great idea when you would coordinate the creation of this
cookbook. Then you learn more about the whole process, can add opinions
from your point of view, etc.

What do you think?

Great. Thanks Marcus.


just to let you know:
I've added a lot of stuff and added also some structure and formatting. 
But just to not loose the overview. ;-)


Of course this doesn't mean that this structure has to be used. We are 
still free to change where it is necessary or looks better.


Marcus

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