Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 22:00:10 UTC, John Colvin wrote: https://github.com/CyberShadow/DFeed/pull/15 Thank you for fixing it.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 01:05:18 UTC, Tyler Jameson Little wrote: [..] It's true though that there are much better answers (and questions) here than on SO, and I'm beginning to shift my search from Google to the forum search, but this isn't something a newcomer will know to do, especially since many other languages put more emphasis on SO. Speaking of searching on this forum: in Chrome, the search box in top right corner of this page has a peculiar feature of being mostly a clickable link item to forum.dlang.org. Only a small fragment (about 25%) shows a text cursor. Sorry for posting this issue here, but I didn't find a suitable category in forum index. Maybe one could be created - Forum use issues?
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 09:21:27 UTC, Paul Jurczak wrote: On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 01:05:18 UTC, Tyler Jameson Little wrote: [..] It's true though that there are much better answers (and questions) here than on SO, and I'm beginning to shift my search from Google to the forum search, but this isn't something a newcomer will know to do, especially since many other languages put more emphasis on SO. Speaking of searching on this forum: in Chrome, the search box in top right corner of this page has a peculiar feature of being mostly a clickable link item to forum.dlang.org. Only a small fragment (about 25%) shows a text cursor. Sorry for posting this issue here, but I didn't find a suitable category in forum index. Maybe one could be created - Forum use issues? This is dependant on the size of your window. If your window is so narrow that the title is overlapping the search box then the title takes precedence, which is not desirable. You could create an issue here to report it: https://github.com/CyberShadow/DFeed
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 11:00:20 UTC, John Colvin wrote: On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 09:21:27 UTC, Paul Jurczak wrote: On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 01:05:18 UTC, Tyler Jameson Little wrote: [..] It's true though that there are much better answers (and questions) here than on SO, and I'm beginning to shift my search from Google to the forum search, but this isn't something a newcomer will know to do, especially since many other languages put more emphasis on SO. Speaking of searching on this forum: in Chrome, the search box in top right corner of this page has a peculiar feature of being mostly a clickable link item to forum.dlang.org. Only a small fragment (about 25%) shows a text cursor. Sorry for posting this issue here, but I didn't find a suitable category in forum index. Maybe one could be created - Forum use issues? This is dependant on the size of your window. If your window is so narrow that the title is overlapping the search box then the title takes precedence, which is not desirable. You could create an issue here to report it: https://github.com/CyberShadow/DFeed Thanks, that's exactly what is happening, except I wouldn't call my window narrow - it is 1200 pixels wide, but 1600 pixels high. I will report this issue.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 20:12:49 UTC, Paul Jurczak wrote: On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 11:00:20 UTC, John Colvin wrote: On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 09:21:27 UTC, Paul Jurczak wrote: On Saturday, 17 August 2013 at 01:05:18 UTC, Tyler Jameson Little wrote: [..] It's true though that there are much better answers (and questions) here than on SO, and I'm beginning to shift my search from Google to the forum search, but this isn't something a newcomer will know to do, especially since many other languages put more emphasis on SO. Speaking of searching on this forum: in Chrome, the search box in top right corner of this page has a peculiar feature of being mostly a clickable link item to forum.dlang.org. Only a small fragment (about 25%) shows a text cursor. Sorry for posting this issue here, but I didn't find a suitable category in forum index. Maybe one could be created - Forum use issues? This is dependant on the size of your window. If your window is so narrow that the title is overlapping the search box then the title takes precedence, which is not desirable. You could create an issue here to report it: https://github.com/CyberShadow/DFeed Thanks, that's exactly what is happening, except I wouldn't call my window narrow - it is 1200 pixels wide, but 1600 pixels high. I will report this issue. https://github.com/CyberShadow/DFeed/pull/15
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 02:30:42 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Wednesday, August 14, 2013 22:56:30 Andre Artus wrote: As with many things it depends on what you want to achieve. Answering on SO is as much about establishing awareness as it is about answering the question. For a newcomer to D StackOverflow may be their first port of call, if questions go unanswered, or are answered after long delays, then the likelihood of the person persisting with D is diminished. I answer questions on SO all the time, but I rarely ask anything there, and I never ask anything D-related there. Of course, if my question is D-related, I'm much more likely to _have_ to ask my question here to get a good answer anyway just based on how many people would even know the answer, simply because I know enough that anything I asked would be much more likely to be esoteric and/or require in-depth knowledge. The experts are all here, and only a small portion of them are on SO. In any case, I'd say that in general, asking your question on SO gives it more visibility to those outside of the core D community, but you're more likely to get a good answer here than there, because there are more people here, and this is where the experts are. - Jonathan M Davis First off, thank you so much for answering questions on SO. Answers there come up higher in Google search results than questions here, and several of your answers have been very helpful to me. There are others that answer, who I'm also grateful for, but your name always sticks out to me when I see an answer there. It's true though that there are much better answers (and questions) here than on SO, and I'm beginning to shift my search from Google to the forum search, but this isn't something a newcomer will know to do, especially since many other languages put more emphasis on SO.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On 8/14/2013 10:05 PM, Brad Anderson wrote: On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 02:30:42 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Wednesday, August 14, 2013 22:56:30 Andre Artus wrote: As with many things it depends on what you want to achieve. Answering on SO is as much about establishing awareness as it is about answering the question. For a newcomer to D StackOverflow may be their first port of call, if questions go unanswered, or are answered after long delays, then the likelihood of the person persisting with D is diminished. I answer questions on SO all the time And I have to thank you for that. You leave some great, in-depth answers on Stack Overflow. I'll chime in thanking Jonathan for this valuable contribution.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 05:06:48 UTC, Nick Sabalausky wrote: On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 22:56:30 +0200 Andre Artus andre.ar...@gmail.com wrote: A relatively small number of people are attracted to tools and languages that don't have broad exposure. These people are marked by dogged determinism and a high tolerance for [mental] pain. Your average Joe or Jane is not like that, they have something they want to achieve and if they perceive the language/tools are working against them they will try something else. FWIW, I'm sold on D specifically *because* I have very little patience for tools that feel like they're working against me. Totally with Nick on this one. I liked C/C++ specifically because of the generic programming aspect + static typing. Then I learned that D did it better. Then I switched for my personal projects (all recently). == A self-case-study regarding SO The conversion started after I read this post on SO: http://stackoverflow.com/a/3560395/1467466 That... was shocking in simplicity. Shocking enough for me to play the what if game for a few minutes. It meant that someone could move a lot of functionality and hackery that build tools perform into the language and make it 'purdy. I *like* my code, including build tool, looking 'purdy. Or even 'purdy. Looking at it now, that demo is a code snippet. It demos *the code* and the constructs and how pretty it looks. The bullet point answer above it, the accepted one, didn't catch my eyes. It was just a list of features. I mean, yeah, CTFE was exciting, but the code snippet demonstrating how succinct it all was... THAT WAS EYE CATCHING. IT. WAS. 'PURDY. D's flippin' awesome, I can implement functionality like C++'s 'bind' function in 40 lines while the Boost library has to do in hundreds of lines (for compatibility, BUT STILL), I can deal with arbitrary tuples in a sane way, mixin arbitrary strings, I'm not constantly reaching down with my pointer finger to the less-than sign while my left hand is occupied with shift or scrunching my right pinky against the shift while my right middle is trying to hit the greater-than sign... D is just -pleasant-. I'm enjoying all of this now *because* I was tipped off on D's awesomeness... by StackOverflow. On the flip-side, here's 'nother tidbit (I saw this crazy thing before the post above): http://stackoverflow.com/a/7303196/1467466 Yeah, sure, it's impressive, but there's no code snippet. There's no demo of how the code was *written*. C++ also has Turing-complete metaprogramming, whoopdeedoo. My only experience at that point with metaprogramming had been torturous for anything more than a little complicated; what else could I have expected of this clearly masochistic individual's code? Nothing new here, moving along... was my thinking there. The post above it had snippets, but was kind of long and I didn't feel like diving too deep when I didn't yet care much for the language. == The long and short of it: I'm only one data point, but I'm still a data point. :-P I understand that, really, er'rything should be for knowledge's sake, but, if it isn't too much effort, please answer Qs while strutting D's prettiness on SO. Massive, massive kudos to whoever's had the patience to answer newbie questions, as unclear as they may have been sometimes (such as my own). == And the obligatory... HI FIRST TIME POSTING. Just yell at me if I get too obnoxious and whatnot.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On 8/14/2013 11:17 PM, Atash wrote: HI FIRST TIME POSTING. Just yell at me if I get too obnoxious and whatnot. I enjoyed your post. Welcome! and post more.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 17:55:38 UTC, monarch_dodra wrote: I'll chime in thanking Jonathan for this valuable contribution. I think I'll chip in by answering questions on SO too. I enjoy helping. Be warned - by the time notification about new question arrives in RSS feed, it usually already has long and comprehensive answer from Jonathan :)
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 06:11:32 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 8/14/2013 10:05 PM, Brad Anderson wrote: On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 02:30:42 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Wednesday, August 14, 2013 22:56:30 Andre Artus wrote: As with many things it depends on what you want to achieve. Answering on SO is as much about establishing awareness as it is about answering the question. For a newcomer to D StackOverflow may be their first port of call, if questions go unanswered, or are answered after long delays, then the likelihood of the person persisting with D is diminished. I answer questions on SO all the time And I have to thank you for that. You leave some great, in-depth answers on Stack Overflow. I'll chime in thanking Jonathan for this valuable contribution. I think I'll chip in by answering questions on SO too. I enjoy helping.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 00:23:16 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: You can define a filter that emails you whenever there are new questions on the D tag. Why not set up D.learn (or a new mailing list) to track that filter? That should help prompt the community here to engage with any new questions.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On 8/15/13 5:07 PM, Joseph Rushton Wakeling wrote: On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 00:23:16 UTC, Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: You can define a filter that emails you whenever there are new questions on the D tag. Why not set up D.learn (or a new mailing list) to track that filter? That should help prompt the community here to engage with any new questions. cc Vladimir Panteleev Terrific idea. Andrei
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Wednesday, 14 August 2013 at 19:52:13 UTC, Dejan Lekic wrote: On Tuesday, 6 August 2013 at 16:02:57 UTC, Atila Neves wrote: On Tuesday, 6 August 2013 at 01:22:29 UTC, Andre Artus wrote: Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/d Andrei Perhaps we can get it to 1000 answers? I'm looking through it now to see if I can find something I can answer. I think the lack of answers is due to most D aficionados posting questions on http://forum.dlang.org/group/digitalmars.D.learn instead of stackoverflow. The last time I asked a question I did it on both assuming I'd get better answers here than there. I was right and had to answer my own question on SO (with the answer I got on the forum from a helpful D programmer) so that others might benefit. I'm not entirely sure this relative insularity is good for D (which is why I bothered to ask my question on SO to begin with). Atila There is really nothing wrong about answering/asking questions here instead of the StackOverflow. As with many things it depends on what you want to achieve. Answering on SO is as much about establishing awareness as it is about answering the question. For a newcomer to D StackOverflow may be their first port of call, if questions go unanswered, or are answered after long delays, then the likelihood of the person persisting with D is diminished. A relatively small number of people are attracted to tools and languages that don't have broad exposure. These people are marked by dogged determinism and a high tolerance for [mental] pain. Your average Joe or Jane is not like that, they have something they want to achieve and if they perceive the language/tools are working against them they will try something else. It could be argued that D (broadly) isn't ready for Joe and Jane yet, but if it isn't yet, it must plan to be ready soon.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Wednesday, 14 August 2013 at 21:03:37 UTC, Adam D. Ruppe wrote: On Wednesday, 14 August 2013 at 20:56:33 UTC, Andre Artus wrote: if questions go unanswered, or are answered after long delays, then the likelihood of the person persisting with D is diminished. Is this a big problem with D? I don't do stack overflow often, but I try to check in every few days to check the D tag, and I usually see answers there by the time I click it. I don't think it is a big problem, 28 unanswered questions out of just over a thousand isn't a terrible stat, but most of those unanswered questions seem to have been there for months. About 1/2 of them have an answer, but are not marked as such. Often the question isn't clear, or the answer is given as a comment. I'm not saying that the D community is unresponsive, quite the opposite is true, my main point was that one cannot dismiss the value of discoverability.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On 8/14/13 2:59 PM, Andre Artus wrote: On Wednesday, 14 August 2013 at 21:03:37 UTC, Adam D. Ruppe wrote: On Wednesday, 14 August 2013 at 20:56:33 UTC, Andre Artus wrote: if questions go unanswered, or are answered after long delays, then the likelihood of the person persisting with D is diminished. Is this a big problem with D? I don't do stack overflow often, but I try to check in every few days to check the D tag, and I usually see answers there by the time I click it. I don't think it is a big problem, 28 unanswered questions out of just over a thousand isn't a terrible stat, but most of those unanswered questions seem to have been there for months. About 1/2 of them have an answer, but are not marked as such. Often the question isn't clear, or the answer is given as a comment. I'm not saying that the D community is unresponsive, quite the opposite is true, my main point was that one cannot dismiss the value of discoverability. Yes. In a way SO is preferable to this forum because it's much more popular. Andrei
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On 8/14/13 2:03 PM, Adam D. Ruppe wrote: On Wednesday, 14 August 2013 at 20:56:33 UTC, Andre Artus wrote: if questions go unanswered, or are answered after long delays, then the likelihood of the person persisting with D is diminished. Is this a big problem with D? I don't do stack overflow often, but I try to check in every few days to check the D tag, and I usually see answers there by the time I click it. You can define a filter that emails you whenever there are new questions on the D tag. Andrei
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Wednesday, August 14, 2013 22:56:30 Andre Artus wrote: As with many things it depends on what you want to achieve. Answering on SO is as much about establishing awareness as it is about answering the question. For a newcomer to D StackOverflow may be their first port of call, if questions go unanswered, or are answered after long delays, then the likelihood of the person persisting with D is diminished. I answer questions on SO all the time, but I rarely ask anything there, and I never ask anything D-related there. Of course, if my question is D-related, I'm much more likely to _have_ to ask my question here to get a good answer anyway just based on how many people would even know the answer, simply because I know enough that anything I asked would be much more likely to be esoteric and/or require in-depth knowledge. The experts are all here, and only a small portion of them are on SO. In any case, I'd say that in general, asking your question on SO gives it more visibility to those outside of the core D community, but you're more likely to get a good answer here than there, because there are more people here, and this is where the experts are. - Jonathan M Davis
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 02:30:42 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Wednesday, August 14, 2013 22:56:30 Andre Artus wrote: As with many things it depends on what you want to achieve. Answering on SO is as much about establishing awareness as it is about answering the question. For a newcomer to D StackOverflow may be their first port of call, if questions go unanswered, or are answered after long delays, then the likelihood of the person persisting with D is diminished. I answer questions on SO all the time, but I rarely ask anything there, and I never ask anything D-related there. Of course, if my question is D-related, I'm much more likely to _have_ to ask my question here to get a good answer anyway just based on how many people would even know the answer, simply because I know enough that anything I asked would be much more likely to be esoteric and/or require in-depth knowledge. The experts are all here, and only a small portion of them are on SO. In any case, I'd say that in general, asking your question on SO gives it more visibility to those outside of the core D community, but you're more likely to get a good answer here than there, because there are more people here, and this is where the experts are. - Jonathan M Davis I agree with every point you've made here. If I had a D related question I would not head for SO first. I have found a lot in the D forums without actually having to ask the questions myself. But it does not do much for D's exposure. Evangelizing takes planning and effort. Technical merit is unfortunately insufficient to guarantee success in the marketplace of ideas. I have known about D for quite some time, but did not put too much effort into it until recently. It's when I stumbled across the DConf2013 videos that I realized that there is some serious legs under D. The quality of the presentations (in terms of content over glitz) exceeded that of many similar conferences I've seen. Languages like Ruby, Python, PHP, R, etc. do not have the buzz they do because of inherent technical merit, but perhaps in spite of thereof. Each has some killer framework compelling you to adopt the language in order to benefit from it, and people putting serious effort into evangelizing and lowering the barriers. I see there is a thread going on creating D GUI framework, I think that would be a major step towards lowering the barriers. It needs to be part of a batteries included set-up for D. So you can download D and run your Hello World GUI app in under 10 minutes. Not spend half the day searching for mostly abandoned efforts and then spending the rest of the day compiling the C/C++ dependencies only later to find that you have been sucked into the 7th layer of Dependency Hell. While modern C++ has become a lot less unpleasant it is still unpleasant; someone new to D should never have to run a C/C++ compiler for any reason other than to compare compilation time (with a big fat grin on their dial for choosing D).
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 22:56:30 +0200 Andre Artus andre.ar...@gmail.com wrote: A relatively small number of people are attracted to tools and languages that don't have broad exposure. These people are marked by dogged determinism and a high tolerance for [mental] pain. Your average Joe or Jane is not like that, they have something they want to achieve and if they perceive the language/tools are working against them they will try something else. FWIW, I'm sold on D specifically *because* I have very little patience for tools that feel like they're working against me.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Thursday, 15 August 2013 at 02:30:42 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Wednesday, August 14, 2013 22:56:30 Andre Artus wrote: As with many things it depends on what you want to achieve. Answering on SO is as much about establishing awareness as it is about answering the question. For a newcomer to D StackOverflow may be their first port of call, if questions go unanswered, or are answered after long delays, then the likelihood of the person persisting with D is diminished. I answer questions on SO all the time And I have to thank you for that. You leave some great, in-depth answers on Stack Overflow.
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
On Tuesday, 6 August 2013 at 01:22:29 UTC, Andre Artus wrote: Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/d Andrei Perhaps we can get it to 1000 answers? I'm looking through it now to see if I can find something I can answer. I think the lack of answers is due to most D aficionados posting questions on http://forum.dlang.org/group/digitalmars.D.learn instead of stackoverflow. The last time I asked a question I did it on both assuming I'd get better answers here than there. I was right and had to answer my own question on SO (with the answer I got on the forum from a helpful D programmer) so that others might benefit. I'm not entirely sure this relative insularity is good for D (which is why I bothered to ask my question on SO to begin with). Atila
Re: D reaches 1000 questions on stackoverflow
Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/d Andrei Perhaps we can get it to 1000 answers? I'm looking through it now to see if I can find something I can answer.
