Re: [IxDA Discuss] Best Practices vs. Patterns
On Sun, Jul 6, 2008 at 8:02 PM, Jarod Tang [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: from above, we know, design pattern more like a checking/fix skill than a stimulation of design, from my own design experience i also find it's true in both software design and interaction design. Hi Jarod, That is one approach to using patterns, and no doubt there are those who abuse patterns. However, I don't think that some folks' tendency to overengineer and attribute that to patterns has much to do with the nature or best use of patterns themselves. And actually I think patterns may be even more useful in interface design as they are more akin to patterns in physical architecture in as much as they are focused on human, experiential aspects and less on internal implementation details. --Ambrose Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Best Practices vs. Patterns
In agency/consulting work best practices also comes up sometimes as a euphemism for we have no research to support this, but our designers tell us they know it works from experience. (good discussion of patterns too - I was going to jump in to note that a pattern may not be a best practice - it may be just a common practice) -x- On Wed, Jul 2, 2008 at 3:47 PM, Filipe Levi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As for best practices, I see those as more granular than, say, do ethnographical research. I'd say it would be particular ways, techniques, methodologies that have been shown to generally produce good results. But they are more focused on *how* you do things rather than the end result, which is I think more the focus of patterns. -- Christian Crumlish http://xianlandia.com Yahoo! pattern detective http://design.yahoo.com Yahoo! Developer Network evangelist http://open.yahoo.com IA Institute director of technology http://iainstitute.org Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Best Practices vs. Patterns
Hi Ambrose and Guys, Here, we should notice, that design pattern's drawbacks becomes more and more obvious to the software development community, the reason is design always/easy to lead to unnessary complex by design pattern thinking (many guys argue that's because the software designer is not a design pattern master, but maybe not). Instead, some guys provide alternative ways for better software design: 1. refactor to pattern. means first dont start from pattern, and then refactor the pattern after we have a decided global design; 2. related to 1/, code smells are more creative. instead of let designers aware of what's good, it's more creative and productive to aware what's the smells of bad design while it comes out from above, we know, design pattern more like a checking/fix skill than a stimulation of design, from my own design experience i also find it's true in both software design and interaction design. Cheers, -- Jarod On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 1:57 AM, J. Ambrose Little [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The notion of patterns and practices is fairly developed in the software engineering field. The idea of formalized software dev patterns originates from Christopher Alexander's series of books on the same subject applied to physical architecture. Back quite a while ago now, some folks saw the applicability to software and began popularizing the idea through books like software *Design Patterns*, *Patterns of Enterprise Application Architecture *, etc. It's worth noting that patterns here has a specialized sense based on Alexander's view. The general idea is that a pattern is a *common *(not innovative) way to build something to address a particular set of problems in a particular context with the ultimate goal of building something that is *alive* and *whole*, as Alexander put it in his *Timeless Way of Building*. This is, to varying degrees, what you'll see in things like Yahoo's library, as well as welie.com, Tidwell's *Designing Interfaces*, ui-patterns.com, et al. In addition to being a source of inspiration and general reference, patterns can also facilitate high-level design discussion. As in philosophy, the names of patterns can be used as short-hand jargon to reference complex ideas and help folks come to a solution faster via a body of knowledge expressed through shared language. I'm curious as to how UX pros use patterns. I realize there is a fair bit (more) pride in being creative/original in the design space than in engineering, but I think the general idea of using patterns to inform design and provide good constraints is a good thing. As for best practices, I see those as more granular than, say, do ethnographical research. I'd say it would be particular ways, techniques, methodologies that have been shown to generally produce good results. But they are more focused on *how* you do things rather than the end result, which is I think more the focus of patterns. It's not, as I see it, an either-or (either patterns or practices) but a both-and. They're both resources on which designers can draw to help inform their work. --Ambrose Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help -- Designing for better life style. http://jarodtang.spaces.live.com/ http://jarodtang.blogspot.com Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Best Practices vs. Patterns
As for best practices, I see those as more granular than, say, do ethnographical research. I'd say it would be particular ways, techniques, methodologies that have been shown to generally produce good results. But they are more focused on *how* you do things rather than the end result, which is I think more the focus of patterns. I agree. As an example, a *pattern *would warn us not to offer more than seven menu options at a time, while a good *practice *would suggest us to have a pair of users in each card sorting session in order to incite consensus and minimize analysis effort. Regards, Filipe Levi User researcher at CESAR UXnet ambassador in Brazil +55 81 99240791 | mobile +55 81 31345131 | office filipelevi.com Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Best Practices vs. Patterns
Two things strike me as missing from this discussion:- - who is the 'best practices' list for? - at what level of granularity is the list useful? My experience makes me feel that practitioners do not need lists of best practices in order to do their work - but they may use it to explain to non-practitioners why they are doing what they are doing. For example, 'why are you doing ethnographic research?' ... 'because it is best practice'. Patterns, by contrast, seem much more likely to be a tool used by the designer in the course of design. Secondly, does interaction design benefit from a best practices list at the level of saying that 'ethnographic research', 'usability testing', 'mental models' or 'personas' are all best practice. Or do we benefit more from having the internal dialogue about what is best practice in ethnographic research, or in persona creation? Personally, I would like to see this latter discussion taking place - what makes for best practice in usability testing, say, and how do I help others identify it and do it? Of course, I raise this question from the point of view of someone who is managing these activities, more than doing them. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=30922 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Best Practices vs. Patterns
The notion of patterns and practices is fairly developed in the software engineering field. The idea of formalized software dev patterns originates from Christopher Alexander's series of books on the same subject applied to physical architecture. Back quite a while ago now, some folks saw the applicability to software and began popularizing the idea through books like software *Design Patterns*, *Patterns of Enterprise Application Architecture *, etc. It's worth noting that patterns here has a specialized sense based on Alexander's view. The general idea is that a pattern is a *common *(not innovative) way to build something to address a particular set of problems in a particular context with the ultimate goal of building something that is *alive* and *whole*, as Alexander put it in his *Timeless Way of Building*. This is, to varying degrees, what you'll see in things like Yahoo's library, as well as welie.com, Tidwell's *Designing Interfaces*, ui-patterns.com, et al. In addition to being a source of inspiration and general reference, patterns can also facilitate high-level design discussion. As in philosophy, the names of patterns can be used as short-hand jargon to reference complex ideas and help folks come to a solution faster via a body of knowledge expressed through shared language. I'm curious as to how UX pros use patterns. I realize there is a fair bit (more) pride in being creative/original in the design space than in engineering, but I think the general idea of using patterns to inform design and provide good constraints is a good thing. As for best practices, I see those as more granular than, say, do ethnographical research. I'd say it would be particular ways, techniques, methodologies that have been shown to generally produce good results. But they are more focused on *how* you do things rather than the end result, which is I think more the focus of patterns. It's not, as I see it, an either-or (either patterns or practices) but a both-and. They're both resources on which designers can draw to help inform their work. --Ambrose Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Best Practices vs. Patterns
Best Practices / Patterns and the likes are important part of the designers toolbox. But the Designer needs to understand when its is best to use the best practice or the pattern based on the context of the work / organization / etc...etc... So ultimately they are just another set of tools for the designer to use. Regards, Jay Kumar On 7/1/08, Matthew Zuckman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: People in my office seem to be obsessed with best practices lately - a notion that seems a bit ethereal to me. After all, splash pages, lead-based paint, burning witches, and other such concepts are now obsolete (or at least frowned upon). In the past, I have tried to steer people towards the idea that certain interfaces or features may be a standard practice, but I am wondering if patterns are now the best evaluation tool. Any thoughts? ./matthew Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Best Practices vs. Patterns
What the others said. And some more. The notion of best practices is not new or ethereal, at least not in the realm of design management, project management and related disciplines. They constantly evolve and the term serves as an umbrella for specific pedagogies. I like to spice it up a bit. In addition to discussing best practices, I like to talk about better practices, worse worst practices, boring practices and dirty practices. Because business rhetoric is boring. In the world of IxD/IA/UX, the establishment of best practices (vs. no practices or sloppy ones) seems implicit - especially within the context of the codification of practices via literature (print web) and rhetoric (conferences, mailing lists, journals, beer talk, etc.). In other words, most of the books that have been published on web design, IA (hello, authors!) and so on over the ages are essentially about the establishment or formation of best practices. It's an old term that can be applied to various disciplines. Usability testing (in all its various forms) is a best practice vs. no usability testing (or practice). Use of Mental Models might turn out to be an ineffective best practice in a few years (and maybe not)... Lazy implementations under the cover of Agile (in other words, fake Agile) could be F-d practices. Joe Blow's Best Practice might be My Nightmare. Oscar Madison's nightmare (uh, say, establishing baseline PM procedures and actually following them) might reflect Felix Unger's idea of a best practice. And so it goes. Within the process of interface design, I don't know if you can apply the term best practice to the actual design output. For example, I wouldn't use the term to describe design product. I wouldn't say, The use of left-aligned CSS pull-down menus is a best practice, in general. (I might call it a common practice.) But I might say that your use of design research best practices helped your UX person to determine that the use of a left-aligned menu was best for your client's user base I would never say that Johnny Quest's habit of dancing to Culture Club songs while prototyping is a bad practice vs. Race Bannon's practice of doing 100 squats and eating raw eggs with jalapenos and whistling Dixie whilst sketching on his Wacom That's my take, anyhow. -- Eric Swenson ++ : eric swenson : swensonia inc : [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Jun 30, 2008, at 9:10 PM, Matthew Zuckman wrote: People in my office seem to be obsessed with best practices lately - a notion that seems a bit ethereal to me. After all, splash pages, lead-based paint, burning witches, and other such concepts are now obsolete (or at least frowned upon). In the past, I have tried to steer people towards the idea that certain interfaces or features may be a standard practice, but I am wondering if patterns are now the best evaluation tool. Any thoughts? ./matthew Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Best Practices vs. Patterns
The original quest appeared to be: whats the best way to design, Best Practices VS Patterns, (I assume this meant some form of Patterns Library)? I believe Best Practices would drive the Patterns, thus they are not mutually exclusive. Best Practices are contextual, meaning what is the whole of the design, and how do these Practices aide the design. Interactions which in isolation may seem counter intuitive, can be the best choice given the surrounding circumstances, (and vice versa). Best Practices not executed within a cohesive/well planned Pattern Library, (which is also a Best Practice), are nothing more then a grab bag of design concepts, which by chance may or may not work well together. Also I wouldn't consider Patterns an evaluation tool, hopefully you come up with the patterns upfront and utilize them in your designs. Rich -- Joseph Rich Rogan President UX/UI Inc. http://www.jrrogan.com On 6/30/08, Matthew Zuckman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: People in my office seem to be obsessed with best practices lately - a notion that seems a bit ethereal to me. After all, splash pages, lead-based paint, burning witches, and other such concepts are now obsolete (or at least frowned upon). In the past, I have tried to steer people towards the idea that certain interfaces or features may be a standard practice, but I am wondering if patterns are now the best evaluation tool. Any thoughts? ./matthew Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help -- Joseph Rich Rogan President UX/UI Inc. http://www.jrrogan.com Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
[IxDA Discuss] Best Practices vs. Patterns
People in my office seem to be obsessed with best practices lately - a notion that seems a bit ethereal to me. After all, splash pages, lead-based paint, burning witches, and other such concepts are now obsolete (or at least frowned upon). In the past, I have tried to steer people towards the idea that certain interfaces or features may be a standard practice, but I am wondering if patterns are now the best evaluation tool. Any thoughts? ./matthew Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
