Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-31 Thread D Webb

 I'm almost sure the problem is this:
 http://bugtrack.alsa-project.org/alsa-bug/view.php?id=2601
 http://pulseaudio.org/ticket/23
 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ekiga/+bug/112948
 
 Regards,
 Yannick


I reported to bugtrack that the patch for report 2601 does not 
fix the crash I report, nor does it remove the assert error I am 
getting.

Dee

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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-31 Thread Edward Dunagin
Hello Dee,

On Mon, Mar 31, 2008 at 2:32 AM, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

   I'm almost sure the problem is this:
  http://bugtrack.alsa-project.org/alsa-bug/view.php?id=2601
  http://pulseaudio.org/ticket/23
  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ekiga/+bug/112948
 
  Regards,
  Yannick


 I reported to bugtrack that the patch for report 2601 does not
 fix the crash I report, nor does it remove the assert error I am
 getting.

I don't know wheather you saw the report I gave, but when I removed
PulseVideo from my system, it corrected my problem. At  least testing
with 500, but have not tested with another user.

Peaceed

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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-30 Thread Damien Sandras
Le dimanche 30 mars 2008 à 00:01 +, D Webb a écrit :
   proving to offer the best sound quality, but many people are
   having problems 
   getting it to work reliably. I have been trying Ekiga 2.0.11
   that 
  
  We rarely get crash reports... My advice might be biased, but Ekiga
 has
  always had a good reputation of stability and reliability.
  -- 
  _ Damien Sandras
 
 I think this is because you have been re-directing bug reports to
 other 
 software like alsa-lib, which I reported. However, alsa-lib is pretty
 much 
 standard on all Linux distros. So if Ekiga is crashing because of a 
 conflict with alsa-lib, regardless of where the fault lies, Ekiga
 won't 
 work reliably under Linux without some kind of changes. I have yet 
 to see Ekiga work with Linux (default Slackware 12.0 install + Gnome) 
 or FreeBSD 7.0, although a friend finally did get it to work under
 Windows. 

The Windows version is beta software. We do not have any maintainer for
it (I even removed it from the website). If we can not find a
maintainer, that means there is no interest for it, so we can drop it.

As for the Linux version, I do not think I can agree with you about the
numerous instability problems you describe. 

I agree the ALSA problem is annoying and is reported by several people
(that is our number 1 bug). 

The problem is that nobody having the problem can fix it and ALSA
developers do not seem to care about it. The ALSA plugin has been there
several years and was working perfectly until they did some change in
the library and triggered that bug.

Have you tried using the very latest libasound2 version ?
Have you tried debugging the problem ?

 ALSA. There are plenty of people around here who have tried and 
 failed, 
 so it is clear there are problems. I guess I could ask around for 
 specifics

Yes, please ask them to tell us, because we rarely have crash reports
(except for the ALSA thing).
-- 
 _ Damien Sandras
(o-  
//\Ekiga Softphone : http://www.ekiga.org/
v_/_   NOVACOM : http://www.novacom.be/
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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-30 Thread Damien Sandras
Le dimanche 30 mars 2008 à 10:28 +0200, Damien Sandras a écrit :
 Le dimanche 30 mars 2008 à 00:01 +, D Webb a écrit :
proving to offer the best sound quality, but many people are
having problems 
getting it to work reliably. I have been trying Ekiga 2.0.11
that 
   
   We rarely get crash reports... My advice might be biased, but Ekiga
  has
   always had a good reputation of stability and reliability.
   -- 
   _ Damien Sandras
  
  I think this is because you have been re-directing bug reports to
  other 
  software like alsa-lib, which I reported. However, alsa-lib is pretty
  much 
  standard on all Linux distros. So if Ekiga is crashing because of a 
  conflict with alsa-lib, regardless of where the fault lies, Ekiga
  won't 
  work reliably under Linux without some kind of changes. I have yet 
  to see Ekiga work with Linux (default Slackware 12.0 install + Gnome) 
  or FreeBSD 7.0, although a friend finally did get it to work under
  Windows. 
 
 The Windows version is beta software. We do not have any maintainer for
 it (I even removed it from the website). If we can not find a
 maintainer, that means there is no interest for it, so we can drop it.
 
 As for the Linux version, I do not think I can agree with you about the
 numerous instability problems you describe. 
 
 I agree the ALSA problem is annoying and is reported by several people
 (that is our number 1 bug). 
 
 The problem is that nobody having the problem can fix it and ALSA
 developers do not seem to care about it. The ALSA plugin has been there
 several years and was working perfectly until they did some change in
 the library and triggered that bug.
 
 Have you tried using the very latest libasound2 version ?

Also, does it occur with both sound devices (Default and direct access
to the sound card) ?
-- 
 _ Damien Sandras
(o-  
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v_/_   NOVACOM : http://www.novacom.be/
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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-30 Thread D Webb

  The Windows version is beta software. We do not have any maintainer for
 it (I even removed it from the website). If we can not find a
 maintainer, that means there is no interest for it, so we can drop it.

Ouch! I guess that basically kills Ekiga. Its appeal was that it worked on 
Linux and Windows which greatly increased its versatility. There just are 
not that many people using Linux.

What is required to be a maintainer?

Dee

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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-30 Thread Edward Dunagin
On Sun, Mar 30, 2008 at 9:23 AM, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

   The Windows version is beta software. We do not have any maintainer for
  it (I even removed it from the website). If we can not find a
  maintainer, that means there is no interest for it, so we can drop it.

 Ouch! I guess that basically kills Ekiga. Its appeal was that it worked on
 Linux and Windows which greatly increased its versatility. There just are
 not that many people using Linux.

 What is required to be a maintainer?


I must unfortunately report that after I offered Dee help, I tried  to
bring up Ekiga again and it crashes.
 I do remember doing an apt-get update and upgrade in the last few
days and ,(again) if I remember there was an ALSA and PulseAudio
upgrade. I think this is my problem and I am going to try and
downgrade those two programs.

Edward Dunagin-Dunigan
Bozeman, MT 59718
mobile 406-570-0992
Landline 406-556-7282
VOIP:sip:[EMAIL PROTECTED]:5063;transport=udp
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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-30 Thread Damien Sandras
Le dimanche 30 mars 2008 à 12:14 -0600, Edward Dunagin a écrit :
 On Sun, Mar 30, 2008 at 9:23 AM, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
The Windows version is beta software. We do not have any maintainer for
   it (I even removed it from the website). If we can not find a
   maintainer, that means there is no interest for it, so we can drop it.
 
  Ouch! I guess that basically kills Ekiga. Its appeal was that it worked on
  Linux and Windows which greatly increased its versatility. There just are
  not that many people using Linux.
 
  What is required to be a maintainer?
 
 
 I must unfortunately report that after I offered Dee help, I tried  to
 bring up Ekiga again and it crashes.
  I do remember doing an apt-get update and upgrade in the last few
 days and ,(again) if I remember there was an ALSA and PulseAudio
 upgrade. I think this is my problem and I am going to try and
 downgrade those two programs.

You could also try to isolate the problem and fix it, either in Ekiga or
in Pulseaudio.
-- 
 _ Damien Sandras
(o-  
//\Ekiga Softphone : http://www.ekiga.org/
v_/_   NOVACOM : http://www.novacom.be/
   FOSDEM  : http://www.fosdem.org/
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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-30 Thread Edward Dunagin
On Sun, Mar 30, 2008 at 12:22 PM, Damien Sandras [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Le dimanche 30 mars 2008 à 12:14 -0600, Edward Dunagin a écrit :

  On Sun, Mar 30, 2008 at 9:23 AM, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   
  The Windows version is beta software. We do not have any maintainer 
 for
 it (I even removed it from the website). If we can not find a
 maintainer, that means there is no interest for it, so we can drop it.
   
Ouch! I guess that basically kills Ekiga. Its appeal was that it worked 
 on
Linux and Windows which greatly increased its versatility. There just are
not that many people using Linux.
   
What is required to be a maintainer?
   
  
   I must unfortunately report that after I offered Dee help, I tried  to
   bring up Ekiga again and it crashes.
I do remember doing an apt-get update and upgrade in the last few
   days and ,(again) if I remember there was an ALSA and PulseAudio
   upgrade. I think this is my problem and I am going to try and
   downgrade those two programs.

  You could also try to isolate the problem and fix it, either in Ekiga or
  in Pulseaudio.

I removed pulseaudio from my system and now Ekiga is ok. Tested it
with 500 and audio and videoare fine. I have not tested it with a live
user.

Peace...ed


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Landline 406-556-7282
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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-30 Thread yannick

Le dimanche 30 mars 2008 à 13:53 -0600, Edward Dunagin a écrit :
 I removed pulseaudio from my system and now Ekiga is ok. Tested it
 with 500 and audio and videoare fine. I have not tested it with a live
 user.

I'm almost sure the problem is this:
http://bugtrack.alsa-project.org/alsa-bug/view.php?id=2601
http://pulseaudio.org/ticket/23
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ekiga/+bug/112948

Regards,
Yannick

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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-30 Thread Damien Sandras
Le dimanche 30 mars 2008 à 13:53 -0600, Edward Dunagin a écrit :
 On Sun, Mar 30, 2008 at 12:22 PM, Damien Sandras [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Le dimanche 30 mars 2008 à 12:14 -0600, Edward Dunagin a écrit :
 
   On Sun, Mar 30, 2008 at 9:23 AM, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

   The Windows version is beta software. We do not have any maintainer 
  for
  it (I even removed it from the website). If we can not find a
  maintainer, that means there is no interest for it, so we can drop 
  it.

 Ouch! I guess that basically kills Ekiga. Its appeal was that it 
  worked on
 Linux and Windows which greatly increased its versatility. There just 
  are
 not that many people using Linux.

 What is required to be a maintainer?

   
I must unfortunately report that after I offered Dee help, I tried  to
bring up Ekiga again and it crashes.
 I do remember doing an apt-get update and upgrade in the last few
days and ,(again) if I remember there was an ALSA and PulseAudio
upgrade. I think this is my problem and I am going to try and
downgrade those two programs.
 
   You could also try to isolate the problem and fix it, either in Ekiga or
   in Pulseaudio.
 
 I removed pulseaudio from my system and now Ekiga is ok. Tested it
 with 500 and audio and videoare fine. I have not tested it with a live
 user.

I have read that bug in their bugtracker and it seems that pulseaudio
guys fixed the problem.

 VOIP:sip:[EMAIL PROTECTED]:5063;transport=udp

Your VoIP address is actually sip:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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v_/_   NOVACOM : http://www.novacom.be/
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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype (D Webb)

2008-03-29 Thread Sergei Steshenko

--- D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
  Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 14:26:30 +0100
  To: ekiga-list@gnome.org
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Subject: Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype (D Webb)
  
  On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 12:00:38PM +, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  ...
   same equipment Skype is choppy, Ekiga VoIP streams about as well as a 
   regular phone. Any thought on how/why? in the present case, it is exactly 
   the 
   same hardware/software and internet connection.
  
  remember that skype is a p2p app while ekiga acts as client for a server.
 
 Hah, didn't know Skype was p2p, I always thought it was also going through 
 a server since there is a login. Thanks for your thoughts, as they are 
 insightful.
 
 Dee
 

Skype can at its own discretion decide to use your connection to route traffic 
of
somebody else.

Ekiga, I think, has adjustable jitter buffer, which sometimes really improves
quality at the expense of latency.

Skype uses pretty wide band codec; Ekiga gives you a choice, so bandwidth can
be better utilized.

Regards,
  Sergei.


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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-29 Thread D Webb

  Hello,
I follow the discussion with great interst. I use Skype and VoIPBuster a lot, 
because the children and family of my wife live in the States, Australia and 
China. However, until now I am not able to get Ekiga working. The webcam is not 
working, and I found out that I have to pay for the calls using Ekiga. (home 
phoners/fixed).

Question: I am a real newbee, any reamrks concerning the items I wrote above. 
Please comment.

HAns Minekus
-

There are a lot of VoIP programs out there these days. I decided to follow 
Ekiga 
because I support the open software concept. Ekiga has thus far been offered 
to the world as a very generous gift. Of the programs I have tested, Ekiga is 
proving to offer the best sound quality, but many people are having problems 
getting it to work reliably. I have been trying Ekiga 2.0.11 that comes with 
recent 
distro of Gnome under Linux Slackware 12.0 and kernel 2.6.21. I have not yet 
complete success yet with this OS or FreeBSD 7.0. I also failed to get it to 
work 
under Windows, but this might only be because of some mis-understandings. I 
think you need to install GTK+ to get it to work in Windows, but following the 
chage-logs, I got idea Ekiga should not depend on GTK because there were 
some comments about removing the error message about requiring GTK. What 
OS are you using?

Others,

There is no error, I actually have gotten very good sound quality with a 56K 
modem. Ekiga is crashing for now and I am trying to solve this. However, 
I can say with great certainty the sound quality has been very good when Ekiga 
does not crash. Interesting point that Skype was originally described as 
working 
well with no more than a modem connection. I have never once experienced 
that. It seems Ekiga has some efficiency that ends up benefiting the end user 
in terms of efficiency and sound quality, which is why I want to see this go.

Dee

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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-29 Thread D Webb

  proving to offer the best sound quality, but many people are
  having problems 
  getting it to work reliably. I have been trying Ekiga 2.0.11
  that 
 
 We rarely get crash reports... My advice might be biased, but Ekiga has
 always had a good reputation of stability and reliability.
 -- 
  _ Damien Sandras

I think this is because you have been re-directing bug reports to other 
software like alsa-lib, which I reported. However, alsa-lib is pretty much 
standard on all Linux distros. So if Ekiga is crashing because of a 
conflict with alsa-lib, regardless of where the fault lies, Ekiga won't 
work reliably under Linux without some kind of changes. I have yet 
to see Ekiga work with Linux (default Slackware 12.0 install + Gnome) 
or FreeBSD 7.0, although a friend finally did get it to work under Windows. 
I know of one report of someone getting Ekiga to work under Ubuntu, 
and I am thinking to give that a try, although I do not yet understand why 
the distribution would make a difference, assuming they are all using 
ALSA. There are plenty of people around here who have tried and failed, 
so it is clear there are problems. I guess I could ask around for specifics 
from others. I already reported the alsa-lib problem. I certainly do not want 
to detract in any way from your hard work. Ekiga looks like great 
software.

Dee

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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-29 Thread Edward Dunagin
Hello D,

On Sat, Mar 29, 2008 at 6:01 PM, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

proving to offer the best sound quality, but many people are
   having problems
   getting it to work reliably. I have been trying Ekiga 2.0.11
   that
 
  We rarely get crash reports... My advice might be biased, but Ekiga has
  always had a good reputation of stability and reliability.
  --
  _ Damien Sandras

 I think this is because you have been re-directing bug reports to other
 software like alsa-lib, which I reported. However, alsa-lib is pretty much
 standard on all Linux distros. So if Ekiga is crashing because of a
 conflict with alsa-lib, regardless of where the fault lies, Ekiga won't
 work reliably under Linux without some kind of changes. I have yet
 to see Ekiga work with Linux (default Slackware 12.0 install + Gnome)
 or FreeBSD 7.0, although a friend finally did get it to work under Windows.
 I know of one report of someone getting Ekiga to work under Ubuntu,
 and I am thinking to give that a try, although I do not yet understand why
 the distribution would make a difference, assuming they are all using
 ALSA. There are plenty of people around here who have tried and failed,
 so it is clear there are problems. I guess I could ask around for specifics
 from others. I already reported the alsa-lib problem. I certainly do not
 want
 to detract in any way from your hard work. Ekiga looks like great
 software.

I am running UbuntuStudio 7.10 and Ekiga 2.0.11.
 I have a little trouble with the audio at times but usually can work
it out to the point of carrying on a conversation. Video has worked
fine on my system as well. Many time I suspect the mic on both ends.
Mine has been stepped on but I intend to invest in a good one that I
can snap to my collar.

I an running a P4 with 1GB of ram and 122GB H.D.

Lets see if we can't get together on Ekiga and work out your problems.
I am in Montana USA with Mounton time.

Peaceed



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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-28 Thread michel memeteau
Maybe because Skype requires more CPU ? Which hardware power was it ?

On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 10:11 PM, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  I think I should mention that I have tinkered with a number of VoIP
 programs
 and have been comparing. One reason to stick with Ekiga was that when it
 works, the sound stream seems to be more efficient than Skype. While on
 same equipment Skype is choppy, Ekiga VoIP streams about as well as a
 regular phone. Any thought on how/why? in the present case, it is exactly
 the
 same hardware/software and internet connection.

 dee

 
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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-28 Thread D Webb

This is rather new desktop computer I would think can handle anything 
Core2Duo 
2.0 Ghz and 2 Gig memory. Latest hardware and Linux Slackware 12.0 and Ekiga 
2.0.11. Connection is 56K modem. I knew for a while Skype can be real choppy on 
a modem connection, but wanted to see if this would also be true with other 
VoIP 
software. I was REALLY surprised sound quality with Ekiga was same as regular 
phone, 
and vastly better than Skype. I am very sure of this. I have repeated it a 
number of 
times. For the moment, there are still problems with Ekiga crashing, but that 
is 
separate matter that I hope to solve. When Ekiga has not crashed, sound is 
really good, 
despite also having a webcam.

Dee

 Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 08:30:07 +0100
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: ekiga-list@gnome.org
 Subject: Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype
 
 Maybe because Skype requires more CPU ? Which hardware power was it ?
 
 On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 10:11 PM, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
   I think I should mention that I have tinkered with a number of VoIP
  programs
  and have been comparing. One reason to stick with Ekiga was that when it
  works, the sound stream seems to be more efficient than Skype. While on
  same equipment Skype is choppy, Ekiga VoIP streams about as well as a
  regular phone. Any thought on how/why? in the present case, it is exactly
  the
  same hardware/software and internet connection.
 
  dee
 
  
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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype (D Webb)

2008-03-28 Thread Paolo
On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 12:00:38PM +, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
...
 same equipment Skype is choppy, Ekiga VoIP streams about as well as a 
 regular phone. Any thought on how/why? in the present case, it is exactly the 
 same hardware/software and internet connection.

remember that skype is a p2p app while ekiga acts as client for a server.
In skype you've no control on number of connections it makes to other
nodes, nor how much bandwith it takes up; and skype's streams are encrypted,
which means longer drops may occur in case of channel congestion.
Moreover, if all goes 'well', your instance may act as a 'supernode' hence 
taking most of your bw.  In some situations, all the rest been equal, such 
cases may lead to poor performance on the channel you're talking.

There are likely other possible explanations for what you see, these are
just a few points.


-- 
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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype

2008-03-28 Thread Edward Dunagin
On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 7:13 AM, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  This is rather new desktop computer I would think can handle anything
 Core2Duo
 2.0 Ghz and 2 Gig memory. Latest hardware and Linux Slackware 12.0 and Ekiga
 2.0.11. Connection is 56K modem. I knew for a while Skype can be real choppy
 on
 a modem connection, but wanted to see if this would also be true with other
 VoIP
 software. I was REALLY surprised sound quality with Ekiga was same as
 regular phone,
 and vastly better than Skype. I am very sure of this. I have repeated it a
 number of
 times. For the moment, there are still problems with Ekiga crashing, but
 that is
 separate matter that I hope to solve. When Ekiga has not crashed, sound is
 really good,
 despite also having a webcam.

Hello Dee,

WOW a 56 K modem connection. Ekiga gives me audio fits when video
works and I have a broadband connection.

Peace.ed

snip*


Edward Dunagin-Dunigan-Dunnigan
Bozeman, MT 59718
mobile 406-570-0992
Landline 406-556-7282
VOIP:sip:[EMAIL PROTECTED]:5063;transport=udp
http://doas.montanalinux.org
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Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype (D Webb)

2008-03-28 Thread D Webb

 Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 14:26:30 +0100
 To: ekiga-list@gnome.org
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Subject: Re: [Ekiga-list] Ekiga vs Skype (D Webb)
 
 On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 12:00:38PM +, D Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 ...
  same equipment Skype is choppy, Ekiga VoIP streams about as well as a 
  regular phone. Any thought on how/why? in the present case, it is exactly 
  the 
  same hardware/software and internet connection.
 
 remember that skype is a p2p app while ekiga acts as client for a server.

Hah, didn't know Skype was p2p, I always thought it was also going through 
a server since there is a login. Thanks for your thoughts, as they are 
insightful.

Dee


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