Re: [Elecraft] K3: Qick Split
I believe a LONG time ago before I even had a radio I made a suggestion of a quick split that Wayne mentioned he was contemplating adding to the radio. I don't really remember how I'd structured it but I was hoping for a way where I could simply assume that the MHZ portion would remain the same and I could just enter the last 3 digits and not even have to hit enter. So when you hear this is JA7XYZ listening this frequency and 234 you simply hit split 234 and boom you're ready to start talking. For CW split I find its always smarter to lurk around and find the right spot to plop your bait. But I'm usually so slow at copying that its tough for me... hihi Thats why I'm often more of a rag chew guy when it comes to CW. But my hardcore CW buddies sure love playing with the K3 when they come over. ~Brett (KC7OTG) On Tue, 2009-02-17 at 11:25 -0800, Andrew Faber wrote: I can't recall which one, but I had a radio that worked exactly this way. My suggestion would be not to change existing button usage at all, but do as Vic suggests, and allow a programmable button to be set to a quick split, that would equalize frequency (or maybe put in a variable offset), turn on SUB and go into SPLIT mode. Then it could be used or ignored at will. 73, andy, ae6y - Original Message - From: Vic K2VCO v...@rakefet.com To: Bill W4ZV btipp...@alum.mit.edu Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 10:18 AM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3: Qick Split Bill W4ZV wrote: I also question the usefulness of Quick Split. You need to learn to tune your TX to anticipate where DX is actually listening rather than where he says he **says** he's listening. They are often not the same! The most important part of quick split is not the offset. I would be happy with an offset of zero, or an offset of don't change VFO B. What I want is one button that will (at least) activate SPLIT and SUB. This will prevent me from carefully finding the station the DX is working with the subreceiver and then calling him -- without activating SPLIT. Believe me, this is easy to do and very embarrassing. If I could have everything I want, it would do three things: A-B SUB SPLIT I would want this to be implemented as a programmable function key rather than an optional behavior for SPLIT, because there are times when I want SPLIT to be just SPLIT. One way to do it would be a menu entry that would let you choose an offset which could be zero or 'no change' and then assign it to a function key. -- 73, Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3: AFX Firmware request
I see that as a great idea that fits relatively well with the theme of the UI! On Sun, 2009-02-22 at 15:17 -0500, Ed K1EP wrote: I don't think this has been mentioned before, I did a quick search of the list. Here is my firmware request :) In order to adjust the AFX properties, you have to go into the menu. It isn't that easy in the heat of the battle. The AFX button is also the DATA MODE button if it is pressed and held. However, in SSB and CW modes, you aren't in a data mode so a N/A is displayed. Why not make this a short cut to the AFX settings menu? If you are in a non-data mode, then pressing and holding AFX will allow you to change the AFX delay or BIN settings. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] K3 quirks
I have downloaded the latest firmware and also get the frequency jump quirks when the VFO's are linked. There is also a further quirk on AM with the 6kHz filter installed. If I press XFIL the sub display shows 6kHz. However if I move the Width control slightly to the left, the readout jumps to 2.9kHz. Then when I turn the Width control to the right, the maximum bandwidth is 5kHz. I press XFIL again and it shows the 6kHz filter. I think I am missing something . 73 Barry Simpson VK2BJ NB is the 5kHz readout just one sideband so that the real width is 10kHz __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] New I/O mod kit E850237 K3
I would assume that when installing this board that its best that we cut the two traces on the main board so that the negative ALC mod isn't half way done right? I've got the board in hand now just need to find the time to tear the shack apart again and start up on mods again. I've done them all but this one... At some point in time the pulled up band data will prove useful so I do need to get it done... The ALC mod is just so I can say my K3 is up to snuff and the same as the newer ones. ~Brett On Wed, 2009-02-11 at 17:31 -0700, W0MU Mike Fatchett wrote: Sorry K3. All I was told that this board had the pull up resistor installed. W0MU A slip of the foot you may soon recover, but a slip of the tongue you may never get over. Ben Franklin -Original Message- From: Terry Price [mailto:w...@comcast.net] Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 4:55 PM To: 'W0MU Mike Fatchett' Subject: RE: [Elecraft] New I/O mod kit E850237 Is this for a K3? Are these active high or just pulled up? Terry -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of W0MU Mike Fatchett Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 6:38 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] New I/O mod kit E850237 For those wanting TTL outputs on the I/O board, you may now replace your old board with a new one. $15.00 plus shipping. This is an alternative to soldering the 2.2k resistors on the old board. Mike W0MU __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Mike I believe there are two separate parts to your post: At 50Hz width it was quite clear that many stations call off frequency. Using RIT, I could see that it was typical for them to be 70Hz or more away from the DX station but I could not hear them in my 50Hz passband. The real problem was when one of them was S9 or greater. They completely swamped weaker DX stations. Sound within the passband just blanked out. No band noise and no DX station. And there was no recovery between dits and dahs. It was actually easier to copy the DX station when people were calling directly on top of him. You could at least hear him between the dits. The K3 will desense for signals about S9+25 that fall *within* the roofing filter but *outside* the DSP WIDTH passband. Elecraft made a modification (hardware AGC in the mod kits list) about a year ago which improved this problem and raised the threshold from a little over S9 to S9+25 (or maybe +30). I don't know your S/N but if it's ~280 or less you should install this mod. In my opinion, the threshold for this mod could still be raised a little more based on my experience with Orion which has a very similar front end to the K3. You didn't mention which filter you were using but even if you had the 200 Hz filter installed, you could have desense from S9+25 signals about +/- 150 Hz from your center frequency. There's simply not much that can be done about this until SHIFT resolution is changed from 50 Hz to 10 Hz. Then you could possibly use SHIFT to put the strong interfering signal on the XFIL passband slope. For my style of operating this was a disappointment. I tried AGC-F and AGC-S but I forgot to try AGC off. I also varied the AGC THR and AGC SLP. I tried NR off and on. (I was not using NB). I tried PRE and ATT off and on. I tried riding the RF gain. I tried shifting the passband but shift doesn't work well when the width is only 50Hz. Nothing helped. I also tried opening up the passband. That didn't help either but I don't remember the results. This was not a one time thing. It happened at least 20 different times on different bands. I guess this is perfectly normal. I was just wondering what operational trick is available to compensate. This could be a second issue (i.e. separating multiple strong stations) which Dave K6LL has identified. I haven't experienced it as yet because unfortunately I haven't had many pileups of strong stations calling me! However I believe Dave W6NL has determined that AGC THR and AGC SLP settings of 5 and 5 are best for this separation issue. I leave my AGC PLS set to NOR and have not experienced any problems that I felt were related to it. As an aside, I never use AGC-S for any mode and have AGC-F set to 120. Using Extreme Isolation EX-29 headphones, I select AF GAIN LO in the CONFIG menu, set my front panel AF GAIN to 9 o'clock (NEVER higher than 11 o'clock), set PRE/ATT so I can hear band noise when antennas are selected and then back off the front panel RF GAIN to a comfortable audio level. In the contest this weekend with ATT on my TX array and PRE on my Beverages (using both antennas for diversity), I typically had RF GAIN for both Main/Sub set from 2 o'clock to noon. The K3 was wonderful on Topband in the contest, especially the first night when QRN was low enough to use both my directional TX array and Beverages in diversity. It appears I set a new USA record with 434 QSOs and 79 countries for 102,858 points, breaking the old record of 81k set by N4PN at W8JI's station in 2006. 73, Bill -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-receiver-desensing-on-CW-during-contest-tp2369819p2371427.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3: AFX Firmware request
Ed K1EP wrote: In order to adjust the AFX properties, you have to go into the menu. It isn't that easy in the heat of the battle. You can assign the AFX setting to one of the PF keys. I doubt Wayne is going to want to start making keys work different ways for different modes. 73, Bill -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3%3A-AFX-Firmware-request-tp2368964p2371459.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Hi Wayne and all: My filters are 200, 400, 1.0, 1.8 and 2.7 and they are all CW enabled. I was using headphones and my sub RX was off. My serial number is 2208 and the radio was factory assembled (including the sub RX). I did not hear key clicks when this was happening. The off frequency transmissions were clean. I also made a point of observing the signal strength of the offending stations and they were usually S8 or S9. Not the 20db or 40db over S9 that I was expecting. I thought it was interesting that recovery was noticeably slow on the DX station's frequency when this was happening. However, under normal conditions when US stations were calling directly on top of the DX station, recovery was fast. Hence the ability to copy the DX station through the dits when the QRM was on frequency. Maybe a passband shift could of helped. I would like to see the shift limits changed to something less than 50Hz. Maybe 10Hz on CW and 50Hz on other modes. I appreciate the interesting ideas from K6LL and W4ZV. Unfortunately I'll have to wait for the next busy contest to try them out. This just isn't the type of condition you can experience under normal band conditions. 73, Mike K2MK wayne burdick Sun, 22 Feb 2009 18:26:03 -0800 Mike, The K3 is virtually desense-proof, with a BDR of ~140 dB. But to take advantage of this, you need a narrow crystal filter -- the closer to the DSP bandwidth the better. This is exactly the situation that we had in mind when we designed the 200-Hz 5-pole filter. For CW pileups, you can't beat it. What crystal filter were you using at the time? Of course if the transmitting stations are wide due to key clicks, there may be situations where no amount of filtering can help (for any receiver). The DSP noise blanker and NR may be useful sometimes -- you might give this a try. Wayne N6KR On Feb 22, 2009, at 4:45 PM, K2MK wrote: I had a great time with my K3 during the ARRL DX contest. I do SP and I was trolling around with my filter width at 50Hz. Absolutely outstanding. The auto spot is equally outstanding. At 50Hz width it was quite clear that many stations call off frequency. Using RIT, I could see that it was typical for them to be 70Hz or more away from the DX station but I could not hear them in my 50Hz passband. The real problem was when one of them was S9 or greater. They completely swamped weaker DX stations. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
There was some big DX contest this weekend. I played in it for about 30 minutes with my K3 and my bugs. Fun. By the end of my time on the air, my small want for a 200 Hz filter had been upgraded to the next thing I buy. You too? - Keith N1AS - - K3 711 - __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
K2MK wrote: I thought it was interesting that recovery was noticeably slow on the DX station's frequency when this was happening. However, under normal conditions when US stations were calling directly on top of the DX station, recovery was fast. Hence the ability to copy the DX station through the dits when the QRM was on frequency. Mike this definitely sounds like desense but I'm surprised you experienced it with only S8-9 signals. I'm not sure what you mean about differing conditions on and off the center frequency. Desense will affect everything inside the roofing filter. What speed AGC were you using (F or S) and what were your AGC-F and AGC-S CONFIG settings? I NEVER use AGC-S on either CW or SSB and like at least 120 dB/sec for AGC-F. Also, help your AGC do its job by not running RF GAIN fully clockwise (as mentioned in my previous message). 73, Bill P.S. As I said before my K3 worked extremely well coping weak signals in the midst of massive ones on 160 this weekend. I smiled when I saw the following comment from OL0W(OK1DSZ): Only for fun, when the band was already closing, I decided to try what I will be able to work with QRP. Using longer callsign OK1DSZ and the power reduced to 5W I spend about 10 minutes calling several east coast big guns. The award for the best ears goes to W4ZV, who was worked as easily as with the kilowatt earlier in the night. K8PO and W2FU were worked with several repeats. The others just kept CQing without any reaction with exception of K1TTT, who apparently heard something, but not enough for the QSO. -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-receiver-desensing-on-CW-during-contest-tp2369819p2372087.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Strange behavior when tuning around with SUB receiver LINKED
I had to try it. Both VFO's set at 6.000.000 and LINKED. Turned VFO A slightly lower to 5.999.999. VFO B followed exactly. Could also turn VFO higher in frequency and VFO B still tracked okay. If I went down farther and tuned very slowly both VFO's tracked. If I went below 6.000.00 and tuned quickly VFO A would jump to 5.371.500 (or whatever freq is setup on the 60M position). VFO would continue to follow VFO A as if VFO A did not jump in frequency. If I then quickly turned VFO A up, it would jump to 6.000.000 and both VFO's would track again. After doing this several times the VFO's would not track exactly. That was weird. Went back to the Ham bands and everything is fine again. That is enough of that for me. Back to the Ham bands. 73, N2TK, Tony _ From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of James Sarte Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2009 4:40 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] Strange behavior when tuning around with SUB receiver LINKED Dear group, Someone please explain to me what's happening with my K3. I have both main receiver and sub receiver linked. This way, I can tune the sub receiver with the main VFO knob. However, there's something weird going on when I cross some sort of band edge. For example, if both VFO A and VFO B are set to 6.020.00 and I tune down the band using the main VFO knob, as soon as VFO B reaches 5.997.00 the readout in VFO A will jump almost 900KHz down to 5.030.1. When tuning back up the band, when VFO B reaches 6.017.0, the reading in VFO A will jump almost 900KHz again to 6.959.0 Sometimes the difference can be 500KHz or 900KHz. When this happens, I also hear a clicking noise in the K3, and I'm assuming it's a relay switching. I've seen this behavior while tuning up and down, which leads me to think that the K3 is hitting band edges and adjusting, but the strange thing is, the frequency between VFO A and VFO B do not stay the same. Also, and possibly another more concerning issue is that when the sub receiver is on, and I'm tuning anywhere from 4.9 to 5.9MHz, there is a loud motorboat or zipper noise that is heard through the speaker, and is affected by spinning either VFO A or VFO B knob. The noise stops if you don't turn any VFO. Turn any VFO knob though, and the motorboat zipper noise resumes. If you turn off the sub receiver and spin any VFO knob, this zipper-like or motorboat noise almost goes away. It is still there, but now very faint and can barely be heard over the static. 73, James KC2UEE __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] New I/O mod kit E850237 K3
I would assume that when installing this board that its best that we cut the two traces on the main board... Yes. 73, Lyle KK7P __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
Last week I sold my 500 Hz filter, and ordered a 250 from Elecraft. On Friday night, the new filter hadn't arrived yet, so I operated in the CW DX Contest with only the 2.7K filter. It worked great! I couldn't see any difference between the 2.7K and the old 500. The skirts of the DSP (set at 300 BW) dominate over the filter skirts, and I never had one case of desensing or overload. On Saturday afternoon, the mailman delivered the new 250, and I installed it immediately and operated the rest of the contest with it. Once again, I couldn't see any difference. The radio sounded exactly like it did with the 2.7K and the 500. If you frequently feel the need to crank your DSP width way down below 300 Hz, you may benefit from the 200 filter, but I don't do that and don't plan to buy the narrow filter. Dave Hachadorian, K6LL Yuma, AZ - Original Message - From: Darwin, Keith keith.dar...@goodrich.com To: Elecraft Discussion List elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 12:54 PM Subject: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering? There was some big DX contest this weekend. I played in it for about 30 minutes with my K3 and my bugs. Fun. By the end of my time on the air, my small want for a 200 Hz filter had been upgraded to the next thing I buy. You too? - Keith N1AS - - K3 711 - __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
I echo Dave's remarks, though I have the 8-pole 400Hz filter. Being in VT made me the focus of several spot pileups, but I experienced none of the desense issues that someone reported on the reflector. There were numerous wide stations, which caused me to tailor the RX EQ settings in an effort to further reduce the audibility of their key clicks. All in all I can say that the K3 (built in January) performed flawlessly. The only item on my wish list is an outboard tuning device to sit on the desk to the left of the keyboard (like my former Omni VII). 48 hours is a long time to reach up to the rig (on a shelf at eye level above the laptop screen) and the keyboard up/down arrow facility isn't flexible enough (station spacing on the band is fairly even, so you want to zip up the the next station and then slowly tune it in). I can see that I'm going to wear out the paint above the bezel where the fingers of my right hand rest while my thumb rotates the dial. Brian K1LI __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
Interesting. I had the opposite experience. I was on 40 meters yesterday afternoon for about 30 minutes. Signals were all pretty strong as Europe is just across the pond from my QTH. I did a lot of listening, comparing 1.1 KHz with 1.0 KHz and 550 Hz with 500 Hz. The difference of course, is that my 1 KHz and 500 Hz filters kick in. What I heard was a noticeable reduction in thumps, pops and AGC desensing as I stepped across the filter engagement boundary. There were a number of situations when I was at 550 Hz and could hear the other guy's signal being pumped up and down as my AGC was affected by someone 400 Hz away. I step down to 500 Hz, and the other guy's signal suddenly becomes smooth and consistent - no more AGC pumping. - Keith N1AS - - K3 711 - -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Dave Hachadorian Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 9:52 AM To: Elecraft reflector Subject: Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering? Last week I sold my 500 Hz filter, and ordered a 250 from Elecraft. On Friday night, the new filter hadn't arrived yet, so I operated in the CW DX Contest with only the 2.7K filter. It worked great! I couldn't see any difference between the 2.7K and the old 500. The skirts of the DSP (set at 300 BW) dominate over the filter skirts, and I never had one case of desensing or overload. On Saturday afternoon, the mailman delivered the new 250, and I installed it immediately and operated the rest of the contest with it. Once again, I couldn't see any difference. The radio sounded exactly like it did with the 2.7K and the 500. If you frequently feel the need to crank your DSP width way down below 300 Hz, you may benefit from the 200 filter, but I don't do that and don't plan to buy the narrow filter. Dave Hachadorian, K6LL Yuma, AZ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] Noise going up with reducing XTAL filter BW
Hello, Can somebody explain to me why the audio noise increase when i select a lower BW XTAL filter? For example going from 1k8 to 400Hz. As i use often BPSK31, the blue background of my waterfall (without signal present) go into the yellow color; (using Digipan with standard waterfall colors). I was expecting a constant level or a noise reduction, but not an increase. Is it a Filter gain setting to modify in my K3? Mny tnx in advance! 73 QRO de Rudolf, HB9ARI PS At 66 yo, it's not to late to learn something! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Hi Bill: Here are my CONFIG settings related to the AGC. The only ones I played with during the contest were SLP and THR. I always use AGC-F but did occasionally try AGC-S. AGC-HOLD 000 AGC-PLS NOR AGC-SLP 010 AGC-THR 005 AGC-F 120 AGC-S 020 The differing conditions I described were the situation of everyone calling the DX close to his frequency versus one strong station calling 70Hz off frequency. When even strong stations called the DX right on frequency I was able to hear signals through the QRM. When strong stations called 70Hz off of the DX frequency the receiver went quiet and took about 1/4 to 1/2 second to recover after he stopped sending. 73, Mike K2MK Bill W4ZV Mon, 23 Feb 2009 05:31:37 -0800 K2MK wrote: I thought it was interesting that recovery was noticeably slow on the DX station's frequency when this was happening. However, under normal conditions when US stations were calling directly on top of the DX station, recovery was fast. Hence the ability to copy the DX station through the dits when the QRM was on frequency. Mike this definitely sounds like desense but I'm surprised you experienced it with only S8-9 signals. I'm not sure what you mean about differing conditions on and off the center frequency. Desense will affect everything inside the roofing filter. What speed AGC were you using (F or S) and what were your AGC-F and AGC-S CONFIG settings? I NEVER use AGC-S on either CW or SSB and like at least 120 dB/sec for AGC-F. Also, help your AGC do its job by not running RF GAIN fully clockwise (as mentioned in my previous message). 73, Bill __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Noise going up with reducing XTAL filter BW
hb9ari wrote: Is it a Filter gain setting to modify in my K3? Yes, there is an FLx GN setting in the menu. Normally you need to increase it a dB or two for the narrow filters to compensate for the extra insertion loss. - Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392 K3 #222. http://www.g4ilo.com/ G4ILO's Shack http://www.g4ilo.com/blog.html G4ILO's Bloghttp://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html KComm for Elecraft K2 and K3 -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/Noise-going-up-with-reducing-XTAL-filter-BW-tp2372658p2372917.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
- Original Message - From: Darwin, Keith keith.dar...@goodrich.com To: Elecraft Discussion List elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering? Interesting. I had the opposite experience. I was on 40 meters yesterday afternoon for about 30 minutes. Signals were all pretty strong as Europe is just across the pond from my QTH. I did a lot of listening, comparing 1.1 KHz with 1.0 KHz and 550 Hz with 500 Hz. The difference of course, is that my 1 KHz and 500 Hz filters kick in. What I heard was a noticeable reduction in thumps, pops and AGC desensing as I stepped across the filter engagement boundary. There were a number of situations when I was at 550 Hz and could hear the other guy's signal being pumped up and down as my AGC was affected by someone 400 Hz away. I step down to 500 Hz, and the other guy's signal suddenly becomes smooth and consistent - no more AGC pumping. - Keith N1AS - - I operate cw with agc off, and absolute minimum rf gain. Preamp is disabled and attenuator is on whenever possible. That probably explains the difference. Dave Hachadorian, K6LL Yuma, AZ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Aha. It sounds like the desense problem arises when the DSP filter is narrower than the roofing filter. A strong station within the roofing passband but outside the DSP passband will shut down the receiver through AGC. I think we all misled ourselves by the impression that desense was impossible in the K3. It's working just as it ought -- but operators need to widen out the DSP to the full width of the roofing filter, when there are strong stations every few Hz. A bit counter-intuitive, perhaps. Peter N8MHD On 2/23/09, K2MK k...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Wayne and all: My filters are 200, 400, 1.0, 1.8 and 2.7 and they are all CW enabled. I was using headphones and my sub RX was off. My serial number is 2208 and the radio was factory assembled (including the sub RX). I did not hear key clicks when this was happening. The off frequency transmissions were clean. I also made a point of observing the signal strength of the offending stations and they were usually S8 or S9. Not the 20db or 40db over S9 that I was expecting. I thought it was interesting that recovery was noticeably slow on the DX station's frequency when this was happening. However, under normal conditions when US stations were calling directly on top of the DX station, recovery was fast. Hence the ability to copy the DX station through the dits when the QRM was on frequency. Maybe a passband shift could of helped. I would like to see the shift limits changed to something less than 50Hz. Maybe 10Hz on CW and 50Hz on other modes. I appreciate the interesting ideas from K6LL and W4ZV. Unfortunately I'll have to wait for the next busy contest to try them out. This just isn't the type of condition you can experience under normal band conditions. 73, Mike K2MK wayne burdick Sun, 22 Feb 2009 18:26:03 -0800 Mike, The K3 is virtually desense-proof, with a BDR of ~140 dB. But to take advantage of this, you need a narrow crystal filter -- the closer to the DSP bandwidth the better. This is exactly the situation that we had in mind when we designed the 200-Hz 5-pole filter. For CW pileups, you can't beat it. What crystal filter were you using at the time? Of course if the transmitting stations are wide due to key clicks, there may be situations where no amount of filtering can help (for any receiver). The DSP noise blanker and NR may be useful sometimes -- you might give this a try. Wayne N6KR On Feb 22, 2009, at 4:45 PM, K2MK wrote: I had a great time with my K3 during the ARRL DX contest. I do SP and I was trolling around with my filter width at 50Hz. Absolutely outstanding. The auto spot is equally outstanding. At 50Hz width it was quite clear that many stations call off frequency. Using RIT, I could see that it was typical for them to be 70Hz or more away from the DX station but I could not hear them in my 50Hz passband. The real problem was when one of them was S9 or greater. They completely swamped weaker DX stations. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
Ah, yes, Dave, that would make a difference. Enough of a difference that you and I are *almost* running different rigs :-) With AGC off, and AF gain up, I assume you ride the RF gain in response to RX signal strength. Cut RF gain for a strong one and boost it a bit for a weak signal, right? If you have RF gain boosted a bit for a weak signal, how do you control the strong ones that suddenly appear in the passband? - Keith N1AS - - K3 711 - -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Dave Hachadorian Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 11:30 AM To: Elecraft reflector Subject: Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering? I operate cw with agc off, and absolute minimum rf gain. Preamp is disabled and attenuator is on whenever possible. That probably explains the difference. Dave Hachadorian, K6LL Yuma, AZ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Having 1/4 to 1/2 second recovery time does not sound like AGC-F. By chance, did you have the CW text decode feature engaged? Did you have NR engaged? - Keith N1AS - - K3 711 - -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of K2MK Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 11:00 AM To: btipp...@alum.mit.edu; Elecraft Reflector Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest Hi Bill: Here are my CONFIG settings related to the AGC. The only ones I played with during the contest were SLP and THR. I always use AGC-F but did occasionally try AGC-S. AGC-HOLD 000 AGC-PLS NOR AGC-SLP 010 AGC-THR 005 AGC-F 120 AGC-S 020 The differing conditions I described were the situation of everyone calling the DX close to his frequency versus one strong station calling 70Hz off frequency. When even strong stations called the DX right on frequency I was able to hear signals through the QRM. When strong stations called 70Hz off of the DX frequency the receiver went quiet and took about 1/4 to 1/2 second to recover after he stopped sending. 73, Mike K2MK Bill W4ZV Mon, 23 Feb 2009 05:31:37 -0800 K2MK wrote: I thought it was interesting that recovery was noticeably slow on the DX station's frequency when this was happening. However, under normal conditions when US stations were calling directly on top of the DX station, recovery was fast. Hence the ability to copy the DX station through the dits when the QRM was on frequency. Mike this definitely sounds like desense but I'm surprised you experienced it with only S8-9 signals. I'm not sure what you mean about differing conditions on and off the center frequency. Desense will affect everything inside the roofing filter. What speed AGC were you using (F or S) and what were your AGC-F and AGC-S CONFIG settings? I NEVER use AGC-S on either CW or SSB and like at least 120 dB/sec for AGC-F. Also, help your AGC do its job by not running RF GAIN fully clockwise (as mentioned in my previous message). 73, Bill __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
This keyboard works GREAT for such things..and has additional keys you can program. www.bella-usa.com - 73, Greg - AB7R Whidbey Island WA NA-065 On Mon Feb 23 8:38 , Julian, G4ILO sent: Brian Machesney wrote: The only item on my wish list is an outboard tuning device to sit on the desk to the left of the keyboard (like my former Omni VII). 48 hours is a long time to reach up to the rig (on a shelf at eye level above the laptop screen) and the keyboard up/down arrow facility isn't flexible enough (station spacing on the band is fairly even, so you want to zip up the the next station and then slowly tune it in). I can see that I'm going to wear out the paint above the bezel where the fingers of my right hand rest while my thumb rotates the dial. I presume you're using some computer software to give you the up/down arrow facility. In which case what you want is a Griffin PowerMate. It's basically a knob attached to a USB cable. The supplied drivers allow you to program different keystrokes for whether you turn the knob clockwise or anticlockwise, so you can use it with pretty much any program. - Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392 K3 #222. http://www.g4ilo.com/ G4ILO's Shack http://www.g4ilo.com/blog.html G4ILO's Bloghttp://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html KComm for Elecraft K2 and K3 -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/So%2C-anyone-going-to-get-more- CW-filtering--tp2371938p2372963.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net','','','')Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Peter Wollan-2 wrote: Aha. It sounds like the desense problem arises when the DSP filter is narrower than the roofing filter. A strong station within the roofing passband but outside the DSP passband will shut down the receiver through AGC. I think we all misled ourselves by the impression that desense was impossible in the K3. It's working just as it ought -- but operators need to widen out the DSP to the full width of the roofing filter, when there are strong stations every few Hz. A bit counter-intuitive, perhaps. Correct me if I'm wrong, but a strong station within the roofing passband but outside the DSP passband will NOT shut down the receiver through AGC unless the strength exceeds s9+25dB (when hardware AGC kicks in due to ADC dynamic range limits). 73, Barry N1EU -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-receiver-desensing-on-CW-during-contest-tp2369819p2373077.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Hi Mike, On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 11:00 AM, K2MK k...@comcast.net wrote: Here are my CONFIG settings related to the AGC. The only ones I played with during the contest were SLP and THR. I always use AGC-F but did occasionally try AGC-S. AGC-HOLD 000 AGC-PLS NOR AGC-SLP 010 AGC-THR 005 AGC-F 120 AGC-S 020 These all look reasonable. I set my AGC-S to the max 040 but I actually never use AGC-S. If I were an AMer or 75m SSB ragchewer, I might. The differing conditions I described were the situation of everyone calling the DX close to his frequency versus one strong station calling 70Hz off frequency. When even strong stations called the DX right on frequency I was able to hear signals through the QRM. When strong stations called 70Hz off of the DX frequency the receiver went quiet and took about 1/4 to 1/2 second to recover after he stopped sending. This is what I'm having problems understanding: When even strong stations called the DX right on frequency I was able to hear signals through the QRM. 1. If two stations are exactly on frequency, the best ears in the world will not be able to separate them. I can distinguish pitch *differences* (i.e. one after the other) of about 0.4 Hz repeatably (see link below), but there's no way I could copy two simultaneous CW signals dead zero beat, so I don't understand your comment. The human ear's DSP has an effective bandwidth of ~50 Hz, so I could probably distinguish two signals 70 Hz apart if their amplitude was not too different (the human ear has AGC limits also!) http://tonometric.com/adaptivepitch/ (a fun test to take!) 2. The way the K3 and similar front ends (i.e. Orion, FT2000/9000, IC 7700/7800) work, strong signals inside the roofing filter passband will desense *all* signals within the passband...i.e. they will affect zero beat signals just as much as those 70 Hz away (which would be the case even if you were using the 200 Hz filter). So I cannot understand how signals off zero beat would be affected more than those zero beat. Anyhow, I'm clearly not understanding what you're saying. 73, Bill __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
I also ran across a stand alone shuttle jog device from www.contourdesign.com . I will check out that keyboard. It looks pretty handy! A slip of the foot you may soon recover, but a slip of the tongue you may never get over. Ben Franklin -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Greg - AB7R Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 9:57 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net; 'jul...@mailman.qth.net; G4ILO' Subject: Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering? This keyboard works GREAT for such things..and has additional keys you can program. www.bella-usa.com - 73, Greg - AB7R Whidbey Island WA NA-065 On Mon Feb 23 8:38 , Julian, G4ILO sent: Brian Machesney wrote: The only item on my wish list is an outboard tuning device to sit on the desk to the left of the keyboard (like my former Omni VII). 48 hours is a long time to reach up to the rig (on a shelf at eye level above the laptop screen) and the keyboard up/down arrow facility isn't flexible enough (station spacing on the band is fairly even, so you want to zip up the the next station and then slowly tune it in). I can see that I'm going to wear out the paint above the bezel where the fingers of my right hand rest while my thumb rotates the dial. I presume you're using some computer software to give you the up/down arrow facility. In which case what you want is a Griffin PowerMate. It's basically a knob attached to a USB cable. The supplied drivers allow you to program different keystrokes for whether you turn the knob clockwise or anticlockwise, so you can use it with pretty much any program. - Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392 K3 #222. http://www.g4ilo.com/ G4ILO's Shack http://www.g4ilo.com/blog.html G4ILO's Bloghttp://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html KComm for Elecraft K2 and K3 -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/So%2C-anyone-going-to-get-more- CW-filtering--tp2371938p2372963.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net','','','')Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
I believe the hardware AGC would be activated if the *combined* strength of all signals within the crystal filter passband gets above the threshold of S9+25 dB or so. This means that multiple unwanted signals don't have to reach the threshold strength *individually* for AGC pumping to occur, but there would have to be *a lot* of closely spaced unwanted signals at S8 to cause a problem if a narrow roofing filter is used. Also under those conditions, the operator would be unlikely to report that individual unwanted signals are no more than S8. I suppose one could also have a case where the wanted signal is almost strong enough to set off the hardware AGC, and a single, weaker signal gets through the roofing filter (but not the DSP) and adds just enough to the combined signal to cause hardware AGC action, resulting in an audible effect on the stronger wanted signal. 73, Erik K7TV - Original Message - From: Barry N1EU barry.n...@gmail.com To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 9:59 AM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest Peter Wollan-2 wrote: Aha. It sounds like the desense problem arises when the DSP filter is narrower than the roofing filter. A strong station within the roofing passband but outside the DSP passband will shut down the receiver through AGC. I think we all misled ourselves by the impression that desense was impossible in the K3. It's working just as it ought -- but operators need to widen out the DSP to the full width of the roofing filter, when there are strong stations every few Hz. A bit counter-intuitive, perhaps. Correct me if I'm wrong, but a strong station within the roofing passband but outside the DSP passband will NOT shut down the receiver through AGC unless the strength exceeds s9+25dB (when hardware AGC kicks in due to ADC dynamic range limits). 73, Barry N1EU -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-receiver-desensing-on-CW-during-contest-tp2369819p2373077.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
I also ran across a stand alone shuttle jog device from www.contourdesign.com... And then of course there're the just-discontinued Logitech NuLOOQ device and the 3DConnexion SpaceNavigator Personal Edition... 73, Lyle KK7P (who has the NuLOOQ, Contour Designs widget, and the PowerMate - and generally uses none of them, preferring the nice knobs and smooth encoders on the front of his K3 :-) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Hi Bill: You stated it correctly. Here's an example. There are two US stations calling the DX. Me and you both within my 50Hz passband. I send my call once and you send your call twice. You are S9 at my receiver and the DX is S7. When I finish calling I can hear you and I can also hear the DX station. (If there is no pitch difference there are still differences in strength and speed). I may not hear every character he is sending but I might hear him come back immediately after I stop sending and I might hear parts of a number 2 and parts of a letter K in his response. So when I no longer hear him I take a chance and assume he called me and I respond with my info. This all happened while you were still sending your call. This was not an unusual situation this weekend. I had a good signal and was getting most stations in one or two calls so it was not really a big leap for me to respond. But I was only able to do it because I could still hear him through the QRM. Now take the same situation except you were calling 70Hz off of his frequency. My receiver was dead until you stopped sending. Once you stopped I might hear the tail end of his message but I wouldn't know if it was me unless he called me a second time. And of those 20 occurrences that I described earlier, maybe half of those times he was calling me but I had to wait for the re-call. Someone else asked if I had the text decode on and I did not. As for NR, I usually had it on. But I always try to keep the aggressiveness low. And I did experiment and I still had the same problem with NR off. 73, Mike K2MK Bill Tippett Mon, 23 Feb 2009 09:20:14 -0800 Hi Mike, On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 11:00 AM, K2MK k...@comcast.net wrote: Here are my CONFIG settings related to the AGC. The only ones I played with during the contest were SLP and THR. I always use AGC-F but did occasionally try AGC-S. AGC-HOLD 000 AGC-PLS NOR AGC-SLP 010 AGC-THR 005 AGC-F 120 AGC-S 020 These all look reasonable. I set my AGC-S to the max 040 but I actually never use AGC-S. If I were an AMer or 75m SSB ragchewer, I might. The differing conditions I described were the situation of everyone calling the DX close to his frequency versus one strong station calling 70Hz off frequency. When even strong stations called the DX right on frequency I was able to hear signals through the QRM. When strong stations called 70Hz off of the DX frequency the receiver went quiet and took about 1/4 to 1/2 second to recover after he stopped sending. This is what I'm having problems understanding: When even strong stations called the DX right on frequency I was able to hear signals through the QRM. 1. If two stations are exactly on frequency, the best ears in the world will not be able to separate them. I can distinguish pitch *differences* (i.e. one after the other) of about 0.4 Hz repeatably (see link below), but there's no way I could copy two simultaneous CW signals dead zero beat, so I don't understand your comment. The human ear's DSP has an effective bandwidth of ~50 Hz, so I could probably distinguish two signals 70 Hz apart if their amplitude was not too different (the human ear has AGC limits also!) http://tonometric.com/adaptivepitch/ (a fun test to take!) 2. The way the K3 and similar front ends (i.e. Orion, FT2000/9000, IC 7700/7800) work, strong signals inside the roofing filter passband will desense *all* signals within the passband...i.e. they will affect zero beat signals just as much as those 70 Hz away (which would be the case even if you were using the 200 Hz filter). So I cannot understand how signals off zero beat would be affected more than those zero beat. Anyhow, I'm clearly not understanding what you're saying. 73, Bill __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
The problem with any of the shuttle knobs or keyboards with integral shuttle control is the need for software support. Most of these devices operate by emulating a mouse wheel (the scroll wheel) and it is not easy to use the external knob to tune while reading e-mail or surfing the web. It would be handy if logging/control programs (e.g., CI-V Commander from DXLab Suite) could capture a specific device like the Griffin Power Mate or Contour Shuttle Express/Shuttle Pro for exclusive use and operate in the background. The shuttle knobs are not so much a problem with contest software like N1MM Logger since that's not likely to be used in the background ... but the same considerations would apply if they were. 73, ... Joe, W4TV -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of W0MU Mike Fatchett Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 12:29 PM To: a...@cablespeed.com; elecraft@mailman.qth.net; 'jul...@mailman.qth.net; 'G4ILO'' Subject: Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering? I also ran across a stand alone shuttle jog device from www.contourdesign.com . I will check out that keyboard. It looks pretty handy! A slip of the foot you may soon recover, but a slip of the tongue you may never get over. Ben Franklin -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Greg - AB7R Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 9:57 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net; 'jul...@mailman.qth.net; G4ILO' Subject: Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering? This keyboard works GREAT for such things..and has additional keys you can program. www.bella-usa.com - 73, Greg - AB7R Whidbey Island WA NA-065 On Mon Feb 23 8:38 , Julian, G4ILO sent: Brian Machesney wrote: The only item on my wish list is an outboard tuning device to sit on the desk to the left of the keyboard (like my former Omni VII). 48 hours is a long time to reach up to the rig (on a shelf at eye level above the laptop screen) and the keyboard up/down arrow facility isn't flexible enough (station spacing on the band is fairly even, so you want to zip up the the next station and then slowly tune it in). I can see that I'm going to wear out the paint above the bezel where the fingers of my right hand rest while my thumb rotates the dial. I presume you're using some computer software to give you the up/down arrow facility. In which case what you want is a Griffin PowerMate. It's basically a knob attached to a USB cable. The supplied drivers allow you to program different keystrokes for whether you turn the knob clockwise or anticlockwise, so you can use it with pretty much any program. - Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392 K3 #222. http://www.g4ilo.com/ G4ILO's Shack http://www.g4ilo.com/blog.html G4ILO's Bloghttp://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html KComm for Elecraft K2 and K3 -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/So%2C-anyone-going-to-get-more- CW-filtering--tp2371938p2372963.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net','','','')Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Is my summary of the issue correct? If both signals are within both the DSP and roofing filter bandwidths, then the receiver recovers instantly after each character. If the stronger signal is outside the DSP filter window (and you can’t hear him) but inside the roofing filter window, then there is de-sensing. Would passband tuning (shift) help to shift his signal outside of the roofing filter bandpass? John W2XS -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-receiver-desensing-on-CW-during-contest-tp2369819p2373481.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] So, anyone going to get more CW filtering?
Joe Subich, W4TV-4 wrote: The problem with any of the shuttle knobs or keyboards with integral shuttle control is the need for software support. Most of these devices operate by emulating a mouse wheel (the scroll wheel) and it is not easy to use the external knob to tune while reading e-mail or surfing the web. It would be handy if logging/control programs (e.g., CI-V Commander from DXLab Suite) could capture a specific device like the Griffin Power Mate or Contour Shuttle Express/Shuttle Pro for exclusive use and operate in the background. The shuttle knobs are not so much a problem with contest software like N1MM Logger since that's not likely to be used in the background ... but the same considerations would apply if they were. This could probably work (tuning while the app is in the background) if the app could register two or three system-wide hot keys which the tuning device could then emulate. But as you say, it requires the logging/control program developer to implement this. Keystroke or mouse wheel emulation only works if the app is in the foreground. - Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392 K3 #222. http://www.g4ilo.com/ G4ILO's Shack http://www.g4ilo.com/blog.html G4ILO's Bloghttp://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html KComm for Elecraft K2 and K3 -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/So%2C-anyone-going-to-get-more-CW-filtering--tp2371938p2373547.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
It seems that this thread is VERY confused about how AGC works to control the RF gain. I also suspect that some are using the radio with too much RF gain. The settings that W4ZV posted are pretty much what I use, except that I regularly also run the RF gains (both main and sub) at about 2 o'clock when I hear signals getting buried in the background noise. I also think many do not understand the definition of desense. Desense occurs when a gain stage is driven into clip so badly that the bias point shifts and reduces the gain (worst case, to cutoff). So far, I've never heard my K3s desense. I have heard a strong station pump the AGC when I'm copying a weak station. I've also heard massive phase noise and clicks from a dirty transmitter (most recently, a JA who was only about 5dB over S9 when I was trying to run JAs 1 kHz away from him on 40M). And there's a JA who made it into my logbook on 80M with a power exchange of 1 watt! He wouldn't have with any other radio. One expansion of W4ZV's comments regarding perception of pitch. Human sight and hearing are logarithmic. Human hearing works on the basis of what acousticians call critical bands, which are logarithmic, and which are tied to the physical construction of the human hearing system itself. The filter between our ears is better able to separate a 50 Hz pitch difference at 300 Hz than at 900 Hz! That's one reason why some CW operators like to work at lower pitches when the going gets tough. 73, Jim Brown K9YC (Member Acoustical Society of America) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Is this correct? If a cw signal falls within the DSP passband it should and will pump the AGC. If a CW signal falls outside the DSP passband it should not pump the DSP's AGC. The problem here is defining what the DSP's passband it. If a signal is just outside the audio range of the DSP (can't be heard) then I would consider it outside the DSP passband and it should not pump the AGC however this is never the case. I see moderate signals just slightly outside the audio passband that pump the AGC. This is partly what is confusing us. Signals that we can't hear pumping the AGC worry us. What we hear coming from the speaker doesn't match how the AGC is responding. If my WIDTH is set for 100hz and a signal is at 110hz, I won't hear him but my S-meter responds to him as well as my AGC desenses (reduces gain). All of this has nothing to do with the roofing filter. Steve Ellington n...@carolina.rr.com - Original Message - From: Jim Brown j...@audiosystemsgroup.com To: Elecraft List elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 1:46 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest It seems that this thread is VERY confused about how AGC works to control the RF gain. I also suspect that some are using the radio with too much RF gain. The settings that W4ZV posted are pretty much what I use, except that I regularly also run the RF gains (both main and sub) at about 2 o'clock when I hear signals getting buried in the background noise. I also think many do not understand the definition of desense. Desense occurs when a gain stage is driven into clip so badly that the bias point shifts and reduces the gain (worst case, to cutoff). So far, I've never heard my K3s desense. I have heard a strong station pump the AGC when I'm copying a weak station. I've also heard massive phase noise and clicks from a dirty transmitter (most recently, a JA who was only about 5dB over S9 when I was trying to run JAs 1 kHz away from him on 40M). And there's a JA who made it into my logbook on 80M with a power exchange of 1 watt! He wouldn't have with any other radio. One expansion of W4ZV's comments regarding perception of pitch. Human sight and hearing are logarithmic. Human hearing works on the basis of what acousticians call critical bands, which are logarithmic, and which are tied to the physical construction of the human hearing system itself. The filter between our ears is better able to separate a 50 Hz pitch difference at 300 Hz than at 900 Hz! That's one reason why some CW operators like to work at lower pitches when the going gets tough. 73, Jim Brown K9YC (Member Acoustical Society of America) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1967 - Release Date: 02/23/09 07:17:00 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
From what I though the original post was about the trouble copying signals in a pile up, it appears to me that thread has become at least 3 different topics. Seems there are people talking desense, AGC settings, and the pile up problem. To make mine clear, I do not have any desense problems with the K3, I can work within hundreds of HZ from very strong stations and have never had it blank the receiver when using narrow filters. AGC, I dont think it is the problem as I have it turned off most of the time and use the RF gain. The third problem is what I have had and apparently others, when there are many stations calling in a pile up that are a sig strength of say s4 to s5, the audio turns to mush and they all sound the same, no difference in strength, like they are all clipped somehow to the same level and distorted. Not a pure audio tone any longer, does not happen with just a couple stations in the pile up, only when maybe over 5 or 6 at a time are calling. Turns to mush as some one said. Have not tried turning the radio on and off when that happens, but will next time to see it that resets something. In an case dont lump all these comments that have come under the desense heading as one problem, it appears to be at least 3.. Perhaps the subject is incorrectly titled. Merv KH7C It seems that this thread is VERY confused about how AGC works to control the RF gain. I also suspect that some are using the radio with too much RF gain. The settings that W4ZV posted are pretty much what I use, except that I regularly also run the RF gains (both main and sub) at about 2 o'clock when I hear signals getting buried in the background noise. I also think many do not understand the definition of desense. Desense occurs when a gain stage is driven into clip so badly that the bias point shifts and reduces the gain (worst case, to cutoff). So far, I've never heard my K3s desense. I have heard a strong station pump the AGC when I'm copying a weak station. I've also heard massive phase noise and clicks from a dirty transmitter (most recently, a JA who was only about 5dB over S9 when I was trying to run JAs 1 kHz away from him on 40M). And there's a JA who made it into my logbook on 80M with a power exchange of 1 watt! He wouldn't have with any other radio. One expansion of W4ZV's comments regarding perception of pitch. Human sight and hearing are logarithmic. Human hearing works on the basis of what acousticians call critical bands, which are logarithmic, and which are tied to the physical construction of the human hearing system itself. The filter between our ears is better able to separate a 50 Hz pitch difference at 300 Hz than at 900 Hz! That's one reason why some CW operators like to work at lower pitches when the going gets tough. 73, Jim Brown K9YC (Member Acoustical Society of America) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
I'm at work and don't have time to check any of this ... But I was under the impression that it was not this way. Signals outside of the DSP passband but inside the roofing filter passband would activate the DSP. So, with a 2 KHz roofing filter and a 200 Hz DSP, you'd have very few signals being heard by the OP but lots of signals affecting the AGC. - Keith N1AS - - K3 711 - -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Steve Ellington Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 1:58 PM To: Jim Brown; Elecraft List Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest Is this correct? If a cw signal falls within the DSP passband it should and will pump the AGC. If a CW signal falls outside the DSP passband it should not pump the DSP's AGC. Steve Ellington n...@carolina.rr.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] FS: two 1 KHz, 8 pole CW filters
Turns out I'm pretty much a bottom feeder and I am using the rig with 150Hz and narrower filtering on CW 99% of the time except when on a voice mode. I'm not using the 1Khz 8 pole filters so they're excess to my needs. $230 for the two, or $118 for one. shipping is included I bought these in Dec 08. If you're interested, please contact me off list. Thanks, Gary KA1J __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Hi John: You are correct. When there was no strong off center signal but two or more strong signals within the 50Hz passband it was possible to copy one signal, as we all do, in the presence of QRM. There was no noticeable AGC action. It was just a normal situation of trying to copy one signal out of several. Even at 50Hz you can't remove 100% of all QRM. When an S8 or S9 signal was around 70Hz away the signals inside the 50Hz passband were quiet until he stopped sending. I wanted to hear what was causing the problem so I used RIT to tune up or down until I could hear the off center signal. When I did I found that the offset was about 70Hz as read on the lower display. I could then also see his signal strength on the S meter. I wish I could say what happened when I opened up the passband but I don't recall. I thought a passband shift might help but the shift is limited to 50Hz increments. So one touch of the shift knob caused me to lose the signal of interest. 73, Mike K2MK John W2XS Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:18:02 -0800 Is my summary of the issue correct? If both signals are within both the DSP and roofing filter bandwidths, then the receiver recovers instantly after each character. If the stronger signal is outside the DSP filter window (and you can't hear him) but inside the roofing filter window, then there is de-sensing. Would passband tuning (shift) help to shift his signal outside of the roofing filter bandpass? John W2XS __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
There are two separate AGC functions: 1. Hardware AGC is activated when the combined signals that get through the roofing filter reach a certain level, about S9+25. When it is activated, all those signals, including the wanted signal, are attenuated before the DSP. AFAIK the hardware AGC cannot be turned off. 2. Software AGC implemented within the DSP. It can be turned on or off, and its parameters can be adjusted. I am not sure whether it is ever totally turned off, even when turned off. It reacts to the strenght of all that has passed through the DSP bandwidth. Signals outside the DSP passband but inside the roofing filter certainly enter the DSP, but the DSP bandpass filter should eliminate them before they can do anything to the software AGC. They can affect the hardware AGC, but only if they together (including the wanted signal) are so strong that the hardware AGC does anything at all. Erik K7TV - Original Message - From: Darwin, Keith keith.dar...@goodrich.com To: Elecraft List elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 12:22 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest I'm at work and don't have time to check any of this ... But I was under the impression that it was not this way. Signals outside of the DSP passband but inside the roofing filter passband would activate the DSP. So, with a 2 KHz roofing filter and a 200 Hz DSP, you'd have very few signals being heard by the OP but lots of signals affecting the AGC. - Keith N1AS - - K3 711 - -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Steve Ellington Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 1:58 PM To: Jim Brown; Elecraft List Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest Is this correct? If a cw signal falls within the DSP passband it should and will pump the AGC. If a CW signal falls outside the DSP passband it should not pump the DSP's AGC. Steve Ellington n...@carolina.rr.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] CW to RTTY
Hello Dave, I must have been sleeping ... I use FSK-D now and all works fine. I just use it for hunting DX-peds. Just wkd K5D on 18Mc RTTY using the internal CW to RTTY decoder. Thanks for waking me up. 73's, Evert PA2KW _ From: David Yarnes [mailto:w7...@cox.net] Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2009 05:48 To: ev...@pa2kw.com; 'Elecraft Discussion List' Subject: Re: [Elecraft] CW to RTTY Evert, Are you sure you are engaging FSK-D rather than FSK-A? Also, if you are trying to use an external keyer, it won't work. You have to use the internal keyer. I've been working RTTY split, using paddle input, with no problem and through all the updates. Dave W7AQK - Original Message From: Evert Bakker (PA2KW) mailto:ev...@pa2kw.com To: 'Elecraft mailto:elecraft@mailman.qth.net Discussion List' Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2009 4:36 PM Subject: [Elecraft] CW to RTTY I have firmware version 2.67/1.96. In this version it is still not possible to use CW to RTTY when using SPLIT. Has this been fixed in the newer firmware version? I now use XIT, but this is not so powerfull. 73's, Evert PA2KW _ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
This is an interesting subject. I've read several opinions on how the K3-AGC works here and MORE important: how it behaves. Can somebody from Elecraft shine a light on the AGC behaviour? I'm very curious now. 73, Arie PA3A __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] RTTY
Hello, I'm having trouble getting N1MM MMTTY to work on my K3. I can copy text ok I can key the transmitter and get output but I can't get it to DIDDLE with the software. When I use the paddles it Diddles all ok but not WIth the computer. Can someone give me some insight as to what is wrong. Thanks MelWE2K Mel Snitchler E-mail w...@binghamtonwireless.com E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (6.0.0.386) Database version: 5.11820 http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] RTTY
Mel, What DATA mode are you using? If you are generating the tones from MMTTY with the soundcard, you must use DATA A or AFSK A. If you can use the paddles to RTTY, then your DATA mode is set to FSK D. Think of the A data modes as Audio sourced, and think of the D modes as Direct or Data sourced - it helps me remember, maybe it will do the same for you. 73, Don W3FPR Mel Snitchler wrote: Hello, I'm having trouble getting N1MM MMTTY to work on my K3. I can copy text ok I can key the transmitter and get output but I can't get it to DIDDLE with the software. When I use the paddles it Diddles all ok but not WIth the computer. Can someone give me some insight as to what is wrong. Thanks MelWE2K __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] Free Membership! Free Certificate!
New Years 2009 may have come and gone but its never too late to resolve to help preserve and encourage CW activity across our amateur bands. To celebrate the new year, come and join the NAQCC (North American QRP CW Club), a club for any and ALL CW enthusiasts around the world. Our members include Big Gun contesters, hard-core QRPers, experimenters, ragchewers and SWLers; young and old alike. As different as we may be, we all share one thing in common, and that is our love for CW. We welcome all who want to help support CW and have at least some interest in using QRP from time-to-time. Our club runs monthly sprints and challenges. Plus we sponsor some additional special on-air activities during the year. Membership is FREE and once you join you're automatically a lifetime member! So sign up today and help us keep CW alive and well. Visit our web site at http://www.usatek.net/~yoel/. You'll find info on all of our various activities plus an online membership application. We look forward to your support and hope to soon see your call added to our membership roster. 73, Paul/KD2MX NAQCC Membership Recruiter On behalf of: Tom, WY3H - NAQCC President John, K3WWP - NAQCC Vice President Larry, W2LJ - NAQCC Asst. Publicity Director Dave, VA3RJ/VE3JDR - NAQCC Publicity Officer __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Free Membership! Free Certificate!
NAQCC wrote: New Years 2009 may have come and gone but its never too late to resolve to help preserve and encourage CW activity across our amateur bands. To celebrate the new year, come and join the NAQCC (North American QRP CW Club), a club for any and ALL CW enthusiasts around the world Done :) 73, Wayne N6KR --- http://www.elecraft.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Free Membership! Free Certificate!
Ditto! wayne burdick wrote: NAQCC wrote: New Years 2009 may have come and gone but its never too late to resolve to help preserve and encourage CW activity across our amateur bands. To celebrate the new year, come and join the NAQCC (North American QRP CW Club), a club for any and ALL CW enthusiasts around the world Done :) 73, Wayne N6KR --- http://www.elecraft.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- R. Kevin Stover, ACØH __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
This is what I was seeing too. I never had any issues with wide or clicky stations causing any issues. The radio is great to use. The K3 produced the least amount of listening fatigue that I have experienced. A good thing! Not being able to pull out callsigns out of a big pile is not a good thing. A slip of the foot you may soon recover, but a slip of the tongue you may never get over. Ben Franklin -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Merv Schweigert Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 12:15 PM Cc: Elecraft List Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest From what I though the original post was about the trouble copying signals in a pile up, it appears to me that thread has become at least 3 different topics. Seems there are people talking desense, AGC settings, and the pile up problem. To make mine clear, I do not have any desense problems with the K3, I can work within hundreds of HZ from very strong stations and have never had it blank the receiver when using narrow filters. AGC, I dont think it is the problem as I have it turned off most of the time and use the RF gain. The third problem is what I have had and apparently others, when there are many stations calling in a pile up that are a sig strength of say s4 to s5, the audio turns to mush and they all sound the same, no difference in strength, like they are all clipped somehow to the same level and distorted. Not a pure audio tone any longer, does not happen with just a couple stations in the pile up, only when maybe over 5 or 6 at a time are calling. Turns to mush as some one said. Have not tried turning the radio on and off when that happens, but will next time to see it that resets something. In an case dont lump all these comments that have come under the desense heading as one problem, it appears to be at least 3.. Perhaps the subject is incorrectly titled. Merv KH7C It seems that this thread is VERY confused about how AGC works to control the RF gain. I also suspect that some are using the radio with too much RF gain. The settings that W4ZV posted are pretty much what I use, except that I regularly also run the RF gains (both main and sub) at about 2 o'clock when I hear signals getting buried in the background noise. I also think many do not understand the definition of desense. Desense occurs when a gain stage is driven into clip so badly that the bias point shifts and reduces the gain (worst case, to cutoff). So far, I've never heard my K3s desense. I have heard a strong station pump the AGC when I'm copying a weak station. I've also heard massive phase noise and clicks from a dirty transmitter (most recently, a JA who was only about 5dB over S9 when I was trying to run JAs 1 kHz away from him on 40M). And there's a JA who made it into my logbook on 80M with a power exchange of 1 watt! He wouldn't have with any other radio. One expansion of W4ZV's comments regarding perception of pitch. Human sight and hearing are logarithmic. Human hearing works on the basis of what acousticians call critical bands, which are logarithmic, and which are tied to the physical construction of the human hearing system itself. The filter between our ears is better able to separate a 50 Hz pitch difference at 300 Hz than at 900 Hz! That's one reason why some CW operators like to work at lower pitches when the going gets tough. 73, Jim Brown K9YC (Member Acoustical Society of America) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] RTTY
Do you have the two transistor interface (FSK and PTT) connected between the MMTTY serial port and the KC ACC port for FSK input? If you are doing FSK, you will need some way of getting the FSK from the computer serial port to the FSK (and PTT) input of the K3. -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Mel Snitchler Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 4:44 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] RTTY Hello, I'm having trouble getting N1MM MMTTY to work on my K3. I can copy text ok I can key the transmitter and get output but I can't get it to DIDDLE with the software. When I use the paddles it Diddles all ok but not WIth the computer. Can someone give me some insight as to what is wrong. Thanks MelWE2K Mel Snitchler E-mail w...@binghamtonwireless.com E-mail message checked by Spyware Doctor (6.0.0.386) Database version: 5.11820 http://www.pctools.com/en/spyware-doctor-antivirus/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] K3: copying 5 weak signals within a 50hz BW
OK...so we (several of you) have identified a similar situation of mushiness. Just out of curiosity, did anyone have a 2nd receiver (non-K3) handy to see if IT could copy the signals cleanly? Also... IMO, copying a slight tone shift (ala W4ZV link, which is VFB) is a lot different than trying to copy multiple (weak) signals all at about the same pitch, all of which are sending digital (cw) information. I think the brain will try to zero in on one, but that will be exceedingly difficult to do, since no one signal ends up being an easy focus. Thanks, de Doug KR2Q __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] K3 #2738
Received my K3 today. I'm a chicken; I ordered it factory built. It is pretty much everything I expected. After getting everything connected, I realize I have hours figuring out how to use the radio. I'm really looking forward to it. Thanks to the crew at Elecraft. They did their usual superb job. 73, Jim, K4ZMV __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 #2738
Congrats! -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim Brassell Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 4:47 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] K3 #2738 Received my K3 today. I'm a chicken; I ordered it factory built. It is pretty much everything I expected. After getting everything connected, I realize I have hours figuring out how to use the radio. I'm really looking forward to it. Thanks to the crew at Elecraft. They did their usual superb job. 73, Jim, K4ZMV __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Free Membership! Free Certificate!
On Mon, 23 Feb 2009 14:24:16 -0800 wayne burdick n...@elecraft.com wrote: NAQCC wrote: New Years 2009 may have come and gone but its never too late to resolve to help preserve and encourage CW activity across our amateur bands. To celebrate the new year, come and join the NAQCC (North American QRP CW Club), a club for any and ALL CW enthusiasts around the world Done :) 73, Wayne N6KR --- ** YO! Wayne! Is it OK if us guys who know that life is to short for QRP can join or is it something that is Clique-oriented? Jim/nn6ee S/N 2406 PS, Just wondering __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3: copying 5 weak signals within a 50hz BW
Yes as matter of fact I do have a second radio sitting alongside the K3 and I split the antenna to both receivers for receive, so its a apple to apple comparison, the second radio had no problems at all in the pile up, was not going to mention I used the second radio to work the pileup and then went back to the K3 later. I know someone will ask, second radio is a modded FT-1000D. not mp not mk v not field, modded D.. Merv KH7C OK...so we (several of you) have identified a similar situation of mushiness. Just out of curiosity, did anyone have a 2nd receiver (non-K3) handy to see if IT could copy the signals cleanly? Also... IMO, copying a slight tone shift (ala W4ZV link, which is VFB) is a lot different than trying to copy multiple (weak) signals all at about the same pitch, all of which are sending digital (cw) information. I think the brain will try to zero in on one, but that will be exceedingly difficult to do, since no one signal ends up being an easy focus. Thanks, de Doug KR2Q __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Free Membership! Free Certificate!
On Feb 23, 2009, at 4:25 PM, JIM DAVIS wrote: YO! Wayne! Is it OK if us guys who know that life is too short for QRP can join or is it something that is Clique-oriented? Jim, NAQCC is open to anyone, including those who haven't had the pleasure of making QSOs with the minimum power necessary :) BTW, I see QRP as fun activity, not as a lifestyle. I run 20-100 watts about half the time, and 5-10 watts the other. 73, Wayne N6KR --- http://www.elecraft.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3: activating sub receiver disables tx ?
The missing L3 has arrived and after installing it I now have transmit output when the subrx is activated Dave ww2r -Original Message- From: ww...@g4fre.com [mailto:ww...@g4fre.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 12:15 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3: activating sub receiver disables tx ? Thanks to information from Charles Allen (who suffered the same issue) and help from Dale at elecraft, the problem has now been identified as a subin board production defect The inductor (L3) that supples bias to switch the tx/rx pin diode to the tx path on the board was not, and had never been fitted, hence drive doesnt get switched to the tx path The missing inductor is on its way from CA The board was supplied with the subrx last november. Wayne assures me all subin boards are now 100% tested Dave ww2r Message: 11 Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 02:09:47 -0500 From: ww...@g4fre.com Subject: [Elecraft] K3: activating sub receiver disables tx ? To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Message-ID: S359335AbZBNHJs/20090214070948z+2...@swip007.ftl.affinity.com Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1 I wonder if anyone else has experienced the following? (and what the cure was?) In a k3 with atu xverter interface and subrx. Ant 1 is selected vfo a is set to cw mode and receives OK. Keying it shows rf output on the k3 power meter and the external power meter vfo b is set to cw mode on the same band. Doing an a/b swap and it receives OK, Keying it shows rf output on the k3 power meter and the external power meter if I activate split (rx a tx b) using the above settings, keying shows rf output on the k3 power meter and the external power meter however if I activate the subreceiver with split (still) enabled keying shows NO rf output on the k3 power meter and NO rf on the external power meter. A signal can be heard on a monitor receiver. Also if I leave the subreceiver activated and turn off the split (no split) keying still shows NO rf output on the k3 power meter and NO rf on the external power meter. A signal can be heard on a monitor receiver using bset ant changes the subrx receive path as expected but doesnt affect the tx output I was using the 2.82 software. I rolled back to 2.76 but still have the same issue Dave ww2r __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 #2738
Jim, I also ordered my K3 # 2536 factory built. Had I not, I still wouldn't be on the air and enjoying my K3! Nothing chicken or shameful just able to savor the Flavor without the cookin :) Best of luck with it. Sid K3SX Jim Brassell wrote: Received my K3 today. I'm a chicken; I ordered it factory built. It is pretty much everything I expected. After getting everything connected, I realize I have hours figuring out how to use the radio. I'm really looking forward to it. Thanks to the crew at Elecraft. They did their usual superb job. 73, Jim, K4ZMV __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] K1 problem during Alignment and Test Part 1
Thanks in advance for any advice... Symptom: Without filter board installed, unit powers up and passes LED tests. Absolutely nothing appears at any time on the LCD display. I thought I might be having a display problem until for giggles and grins, I popped in the filter board and powered up. With filter board in, LEDs behave as expected, relays can be heards twiddling, and then the E42 error code is displayed for a short time and then the display goes blank again. In either case, with the display blank, subsequently pressing any of the buttons produces nothing. Other things I've done... I've looked at every pin of the display with a scope to verify no shorted pins. Likewise, I've looked at every pin of the PIC on the FP board with a scope to verify no unexpected shorts to gnd or Vdd. Can see activity on the SDA and SCL lines as well. Checked U4 for proper voltage out. I've physically inspected every connection to check for improper soldering. (I'm a very experienced kit builder and can honestly say I've not had a problem with improper soldering. I've missed the occasional pin though ;-) Physically inspected RF board as well. Voltages good. Solder joints all seem good and present! The PIC on the FP board is definitely running, and because the E42 error code displays, albeit temporarily, I know the display is good. Why no E27 code at all? Why doesn't E42 code stay, so that a tap of a button gets me to the next state? Again, thanks for your consideration, Kelly NN8E __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] It arrived, it did, it did... wow!
Please forgive, I need to share... it seems that I have received a certificate, and it is pretty speacial to me. So, please bear with me on this. The certificate in hand... is the very nicely done, attractive and explicit paper, decribing my efforts in the CQ WW 160 DX Contest. It is in Recognition of winning 1st place single op, QRP cw Wyoming, #17 US, and #1 th area, with 11,931. I want to thank all those that helped with straining their ears to hear me... and those that logged me, during a run on my part. And I especially want to thank CQ and N2NT and W2VU for their continueing efforts to put together a fine contest enjoyed by many. So.. if I haven't broken my arm now... I hope to see you in the next test too.. --... ...-- Dale - WC7S in Wy _ It’s the same Hotmail®. If by “same” you mean up to 70% faster. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_AE_Same_022009 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] It arrived, it did, it did... wow!
And I used my K2 - qrp, with a pair of dipoles, and a vertical. The Elecraft K2 is amazing when put to work on things like lowband with an electric fence under the antenna. Thank you, --... ...-- Dale - WC7S in Wy Please forgive, I need to share... it seems that I have received a certificate, and it is pretty speacial to me. So, please bear with me on this. The certificate in hand... is the very nicely done, attractive and explicit paper, decribing my efforts in the CQ WW 160 DX Contest. It is in Recognition of winning 1st place single op, QRP cw Wyoming, #17 US, and #1 th area, with 11,931. I want to thank all those that helped with straining their ears to hear me... and those that logged me, during a run on my part. And I especially want to thank CQ and N2NT and W2VU for their continueing efforts to put together a fine contest enjoyed by many. So.. if I haven't broken my arm now... I hope to see you in the next test too.. --... ...-- Dale - WC7S in Wy It’s the same Hotmail®. If by “same” you mean up to 70% faster. Get your account now. _ Access your email online and on the go with Windows Live Hotmail. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_AE_Access_022009 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3: AFX Firmware request
Many of the buttons do different stuff based on what mode you're in. I'd not put something like this past him in the least. On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 2:35 AM, Bill W4ZV btipp...@alum.mit.edu wrote: Ed K1EP wrote: In order to adjust the AFX properties, you have to go into the menu. It isn't that easy in the heat of the battle. You can assign the AFX setting to one of the PF keys. I doubt Wayne is going to want to start making keys work different ways for different modes. 73, Bill -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3%3A-AFX-Firmware-request-tp2368964p2371459.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
When I first received my K3, I too was disappointed with the BDR until I understood what was happening. In an effort to quantify the BDR of signals between the xtal filter bandpass and the DSP bandpass, I set up the following scenario... Two generators feeding the K3 through a hybrid combiner. One set to about -85dBm (S7 on my K3), and the other variable. I tuned in the -85dBm signal, with the xtal filter set to 500Hz, and DSP to 50Hz. With the interfering signal set to 200Hz offset (within the xtal filter passband) I started to see desense of the weaker signal at -34dBm output level for the stronger signal. With the interfering signal set to 2kHz offset, I started to see desense at +15dBm. The difference of 49dB shows the importance of the xtal filter to this design. Of course, different AGC settings would affect this test. The promised variable roofing filters would reduce the problem quite a bit, but that opens up other issues. I think the days of receivers with xtal filters are numbered. High speed ADCs capable of 140dB dynamic range without xtal filtering are on the horizon. A 20-bit ADC with enough processing gain would do it. 73, Larry N8LP Bill W4ZV wrote: K2MK wrote: I thought it was interesting that recovery was noticeably slow on the DX station's frequency when this was happening. However, under normal conditions when US stations were calling directly on top of the DX station, recovery was fast. Hence the ability to copy the DX station through the dits when the QRM was on frequency. Mike this definitely sounds like desense but I'm surprised you experienced it with only S8-9 signals. I'm not sure what you mean about differing conditions on and off the center frequency. Desense will affect everything inside the roofing filter. What speed AGC were you using (F or S) and what were your AGC-F and AGC-S CONFIG settings? I NEVER use AGC-S on either CW or SSB and like at least 120 dB/sec for AGC-F. Also, help your AGC do its job by not running RF GAIN fully clockwise (as mentioned in my previous message). 73, Bill P.S. As I said before my K3 worked extremely well coping weak signals in the midst of massive ones on 160 this weekend. I smiled when I saw the following comment from OL0W(OK1DSZ): Only for fun, when the band was already closing, I decided to try what I will be able to work with QRP. Using longer callsign OK1DSZ and the power reduced to 5W I spend about 10 minutes calling several east coast big guns. The award for the best ears goes to W4ZV, who was worked as easily as with the kilowatt earlier in the night. K8PO and W2FU were worked with several repeats. The others just kept CQing without any reaction with exception of K1TTT, who apparently heard something, but not enough for the QSO. -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-receiver-desensing-on-CW-during-contest-tp2369819p2375849.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3: AFX Firmware request
Brett Howard wrote: Many of the buttons do different stuff based on what mode you're in. I'd not put something like this past him in the least. Brett, I'm cautiously flexible (and hopefully, consistent) with the controls. But I would never engage in a breech of UI etiquette as flagrant as making the DATA MD switch act as a shortcut to the AFX menu entry. One of our field testers proposed that over a year ago, and he couldn't talk me into it, either :) You *can* use a programmable switch function (PFx/Mx) for this, though. 73, Wayne N6KR --- http://www.elecraft.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] EMI problem between main and sub receivers - possible cause found
Dear group, Regarding this issue I had described in a previous email, I wrote: The zipper or motorboat noise occurs when tuning around 4.9-5.5 MHz or 4900-5500 KHz. It is most noticeable when the sub receiver is turned on, the sub volume is up, and tuning steps are set to fine. The noise ONLY occurs when I turn a VFO knob or filter knob. If I do not touch any knob, the noise does not occur. It does not matter if VFO A or VFO B knob is used, or whether or not they are linked. So think of it like this: when I am in that band area, if I continuously turn a VFO knob, I will hear the motorboat noise until I stop turning the knob. If I pass that particular frequency area, the noise disappears completely. And another email of mine describing the issue: As for my motorboating issue, this is not something that you hear if you just let the receiver sit at 5.000.000. Instead, the noise only appears when you turn any VFO or filter knob... if you turn the VFO knob quickly enough, then it sounds like a motorboat. This happens from approximately 4.899.91 to 5.302.35 What's really weird though is that if I happen to come across a broadcast station anywhere between those frequencies, then the motorboating noise will stop until I pass the station. After that noise picks up again... it's as if the receivers don't know what to do with themselves when there's no signal received between those frequencies, and they decide to inject noise until another station pops up, or you reach the end of this particular frequency area. Now if I stop turning the VFO, then no noise... just band static. Well, it looks like I've narrowed down whatever was going on with my K3. It seems this issue only manifests itself between 4.8-5.3 KHz with the peak of EMI noise around 5.00 KHz, AND only when the sub receiver is utilizing the same antenna input as the main receiver. If both receivers are set to ANT1 or ANT2, I can hear this EMI generated as I spin the VFO's. I also noticed that when tuning around, this EMI noise will peak the S-meter around S-7. However, if the sub receiver uses an antenna input other than what the main receiver is set to (or vice-versa), then there is no EMI noise. Again, this issue only occurs when both sub receiver and main receiver are set to use the same antenna input! I came across this discovery after exhausting all other possibilities. I spent several hours tonight doing the following: 1. Recalibrate synthesizers 2. Calibrate oscillator by zero-beating to WWV 3. Physically swap synthesizer positions 4. Check and adjust all TMP cables 5. Check all knobs and circuit boards in the face plate 6. Check oscillator board and crystal 7. Check all screws on main board and chassis Could there possibly be a problem with EMI isolation in my KAT3 tuner board when both receivers use the same antenna input? I inspected it physically, and everything is assembled according to the instructions. Can anyone here recreate this issue? Could my antenna tuner module be defective? I've already sent my findings via email to Elecraft tech support, but I'm hoping anyone here on the reflector can provide some input or solutions to try. It would be nice to find a way to isolate or eliminate this noise when using both receivers on a single antenna input. 73, James KC2UEE __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Noise going up with reducing XTAL filter BW
Tim, Thank you for info; i will look for the current filter gain values and adjust them if necessary. 73 QRO de Rudolf, HB9ARI Tim Heasman wrote: Hi Rudolf, Just checked the gains on my 1 kHz and 400 Hz filters they are 3 and 8 dB. I also checked the audio noise using the dBV display and the noise reduced each time I reduced the bandwidth from 2.8 kHz down to 200 Hz and lower. Use the K3 utility to check the gains. 73 Tim gm4lmh - Original Message - From: hb9ari hb9...@bluewin.ch To: elecraft Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 3:44 PM Subject: [Elecraft] Noise going up with reducing XTAL filter BW Hello, Can somebody explain to me why the audio noise increase when i select a lower BW XTAL filter? For example going from 1k8 to 400Hz. As i use often BPSK31, the blue background of my waterfall (without signal present) go into the yellow color; (using Digipan with standard waterfall colors). I was expecting a constant level or a noise reduction, but not an increase. Is it a Filter gain setting to modify in my K3? Mny tnx in advance! 73 QRO de Rudolf, HB9ARI PS At 66 yo, it's not to late to learn something! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
On Mon, 2009-02-23 at 18:40, N8LP wrote: ... I think the days of receivers with xtal filters are numbered. High speed ADCs capable of 140dB dynamic range without xtal filtering are on the horizon. A 20-bit ADC with enough processing gain would do it. I don't think you'll find a 20-bit ADC with a high enough sample rate to digitize the 3-30 MHz HF band (i.e. 65-70 MHz or so). At least not at a reasonable cost. I believe the best suitable, reasonable-cost ADCs available these days are able to achieve a 500-Hz blocking dynamic range in the low 120's dB, maybe 15-20 dB worse than the K3. That's significantly better than the previous generation of ADCs could achieve, and no doubt someday we'll get even better parts that are good enough to challenge the traditional superhet/crystal filter architecture. But I don't believe we're close to that level of performance today. Another issue, of course, is spurious responses. I'm pretty sure that current ADCs don't have good enough spurious-free dynamic range to challenge a state-of-the-art receiver like the K3. Al N1AL __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest
Thanks Larry, These measurements explain a lot of what's happening. 73, Arie PA3A -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] Namens N8LP Verzonden: dinsdag 24 februari 2009 3:41 Aan: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Onderwerp: Re: [Elecraft] K3 receiver desensing on CW during contest When I first received my K3, I too was disappointed with the BDR until I understood what was happening. In an effort to quantify the BDR of signals between the xtal filter bandpass and the DSP bandpass, I set up the following scenario... Two generators feeding the K3 through a hybrid combiner. One set to about -85dBm (S7 on my K3), and the other variable. I tuned in the -85dBm signal, with the xtal filter set to 500Hz, and DSP to 50Hz. With the interfering signal set to 200Hz offset (within the xtal filter passband) I started to see desense of the weaker signal at -34dBm output level for the stronger signal. With the interfering signal set to 2kHz offset, I started to see desense at +15dBm. The difference of 49dB shows the importance of the xtal filter to this design. Of course, different AGC settings would affect this test. The promised variable roofing filters would reduce the problem quite a bit, but that opens up other issues. I think the days of receivers with xtal filters are numbered. High speed ADCs capable of 140dB dynamic range without xtal filtering are on the horizon. A 20-bit ADC with enough processing gain would do it. 73, Larry N8LP Bill W4ZV wrote: K2MK wrote: I thought it was interesting that recovery was noticeably slow on the DX station's frequency when this was happening. However, under normal conditions when US stations were calling directly on top of the DX station, recovery was fast. Hence the ability to copy the DX station through the dits when the QRM was on frequency. Mike this definitely sounds like desense but I'm surprised you experienced it with only S8-9 signals. I'm not sure what you mean about differing conditions on and off the center frequency. Desense will affect everything inside the roofing filter. What speed AGC were you using (F or S) and what were your AGC-F and AGC-S CONFIG settings? I NEVER use AGC-S on either CW or SSB and like at least 120 dB/sec for AGC-F. Also, help your AGC do its job by not running RF GAIN fully clockwise (as mentioned in my previous message). 73, Bill P.S. As I said before my K3 worked extremely well coping weak signals in the midst of massive ones on 160 this weekend. I smiled when I saw the following comment from OL0W(OK1DSZ): Only for fun, when the band was already closing, I decided to try what I will be able to work with QRP. Using longer callsign OK1DSZ and the power reduced to 5W I spend about 10 minutes calling several east coast big guns. The award for the best ears goes to W4ZV, who was worked as easily as with the kilowatt earlier in the night. K8PO and W2FU were worked with several repeats. The others just kept CQing without any reaction with exception of K1TTT, who apparently heard something, but not enough for the QSO. -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-receiver-desensing-on-CW-during-contest-tp236981 9p2375849.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
