filling more narrowly --- or unfilling -- for export to email, upon ascii export

[Samuel Wales]

i get pretty confused about this.  i often write things in org, with my own
fill column, and m-q.  and various half-broken tricks to try to fill/unfill.

then i want to send email, preferably via ascii export.  i do not know
whehter i should try to fill to a shorter column [in org i use 60 normally]
because the recipient might have a smaller window for reading the mail, or
unfill everything.

unfilled paragraphs seems to be the norm in email these days for
nontechnical folk.  but org has plain lists and things, which need
org-style unfilling.

i do not know how to accurately unfill everything or if it's a good idea.

can this be optionally done at ascii export time?  unfilling everything or
filling to a narrower column?  for sending via email.


separately... PERHAPS?... i should figure out how to not fill any of my
paragraphs  but htat is a big step.  with visual stuff.



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A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
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HowTo: Upgrade org-mode installation from the command-line

[Samuel Wales]

never mind.  package-initilalize if called in .emacs once will not repeat
or warn despite being not needed there normally.  at least in 27.



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Re: HowTo: Upgrade org-mode installation from the command-line

[Samuel Wales]

On Sunday, April 28, 2024, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:

> > Note: For the upgraded version to be loaded by emacs, you mush place
> > `package-initialize` early in your init.el.  Failure to do so will
> > result in the old system version to be loaded, as can be seen:
>
> This is only true when running emacs -Q or emacs -q.
> For normal emacs invocation, since Emacs 27, by default, Emacs calls
> (package-initialize) automatically on startup.
>
> strangely in my 27, help on package-initialize does not say explicitly
whether it is called automatically.

it says "If ‘package-initialize’ is called twice during Emacs startup,
signal a warning, since this is a bad idea except in highly
advanced use cases.  To suppress the warning, remove the
superfluous call to ‘package-initialize’ from your init-file.  If
you have code which must run before ‘package-initialize’, put
that code in the early init-file."

i ran package-initialize in my .emacs and checked c-h e and did not find a
warning.  however, without running it, it still seems to have been run.



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Re: [FR] Add C-u and C-u C-u prefix arguments to org-paste-subtree (was: Make org-paste-subtree more predictable and useful)

[Samuel Wales]

to be clear, i am not suggesting violating outline mode's inability to
continue text after children, or violating levels.  let me redo.

i am ONLY saying i sometimes have the need to yank into the middle of the
text of an entry, even if what i am yanking is an entry.

it was probalby confusing that i provided 2 possibilities.  one was
removing stars, which leaves remaining questions about any descendants of
heading 1.  forget about that one.  the other was merely to yank heading 1
in the middle of heading 2's text.  both same level.

so here i go again with new decription: i am taking an entry and putting a
whole other entry into the middle of it at the same level like this:

===
* a new idea i had
regarding snicker snacks
* jabberwoky
some sophomoric comments on a poem

more sophomoric comments
===

becomes:

===
* jabberwoky
some sophomoric comments on a poem

* a new idea i had
regarding snicker snacks

more sophomoric comments
===

then i edit, probably turnign the new idea heading into a regular line.

if nobody else has this use case, then i would have to modify heading 1
before cutting and then paste it.  becauyse otherwise in my settings for
whatefer reason heading 1 ends up after heading 2.


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Re: [FR] Add C-u and C-u C-u prefix arguments to org-paste-subtree (was: Make org-paste-subtree more predictable and useful)

[Samuel Wales]

not sure i am fully following but it seems useful.

i thought i would report on a use case thtat might or might not be
relevant.  it seems so.

i often have

===
* heading 1
text of heading 1
* heading 2
text of heading 2
|
and more text
===

where | just shows where i want to yank.

and i want to make it look like this.

===
* heading 2
text of heading 2

heading 1 [/possibly/ with star removed]
text of heading 1

and more text
===

in other words i want to combine two entries into one by cutting the first
and pasting it someplace in the middle of the second.  [or, if the star is
not removed, then i want to basically truncate heading 2 with putting
heading 1 in the middle of the text of heading 2.]

what seems to occur with my settings is that heading 1 gets inserted as a
sibling below heading 2.  which doesn't help much if heading 2 has lots of
text.  so i'd like something that can allow me to at least yank at point.
others might not have this use case.  it is rather frequent for me.


On Sunday, April 21, 2024, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:

> Philipp Kiefer  writes:
>
> > To be honest, I don't see much need for fine-grained special cases. I'd
> > be very happy with C-u yanking at the level of the heading at point and
> > C-u C-u yanking at one level below that, regardless of the exact
> > position of point. I realize that would mean C-u doubling what can
> > already be done by calling org-paste-subtree with point at the beginning
> > of a heading but accessing both options (paste as sibling or child) with
> > a single or repeat C-u seems more consistent to me than having one
> > depend on position and getting at the other via the command prefix.
>
> This feature is now implemented on main.
> https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git/commit/?id=5b0b7f292
> Done.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at .
> Support Org development at ,
> or support my work at 
>
>

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Re: [POLL] Should we enable or disable automatic tag alignment by default everywhere

[Samuel Wales]

for some reason 9.6.22 says org-auto-align-tags is set to t by default.
[btw, i use proportional fonts, so org-tags-column is 0.]



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Re: Agenda preserve setting on date change

[Samuel Wales]

actually you migt be betst ignoring the notes as they were written many
years before even the tses in it.  but the code wfm.

On Wednesday, April 10, 2024, Samuel Wales  wrote:

> to me, the concepts of the log mode feature and the showing inactive tses
> feature are so close that they are worth merging into the same
> functionality, parameterized if needed [not needed for me].
>
> in my own case, i basically want all [log mode and inactive tses] off or
> all on.  years ago, i implemented a toggle, using log mode as the toggle.
> i made lots of notes, but the notes might not be comprehensible to anybody.
>
> i also wanted certain information to show or not show regarding state
> changes.
>
> the code is trivial.  it merely toggles inactive when you toggle log mode.
>
> ;; [[id:26806393-dca3-43a6-a92d-d8985d32f4bd][COMMENT issues with my
> inactive thing -- need to have v L still respect inactive, but pre-empt
> when state change]]
> ;;
> ;; if i want to see state changes i have to do v L, but inactive
> ;; disappears.  so i need to do l twice to fix it, but that
> ;; deletes state changes
> ;;
> ;; currently implemented options are state changes but no
> ;; inactive, state changes with redundant inactive, and only
> ;; inactive.
> ;;
> ;; i want inactive preempted by state change.  but don't care
> ;; much if i can just get inactive, which i do.
> ;;
> ;; =later this might or might not be analogous to closed being
> ;; tagged ts and thus correctly not tsia.
>
> ;;l or v l is for log mode: closed (doneish), clock, and state if
> ;;you set that.
> ;;
> ;;what about notes?
> ;;
> ;; too confusing to have two levels of log mode unless i really
> ;; want to always show something (like closed deadline) and
> ;; toggle showing all.  which i don't really need.  i prefer all
> ;; or none i think.
> ;;
> ;;super log mode (/logall/ log all) c-u l or v L is particularly
> ;;useful as it includes state changes with fewer bugs than [ (but
> ;;still not yet other inactive timestamps).
> ;;
> ;; maybe i can use the intermediate sort thing -- the thing sacha
> ;; used and that i use to sort or set scores or something -- to
> ;; eliminate duplicates after setting logall and also using my
> ;; inactive.  [2016-04-07 Thu 20:37]  
> org-agenda-before-sorting-filter-function
> ka
> ;;
> ;; try setting org-agenda-log-mode-items to allow state and find
> ;; out what gets duplicated.  i think it is just that it shows as
> ;; a bare inactive timetamp and as a state change.
> ;;
> ;; [ is different from log mode.
> ;;
> ;; [ provides nothing with my current setup which shows inactive
> ;; timestamps without duplicates.
> ;;
> ;;there are bugs with [
> ;;  [ with no log mode loses information
> ;;repeater state is just nextrepeat
> ;;  [ resets upon navigation while l does not
> ;;you can't make it persist or start up with it
> ;;  log mode (if you include state change) gets duplicated
> ;;it finds the inactive timestamp?
> ;;but only for state changes, not all?  =could check
> ;;  active timestamps including deadline and scheduled do not show
> ;;presumably this is ok because will be elsewhere
> ;;=later this needs detail
> ;;
> ;;adding state to org-agenda-log-mode-items makes l and log
> ;;mode at startup do the same thing as logall = c-u l or v L.
> ;;
> ;; state in org-agenda-log-mode-items duplicates inactive
> ;; (presumably because inactive does not exclude it).  it is sort
> ;; of useful.  i'd like bangification or todo kw.  if needed i
> ;; can use logall (c-u l or v L).
> ;;
> ;; =later i think i implemented bangification for ts agenda, with
> ;; slightly different semantics from bangification for search
> ;; agenda.  because more useful not to bangify known d s or so.
> ;;
> ;; /log mode does not show inactive timestamps/ ka.
> ;;   to me, the concepts are similar enough that they should be
> ;;   merged into the same mechanism.  i do that here.  also [ is
> ;;   conflated between two unrelated features.
> ;;
> ;;the default of org-agenda-log-mode-items is closed and clock
> ;;which is good.  that leaves out inactive, but i have a solution
> ;;for that.  but perhaps i can do state and filter it.
> ;;  [2016-04-26 Tue 11:05] sometimes it duplicates my inactive
> '(with-eval-after-load 'org-agenda
>   (add-to-list 'org-agenda-log-mode-items 'state))
> ;;
> ;;this is a good solution, but it is a defvar not defcustom.  it
> ;;might exclude the ts in the closed ts.  which is good in this
> ;;case because we show closed in org-agenda-log-mode-items.  and
> ;;that shows them in a closed face with closed leader.
> ;;
> ;; this is problematic when org-agenda-start-with-log-mode is
> ;; nil.  we

Re: Agenda preserve setting on date change

[Samuel Wales]

to me, the concepts of the log mode feature and the showing inactive tses
feature are so close that they are worth merging into the same
functionality, parameterized if needed [not needed for me].

in my own case, i basically want all [log mode and inactive tses] off or
all on.  years ago, i implemented a toggle, using log mode as the toggle.
i made lots of notes, but the notes might not be comprehensible to anybody.

i also wanted certain information to show or not show regarding state
changes.

the code is trivial.  it merely toggles inactive when you toggle log mode.

;; [[id:26806393-dca3-43a6-a92d-d8985d32f4bd][COMMENT issues with my
inactive thing -- need to have v L still respect inactive, but pre-empt
when state change]]
;;
;; if i want to see state changes i have to do v L, but inactive
;; disappears.  so i need to do l twice to fix it, but that
;; deletes state changes
;;
;; currently implemented options are state changes but no
;; inactive, state changes with redundant inactive, and only
;; inactive.
;;
;; i want inactive preempted by state change.  but don't care
;; much if i can just get inactive, which i do.
;;
;; =later this might or might not be analogous to closed being
;; tagged ts and thus correctly not tsia.

;;l or v l is for log mode: closed (doneish), clock, and state if
;;you set that.
;;
;;what about notes?
;;
;; too confusing to have two levels of log mode unless i really
;; want to always show something (like closed deadline) and
;; toggle showing all.  which i don't really need.  i prefer all
;; or none i think.
;;
;;super log mode (/logall/ log all) c-u l or v L is particularly
;;useful as it includes state changes with fewer bugs than [ (but
;;still not yet other inactive timestamps).
;;
;; maybe i can use the intermediate sort thing -- the thing sacha
;; used and that i use to sort or set scores or something -- to
;; eliminate duplicates after setting logall and also using my
;; inactive.  [2016-04-07 Thu 20:37]
org-agenda-before-sorting-filter-function ka
;;
;; try setting org-agenda-log-mode-items to allow state and find
;; out what gets duplicated.  i think it is just that it shows as
;; a bare inactive timetamp and as a state change.
;;
;; [ is different from log mode.
;;
;; [ provides nothing with my current setup which shows inactive
;; timestamps without duplicates.
;;
;;there are bugs with [
;;  [ with no log mode loses information
;;repeater state is just nextrepeat
;;  [ resets upon navigation while l does not
;;you can't make it persist or start up with it
;;  log mode (if you include state change) gets duplicated
;;it finds the inactive timestamp?
;;but only for state changes, not all?  =could check
;;  active timestamps including deadline and scheduled do not show
;;presumably this is ok because will be elsewhere
;;=later this needs detail
;;
;;adding state to org-agenda-log-mode-items makes l and log
;;mode at startup do the same thing as logall = c-u l or v L.
;;
;; state in org-agenda-log-mode-items duplicates inactive
;; (presumably because inactive does not exclude it).  it is sort
;; of useful.  i'd like bangification or todo kw.  if needed i
;; can use logall (c-u l or v L).
;;
;; =later i think i implemented bangification for ts agenda, with
;; slightly different semantics from bangification for search
;; agenda.  because more useful not to bangify known d s or so.
;;
;; /log mode does not show inactive timestamps/ ka.
;;   to me, the concepts are similar enough that they should be
;;   merged into the same mechanism.  i do that here.  also [ is
;;   conflated between two unrelated features.
;;
;;the default of org-agenda-log-mode-items is closed and clock
;;which is good.  that leaves out inactive, but i have a solution
;;for that.  but perhaps i can do state and filter it.
;;  [2016-04-26 Tue 11:05] sometimes it duplicates my inactive
'(with-eval-after-load 'org-agenda
  (add-to-list 'org-agenda-log-mode-items 'state))
;;
;;this is a good solution, but it is a defvar not defcustom.  it
;;might exclude the ts in the closed ts.  which is good in this
;;case because we show closed in org-agenda-log-mode-items.  and
;;that shows them in a closed face with closed leader.
;;
;; this is problematic when org-agenda-start-with-log-mode is
;; nil.  we want it nil then.  and then (as i have it) toggle it
;; on when doing log mode.
;; [2018-12-10 Mon 19:31] turning off because i have start with log mode off
;; (setq org-agenda-include-inactive-timestamps nil)
;; (setq org-agenda-include-inactive-timestamps t)
;;this way i can see what i did so far in the day and remind me
;;of good or bad things i did.
;; l toggles
;; [2018-11-24 Sat 15:53] trying without it to not clutter
;; (setq org-agenda-start-with-log-mode nil)
;; (setq org-agenda-start-with-log-mode t)
;; (defadvice org-agenda-log-mode
;; (around toggle-off-inactive-also activate compile)
;;   (let ((org-agenda-include-inactive-timestamps t)
;; ad-do-it))
;; fixme maybe i 

Re: [WORG] 2680e65 * org-maintenance.org (Copyright assignments): Minor improvements

[Samuel Wales]

not following this.

but it amused me:

>>   In rare cases, an inquiry from an
>> +Org maintainer gets the process moving again.
>
> may be missing something, but the last sentence now reads like our
>(Org maintainer's) inquiry rarely works.

while it can definitely read that way, to me as a native speaker at least,
it is reasonably ok, although ambiguous.  it is saying, somewhat casually,
that in rare cases it is /needed/ for the org maintainer to intervene and
he or she does so successfully or so.  removing ambiguity would  help, but
nto a huge deal.

apropos of nothing, ambiguity should be eliminated from medical textbooks
and papers.  "rarely, " can be interpreted like, it's rare so look for
horses not zebras [neglecting that zebras exist], or it's rare but consider
it and find out more about it, or various other things.



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heading structure ramblie

[Samuel Wales]

this is open ended.  i'd probably be happy with simple
solution but want to explore the space.

i sometimes need to know when a folded heading has children,
and also possibly go to them.  maybe it swallowed a heading
without my intention.  creating new headings with c-c *
seems to create children, when i want a sibling.  (so maybe i need a
command like c-c * that creates a sibling.  but i also want to show and
navigate heading structure.)

i'd also like to know without linting the whole file if
anything is awry locally, such as twice or more indented
(***) or half-indented (), when org-odd-levels-only
t.

it is too cumbersome to go to the parent and expand all with
TAB and navigate headings.

this could be solved by showing a view similar to canonical
visibility, but only headings perhaps as an org-cycle state.

i THINK this is supposed to be possible with c-u:

2. CONTENTS: Show all headlines of all levels, but no body text.

i probably need to upgrade, but in org 9.6.7, it folds and
mangles the whole buffer.

or perhaps i can run org-fold-show-set-visibility as a
special command.  this view would show the heading structure
without anything else.  maybe it's there, but i couldn't
find such a view in org-fold-show-context-detail.

if this view is indeed present in c-u m-x org-cycle, then perhaps for
consistency it is or should be also usable in org-fold-show-set-visibility.

org-cycle uses org-cycle-content, but that folds the whole
buffer in my version of org.

perhaps i would bind a command to run (org-fold-show-context-detail
'headings-canonical) or something like that.

but maybe we can get more fancy, by running a command that
will overlay org-ellipsis with the number of direct children.

or perhaps simpler, is there a command that will go to the
next heading even if it is invisible, and unfold?  there
seems to be no org-next-heading, but there is one for
visible headings.



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Re: naming: Re: Experimental public branch for inline special blocks

[Samuel Wales]

cannot follow discussion but is the role and scope of the proposed
semantics settled and agreed upon by those who do?

Re: naming: Re: Experimental public branch for inline special blocks

[Samuel Wales]

[i did not aim that at any particular person!]

On 3/4/24, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> If language is not correct, then what is said is
> not what is meant; if what is said is not what is meant,
> then what must be done remains undone; if this remains
> undone, morals and art will deteriorate; if justice goes
> astray, the people will stand about in helpless
> confusion. Hence there must be no arbitrariness in what is
> said. This matters above everything.  --- analects
>
> On 3/4/24, Juan Manuel Macías  wrote:
>> Max Nikulin writes:
>>
>>> In Org syntax, "elements" are paragraphs and larger parts, while parts
>>> within paragraphs are named objects. I admit that for org-element
>>> everything is element.
>>
>> In my initial message I used 'element' loosely. Note that
>> inline-special-block is included in org-element-all-objects, where
>> inline-src-block is also.
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
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Re: naming: Re: Experimental public branch for inline special blocks

[Samuel Wales]

If language is not correct, then what is said is
not what is meant; if what is said is not what is meant,
then what must be done remains undone; if this remains
undone, morals and art will deteriorate; if justice goes
astray, the people will stand about in helpless
confusion. Hence there must be no arbitrariness in what is
said. This matters above everything.  --- analects

On 3/4/24, Juan Manuel Macías  wrote:
> Max Nikulin writes:
>
>> In Org syntax, "elements" are paragraphs and larger parts, while parts
>> within paragraphs are named objects. I admit that for org-element
>> everything is element.
>
> In my initial message I used 'element' loosely. Note that
> inline-special-block is included in org-element-all-objects, where
> inline-src-block is also.
>
>


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Re: [FR] Add a way to mark an item in a checklist as failed

[Samuel Wales]

my brain for some reason isn't figuring out using headings to simulate
checklists.  i'm not sure why i keep reaching for checklists or what
it is that i find useful about them that i can't yet figure out how to
do with headings.

sure, they're cleaner and simpler and have bullet styles,

but still. it ought to be possible to do similar with kw and such, not
sure how though.


On 2/26/24, Sławomir Grochowski  wrote:
> Rudi C  writes:
>
>> I also use the partial tick for partial completion of tasks, so I cannot
>> abuse it for marking failed tasks. :wry_smile:
>
> That's interesting. Can you show some examples?
>
> So 4 state checkbox?
> Search the net. e.g.
> https://ux.stackexchange.com/questions/144576/how-to-visually-represent-4-state-checkbox
>
> "Checkboxes have long-been established to have 3 states: checked,
> unchecked, and mixed (with the horizontal line). Changing this
> behavior is confusing and should be avoided."
>
> I also miss this failed state a bit. But indeed it's getting a little
> too complicated.
>
> What others think?
>
> --
> Sławomir Grochowski
>
>


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Re: [proof of concept] inline language blocks

[Samuel Wales]

yes as i said emphasis is convenient.

On 2/21/24, Juan Manuel Macías  wrote:
> Samuel Wales writes:
>
>> for language feature, there are various options here which range from
>> e.g.
>>
>> :fr{some text in French}
>>
>> being expressed as
>>
>> $[lang :fr "bonjour"]
>
> Thanks for your interesting comment. However, your example still seems
> too verbose to me. There are two elements that, in my opinion, get in
> the way: 'lang' and "bonjour" quotes. Imagine something like this for
> emphasis (mutatis mutandis):
>
> $[emphasis :italic "text in italic"]
>
> instead of
>
> /text in italic/.
>
> That simplicity is what I intend to look for with this type of elements
> inside the paragraph.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Juan Manuel
>
> --
> Juan Manuel Macías -- Composición tipográfica, tratamiento de datos, diseño
> editorial y ortotipografía
>
>
>


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The Kafka Pandemic

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Re: [proof of concept] inline language blocks

[Samuel Wales]

at risk of being like a broken record [over many years]: i still like
cl lambda lists e.g. $[thing arg :kw value :kw value] or %(thing ...)
for allowing generality to basically all new syntax of most types,
extensibility, user-defined major ["thing"] and minor [":kw"] features
if desired to support, reduced parsing risk, ability to control
display and export and visibility and folding and other stuff like
locale or whatever, nestability, escaping/quoting, and familiar
defined syntax, all applicable to new features without having to
change anything.  also, you won't have to look up how to use it much
when you use a new feature.

i'm not expressing this as well as i have in unpublished posts or
previous posts.

i might be in the minority, and it was once said that it is too
verbose.  if so, i value desiderata like the above higher.

i feel org has proliferated different syntaxes and special cases a bit
too much.  it's hard to have to look up what's needed, detect errors
manually etc.  some of the more basic  things are good with special
syntax, such as emphasis and \\.  but we contend with invisible space,
variant quoting, 

there is a school of thought that more types of syntax are usually
good; in most cases, i do not agree with that school of thought.

it's a bit like the old conflict between lisp vs. the original perl.
i never agreed with larry wall on arguments like [paraphrased,
possibly not correctly] "english is not orthogonal; lisp is, which is
bad; perl is not orthogonal; it shouldn't be because english isn't [or
perhaps for the [unspecified] reasons english isn't]".  plenty of
human languages are orthogonal in places where english isn't, and i
believe they work well in those places because of, not in spite of,
that convenient orthogonality.  you can know how to get the transitive
if you have the intransitve, for example.  i say this despite being a
huge fan of english.


for language feature, there are various options here which range from e.g.

:fr{some text in French}

being expressed as

$[lang :fr "bonjour"]

which i think is pretty straightforward and not much more verbose,

to a more block style like this

$[lang :fr :start]
bonjour
$[lang :fr end]

and of course that "lang" can be replaced with any other new feature
we dream up, having nothing to do with languages.  all the
meta-features like parsing, quoting, invisibility, folding,
nestability, extensibility will already have been worked out, and will
apply to new features and sub-features.


On 2/21/24, Juan Manuel Macías  wrote:
> Ihor Radchenko writes:
>
>> Juan Manuel Macías  writes:
>>
 We need to finalize inline special block syntax first, and then talk
 about special cases like inline language markup you propose.
>>>
>>> As I already said, in my local branch I have both elements created,
>>> based on the same syntax:
>>>
>>> - language block: :lang{text}
>>>
>>> - special block {text}
>>>
>>> the latter would be exported, for example, to html as >> class="type">text or to LaTeX as \type{text}
>>>
>>> I like the syntax because it is minimalist and not verbose at all. That
>>> could serve as a basis (at least it is good to have a starting point,
>>> because otherwise everything will be diluted in discussions). Then we
>>> can start thinking about whether to add options and how to add them.
>>
>> We do not need to design the inline special block markup fully to
>> introduce it. However, we do need to make sure that whatever simple
>> version of inline markup we introduce does not prevent further planned
>> extensions.
>
> My proposed syntax could be:
>
> [options]{content}
>
>> My main concern is the possibility to introduce multi-argument markup.
>> Like @abbrev{EA}{example abbreviation}. This will be necessary to
>> achieve parity with Texinfo markup.
>> However, it is not yet clear about the best syntax to pass multiple
>> arguments.
>
> I imagine multiple arguments would depend on each backend, right?
> Because I don't quite see much sense in html, for example. However, it
> occurs to me to reuse content, and add some separator character:
>
> [options]{arg1::arg2::etc}
>
> or better:
>
> [options and aditional args]{content}
>
> to maintain a certain parallelism with the large blocks.
>
> --
> Juan Manuel Macías -- Composición tipográfica, tratamiento de datos, diseño
> editorial y ortotipografía
>
>
>


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Re: [PATCH v2] org-id: allow using parent's existing id in links to headlines

[Samuel Wales]

On 1/29/24, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> You mentioned this feature request in the past. It is not forgotten.

thank you.

> May you please elaborate what you want to add to the manual and where?

had been merely thinking mentioning non-brittleness for newcomers.

in handling links.

but MAYBE also org-id could be slightly more integrated in org, such
as not having to load the library.  9.6 info (info "(org) Handling
Links") has context of org buffers.  in future, i'd like to link to
org-id in non-org files.  (info "(org) Include Files") does not
mention whether org-id works.  could eliminate the need to specify
file.

Re: [PATCH v2] org-id: allow using parent's existing id in links to headlines

[Samuel Wales]

sounds like a lot of contribution.  i do not want to impede anything
anybody else wants, but want to point out my user experience over
years in case useful to anybody.

my experiene is that context, search, and file links typically break
for me, as i change headers, refile, fix typos, change paths, etc.  so
i stick with just org-id and, for export, custom id where possible.
however, i would DEFINITELY also use org id link targets that are
puttable in various locations [e.g. id markers].
what i am pointing out is probably obvious, but might be worth
pointing out in a sentence in manual, or for setting defaults?


On 1/28/24, Rick Lupton  wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Thanks for trying it out.  Updated patches attached, comments below.
>
> On Mon, 18 Dec 2023, at 12:27 PM, Ihor Radchenko wrote:
>> I played around with the patch a bit and found a couple of rough edges:
>>
>> 1. When I try to open a link to non-existing search target, like
>>, I get a query to create a new
>>heading. If I reply "yes", a new heading is created. However, the
>>heading is created at the end of the file and is always level 1,
>>regardless of the "some-id" parent context.
>>It would make more sense to create a new heading at the end of the
>>id:some-id subtree.
>
> Fixed in updated patches -- first patch adds generic new flexibility to
> `org-insert-heading', second patch uses it so new headings now added at
> correct level at the end of the id:sub-id subtree.
>
>> 2. Consider the following setting:
>>(setq org-id-link-consider-parent-id t)
>>(setq org-id-link-to-org-use-id
>> 'create-if-interactive-and-no-custom-id)
>>
>>Then, create the following Org file
>>
>> * Sub
>> * Parent here
>> ** This is test
>> :PROPERTIES:
>> :ID:   fe40252e-0527-44c1-a990-12498991f167
>> :END:
>>
>> *** Sub 
>> :PROPERTIES:
>> :CUSTOM_ID:   subid
>> :END:
>>
>>When you M-x org-store-link, the stored link has ::*Sub instead of
>>the expected ::#subid
>
> Updated so that search strings prefer custom-ids (::#subid) to headline
> matches (::*Sub).  This makes this example behave as you expect.
>
> The correct behaviour of org-store-link doesn't seem totally obvious to me
> about id vs custom-id links.  Currently org-store-link has special logic to
> store TWO links (one , one ) when a
> CUSTOM_ID is present. In the manual, it says:
>
>  If the headline has a ‘CUSTOM_ID’ property, store a link to this
>  custom ID.  In addition or alternatively, depending on the value of
>  ‘org-id-link-to-org-use-id’, create and/or use a globally unique
>  ‘ID’ property for the link(1).  So using this command in Org
>  buffers potentially creates two links: a human-readable link from
>  the custom ID, and one that is globally unique and works even if
>  the entry is moved from file to file.  The ‘ID’ property can be
>  either a UUID (default) or a timestamp, depending on
>  ‘org-id-method’.  Later, when inserting the link, you need to
>  decide which one to use.
>
> That refers to ID links specifically, but now, using the generic link store
> functions, there is only the possibility to store one link type, so it's not
> possible to neatly keep exactly the same behaviour (i.e. for ID links but
> not for other external link types).
>
> I think the intention of what's described in the manual is to distinguish
> "human-readable" vs "persistent id" links.  There could be other types of
> "persistent id" links apart from org-id links, such as mu4e: links to email
> message-ids.  Therefore I've updated org-store-link to simply store a
>  link as an additional option, whether or not the
> first matched link was an org-id link (this is the current behaviour) or
> another external link type (this is changed behaviour).
>
> Added a note to ORG-NEWS about this.
>
>> 3. Consider
>>(setq org-id-link-consider-parent-id t)
>>(setq org-id-link-to-org-use-id t)
>>
>>Then, create a new empty Org file
>>M-x org-store-link with create a top-level properties drawer with ID
>>and store the link. However, that link will not be a simple ID link,
>>but also have ::PROPERTIES search string, which is not expected.
>
> This is because it is trying to link to the current line of the file, which
> contains the text "PROPERTIES".  On main, with (setq
> org-id-link-to-org-use-id nil), you see the equivalent behaviour (a link to
> [[file:test.org:::PROPERTIES:]]) when point is before the first heading.
> So, this seems consistent with non-org-id links?
>
> (these links don't actually work with the default value of
> `org-link-search-must-match-exact-headline', but I think that's a separate
> issue).
>
>>> +  #+vindex: org-id-link-consider-parent-id
>>> +  When ~org-id-link-consider-parent-id~ is ~t~, parent =ID= properties
>>> +  are considered.  This allows linking to specific targets, named
>>> +  blocks, or headlines (which may not have a globally unique =ID=
>>> +  themselves) within the context of 

Re: bugs in the new release of org

[Samuel Wales]

works, please cancel

On 1/24/24, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Samuel Wales  writes:
>
>> in emacs25 -Q with recent maint, this code fails to export; it errors
>> if there is an org-id link anywhere in the tree.
>>
>>   (org-export-as 'html 'subtree nil 'body-only nil)
>
> I assume that this no longer happens in the supported versions of Emacs
> (currently - Emacs 27).
> Let us know if you still see problems.
>
> Canceled.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>


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Re: [fr] org-copy-subtree or so with no header

[Samuel Wales]

idk if 2 is a bug vs. overly strict behavior.  org-export-with-tasks
is technically doing what it is documented to do.  but only
technically.

it is not useful to me for it to fail to export when you explicitly
try to export a subtree that is forbidden by the combinatin of o-e-w-t
and the kw at top.

Re: org-(un)fill-buffer

[Samuel Wales]

i lost track of all the visual fill stuff vs. emacs native filling vs.
org filling vs. filladapt back before visual filling was able to fill
with both a fill column and a reasonably smart fill prefix reliably.
is that possible now?

also, if a new command is to be introduced, presumably it would work
on subtrees, paragraphs, lists, and regions, so that you could have it
not apply to informal non-org lists or code that is not in a source
block etc.

met with alex today
yesterday he wasn't available
  even thuogh he said he would be


On 1/10/24, Psionic K  wrote:
> If I run fill-region on a buffer, there's a lot of errors where the
> lack of element awareness means filling is attempted on text that does
> not fill properly, such as property drawers, keywords, and even
> src-blocks without newline separations.  The result requires way too
> much cleanup.
>
> It is critical to be able to unfill documents for people to migrate
> off of hard newlines and onto visual line mode with variable pitched
> fonts.
>
> I could probably convert this to a region-based command and we could
> shadow fill-region.  It might be slightly tricky to deal with the
> region if it overlaps elements, but if I had to do it now, I would
> make the inclusion of part of an element include all of that element.
>
> On Thu, Jan 11, 2024 at 12:47 AM Ihor Radchenko 
> wrote:
>>
>> Psionic K  writes:
>>
>> >> You may instead just run
>> >> (let ((fill-column most-positive-fixnum)) (fill-region (point-min)
>> >> (point-max)))
>> > No.  That will have to be run manually on every element and every line
>> > of every list.  I suppose let's just not talk about it further and
>> > I'll submit a patch so there's no confusion.
>>
>> May you please elaborate what is wrong with `fill-region'?
>>
>> > This is the org-fill-buffer command, done generically for people who
>> > want
>> > to fill or unfill the entire buffer, as is required when alternating
>> > between hard newline filling and visual line mode filling.
>> > ...
>> > * lisp/org.el: (org-fill-buffer) this command walks the tree and will
>> > call fill-paragraph on every paragraph or plain-list element, enabling
>> > the user to quickly cycle between hard newlines or visual-line-mode.
>> > They can also adjust the fill, such as after removing indentation.
>>
>> I'd rather make use of the existing Emacs toggles that control filling,
>> so that `fill-region' works as expected.
>>
>> --
>> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
>> Org mode contributor,
>> Learn more about Org mode at .
>> Support Org development at ,
>> or support my work at 
>
>
>
> --
>
> 남백호
> 대표 겸 공동 창업자
> 포지트론
>
>


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Re: [fr] org-copy-subtree or so with no header

[Samuel Wales]

hi ihor,

more below.

On 1/9/24, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Samuel Wales  writes:
>
>> i set c speed command to copy subtree.  i'd like to set C to copy
>> subtree without top header.  idk how to expand subtree temporarily.
>>
>> i thought it MIGHT be a useful fr.
>
> May you illustrate your request with an example?

sure, thanks for interest.


* top top
^*** my example header
text
this is an entry
it's also a subtree
it is an example of an almost trivial subtree, i.e. text but no child entries.


with point at ^, i press c, which copies the whole example entry
including the header/heading.  great speed command.  it is configured
by assigning org-copy-subtree to the speed command.

what i want is, the exact same thing, which i will assign to C, except
that the line that point is on is not part of hte copy.  essentially
an org-copy-subtree--no-heading command.


[more complexity, perhaps unnecessary: if there are child entries,
again the result is exactly like org-copy-subtree except without the
line/header/heading point is on.]

===

[there is more that could in principle be discussed as an /analogous/
topic, perhaps for the picky sake of keeping orthogonality across org
features in mind, but i don't have it in me to cover.  to adumbrate:
1] allowing choosing exporting a subtree with or without the top
header similar to the above and 2] allowing /forcing/ exporting
subtrees, again with or without exporting the top header just as in
[1], even when the todo kw on the header in conjunction with
org-export-with-tasks has inhibited exporting the subtree.  i have for
many years waned both feaures also.  but i might not be able to
provide further clarification or particpate in the discussion for
unrelated reasons.  it is just an extraneous comment for those who get
what i am talking about, if any.]

Re: [fr] org-copy-subtree or so with no header

[Samuel Wales]

[i should not have mentioned expanding subtree temporarily as idk how
to code it in general.]

[fr] org-copy-subtree or so with no header

[Samuel Wales]

i set c speed command to copy subtree.  i'd like to set C to copy
subtree without top header.  idk how to expand subtree temporarily.

i thought it MIGHT be a useful fr.

Re: oeg-add-note and double backslash ?

[Samuel Wales]

(info "(org) Paragraphs")

On 12/4/23, David Masterson  wrote:
> Ihor Radchenko  writes:
>
>> David Masterson  writes:
>>
>>> org-add-note puts a '\\' at the end of the first line.  Is it expected
>>> the user will put '\\' at the end of each line of a multiline note
>>> (except the last line)?
>>
>> No.
>>
>>> .. Why is this done?
>>
>> To prevent fill-region from concatenating the auto-generated text in the
>> first line and the user input in the following lines.
>
> Ah.  Is that mentioned somewhere in the Org manual?  I don't mean the
> details of filll-region, but a little something to answer "why is that
> there?" by new users.
>
> --
> David Masterson
>
>


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replacement for poporg?

[Samuel Wales]

poporg allows you to do a c-c ' type of thing, in non-org and get an
org bufffer that you then save back to the file you ran it on.

  ;;; poporg.el --- Pop a comment or string to an empty buffer for text editing

you can do lists and tables, and then you save and you get the org
formatting that you just created in your elisp file or whatever.

however, in my emacs 27, it is making mistakes, such as grabbing from
the wrong comments in a bash function.

i have the latest package from elpa or nongnu elpa.

is there an alternative package for this package or a replacement?

thanks.

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org-capture does not capture from certain pages

[Samuel Wales]

On 11/22/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> It seems neither the org-capture developer nor other disroot users read
> this mailing list since you did not response previous time:
>
> https://list.orgmode.org/cajcao8uxpmlmlb0mahrvjrmnzszvyzxxxvd_rppycmj9xeu...@mail.gmail.com/T/#u

ah thank you.  i haev been experiencing cognitive decline.

> Fri, 6 Oct 2023 16:43:46 -0700
>
> The following add-on is not suitable for you, but it tries to get
> metadata for web pages more aggressively:
> https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/linkremark/
> Can it get details you need when called through the toolbar icon or
> through context menu for selected text? It should open a "preview" tab
> with obtained page info.

will do when i am able to ensure i am doing it right.  hafve installed
the extension.  need to test this on disroot.

btw checking also i found that there is a url for mobile inbox view.
idk if it is going to go away like html view.  it does use js
unfortunately. so it might be a replacement for html view.  it has
intelligent horizontal space for y fonts.  low contrast unfortuately.

in /this/ view, text selection /does/ capture.  however, unfortunately
the title of the url does not includ the subject,

so a different org-capture problem.  will look at the disroot one when
i can.  and try it for this view also.

if view does not go away it will give me more time to transition to
non-google at least, if the imap idea which is a good idea is too hard
to get working for me.

# the 9... stands for 3 numbers starting with 9.  idk if privacy
issue.  tried searchjig for it and nothing came up but this works
https://mail.google.com/mail/mu/mp/9.../#tl/search/html%20view%20standard

>
>> i wonder if this is fixable?  disroot uses js.
>
> The link you posted tells that it does not use History API to set URL to
> specific message. It might use an iframe to display current message. The
> question is if it makes message subject available in page metadata.

ok

>
>> [*] html gmail is horrifyingly going away soon
>
> Try to find a mail application suitable for you (I have not tried Emacs
> built-in ones) and use IMAP to access your mail boxes.

ah good idea, like thunderbird or so i guess?  i am philosophically on
board with gnus or so but i need good mouse support and prefer running
through tor [though perhaps that is a pointless idea] and cannot do
complex configuring so i am guessing no gnus most likely.

>
>
>
>


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org-capture does not capture from certain pages

[Samuel Wales]

i find that if i use html gmail[*], i can capture using the
org-capture extension in firefox, and i will get page title [which is
email subject] and selected text.

this is glorious.

if i do the same from emails sent to a disroot.org address, it
captures only like

  * [[https://webmail.disroot.org/?_task=mail&_mbox=INBOX][Disroot
webmail :: Inbox]]

i wonder if this is fixable?  disroot uses js.

[*] html gmail is horrifyingly going away soon, and for those who'd
like me to de-google, every time i use google takeout, it fails to
download my emails.

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Re: can emphasis emphasize this?

[Samuel Wales]

haha ah the old zws thing.  of course.

hadn't crossed my mind!  this isn't for export [yet] and previously
discussed soluytions for using syntax made me think of exports so it
slipped my mind.  i do find it odd that a non-visible character is
needed, but thanks for bringing it up and providing the code.

on the basis of the invisibilty thing, i /might/ stick to using spc
when emphasis is first char of a = note, if no more responses, but
will consider it!


On 11/12/23, Marcin Borkowski  wrote:
>
> On 2023-11-13, at 05:29, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>
>> if it is as above, the emphasis does not show.  but if i put a space
>> after =, it does show.  i kind of want to keep trying without space,
>> but i want emphasis.
>>
>> is this a possible hack to emphasis syntax?  we've changed that around
>> a bunch i know, and forgotten details.  i suspect it is at your own
>> risk stuff now.
>
> My go-to solution is this:
>
> (defun insert-zero-width-space ()
>   "Insert Unicode character \"zero-width space\"."
>   (interactive)
>   (insert 8203))
>
> Hth,
>
> --
> Marcin Borkowski
> http://mbork.pl
>


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can emphasis emphasize this?

[Samuel Wales]

tldr can i emphasize
=/emphasized/ not emphazised
or find a workaround that is easy to type?


i like to notate meta-notes with = like this:

=/send to mary ka/
a bunch of stuff

or

=i am skeptiucal this is true
he said aliens invadded yesterday

or even just notes by themselves with blank space after in org body
text to describe the entry in meta terms.  such as links to other
stuff etc.  and tses.

i do this in text notes to myself all over emacs but especially in org
body text.

[i don't do anything programmatic with them; they are just notes to
myself.  but programmatic expansion of hte idea into features would b
interesting.]

i just have a small question of syntax and workarounds.

if it is as above, the emphasis does not show.  but if i put a space
after =, it does show.  i kind of want to keep trying without space,
but i want emphasis.

is this a possible hack to emphasis syntax?  we've changed that around
a bunch i know, and forgotten details.  i suspect it is at your own
risk stuff now.

if that's not a good option, are there other options like macros,
except as easy to type just like the =?  thanks.

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Re: [BUG] tmp [9.7-pre (release_9.6.10-881-g595a32 @ /home/ps/.emacs.d/org-mode-git/lisp/)]

[Samuel Wales]

not a real ans but maybe related history.  iirc outline.el made the
decision to consider an entry not to include its final newline.  org
derives from that and did not comprehensively change that.  there have
been bugs.


On 11/10/23, Paul Stansell  wrote:
> Hello,
>
> When using Org Mode version 9.7-pre (release_9.6.10-881-g595a32) the
> following happens that doesn't happen when using Org Mode version 9.5.5
> (release_9.5.5 @ /usr/share/emacs/28.2/lisp/org/)]:
>
> When the cursor is at the end of a folded section, that is, immediately
> after the ellipses, and return is pressed the folded section is made
> visible (i.e., it is unfolded).
>
>
> This is particularly problematic when adding a new section after the last
> section in an org file.  If the last section is folded it seems impossible
> to get the cursor beyond the final ellipses so when adding a new section
> below this one (using return or Alt-return) the previous section is
> always opened.  For sections that aren't the last one can put the cursor at
> the start of the next section and press Alt-return to insert a new section
> above it without unfolding any sections.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Paul
>
> # ==
>
> Emacs  : GNU Emacs 28.2 (build 1, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version
> 3.24.37, cairo version 1.16.0)
>  of 2023-03-16, modified by Debian
> Package: Org mode version 9.7-pre (release_9.6.10-881-g595a32 @
> /home/ps/.emacs.d_Kubuntu-23.04/org-mode-git/lisp/)
>
> current state:
> ==
> (setq
>  org-link-elisp-confirm-function 'yes-or-no-p
>  org-bibtex-headline-format-function 'org-bibtex-headline-format-default
>  org-log-done 'time
>  org-fontify-done-headline nil
>  org-log-into-drawer t
>  org-startup-folded 'content
>  org-persist-after-read-hook '(org-element--cache-persist-after-read)
>  org-format-latex-options '(:foreground "Yellow" :background default :scale
> 1.2
> :html-foreground "Black" :html-background
> "Transparent"
> :html-scale 1.07 :matchers ("begin" "$1" "$"
> "$$" "\\(" "\\["))
>  org-export-before-parsing-hook '(org-attach-expand-links)
>  org-cycle-tab-first-hook '(org-babel-hide-result-toggle-maybe
> org-babel-header-arg-expand)
>  org-archive-hook '(org-attach-archive-delete-maybe)
>  org-file-apps '((auto-mode . emacs) ("\\.odt\\'" . "libreoffice %s")
>  ("\\.docx\\'" . "libreoffice %s") ("\\.xlsx\\'" .
> "libreoffice %s")
>  ("\\.png\\'" . "xv %s") ("\\.jpg\\'" . "xv %s")
> ("\\.jpeg\\'" . "xv %s")
>  ("\\.webp\\'" . "xv %s") ("\\.pdf\\'" . "okular \"%s\"")
>  ("\\.xoj" . "xournal %s") ("\\.xopp" . "xournalpp %s"))
>  org-odt-format-inlinetask-function
> 'org-odt-format-inlinetask-default-function
>  org-ascii-format-drawer-function #[771 " \207" [] 4 "\n\n(fn NAME CONTENTS
> WIDTH)"]
>  org-cycle-hook '(org-cycle-hide-archived-subtrees
> org-cycle-show-empty-lines
>   org-cycle-optimize-window-after-visibility-change
>   org-cycle-display-inline-images)
>  org-persist-before-read-hook '(org-element--cache-persist-before-read)
>  org-mode-hook '(#[0 "\301\211 \207" [imenu-create-index-function
> org-imenu-get-tree] 2]
>  #[0 "\300\301\302\303\304$\207"
>[add-hook change-major-mode-hook org-fold-show-all
> append local] 5]
>  #[0 "\300\301\302\303\304$\207"
>[add-hook change-major-mode-hook
> org-babel-show-result-all append local]
>5]
>  org-babel-result-hide-spec org-babel-hide-all-hashes)
>  org-babel-load-languages '((R . t) (emacs-lisp . t) (gnuplot . t) (octave
> . t) (python . t)
> (fortran . t) (sql . t) (ditaa . t) (dot . t)
> (shell . t))
>  org-latex-format-drawer-function #[514 "\207" [] 3 "\n\n(fn _ CONTENTS)"]
>  org-latex-format-headline-function
> 'org-latex-format-headline-default-function
>  org-confirm-shell-link-function 'yes-or-no-p
>  org-adapt-indentation t
>  org-html-format-drawer-function #[514 "\207" [] 3 "\n\n(fn NAME
> CONTENTS)"]
>  outline-isearch-open-invisible-function 'outline-isearch-open-invisible
>  org-highlight-latex-and-related '(latex)
>  org-odt-format-headline-function 'org-odt-format-headline-default-function
>  org-agenda-before-write-hook '(org-agenda-add-entry-text)
>  org-babel-tangle-lang-exts '(("fortran" . "F90") ("python" . "py")
> ("emacs-lisp" . "el")
>   ("elisp" . "el"))
>  org-src-mode-hook '(org-src-babel-configure-edit-buffer
> org-src-mode-configure-edit-buffer)
>  org-confirm-elisp-link-function 'yes-or-no-p
>  org-clock-out-remove-zero-time-clocks t
>  org-hide-leading-stars t
>  org-todo-keywords '((sequence "TODO(t!)" "MAYBE(m!)" "STARTED(s!)"
> "WAITING(w@/!)" "|"
>   "DONE(d)" "INFO(i!)" "CANCELLED(c@)" "UNFINISHED(u@)"
> "ABANDONED(a@)")
>  

ancestor/descendant in agenda

[Samuel Wales]

anybody know the latest, in built-in features or in 3rd party
packages, for doing the following?

  - dim entries that have an ancestor in the same agenda buffer
  - dim/highlight entries that have a descendant in the same agenda buffer

this would work in the text search agenda and the ts [daily/weekly] agenda.

it would work regardless of sorting or multiple parts etc.

Re: Exporting Hyperlinks ?

[Samuel Wales]

[again, the specific implementation or syntax isn't the issue for me
here, just hte ability to have global custom id in addition to
existing .org local custom id]

Re: Exporting Hyperlinks ?

[Samuel Wales]

[in case not obvious,  i used org-link-minor-mode to implement the
equivalent of global custom id's, including non-org.  i'd say, like,
";; mypackage-whatever-parsing-thingie".  that is a kludge if we can
do it right with an oref-concept-ish org minor mode, but it was hugely
useful.]

Re: Exporting Hyperlinks ?

[Samuel Wales]

to throw a cat among the pigeons, [[file:contacts.org::#custom_id][My
text]] made me think of the need for global custom id in addition to a
file-specific one like this.  idk what a good ui for it would be given
all the options we have considered over the years and recently.  just
thought to bring it up.

one thing i dislike is having to specify a file name in #+include or
links.  too brittle for my taste.  you change the file name and the
inclusion [transclusion package also?] or link is broken.  i'm ok with
org id most of the time but suepect global human-readable would be
really really useful.

imo huge value here.  in fact, i think we should allow human-readable
id's [/and/ org id's] in non-org files, such as .el.

oref seems to do this, but is not part of org and does not use org id
db yet, and some might or might not want a different syntax [no
opinion].

good concept.  as something similar, i found myself using
org-link-minor mode all the time for linking together, in comments,
parts of .el files, such as comments with distant code or code in
another file, or format statements with something that parses them but
is for whatever reason not nearby them.  and i also linked org with
.el so that org would do org things.  it made tses and links
clickable.  id markers [not implemented] would be even better as they
would allow instar and outstar formations and unbreakable bidir links
and tours/cycles and arbitrary graphs if those turn out to be desired.
if desired and not too complex, it could even hook up with the org
link insertion and editing mechanism in principle.

i did look at hyperbole both old and new, and found almost nothing
that i needed there.  just personal experience.

also, given especially the org-id stuff and other org aspects, i
actually think this kind of thing should NOT be a
separately-maintained package like oref, but should be a minor mode
that is part of the org-maintained codebase.  we do already have at
least one org minor mode for operating on non-org files.

of course, maintainers would have to be on board with it being part of
org-maintained code.  i just think org should branch out to this minor
mode.


On 11/3/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 03/11/2023 13:29, David Masterson wrote:
>> the generated LaTeX href looks like
>>
>>\href{contacts.tex}{My text}
>>
>> which looks wrong.
>
> Search part definitely should be retained.
>
> I have realized that in the LaTeX world inter-document cross-linking
> works differently. With the xr-hyper package, labels from another
> document may be used directly or with a prefix:
> https://texfaq.org/FAQ-extref
> It may be implemented for Org random labels.
>
> However I would strongly prefer PDF files having stable anchors based on
> CUSTOM_ID, not ones derived from section, figure, etc. counters. I am
> unsure if there is a package that allows to get such anchors out of the
> box.
>
> When I looked into the code for link targets resolution in the context
> of ox-html, I found it rather complicated.
>
>> I use publish for LaTex (org-latex-publish-to-pdf)
>
> Depending on your requirements, it might be possible to export to HTML
> files and then print them to PDF as a workaround. Chromium supports
> headless printing, so it should be scriptable. However to improve
> quality of formatting almost certainly heavy customization of CSS.
>
> I have realized that Chomium scrolls to proper position in PDF when it
> opens a file URI with #anchor part, but it does not update tab address
> bar when an internal link is clicked and it does not react when URL is
> edited to change #anchor part.
>
>
>


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Re: org-search-view across all org-agenda-files ?

[Samuel Wales]

"This command searches the agenda files, and in addition the files
listed in ‘org-agenda-text-search-extra-files’ unless a restriction lock
is active." --

On 10/26/23, David Masterson  wrote:
> Can org-search-view work across all org-agenda-files?  Is there an
> alternative?
> --
> David Masterson
>
>


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[fr/rfc] switch to buffer that contains given heading without moving point

[Samuel Wales]

suppose i am in the middle of a subtree, and it is in a buffer that i
am not in.  suppose i want to go to the buffer without moving point in
target buffer.

remembering what buffer contains the heading that i can use completion
to get to works with c-x b, but requires remembering where teh heading
is

refile goto takes me to the top heading it matches which could move point.

so those are not solutions.

i wonder if it is possible, or desirable, to have a wrapper around
refile goto that would chek for a buffer where point is in the target
subtree, and warn that you're not on the header, and take you to that
buffer so that you can be at the point location you were at in that
holon.

i can imagine other solutions, such as using refile goto to go to the
heading, then a move bcak to previous point command to get to where i
was.


example

  * computers
  *** good computers
text^
  *** bad computers

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Re: Support for buffer-column-aligned tables in Org?

[Samuel Wales]

ignore the 2 spaces before width in row 2

On 10/25/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> long shot but try align.el maybe?  column -t or similar?
>
> ===
>
> fwiw a more advanced version: cells shouodb e presumed to be in their
> own columns even if missing.
>
> length  20  H  width  20  depth  20
> length  2width  20  depth  20
>
> i mainly want to compact these column tables by reducing extraneous
> whitespece beetween columns to the miimum whitespace necessary while
> retaining all columns.
>
> an org table would be itnerestig.
>
> i have long wondered if org tables could be converted into a minimal
> column-based ascii table such as yours, to preserve horizontal space.
>
>
> On 10/25/23, Jens Schmidt  wrote:
>> Is there any kind of support (also by non-core extensions) for tables
>> in Org that are entirely organized along buffer columns?  Some magic
>> (= clever heuristics) that recognizes the following as a table with
>> four columns, the first three left-aligned, the last right-aligned:
>>
>> <6> 1.0
>>  1  one  some  10.0
>>  2  two  boring   100.0
>>  3  This is a long text  column  1000.0
>>
>> By "organized along buffer columns" I mean that basically any kind of
>> white-space should be allowed to align the columns in the buffer.
>>
>> By "any kind of support" I mean:
>>
>> - one-time conversion support to an Org table along the lines of C-c |
>>
>> - or edit/export support of such tables w/o the need to convert them
>>   to an Org table first.
>>
>> I tried searching but failed to find search terms that are specific
>> enough to find anything useful.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
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A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
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Re: Support for buffer-column-aligned tables in Org?

[Samuel Wales]

long shot but try align.el maybe?  column -t or similar?

===

fwiw a more advanced version: cells shouodb e presumed to be in their
own columns even if missing.

length  20  H  width  20  depth  20
length  2width  20  depth  20

i mainly want to compact these column tables by reducing extraneous
whitespece beetween columns to the miimum whitespace necessary while
retaining all columns.

an org table would be itnerestig.

i have long wondered if org tables could be converted into a minimal
column-based ascii table such as yours, to preserve horizontal space.


On 10/25/23, Jens Schmidt  wrote:
> Is there any kind of support (also by non-core extensions) for tables
> in Org that are entirely organized along buffer columns?  Some magic
> (= clever heuristics) that recognizes the following as a table with
> four columns, the first three left-aligned, the last right-aligned:
>
> <6> 1.0
>  1  one  some  10.0
>  2  two  boring   100.0
>  3  This is a long text  column  1000.0
>
> By "organized along buffer columns" I mean that basically any kind of
> white-space should be allowed to align the columns in the buffer.
>
> By "any kind of support" I mean:
>
> - one-time conversion support to an Org table along the lines of C-c |
>
> - or edit/export support of such tables w/o the need to convert them
>   to an Org table first.
>
> I tried searching but failed to find search terms that are specific
> enough to find anything useful.
>
> Thanks.
>
>


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Re: org-capture firefox extension not capture in some cases

[Samuel Wales]

i am using firefox org-capture extension with the unicorn label on the
toolbar in firefox.  seems likely that this
possibly-tangential-to-org-per-se message is really wether the
extension is supposed to be able to capture js webmail content text,
or so.  but idk.  it could be an org connection of some type.


On 10/7/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Samuel Wales  writes:
>
>> in html gmail, i can capture message body text and whatever else.
>>
>> gmail has an html version and a js version.  html is faster and better for
>> me.
>>
>> in disroot.org, if i try to capture message body text, it seems to
>> capture just the link but does not capture the message body text.
>
> Are you using bookmarklet? Particular extension?
>
> From Org perspective, all we care about is the data passed to Emacs via
> org-protocol key/value fields. The question is whether that data is
> actually given and mishandled by Org or whether the Firefox extension
> you are using is not being able to get the text from particular web page.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>


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org-capture firefox extension not capture in some cases

[Samuel Wales]

in html gmail, i can capture message body text and whatever else.

gmail has an html version and a js version.  html is faster and better for me.

in disroot.org, if i try to capture message body text, it seems to
capture just the link but does not capture the message body text.

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[bug] org-priority-up on a line with a link puts the cookie in org-link face

[Samuel Wales]

i am on recent bugfix but this has been around forever.

  * [[https://forums.whatever][MCAS and Omalizumab]]

when i raise the priority from none to [#A], often or always the
cookie is in link face also.

for unrelated reasons, i haven't set up an untainted reproducer, so
this is a merely hoping others have seen this behavior report.

org id link to arbitrary place in an org file

[Samuel Wales]

i know we talked about something like this recently, perhaps related
to inline tasks, perhaps not.  apologies redundancy.

i'd like to have an org-id link to a place in a different file.  a
paragraph or even more arbitrary.

is this possible with current org technology?  [i think recent
discussion did not mention id markers.]

Re: [PATCH] Define new face for the contents of #+RESULTS drawers

[Samuel Wales]

perhaps a face for results to indicate that it is generated?


On 9/17/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Protesilaos Stavrou  writes:
>
>> Though I understand now that there are more cases involved than I had
>> anticipated.  I will need to review everything on offer.  Let's abort
>> this effort for now.
>
> Ok. Closing.
> Canceled.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at .
> Support Org development at ,
> or support my work at 
>
>


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Re: Possible File Saving Bug with [/]?

[Samuel Wales]

lock file?  in 27 (info "(emacs) Interlocking") strangely does not
mention .# but it could be the concept in question.


On 9/6/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Summer Emacs  writes:
>
>> I have a .org file which is just a list of Emacs commands I like to keep
>> handy to refer to (navigation, selection, commands in some modes etc…) One
>> of these had help about the [/] command for a header for a list. However,
>> because I had [/] and no numbers in it (it was just an example to show me
>> how to do it if I forgot), it kept saving a backup copy of that file
>> anytime that I saved it, and kept that backup “alive” to track. The name
>> of the regular file is emacshelp.org, and the file it kept creating in my
>> directory was .#emacshelp.org#  ->
>> summer@summer.localhost.randomnumberhere:randomportnumberhere
>
> Thanks for the report!
> Unfortunately, it is not clear to me what exactly is going on from your
> description.
> May you please provide more detailed instructions how to trigger the
> observed behavior? See https://orgmode.org/manual/Feedback.html#Feedback
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at .
> Support Org development at ,
> or support my work at 
>
>


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Re: [POLL] Should we accept breaking changes to get rid of Org libraries that perform side effects when loading?

[Samuel Wales]

another idea, at the cost of 3 dumb messages in a row  there are
annotation packages.  i wonder if integration of those is relevant.

On 8/24/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> [p.s.  not saying this will satisfy ardent users, just bringing up the
> idea in case it is of use.]
>
>
> On 8/24/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>> iiuc bastien brought up the use of a no export this heading tag as an
>> alternative to inline tasks.  we have much or all of this capability
>> in faq.
>>
>> i was thinking the same thing.  perhaps many use cases could have
>> inline tasks as siblings below the document heading, and undesired
>> headers could be just not exported.
>>
>> i was also wondering if links and/or some type of transclusion could
>> also obviate inline tasks.  the formerly-inline task would contain a
>> link to a target above the paragraph.  c-c c-c on that location would
>> take you back to the task.
>>
>>
>> On 8/24/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
>>> On 24/08/2023 19:21, Ihor Radchenko wrote:
>>>> As I described, I often want inlinetasks to be exported and to be
>>>> displayed in my agenda/sparse tree views
>>>
>>> It sounds like that if agenda had hooks allowing to gather either
>>> :inlinetask:...:end: drawers or #+begin_inlinetask...#+end_inlinetask
>>> custom blocks then ** END would not be necessary.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>
>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


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Re: [POLL] Should we accept breaking changes to get rid of Org libraries that perform side effects when loading?

[Samuel Wales]

[p.s.  not saying this will satisfy ardent users, just bringing up the
idea in case it is of use.]


On 8/24/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> iiuc bastien brought up the use of a no export this heading tag as an
> alternative to inline tasks.  we have much or all of this capability
> in faq.
>
> i was thinking the same thing.  perhaps many use cases could have
> inline tasks as siblings below the document heading, and undesired
> headers could be just not exported.
>
> i was also wondering if links and/or some type of transclusion could
> also obviate inline tasks.  the formerly-inline task would contain a
> link to a target above the paragraph.  c-c c-c on that location would
> take you back to the task.
>
>
> On 8/24/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
>> On 24/08/2023 19:21, Ihor Radchenko wrote:
>>> As I described, I often want inlinetasks to be exported and to be
>>> displayed in my agenda/sparse tree views
>>
>> It sounds like that if agenda had hooks allowing to gather either
>> :inlinetask:...:end: drawers or #+begin_inlinetask...#+end_inlinetask
>> custom blocks then ** END would not be necessary.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


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Re: [POLL] Should we accept breaking changes to get rid of Org libraries that perform side effects when loading?

[Samuel Wales]

iiuc bastien brought up the use of a no export this heading tag as an
alternative to inline tasks.  we have much or all of this capability
in faq.

i was thinking the same thing.  perhaps many use cases could have
inline tasks as siblings below the document heading, and undesired
headers could be just not exported.

i was also wondering if links and/or some type of transclusion could
also obviate inline tasks.  the formerly-inline task would contain a
link to a target above the paragraph.  c-c c-c on that location would
take you back to the task.


On 8/24/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 24/08/2023 19:21, Ihor Radchenko wrote:
>> As I described, I often want inlinetasks to be exported and to be
>> displayed in my agenda/sparse tree views
>
> It sounds like that if agenda had hooks allowing to gather either
> :inlinetask:...:end: drawers or #+begin_inlinetask...#+end_inlinetask
> custom blocks then ** END would not be necessary.
>
>
>


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w3m rclick menu, regular rclick menu, org capture

[Samuel Wales]

long ago i set up emacs to pop up global menu.  this allows me to e.g.
copy text when i do not use keyboard.

(define-key global-map (kbd "") 'alpha-menu)
(defun alpha-menu ()
  (interactive)
  (menu-bar-open)
  '(call-interactively 'mouse-popup-menubar))

this works in many modes including org but not w3m.

i also do other stuff with spectacular results:

;;   right fringe is vertical scrolling with clicks
;;   right fringe is horizontal scrolling with wheel
;;   left fringe is placement and one window with clicks
;;   left fringe /could be/ something useful with wheel
;;  buffers same mode?
;;  horiz scrolling to a schelling point like bol?
;;   mode line is buffers with wheel
;;   could be mode-line is copy or paste with click
;;   mode line is same mode buffer with click
;;   mode line is any mode buffer with wheel
;;   i think there is nothing special about the basename part
;; do i mean the buffer name part of modeline here?

these work with probably every mode.  i'm pretty sure there is no top
fringe in emacs unfortunately, and header line is not common, so there
is nothing to provide an affordance at the top of the emacs windown.
but fringe and mode line are gret.

i rely on org-mouse for org which doesn't seem to particularly
interfere in either direction.  i.e. i can do org-mouse and the other
stuff.

my questions are:

1.  i'd like to include org-capture in global menu
2.  i'd like to include global menu in w3m and other menus

thanks.

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Re: desirability of boxquote-style snippets for helping new users

[Samuel Wales]

On 1/15/09, Kevin Rodgers  wrote:
>> However, most prefix every line.  For example, boxquote by default uses
>> "|".
>>
>> While an experienced user can figure out rectangle commands or write a
>> command to unpack the quote, new users and users who can't type much
>> might skip using the code to avoid having to do that.  And a very new
>> user could actually stick the whole thing in .emacs and wonder why it
>> doesn't work.  It adds to the burden of fixing a problem or meeting a
>> need in emacs without providing much benefit.  Even a few keystrokes
>> can do that.
>>
>> Perhaps quotes of code, in all packages like boxquote, could by
>> default get fancy only on the lines precediing and following.
>>
>> What do you think?
>
> ,[ C-h f boxquote-unbox RET ]
> | boxquote-unbox is an interactive compiled Lisp function in `boxquote.el'.
> | (boxquote-unbox)
> |
> | Remove the boxquote that contains `point'.
> |
> | [back]
> `

thanks for your suggestion.

as i said, i am suggesting that the prefixed lines should never be
prefixed in the first place.  i don't think it adds enough to outweigh
the extra keystrokes, rectangle, boxquote package, etc.  i don't think
all newcomers will know what to do.

imho, above and below quoting is a preferable default convention.
exceptions are few and can be optional.

Re: Htmlize support, maintenance, and Org mode (was: [MAINTENANCE] Org orphanage?)

[Samuel Wales]

[fyi that is probably not related: i use htmlize.el for functions it
has that allow you to copy a region omitting invisible parts.  e.g.
partly folded magit.  i haven't found other code that workd for that
and myb rain could not construct any.]


On 8/13/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Jonas Bernoulli  writes:
>
>> `htmlize' is currently maintained at
>> https://github.com/hniksic/emacs-htmlize
>> but its maintainer hasn't been responding to any issues and pull-requests
>> for quite some time now and seems to be inactive on Github altogether.
>
> Hmm... Org has built-in htmlize support and I did not know that it is
> not maintained actively.
>
> Note that Timothy wrote https://github.com/tecosaur/engrave-faces that
> provides similar functionality but not just for HTML.
>
> We might consider extending engrave-faces to cover all the htmlize
> features.
>
>> Regardless of where this package will eventually end up being
>> maintained, it would be a good idea to keep it on Github at least until
>> most of the issues and pull-requests that have already been opened there
>> have been resolved.
>
> Or we can simply hand-pick that 13 open Github issues and transfer them
> manually. (Does not mean that we have to do it, but I see not why having
> a few issues on Github should be a blocker to anything)
>
>> It seems to me it would be a good idea if Hrvoje gave one or more Org
>> maintainer commit access to this repository.  Alternatively we could
>> maintain it at https://github.com/emacsorphanage/htmlize, and I could
>> take care of giving commit access, but in that case Hrvoje would also
>> have to get involved briefly at least, to transfer the repository to
>> that organization.
>
> Also an option.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at .
> Support Org development at ,
> or support my work at 
>
>


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Re: [POLL] Should we accept breaking changes to get rid of Org libraries that perform side effects when loading?

[Samuel Wales]

unable to do much of a search atm.  but i recall 3-4 org vars that
used to say so in their docstrings but didn't seem to need to be to me
at the time.  perhaps they have been fixed or i was mistaken.

regexp components docstring in bugfix still say reload or restart.
biut mayube that is obsolete.

i found possible examples in appt and ediff bot those are not org.  so
perhaps this is a case where the problem no longer exists?  8if so,
then never mind that comment about guideline for not requiring setting
before org where possible.

perhaps these are unavoidable.

bugfix .el
g set *.el|g before|g load
org-fold-core.el:Important: This variable must be set before loading Org."
org-keys.el:Needs to be set before Org is loaded.
org-list.el:This variable needs to be set before org.el is loaded.  If you
org-list.el:This variable needs to be set before org.el is loaded.  If you
org-persist.el:This variable must be set before loading org-persist library.")
org.el:This variable needs to be set before org.el is loaded.  If you
org.el:This variable needs to be set before org.el is loaded, and you need to


On 8/13/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Samuel Wales  writes:
>
>> 3.
>>
>> istr loading org-id is or was what enables org-ids?  i'd rather have
>> org-id work by default.  OR maybe require activating.
>
> org-id is mostly fine, except that it (1) adds a new link type. (2) adds
> a hook that saves ids before exiting Emacs.
> In general, it is not too different in its design to other link type
> providers. The only difference is better support in other Org core
> libraries, but it only plays when a user customized org-id to take
> preference over other built-in link types - not a problem for users who
> do not use org-id.
>
>> 4.
>>
>> idk if related, but some settings in org must be done before loading.
>> i'd want a guideline in which, where possible, settings can be done
>> after loading.  this is because the user might need to go through
>> contortions in .emacs.  a user can do with-eval-after-load, but
>> with-eval-before-load sounds radically grotesque.
>
> Please, list the settings you have in mind. Some things, like
> configuring Org syntax, must be loaded before Org because we have no
> other way around.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>


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Re: [PATCH] Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?

[Samuel Wales]

i currently want to copy a link location and then paste that link
loadtion.  i don't recall theis breaking before.  it does now.

On 8/13/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Bastien Guerry  writes:
>
>> Here is another suggestion:
>>
>> 1) Remove the option and make adding the dup link on top the default.
>>
>> 2) Also remove the current C-u C-u C-u arg and make it the default
>>when a region is active.
>>
>> (1) is because removing this option would be a breaking change, and
>> inflincting a new option to every user to deal with a hypothetical
>> use-case does not seem right.
>>
>> (2) should be done anyway.
>>
>> WDYT?
>
> +1
> I did not do (1) originally to maximize backwards-compatibility.
> I do not feel strongly about keeping the old behaviour as an option
> otherwise.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at .
> Support Org development at ,
> or support my work at 
>
>


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Re: [POLL] Should we accept breaking changes to get rid of Org libraries that perform side effects when loading?

[Samuel Wales]

may i post a few notes?

i've had tehse previously.

1.

i rely on org-mouse for accessibility, as i often cannot use keyboard
at all, so there is a personal stake in having it be part of org so
that it is fully integrated.  of course i have no problem with having
to enable it instead of only load it.

it has /minor/ limbo status in that, for example, you can't set a
specific todo kw with the mouse, but that does not disturb me as much
as code rot.  see below.

2.

i don't use org-inlinetask enough to have a personal stake [in my case
i could make them siblings], but it seemed to me that it was never
sufficiently integrated into org, or had bugs, at least before parsers
became common.

if anybody does have a strong personal stake in them, like i do in 1.,
it might be desirable to make inline tasks, even breakingly, part of
org, merely to make sure that they fully integrate and test, as
opposed to limbo or code rot.

i would apply that principle to org-mouse, which being smallish and
about bindings is probably not too disruptive to be part of org.  i
defer the measurement of the disruptiveness of inline tasks to the
experts/stakeholders.

3.

istr loading org-id is or was what enables org-ids?  i'd rather have
org-id work by default.  OR maybe require activating.

4.

idk if related, but some settings in org must be done before loading.
i'd want a guideline in which, where possible, settings can be done
after loading.  this is because the user might need to go through
contortions in .emacs.  a user can do with-eval-after-load, but
with-eval-before-load sounds radically grotesque.


On 8/12/23, Bastien Guerry  wrote:
> Ihor Radchenko  writes:
>
>> Yes, org-mouse modifies the behavior of certain key bindings. Not
>> directly, but by advising `org-open-at-point'.
>
> IIRC Emacs core libraries should not advise functions.
> This is something we should fix.
>
> Also, I'm not sure org-mouse.el has its place in Org's core nowadays.
>
>> It changes the very notion of that is a headline - the syntax definition
>> is altered. Very deeply nested headlines may become inlinetasks upon
>> loading org-inlinetask, touching all aspects of Org, not just editing.
>
> Same here, I'd be tempted to deny Org citizenship to inline tasks: it
> always felt like a nice hack for a niche use-case, but a hack anyway.
>
> If it modifies Org syntax in surprising ways, this is another argument
> for removing org-inlinetask.el from Org's core.  Remember: this is not
> to say that inline tasks are forbidden, it's just a message for users
> that inline tasks are something not maintained by Org's core team.
>
>> And it is not clear how to fix this. We did not make inlinetasks into
>> standard Org syntax in the past and now it is in the weird state when we
>> have (featurep 'org-inlinetask) sprinkled across the code just to
>> accommodate for this conditional syntax.
>
> Yes, this is ugly.
>
>> Inlinetasks are too similar in syntax with headlines, so it is
>> impossible to make the change backwards-compatible.
>>
 With the current state of affairs, it is often enough to
 (require 'org-library) to get things work. If we get rid of all the
 possible side effects, users will have to adapt their configurations
 and we will thus violate "I won't force you to update your
 configuration."
>>>
>>> Defining new functions is a desirable "side-effect" of all Elisp
>>> library, I don't think we should worry abou this.
>>
>> Defining new functions by itself is not a big deal. But there are parts
>> of Org that alter their behavior depending on whether a feature is
>> loaded (like org-inlinetask) or depending whether certain function
>> symbol is defined (babel). Similarly, loading new link types re-defines
>> Org syntax in all the documents, affecting editing of everything that
>> looks like the loaded link type (org-ctags).
>
> I feel like the stakes are not the same for features like org-mouse.el
> and org-inlinetask.el and for core features like Babel libs and links.
> For the former, a decision should be made relatively to the usefulness
> of the feature; for the latter, loading libs (with side-effects on the
> syntax) is required by the design of the core feature at hand (Babel
> and links).
>
> I'd focus on solving the problem with org-mouse and org-inlinetasks
> first. Let's make a poll for org-mouse.el then for org-inlinetasks.el ?
>
> --
>  Bastien Guerry
>
>


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Re: [accessibility] worg obscures text (Re: [PATCH] ob-sqlite: Use a transient in-memory database by default)

[Samuel Wales]

yikes yes re columns.

[my fill-column is 60.  on a 32 inch.  and i cannot even do ediff side
by side with that, to my displeasure.]

[i hope to find a low-[preferably-1-nit]-minimum-brightness
flicker-free monitor someplace, and i /think/ oleds, which /might/
partly satisfy that, can come standardly in 42 inches, which /might/
allow side by side ediff at 60 finally.]


On 8/10/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 05/08/2023 10:22, Samuel Wales wrote:
>> [i.e. agree that the manuals and standard toc at top imo do a good job
>> for accessibility.]
>
> Notice that Org manual is exported through ox-texinfo, not by ox-html
> directly. So somebody should confirm that default ox-html table of
> contents is suitable for various worg pages: short and long ones.
>
> Personally I do not like CSS of the manuals (Org and Emacs) because it
> allows ~190 characters per line. For regular paragraphs it is
> recommended to have lines 60-70 characters long. Code blocks may be wider.
>
>
>
>


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blank line in ido as default when refiling

[Samuel Wales]

Subject: is blank option in ido a bugfix refile change?
idk if this is etireoly user eror but i ave made no changes to my
config that i am aware of so want to confirm with others who mght be
able to guess or know there was a change i bugfix..

recent bugfix refile trying to insert link, presents a blank line in
my choices and makes it default.

this reults in

  user-error: No link selected

so to insert i have to arrow down to number 2 efery time.  this
behavior started recently in bugfix, but again idk why.  i am aware
that the moving link fix is still only in master as there has not been
a release so this might be another issue.

Re: [PATCH] Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?

[Samuel Wales]

i am confused.  org-stored-links is a command?  what are the known
user needs for storing and pasting links?

i am also unclear on why we have a dedicated paste function as opposed
to kill ring.  probably a good reason.  but wfm.

i merely wanted to store then yank a link.  which in bugfix errors if
dup.  i also envisioned other less defined use cases.

stprog link several times could include having colelected a bunch of
links, perhaps in sequene but in the meantime wanting to copy and
paste a single link that is by coincidence in that list?  i could
imagine such a thing.

On 8/6/23, Bastien  wrote:
> Ihor Radchenko  writes:
>
>> * lisp/ol.el (org-link-store-existing): New customization controlling
>> how to deal with already stored links.
>> (org-store-link): Respect the new customization, allowing duplicates
>> to (1) be added anyway; (2) be ignored; (3) be moved to front of
>> `org-stored-links'.  The default is (3).
>> * etc/ORG-NEWS (~org-store-link~ now moves an already stored link to
>> front of the ~org-stored-links~): Document the breaking change.
>
> I'm not sure what is the real world use-case for allowing storing the
> same link several times.  Maybe one was provided, but I missed it.
>
> I believe the new default behavior makes a lot of sense, thanks for
> implementing this.
>
> I'm skeptical about the need for a new dedicated option, though.
>
> The current single universal prefix argument seems not that useful ("A
> single `C-u' negates `org-context-in-file-links' for file links or
> `org-gnus-prefer-web-links' for links to Usenet articles.") and we
> could use it to force storing duplicates, which is more useful.
>
> Here is the suggested new behavior, also modifying other universal
> prefix args:
>
> - M-x org-stored-links : don't store dups, move upfront if dup
> - C-u M-x org-stored-links : force storing the link, even if dup
> - [2 universal prefix arg] : negates ‘org-context-in-file-links’, etc
> - [3 universal prefix arg] : forces skipping storing functions
>   that are not part of Org core.
>
> The current behavior for 3 prefix args should be the default when the
> region is active.
>
> WDYT?
>
> --
>  Bastien
>
>


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Re: [accessibility] worg obscures text (Re: [PATCH] ob-sqlite: Use a transient in-memory database by default)

[Samuel Wales]

[i.e. agree that the manuals and standard toc at top imo do a good job
for accessibility.]

On 8/4/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> fwiw i agree with the non-fancy toc concept for accessibility.
>
> On 8/4/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
>> On 05/08/2023 05:57, Rudolf Adamkovič wrote:
>>> P.S. #2: The Table of Contents (TOC) on the
>>> WORG is "jumpy" on Safari.  In fact, it has
>>> always been problematic for me, in one way or
>>> another.  Why cannot TOC be included at the
>>> beginning of the document, like in standard
>>> Org exports?  Org and Emacs manuals, with no
>>> "smart" side bars, get it right, IMO.
>>
>> I have found your message in a dedicated thread
>>
>> Rudolf Adamkovič to emacs-orgmode… Re: [accessibility] worg obscures
>> text. Sun, 12 Jun 2022 21:35:14 +0200.
>> https://list.org.mode.org/m2v8t5y8st@me.com
>>
>> Somebody should propose a CSS for responsive design for Worg. Perhaps
>> with ability to open/close table of contents on mobile devices.
>>
>>
>
>
> --
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>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


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Re: [accessibility] worg obscures text (Re: [PATCH] ob-sqlite: Use a transient in-memory database by default)

[Samuel Wales]

fwiw i agree with the non-fancy toc concept for accessibility.

On 8/4/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 05/08/2023 05:57, Rudolf Adamkovič wrote:
>> P.S. #2: The Table of Contents (TOC) on the
>> WORG is "jumpy" on Safari.  In fact, it has
>> always been problematic for me, in one way or
>> another.  Why cannot TOC be included at the
>> beginning of the document, like in standard
>> Org exports?  Org and Emacs manuals, with no
>> "smart" side bars, get it right, IMO.
>
> I have found your message in a dedicated thread
>
> Rudolf Adamkovič to emacs-orgmode… Re: [accessibility] worg obscures
> text. Sun, 12 Jun 2022 21:35:14 +0200.
> https://list.org.mode.org/m2v8t5y8st@me.com
>
> Somebody should propose a CSS for responsive design for Worg. Perhaps
> with ability to open/close table of contents on mobile devices.
>
>


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Re: [PATCH] org-id: allow using parent's existing id in links to headlines

[Samuel Wales]

i can see the appeal given the granularity of id [headings, files]. yu
want to point to smaller things.  but what if those smaller things
could have ids without drawers?  id markers.  then changes in
surrounding text would not break anything.


On 7/26/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Max Nikulin  writes:
>
>> I am not excited by the idea of extending id links for heading
>> hierarchy. From my point of view it is more natural to add the ID
>> property to the heading that should be link target.
>>
>> Sometimes I do not mind to disambiguate heading search link by
>> specifying title of its ancestor. I usually add the CUSTOM_ID property
>> or rename heading to be unique.
>>
>> I am afraid that allowing arbitrary link types to specify path to an
>> element is overkill. It is not XPath and not CSS selectors.
>
> I am looking at it from an opposite direction: we already have file:
> links with ::search term, but file is not a very reliable link anchor.
> File ID will persist even when the file is moved. So, instead of having
> something like , we should better also
> provide  with ID defined in the top-level property
> drawer. ID being some sub-heading is then a natural extension of the
> same idea.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at .
> Support Org development at ,
> or support my work at 
>
>


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Re: [Bug] org-insert-link removes on one link from 2 added by org-store-link

[Samuel Wales]

"in my case"

On 7/23/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 13/07/2023 10:34, Samuel Wales wrote:
>> link has already been stored is a bug in my case in that i can't just
>> go to a header, grab it [whether rabbed bfere or not] and then paste
>> it.  i surprise easily when the wrong link gets pasted.
>
> The message is not a bug, it tells me that I am trying to store a wrong
> link. The issue is that current implementation does not prevent
> appearance of multiple identical links after several cycles
> store-link/insert-link to the same heading.
>
> Whether stored links should be reordered depends on specific action, so
> a defcustom user option is not a rescue:
>
> 1. Collect links in certain order for `org-insert-org-links'. Duplicated
> link is a real error.
>
> 2. Copy link going to immediately insert it. Making the link the default
> one sounds reasonable. Perhaps the user still should be notified.
>
> So I disagree that "already stored" is a bug, but there is room for
> improvements.
>
>
>


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Re: [PATCH] Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?

[Samuel Wales]

On 7/15/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Applied, onto main.
> https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git/commit/?id=c0dbcf361

thank you!  will this reach bugfix too?

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Re: [Bug] org-insert-link removes on one link from 2 added by org-store-link

[Samuel Wales]

link has already been stored is a bug in my case in that i can't just
go to a header, grab it [whether rabbed bfere or not] and then paste
it.  i surprise easily when the wrong link gets pasted.

[also the id links with no desc and the prefix links do not help me
find the link i want to insert if it is opne previously.

in answer to a q by ihor, indeed puttig previously stored id liks as
descriptions in front of all the prefixes woudl be useful to me, but
idk who is doing the sorting, so idk whether it wold make a difference
but if it dos then gret..]

it seems org-insert-=inki is overloaded.  one use case says insert a
previously stored link.  the other says insert a brand new link which
i will now specify.  might it be useful to separate those two
functions?

On 7/12/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 02/07/2023 14:49, Ihor Radchenko wrote:
>> Max Nikulin  writes:
>>> M-x org-store-link adds 2 entries:
>>> - [[*title][title]]
>>> - [[#a-heading][title]]
>>>
>>> however `org-insert-link' (C-c C-l) removes from the stored link only
>>> one of them. As a result the number of unused stored links increases
>>> during an Emacs session.
>> Confirmed.
>> Not Urgent.
>
> Agree. I forgot to mention that the "This link has already been stored"
> feature works only for one link from this pair.
>
>
>
>


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Re: move siblings

[Samuel Wales]

no, i want to move in a single command, not drag.

as if
m-x org-move-this-entry-to-top-same-level
m-x org-move-to-bottom-same-level


On 7/10/23, Dominik Schrempf  wrote:
> Hi!
>
> Are you looking for =org-shiftmetadown= and sibling functions? I think
> they are bound to SHIFT-META-ArrowDown, and so on, by default.
>
> Cheers,
> Dominik
>
> Samuel Wales  writes:
>
>> * aa
>> ** a
>> ** b
>> ** c
>>
>> is there a command to move entry at point to below c, or to above a?
>


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move siblings

[Samuel Wales]

* aa
** a
** b
** c

is there a command to move entry at point to below c, or to above a?

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Re: How to go to an Org headline programmatically?

[Samuel Wales]

i have e.g. (let (org-refile-target-verify-function) (org-refile '(4))
for interactive; ther emight be a place to put the header name or id.


On 7/5/23, Marcin Borkowski  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I want to find an Org headline in Elisp.  No need to make it visible,
> for example - just move the point to the heading with a given title (it
> may even be within `save-excursion', as in "go there, do something, go
> back").  `org-link-search' seems to do what I want, but it does a lot
> more - is there some simpler function to do that?
>
> TIA,
>
> --
> Marcin Borkowski
> http://mbork.pl
>
>


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Re: [PATCH] Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?

[Samuel Wales]

On 7/5/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Ihor Radchenko  writes:
>
>> What Samuel described is a sequence of M-x org-store-link followed by
>> M-x org-insert-all-links. With such workflow, user can expect that the
>> links are going to be stored in order. If we are instead shuffle the
>> stored links, M-x org-insert-all-links may result in unexpected
>> behaviour.

fwiw i think i described merely org-store-link org-insert-link as i
think i ahve not tried oial yet.  thanks for patch.

>>
>> Currently, when link to place is already stored, not error is thrown, a
>> message is displayed, no link is stored, and the stored link list is not
>> altered.
>
> Attaching the patch.
>


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Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

On 7/4/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Samuel Wales  writes:
>
>>> -UUU:**--F1  *Org Links*Top L1 (Fundamental)
>>
>> this buffer contains nothing useful and shortens the above buffer.
>
> This is fine. I assume that you can simply hide it away using
> `display-buffer-alist'.

i have struggled with this in a wider context and gotten nowhere for years.

>
>> ---
>>> http:  https:
>>> id:id:e69336ca-ca50-4535-9bad-63a31e030f31
>>> info:  irc:
>>> mailto:mhe:
>>> news:  rmail:
>>> shell: title
>>> w3m:
>>
>> these prefixes like http: i do not understand thier use.  i want
>> descriptions of headings.  the id link is not one.
>
> Org shows link prefixes, stored links, and link description in the
> completion. The relevant code in `org-insert-link' is:

what is the purpose of the prefixes?

where is the description in this case?  was it a bare link?  that is
unusual for an id link.

>
> (org-completing-read
>  "Link: "
>  (append
>   (mapcar (lambda (x) (concat x ":")) all-prefixes)
>   (mapcar #'car org-stored-links)
> ;; Allow description completion.  Avoid "nil" option
> ;; in the case of `completing-read-default' and
> ;; an error in `ido-completing-read' when some links
> ;; have no description.
> (delq nil (mapcar 'cadr org-stored-links)))
>  nil nil nil
>  'org-link--history
>  (caar org-stored-links))
>
>>> Notice that "title" is present among the completion options.
>>
>> title does not show in my case and nots ure the signiricance.  i use
>> large fonts.  that might or might nto be relevant.
>
> Completing descriptions feature has been added by Max 10 months ago - it
> is a fairly recent addition:

please note that it is of course not my intention to criticize anybody
or anybody's code.  merely saying what i need.  max is trying to be
helpful.  iu am not even sure how we got on this topic as my original
report was the already stored bug.

in the context of mindless store/insert, which is what i do most
frequently, if the most recently stored is set to the completion
default, this topic is moot as presumably others agree this is
desirable.  in the context of choosing a different link from the
default, the short url-like prefixes being there in front of specific
links confuses me.

for me, i just want the original buffer where you are pasting, and
minibuffer completion.  only.


then there is the more fancy question of grabbing random links from
all over your org files in order to paste them all in one place which
i will not cover here.

>
> 0432f4fe6ba9b07c17ac555beab1527d8f844234
> Author: Max Nikulin 
> ol.el: Restore complete by description for insert link
>
> * lisp/ol.el (org-insert-link): Allow completion of link target by its
> description.  Almost certainly the feature was removed unintentionally.

definitely in favor of copleting by the description of the link.
htank you for any effort toward that.

>
> This commit is a part of Org 9.6.
> May it be that you are using older Org version?

9.6.7, most recent bugfix.  comments apply to vanilla.

>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>


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A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

On 7/3/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 04/07/2023 07:28, Samuel Wales wrote:
>> again i normally work with 1 window so i can have enough text.
>> sometimes i have a minuibffer.  the end.
>
>  8< 
> File Edit Options Buffers Tools Minibuf Help
>
> * title
> :PROPERTIES:
> :ID:   e69336ca-ca50-4535-9bad-63a31e030f31
> -UU-:F1  test.org2% L2 (Org) ---

for my purposes this window should remain, and be larger.

> Insert a link.
> Use TAB to complete link prefixes, then RET for type-specific compl$
>
> -UUU:**--F1  *Org Links*Top L1 (Fundamental)

this buffer contains nothing useful and shortens the above buffer.

---
> http:  https:
> id:id:e69336ca-ca50-4535-9bad-63a31e030f31
> info:  irc:
> mailto:mhe:
> news:  rmail:
> shell: title
> w3m:

these prefixes like http: i do not understand thier use.  i want
descriptions of headings.  the id link is not one.

>
>
>
>
> -UUU:%*--F1  *Completions*   Bot L10(Completion List)

i do not see the need for a buffer here.  it reduces the size of hte
buffer that matters.

-
> Link:
>  >8 
>
> Notice that "title" is present among the completion options.

title does not show in my case and nots ure the signiricance.  i use
large fonts.  that might or might nto be relevant.

> You may be
> upset, but org-insert-link works correctly. I have no idea why you

emotions are not germane and can carry unintended implications in a
laudably usually polite ml.  i am not upset.

i cannot do this kind of back and forth.  i am limited in computer use.

you used the word correct.  i would say that it is not correct for me.
i believe you if you say it is correct for you.

> customization throws away this completion variant.

you asked me to do -q.  i did -q.  are you saying i am customizeing
-q?  i am unaware of it if so.

everythign here has nothign t9o do with my .emacs.

>
>
>
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

again i normally work with 1 window so i can have enough text.
sometimes i have a minuibffer.  the end.

On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> the copletions window dos notc ontain the link dscription or a
> default.  there is no tdeafult listed in minibuffer or any tlink
> description.  so it is 1 orig buffer, which is saller and therefoere
> lss useful, 1 links buffer, which is useless beause does not show what
> i need, 1 copletions buffer which is useollss befause all it shows is
> url prefixes, and a minibuffer which shows nothing.
>
> On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>> maybe most folk are ok with 3 windows + minibuffer.  this is not useful
>> to
>> me.
>>
>> On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>>> please feel free to give up if that doesn't get it across.  i can't
>>> continue a bac and forth for unrelated reasons.
>>>
>>> On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>>>> scratch the expanded thing.
>>>>
>>>> it ends up showing orig smaller less useful, links uselessly
>>>> boilerplate, completions -- 3 windows!  and a terse minibuffer i
>>>> wouldn't be able to use.  -q.  i cannot use such a ui.
>>>>
>>>> in contrast, what i expected is orig, and then expanded minibuffer
>>>> with, instead of doi: and so on, has useful links as descriotions.
>>>> only 1 window, if you don't count minibuffer.
>>>>
>>>> On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>>>>> defait cp[;etopm immediately makes 2 windows [orig+links] + expanded
>>>>> completion imnibuffer.  not useful for me.
>>>>>
>>>>> On 7/3/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
>>>>>> On 02/07/2023 13:03, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>>>>> there is not supposed to be any connection between org refile or org
>>>>>>> goto with the code in org insert link.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> completion works to select ol paths for org refile and also for org
>>>>>>> refile when it is doing goto.  i just want the same for links.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am giving up my attempts to clarify a possible issue with
>>>>>> completion
>>>>>> by description in `org-insert-link'. It works for me.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 7/1/23, Max Nikulin wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 02/07/2023 12:02, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>>>>>>> another window would not work for me but using completion as i do
>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>> e.g. refile goto would.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Samuel, you claimed that completion by description does not work
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> `org-insert-link'. I expect that it is fixed in Org-9.6 since I do
>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>> see the issue with the default completion. It is the reason why I
>>>>>>>> asked
>>>>>>>> you to confirm that *default completion* works for you as well. I
>>>>>>>> suspect that the cause of your problem is either ido or your
>>>>>>>> customization.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I see no connection of `org-refile' and `org-goto' with the code in
>>>>>>>> `org-insert-link'.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>>>>
>>>>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>>>>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>>>
>>>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>>>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>>
>>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>
>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

the copletions window dos notc ontain the link dscription or a
default.  there is no tdeafult listed in minibuffer or any tlink
description.  so it is 1 orig buffer, which is saller and therefoere
lss useful, 1 links buffer, which is useless beause does not show what
i need, 1 copletions buffer which is useollss befause all it shows is
url prefixes, and a minibuffer which shows nothing.

On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> maybe most folk are ok with 3 windows + minibuffer.  this is not useful to
> me.
>
> On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>> please feel free to give up if that doesn't get it across.  i can't
>> continue a bac and forth for unrelated reasons.
>>
>> On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>>> scratch the expanded thing.
>>>
>>> it ends up showing orig smaller less useful, links uselessly
>>> boilerplate, completions -- 3 windows!  and a terse minibuffer i
>>> wouldn't be able to use.  -q.  i cannot use such a ui.
>>>
>>> in contrast, what i expected is orig, and then expanded minibuffer
>>> with, instead of doi: and so on, has useful links as descriotions.
>>> only 1 window, if you don't count minibuffer.
>>>
>>> On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>>>> defait cp[;etopm immediately makes 2 windows [orig+links] + expanded
>>>> completion imnibuffer.  not useful for me.
>>>>
>>>> On 7/3/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
>>>>> On 02/07/2023 13:03, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>>>> there is not supposed to be any connection between org refile or org
>>>>>> goto with the code in org insert link.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> completion works to select ol paths for org refile and also for org
>>>>>> refile when it is doing goto.  i just want the same for links.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am giving up my attempts to clarify a possible issue with completion
>>>>> by description in `org-insert-link'. It works for me.
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 7/1/23, Max Nikulin wrote:
>>>>>>> On 02/07/2023 12:02, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>>>>>> another window would not work for me but using completion as i do
>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>> e.g. refile goto would.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Samuel, you claimed that completion by description does not work for
>>>>>>> `org-insert-link'. I expect that it is fixed in Org-9.6 since I do
>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>> see the issue with the default completion. It is the reason why I
>>>>>>> asked
>>>>>>> you to confirm that *default completion* works for you as well. I
>>>>>>> suspect that the cause of your problem is either ido or your
>>>>>>> customization.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I see no connection of `org-refile' and `org-goto' with the code in
>>>>>>> `org-insert-link'.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>>>
>>>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>>>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>>
>>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>
>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

maybe most folk are ok with 3 windows + minibuffer.  this is not useful to me.

On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> please feel free to give up if that doesn't get it across.  i can't
> continue a bac and forth for unrelated reasons.
>
> On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>> scratch the expanded thing.
>>
>> it ends up showing orig smaller less useful, links uselessly
>> boilerplate, completions -- 3 windows!  and a terse minibuffer i
>> wouldn't be able to use.  -q.  i cannot use such a ui.
>>
>> in contrast, what i expected is orig, and then expanded minibuffer
>> with, instead of doi: and so on, has useful links as descriotions.
>> only 1 window, if you don't count minibuffer.
>>
>> On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>>> defait cp[;etopm immediately makes 2 windows [orig+links] + expanded
>>> completion imnibuffer.  not useful for me.
>>>
>>> On 7/3/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
>>>> On 02/07/2023 13:03, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>>> there is not supposed to be any connection between org refile or org
>>>>> goto with the code in org insert link.
>>>>>
>>>>> completion works to select ol paths for org refile and also for org
>>>>> refile when it is doing goto.  i just want the same for links.
>>>>
>>>> I am giving up my attempts to clarify a possible issue with completion
>>>> by description in `org-insert-link'. It works for me.
>>>>
>>>>> On 7/1/23, Max Nikulin wrote:
>>>>>> On 02/07/2023 12:02, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>>>>> another window would not work for me but using completion as i do
>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>> e.g. refile goto would.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Samuel, you claimed that completion by description does not work for
>>>>>> `org-insert-link'. I expect that it is fixed in Org-9.6 since I do
>>>>>> not
>>>>>> see the issue with the default completion. It is the reason why I
>>>>>> asked
>>>>>> you to confirm that *default completion* works for you as well. I
>>>>>> suspect that the cause of your problem is either ido or your
>>>>>> customization.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I see no connection of `org-refile' and `org-goto' with the code in
>>>>>> `org-insert-link'.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>>
>>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>
>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

please feel free to give up if that doesn't get it across.  i can't
continue a bac and forth for unrelated reasons.

On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> scratch the expanded thing.
>
> it ends up showing orig smaller less useful, links uselessly
> boilerplate, completions -- 3 windows!  and a terse minibuffer i
> wouldn't be able to use.  -q.  i cannot use such a ui.
>
> in contrast, what i expected is orig, and then expanded minibuffer
> with, instead of doi: and so on, has useful links as descriotions.
> only 1 window, if you don't count minibuffer.
>
> On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>> defait cp[;etopm immediately makes 2 windows [orig+links] + expanded
>> completion imnibuffer.  not useful for me.
>>
>> On 7/3/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
>>> On 02/07/2023 13:03, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>> there is not supposed to be any connection between org refile or org
>>>> goto with the code in org insert link.
>>>>
>>>> completion works to select ol paths for org refile and also for org
>>>> refile when it is doing goto.  i just want the same for links.
>>>
>>> I am giving up my attempts to clarify a possible issue with completion
>>> by description in `org-insert-link'. It works for me.
>>>
>>>> On 7/1/23, Max Nikulin wrote:
>>>>> On 02/07/2023 12:02, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>>>> another window would not work for me but using completion as i do
>>>>>> with
>>>>>> e.g. refile goto would.
>>>>>
>>>>> Samuel, you claimed that completion by description does not work for
>>>>> `org-insert-link'. I expect that it is fixed in Org-9.6 since I do not
>>>>> see the issue with the default completion. It is the reason why I
>>>>> asked
>>>>> you to confirm that *default completion* works for you as well. I
>>>>> suspect that the cause of your problem is either ido or your
>>>>> customization.
>>>>>
>>>>> I see no connection of `org-refile' and `org-goto' with the code in
>>>>> `org-insert-link'.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>
>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

scratch the expanded thing.

it ends up showing orig smaller less useful, links uselessly
boilerplate, completions -- 3 windows!  and a terse minibuffer i
wouldn't be able to use.  -q.  i cannot use such a ui.

in contrast, what i expected is orig, and then expanded minibuffer
with, instead of doi: and so on, has useful links as descriotions.
only 1 window, if you don't count minibuffer.

On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> defait cp[;etopm immediately makes 2 windows [orig+links] + expanded
> completion imnibuffer.  not useful for me.
>
> On 7/3/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
>> On 02/07/2023 13:03, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>> there is not supposed to be any connection between org refile or org
>>> goto with the code in org insert link.
>>>
>>> completion works to select ol paths for org refile and also for org
>>> refile when it is doing goto.  i just want the same for links.
>>
>> I am giving up my attempts to clarify a possible issue with completion
>> by description in `org-insert-link'. It works for me.
>>
>>> On 7/1/23, Max Nikulin wrote:
>>>> On 02/07/2023 12:02, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>>> another window would not work for me but using completion as i do with
>>>>> e.g. refile goto would.
>>>>
>>>> Samuel, you claimed that completion by description does not work for
>>>> `org-insert-link'. I expect that it is fixed in Org-9.6 since I do not
>>>> see the issue with the default completion. It is the reason why I asked
>>>> you to confirm that *default completion* works for you as well. I
>>>> suspect that the cause of your problem is either ido or your
>>>> customization.
>>>>
>>>> I see no connection of `org-refile' and `org-goto' with the code in
>>>> `org-insert-link'.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

my reading was:

s> another window would not work for me but using completion as i do
with e.g. refile goto would

m> try again

s> creates another window.  ergo not work for me.

in fact, it is worse than that for me.  with my fonts, the links
window shows nothing useful on screen.  it is boilerplate.  orig is
smaller.  completion window -- not minibuffer -- shows bbdb: doi: and
other useless things.  the link i want to dinsert does not show in
either.  i would have to remember the link description then enter
that.  and learn a ew compoetion mechanism just for this one case?
not sure what you mean here  minibuffer says link.  unfamiliar
interface no flex no vertical no default of most recent stored.

On 7/3/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> defait cp[;etopm immediately makes 2 windows [orig+links] + expanded
> completion imnibuffer.  not useful for me.
>
> On 7/3/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
>> On 02/07/2023 13:03, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>> there is not supposed to be any connection between org refile or org
>>> goto with the code in org insert link.
>>>
>>> completion works to select ol paths for org refile and also for org
>>> refile when it is doing goto.  i just want the same for links.
>>
>> I am giving up my attempts to clarify a possible issue with completion
>> by description in `org-insert-link'. It works for me.
>>
>>> On 7/1/23, Max Nikulin wrote:
>>>> On 02/07/2023 12:02, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>>> another window would not work for me but using completion as i do with
>>>>> e.g. refile goto would.
>>>>
>>>> Samuel, you claimed that completion by description does not work for
>>>> `org-insert-link'. I expect that it is fixed in Org-9.6 since I do not
>>>> see the issue with the default completion. It is the reason why I asked
>>>> you to confirm that *default completion* works for you as well. I
>>>> suspect that the cause of your problem is either ido or your
>>>> customization.
>>>>
>>>> I see no connection of `org-refile' and `org-goto' with the code in
>>>> `org-insert-link'.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

defait cp[;etopm immediately makes 2 windows [orig+links] + expanded
completion imnibuffer.  not useful for me.

On 7/3/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 02/07/2023 13:03, Samuel Wales wrote:
>> there is not supposed to be any connection between org refile or org
>> goto with the code in org insert link.
>>
>> completion works to select ol paths for org refile and also for org
>> refile when it is doing goto.  i just want the same for links.
>
> I am giving up my attempts to clarify a possible issue with completion
> by description in `org-insert-link'. It works for me.
>
>> On 7/1/23, Max Nikulin wrote:
>>> On 02/07/2023 12:02, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>>> another window would not work for me but using completion as i do with
>>>> e.g. refile goto would.
>>>
>>> Samuel, you claimed that completion by description does not work for
>>> `org-insert-link'. I expect that it is fixed in Org-9.6 since I do not
>>> see the issue with the default completion. It is the reason why I asked
>>> you to confirm that *default completion* works for you as well. I
>>> suspect that the cause of your problem is either ido or your
>>> customization.
>>>
>>> I see no connection of `org-refile' and `org-goto' with the code in
>>> `org-insert-link'.
>
>
>
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

there is not supposed to be any connection between org refile or org
goto with the code in org insert link.

completion works to select ol paths for org refile and also for org
refile when it is doing goto.  i just want the same for links.

On 7/1/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 02/07/2023 12:02, Samuel Wales wrote:
>> another window would not work for me but using completion as i do with
>> e.g. refile goto would.
>
> Samuel, you claimed that completion by description does not work for
> `org-insert-link'. I expect that it is fixed in Org-9.6 since I do not
> see the issue with the default completion. It is the reason why I asked
> you to confirm that *default completion* works for you as well. I
> suspect that the cause of your problem is either ido or your customization.
>
> I see no connection of `org-refile' and `org-goto' with the code in
> `org-insert-link'.
>
>
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

another window would not work for me but using completion as i do with
e.g. refile goto would.

On 7/1/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 01/07/2023 13:12, Max Nikulin wrote:
>> On 01/07/2023 12:15, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>> emacs -q 9.6.7, vaniila except for whatever -q loads, opens a links
>>> window that shows descrtipition and truncated link.
>>
>> Ignore the links window and try to type first letter of a link
>> description and TAB.
>
> ...and TAB once more to make the completions window appeared. If default
> completion works then it is necessary to debug ido and customization to
> realize why data passed by `org-insert-link' is not enough for ido in
> your case.
>
>
>
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: batch breaks bugfix

[Samuel Wales]

i still use maint as a comparison against bugfix and main to make sure
they didn't intro regressions.  i even tested 8 for a long time so i
could go back and check formatting changes etc.  if maint gets it
right tht might be a clue is all.


On 7/1/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Samuel Wales  writes:
>
>> - bugfix and main sorting still not getting ts-down tsia-down right.
>> maint gets it right.
>
> maint is obsolete and no longer used.
>
>> - having said that it was a relief to have had this script for so many
>> years as i was able to be confident that the agenda was picking up
>> every relevant task, not picking up others, sorting, formatting
>> correctly, org version changes, .emacs...]
>
> Understood. That's why Org has regression tests as well :)
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

i guess i expected completion to show only description with recently
saved at top.  if i want, i can also select by ido's flex, c-spc,
arrow keys, etc.  ido is already set up for accessibility for me and
is used all the time for other purposes.

then there is the opportunity for fanciness with sets of links
gathered and pasted in one place.  i haven't considred what i would
need or what is possible there.  except the crash-proof editing and
register ideas which are almost orthogonal.


On 6/30/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> yes, 9.6.7 has the bug as i described it, at least with my window and ido
> setup.
>
> emacs -q 9.6.7, vaniila except for whatever -q loads, opens a links
> window that shows descrtipition and truncated link.  idk what you do
> to select.  idk what it does with completion setups.
>
> one problem is  this means a 2 window setup.  i use VERY large fonts
> and basically never have a 2 window setup even for completions.  i
> spent 20y kludging emacs to get rid of other window stuff and still
> there re many places where it creeps in [occur-like buffers are a big
> one].  the new [years old actally] window mechanism might improvbe on
> it in principle but i am not in a position to try that atm.  idk if it
> would work with my ido setup.  and if it did all technically work idk
> if the result would be accessible for me wrt window sizes.
>
>
> On 6/30/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
>> On 28/06/2023 08:35, Samuel Wales wrote:
>>> 2) org-insert-link, with my ido setup, and i am aware other
>>> completion mechanisms exist but find it difficult to
>>> switch, offers as completion candidates a completely
>>> useless list.
>>
>> The Org version in the Anthony's report is 9.5. Samuel, could you,
>> please, confirm that you use at least Org-9.6? It contains a number of
>> fixes related to `org-store-link' and `org-insert-link' including a
>> change related to completion by description.
>>
>> Is it realistic for you to try the default completion function (emacs -q
>> and load newer Org) instead of ido? I mean namely completion by
>> description ignoring selection from the links buffer.
>>
>> There is a number of issues with this pair of functions, however
>> completion by description should work to some extent.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: org-insert-link completion by description (Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?)

[Samuel Wales]

yes, 9.6.7 has the bug as i described it, at least with my window and ido setup.

emacs -q 9.6.7, vaniila except for whatever -q loads, opens a links
window that shows descrtipition and truncated link.  idk what you do
to select.  idk what it does with completion setups.

one problem is  this means a 2 window setup.  i use VERY large fonts
and basically never have a 2 window setup even for completions.  i
spent 20y kludging emacs to get rid of other window stuff and still
there re many places where it creeps in [occur-like buffers are a big
one].  the new [years old actally] window mechanism might improvbe on
it in principle but i am not in a position to try that atm.  idk if it
would work with my ido setup.  and if it did all technically work idk
if the result would be accessible for me wrt window sizes.


On 6/30/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 28/06/2023 08:35, Samuel Wales wrote:
>> 2) org-insert-link, with my ido setup, and i am aware other
>> completion mechanisms exist but find it difficult to
>> switch, offers as completion candidates a completely
>> useless list.
>
> The Org version in the Anthony's report is 9.5. Samuel, could you,
> please, confirm that you use at least Org-9.6? It contains a number of
> fixes related to `org-store-link' and `org-insert-link' including a
> change related to completion by description.
>
> Is it realistic for you to try the default completion function (emacs -q
> and load newer Org) instead of ido? I mean namely completion by
> description ignoring selection from the links buffer.
>
> There is a number of issues with this pair of functions, however
> completion by description should work to some extent.
>
>
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: batch breaks bugfix

[Samuel Wales]

correction for anybody who bothered to follow all that nonsense: the
bizarre bug with not including certain entries only exists in bugfix.
i had gotten it to exhibit itself in 2 repos with different names at
one point but never mind that.

Re: batch breaks bugfix

[Samuel Wales]

On 6/19/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Samuel Wales  writes:
>
>> the bug occurs in recent bugfix, but not recent main, so perhaps we
>> could say that it is fixed in main but that the fix has not been
>> applied to bugfix?  [if only the fix were known.]
>
> Maybe.
>
>> does org testing use --batch?
>
> Yup.
> If you have time and interest, it would be useful if you can integrate
> your regression tests with Org's test suite.

[so as to not ignore you --- i would like that very much but npot poss
or useful to do that atm for me for unrelated reasons or for the tests
[ignore following unless of interest]:
- not signed up
- private data included [but useful tses]
- scattered shell functions + elisp to be extracted/cleaned
- running as --batch currently errors at emacs "Unknown option
‘-maximized’" [only one hyphen] with no backtrace even with
--debug-init.  i can't find where this originates from, although it is
guessably windowy code that --batch does not run -- i want to have it
work as --batch.  i think it does not seem to be my maximizing code in
.emacs.  i wonder what org standard testcase does to get no errors
like that.
- running non-batch works but is annoying with emacs popping up for
each test and loading .emacs for a few seconds
  - [currently not at stage of reducing that to ecm -Q elisp that
might or might not resolve any batch issues.
  - for my tastes it would ahve to be made to not violate DRY so as to
forestall syncing issues and would be less like running normal emacs
anyway, thus in principle could fail to flag possible future
non-intuitive bug-causing changes in .emacs
  - still want --batch though as lower-frame does not solve annoyance]
- make info, errors, etc. not yet appended to the diffable agenda
output for convenience in showing all factors like pulling and making
and running that could affect a given output and speed.
- truly bizarre bug with certain tasks not showing up in agenda in
certain repos.  i even have 2 repos, identical, just /named/
differently, where one does this and the other does not.  this is no
longer batch vs. non-batch; it's an unknown cause.
- currently i do make oldorg for everything but my non-canonical repos
havfe a local.mk.  also tried make.  not sure if such differences
could cause any bugs subtly.
- bugfix and main sorting still not getting ts-down tsia-down right.
maint gets it right.
  - i'd have to make ecm which is not possible atm.
- having said that it was a relief to have had this script for so many
years as i was able to be confident that the agenda was picking up
every relevant task, not picking up others, sorting, formatting
correctly, org version changes, .emacs...]

>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: basic git

[Samuel Wales]

On 6/30/23, Max Nikulin  wrote:
> On 30/06/2023 13:55, Samuel Wales wrote:
>> the merge conflict is
>>
>> <<<<<<< HEAD
>> ;; Version: 9.7-pre
>> ===
>> ;; Version: 9.6.7
>>>>>>>>> 7da765e459384f68d764589c94fd26472f1c3361
>
> It looks like you tried to merge into the "bugfix" branch the "main"
> branch.

i had no idea.

>
> Do you have history of last git commands, e.g. in an emacs eshell
> buffer? Please, post them.

would rather forget the trauma.  but there is amusement value to be
had by onlookers so here goes.

hehe you get to see all my git ignorance and try to wonder at what my
scritps do.

  502  ado git-pullv # says what's new etc.
  503  git branch --set-upstream-to=origin/bugfix bugfix
#i was told to do this.  it worked ok before.  but now it tells me i
have to do something.
  504  cd $delbig
  505  cd 9bugfix #symlink
  506  git status
  507  ado git-pullv
  508  git pull
  509  git fetch --tags origin #desperation sets in
  510  git status
  511  ado git-pullv
# this is the !@#$ it moment.  should work for sure.  ha ha.
  512  git clone https://git.savannah.gnu.org/git/emacs/org-mode.git
  513  mv org-mode ../new
  514  cd ..
  515  mv org-mode--vanilla-bugfix--ok-to-pull--xyzzy-nomost
../obsolescent--xyzzy-nomost/
  516  mv new org-mode--vanilla-bugfix--ok-to-pull--xyzzy-nomost
  517  cd org-mode--vanilla-bugfix--ok-to-pull--xyzzy-nomost
  518  git status
  519  git gc
  520  git status
  521  git branch bugfix
  522  git status
  523  git branch
  524  git checkout bugfix
  525  git status
  526  ado git-pullv
  527  ado diffoldnew cat .git/config
  528  git branch --set-upstream-to=origin/bugfix bugfix
  529  ado diffoldnew cat .git/config
#so i can s3ee what git does with its inscrutably seemingly suddenly
needed command
  530  git status
  531  git pullv
  532  ado git-pullv
  533  git fetch
  534  git merge --force #flailing around
  535  git status
  536  git pull
  537  git pull --theirs #i just want upstream
  538  git status
  539  git merge --abort #well it said i could didn't it?
  540  git status
  541  git pull --their
  542  git --theirs pull
  543  git pull --theirs
  544  git branch
  545  git branch asdfasdf
  546  git branch
  547  git branch -d associated
  548  git branch -d asdfasdf
  549  git branch #ok i get that it doesn't change branches by now
  553  u;eagenda
  554  lt
  555  cd /tmp
  556  git clone https://git.savannah.gnu.org/git/emacs/org-mode.git
#try again, as i did all that weird wrong stuff
  557  cd org-mode
  558  ,git branch -a
  559  git branch -a
  560  git checkout bugfix
  561  git branch -a
  562  git pull
  563  git pull origin bugfix
  564  cd ..
  565  pd
  566  cd $delbit
  567  lt
  568  cd $delbig
  569  lt
  570  rmg org-mode--vanilla-bugfix--ok-to-pull--xyzzy-nomost
  571  mv /tmp/org-mode org-mode--vanilla-bugfix--ok-to-pull--xyzzy-nomost
  572  cd org-mode--vanilla-bugfix--ok-to-pull--xyzzy-nomost
  573  git status
  574  ado git-pullv
# ok it works

> Git is a flexible and powerful tool.

cannot disagree but also it is one which is too much for me most of
the time given my cognitive decline.  i try to stick to the basics and
it throws me into stress territory when even just blowing away the
existing and cloning doesn't work.

sticking to the basics /usually/ works.  yeah, it's a dag, you
checkout stuff, you avoid fancy stuff like plutonium.  actiually it
can have muluple roots but never mind that. git is like they say about
war.  boredom punctuated by terror.

-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: basic git

[Samuel Wales]

i did it a few times, it broke, i did what you did, which is really
the same except like -a, it works, i moved that to my dir, it works
for now.  thanks.  older git.

===

apropos of nothing, btw what does one do to make org these days?

make cleanall;make?  make oldorg?

as for other repos [i keep multiple copies for speed in switching for
testing] to clean up an old org with a local.mk do i just delete that
file?  can i keep doing make oldorg?


On 6/30/23, Dumitru Sipos  wrote:
> It behaves quite normally on my side:
>
> $ git clone https://git.savannah.gnu.org/git/emacs/org-mode.git
> Cloning into 'org-mode'...
> remote: Counting objects: 141138, done.
> remote: Compressing objects: 100% (30420/30420), done.
> remote: Total 141138 (delta 110608), reused 141085 (delta 110576)
> Receiving objects: 100% (141138/141138), 96.60 MiB | 21.35 MiB/s, done.
> Resolving deltas: 100% (110608/110608), done.
>
> $ cd org-mode/
>
> $ git branch -a
> * main
>    remotes/origin/HEAD -> origin/main
>    remotes/origin/bugfix
>    remotes/origin/emacs-sync
>    remotes/origin/main
>
> $ git checkout bugfix
> branch 'bugfix' set up to track 'origin/bugfix'.
> Switched to a new branch 'bugfix'
>
> $ git branch -a
> * bugfix
>    main
>    remotes/origin/HEAD -> origin/main
>    remotes/origin/bugfix
>    remotes/origin/emacs-sync
>    remotes/origin/main
>
> $ git pull
> Already up to date.
>
> $ git pull origin bugfix
>  From https://git.savannah.gnu.org/git/emacs/org-mode
>   * branch    bugfix     -> FETCH_HEAD
> Already up to date.
>
> $ git --version
> git version 2.39.0
>
> On 30-Jun-23 08:56, Samuel Wales wrote:
>> how can a freshly cloned bugfix be any different from upstream?
>>
>> On 6/29/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>>> i pulled vanilla bugfix and got errors.  i deleted the repo, cloned
>>> org, did git checkout bugfix, pulled, and still got errors.
>>>
>>> git clone https://git.savannah.gnu.org/git/emacs/org-mode.git
>>>
>>> i am gitophobic.
>>>
>>> ===
>>> On branch bugfix
>>> Your branch and 'origin/bugfix' have diverged,
>>> and have 424 and 3 different commits each, respectively.
>>>(use "git pull" to merge the remote branch into yours)
>>>
>>> You have unmerged paths.
>>>(fix conflicts and run "git commit")
>>>(use "git merge --abort" to abort the merge)
>>>
>>> Unmerged paths:
>>>(use "git add ..." to mark resolution)
>>>
>>> both modified:   lisp/org.el
>>>
>>> no changes added to commit (use "git add" and/or "git commit -a")
>>> ===
>>>
>>> the merge conflict is
>>>
>>> <<<<<<< HEAD
>>> ;; Version: 9.7-pre
>>> ===
>>> ;; Version: 9.6.7
>>>>>>>>>> 7da765e459384f68d764589c94fd26472f1c3361
>>> thanks for anything that will get me back to my old habits of just
>>> having a repo and pulling it.
>>>
>>> p.s.  i HATE git.
>>>
>>> --
>>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>>
>>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>>
>>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>>
>>
>
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: basic git

[Samuel Wales]

how can a freshly cloned bugfix be any different from upstream?

On 6/29/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> i pulled vanilla bugfix and got errors.  i deleted the repo, cloned
> org, did git checkout bugfix, pulled, and still got errors.
>
> git clone https://git.savannah.gnu.org/git/emacs/org-mode.git
>
> i am gitophobic.
>
> ===
> On branch bugfix
> Your branch and 'origin/bugfix' have diverged,
> and have 424 and 3 different commits each, respectively.
>   (use "git pull" to merge the remote branch into yours)
>
> You have unmerged paths.
>   (fix conflicts and run "git commit")
>   (use "git merge --abort" to abort the merge)
>
> Unmerged paths:
>   (use "git add ..." to mark resolution)
>
>   both modified:   lisp/org.el
>
> no changes added to commit (use "git add" and/or "git commit -a")
> ===
>
> the merge conflict is
>
> <<<<<<< HEAD
> ;; Version: 9.7-pre
> ===
> ;; Version: 9.6.7
>>>>>>>> 7da765e459384f68d764589c94fd26472f1c3361
>
> thanks for anything that will get me back to my old habits of just
> having a repo and pulling it.
>
> p.s.  i HATE git.
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

basic git

[Samuel Wales]

i pulled vanilla bugfix and got errors.  i deleted the repo, cloned
org, did git checkout bugfix, pulled, and still got errors.

git clone https://git.savannah.gnu.org/git/emacs/org-mode.git

i am gitophobic.

===
On branch bugfix
Your branch and 'origin/bugfix' have diverged,
and have 424 and 3 different commits each, respectively.
  (use "git pull" to merge the remote branch into yours)

You have unmerged paths.
  (fix conflicts and run "git commit")
  (use "git merge --abort" to abort the merge)

Unmerged paths:
  (use "git add ..." to mark resolution)

both modified:   lisp/org.el

no changes added to commit (use "git add" and/or "git commit -a")
===

the merge conflict is

<<< HEAD
;; Version: 9.7-pre
===
;; Version: 9.6.7
>>> 7da765e459384f68d764589c94fd26472f1c3361

thanks for anything that will get me back to my old habits of just
having a repo and pulling it.

p.s.  i HATE git.

-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com



-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?

[Samuel Wales]

or to [/mere brainstorm alert/] get really fancy, to be able to mark a
place where links are to be inserted [perhas to become a plain list or
so] then collect llinks from all over, then hit store and they all go
to the place you marked.  crash-proof.


On 6/29/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> although i just store and insert now, i'd also welcome the ability to
> collect links from various places and have them someplace like a
> register where they can be pasted all at once.  or even edit the list
> in the register, clear it, etc.
>
>
> On 6/29/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
>> Anthony Carrico  writes:
>>
>>>> Makes sense. It is a +1 for a defcustom.
>>>> Although I still believe that we should change the current default,
>>>> even
>>>> if leaving an option to fall back to previous behaviour.
>>>
>>> I don't think there is much reason to complicate the interface with a
>>> defcustom. The current default is an error, so changing the default
>>> doesn't break the workflow of anyone using it the way Samuel describes
>>> (unless I'm missing something).
>>
>> What Samuel described is a sequence of M-x org-store-link followed by
>> M-x org-insert-all-links. With such workflow, user can expect that the
>> links are going to be stored in order. If we are instead shuffle the
>> stored links, M-x org-insert-all-links may result in unexpected
>> behaviour.
>>
>> Currently, when link to place is already stored, not error is thrown, a
>> message is displayed, no link is stored, and the stored link list is not
>> altered.
>>
>> --
>> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
>> Org mode contributor,
>> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
>> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
>> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?

[Samuel Wales]

although i just store and insert now, i'd also welcome the ability to
collect links from various places and have them someplace like a
register where they can be pasted all at once.  or even edit the list
in the register, clear it, etc.


On 6/29/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Anthony Carrico  writes:
>
>>> Makes sense. It is a +1 for a defcustom.
>>> Although I still believe that we should change the current default, even
>>> if leaving an option to fall back to previous behaviour.
>>
>> I don't think there is much reason to complicate the interface with a
>> defcustom. The current default is an error, so changing the default
>> doesn't break the workflow of anyone using it the way Samuel describes
>> (unless I'm missing something).
>
> What Samuel described is a sequence of M-x org-store-link followed by
> M-x org-insert-all-links. With such workflow, user can expect that the
> links are going to be stored in order. If we are instead shuffle the
> stored links, M-x org-insert-all-links may result in unexpected
> behaviour.
>
> Currently, when link to place is already stored, not error is thrown, a
> message is displayed, no link is stored, and the stored link list is not
> altered.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at .
> Support Org development at ,
> or support my work at 
>
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?

[Samuel Wales]

i am not sure i am using store/insert to their full actual or
potential potential.

if you move the recent one to top of list, that would work for my
mindless store/insert, but it might not work for a user who has
carefully cultivated a set of links that are all to be inserted, or
such.  although idk if the mechanism supports.

On 6/28/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> that is, if completing-read is changed, idk if ido will work with it
> well or not  idk if proposed fix means
>
> - include id and description in orig list for selection
> - include id and description is for marginalia
> - user selects description and id is returned
> - another change
>
> just showing the basename headings [or whatever has an org id] wold
> wfm but there are probably other considerations.
>
> at least, as long as the inserted link mainains the mapping of id with
> description.
>
> On 6/28/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
>> On 6/28/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
>>> This behaviour has been introduced in bb61b37ee
>>>
>>> bb61b37ee223fd89cf951a5fbf62e35e606a4646
>>> Author: Bastien 
>>> AuthorDate: Thu Dec 5 17:11:26 2019 +0100
>>> ol.el: Don't store the same link twice
>>>
>>> * lisp/ol.el (org-store-link): Don't store the same link twice.
>>
>> thanks for traking down.
>>
>>>
>>> I think that it will make a lot more sense to move the link in front of
>>> the stored link list instead of just printing the message.
>>
>> good idea.  after all you most recently stored it, duplicate or no.
>>
>>>>  id:2134123-11234123-41234123--12341
>>>>  eww:
>>>>  gnus:
>>>>  ...
>>>>  id:44242423-23452-345-234-523452-345
>>>>  ...
>>>>
>>>>as there is no description and the presumably useful ids
>>>>are near te bottom it is useless to try to use
>>>>org-insert-link.  so idk what the solution is.
>>>
>>> The descriptions are displayed in *Org Links* buffer.
>>
>> all i see is the org buffer and the minibuffer.  perhaps for
>> accessibility reasons i made it so that i don't see an org links
>> bufer.  i maximize everything and one window where possibel.
>>
>> idk what geeral use links buffer woul be in practice, but it wouln't
>> work for me.  orig, mini, and links buffers would be too small, frame
>> maximized.
>>
>>> The completing-read call could, however, be improved to display link
>>> descriptions as well. Patches welcome!
>>
>> sounds good but idk.  ido did ussed to do things like put files in
>> parens, although i removed that nad only have the basename heading in
>> my ido lists for olpaths for clarity.  but idk if ido integrates well
>> enough to work with such a fix or not.
>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
>>> Org mode contributor,
>>> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
>>> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
>>> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> The Kafka Pandemic
>>
>> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
>> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
The Kafka Pandemic

A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?

[Samuel Wales]

that is, if completing-read is changed, idk if ido will work with it
well or not  idk if proposed fix means

- include id and description in orig list for selection
- include id and description is for marginalia
- user selects description and id is returned
- another change

just showing the basename headings [or whatever has an org id] wold
wfm but there are probably other considerations.

at least, as long as the inserted link mainains the mapping of id with
description.

On 6/28/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> On 6/28/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
>> This behaviour has been introduced in bb61b37ee
>>
>> bb61b37ee223fd89cf951a5fbf62e35e606a4646
>> Author: Bastien 
>> AuthorDate: Thu Dec 5 17:11:26 2019 +0100
>> ol.el: Don't store the same link twice
>>
>> * lisp/ol.el (org-store-link): Don't store the same link twice.
>
> thanks for traking down.
>
>>
>> I think that it will make a lot more sense to move the link in front of
>> the stored link list instead of just printing the message.
>
> good idea.  after all you most recently stored it, duplicate or no.
>
>>>  id:2134123-11234123-41234123--12341
>>>  eww:
>>>  gnus:
>>>  ...
>>>  id:44242423-23452-345-234-523452-345
>>>  ...
>>>
>>>as there is no description and the presumably useful ids
>>>are near te bottom it is useless to try to use
>>>org-insert-link.  so idk what the solution is.
>>
>> The descriptions are displayed in *Org Links* buffer.
>
> all i see is the org buffer and the minibuffer.  perhaps for
> accessibility reasons i made it so that i don't see an org links
> bufer.  i maximize everything and one window where possibel.
>
> idk what geeral use links buffer woul be in practice, but it wouln't
> work for me.  orig, mini, and links buffers would be too small, frame
> maximized.
>
>> The completing-read call could, however, be improved to display link
>> descriptions as well. Patches welcome!
>
> sounds good but idk.  ido did ussed to do things like put files in
> parens, although i removed that nad only have the basename heading in
> my ido lists for olpaths for clarity.  but idk if ido integrates well
> enough to work with such a fix or not.
>
>>
>> --
>> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
>> Org mode contributor,
>> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
>> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
>> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


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Re: what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?

[Samuel Wales]

On 6/28/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> This behaviour has been introduced in bb61b37ee
>
> bb61b37ee223fd89cf951a5fbf62e35e606a4646
> Author: Bastien 
> AuthorDate: Thu Dec 5 17:11:26 2019 +0100
> ol.el: Don't store the same link twice
>
> * lisp/ol.el (org-store-link): Don't store the same link twice.

thanks for traking down.

>
> I think that it will make a lot more sense to move the link in front of
> the stored link list instead of just printing the message.

good idea.  after all you most recently stored it, duplicate or no.

>>  id:2134123-11234123-41234123--12341
>>  eww:
>>  gnus:
>>  ...
>>  id:44242423-23452-345-234-523452-345
>>  ...
>>
>>as there is no description and the presumably useful ids
>>are near te bottom it is useless to try to use
>>org-insert-link.  so idk what the solution is.
>
> The descriptions are displayed in *Org Links* buffer.

all i see is the org buffer and the minibuffer.  perhaps for
accessibility reasons i made it so that i don't see an org links
bufer.  i maximize everything and one window where possibel.

idk what geeral use links buffer woul be in practice, but it wouln't
work for me.  orig, mini, and links buffers would be too small, frame
maximized.

> The completing-read call could, however, be improved to display link
> descriptions as well. Patches welcome!

sounds good but idk.  ido did ussed to do things like put files in
parens, although i removed that nad only have the basename heading in
my ido lists for olpaths for clarity.  but idk if ido integrates well
enough to work with such a fix or not.

>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at .
> Support Org development at ,
> or support my work at 
>


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what is the purpose of "This link has already been stored"?

[Samuel Wales]

in maint and bugfix i frequently do org-store-link on a
heading that has a properties drawer with an id in it.

my intent is to store it so that i can paste the link later
with org-insert-link.

i frequently get "This link has already been
stored".  perhaps this is meant to teach me that i can find
it in org-insert-link?  there are 2 problems with that for
me in practice:

1) i want to store it anyway so i can use the
   mindless store-insert combination.
2) org-insert-link, with my ido setup, and i am aware other
   completion mechanisms exist but find it difficult to
   switch, offers as completion candidates a completely
   useless list.

   idk how to show you the list but it looks kinda sorta like this:
 id:2134123-11234123-41234123--12341
 eww:
 gnus:
 ...
 id:44242423-23452-345-234-523452-345
 ...

   as there is no description and the presumably useful ids
   are near te bottom it is useless to try to use
   org-insert-link.  so idk what the solution is.

   i tried setting (setq org-link-make-description-function
   t) but that made no noticeable difference.  i am probably
   doing somethign wrong someplace.  i hope using ido is ok.
   i'd switch to vertico if i could get it closer to my ido.

   what i woul dlike to see is, for there to be no
   error/warning in org-store-link, and for org-insert-link
   to show me link descriptions and maybe id also.

   ideas?

   thanks.


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id links in non-org buffers

[Samuel Wales]

will any package highlight or follow org id in non-org?

Re: ts-down sorts between deadline-down and scheduled-down

[Samuel Wales]

actually:

ts-down
deadline-down
scheduled-down

results in output:

scheduled-down
deadlie-down
ts-down


On 6/19/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> if i put ts-down before deadline-down and scheduled-down, it shows up
> after deadline and before scheduled.
>
> ((agenda habit-down time-up tsia-down ts-down deadline-down
> scheduled-down category-up user-defined-up)
>  (todo category-up user-defined-up)
>  (tags category-up user-defined-up)
>  (search category-up user-defined-up))
>
> what i expect is before deadline.
>
> i am getting this in vanilla bugfix and main with my .emacs [canot do
> ecm atm].  vanilla 9.4 maint works correctly.
>


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ts-down sorts between deadline-down and scheduled-down

[Samuel Wales]

if i put ts-down before deadline-down and scheduled-down, it shows up
after deadline and before scheduled.

((agenda habit-down time-up tsia-down ts-down deadline-down
scheduled-down category-up user-defined-up)
 (todo category-up user-defined-up)
 (tags category-up user-defined-up)
 (search category-up user-defined-up))

what i expect is before deadline.

i am getting this in vanilla bugfix and main with my .emacs [canot do
ecm atm].  vanilla 9.4 maint works correctly.

Re: batch breaks bugfix

[Samuel Wales]

i don't do anything with visibility.  make test seems ok in bugfix.
but perhaps it does not generate a comprehensive agenda, in which case
maybe --batch would cause the bug.

what i am going to try to do is just remove --batch and lower the
frame and try to get bugfix to work like main.  this is more like
normal use.  but it would be good to know what the problem is with
--batch.


On 6/19/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Samuel Wales  writes:
>
>> the bug occurs in recent bugfix, but not recent main, so perhaps we
>> could say that it is fixed in main but that the fix has not been
>> applied to bugfix?  [if only the fix were known.]
>
> Maybe.
>
>> does org testing use --batch?
>
> Yup.
> If you have time and interest, it would be useful if you can integrate
> your regression tests with Org's test suite.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>


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Re: batch breaks bugfix

[Samuel Wales]

wondering if it is possible to enable display stuff without actually
dispaying anything.

On 6/18/23, Samuel Wales  wrote:
> the bug occurs in recent bugfix, but not recent main, so perhaps we
> could say that it is fixed in main but that the fix has not been
> applied to bugfix?  [if only the fix were known.]
>
> does org testing use --batch?
>
> bugfix tests ok.  but idk if that tests agenda.
>
>
> On 6/18/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
>> Samuel Wales  writes:
>>
>>> can you think of any differences between bugfix and main
>>> that could result in
>>>
>>> 1) bugfix not producing certain agenda entries from the org
>>>outline (THE BUG)
>>> 2) with no obvious differences between the entries that show
>>>and the entries that do not
>>> 3) FROM A BATCH CALL.  removing --batch from the emacs call
>>>removes the bug.
>>
>> If you play with visibility, there might be differences. Emacs batch
>> mode disables some display staff and visibility relies upon display
>> working properly.
>>
>> No other ideas.
>>
>> --
>> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
>> Org mode contributor,
>> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
>> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
>> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>>
>
>
> --
> The Kafka Pandemic
>
> A blog about science, health, human rights, and misopathy:
> https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com
>


-- 
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https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

Re: batch breaks bugfix

[Samuel Wales]

the bug occurs in recent bugfix, but not recent main, so perhaps we
could say that it is fixed in main but that the fix has not been
applied to bugfix?  [if only the fix were known.]

does org testing use --batch?

bugfix tests ok.  but idk if that tests agenda.


On 6/18/23, Ihor Radchenko  wrote:
> Samuel Wales  writes:
>
>> can you think of any differences between bugfix and main
>> that could result in
>>
>> 1) bugfix not producing certain agenda entries from the org
>>outline (THE BUG)
>> 2) with no obvious differences between the entries that show
>>and the entries that do not
>> 3) FROM A BATCH CALL.  removing --batch from the emacs call
>>removes the bug.
>
> If you play with visibility, there might be differences. Emacs batch
> mode disables some display staff and visibility relies upon display
> working properly.
>
> No other ideas.
>
> --
> Ihor Radchenko // yantar92,
> Org mode contributor,
> Learn more about Org mode at <https://orgmode.org/>.
> Support Org development at <https://liberapay.com/org-mode>,
> or support my work at <https://liberapay.com/yantar92>
>


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https://thekafkapandemic.blogspot.com

batch breaks bugfix

[Samuel Wales]

can you think of any differences between bugfix and main
that could result in

1) bugfix not producing certain agenda entries from the org
   outline (THE BUG)
2) with no obvious differences between the entries that show
   and the entries that do not
3) FROM A BATCH CALL.  removing --batch from the emacs call
   removes the bug.

i am merely hoping for an a priori idea about what might be
different from bugfix to main so that i don't have to do
what for unrealted reasons i cannot do at this time which is
produce an ecm.  27.1.  apologies for bad non-bug-report.

===

(info "(elisp) Startup Summary") says what --batch does
differehtly from interactive.  long ago i tried to make
testcase be like normal emacs gui use.  loads .emacs, which
batch does not.  i have no default library for batch to not
run.  i did not do the other stuff --batch does.  recently
adding (package-initialize) made no difference.

so idk what --batch is doing or not doing to screw up the
bugfix agenda but not main.

batch maint has sorting differences from main, which i will
presume are expected and fixable.

===

i wouldn't care about this issue but i like running my old
regression script to ensure agenda works ok.


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