Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[John Dammeyer]

Hi Marcus,

> From: Marcus Bowman [mailto:marcus.bow...@visible.eclipse.co.uk]
> On 4 Nov 2021, at 21:46, andy pugh wrote:
> >
> > Or possibly:
> > https://photos.app.goo.gl/72BgoRiKeGmQqDHs9
> 
> I removed the ACME screws when I converted my mill. I replaced them with 
> ballscrews. The nuts are platform-style, rather than
> cylindrical.
> https://tech.thk.com/en/products/pdfs/en_a15_228.pdf
> I turned a bit of square bar to produce a spigot rather like the top of the 
> nut in that second photo, but with the top plate and spigot
> bolted to the complete ball nut. I had to mill a groove on the underside of 
> the X table to clear the top of the nut --- and I would
> caution you not to do that, as the casting will probably change shape and bow 
> the table. I had to have mine reground. The other
> axes had enough clearance, and the general method works fine.
> 
> Marcus

Yeah I've heard about those kinds of issues with warped castings.  
Thanks for the feedback.
John




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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[Marcus Bowman]

On 4 Nov 2021, at 21:46, andy pugh wrote:

> 
> Or possibly:
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/72BgoRiKeGmQqDHs9

I removed the ACME screws when I converted my mill. I replaced them with 
ballscrews. The nuts are platform-style, rather than cylindrical.
https://tech.thk.com/en/products/pdfs/en_a15_228.pdf
I turned a bit of square bar to produce a spigot rather like the top of the nut 
in that second photo, but with the top plate and spigot bolted to the complete 
ball nut. I had to mill a groove on the underside of the X table to clear the 
top of the nut --- and I would caution you not to do that, as the casting will 
probably change shape and bow the table. I had to have mine reground. The other 
axes had enough clearance, and the general method works fine.

Marcus


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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 04 November 2021 19:33:39 John Dammeyer wrote:

> Thanks Andy,
>
> > From: andy pugh [mailto:bodge...@gmail.com]
> >
> > On Thu, 4 Nov 2021 at 21:34, John Dammeyer  
wrote:
> > > The backlash removal will be a major project.
> >
> > Maybe https://www.denfordata.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=3727
>
> I have plastic on the Z of my CNC Router.  It doesn't move too fast. 
> I think the 180 IPM I'm running with the mill plastic of any sort is a
> non starter.
>
> > Or possibly:
> > https://photos.app.goo.gl/72BgoRiKeGmQqDHs9
>
> But I like this idea.
>
> > There is a GTEN RSH ballnut in there. They are rather slim but have
> > an external ball return to deal with. That particular one was
> > special-order with preload.
>
> The RSH is doesn't come in 25mm but the RSU 2505-4 looks like it would
> be workable.  The next time I take the table off I'll do more detailed
> measurements.  I have some latitude on placement height as both ends
> of the table bearing mounts are custom castings.
>
> http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/XAxis-AlmostDone4.jpg
>
> The LHS has angular contact bearings and the holes although marked out
> symmetrical turned out to not match up to poorly positioned holes in
> the table.
>
> The other side where the power feed used to live turns out wasn't any
> better and there the shaft just floats in a radial bearing.
> http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/RHS_BearingHolder.jpg

Ouch, I can see backlash from here

> Cheap mills come with a price...

As I have learned the hard way with this g0704, the post isn't even 
vertical. So I am sorta in the market for one that is square.
>
> > --
> > atp
> > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > lunatics."
> > � George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
> ___
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Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 


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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[John Dammeyer]

Thanks Andy,
> From: andy pugh [mailto:bodge...@gmail.com]
> On Thu, 4 Nov 2021 at 21:34, John Dammeyer  wrote:
> >
> > The backlash removal will be a major project.
> 
> Maybe https://www.denfordata.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=3727

I have plastic on the Z of my CNC Router.  It doesn't move too fast.  I think 
the 180 IPM I'm running with the mill plastic of any sort is a non starter.


> 
> Or possibly:
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/72BgoRiKeGmQqDHs9
But I like this idea.

> There is a GTEN RSH ballnut in there. They are rather slim but have an
> external ball return to deal with. That particular one was
> special-order with preload.

The RSH is doesn't come in 25mm but the RSU 2505-4 looks like it would be 
workable.  The next time I take the table off I'll do more detailed 
measurements.  I have some latitude on placement height as both ends of the 
table bearing mounts are custom castings.  

http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/XAxis-AlmostDone4.jpg

The LHS has angular contact bearings and the holes although marked out 
symmetrical turned out to not match up to poorly positioned holes in the table.

The other side where the power feed used to live turns out wasn't any better 
and there the shaft just floats in a radial bearing.
http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/RHS_BearingHolder.jpg

Cheap mills come with a price...


> 
> 
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> � George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> 
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[dave engvall]

For the fussy or perfectionist water cool. Probably water cool the 
ballscrew as heat conduction will be far superior to trying  to cool the 
acetal nut.

Yep! I just fell out of the trees and damaged my head. ;-)

Dave

On 11/4/21 2:46 PM, andy pugh wrote:

On Thu, 4 Nov 2021 at 21:34, John Dammeyer  wrote:

The backlash removal will be a major project.

Maybe https://www.denfordata.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=3727

Or possibly:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/72BgoRiKeGmQqDHs9
There is a GTEN RSH ballnut in there. They are rather slim but have an
external ball return to deal with. That particular one was
special-order with preload.


--
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[bob X]

PERHAPS MAKE A SECOND CUBE WITH ID TREAD TO MATCH, DRILL AND INSTALL 4 PINS 
BETWEEN THE EXISTING AND NEW CUBS. PLACE A COMPRESSION SPRING BETWEEN THEM SET 
THE 4 PINS FROM THE FARE SIDE OF THE NEW CUBE TO THE EXISTING AND LOCK THEM. 
THE OPPOSING TRUST CREATED SHOULD REDUCE BACKLASH BY A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT IF 
NOT ELIMINATED.   DIY BACKLASH NUT.


From: John Dammeyer 
Sent: Thursday, November 4, 2021 5:31 PM
To: 'Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)' 
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

The backlash removal will be a major project.
This is what the bronze ACME nut looks like.  Clearly no way to split it and 
add any sort of backlash tweak.
http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/XAxis_Nut-2.jpg

The pin on the nut fits into this hole.
http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/XAxis-Ways-3.jpg

I did think about making a bronze replacement that was longer and could have 
adjusting screws.  But getting at it to adjust and trusting that the lead screw 
isn't worn already making it loose in some parts and tight in others doesn't 
seem like a great plan.

Alternatively I could mount a plate at the end of the casting and install a 
second ACME bronze nut that has a very fine pitch thread on the outside into 
the plate so it can be twisted to remove backlash.

Someone in Australia modified this type of mill by putting the ball nut onto a 
plate on the end and just adding a spacer on the motor bracket at the end of 
the table to deal with the loss of space taken up by the nut assembly.

So many options.  No idea which way to go.
John




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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[andy pugh]

On Thu, 4 Nov 2021 at 21:34, John Dammeyer  wrote:
>
> The backlash removal will be a major project.

Maybe https://www.denfordata.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=3727

Or possibly:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/72BgoRiKeGmQqDHs9
There is a GTEN RSH ballnut in there. They are rather slim but have an
external ball return to deal with. That particular one was
special-order with preload.


--
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[John Dammeyer]

The backlash removal will be a major project.
This is what the bronze ACME nut looks like.  Clearly no way to split it and 
add any sort of backlash tweak.
http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/XAxis_Nut-2.jpg

The pin on the nut fits into this hole.
http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/XAxis-Ways-3.jpg

I did think about making a bronze replacement that was longer and could have 
adjusting screws.  But getting at it to adjust and trusting that the lead screw 
isn't worn already making it loose in some parts and tight in others doesn't 
seem like a great plan.

Alternatively I could mount a plate at the end of the casting and install a 
second ACME bronze nut that has a very fine pitch thread on the outside into 
the plate so it can be twisted to remove backlash.

Someone in Australia modified this type of mill by putting the ball nut onto a 
plate on the end and just adding a spacer on the motor bracket at the end of 
the table to deal with the loss of space taken up by the nut assembly.

So many options.  No idea which way to go.
John




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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[dave engvall]

The aquaium pump should keep the sump aerobic. I suppose adding a bit of 
peroxide from time to time would do the same thing. If you let the sump 
go reducing (anaerobic) then the beastie that grow make volatile fatty 
acids and other wonderful smelling ( :-(  ) by-products.

I live in a high desert area and do not seem to have an odor problem.
Obviously YMMV.
Dave

On 11/3/21 11:34 PM, John Dammeyer wrote:

I used the big 1/2" one for the large pocket and the smaller 5mm one for the 
smaller pocket and profile.  The surface finish, given my crappy cast aluminium, was 
really nice.

My mill does have a coolant pump but I don't know if I use the mill often 
enough to fill the reservoir with coolant that then goes mouldy and stinky.  So 
I'm working on a compressed air mist coolant system.  But maybe having a 
secondary reservoir that pumps out the main one and adds an aquarium bubbler 
would work for the flood system.  So in the last 12 years I've never used 
coolant.

John



-Original Message-
From: andrew beck [mailto:andrewbeck0...@gmail.com]
Sent: November-03-21 10:52 PM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

What cutters are you using?

As a sideline here in New Zealand I buy and sell tooling so I'm always
testing the limits.

And can probably advise a bit

On Thu, 4 Nov 2021, 11:29 John Dammeyer,  wrote:


I've been using LCNC quite a bit (for me).   In the photo there are two
steel spring collars that were entirely done with the mill.  I could have
left them as large disks with just a stepped hole and the set screw holes
but what's the fun in that.


http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/SpindleControl/TrialFitOnSpindleCover-1.jpg

The spindle cover casting (10lbs of scrap aluminium) was machined in the
places I needed flat surfaces and to get rid of a bit of sag in the casting
mostly for looks.  I'd occasionally spray a bit of WD-40 but mostly just
held the shop vac to clean up the chips.

http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/SpindleControl/SpindleCoverplate-4.jpg

Essentially between 1000 and 2000 RPM, 2 flute 1/2" end mill, 25% step
over, about 2.5 to 5 IPM IPM and a depth of cut of about 0.1" for each
pass.  This created chips that did not melt onto the tool bit and left a
quite nice smooth finish.

But with those parameters it did take quite a while.  OTOH, it ran
automatically and other than check on it periodically and vacuum or blow
away chips I could do other things nearby.

If I enter the parameters into Machinist Toolbox with a target RPM of 1500
I see it suggests a tool feed rate of 21 IPM.  I think that would melt the
chips without flood coolant.  Since I didn't want to screw it up and have
to cast it all over again I was very conservative.

Was I too conservative on this?   It's been suggested by a friend who runs
MACH3 that he dials in a much faster feed and spindle rate and then hauls
back on the sliders to reduce it to very slow and then in small steps bumps
up the speed until it feels right.



Suggestions are welcome.
Thanks
John
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Re: [Emc-users] Prox sensors and wiring

[dave engvall]

Hi Andy,
I have a box of those connectors in a 6 wide and will get a box of 1 
wide and two wide.
My thoughts are when used outside in a marine environment to glop some 
3M Scotchcoat on them. Of course that make them rather fixed but they 
are cheap. :-)


Dave

On 11/4/21 1:44 AM, andy pugh wrote:

On Thu, 4 Nov 2021 at 06:30, John Dammeyer  wrote:


As for connectors, I'd solder and heat shrink to cables if they weren't long 
enough to reach the cabinet.

You can get glue-lined heat-shrink for a truly watertight joint.

I bring the prox leads back to a watertight junction box, and in the
junction box have these:
https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/pcb-terminal-blocks/8745433/

On a little board  in the box. It makes re-connecting a new prox in an
awkward position rather less painful.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/W85tdizk8BKjV5sf9

Less downtime, as I don't  need to find a new mating connector.

I might be tempted to use these inside a box now.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B08N6G8B1Z





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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[John Dammeyer]

Thanks.  I'll look into that coolant.  Seems such a waste not to use what came 
with the mill.
John


> -Original Message-
> From: andy pugh [mailto:bodge...@gmail.com]
> Sent: November-04-21 1:50 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress
> 
> On Thu, 4 Nov 2021 at 06:36, John Dammeyer  wrote:
> 
> > My mill does have a coolant pump but I don't know if I use the mill often 
> > enough to fill the reservoir with coolant that then goes
> mouldy and stinky.
> 
> Just get modern coolant.
> I probably don't even use my mill ever month, and the coolant in there
> has only been changed once since I built the machine 10 years ago,
> just topped-up when it no longer reaches the pump.
> 
> No problem with old-coolant smell. FWiW I use Biocut FG.
> 
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> � George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> 
> 
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[John Dammeyer]

Hi Andrew, 
The max my mill will run is 3000 RPM.  And because I made my own pulleys and am 
using a stock V belt there's a bit of vibration at that speed which I don't 
think helps much.

The other issue is backlash on the X is over 0.020" so climb milling is out of 
the question.  I've had a few scary moments when a plunge (due to bad G-Code 
programming on my part) is too fast and I can see the whole table shift as the 
1/2" cutter bites in.

More work to do I guess.
John


> -Original Message-
> From: andrew beck [mailto:andrewbeck0...@gmail.com]
> Sent: November-04-21 1:41 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress
> 
> John
> 
> I buy dlc costed aluminium end Mills.  From my Chinese supplier.
> 
> In my Linuxcnc controlled machine I use these feeds and speeds.  For a 3
> flute 10mm dia cutter.  With Dlc. (diamand like coating)
> 
> 
> High speed aka fusion 360 adaptive clearing
> 
> Depth of cut 25mm
> Side width of cut. 2mm
> 10k rpm
> 0.15 chip per tooth so 4500mm/min feedrate
> 
> 
> Slotting
> 
> 
> Depth of cut 10
> 10k rpm
> 0.05 chip per tooth so 1500mm/min feedrate
> 
> The cutters last for months of constant use.
> 
> And are like 10 times better than the high speed cutters you are running.
> Plus it's much harder to overheat the carbide. Than HSS.
> 
> For reference you can buy a 10mm cutter for about 30 usd each.
> 
> 6mm cost about 15 usd.
> 
> I get a decent discount on that.  But we are to far apart in the world for
> be to send them to you. (new Zealand
> 
> So in a nut shell.  Try some new cutters.
> 
> I'm running flood coolant.  But I think a mist would be almost as good as
> the Dlc coating is pretty amazing
> 
> Feel free to pm anyone for links
> 
> 
> On Thu, 4 Nov 2021, 19:36 John Dammeyer,  wrote:
> 
> > I used the big 1/2" one for the large pocket and the smaller 5mm one for
> > the smaller pocket and profile.  The surface finish, given my crappy cast
> > aluminium, was really nice.
> >
> > My mill does have a coolant pump but I don't know if I use the mill often
> > enough to fill the reservoir with coolant that then goes mouldy and
> > stinky.  So I'm working on a compressed air mist coolant system.  But maybe
> > having a secondary reservoir that pumps out the main one and adds an
> > aquarium bubbler would work for the flood system.  So in the last 12 years
> > I've never used coolant.
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: andrew beck [mailto:andrewbeck0...@gmail.com]
> > > Sent: November-03-21 10:52 PM
> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress
> > >
> > > What cutters are you using?
> > >
> > > As a sideline here in New Zealand I buy and sell tooling so I'm always
> > > testing the limits.
> > >
> > > And can probably advise a bit
> > >
> > > On Thu, 4 Nov 2021, 11:29 John Dammeyer,  wrote:
> > >
> > > > I've been using LCNC quite a bit (for me).   In the photo there are two
> > > > steel spring collars that were entirely done with the mill.  I could
> > have
> > > > left them as large disks with just a stepped hole and the set screw
> > holes
> > > > but what's the fun in that.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/SpindleControl/TrialFitOnSpindleCover-1.jpg
> > > >
> > > > The spindle cover casting (10lbs of scrap aluminium) was machined in
> > the
> > > > places I needed flat surfaces and to get rid of a bit of sag in the
> > casting
> > > > mostly for looks.  I'd occasionally spray a bit of WD-40 but mostly
> > just
> > > > held the shop vac to clean up the chips.
> > > >
> > > >
> > http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/SpindleControl/SpindleCoverplate-4.jpg
> > > >
> > > > Essentially between 1000 and 2000 RPM, 2 flute 1/2" end mill, 25% step
> > > > over, about 2.5 to 5 IPM IPM and a depth of cut of about 0.1" for each
> > > > pass.  This created chips that did not melt onto the tool bit and left
> > a
> > > > quite nice smooth finish.
> > > >
> > > > But with those parameters it did take quite a while.  OTOH, it ran
> > > > automatically and other than check on it periodically and vacuum or
> > blow
> > > > away chips I could do other things nearby.
> > > >
> > > > If I enter the parameters into Machinist Toolbox with a target RPM of
> > 1500
> > > > I see it suggests a tool feed rate of 21 IPM.  I think that would melt
> > the
> > > > chips without flood coolant.  Since I didn't want to screw it up and
> > have
> > > > to cast it all over again I was very conservative.
> > > >
> > > > Was I too conservative on this?   It's been suggested by a friend who
> > runs
> > > > MACH3 that he dials in a much faster feed and spindle rate and then
> > hauls
> > > > back on the sliders to reduce it to very slow and then in small steps
> > bumps
> > > > up the speed until it feels right.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Suggestions are welcome.
> > > > Thanks
> > > > John
> > > > ___
> > 

Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[andy pugh]

On Thu, 4 Nov 2021 at 06:36, John Dammeyer  wrote:

> My mill does have a coolant pump but I don't know if I use the mill often 
> enough to fill the reservoir with coolant that then goes mouldy and stinky.

Just get modern coolant.
I probably don't even use my mill ever month, and the coolant in there
has only been changed once since I built the machine 10 years ago,
just topped-up when it no longer reaches the pump.

No problem with old-coolant smell. FWiW I use Biocut FG.

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


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Re: [Emc-users] Prox sensors and wiring

[andy pugh]

On Thu, 4 Nov 2021 at 06:30, John Dammeyer  wrote:

> As for connectors, I'd solder and heat shrink to cables if they weren't long 
> enough to reach the cabinet.

You can get glue-lined heat-shrink for a truly watertight joint.

I bring the prox leads back to a watertight junction box, and in the
junction box have these:
https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/pcb-terminal-blocks/8745433/

On a little board  in the box. It makes re-connecting a new prox in an
awkward position rather less painful.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/W85tdizk8BKjV5sf9

Less downtime, as I don't  need to find a new mating connector.

I might be tempted to use these inside a box now.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B08N6G8B1Z

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[andrew beck]

John

I buy dlc costed aluminium end Mills.  From my Chinese supplier.

In my Linuxcnc controlled machine I use these feeds and speeds.  For a 3
flute 10mm dia cutter.  With Dlc. (diamand like coating)


High speed aka fusion 360 adaptive clearing

Depth of cut 25mm
Side width of cut. 2mm
10k rpm
0.15 chip per tooth so 4500mm/min feedrate


Slotting


Depth of cut 10
10k rpm
0.05 chip per tooth so 1500mm/min feedrate

The cutters last for months of constant use.

And are like 10 times better than the high speed cutters you are running.
Plus it's much harder to overheat the carbide. Than HSS.

For reference you can buy a 10mm cutter for about 30 usd each.

6mm cost about 15 usd.

I get a decent discount on that.  But we are to far apart in the world for
be to send them to you. (new Zealand

So in a nut shell.  Try some new cutters.

I'm running flood coolant.  But I think a mist would be almost as good as
the Dlc coating is pretty amazing

Feel free to pm anyone for links


On Thu, 4 Nov 2021, 19:36 John Dammeyer,  wrote:

> I used the big 1/2" one for the large pocket and the smaller 5mm one for
> the smaller pocket and profile.  The surface finish, given my crappy cast
> aluminium, was really nice.
>
> My mill does have a coolant pump but I don't know if I use the mill often
> enough to fill the reservoir with coolant that then goes mouldy and
> stinky.  So I'm working on a compressed air mist coolant system.  But maybe
> having a secondary reservoir that pumps out the main one and adds an
> aquarium bubbler would work for the flood system.  So in the last 12 years
> I've never used coolant.
>
> John
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: andrew beck [mailto:andrewbeck0...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: November-03-21 10:52 PM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress
> >
> > What cutters are you using?
> >
> > As a sideline here in New Zealand I buy and sell tooling so I'm always
> > testing the limits.
> >
> > And can probably advise a bit
> >
> > On Thu, 4 Nov 2021, 11:29 John Dammeyer,  wrote:
> >
> > > I've been using LCNC quite a bit (for me).   In the photo there are two
> > > steel spring collars that were entirely done with the mill.  I could
> have
> > > left them as large disks with just a stepped hole and the set screw
> holes
> > > but what's the fun in that.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/SpindleControl/TrialFitOnSpindleCover-1.jpg
> > >
> > > The spindle cover casting (10lbs of scrap aluminium) was machined in
> the
> > > places I needed flat surfaces and to get rid of a bit of sag in the
> casting
> > > mostly for looks.  I'd occasionally spray a bit of WD-40 but mostly
> just
> > > held the shop vac to clean up the chips.
> > >
> > >
> http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/SpindleControl/SpindleCoverplate-4.jpg
> > >
> > > Essentially between 1000 and 2000 RPM, 2 flute 1/2" end mill, 25% step
> > > over, about 2.5 to 5 IPM IPM and a depth of cut of about 0.1" for each
> > > pass.  This created chips that did not melt onto the tool bit and left
> a
> > > quite nice smooth finish.
> > >
> > > But with those parameters it did take quite a while.  OTOH, it ran
> > > automatically and other than check on it periodically and vacuum or
> blow
> > > away chips I could do other things nearby.
> > >
> > > If I enter the parameters into Machinist Toolbox with a target RPM of
> 1500
> > > I see it suggests a tool feed rate of 21 IPM.  I think that would melt
> the
> > > chips without flood coolant.  Since I didn't want to screw it up and
> have
> > > to cast it all over again I was very conservative.
> > >
> > > Was I too conservative on this?   It's been suggested by a friend who
> runs
> > > MACH3 that he dials in a much faster feed and spindle rate and then
> hauls
> > > back on the sliders to reduce it to very slow and then in small steps
> bumps
> > > up the speed until it feels right.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Suggestions are welcome.
> > > Thanks
> > > John
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

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Re: [Emc-users] Prox sensors and wiring

[andrew beck]

Or from the servo drive suppliers.  In China you can get good quality
aviation connectors for like 7usd.

That's what I use and I buy cable from them to.

I have a guy that buys it all up for me and ships from one place.

On Thu, 4 Nov 2021, 21:20 Chris Albertson, 
wrote:

> I bought some of the proximity detectors for my 3D printer to measure the
> bed.I tested them on my mill by moving them untillthey tripped, backing
> off and doing it again to see how repeatable they are.Even the cheap
> no-=brand unit where as good as my ability to measure them.   Set up a test
> using a dial indicator.
>
> The absolute trip point was some random distance, all you care about is how
> repeatable they are.
>
> The one I liked is mounted in M12x1 threads.  I bought am M12x1 tap to make
> a mounting block
>
> The usual connector is called an "Aviation Plug".  they come in different
> diameters and with different amounts of pins.  The smaller size is enough
> for signals and the larger ones can handle motor current.They come in
> different quality levels too. The cheap Chinese ones are "good enough" but
> the American ones are precision made and have rubber gaskets.  Prices are
> about $3.50 for the cheap ones (on eBay or Amazon) and about $35 for the
> best quality ones (at Mc Master Carr and the like).
>
> The cheap plugs are made of something like chromed zinc and look cheap but
> work surprisingly well.   The best one are made of machined an
> green-primmered aluminum and have the quality you'd expect for an $80 per
> mating par part.   They are also sold with engineering-grade plastic
> housing
>
> On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 10:01 PM Ralph Stirling <
> ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu> wrote:
>
> > I have finally started stripping out the control cabinet on my cnc mill
> in
> > preparation for my retrofit.  The brushed servos and mechanical limit and
> > home switches were wired up with crimped "bullet" quick connect pins.
> I'm
> > replacing the servos with brushless servos, and am considering replacing
> > the mechanical switches with inductive prox sensors (pnp, nc type).  All
> > the old wires are sticky with coolant and metal chips.
> >
> > So, I am interested to hear what other lcnc retrofitters have found works
> > well for modest priced coolant proof connectors (3 or 4 pin), and
> opinions
> > on cheap Chinese prox sensors (since the name brand ones are so
> expensive,
> > even on ebay).  An example is:
> >
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/US-5Pcs-NC-PNP-LJ18A3-8-Z-AY-Inductive-Proximity-Sensor-Switch-DC6V-36V-/143861840692
> >
> > Photos (rather unorganized) of the retrofit are at:
> > https://photos.app.goo.gl/yBSRVf3QAVUK39PC7
> >
> > Thanks,
> > -- Ralph
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
>
> --
>
> Chris Albertson
> Redondo Beach, California
>
> ___
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

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Re: [Emc-users] Prox sensors and wiring

[Chris Albertson]

I bought some of the proximity detectors for my 3D printer to measure the
bed.I tested them on my mill by moving them untillthey tripped, backing
off and doing it again to see how repeatable they are.Even the cheap
no-=brand unit where as good as my ability to measure them.   Set up a test
using a dial indicator.

The absolute trip point was some random distance, all you care about is how
repeatable they are.

The one I liked is mounted in M12x1 threads.  I bought am M12x1 tap to make
a mounting block

The usual connector is called an "Aviation Plug".  they come in different
diameters and with different amounts of pins.  The smaller size is enough
for signals and the larger ones can handle motor current.They come in
different quality levels too. The cheap Chinese ones are "good enough" but
the American ones are precision made and have rubber gaskets.  Prices are
about $3.50 for the cheap ones (on eBay or Amazon) and about $35 for the
best quality ones (at Mc Master Carr and the like).

The cheap plugs are made of something like chromed zinc and look cheap but
work surprisingly well.   The best one are made of machined an
green-primmered aluminum and have the quality you'd expect for an $80 per
mating par part.   They are also sold with engineering-grade plastic housing

On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 10:01 PM Ralph Stirling <
ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu> wrote:

> I have finally started stripping out the control cabinet on my cnc mill in
> preparation for my retrofit.  The brushed servos and mechanical limit and
> home switches were wired up with crimped "bullet" quick connect pins.  I'm
> replacing the servos with brushless servos, and am considering replacing
> the mechanical switches with inductive prox sensors (pnp, nc type).  All
> the old wires are sticky with coolant and metal chips.
>
> So, I am interested to hear what other lcnc retrofitters have found works
> well for modest priced coolant proof connectors (3 or 4 pin), and opinions
> on cheap Chinese prox sensors (since the name brand ones are so expensive,
> even on ebay).  An example is:
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/US-5Pcs-NC-PNP-LJ18A3-8-Z-AY-Inductive-Proximity-Sensor-Switch-DC6V-36V-/143861840692
>
> Photos (rather unorganized) of the retrofit are at:
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/yBSRVf3QAVUK39PC7
>
> Thanks,
> -- Ralph
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>


-- 

Chris Albertson
Redondo Beach, California

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Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 04 November 2021 03:44:54 Marcus Bowman wrote:

> John,
>
> I always use single flute router-style cutters (Accupro, from MSC
> Industrial  at www.mscdirect.co.uk) which are specifically designed
> for machining aluminium and are highly polished so the aluminium will
> not stick to the flutes. These are jolly expensive cutters, and other
> makes are available, etc. I would not use an 'ordinary' endmill on
> aluminium (unless you keep your jar of caustic soda handy to dissolve
> the welded-on chips in the flutes).I would use a 10 or 12mm cutter at
> 2000-3000 rpm, so the tooth peripheral linear speed is a bit faster
> than your speeds. I am not using flood coolant, for the same reasons
> as you, but do use neat cutting oil around the area being cut. Running
> at the same feedrate as you, I would probably take a cut of 50 to 100%
> of what you are taking, for roughing, although bear n mind that is a
> tooth loading of twice what you are using (1 tooth versus 2). Linear
> speed around the same as you, at 120 - 200mm/min. All cuts are climb
> cuts, in aluminium.

I use most any old carbide mill of around 3 mill or 1/8" in my 6040 at 
revs up to 20k and have not lost 1 single mill since building a mister, 
It uses about 2 ounces an hour of heavily diluted koolmist and water. 
Just enough to keep the tool and alu plate damp. It doesn't take much.

> Marcus
>
> On 4 Nov 2021, at 06:34, John Dammeyer wrote:
> > I used the big 1/2" one for the large pocket and the smaller 5mm one
> > for the smaller pocket and profile.  The surface finish, given my
> > crappy cast aluminium, was really nice.
> >
> > My mill does have a coolant pump but I don't know if I use the mill
> > often enough to fill the reservoir with coolant that then goes
> > mouldy and stinky.  So I'm working on a compressed air mist coolant
> > system.  But maybe having a secondary reservoir that pumps out the
> > main one and adds an aquarium bubbler would work for the flood
> > system.  So in the last 12 years I've never used coolant.
> >
> > John
> >
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: andrew beck [mailto:andrewbeck0...@gmail.com]
> >> Sent: November-03-21 10:52 PM
> >> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> >> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress
> >>
> >> What cutters are you using?
> >>
> >> As a sideline here in New Zealand I buy and sell tooling so I'm
> >> always testing the limits.
> >>
> >> And can probably advise a bit
> >>
> >> On Thu, 4 Nov 2021, 11:29 John Dammeyer,  
wrote:
> >>> I've been using LCNC quite a bit (for me).   In the photo there
> >>> are two steel spring collars that were entirely done with the
> >>> mill.  I could have left them as large disks with just a stepped
> >>> hole and the set screw holes but what's the fun in that.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/SpindleControl/TrialFitOnSpindleC
> >>>over-1.jpg
> >>>
> >>> The spindle cover casting (10lbs of scrap aluminium) was machined
> >>> in the places I needed flat surfaces and to get rid of a bit of
> >>> sag in the casting mostly for looks.  I'd occasionally spray a bit
> >>> of WD-40 but mostly just held the shop vac to clean up the chips.
> >>>
> >>> http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/SpindleControl/SpindleCoverplate-
> >>>4.jpg
> >>>
> >>> Essentially between 1000 and 2000 RPM, 2 flute 1/2" end mill, 25%
> >>> step over, about 2.5 to 5 IPM IPM and a depth of cut of about 0.1"
> >>> for each pass.  This created chips that did not melt onto the tool
> >>> bit and left a quite nice smooth finish.
> >>>
> >>> But with those parameters it did take quite a while.  OTOH, it ran
> >>> automatically and other than check on it periodically and vacuum
> >>> or blow away chips I could do other things nearby.
> >>>
> >>> If I enter the parameters into Machinist Toolbox with a target RPM
> >>> of 1500 I see it suggests a tool feed rate of 21 IPM.  I think
> >>> that would melt the chips without flood coolant.  Since I didn't
> >>> want to screw it up and have to cast it all over again I was very
> >>> conservative.
> >>>
> >>> Was I too conservative on this?   It's been suggested by a friend
> >>> who runs MACH3 that he dials in a much faster feed and spindle
> >>> rate and then hauls back on the sliders to reduce it to very slow
> >>> and then in small steps bumps up the speed until it feels right.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Suggestions are welcome.
> >>> Thanks
> >>> John
> >>> ___
> >>> Emc-users mailing list
> >>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Emc-users mailing list
> >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There a

Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress

[Marcus Bowman]

John,

I always use single flute router-style cutters (Accupro, from MSC Industrial  
at www.mscdirect.co.uk) which are specifically designed for machining aluminium 
and are highly polished so the aluminium will not stick to the flutes. These 
are jolly expensive cutters, and other makes are available, etc. I would not 
use an 'ordinary' endmill on aluminium (unless you keep your jar of caustic 
soda handy to dissolve the welded-on chips in the flutes).I would use a 10 or 
12mm cutter at 2000-3000 rpm, so the tooth peripheral linear speed is a bit 
faster than your speeds. I am not using flood coolant, for the same reasons as 
you, but do use neat cutting oil around the area being cut. Running at the same 
feedrate as you, I would probably take a cut of 50 to 100% of what you are 
taking, for roughing, although bear n mind that is a tooth loading of twice 
what you are using (1 tooth versus 2). Linear speed around the same as you, at 
120 - 200mm/min. All cuts are climb cuts, in aluminium.

Marcus

On 4 Nov 2021, at 06:34, John Dammeyer wrote:

> I used the big 1/2" one for the large pocket and the smaller 5mm one for the 
> smaller pocket and profile.  The surface finish, given my crappy cast 
> aluminium, was really nice.
> 
> My mill does have a coolant pump but I don't know if I use the mill often 
> enough to fill the reservoir with coolant that then goes mouldy and stinky.  
> So I'm working on a compressed air mist coolant system.  But maybe having a 
> secondary reservoir that pumps out the main one and adds an aquarium bubbler 
> would work for the flood system.  So in the last 12 years I've never used 
> coolant.
> 
> John
> 
> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: andrew beck [mailto:andrewbeck0...@gmail.com]
>> Sent: November-03-21 10:52 PM
>> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
>> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Project Progress
>> 
>> What cutters are you using?
>> 
>> As a sideline here in New Zealand I buy and sell tooling so I'm always
>> testing the limits.
>> 
>> And can probably advise a bit
>> 
>> On Thu, 4 Nov 2021, 11:29 John Dammeyer,  wrote:
>> 
>>> I've been using LCNC quite a bit (for me).   In the photo there are two
>>> steel spring collars that were entirely done with the mill.  I could have
>>> left them as large disks with just a stepped hole and the set screw holes
>>> but what's the fun in that.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/SpindleControl/TrialFitOnSpindleCover-1.jpg
>>> 
>>> The spindle cover casting (10lbs of scrap aluminium) was machined in the
>>> places I needed flat surfaces and to get rid of a bit of sag in the casting
>>> mostly for looks.  I'd occasionally spray a bit of WD-40 but mostly just
>>> held the shop vac to clean up the chips.
>>> 
>>> http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/SpindleControl/SpindleCoverplate-4.jpg
>>> 
>>> Essentially between 1000 and 2000 RPM, 2 flute 1/2" end mill, 25% step
>>> over, about 2.5 to 5 IPM IPM and a depth of cut of about 0.1" for each
>>> pass.  This created chips that did not melt onto the tool bit and left a
>>> quite nice smooth finish.
>>> 
>>> But with those parameters it did take quite a while.  OTOH, it ran
>>> automatically and other than check on it periodically and vacuum or blow
>>> away chips I could do other things nearby.
>>> 
>>> If I enter the parameters into Machinist Toolbox with a target RPM of 1500
>>> I see it suggests a tool feed rate of 21 IPM.  I think that would melt the
>>> chips without flood coolant.  Since I didn't want to screw it up and have
>>> to cast it all over again I was very conservative.
>>> 
>>> Was I too conservative on this?   It's been suggested by a friend who runs
>>> MACH3 that he dials in a much faster feed and spindle rate and then hauls
>>> back on the sliders to reduce it to very slow and then in small steps bumps
>>> up the speed until it feels right.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Suggestions are welcome.
>>> Thanks
>>> John
>>> ___
>>> Emc-users mailing list
>>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>> 
>> 
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