Re: [Emc-users] Lathe Spindle Drive Questions

[Sam Sokolik]

Is there a reduction?  What is the rated rpm?

On Mon, Jul 26, 2021, 6:03 PM andrew beck  wrote:

>  I would suggest a closed loop ac Vfd drive with encoder.  They are
> awesome.
>
> I normally. Buy schiender altivar 71 drives cheap second hand.
>
> But most brands have them.
>
> Second option is a open loop vector control Vfd.  They are pretty good.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jul 27, 2021, 10:55 AM Earl Weaver 
> wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> > I have a lathe spindle with 8 in. chuck that is run with a 5HP Reliance
> > DC Motor and Reliance DC Drive.
> > I just cannot get much power out of it at low RPM. Was trying to turn
> > 8in OD steel, at approx. 200 -250 RPM with .005 in. cut. It didn't work,
> > it just stalled.
> > When I run it at low RPM the chuck rotation is movable, not firm.
> > I can take a hold of the chuck and hold it and move it back and forth as
> > it rotates.
> > It also is more noisy at low RPM.
> >
> > This lathe is a Linuxcnc retrofit with J Elson's  Universal PWM
> > Controller and DAC Spindle control.
> > The DC drive has tachometer feedback from the motor.
> > I have tried numerous times to adjust, tune the drive, without success.
> > I also tried closed loop control from the spindle encoder within LCNC,
> > also no success.
> >
> > So here come the questions:
> > Should I keep trying to get this DC Drive working or would it be better
> > to switch to  AC Variable Frequency Drive?
> > If I would switch to AC VFD would 5HP AC Motor  be sufficient size for
> > existing 1:1 ratio double v belt to drive 8" spindle chuck?
> > What torque at low RPM can I expect for this 5HP DC motor? am I
> > expecting to much from it?
> > Would there be a better drive option for the existing DC motor?
> > Any recommendations?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > --
> > Earl Weaver
> > Email: weaverst...@frontier.com 
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Something went wrong.

[Sam Sokolik]

Are these running single ended?  Have you tried it with the spindle
running?

sam

On Sat, Aug 7, 2021 at 11:33 AM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> Hi Jon,
> > From: Jon Elson [mailto:el...@pico-systems.com]
> > On 8/4/21 1:53 AM, John Dammeyer wrote:
> > > In fact, a bit more work just now shows that the X axis is losing
> position in the positive(?) direction.   So on each return to X0 after a
> > bunch of jogging back and forth (even without backlash enabled) shows as
> high an error as -0.156".  And it's cumulative increasing in
> > the negative count direction.
> > >
> > > That wasn't there when I first changed from the US Digital Encoders to
> the CUI encoders.  So either the encoder is slipping on the
> > shaft or the way the wires are run is creating noise that changes the
> encoder values.
> > >
> > Yes, you have some sort of issue there.� The CUI encoders
> > have a plastic collet that has a clamp ring that has to be
> > snapped down quite forcefully to close the collet on the
> > shaft.� Sometimes the molding is not precise and the collet
> > doesn't grip well.� Some people put a drop of superglue on
> > the shaft to make sure it holds.� I hope you can find the issue.
> >
> > Jon
>
> I pulled the motor off the machine and then removed the encoder part.  No
> matter how hard I tried I could not rotate the plastic collet that turns
> the encoder disk.  On solid.  No super glue needed here.
>
> Decided I'd put it back together and use the instructions Henrik Olsson
> gave me on interpreting the GP, GE and GT commands to his processor
> module.  Figured I would see if the 150,000 encoder counts were occurring
> in a 10" move in both directions or if just in one.
>
> Wouldn't you know it.  Works perfectly again.  Doesn't matter how much
> jogging I do a 10" move in either direction from 0.000" to 10.000" reports
> as 150,000 encoder counts;  as it should.  Now once again the DRO-350 and
> LCNC agree.
>
> Since I didn't change anything I can only assume that perhaps the teensy
> tiny connector to the encoder has a poor crimp on one of the pins and the
> vibration over time caused an erratic connection.  Pulling it out and
> putting it back in resulted in it (temporarily?) being properly connected
> and now things work again.
>
> I guess I'm going to have to wait until it once again screws up
> positioning while making something.  Then only remove the encoder cap,
> unplug and plug in the tiny connector and see if the problem is fixed
> again.  And I'm going to make up a second DB-15 to CUI connector for inside
> the end cap just in case it's intermittent that becomes permanent.
>
> John Dammeyer
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] jerk control

[Sam Sokolik]

I am going to ask a stuid question..  If you have a velocity run step gen
with pid.   Couldn't you hook a limit3 between the pid and steghen.
Because the input is velocity instead of position - wouldn't the
acceleration limit in the limit3 be jerk instead of acceleration?   I am
sure it doesn't work that way.. I was just thinking you have moved the
derivatives up one..

(I can tell you it doesn't seem to work in practice - probably because the
pid will always try to correct the error.  Like maybe you would need to
negate the limit3 amount on the feedback side..)

On Tue, Aug 17, 2021 at 1:28 PM Scott Harwell via Emc-users <
emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:

>  I haven't tried it yet, but this looks promising.
> LinuxCNC S-Curve Accelerations
>
>
>
> Scott H
>
>
> On Tuesday, August 17, 2021, 12:57:06 PM CDT, Ralph Stirling <
> ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu> wrote:
>
>  I've also been hoping to see this appear in a Linuxcnc update,
> as it has been worked on by a number of people for years.
> Here are the most recent threads about jerk-limited trajectory planning:
>
>
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/40152-jerk-limited-trajectory-planner-hal-component
>
>
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/38-general-linuxcnc-questions/34666-c2-smooth-velocity-profile?start=0
>
> -- Ralph
> 
> From: David Berndt [ber...@uberwin.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2021 9:01 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC); andrew beck
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] jerk control
>
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> email system.
>
>
> I don't have a great need for it with my machines, or the time/brains to
> implement it. It just seems like a feature we really should have.
>
>   I'd be willing to participate monetarily in some sort of system to
> incentivize the inclusion of jerk control. Perhaps an open-source feature
> bounty? Does the community want to consider that sort of thing?
>
> -Dave
>
> On Mon, 16 Aug 2021 23:06:05 -0400, andrew beck 
> wrote:
>
> > hey guys
> >
> > I am sitting here watching my cnc mill atm its shaking quite a bit
> > acceleration is 600mm/sec2  which is not that high i think.  compared to
> > every other cnc mill i have used with a commercial controller.  they have
> > jerk control and work much better.  so looking forward to when we get
> > jerk
> > control here on linuxcnc!
> >
> > but in the mean time i need a poor mans jerk control and thinking of a
> > limit on the pid output to chop down the initial acceleration for the
> > first
> > moment in time just so little moves don't shake it to death
> >
> > andy mentioned that I could maybe use a limit component to limit the
> > initial acceleration for the first tiny moment in time to cut down on the
> > vibrations.
> >
> > how do you guys think that could work?
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Andrew
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7C7457b9607a2d4747a1e508d961a1b508%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637648169423748846%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=ue%2BwIaVhfay08NBevlCAvyOoNp0qVz9ojUuigRuCOOs%3D&reserved=0
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7C7457b9607a2d4747a1e508d961a1b508%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637648169423748846%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=ue%2BwIaVhfay08NBevlCAvyOoNp0qVz9ojUuigRuCOOs%3D&reserved=0
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] jerk control

[Sam Sokolik]

It would be the same setup...  Just using servo amps..   Velocity out of
the pid - position back from the encoders.

On Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 8:14 PM andrew beck  wrote:

> Not sure Sam.
>
> I have a 7i77 on this mill though also.  So analog control
>
> On Wed, Aug 18, 2021, 12:51 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>
> > I am going to ask a stuid question..  If you have a velocity run step gen
> > with pid.   Couldn't you hook a limit3 between the pid and steghen.
> > Because the input is velocity instead of position - wouldn't the
> > acceleration limit in the limit3 be jerk instead of acceleration?   I am
> > sure it doesn't work that way.. I was just thinking you have moved the
> > derivatives up one..
> >
> > (I can tell you it doesn't seem to work in practice - probably because
> the
> > pid will always try to correct the error.  Like maybe you would need to
> > negate the limit3 amount on the feedback side..)
> >
> > On Tue, Aug 17, 2021 at 1:28 PM Scott Harwell via Emc-users <
> > emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:
> >
> > >  I haven't tried it yet, but this looks promising.
> > > LinuxCNC S-Curve Accelerations
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Scott H
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tuesday, August 17, 2021, 12:57:06 PM CDT, Ralph Stirling <
> > > ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu> wrote:
> > >
> > >  I've also been hoping to see this appear in a Linuxcnc update,
> > > as it has been worked on by a number of people for years.
> > > Here are the most recent threads about jerk-limited trajectory
> planning:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/40152-jerk-limited-trajectory-planner-hal-component
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/38-general-linuxcnc-questions/34666-c2-smooth-velocity-profile?start=0
> > >
> > > -- Ralph
> > > 
> > > From: David Berndt [ber...@uberwin.com]
> > > Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2021 9:01 AM
> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC); andrew beck
> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] jerk control
> > >
> > > CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> > > email system.
> > >
> > >
> > > I don't have a great need for it with my machines, or the time/brains
> to
> > > implement it. It just seems like a feature we really should have.
> > >
> > >   I'd be willing to participate monetarily in some sort of system to
> > > incentivize the inclusion of jerk control. Perhaps an open-source
> feature
> > > bounty? Does the community want to consider that sort of thing?
> > >
> > > -Dave
> > >
> > > On Mon, 16 Aug 2021 23:06:05 -0400, andrew beck <
> > andrewbeck0...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > hey guys
> > > >
> > > > I am sitting here watching my cnc mill atm its shaking quite a bit
> > > > acceleration is 600mm/sec2  which is not that high i think.  compared
> > to
> > > > every other cnc mill i have used with a commercial controller.  they
> > have
> > > > jerk control and work much better.  so looking forward to when we get
> > > > jerk
> > > > control here on linuxcnc!
> > > >
> > > > but in the mean time i need a poor mans jerk control and thinking of
> a
> > > > limit on the pid output to chop down the initial acceleration for the
> > > > first
> > > > moment in time just so little moves don't shake it to death
> > > >
> > > > andy mentioned that I could maybe use a limit component to limit the
> > > > initial acceleration for the first tiny moment in time to cut down on
> > the
> > > > vibrations.
> > > >
> > > > how do you guys think that could work?
> > > >
> > > > Regards
> > > >
> > > > Andrew
> > > >
> > > > ___
> > > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7C7457b9607a2d4747a1e508d961a1b508%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debf

Re: [Emc-users] jerk control

[Sam Sokolik]

Default is 50...  These are what can be tweeked in the tp..


http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/config/ini-config.html#sec:traj-section

On Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 8:49 PM Feral Engineer 
wrote:

> I'm curious what the current level of block lookahead is on lcnc compared
> to commercial controls. Anyone know the amount of data buffering that it
> can handle?
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
>
> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
> www.patreon.com/theferalengineer
>
> On Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:36 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>
> > It would be the same setup...  Just using servo amps..   Velocity out of
> > the pid - position back from the encoders.
> >
> > On Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 8:14 PM andrew beck 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Not sure Sam.
> > >
> > > I have a 7i77 on this mill though also.  So analog control
> > >
> > > On Wed, Aug 18, 2021, 12:51 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> > >
> > > > I am going to ask a stuid question..  If you have a velocity run step
> > gen
> > > > with pid.   Couldn't you hook a limit3 between the pid and steghen.
> > > > Because the input is velocity instead of position - wouldn't the
> > > > acceleration limit in the limit3 be jerk instead of acceleration?   I
> > am
> > > > sure it doesn't work that way.. I was just thinking you have moved
> the
> > > > derivatives up one..
> > > >
> > > > (I can tell you it doesn't seem to work in practice - probably
> because
> > > the
> > > > pid will always try to correct the error.  Like maybe you would need
> to
> > > > negate the limit3 amount on the feedback side..)
> > > >
> > > > On Tue, Aug 17, 2021 at 1:28 PM Scott Harwell via Emc-users <
> > > > emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >  I haven't tried it yet, but this looks promising.
> > > > > LinuxCNC S-Curve Accelerations
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Scott H
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Tuesday, August 17, 2021, 12:57:06 PM CDT, Ralph Stirling <
> > > > > ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >  I've also been hoping to see this appear in a Linuxcnc update,
> > > > > as it has been worked on by a number of people for years.
> > > > > Here are the most recent threads about jerk-limited trajectory
> > > planning:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/40152-jerk-limited-trajectory-planner-hal-component
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/38-general-linuxcnc-questions/34666-c2-smooth-velocity-profile?start=0
> > > > >
> > > > > -- Ralph
> > > > > 
> > > > > From: David Berndt [ber...@uberwin.com]
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2021 9:01 AM
> > > > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC); andrew beck
> > > > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] jerk control
> > > > >
> > > > > CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla
> > University
> > > > > email system.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't have a great need for it with my machines, or the
> time/brains
> > > to
> > > > > implement it. It just seems like a feature we really should have.
> > > > >
> > > > >   I'd be willing to participate monetarily in some sort of system
> to
> > > > > incentivize the inclusion of jerk control. Perhaps an open-source
> > > feature
> > > > > bounty? Does the community want to consider that sort of thing?
> > > > >
> > > > > -Dave
> > > > >
> > > > > On Mon, 16 Aug 2021 23:06:05 -0400, andrew beck <
> > > > andrewbeck0...@gmail.com>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > hey guys
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I am sitting here watching my cnc mill atm its shaking quite a
> bit
> > > >

Re: [Emc-users] Force homed signal

[Sam Sokolik]

Pretty sure you can do this where you set the home position at homing.  (So
it doesn't move). The k&t homes to 38",34"',24 respectively..  it sets
those positions but doesn't then move anywhere else.

On Tue, Aug 31, 2021, 2:04 AM Marius  wrote:

>
> On 2021/08/31 03:25, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:
> > Hi Marius,
> >
> > Are you driving your A axis with steppers or servos? What are you using
> as
> > the physical home switch?
> >
> > You can always fool the homing sequence at least into some extent. I
> wanted
> > to use servos in open loop but that was incompatible with homing with
> > index. So I bypassed the home switch for the final detection, and then
> > feeded the index pulse of the servos making LCNC believe it was the home
> > switch. May be you can implement something like that.
> >
> > El lun, 30 ago 2021 a las 9:23, Marius ()
> escribió:
>
>
> It uses steppers and there is no home switch. The machine was built for
> Mach3 and they used a pin to lock the rotary axis in a known place. Then
> they applied an offset to put the axis in the zero position. This
> position was not where the pin locked the axis. My problem is that I can
> apply the pin before the homing cycle starts but I cannot release it
> before the offset is applied to the axis at the end of the homing cycle.
>
> >> Hi
> >>
> >> I am trying to create my own homing sequence on the A axis in Gmoccapy.
> >> Is there a way to set the "homed" signal to true once I have done my
> >> sequence?
> >>
> >> Regards
> >>
> >> Marius
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Emc-users mailing list
> >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >>
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] Minimally printed rotary. Initial torque testing..

[Sam Sokolik]

Small update

https://youtu.be/eW1GGI55Epc

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Minimally printed rotary. Initial torque testing..

[Sam Sokolik]

I agree with the quick math I did yesterday...   But again I have no info
on these steppers..

And yes - I think it is totally usable at 35 ft-lbs..  there is some
friction there also running the 'wave' generator...

On Mon, Sep 13, 2021, 12:26 PM John Dammeyer  wrote:

> Nice update.
> My math works out as follows:
> 35 lb-ft is 35 * 12"/ft * 16 oz/lb = 6720 oz-in.
> You said the ratio is 100:1 so that means to get 6720 you only input 67.2
> oz-in.  That's about 1/3 of what you suspect your motor can do.
>
> Something is wrong with this picture then.  Especially since you were
> effectively using static torque rather than the much lower torque when the
> motor is turning at say 400 RPM.  With micro-stepping you also get a
> reduction in full step torque because the max current is now 0.707 x full
> torque.  And without closed loop encoder feedback you can quite easily have
> to micro-step a number of times before you see physical motion.
>
> None of that matters other than that you have shown your mechanics can
> handle 35 lb-ft which is all in all pretty cool !
>
> John
>
>
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: September-12-21 5:50 PM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: [Emc-users] Minimally printed rotary. Initial torque testing..
> >
> > Small update
> >
> > https://youtu.be/eW1GGI55Epc
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] DC Servo issues

[Sam Sokolik]

I have never used servo drives that close the loop..   I have always had
great luck with normal closed loop within linuxcnc.  (cheap used amc
drives)

(Actually - I take that back - I have used the stmbl drives. so far only
for a spindle..)

This is of course using mesa analog interface hardware.

The only time I had issues with encoder counting was when I thought I could
get by with single ended encoders going over 8 ft...

Look at something like this..  2 counts per rev,  2 axis with 4000?
counts per rev...  (and the encoders came installed on the servo, single
ended and I think they are us-digital)
If I was missing counts during these complicated sync moves - you would
certainly see it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4sKHBh6rDk

(plus no 3rd party software to tune...)  - Granted you have the drives and
are familiar with them - at what point do you give up?

sam

On Sun, Sep 19, 2021 at 12:59 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> Hi Rick,
> It may also have something to do with the DC Servo drive electronics.
> Although it's differential encoder signalling the design may have internal
> issues that are somewhat corrected by the Henk Olsson module.  I had both a
> small electrolytic and ceramic capacitors right by the US Digital encoders,
> which BTW, have been discontinued for a few years.  Perhaps that's why?
> Issues?
>
> I swapped the X and Y motor/encoder pair and sure enough the problem moved
> to the Y axis along with now only 120 IPM instead of 150 IPM.  Above that I
> get following errors.  Given that this motor has a higher winding
> resistance I'm going to guess it's not a 90VDC motor but is more likely a
> 180VDC motor that was shipped as a 90VDC.   Maybe the loading introduces
> noise in one direction that fools the quadrature encoder.  It's very
> strange that the following errors are only in one direction.
>
> At $145US plus shipping, since Automation Technologies won't replace it,
> I'm going to cast a new mounting plate for one of the slightly smaller
> 1.27NM Bergerda AC servos.  They were destined for the ball screw upgrade
> (and I'd ordered the wrong size thinking they were the same torque as the
> DC ones).  So we'll see.  If the Bergerda does well on the heavier Y axis
> then problem solved.
>
> More as it unfolds.
>
> Oh I swapped motor/encoder sets between X and Y,and with the Y motor
> running the X axis the test program that runs the table back and forth no
> longer has a slightly different sound between changing direction CW
> compared to CCW.  So it appears that's also on the motor and not LinuxCNC
> nor the MESA.  And absolutely no errors in position on X.  Only now on the
> Y instead.  That lets the HP_UHU servo drive off the hook too.
>
> John
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Rick Moscoloni [mailto:rmoscol...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: September-19-21 10:12 AM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] DC Servo issues
> >
> > us digital encoders with a capacitor across dc+and- works without a
> > fault
> >
> > El dom, 19 sept 2021 a las 2:49, John Dammeyer ( >)
> > escribi�:
> >
> > > Over 10 years ago I bought two of these for the XY axis of the mill.
> > >
> > >
> https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/dc-servo-motor/nema34-1125ozin-dual-shaft-servo-motor
> > >
> > > Also from US Digital the 250 line encoders.
> > > I had assembled HP_UHU kits and had on standby the Henrik Olsson
> > > replacement PIC processor modules although this photo shows the
> original
> > > processor.
> > > http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/HP_UHU_Modified.jpg
> > >
> > > One of the things that showed up right away was that with identical
> drives
> > > one motor ran hotter than the other.  Further investigation showed the
> > > resistance of the windings was different with the warmer motor having
> the
> > > lower resistance and inductance which matched the spec sheet.  By then
> it
> > > was too late to return the high resistance one so I decided to put what
> > > appeared to be the on spec motor on the Y axis since it had to carry
> more
> > > weight.  The X axis got the cooler and higher resistance motor.
> > >
> > > When I finally got it all together I had a lot of position errors and
> > > Henrik convinced me to trash the US Digital encoders which appeared to
> be
> > > losing counts and replace them with the CUI.  Changing to Henrik's
> module
> > > improved things and positioning was now reasonably accurate.  Until a
> short
> > > while ago on the X axis.
> > >
> > > I pulled the encoder off remounted things and the problem seemed to go
> > > away.  Well last week, after the center drilled holes were off from
> where
> > > the 1/4" drill bit went down I realized the problem had returned.
> After
> > > much mucking around it seems that the real issue is still with that X
> axis
> > > out of spec motor.
> > >
> > > What I did is swap motor+encoder from X <=> Y.  The cumulative position
> > > errors on X are now gone so that shows the HP_UHU dr

Re: [Emc-users] DC Servo issues

[Sam Sokolik]

Lol..  I certainly love the electrics part more than the machining most of
the time...

On Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 2:07 PM John Dammeyer  wrote:

> Hi Sam,
> See below.
> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> >
> > I have never used servo drives that close the loop..   I have always had
> > great luck with normal closed loop within linuxcnc.  (cheap used amc
> > drives)
> >
> > (Actually - I take that back - I have used the stmbl drives. so far only
> > for a spindle..)
> >
> > This is of course using mesa analog interface hardware.
> >
> > The only time I had issues with encoder counting was when I thought I
> could
> > get by with single ended encoders going over 8 ft...
> >
> > Look at something like this..  2 counts per rev,  2 axis with 4000?
> > counts per rev...  (and the encoders came installed on the servo, single
> > ended and I think they are us-digital)
> > If I was missing counts during these complicated sync moves - you would
> > certainly see it.
> >
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4sKHBh6rDk
> >
> > (plus no 3rd party software to tune...)  - Granted you have the drives
> and
> > are familiar with them - at what point do you give up?
> >
> > sam
>
> That's the question.  One possibility to try is to grab 110VAC line
> voltage. Put a bridge and caps on it and drive that motor with more than
> the 105VDC power supply.  I'll have to check if my transistors are rated
> for the 165VDC rectified voltage and I really would rather have them be
> 250V transitors.   And then there's the filters on the board too. The UHU
> circuit was originally for up to about 75V.  The HP_UHU came about for
> higher voltage drives;  Just don't know if I built mine for more than
> 125VDC although the circuit design parts are for 11A.
>
> I _have_ tried one these motors with the STMBL but could never get it
> tuned and support from the designers was inadequate to help me so I gave
> up.
>
> I'd rather be machining...
>
> John
>
>
>
> >
> > On Sun, Sep 19, 2021 at 12:59 PM John Dammeyer 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Rick,
> > > It may also have something to do with the DC Servo drive electronics.
> > > Although it's differential encoder signalling the design may have
> internal
> > > issues that are somewhat corrected by the Henk Olsson module.  I had
> both a
> > > small electrolytic and ceramic capacitors right by the US Digital
> encoders,
> > > which BTW, have been discontinued for a few years.  Perhaps that's why?
> > > Issues?
> > >
> > > I swapped the X and Y motor/encoder pair and sure enough the problem
> moved
> > > to the Y axis along with now only 120 IPM instead of 150 IPM.  Above
> that I
> > > get following errors.  Given that this motor has a higher winding
> > > resistance I'm going to guess it's not a 90VDC motor but is more
> likely a
> > > 180VDC motor that was shipped as a 90VDC.   Maybe the loading
> introduces
> > > noise in one direction that fools the quadrature encoder.  It's very
> > > strange that the following errors are only in one direction.
> > >
> > > At $145US plus shipping, since Automation Technologies won't replace
> it,
> > > I'm going to cast a new mounting plate for one of the slightly smaller
> > > 1.27NM Bergerda AC servos.  They were destined for the ball screw
> upgrade
> > > (and I'd ordered the wrong size thinking they were the same torque as
> the
> > > DC ones).  So we'll see.  If the Bergerda does well on the heavier Y
> axis
> > > then problem solved.
> > >
> > > More as it unfolds.
> > >
> > > Oh I swapped motor/encoder sets between X and Y,and with the Y motor
> > > running the X axis the test program that runs the table back and forth
> no
> > > longer has a slightly different sound between changing direction CW
> > > compared to CCW.  So it appears that's also on the motor and not
> LinuxCNC
> > > nor the MESA.  And absolutely no errors in position on X.  Only now on
> the
> > > Y instead.  That lets the HP_UHU servo drive off the hook too.
> > >
> > > John
> > >
> > > > -Original Message-
> > > > From: Rick Moscoloni [mailto:rmoscol...@gmail.com]
> > > > Sent: September-19-21 10:12 AM
> > > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] DC Servo issues
> > > >
> > > > us digi

Re: [Emc-users] DC Servo issues

[Sam Sokolik]

Yes..  I agree.   Though my favorite thing to setup on a linuxcnc machine
is an encoder wheel for jogging and overrides...   What I use the most is
maximum velocity over ride..  allows you to sneak up on part...

On Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 2:53 PM John Dammeyer  wrote:

> Hi Sam,
> I must admit there's a certain amount of fear every time I press the go
> button for a CNC program.  Especially when I started mucking around with
> tool #'s and offsets.   My hand now overs over ESTOP when I press start.
> Watching a tool that appears too low scream over to the part held in the
> vise at a G0 180 ipm is not for the faint of heart.
>
> But then the first time I apply power to a newly assembled power supply my
> heart is also in my throat.  For one product, if the Pick and Place people
> didn't use enough solder under the ground pad of the regulator chip (the
> only ground connection too), it would fry and take out the 8 SMD power
> transistors for the dual supply.  Very difficult to repair.
>
> On the servo side, the caps are 200V rated as are the 50A transistors so
> theoretically I could run one with 115VAC as the 165VDC supply.   That
> would certainly provide the force to drive more current into the motor
> windings and create the speed desired.  With 105V the motor can reach 3000
> RPM with a lighter load, otherwise it would never work on the X axis but
> the torque might also just be on the edge during acceleration in one
> direction and not the other.
>
> Or build up a small circuit so I can measure the instantaneous DC current
> with the scope (don't have a current probe) and see how much current the
> motors are really drawing.   Torque is Amps x Turns and if the voltage
> isn't there to push the amps then following errors are likely.
>
> John
>
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: September-19-21 12:11 PM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] DC Servo issues
> >
> > Lol..  I certainly love the electrics part more than the machining most
> of
> > the time...
> >
> > On Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 2:07 PM John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Sam,
> > > See below.
> > > > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> > > >
> > > > I have never used servo drives that close the loop..   I have always
> had
> > > > great luck with normal closed loop within linuxcnc.  (cheap used amc
> > > > drives)
> > > >
> > > > (Actually - I take that back - I have used the stmbl drives. so far
> only
> > > > for a spindle..)
> > > >
> > > > This is of course using mesa analog interface hardware.
> > > >
> > > > The only time I had issues with encoder counting was when I thought I
> > > could
> > > > get by with single ended encoders going over 8 ft...
> > > >
> > > > Look at something like this..  2 counts per rev,  2 axis with
> 4000?
> > > > counts per rev...  (and the encoders came installed on the servo,
> single
> > > > ended and I think they are us-digital)
> > > > If I was missing counts during these complicated sync moves - you
> would
> > > > certainly see it.
> > > >
> > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4sKHBh6rDk
> > > >
> > > > (plus no 3rd party software to tune...)  - Granted you have the
> drives
> > > and
> > > > are familiar with them - at what point do you give up?
> > > >
> > > > sam
> > >
> > > That's the question.  One possibility to try is to grab 110VAC line
> > > voltage. Put a bridge and caps on it and drive that motor with more
> than
> > > the 105VDC power supply.  I'll have to check if my transistors are
> rated
> > > for the 165VDC rectified voltage and I really would rather have them be
> > > 250V transitors.   And then there's the filters on the board too. The
> UHU
> > > circuit was originally for up to about 75V.  The HP_UHU came about for
> > > higher voltage drives;  Just don't know if I built mine for more than
> > > 125VDC although the circuit design parts are for 11A.
> > >
> > > I _have_ tried one these motors with the STMBL but could never get it
> > > tuned and support from the designers was inadequate to help me so I
> gave
> > > up.
> > >
> > > I'd rather be machining...
> > >
> > > John
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >

Re: [Emc-users] Square holes

[Sam Sokolik]

I don't know if the latest code is here...  If not I will post it

https://forum.linuxcnc.org/10-advanced-configuration/38549-non-circular-boring-linuxcnc-fun?start=0

On Mon, Sep 20, 2021, 2:05 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Monday 20 September 2021 14:38:43 ken.stra...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > Recently (a nebulous concept as one gets older) there was a thread
> > about milling square and other shaped holes using synchronized motion
> > of the spindle and X/Y. I tried searching the list archive but am
> > obviously not using the right search terms. Help, please?
>
> That was a link or 3 to some youtube videos by Sam Sokolik, and he has
> not shared the code AFAIK. Both square and hex wre demoed. Nice concept
> though.
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Square holes

[Sam Sokolik]

Tool geometry is important with the lower number of sides...  ;)

On Mon, Sep 20, 2021 at 3:31 PM  wrote:

> I couldn't think of the name. Thanks!
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Ralph Stirling 
> Sent: September 20, 2021 2:53 PM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Square holes
>
> That's Sam Sokolik's specialty.  He has a number of amazing youtube videos
> of his experiments.  Here is his channel:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/user/samcoinc/videos
>
> -- Ralph
> 
> From: ken.stra...@gmail.com [ken.stra...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Monday, September 20, 2021 11:38 AM
> To: 'Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)'
> Subject: [Emc-users] Square holes
>
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> email
> system.
>
>
> Recently (a nebulous concept as one gets older) there was a thread about
> milling square and other shaped holes using synchronized motion of the
> spindle and X/Y. I tried searching the list archive but am obviously not
> using the right search terms. Help, please?
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sour
>
> ceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling
> 
> %40wallawalla.edu
> %7Ce8ee57727f7d449bbb1b08d97c65ee0a%7Cd958f048e43142779c8de
>
> bfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C1%7C637677599521469332%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4
>
> wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C2000&sdata=S3w
> HkDDrX7qjOvlOuG8uOVXYM6iQKz1Ra0yOG34oG6M%3D&reserved=0
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] 1973 cnc retro tech.. How to switch between metric and English

[Sam Sokolik]

We are finally getting around to converting the 73
cincinnati milacron lathe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-J7EmnRZXjw

At the end of the video I show the switch that switches between 2
differently geared resolvers.

On the back of the hydraulic servo is a gearbox.   first is a 2.5:1
increaser that makes it so the english resolver spins 5 times per inch (.2"
of axis movement - 2TPI lead screw)  then there is a set of gears 127:50
(2.54:1) for the resolver used for metric.  Than that resolver runs at 2mm
per rev.   Amazing how it was cheaper to do this in hardware than in the
control (ttl ic's)

https://photos.app.goo.gl/yezaTdnNWZHg9Dm4A

https://photos.app.goo.gl/QNDzVJmnD9HWjs8LA

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] 1973 cnc retro tech.. How to switch between metric and English

[Sam Sokolik]

There was a short period of time that I almost thought about trying to get
the hydraulic servos working with linuxcnc...   (it didn't last long as I
really didn't want to listen to the 20hp hydraulic unit running)  Thinking
though it I was going to try to run the servo valves with amc drives and
injecting a 100hz signal in hall to keep the valves from sticking..
(looking at the valve schematic - it looked like it was doing something
similar..)

but - the x axis is run through a right angle gearbox that has backlash (no
thought of zero backlash gear train like the k&t) and the Z axis has a
coupling from the servo to the lead screw that has backlash in it.

sam

On Tue, Oct 26, 2021 at 8:27 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Tue, 26 Oct 2021 at 13:47, Eric Keller  wrote:
> >
> > I wanted to modify my lathe to cut metric threads.  But it requires 7
> > gears.
>
> Have you considered a full CNC conversion?
> It makes cutting threads up to shoulders in blind holes a lot less
> frightening :-)
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Fwd: Requesting a short history review, if you'd be so kind.

[Sam Sokolik]

All my machines - steppers and servos are running pid.I think Peter
forgot to mention - The reason PID is recommended is because it handles
latency spikes way better.  We have seen situations where a latency spike
confuses the hell out of position mode stepgens.   (ymmv)

On Thu, Oct 28, 2021 at 4:42 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Wednesday 27 October 2021 14:35:30 Ted wrote:
>
> > Greets - although I haven't read every post of late, I've been an LCNC
> > follower since we had BDI's of EMC; LCNC has been my platform of
> > choice for many projects.
> >
> > Like many, I started with software stepgens driving open loop
> > steppers, and although my shelves are full of them, I typically reach
> > for a Mesa board and position-capable servos these days. I have a
> > particular love for Yaskawa and Allen Bradley drives, and Yaskawa or
> > Fanuc motors. Typically I end up mixing brands from ebay finds when we
> > hit the 3Nm mark (or 500w, whichever comes first), so for my own gear,
> > it's never a perfect numerical match, but with appropriate care it
> > functions fine.
> >
> > I recently decided to redo my lathe (a Tsugami NCM, 6" chuck, 2" bore,
> > 12 station turret, 6 station live) which I had a rather old (perhaps
> > 2.3) LCNC on, more to work on a custom glade gui, as well as try and
> > stay more up to date, particularly with the RT kernel changes. (Yes,
> > it was that old).
> >
> > The prior command path was LCNC Axis gui -> motmod -> Mesa Stepgen
> > position mode, quadrature out -> AB Ultra 100 drive in position
> > follower mode -> AC servomotor with encoder -> drive encoder output
> > electronically geared 1:1 -> Mesa Encoder input, scaled in inches ->
> > LCNC axis feedback. Effectively that was a closed loop stepper system,
> > wherein the feedback came from the encoder (motor) shaft - and this
> > all worked well. It sounded like a servo (velocities didn't sound like
> > a stepper), it acted like a servo and its following was really close
> > both in time and position. Enough for the things I was cutting. (ok,
> > it held +/- 5 tenths in 12L steel)
> >
> > In having read some past posts, it became clear that the old config
> > files I had were not going to be easily translatable, so I gave
> > Stepconf a try (something I haven't used in years). Although it
> > generated "working" configs, I was really puzzled by the inclusion of
> > PIDs and their connection in the command chain, despite the fact I was
> > still using the Mesa stepgens.
> >
> > I figured it must have been an update I missed, perhaps a
> > higher-performance path with the new motion planner (recalling I did
> > skip a lot of the posts during the early PathPilot discussions), so I
> > just went with it.
> >
> > I was completely unable to get either axis to respond consistently.
> > Sometimes the drive would fault because of improper quadrature state
> > (namely changing pulse states while disabled), or it would move 0.5
> > inch one way, then 1.0 inch the other way, despite scaling matching
> > the real world. Sometimes on an 0.1 move it wouldn't move at all, and
> > would wait for my FERROR to get almost limited out then it would snap
> > the full distance.
> >
> > I'm not new to PIDs; in an earlier time between steppers and position
> > servos, I used to enjoy the task of tuning both torque and velocity
> > loops. (preferring velocity, though). However I have not until now
> > observed both pid error and command increase in the same direction
> > before, wherein the PID just seemed to be oblivious.
> >
> > I chalked it up to the possibility that my servos and drives, although
> > mismatched but working prior, may have reached their useful life.
> > Other potential electro-mechanical variables such as connectors could
> > easily be the culprit, so I decided for another upgrade - a pair of
> > brand new Bergerda 1500w servos.
> >
> > Those arrived a week back; I'm very happy with them. After mounting
> > and checking appropriate defaults, I wrote a quick hal config so I
> > could test the base pulses-per-inch for drive against the
> > newly-installed glass scales I decided to add to the mix. With this
> > combination, I expected that there really weren't any assumptions -
> > the glass scales have a known resolution, wherein the
> > drive->motor->screw although numerically believed to be known, may
> > have been a little off due to age or manufacturing tolerances. however
> > things like rotor pole counts, internal electronic gearing and actual
> > screw pitch were no longer going to be of issue.
> >
> > Without too much trouble I found base scale, velocity and accel from
> > the Mesa stepgen (51010 scale, 9.0 vel, 7.0 accel) - which gave me
> > more than acceptable rapids, and the 5um glass scale has an encoder
> > scale value of 5101.0. Mathematically, yes, it should have been 5080
> > or some multiple, but clearly there is a small amount of error in the
> > system compared to my other metrology gear. That might get tuned
>

Re: [Emc-users] Fwd: Requesting a short history review, if you'd be so kind.

[Sam Sokolik]

This is a quote from peter on the forum..

'I have done some experimentation and have found that you can get better
stepgen following performance on systems with moderate jitter by using a
PID loop for position control instead of the stepgen drivers built-in
position control loop.
The problem with the built in driver position control is that its tends to
overcorrect
for measured position errors cause by sampling jitter.'

On Thu, Oct 28, 2021 at 12:35 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Thursday 28 October 2021 11:45:49 Sam Sokolik wrote:
>
> > All my machines - steppers and servos are running pid.I think
> > Peter forgot to mention - The reason PID is recommended is because it
> > handles latency spikes way better.  We have seen situations where a
> > latency spike confuses the hell out of position mode stepgens.
> > (ymmv)
>
> But thats why we run preempt-rt kernels Sam. Even on the pi, the maximum
> spike is 200 microseconds while FF is initializing. W/O FF, 4 to 50
> u-secs. And the big lathe has never noticed that. The little mill,
> before it commited suicide by spitting out all the balls of the y nut,
> was running sw steppers, and they did notice occasionally. It also
> severely limited that machines rapids, to around 8 or 9" a minute.
> Putting a 5i25 in it and it ran about 50 ipm w/o any stutters.
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] Getty's/fanuc 10-2000m servo

[Sam Sokolik]

Anyone have specs on this brushed servo from the 70's?

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Getty's/fanuc 10-2000m servo

[Sam Sokolik]

Lol - yes..  Wondering the torque..   The only thing I found so far was
around 20ft-lbs..  That would be more than enough - doing a 4:1 reduction
would give us around 200ipm and over 10k pounds of push...  give or take..

On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 9:32 PM Ed  wrote:

> On 11/9/21 8:46 PM, Sam Sokolik wrote:
> > Anyone have specs on this brushed servo from the 70's?
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> If I remember correctly the 2000 in the part number is the rated speed.
> Spin the motor at 2K RPM and measure voltage output. PM motor I presume.
>
>
> Is this for your "new" lathe?
>
>
> Ed.
>
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] 7i90 ethernet link

[Sam Sokolik]

I think...  It is only smart serial.  (not ethernet)

On Mon, Nov 15, 2021 at 10:48 AM dave engvall  wrote:

> Is anyone using ethernet as a link between linuxcnc and a 7i90?
> Comments and/help appreciated
>
> Dave
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Getty's/fanuc 10-2000m servo

[Sam Sokolik]

Quick test seems to be

2000rpm at about 111v

.4ft-lbs per amp.   (8ft-lbs at 20a)

On Wed, Nov 10, 2021, 9:07 AM Jon Elson  wrote:

> On 11/9/21 8:46 PM, Sam Sokolik wrote:
> > Anyone have specs on this brushed servo from the 70's?
> >
> Arrgh!  These Gettys motors were designed to use power
> transistors from car radio speaker amplifiers, so very low
> voltage and LOTS of amps.  They used positive and negative
> power supplies, and about 20 transistors in parallel from
> each supply to the motor.  Stuart Stevenson's 5-axis
> Cincinnatti mills used those. The servo amps took up 3 feet
> of vertical rack space EACH!  I think you can tell this
> series of motors because they have EIGHT brush caps on
> them.  I think the rating is something like 12 V at 80 A
> continuous.
>
> Jon
>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Spindle positioning.

[Sam Sokolik]

Can you backdrive the impact wrench?  Keep it engaged?

On Mon, Nov 22, 2021 at 11:45 AM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> Thanks Roland,
> What I've found is that once the socket has reached that midpoint between
> flats it sticks there.  Rounding off the edges of the inside didn't fix it
> but did help.  I can even shut off the air so I can pull it down slowly
> against the return spring pressure and turn the spindle carefully by hand
> and I can still make it stick in that one area.
>
> The problem with turning the spindle is that the socket spins freely in
> the wrench so even the slightest bit of friction once it touches the nut
> causes it to turn with the spindle.  I tried 1RPM all the way up to 30RPM
> and it didn't matter.  The rounding of the nut and socket means 50% of the
> time it works perfectly and the other 50% sticks.
>
> Also if my set screw is too loose then on the way up the socket pulls
> out.  And the set screw loosens after about 10 cylces.  Hardened metal
> against hardened metal doesn't work well.  A softer screw didn't work much
> better.  Way to much rattle on the socket/driver connection.
>
> I never thought I'd have this much trouble...
> John
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Roland Jollivet [mailto:roland.jolli...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: November-22-21 4:01 AM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: [Emc-users] Spindle positioning.
> >
> > You probably don't need more than 1 bar on the lifting air cylinder, up
> or
> > down. No need to force it down.
> > So let it down, then if you can give the spindle a 1RPM burst to let the
> > nut slip over.
> > And have a switch on driver Z to know if it's down over the nut.
> >
> > You could also stop the spindle and descend the driver as the spindle
> > reaches it's last 5RPM? before stopping.
> >
> > Roland
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, 22 Nov 2021 at 10:03, John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > > From: dave engvall [mailto:dengv...@charter.net]
> > > > On 11/21/21 9:24 PM, John Dammeyer wrote:
> > > > > Is there a way to tell the spindle to turn until it finds the index
> > > and stop so it's always stopping at the exact same spot?  Like
> > > > decelerate to 0.5 rev per second  (30 RPM) or slower and stop when
> the
> > > index happens?  With either an M5 or the button on the
> > > > user interface?
> > > > >
> > > > If I were? doing that? today I would use 3 sensors. IOW a guard
> sensor
> > > > either side of index, rotate quickly to detection of guard slow way
> down
> > > > and search for the central sensor. How you know which is the shortest
> > > > path is left as an exercise for the "student". ;-) Or maybe one
> simply
> > > > defaults to searching in one direction.
> > > >
> > > > If you don't need orientation then a stepper motor and a gear would
> seem
> > > > to be as simplistic as one can get.
> > > >
> > > > Dave
> > >
> > > One still has to line up the socket to the hex head of the drawbar.
> And
> > > since it can be at any position relative to the spindle the sensing
> has to
> > > happen against the hex head.  Rotate spindle until hex head is at a
> known
> > > position.  Then rotate socket from and indexed position until it
> matches
> > > the socket and then send it down.  This could all happen in under
> 100mS and
> > > be almost transparent to an end user.
> > >
> > > There are times where I wish I had BMT-30 cone type tooling or just
> only
> > > TTS.
> > > John
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

I found that a while ago - That was what I initially started to build.
 But the cup seems to not handle flexing.  Atleast pla (I never tried it
with petg).  When Andy mentioned the style with no cup - I went that
direction.  I first made the flex gear out of pla - but it fatigued after
about 6 hours of running full speed (of the stepper).   Which might be just
fine for a hobby 4th axis.  Your not running the rotary axis at 100% feed
all the time. I bought a role of petg and printed a flex gear with it.
 As much as I have run this setup (petg flex gear and pla splines) - I have
not had the petg flex gear fail - even after torque testing it.  (although
I have not taken it apart) but it still runs and doesn't randomly stall.

sam

On Sat, Nov 27, 2021 at 10:05 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> For those who have 3D printed the gear portions of the harmonic drive what
> plastic did you find worked the best?
>
> Thanks
> John
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: John Dammeyer [mailto:jo...@autoartisans.com]
> > Sent: November-26-21 11:18 PM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> >
> > List has been quiet lately on the harmonic drive subject.  I stumbled on
> this site.
> >
> >
> https://howtomechatronics.com/how-it-works/what-is-strain-wave-gear-harmonic-drive-a-perfect-gear-set-for-robotics-
> > applications
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

Um

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eW1GGI55Epc


On Sat, Nov 27, 2021 at 10:37 PM Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> That article is one of the best descriptions of a harmonic drive.But
> the problem is that 3D printed plastic is not strong enough to make a
> practical system.Note that the author says his drive can supply 3 Nm of
> torque.   A stepper motor can do that already.
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 27, 2021 at 8:05 PM John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
>
> > For those who have 3D printed the gear portions of the harmonic drive
> what
> > plastic did you find worked the best?
> >
> > Thanks
> > John
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: John Dammeyer [mailto:jo...@autoartisans.com]
> > > Sent: November-26-21 11:18 PM
> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > Subject: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> > >
> > > List has been quiet lately on the harmonic drive subject.  I stumbled
> on
> > this site.
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://howtomechatronics.com/how-it-works/what-is-strain-wave-gear-harmonic-drive-a-perfect-gear-set-for-robotics-
> > > applications
> > >
> > > John
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
>
> --
>
> Chris Albertson
> Redondo Beach, California
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

I will post them later tonight..  To be honest - I took a video of the one
of the drive mfg and kinda measured the tooth angle.  (mine are just
triangles..)

sam

On Tue, Nov 30, 2021 at 2:30 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> Hi Sam,
> Could you share the STEP file for the flex gear?  I want to look at the
> tooth shape.
> Thanks
> John
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: November-27-21 8:18 PM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> >
> > I found that a while ago - That was what I initially started to build.
> >  But the cup seems to not handle flexing.  Atleast pla (I never tried it
> > with petg).  When Andy mentioned the style with no cup - I went that
> > direction.  I first made the flex gear out of pla - but it fatigued after
> > about 6 hours of running full speed (of the stepper).   Which might be
> just
> > fine for a hobby 4th axis.  Your not running the rotary axis at 100% feed
> > all the time. I bought a role of petg and printed a flex gear with
> it.
> >  As much as I have run this setup (petg flex gear and pla splines) - I
> have
> > not had the petg flex gear fail - even after torque testing it.
> (although
> > I have not taken it apart) but it still runs and doesn't randomly stall.
> >
> > sam
> >
> > On Sat, Nov 27, 2021 at 10:05 PM John Dammeyer 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > For those who have 3D printed the gear portions of the harmonic drive
> what
> > > plastic did you find worked the best?
> > >
> > > Thanks
> > > John
> > >
> > > > -Original Message-
> > > > From: John Dammeyer [mailto:jo...@autoartisans.com]
> > > > Sent: November-26-21 11:18 PM
> > > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > > Subject: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> > > >
> > > > List has been quiet lately on the harmonic drive subject.  I
> stumbled on
> > > this site.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> https://howtomechatronics.com/how-it-works/what-is-strain-wave-gear-harmonic-drive-a-perfect-gear-set-for-robotics-
> > > > applications
> > > >
> > > > John
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ___
> > > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

This is the profile I am currently using...

http://electronicsam.com/images/greenmachine/IMG_20210127_104354.jpg


On Tue, Nov 30, 2021, 3:10 PM John Dammeyer  wrote:

> So nothing as complicated as:
> https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/pdf/10.1177/1687814019850656
>
> I did detailed measurements on the cup version I printed and there are two
> issues.  The worst is the shrinkage of the plastic results in the bearing
> holder being 1mm too small in diameter compared to the drawing.  Outside of
> Bearing to Bearing should be 84mm and is 83mm.   That leads to the teeth
> not entering the spline gear as deep as they should.
>
> There's also shrinkage across each tooth from the 3D print process so that
> even as they mate they bottom out before the sides contact.  And based on
> other reports of 3D printed harmonic gears the thickness behind the teeth
> should be 1mm rather than 1.5mm which ends up being too stiff.
>
> Then end result is this version has backlash but it turns quite nicely.
> The max I can get with this small Size 23 old surplus stepper is 8 seconds
> in one revolution with the 35:1 reduction at 1600 micro-steps/rev.  I also
> can't grab the hub and stop it.
>
> Finally, the spline gear and support body must be a lot thicker as it
> moves under load which shows up in the original authors video too.
>
> I'll put together a folder with the photos.
>
> John
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: November-30-21 12:46 PM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> >
> > I will post them later tonight..  To be honest - I took a video of the
> one
> > of the drive mfg and kinda measured the tooth angle.  (mine are just
> > triangles..)
> >
> > sam
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 30, 2021 at 2:30 PM John Dammeyer 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Sam,
> > > Could you share the STEP file for the flex gear?  I want to look at the
> > > tooth shape.
> > > Thanks
> > > John
> > >
> > >
> > > > -Original Message-
> > > > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> > > > Sent: November-27-21 8:18 PM
> > > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> > > >
> > > > I found that a while ago - That was what I initially started to
> build.
> > > >  But the cup seems to not handle flexing.  Atleast pla (I never
> tried it
> > > > with petg).  When Andy mentioned the style with no cup - I went that
> > > > direction.  I first made the flex gear out of pla - but it fatigued
> after
> > > > about 6 hours of running full speed (of the stepper).   Which might
> be
> > > just
> > > > fine for a hobby 4th axis.  Your not running the rotary axis at 100%
> feed
> > > > all the time. I bought a role of petg and printed a flex gear
> with
> > > it.
> > > >  As much as I have run this setup (petg flex gear and pla splines) -
> I
> > > have
> > > > not had the petg flex gear fail - even after torque testing it.
> > > (although
> > > > I have not taken it apart) but it still runs and doesn't randomly
> stall.
> > > >
> > > > sam
> > > >
> > > > On Sat, Nov 27, 2021 at 10:05 PM John Dammeyer <
> jo...@autoartisans.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > For those who have 3D printed the gear portions of the harmonic
> drive
> > > what
> > > > > plastic did you find worked the best?
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks
> > > > > John
> > > > >
> > > > > > -Original Message-
> > > > > > From: John Dammeyer [mailto:jo...@autoartisans.com]
> > > > > > Sent: November-26-21 11:18 PM
> > > > > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > > > > Subject: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> > > > > >
> > > > > > List has been quiet lately on the harmonic drive subject.  I
> > > stumbled on
> > > > > this site.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > >
> https://howtomechatronics.com/how-it-works/what-is-strain-wave-gear-harmonic-drive-a-perfect-gear-set-for-robotics-
> > > > > > applications
> > > > > >
> > > > > > John
> > > > > >
> > &

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

The meshing of the harmonic drive splines slide in and out...   not like
involute gears that rotate though with point pressure (not sliding)


On Tue, Nov 30, 2021, 7:32 PM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> Isn't the purpose of an involute surface the minimization of sliding two
> surfaces? I would think an attempt would be made in the harmonic mesh.
>
> On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 12:09 AM andy pugh  wrote:
>
> > On Tue, 30 Nov 2021 at 23:07, Stuart Stevenson 
> wrote:
> >
> > > Is the tooth shape an attempt to mesh in an involute fashion?
> >
> > No, because the motion of the teeth relative to each other is very
> > much unlike meshing gears, and so involute is inappropriate.
> >
> > --
> > atp
> > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > lunatics."
> > — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
>
> --
> Addressee is the intended audience.
> If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read
> this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without saving or
> reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
> correspondence.
> Thank you for honoring my wish.
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

ok - I sent the stl's but it is awaiting for approval..   So here they are
again..

http://electronicsam.com/images/greenmachine/harmonic/

That creates 100:1 or 101:1 depending on which side is stationary...

On Tue, Nov 30, 2021 at 9:12 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> I am pretty sure this is the current stl's
>
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 30, 2021 at 8:08 PM John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
>
>> Said in so many less words than I used...
>>
>> > -Original Message-
>> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
>> > Sent: November-30-21 5:38 PM
>> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
>> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
>> >
>> > The meshing of the harmonic drive splines slide in and out...   not like
>> > involute gears that rotate though with point pressure (not sliding)
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, Nov 30, 2021, 7:32 PM Stuart Stevenson 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > > Isn't the purpose of an involute surface the minimization of sliding
>> two
>> > > surfaces? I would think an attempt would be made in the harmonic mesh.
>> > >
>> > > On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 12:09 AM andy pugh  wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > On Tue, 30 Nov 2021 at 23:07, Stuart Stevenson 
>> > > wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > > Is the tooth shape an attempt to mesh in an involute fashion?
>> > > >
>> > > > No, because the motion of the teeth relative to each other is very
>> > > > much unlike meshing gears, and so involute is inappropriate.
>> > > >
>> > > > --
>> > > > atp
>> > > > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
>> > > > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
>> > > > lunatics."
>> > > > � George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > ___
>> > > > Emc-users mailing list
>> > > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > Addressee is the intended audience.
>> > > If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to
>> read
>> > > this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without
>> saving or
>> > > reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
>> > > correspondence.
>> > > Thank you for honoring my wish.
>> > >
>> > > ___
>> > > Emc-users mailing list
>> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>> > >
>> >
>> > ___
>> > Emc-users mailing list
>> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

I popped it apart so I could measure the bearings (couldn't remember the
size).  It looks quite good still considering the torque testing and
stuff...

https://photos.app.goo.gl/6DcMdFQp98aTvbQi8

https://photos.app.goo.gl/cDcRrPErWqH4c8gV7

sam

On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 1:22 AM John Dammeyer  wrote:

> I've added a photo.
> www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-8.jpg
>
> The new wave generator pieces puts the bearings 1mm further out.  Was also
> able to bring it a bit closer to the motor so the bearings now sit in the
> middle of the fixed spline gear.
>
> I've run it with 18,000 steps per second through a driver that does 1600
> steps per rev.  It still has that rough plastic against plastic sound.  I
> need to add a few more nyloc nuts and Loctite to prevent things from coming
> loose from vibration but with that small motor I can't grab onto the 40mm
> output drive and stop it from turning.If anything a bit of load on it
> makes it quieter.
>
> I'll also add some white lithium grease and then run it for a number of
> hours.  I suspect , like Sam's it will break.
>
> Oh and those speeds:  11.25 revs per sec for the motor (675 RPM).  With
> the 35:1 that's 19.2 RPM for the output shaft or 3.11 seconds for one rev.
> I think that would work fine as one arm on a robot style automatic tool
> changer.
>
> John
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: John Dammeyer [mailto:jo...@autoartisans.com]
> > Sent: November-30-21 1:41 PM
> > To: 'Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)'
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> >
> > Here's a link to the photos.
> > Two views of all the parts not including the bearing arm.
> > www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-1.jpg
> > www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-2.jpg
> >
> > I didn't have the larger ID bearings so I used one with OD 47 but ID
> 20mm and recreated the appropriate hubs for the smaller
> > diameter.
> > www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-3.jpg
> >
> > As I only found two of the correct size bearings in my parts bin I down
> sized the bearing wheel to have less wheels and speed up the
> > print process.
> > www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-4.jpg
> >
> > This photo shows that the printed teeth appear to match the drawing in -7
> > www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-5.jpg
> >
> > And because the bearing actuator is 1mm too short the cup is just barely
> stretched enough and does clear but only just.
> > www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-6.jpg
> > This one shows the drawing of spline gear and cup (cup not flexed) and
> either because the STL files were not converted properly to
> > STEP or the drawings just weren't correct to start with.The prints
> of the cup and spline gear were done directly from the STL.
> > www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-7.jpg
> >
> > I still think it will be better to use LCNC and make the gear parts out
> of metal.
> > John
> >
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: John Dammeyer [mailto:jo...@autoartisans.com]
> > > Sent: November-30-21 1:07 PM
> > > To: 'Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)'
> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> > >
> > > So nothing as complicated as:
> > > https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/pdf/10.1177/1687814019850656
> > >
> > > I did detailed measurements on the cup version I printed and there are
> two issues.  The worst is the shrinkage of the plastic results
> > in
> > > the bearing holder being 1mm too small in diameter compared to the
> drawing.  Outside of Bearing to Bearing should be 84mm and
> > is
> > > 83mm.   That leads to the teeth not entering the spline gear as deep
> as they should.
> > >
> > > There's also shrinkage across each tooth from the 3D print process so
> that even as they mate they bottom out before the sides
> > > contact.  And based on other reports of 3D printed harmonic gears the
> thickness behind the teeth should be 1mm rather than
> > > 1.5mm which ends up being too stiff.
> > >
> > > Then end result is this version has backlash but it turns quite
> nicely.The max I can get with this small Size 23 old surplus stepper is
> > 8
> > > seconds in one revolution with the 35:1 reduction at 1600
> micro-steps/rev.  I also can't grab the hub and stop it.
> > >
> > > Finally, the spline gear and support body must be a lot thicker as it
> moves under load which shows u

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

The problem (I think) is that you want to deform the plastic as little as
possible.  That is why I went with smaller teeth...  (and no cup)

sam

On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 3:22 PM Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> Thanks for the link.  But I noticed there was a STEP file provided.   I've
> imported it into Fusion360.  It imports well.  No need to convert the STL
> files.
>
> Here is a view-only public link to the Fusion360 model.
> https://a360.co/3phrfI6
> I've made no edits to the above. simply did the import.
>
> The model could use some reorganization.  It is just a linear list of parts
> with no hierarchy but unlike STL files the exact shape of the parts is
> preserved.
>
> Thanks again.
>
> Chris
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:33 AM John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
>
> > Chris,
> >
> > This was my starting point.  The step files aren't available in that
> > link.  The STLs have been converted although some badly.  Still working
> on
> > getting better step files from STL.
> >
> >
> >
> https://howtomechatronics.com/how-it-works/what-is-strain-wave-gear-harmonic-drive-a-perfect-gear-set-for-robotics-applications/
> >
> > I don't have the larger 47x35 bearings yet so I subbed in a 47x20.
> > Without two bearings there will always be a bit of wiggle there.  I found
> > only two of the 5x16x5 in my random bearing box.  I have 10 of those on
> > order too.  For now I recreated the wave generator to just use two
> > bearings.
> >
> > I have a tube of 11mm bearings that when doubled up (or maybe not) can be
> > put closer together creating less of a point source bend that the single
> > bearing does.  That might fatigue the plastic less.
> >
> > Also turning the hub that goes through the bearing out of metal and
> making
> > the companion mounting plate for the cup out of metal would allow a
> coupler
> > shaft through from the wave generator disk to the centerline of the drive
> > bearing.  This would likely also clean up any wobble from thin printed
> > plastic.
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
> > > Sent: December-01-21 9:13 AM
> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> > >
> > > John,
> > >
> > > Looks like I'm finding this thread late.  Where are the design files
> for
> > > this harmonic drive?
> > >
> > > On Tue, Nov 30, 2021 at 11:22 PM John Dammeyer  >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > I've added a photo.
> > > > www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-8.jpg
> > > >
> > > > The new wave generator pieces puts the bearings 1mm further out.  Was
> > also
> > > > able to bring it a bit closer to the motor so the bearings now sit in
> > the
> > > > middle of the fixed spline gear.
> > > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Chris Albertson
> > > Redondo Beach, California
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
>
> --
>
> Chris Albertson
> Redondo Beach, California
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] to JD

[Sam Sokolik]

My ender 3 seem to print petg ok...

On Wed, Dec 1, 2021, 5:02 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Wed, 1 Dec, 2021 at 5:21 PM, John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
>
>
> To: 'enhanced machine controller (emc)'
> >As it turns out I have something called Molykote 111 compound used for
> lubricating
> >the rotating valve for the Rocket Espresso Machine.  Had to buy a large
> tube for a once
> >every 6 month cleaning and still have lots left.   Definitely food grade
> since it's in the
> >hot water path.  Should work great I think.
>
>
>
> It's also black, won't wash out of clothes.  Takes about a week and lots
> of 20 mule team
>
> boraxo to wear off your fingers. Good for bullets and rifle barrels though.
>
>
>
> >Just printed a cup with 1mm wall instead of 1.5 and random layer changes
> to avoid
> >the hard spot at that location.   Doesn't seem any more flexible so it
> may well be most
> >of the stiffness is in the bottom part of large 1.25mm pitch teeth.
>
>
>
> I gave making cups up, they always broke, sometimes at the bottom of the
> splines but usually at the corner junction of the output disk and the
> bottom of the cup. Even in PETG.
>
>
> Additional fillets on the inside of that corner just moved the breakage to
> the top of the filet.
>
>
> Sam's loose belt version has only broken once, when I tried to make it
> from PLA.
>
>
> The problem with printers that claim to be able to work in PETG is the
> teflon Bowden tube that usually goes thru the hot and to the back face of
> the nozzle, slowly goes away at the higher temps PETG needs. I had to buy
> an $800 Prusa MK3S kit and build it,
> took 3 days, to get an E3D hot end which puts a metal heat break that ends
> the teflon tubing up inside the cooled upper end of the hot end. Once I had
> replaced that heat break with a titanium version, I have now put about 5,
> 2kg rolls of filament thru it without any further take it apart trouble. It
> does need a good cleaning with a brass toothbrush as it warms up though.
>
>
> >John
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com albertson.ch...@gmail.com>]
> > Sent: December-01-21 12:43 PM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] to JD
> >
> > The best stuff is PTFE based, "Superlube" for $5 on Amazon. This is a
> > "food-grade" lube which means it is ok to use on food prep equipment (not
> > to eat) and is non-reactive.   It is what "everyone" recommends for 3D
> > printed gearboxes.
> > amazon.com/Super-Lube-21030-Synthetic-Grease<
> http://amazon.com/Super-Lube-21030-Synthetic-Grease>
> > <
> https://www.amazon.com/Super-Lube-21030-Synthetic-Grease/dp/B000XBH9HI/ref=asc_df_B000XBH9HI/?tag=hyprod-
> >
> 20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167152075853&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=2257681426504032291&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvd
> >
> ev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031026&hvtargid=pla-31599188&psc=1>
> >
> > Teflon is good stuff.  It has low friction and is 100% non-reactive.I
> > don't know what a carrier is but if the stuff is "food grade" i'd guess
> it
> > is mostly harmless.
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:22 AM Gene Heskett  > wrote:
> >
> > > I'll also add some white lithium grease and then run it for a number of
> > > hours.  I suspect ,
> > >
> > >
> > > That petroleum based grease will craze the plastic, Sam. You need a
> > > vegetable based grease or oil, crisco is cheaper than the "special"
> stuff
> > > for plastic, which I've used on the bb's in miine.
> > >
> > >
> > > OTOH the special stuff is IMO a bit thicker than crisco, I bought a
> small
> > > can on it for $14 from
> > > some  guy in China.
> > >
> > >
> > > Still on webmail (spit) excuse the mess. 7 damned bullseye installs
> later
> > > I still don't have
> > > the tools to make a proper email agent work..
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Take care and stay well John.
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net >
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Chris Albertson
> > Redondo Beach, California
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> .
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] to JD

[Sam Sokolik]

Huh.  I have printed probably half a roll so far..  (it is an ender 3 pro -
from maybe a year ago)

On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 5:21 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Wed, 1 Dec, 2021 at 6:10 PM, Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>
>
> To: enhanced machine controller (emc)
> [...]
> My ender 3 seem to print petg ok...
>
>
> It will, for several parts, but it will start leaking hot plastic above
> the hot block
> eventually as the bowden tube slowly evaporates from the 240C or higher
> temps PETG needs.
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 1, 2021, 5:02 PM Gene Heskett  ghesk...@shentel.net>> wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 1 Dec, 2021 at 5:21 PM, John Dammeyer  <mailto:jo...@autoartisans.com>>
> > wrote:
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

Lol - both work here.


On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 6:43 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

> still a 404
>
>
> On Wed, 1 Dec, 2021 at 7:21 PM, John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
>
>
> To: 'enhanced machine controller (emc)'
> Try it again.  Should be there now.  Timing I think...
>
> Also take a look at
> www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-9.jpg
> and so is this.
>
>
> Shows that the teeth are not quite straight but have a slight arc to
> them.  The bottom of the teeth are rounded to avoid hard points.  This is
> the part as provided by the original author.
>
> John
>
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Gene Heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net ghesk...@shentel.net>]
> > Sent: December-01-21 4:10 PM
> > To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> >
> > On Wed, 1 Dec, 2021 at 6:55 PM, John Dammeyer  > wrote:
> >
> >
> > To: 'enhanced machine controller (emc)'
> > Here's one of the things I would change on this project.
> > www.autoartisans.com/harmonicdrive/HarmonicDrive-10.jpg
> >
> >
> > 404 here
> >
> >
> > The cavity is for the same sort of 16mm bearing with either a 6mm or
> 6.35mm hole.   Instead of 4 nuts a nut plate a  10mm hole. A
> > rod attached to the wave generator disk slips into the bearing lining up
> the cup to motor.  I think Sam did something similar with his
> > belt unit.
> >
> > There are probably other ways to do that too but I think that if the
> base of the cup is held more solidly and in line it will improve
> > performance.
> >
> > I've also thought about tapering the cup so it's thicker at the bottom
> (say 2.0mm) and tapers to 0.9mm at the top  That would tend to
> > get rid of the hard spots where it might crack.   Plus, the right way
> IMHO is to make the cup and internal spline out of metal.
> > John
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net >>
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > .
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> .
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

I have seen that video too!  I watch too much youtube..   It doesn't really
look that strong..mine stalled at 35ftlb or 47.45Nm

Oh - I am officially a thingiverser...

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5151905




On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 10:24 PM Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> The Step file I sent is fully functional when imported to Fusion360.
>
> There are a few changes I would make too.  If the problem is the cup
> flexing, Maybe try some accordion pleats, a few broad sine-like curves in
> the cup.  Why are the wals cylindrical?
>
> Another idea is to remove the bottom from the cup so it is just a tube and
> not a cup then cut a square wave patters on the bottom and drive ot with a
> disk with an interlocking pattern. Then there is no more bending on the
> booton radius.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 3:38 PM John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
>
> > Chris sent me a zip with the project step file.  This one I was able to
> > load and save.  The individual part files were not editable.
> >
> > However, once I saved that imported step file as the entire assembly
> > AlibreCAD saved it as a series of assemblies and part files;  88 in all
> > including the original step file.  The assembly does not have any
> > constraints so once you pull the pieces apart it's hard to put them back
> > without adding in constraints.
> >
> > Anyway, these are editable.
> > If anyone wants a zip with the .AD_ASM and .AD_PRT files I'll pass it on.
> > At this point you load Harmonic Drive Project v45.AD_ASM and can edit the
> > individual part files although they can't be saved from within the part
> > editing.  Only inside the assembly.
> >
> > But separately they can be edited.  Probably a bug in Alibre.  They don't
> > call it Read Only or Read/Write but locked and unlocked.
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
> > > Sent: December-01-21 2:59 PM
> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> > >
> > > If it is too much work, ask me and I will re-export the entire model
> from
> > > Fusion360 to STEP, and I'm sure there will be no read-only as Fusion360
> > > does not do that.
> > >
> > > I also want to re-organize it, like at least placing all the nuts and
> > > screws in a "hardware" component so that can all be turned off and on
> at
> > > once rather than doing 100+ clicks
> > >
> > > On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 2:53 PM John Dammeyer 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > How about.  Now it works.  I can load the assembly but the embedded
> > read
> > > > only characteristic is just plain rude.  So the work around with
> > Alibre is
> > > > as follows:
> > > >
> > > > Import the .step file.
> > > > Select one of the elements like "Housing"  and right click to open in
> > > > separate window.
> > > > Doesn't matter what you do to the drawing you can't change it but it
> > can
> > > > be exported as an .IGES file.
> > > > So now I have "Housing.igs" and can import that and then save as the
> > > > "Housing.AD_PRT"
> > > >
> > > > It's still a clumsy step file type of import that doesn't have the
> same
> > > > ease of use editing that parts built with Alibre have but at least
> it's
> > > > editable and some of the very poor features of the design can be
> > changed.
> > > >
> > > > John
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > -Original Message-
> > > > > From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
> > > > > Sent: December-01-21 1:18 PM
> > > > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks for the link.  But I noticed there was a STEP file provided.
> > > >  I've
> > > > > imported it into Fusion360.  It imports well.  No need to convert
> > the STL
> > > > > files.
> > > > >
> > > > > Here is a view-only public link to the Fusion360 model.
> > > > > https://a360.co/3phrfI6
> > > > > I've made no edits to the above. simply did the import.
> > > > >
> > > > > The model could use some reorganization.  It is just a linear list
> of
> > > > parts
> > > > > with no hierarchy but unlike STL files the exact shape of the parts
> > is
> > > > > preserved.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks again.
> > > > >
> > > > > Chris
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:33 AM John Dammeyer <
> jo...@autoartisans.com
> > >
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Chris,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > This was my starting point.  The step files aren't available in
> > that
> > > > > > link.  The STLs have been converted although some badly.  Still
> > > > working on
> > > > > > getting better step files from STL.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> >
> https://howtomechatronics.com/how-it-works/what-is-strain-wave-gear-harmonic-drive-a-perfect-gear-set-for-robotics-
> > > > > applications/
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I don't have the larger 47x35 bearings yet so I subbed in a
> 47x

[Emc-users] Resolver to quadrature converter.

[Sam Sokolik]

Andy had sent these to me years ago and I finally figured out why I
couldn't get them to work.

(Granted the ones that pico systems and mesa sell are better.)

https://youtu.be/xoHajQaHcOU

Wiki here...

http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ResolverToQuadratureConverter

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

That bearing was picked because it is a common wheel bearing you can get
pretty cheap.  (Double ball bearing). Plus you can pop it apart and grind
the race to create higher preload.

On Thu, Dec 2, 2021, 2:46 AM John Dammeyer  wrote:

> Nice to see that on Thingiverse.
>
> A couple of things that come to mind.  That is one huge bearing.   For the
> output shaft how much end play does it allow?
>
> An output shaft like that with a couple of cheap tapered trailer bearings
> instead of an unobtanium bearing.   Provide stl/stp models of the parts the
> gears (and bearings) fit into.
>
> Now granted someone in real life wouldn't make those parts from plastic
> but as a model to demonstrate the entire unit would be really nice.  An
> exploded diagram showing how the motor is attached to the wave generator.
> For example I can't quite figure out how you lock it onto the shaft.
>
> John
>
>
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: December-01-21 8:50 PM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> >
> > I have seen that video too!  I watch too much youtube..   It doesn't
> really
> > look that strong..mine stalled at 35ftlb or 47.45Nm
> >
> > Oh - I am officially a thingiverser...
> >
> > https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5151905
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 10:24 PM Chris Albertson <
> albertson.ch...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > The Step file I sent is fully functional when imported to Fusion360.
> > >
> > > There are a few changes I would make too.  If the problem is the cup
> > > flexing, Maybe try some accordion pleats, a few broad sine-like curves
> in
> > > the cup.  Why are the wals cylindrical?
> > >
> > > Another idea is to remove the bottom from the cup so it is just a tube
> and
> > > not a cup then cut a square wave patters on the bottom and drive ot
> with a
> > > disk with an interlocking pattern. Then there is no more bending on the
> > > booton radius.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 3:38 PM John Dammeyer 
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Chris sent me a zip with the project step file.  This one I was able
> to
> > > > load and save.  The individual part files were not editable.
> > > >
> > > > However, once I saved that imported step file as the entire assembly
> > > > AlibreCAD saved it as a series of assemblies and part files;  88 in
> all
> > > > including the original step file.  The assembly does not have any
> > > > constraints so once you pull the pieces apart it's hard to put them
> back
> > > > without adding in constraints.
> > > >
> > > > Anyway, these are editable.
> > > > If anyone wants a zip with the .AD_ASM and .AD_PRT files I'll pass
> it on.
> > > > At this point you load Harmonic Drive Project v45.AD_ASM and can
> edit the
> > > > individual part files although they can't be saved from within the
> part
> > > > editing.  Only inside the assembly.
> > > >
> > > > But separately they can be edited.  Probably a bug in Alibre.  They
> don't
> > > > call it Read Only or Read/Write but locked and unlocked.
> > > >
> > > > John
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > -Original Message-
> > > > > From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
> > > > > Sent: December-01-21 2:59 PM
> > > > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive
> > > > >
> > > > > If it is too much work, ask me and I will re-export the entire
> model
> > > from
> > > > > Fusion360 to STEP, and I'm sure there will be no read-only as
> Fusion360
> > > > > does not do that.
> > > > >
> > > > > I also want to re-organize it, like at least placing all the nuts
> and
> > > > > screws in a "hardware" component so that can all be turned off and
> on
> > > at
> > > > > once rather than doing 100+ clicks
> > > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 2:53 PM John Dammeyer <
> jo...@autoartisans.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> &

Re: [Emc-users] Resolver to quadrature converter.

[Sam Sokolik]

Part 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoHajQaHcOU

On Thu, Dec 2, 2021 at 12:19 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Andy had sent these to me years ago and I finally figured out why I
> couldn't get them to work.
>
> (Granted the ones that pico systems and mesa sell are better.)
>
> https://youtu.be/xoHajQaHcOU
>
> Wiki here...
>
> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ResolverToQuadratureConverter
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Resolver to quadrature converter.

[Sam Sokolik]

this is what happens when you short out the op-amp with the
oscilloscope probe..  Good thing I have 2...

https://photos.app.goo.gl/wzKK3JSgVtdbBmfM6

On Mon, Dec 6, 2021 at 12:21 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Part 2
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoHajQaHcOU
>
> On Thu, Dec 2, 2021 at 12:19 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>
>> Andy had sent these to me years ago and I finally figured out why I
>> couldn't get them to work.
>>
>> (Granted the ones that pico systems and mesa sell are better.)
>>
>> https://youtu.be/xoHajQaHcOU
>>
>> Wiki here...
>>
>> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ResolverToQuadratureConverter
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

Hmm - seems we are making things a bit more complicated than they need to
be..  Why didn't the simple flex gear work ok?   You need to make the
system with fine enough splines that the flexure is at a minimum...You
can lower the backlash to a minimum by applying a small amount of
pressure to the system.

sam

On Fri, Dec 17, 2021 at 7:46 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> Alright.  So it spins really freely but keeping the planetary cluster
> centred is a bit of an issue.  So the attached photo shows roughly (very
> roughly) what I had in mind.
>
> With the right coupler between the motor and the gear cluster the
> planetary assembly should stay in the same place.  There really isn't any
> axial load.  There is a place for a 40mmx19mm bearing that I happen to have
> on hand.
>
> But what about the driven ring gear?  In one of the model shops today I
> saw a package of 100 5.5mm stainless steel balls they sell for putting into
> paint bottles to help mix them up.
>
> Seemed and ideal size for a bearing race between the two ring gears.  Kind
> of like what Gene H. stated he did on his setup.  (Pictures?)  So the Blue
> Gear is fixed.  The Green Rotates.  The lazy susan like bearing between
> handles axial pressure in the direction of the blue gear.  But really the
> only thing holding up the green ring gear is the planetary assembly.
>
> Say we wanted to mount a face plate or chuck onto the green gear.  I'm
> open to ideas on how to stabilize that.  Sketches would be great.
>
> Methinks a part that surrounds the blue gear and extends over the green
> and they also have a bearing race between.  Or we make a similar bearing
> mount to the rear one for the front with the gear cluster holding this in
> place extended out to the bearing.  Now the faceplate is attached to this.
> But a lot more axial twist on the small bearing in the middle.
>
> Thanks
> John
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

Did you watch this video til the end?  I time stamped it.

https://youtu.be/eW1GGI55Epc?t=878

sam



On Mon, Dec 20, 2021 at 12:26 PM Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> On Fri, Dec 17, 2021 at 6:05 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>
> > Hmm - seems we are making things a bit more complicated than they need to
> > be..  Why didn't the simple flex gear work ok?   You need to make the
> > system with fine enough splines that the flexure is at a minimum...
> You
> > can lower the backlash to a minimum by applying a small amount of
> > pressure to the system.
> >
>
> The problem with small splines is that he is making this with printed
> plastic.   There is a minimum feature size that works.  Seriously you want
> to stay above module 0.5 and bigger if you can.   Mod 1.0 is more
> realistic  There are two reasons.  (1) plastic is not very strong unless
> you make the parts big and (2) the printer makes parts with dimensional
> tolerances of about 0.4 mm so if your parts have 1mm features you can
> expect 50% dimensional errors.  That said, modulo 1.0 gears work really
> well.  Smaler ones have a short life.
>
> Finally ANY flexing at all is the death of printed parts.  They fail by the
> failure of interlayer adhesion.  Think of printed plastic like it is soft
> pine wood.  When making gears from yellow pine, the direction of the grain
> matters a lot and no one would think of making module 0.5 gears with pine.
>
> I've been able to build an entire CNC conversion kit for a mini-mill from
> printed plastic.  The stuff is VERY rigid and strong if you make the parts
> large enough
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >
> > sam
> >
> > On Fri, Dec 17, 2021 at 7:46 PM John Dammeyer 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Alright.  So it spins really freely but keeping the planetary cluster
> > > centred is a bit of an issue.  So the attached photo shows roughly
> (very
> > > roughly) what I had in mind.
> > >
> > > With the right coupler between the motor and the gear cluster the
> > > planetary assembly should stay in the same place.  There really isn't
> any
> > > axial load.  There is a place for a 40mmx19mm bearing that I happen to
> > have
> > > on hand.
> > >
> > > But what about the driven ring gear?  In one of the model shops today I
> > > saw a package of 100 5.5mm stainless steel balls they sell for putting
> > into
> > > paint bottles to help mix them up.
> > >
> > > Seemed and ideal size for a bearing race between the two ring gears.
> > Kind
> > > of like what Gene H. stated he did on his setup.  (Pictures?)  So the
> > Blue
> > > Gear is fixed.  The Green Rotates.  The lazy susan like bearing between
> > > handles axial pressure in the direction of the blue gear.  But really
> the
> > > only thing holding up the green ring gear is the planetary assembly.
> > >
> > > Say we wanted to mount a face plate or chuck onto the green gear.  I'm
> > > open to ideas on how to stabilize that.  Sketches would be great.
> > >
> > > Methinks a part that surrounds the blue gear and extends over the green
> > > and they also have a bearing race between.  Or we make a similar
> bearing
> > > mount to the rear one for the front with the gear cluster holding this
> in
> > > place extended out to the bearing.  Now the faceplate is attached to
> > this.
> > > But a lot more axial twist on the small bearing in the middle.
> > >
> > > Thanks
> > > John
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
>
> --
>
> Chris Albertson
> Redondo Beach, California
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Harmonic Drive

[Sam Sokolik]

Yes - because I cannot easily make the harmonic drive out of metal..  Hence
the 3d printed bits.  I have run it for 24 hours at about 700 rpm..   The
gears still look good.  You are engaging a substantial amount of teeth - I
think errors are probably pretty minimal.  I could certainly throw a high
count encoder on it and plot the errors.  (and the normal use case of a 4th
axis isn't full out 100% of the time..)

https://photos.app.goo.gl/MA6tpCP8doLCd9Xn9

sam

On Mon, Dec 20, 2021 at 12:51 PM Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> Yes, he used maybe 30 pounds of metal parts.   And I only saw a few degrees
> of rotation in the video, run it for 100 hours and see what happens.   Flex
> is what kills the plastic so after 100 hours it will have had a few million
> cycles.   But still it is 99% made of metal.
>
> I want to see a 100% plastic unit stand up to 100 hours of use.  It can be
> done but not if the plastic parts flex.
>
> On Mon, Dec 20, 2021 at 10:39 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>
> > Did you watch this video til the end?  I time stamped it.
> >
> > https://youtu.be/eW1GGI55Epc?t=878
> >
> > sam
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Dec 20, 2021 at 12:26 PM Chris Albertson <
> > albertson.ch...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > On Fri, Dec 17, 2021 at 6:05 PM Sam Sokolik 
> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hmm - seems we are making things a bit more complicated than they
> need
> > to
> > > > be..  Why didn't the simple flex gear work ok?   You need to make the
> > > > system with fine enough splines that the flexure is at a minimum...
> > > You
> > > > can lower the backlash to a minimum by applying a small amount of
> > > > pressure to the system.
> > > >
> > >
> > > The problem with small splines is that he is making this with printed
> > > plastic.   There is a minimum feature size that works.  Seriously you
> > want
> > > to stay above module 0.5 and bigger if you can.   Mod 1.0 is more
> > > realistic  There are two reasons.  (1) plastic is not very strong
> unless
> > > you make the parts big and (2) the printer makes parts with dimensional
> > > tolerances of about 0.4 mm so if your parts have 1mm features you can
> > > expect 50% dimensional errors.  That said, modulo 1.0 gears work really
> > > well.  Smaler ones have a short life.
> > >
> > > Finally ANY flexing at all is the death of printed parts.  They fail by
> > the
> > > failure of interlayer adhesion.  Think of printed plastic like it is
> soft
> > > pine wood.  When making gears from yellow pine, the direction of the
> > grain
> > > matters a lot and no one would think of making module 0.5 gears with
> > pine.
> > >
> > > I've been able to build an entire CNC conversion kit for a mini-mill
> from
> > > printed plastic.  The stuff is VERY rigid and strong if you make the
> > parts
> > > large enough
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > sam
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Dec 17, 2021 at 7:46 PM John Dammeyer <
> jo...@autoartisans.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Alright.  So it spins really freely but keeping the planetary
> cluster
> > > > > centred is a bit of an issue.  So the attached photo shows roughly
> > > (very
> > > > > roughly) what I had in mind.
> > > > >
> > > > > With the right coupler between the motor and the gear cluster the
> > > > > planetary assembly should stay in the same place.  There really
> isn't
> > > any
> > > > > axial load.  There is a place for a 40mmx19mm bearing that I happen
> > to
> > > > have
> > > > > on hand.
> > > > >
> > > > > But what about the driven ring gear?  In one of the model shops
> > today I
> > > > > saw a package of 100 5.5mm stainless steel balls they sell for
> > putting
> > > > into
> > > > > paint bottles to help mix them up.
> > > > >
> > > > > Seemed and ideal size for a bearing race between the two ring
> gears.
> > > > Kind
> > > > > of like what Gene H. stated he did on his setup.  (Pictures?)  So
> the
> > > > Blue
> > > > > Gear is fixed.  The Green Rotates.  The lazy susan like bearing
> > between
> > > > > handles axial pressure in the direction of the blue gear.  But

Re: [Emc-users] Choice of CNC conversions

[Sam Sokolik]

Because linuxcnc is so flexible - I actually did some testing between mach3
and linuxcnc when the new trajectory planner was being developed..

http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?NewTrajectoryControl

This is using linuxcnc to sample the step/direction signals from mach and
linuxcnc to plot and graph acc/vel and also visualize path following.

I also did it with grbl...

https://www.cnczone.com/forums/opensource-software/271966-grbl-logging-linuxcnc.html

sam

On Thu, Dec 23, 2021 at 3:34 PM Murray Lindeblom 
wrote:

> I think there is more fear of the unknown rather than any technical
> challenge in using a Linux based solution.  It's a new TV remote with
> different colored buttons.
>
> My concern is the precision of the resulting work using a solution that
> does not have real-time response to the control devices (i.e. how round are
> your circular holes).
>
> Is anyone aware of measured results that are documented comparing the
> various styles of CNC conversion?
>
> Murray
>
> On Thu, 23 Dec 2021 at 13:05, John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
>
> > Everyone is probably partying or drinking egg nog this close to Christmas
> > but on one of the local metal groups a new member posted that he was
> > converting his mill to CNC.
> >
> > His first posting:
> > "Just doing a cnc conversion to my Craftex knee mill, using the Acorn cnc
> > board and Clearpath Nema 34 servo's, direct drive. Motor has been
> converted
> > to VFD, and just installed a rotor encoder to measure RPM accurately.
> Post
> > some pic's when I'm done. Now I just have to learn g-code."
> >
> > Here's my question to him:
> > "May I ask why you chose Acorn over say a MESA Solution <
> > http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/search&search=7I76E%20>
> > and LinuxCNC running on a PC or Pi4. Granted Pi4 4GB is hard to find at
> the
> > moment but PCs can be had for next to nothing as well as LinuxCNC is
> free."
> >
> > And his answer:
> > "Did my research, liked that it was Windows compatible (sorry been at
> > computers too long and don't need to learn another set of headaches).
> > Additionally it is plug and play using the add on board from CNC4PC for
> the
> > Clearpath SDSK. Clearpath was to only choice based on the torque and
> built
> > in encoding and processing. Based on the basic encoder 0.000125 is
> possible
> > if all works as designed and the winds in the right direction."
> >
> > I checked and Clearpath motors are not cheap so I don't think money was
> an
> > obstacle.  And I understand being a Windows type about not wanting to
> learn
> > a new OS.  I've had a love/hate relationship with Unix/Linux since a
> PDP-10
> > in university.  No choice but to learn it for Beaglebone or Pi and now of
> > course LCNC.
> >
> > But I wonder if it wouldn't be a good idea in the new year to develop a
> > build thread that takes a beginner through conversion of a mill to LCNC
> so
> > it appears to be turnkey like the perhaps the ACORN CNC approach.
> >
> > Comments?
> > John
> >
> >
> >
> > "ELS! Nothing else works as well for your Lathe"
> > Automation Artisans Inc.
> > www dot autoartisans dot com
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Choice of CNC conversions

[Sam Sokolik]

Hmm..  so the realtime patches being integrated into Linux kernel is
worthless old technology?  They are waisting their time?  (This is
unrelated to LinuxCNC)

Currently LinuxCNC is being added to debian testing.  It will soon be part
of the debian repository.

On Fri, Dec 24, 2021, 12:54 PM Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> The problem that is limiting LCNC's wider use is that it is a very old
> design.  It is definitely not what anyone would design today.   And it is
> not what moderned users expect or want.   Documentation i=will not change
> what it is.
>
> Today, if this were being built again from scratch it would
>
> Run on any computer and not require some special real-time version of
> Linux.  The user interface would be written in some portable way so it
> could be accessed even on a iPad or Andriod tablet or from macOS or
> Windows. This is possible.   I proved it to myself just a few days
> ago.   I have a 12 DOF robot here that is being driven by a Raspberry Pi
> and the user interface is web-based or X11 based and in theory, should work
> on other platforms.
>
> Should not need a real-time OS on the computer.  The real-time stuff (al
> of it) goes in hardware,   Leaving only not-t=real-time tasks to the
> PC/Mac/iPhone
>
> It would configure 100% with no need to edit a single file by hand.
>
> It would have a conversational system so that a user could do simple things
> with no need to write g-code.
>
> People care less about if it is free then if it acts like the above.
>
> What I would do is design some kind of real-time module.  Perhaps that
> would be made of Mesa cards with different firmware or of microcontrollers
> like "Teensy" and each of these could handle some number of axies.  Maybe
> four.  Then you use multiple of these to drive a larger machine of a
> robot.
>
> The 1980's was 40 years ago.  Yes it really has been that long.  LCNC is
> using 1980s software technology and people today are expecting the 21st
> century and mostly getting what they expect.   Think of a basic 3D
> printer.  It is no different from a milling machine just mechanically
> lighter weight.  The whole thing, g_code interpreter and all is a cheap
> package with a self-contained controller  One does not need to hunt
> dumpsters for antique desktop PCs and then install specialist OSes on
> them.  The controller is built-in and pre-programmed.
>
> That said.  I use LCNC because it does what I want and uses the 40 years
> old (maybe 50 years old now) technology I'm familiar with.   Yes it is that
> Old.  I was a computer science student back when this wascutting edge and
> I'm retired now.
>
> Big goals for any new system should be
> 1) cross platform, especially mobile device friendly
> 2) zero file editing (zero, not just a small number)
> 3) modular, you can swap out parts and add parts as requirements change.
> 4) today we have "The Cloud"  It could live at Amazon or in your own shop.
> Some prefer to let a big company manage things, others like to buy their
> own equipment is mess with it themselves.   Either way should work.   But a
> modern CNC system would run any number of mills and lathes and laser
> cutters and have any number of user interface screens and pendants.  Jobs
> are moved and assigned to available shop equipment as needed.  The cloud
> (local or remote, acts as a kind of NxM switch with storage and computation
> while the local controller talks to motors.   Today, I expect "job
> persistence" as I move between screens that are on my Phone or in the
> office of the shop. The cloud connects running processes that are on a
> milling machine with the design files and operator screens while the
> microsecond-level real-time jobs are handled by any number of little
> controllers.   TodayI'd add cameras to the system too.   I decent model is
> "Octoprint".  I can control or monitor prints from any screen.Any
> screen in the building or in my pocket could control any screen with no
> handoff required.  Just sign-on and your work is there.
>
> The problem is that all of the above would take many man-years of
> development and there is no motivation to work on this for free.  There
> needs to be some kind of business model.  Some conly has to design they
> will develop this andthen make a living by consulting and hosts cloud
> processes.
>
> But without an changes LCNC will be using 60 year old tech inanother 10
> years, then 70 and so on.  It is already a non-starter in the eyes of many
> people.   it will just get more and more that way.
>
> The market for this is huge. Some one could make millions but the up front
> effort and the existing big players will prevent that.
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 24, 2021 at 2:46 AM Jérémie Tarot  wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > Le jeu. 23 déc. 2021 à 20:05, John Dammeyer  a
> > écrit :
> >
> > > ...
> >
> > But I wonder if it wouldn't be a good idea in the new year to develop a
> > > build thread that takes a beginner through conversion of a mill to LCNC
> > so
> > > it appea

Re: [Emc-users] Choice of CNC conversions

[Sam Sokolik]

The Kearney and trecker

On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 5:33 PM Feral Engineer 
wrote:

> The pay walls, axis limits and markups on accessories are the reasons I
> avoided centroid.
>
> The thing I love most about Linuxcnc is the flexibility, reliability and
> yes, classicladder - or at least ladder based plc in general, which makes
> it incredibly easy to figure out for someone with an industrial electronics
> background. I do miss some of the functionality of industrial controls
> inside of LinuxCNC that I think should be implemented, but all in all, it's
> an incredible tool.
>
> I do think that in order for it to gain traction, it needs some more "black
> box" usability, though. As an example, an input sniffer to assign hal pins
> to button presses on a game controller or hardware buttons on a Mesa card
> would be kinda cool to implement.
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
>
> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
> www.patreon.com/theferalengineer
>
> On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 4:38 PM gene heskett  wrote:
>
> > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 1:30:42 PM EST John Dammeyer wrote:
> > > Hi Mark,
> > > I'll summarize your basic premise here that all machines are different.
> > > That's true!
> > >
> > > And MACH2/3/4 has a huge user base without ever needing a command line
> > > editor.  So if it can be done for Windows then certainly it can be done
> > > for LCNC.
> > >
> > > Having said that I'm also not suggesting we do away with the underbelly
> > of
> > > what is LCNC.   Please recall my original post in this subject.   The
> > > ACORN based system cannot run an old iron system with existing servo
> > > drives.  It's likely it can't even run a system with a STMBL drive that
> > > faults on low power supply voltage which mine does because I have a
> soft
> > > start delay on mine so ENABLE shows up before the Voltage is there.
> > > Doesn't look like it can even do step/dir for the spindle (which MACH3
> > > can).  So there is a place for the 'raw' LinuxCNC install and HAL/INI
> > > file model.
> > >
> > > But that user I mentioned wasn't interested in learning a new OS and
> the
> > > ACORN was a one stop shop for the Ethernet controlled step/dir/VFD/IO
> > > board and windows CNC software.  He went with Clearpath Servos so he
> > > wasn't adverse to spending money.  He could just as easily have
> installed
> > > LCNC 2.8.2 and the MESA board with terminal strips and used the config
> > > screens in AXIS and I suspect for less money.  But the LinuxOS itself
> > > appeared to also scare him away so he likely would never be a user.
> > >
> > > I think everyone who likes using an editor for configuration and
> issuing
> > > multiple commands with a command line interface has already been
> brought
> > > over to the dark side so to speak.   They aren't the market for
> expanding
> > > the LCNC user base.
> > >
> > > I've attached a screen shot of something I've been playing with.  Took
> > > about an hour to write using a modern GUI based software development
> > > tool; in this case Lazarus Free Pascal.  The TCanvas Property has all
> > > sorts of drawing tools so I thought I'd take a quick look at the Axis
> > > source code.  To see how easy it would be to port over the Preview
> screen
> > > to Pascal.
> > >
> > > I was immediately reminded of something I written many years ago by
> > > Nicholas Wirth the author of Pascal.  "Those who learn Fortran as their
> > > first language are brain damaged for life". Rather harsh actually and
> > > taken out of context appears elitist .  OTOH, 4195 lines of essentially
> > > undocumented python code does look like a lot of the Fortran code the
> > > Electrical Engineers were writing in University while we in the Comp
> Sci.
> > > stream were writing in structured languages Algol-68.  And those were
> not
> > > for GUI type interfaces which add to complexity.
> > >
> > > For example:
> > > if o.canon:
> > > x = (o.canon.min_extents[0] + o.canon.max_extents[0])/2
> > > y = (o.canon.min_extents[1] + o.canon.max_extents[1])/2
> > > z = (o.canon.min_extents[2] + o.canon.max_extents[2])/2
> > > o.set_centerpoint(x, y, z)
> > >
> > > If you go searching for o.cannon you find:
> > >   o.canon = canon = AxisCanon(o, widgets.text, i, progress,
> arcdivision)
> > >
> > > Search for AxisCAnon and we find the object definition:
> > > class AxisCanon(GLCanon, StatMixin):
> > >
> > > Now we're into the include side of things where the rs274 library is
> > > needed: from rs274.interpret import StatMixin
> > > from rs274.glcanon import GLCanon, GlCanonDraw
> > >
> > > which takes us to here:
> > > https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/lib/python/rs274/
> > glcanon.
> > > py which is another 1886 lines of undocumented code.
> > >
> > > The excuses that will be made for no documentation will be the same
> ones
> > > given for command line operation 

Re: [Emc-users] Choice of CNC conversions

[Sam Sokolik]

Lol.. let me do that again...

The Kearney and Trecker has at least 96 i\o and 5+ analog axis.  Everything
(and I mean everything) is controlled within LinuxCNC using classic ladder,
Hal and one poorly written realtime component to do the spindle shifting.
Been 100% stable for years.

Sam

On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 5:35 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> The Kearney and trecker
>
> On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 5:33 PM Feral Engineer 
> wrote:
>
>> The pay walls, axis limits and markups on accessories are the reasons I
>> avoided centroid.
>>
>> The thing I love most about Linuxcnc is the flexibility, reliability and
>> yes, classicladder - or at least ladder based plc in general, which makes
>> it incredibly easy to figure out for someone with an industrial
>> electronics
>> background. I do miss some of the functionality of industrial controls
>> inside of LinuxCNC that I think should be implemented, but all in all,
>> it's
>> an incredible tool.
>>
>> I do think that in order for it to gain traction, it needs some more
>> "black
>> box" usability, though. As an example, an input sniffer to assign hal pins
>> to button presses on a game controller or hardware buttons on a Mesa card
>> would be kinda cool to implement.
>>
>> Phil T.
>> The Feral Engineer
>>
>> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
>> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
>>
>> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
>> www.patreon.com/theferalengineer
>>
>> On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 4:38 PM gene heskett  wrote:
>>
>> > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 1:30:42 PM EST John Dammeyer wrote:
>> > > Hi Mark,
>> > > I'll summarize your basic premise here that all machines are
>> different.
>> > > That's true!
>> > >
>> > > And MACH2/3/4 has a huge user base without ever needing a command line
>> > > editor.  So if it can be done for Windows then certainly it can be
>> done
>> > > for LCNC.
>> > >
>> > > Having said that I'm also not suggesting we do away with the
>> underbelly
>> > of
>> > > what is LCNC.   Please recall my original post in this subject.   The
>> > > ACORN based system cannot run an old iron system with existing servo
>> > > drives.  It's likely it can't even run a system with a STMBL drive
>> that
>> > > faults on low power supply voltage which mine does because I have a
>> soft
>> > > start delay on mine so ENABLE shows up before the Voltage is there.
>> > > Doesn't look like it can even do step/dir for the spindle (which MACH3
>> > > can).  So there is a place for the 'raw' LinuxCNC install and HAL/INI
>> > > file model.
>> > >
>> > > But that user I mentioned wasn't interested in learning a new OS and
>> the
>> > > ACORN was a one stop shop for the Ethernet controlled step/dir/VFD/IO
>> > > board and windows CNC software.  He went with Clearpath Servos so he
>> > > wasn't adverse to spending money.  He could just as easily have
>> installed
>> > > LCNC 2.8.2 and the MESA board with terminal strips and used the config
>> > > screens in AXIS and I suspect for less money.  But the LinuxOS itself
>> > > appeared to also scare him away so he likely would never be a user.
>> > >
>> > > I think everyone who likes using an editor for configuration and
>> issuing
>> > > multiple commands with a command line interface has already been
>> brought
>> > > over to the dark side so to speak.   They aren't the market for
>> expanding
>> > > the LCNC user base.
>> > >
>> > > I've attached a screen shot of something I've been playing with.  Took
>> > > about an hour to write using a modern GUI based software development
>> > > tool; in this case Lazarus Free Pascal.  The TCanvas Property has all
>> > > sorts of drawing tools so I thought I'd take a quick look at the Axis
>> > > source code.  To see how easy it would be to port over the Preview
>> screen
>> > > to Pascal.
>> > >
>> > > I was immediately reminded of something I written many years ago by
>> > > Nicholas Wirth the author of Pascal.  "Those who learn Fortran as
>> their
>> > > first language are brain damaged for life". Rather harsh actually and
>> > > taken out of context appears elitist .  OTOH, 4195 lin

Re: [Emc-users] Choice of CNC conversions

[Sam Sokolik]

Hmm - I mean - if you want to do a ton of reading - you can watch the
journey...  This was a big project because it originally was 2.5 axis
hydraulic servos.

https://www.cnczone.com/forums/linuxcnc-formerly-emc2-/25929-large-brushed-servo-setup-cheap-wip.html
then
https://www.cnczone.com/forums/vertical-mill-lathe-project-log/24-large-kearney-amp-trecker-hmc-conversion.html

On Mon, Dec 27, 2021 at 6:34 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> Web Link?
>
> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> >
> > Lol.. let me do that again...
> >
> > The Kearney and Trecker has at least 96 i\o and 5+ analog axis.
> Everything
> > (and I mean everything) is controlled within LinuxCNC using classic
> ladder,
> > Hal and one poorly written realtime component to do the spindle shifting.
> > Been 100% stable for years.
> >
> > Sam
> >
> > On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 5:35 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> >
> > > The Kearney and trecker
> > >
> > > On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 5:33 PM Feral Engineer <
> theferalengin...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> The pay walls, axis limits and markups on accessories are the reasons
> I
> > >> avoided centroid.
> > >>
> > >> The thing I love most about Linuxcnc is the flexibility, reliability
> and
> > >> yes, classicladder - or at least ladder based plc in general, which
> makes
> > >> it incredibly easy to figure out for someone with an industrial
> > >> electronics
> > >> background. I do miss some of the functionality of industrial controls
> > >> inside of LinuxCNC that I think should be implemented, but all in all,
> > >> it's
> > >> an incredible tool.
> > >>
> > >> I do think that in order for it to gain traction, it needs some more
> > >> "black
> > >> box" usability, though. As an example, an input sniffer to assign hal
> pins
> > >> to button presses on a game controller or hardware buttons on a Mesa
> card
> > >> would be kinda cool to implement.
> > >>
> > >> Phil T.
> > >> The Feral Engineer
> > >>
> > >> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> > >> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
> > >>
> > >> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
> > >> www.patreon.com/theferalengineer
> > >>
> > >> On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 4:38 PM gene heskett 
> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 1:30:42 PM EST John Dammeyer wrote:
> > >> > > Hi Mark,
> > >> > > I'll summarize your basic premise here that all machines are
> > >> different.
> > >> > > That's true!
> > >> > >
> > >> > > And MACH2/3/4 has a huge user base without ever needing a command
> line
> > >> > > editor.  So if it can be done for Windows then certainly it can be
> > >> done
> > >> > > for LCNC.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Having said that I'm also not suggesting we do away with the
> > >> underbelly
> > >> > of
> > >> > > what is LCNC.   Please recall my original post in this subject.
>  The
> > >> > > ACORN based system cannot run an old iron system with existing
> servo
> > >> > > drives.  It's likely it can't even run a system with a STMBL drive
> > >> that
> > >> > > faults on low power supply voltage which mine does because I have
> a
> > >> soft
> > >> > > start delay on mine so ENABLE shows up before the Voltage is
> there.
> > >> > > Doesn't look like it can even do step/dir for the spindle (which
> MACH3
> > >> > > can).  So there is a place for the 'raw' LinuxCNC install and
> HAL/INI
> > >> > > file model.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > But that user I mentioned wasn't interested in learning a new OS
> and
> > >> the
> > >> > > ACORN was a one stop shop for the Ethernet controlled
> step/dir/VFD/IO
> > >> > > board and windows CNC software.  He went with Clearpath Servos so
> he
> > >> > > wasn't adverse to spending money.  He could just as easily have
> > >> installed
> > >> > > LCNC 2.8.2 and the MESA board with terminal strips and used the
> config
> > >>

Re: [Emc-users] Choice of CNC conversions

[Sam Sokolik]

wow - that was a walk down memory lane..  JohnK, JonE and Peter all posted
in those threads...

On Mon, Dec 27, 2021 at 7:16 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Hmm - I mean - if you want to do a ton of reading - you can watch the
> journey...  This was a big project because it originally was 2.5 axis
> hydraulic servos.
>
>
> https://www.cnczone.com/forums/linuxcnc-formerly-emc2-/25929-large-brushed-servo-setup-cheap-wip.html
> then
>
> https://www.cnczone.com/forums/vertical-mill-lathe-project-log/24-large-kearney-amp-trecker-hmc-conversion.html
>
> On Mon, Dec 27, 2021 at 6:34 PM John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
>
>> Web Link?
>>
>> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
>> >
>> > Lol.. let me do that again...
>> >
>> > The Kearney and Trecker has at least 96 i\o and 5+ analog axis.
>> Everything
>> > (and I mean everything) is controlled within LinuxCNC using classic
>> ladder,
>> > Hal and one poorly written realtime component to do the spindle
>> shifting.
>> > Been 100% stable for years.
>> >
>> > Sam
>> >
>> > On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 5:35 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>> >
>> > > The Kearney and trecker
>> > >
>> > > On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 5:33 PM Feral Engineer <
>> theferalengin...@gmail.com>
>> > > wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> The pay walls, axis limits and markups on accessories are the
>> reasons I
>> > >> avoided centroid.
>> > >>
>> > >> The thing I love most about Linuxcnc is the flexibility, reliability
>> and
>> > >> yes, classicladder - or at least ladder based plc in general, which
>> makes
>> > >> it incredibly easy to figure out for someone with an industrial
>> > >> electronics
>> > >> background. I do miss some of the functionality of industrial
>> controls
>> > >> inside of LinuxCNC that I think should be implemented, but all in
>> all,
>> > >> it's
>> > >> an incredible tool.
>> > >>
>> > >> I do think that in order for it to gain traction, it needs some more
>> > >> "black
>> > >> box" usability, though. As an example, an input sniffer to assign
>> hal pins
>> > >> to button presses on a game controller or hardware buttons on a Mesa
>> card
>> > >> would be kinda cool to implement.
>> > >>
>> > >> Phil T.
>> > >> The Feral Engineer
>> > >>
>> > >> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
>> > >> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
>> > >>
>> > >> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
>> > >> www.patreon.com/theferalengineer
>> > >>
>> > >> On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 4:38 PM gene heskett 
>> wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >> > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 1:30:42 PM EST John Dammeyer wrote:
>> > >> > > Hi Mark,
>> > >> > > I'll summarize your basic premise here that all machines are
>> > >> different.
>> > >> > > That's true!
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > And MACH2/3/4 has a huge user base without ever needing a
>> command line
>> > >> > > editor.  So if it can be done for Windows then certainly it can
>> be
>> > >> done
>> > >> > > for LCNC.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Having said that I'm also not suggesting we do away with the
>> > >> underbelly
>> > >> > of
>> > >> > > what is LCNC.   Please recall my original post in this subject.
>>  The
>> > >> > > ACORN based system cannot run an old iron system with existing
>> servo
>> > >> > > drives.  It's likely it can't even run a system with a STMBL
>> drive
>> > >> that
>> > >> > > faults on low power supply voltage which mine does because I
>> have a
>> > >> soft
>> > >> > > start delay on mine so ENABLE shows up before the Voltage is
>> there.
>> > >> > > Doesn't look like it can even do step/dir for the spindle (which
>> MACH3
>> > >> > > can).  So there is a place for the 'raw' LinuxCNC install and
>> HAL/INI
>> > >> > > file model.
>&g

Re: [Emc-users] Very good software backlash control demo.

[Sam Sokolik]

This has been done at a bigger scale...  (2 feedback loops)

https://web.archive.org/web/20160222165548/http://jmkasunich.com/cgi-bin/blosxom/shoptask/wichita-trip-02-20-08.html

http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Combining_Two_Feedback_Devices_On_One_Axis

On Mon, Jan 3, 2022, 8:42 PM Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> CNC is about precision motion control.   Here is a new idea where this
> builder gets 0.05mm accuracy but uses hobby level R/C servo  Not only that,
> but he connects three of these in series, one to the next to the next so
> all the backlashes and poor tolerances add together.  Then he uses this to
> do precise motion.  He loads a mechanical pencil with this chain of cheap
> parts.
>
> What does this means for LCNC?  It means that someone has found a software
> solution to backlash.   What he does is place a quadrature encoder on both
> the motor and the output shaft.The difference in encoder reading is an
> exact measure of mechanical backlash and effective gear ratio.He can
> measure the backlash under different conditions and store the
> measurements.  Then he places a cascaded PID controller and Kalman filter
> over this hardware.
>
> Technically the problem with backlash control via software is the delay
> from input to output pays poorly with the PID algorithm.  He applies a
> predictive model.
>
> Checkup this video.  It is unimpressive if you have a  $100,000 CNC milling
> machine, but he is using a linked chain of hobby servos.  The novel idea is
> his software.   It is on github, you can read it.
> https://youtu.be/gq-P39rfRqU
>
> He explains it  here.   Notice in the video he shows the backlash.  The
> gear-slop is at the 1/4 inch level but using his software backlash
> correction you can see the results in the dial indicator is about 0.05mm
> (or about 0.002 in American units)  Not bad given the truly horrible
> mechanics.
> https://youtu.be/SioCwvR_PYY
>
> Why do I care?   I have a robot-dog leg here on my workbench using hobby
> servos, let's say performance could be improved.   But the anti-lash
> technique might be used on a real milling machine. Maybe one of the
> experts here could look and see if it could be applied?I will use parts
> of his idea on my dog-bot.
>
> --
>
> Chris Albertson
> Redondo Beach, California
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Very good software backlash control demo.

[Sam Sokolik]

I think this just would work with linuxcnc and scales + motor encoders.
WIth the scales using only I in the 2 pid loops - it would be constantly
correcting backlash to keep the position..  (that is what the G&L did)

sam

On Mon, Jan 3, 2022 at 9:50 PM Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> I think his method would work for your mill.   Yes the tool pushed the
> table and the table moves.   What he does is not just a double loop.  He
> models the movement of the table and predicts how it will move.To do
> this on a mill you would need encoders on the table and then run a
> calibration cycle that measure table movement as a function of force.
>
> Then as the mill cuts he can update the model parameter in real time by
> seeing if the predicted table motion matches the actual table motion.
>
> In this video he loads a pencil.  He says (in comments some place) the
> reason for the initial slow movement is that the system is measuring flex
> vs. force applied as it puts the lead in the pencil.   after a second or so
> the data is good enough the system can move faster.  You can see the rate
> of lead insertion gets faster.  It is because he has better data.
> https://youtu.be/GCHXNcpq3OA
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 3, 2022 at 7:02 PM John Dammeyer 
> wrote:
>
> > Interesting concept.  I notice that although he showed his finger pushing
> > on the jaws (and text said compensation turned off) we never saw him
> > disturb the jaws with compensation on.  That he can position accurately
> is
> > pretty cool.  But backlash on my X axis results in the milling cutter
> > pulling or pushing the table under heavy cuts.
> >
> > The only real solution is ball screws or double nut ACME.
> >
> > Now for a robot arm that does pick and place of work "on to"/"off of" the
> > mill or a conveyor belt maybe it's not an issue?
> > John
> >
> >
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
> > > Sent: January-03-22 6:40 PM
> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > Subject: [Emc-users] Very good software backlash control demo.
> > >
> > > CNC is about precision motion control.   Here is a new idea where this
> > > builder gets 0.05mm accuracy but uses hobby level R/C servo  Not only
> > that,
> > > but he connects three of these in series, one to the next to the next
> so
> > > all the backlashes and poor tolerances add together.  Then he uses this
> > to
> > > do precise motion.  He loads a mechanical pencil with this chain of
> cheap
> > > parts.
> > >
> > > What does this means for LCNC?  It means that someone has found a
> > software
> > > solution to backlash.   What he does is place a quadrature encoder on
> > both
> > > the motor and the output shaft.The difference in encoder reading is
> > an
> > > exact measure of mechanical backlash and effective gear ratio.He
> can
> > > measure the backlash under different conditions and store the
> > > measurements.  Then he places a cascaded PID controller and Kalman
> filter
> > > over this hardware.
> > >
> > > Technically the problem with backlash control via software is the delay
> > > from input to output pays poorly with the PID algorithm.  He applies a
> > > predictive model.
> > >
> > > Checkup this video.  It is unimpressive if you have a  $100,000 CNC
> > milling
> > > machine, but he is using a linked chain of hobby servos.  The novel
> idea
> > is
> > > his software.   It is on github, you can read it.
> > > https://youtu.be/gq-P39rfRqU
> > >
> > > He explains it  here.   Notice in the video he shows the backlash.  The
> > > gear-slop is at the 1/4 inch level but using his software backlash
> > > correction you can see the results in the dial indicator is about
> 0.05mm
> > > (or about 0.002 in American units)  Not bad given the truly horrible
> > > mechanics.
> > > https://youtu.be/SioCwvR_PYY
> > >
> > > Why do I care?   I have a robot-dog leg here on my workbench using
> hobby
> > > servos, let's say performance could be improved.   But the anti-lash
> > > technique might be used on a real milling machine. Maybe one of the
> > > experts here could look and see if it could be applied?I will use
> > parts
> > > of his idea on my dog-bot.
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Chris Albertson
> > > Redondo Beach, California
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
>
> --
>
> Chris Albertson
> Redondo Beach, California
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://

Re: [Emc-users] Very good software backlash control demo.

[Sam Sokolik]

I think it is just easy to have 2 pid's and sum them..  (one on the motor
encoder with P,D and feed forward - the other with scales and the I term)
Then you are not re-writing the pid component for some odd corner case.

sam

On Mon, Jan 3, 2022 at 10:36 PM gene heskett  wrote:

> On Monday, January 3, 2022 11:00:54 PM EST Sam Sokolik wrote:
> > I think this just would work with linuxcnc and scales + motor encoders.
> > WIth the scales using only I in the 2 pid loops - it would be constantly
> > correcting backlash to keep the position..  (that is what the G&L did)
> >
> > sam
>
> Or, better yet, using the new 3 phase servo steppers where the motor
> encoder
> only feeds the driver, use a PID to drive the stepgen, and feed only the
> scale back to the PID with only the FF0=1, and Igain active?
>
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 3, 2022 at 9:50 PM Chris Albertson <
> albertson.ch...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > I think his method would work for your mill.   Yes the tool pushed the
> > > table and the table moves.   What he does is not just a double loop.
> He
> > > models the movement of the table and predicts how it will move.To
> do
> > > this on a mill you would need encoders on the table and then run a
> > > calibration cycle that measure table movement as a function of force.
> > >
> > > Then as the mill cuts he can update the model parameter in real time by
> > > seeing if the predicted table motion matches the actual table motion.
> > >
> > > In this video he loads a pencil.  He says (in comments some place) the
> > > reason for the initial slow movement is that the system is measuring
> > > flex
> > > vs. force applied as it puts the lead in the pencil.   after a second
> or
> > > so the data is good enough the system can move faster.  You can see the
> > > rate of lead insertion gets faster.  It is because he has better data.
> > > https://youtu.be/GCHXNcpq3OA
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, Jan 3, 2022 at 7:02 PM John Dammeyer 
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > > > Interesting concept.  I notice that although he showed his finger
> > > > pushing
> > > > on the jaws (and text said compensation turned off) we never saw him
> > > > disturb the jaws with compensation on.  That he can position
> > > > accurately
> > >
> > > is
> > >
> > > > pretty cool.  But backlash on my X axis results in the milling cutter
> > > > pulling or pushing the table under heavy cuts.
> > > >
> > > > The only real solution is ball screws or double nut ACME.
> > > >
> > > > Now for a robot arm that does pick and place of work "on to"/"off of"
> > > > the
> > > > mill or a conveyor belt maybe it's not an issue?
> > > > John
> > > >
> > > > > -Original Message-
> > > > > From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
> > > > > Sent: January-03-22 6:40 PM
> > > > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > > > Subject: [Emc-users] Very good software backlash control demo.
> > > > >
> > > > > CNC is about precision motion control.   Here is a new idea where
> > > > > this
> > > > > builder gets 0.05mm accuracy but uses hobby level R/C servo  Not
> > > > > only
> > > >
> > > > that,
> > > >
> > > > > but he connects three of these in series, one to the next to the
> > > > > next
> > >
> > > so
> > >
> > > > > all the backlashes and poor tolerances add together.  Then he uses
> > > > > this
> > > >
> > > > to
> > > >
> > > > > do precise motion.  He loads a mechanical pencil with this chain of
> > >
> > > cheap
> > >
> > > > > parts.
> > > > >
> > > > > What does this means for LCNC?  It means that someone has found a
> > > >
> > > > software
> > > >
> > > > > solution to backlash.   What he does is place a quadrature encoder
> > > > > on
> > > >
> > > > both
> > > >
> > > > > the motor and the output shaft.The difference in encoder
> reading
> > > > > is
> > > >
> > > > an
> > > >
> > > > > exact measure of mechanical backlash and effective gear ratio.
&

[Emc-users] 60's vintage position feedback.. (GE Accupins)

[Sam Sokolik]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogUdjX3zerY

The plan is to use the arduino to count the phase difference between the
input and output.  The original control used a 250khz clock frequency to
count - the coils are driven with 250hz.  So they could divide each .1" pin
by 1000.  This gave the machine a .0001 resolution.

sam

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] 60's vintage position feedback.. (GE Accupins)

[Sam Sokolik]

My plan is to use the 16 bit timer on the arduino to trigger on the input
square wave rising edge and then count until it see's the return wave
form rising edge. (the return waveform will get converted to a square
wave)  Atleast that is the plan...

SO - I guess it comes down to how accurate the phase relationship is
between the 2 signals and how high a frequency you are using to count
between edgees...

On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 3:00 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Fri, 21 Jan 2022 at 08:54, andy pugh  wrote:
>
> > You might be able to do a lot better than that if you can find a way
> > to have the Arduino set timers on interrupts.
> > (How fast does the Arduino run a polling loop?)
>
> I haven't watched the video yet (I am in a meeting :-) but I am not
> clear on how the sampling rate relates to the positional accuracy.
>
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] 60's vintage position feedback.. (GE Accupins)

[Sam Sokolik]

Remember - the excitation signal is 250hz   I want to measure wave form
to wave form within that at a minimum of 1000 counts.  Not much power
needed..

sam

On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 9:09 AM Les Newell 
wrote:

> The only issue on an Uno would be interrupt latency. If you disable all
> other interrupts, latency should be easily low enough. The only real
> advantage of going to ARM is interrupt priority. You could assign the
> sampling interrupt to maximum priority without having to disable other
> interrupts.
>
> Les
>
> On 21/01/2022 14:55, Ralph Stirling wrote:
> > I would suggest starting with a more capable microcontroller.  I like
> the $15 Adafruit ItsyBitsy M4 modules, which are programmable with the
> Arduino IDE, but have a 120MHz clock, 32 bit timers, floating point
> hardware, and two 1Mhz 12bit adc's.  Their processor is an ATSAMD51 (Cortex
> M4).  The original Uno is very limited for precision timing.
> >
> > -- Ralph
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] 60's vintage position feedback.. (GE Accupins)

[Sam Sokolik]

day 2...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZ6Xuvo6zWs

On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 9:12 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Remember - the excitation signal is 250hz   I want to measure wave
> form to wave form within that at a minimum of 1000 counts.  Not much power
> needed..
>
> sam
>
> On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 9:09 AM Les Newell 
> wrote:
>
>> The only issue on an Uno would be interrupt latency. If you disable all
>> other interrupts, latency should be easily low enough. The only real
>> advantage of going to ARM is interrupt priority. You could assign the
>> sampling interrupt to maximum priority without having to disable other
>> interrupts.
>>
>> Les
>>
>> On 21/01/2022 14:55, Ralph Stirling wrote:
>> > I would suggest starting with a more capable microcontroller.  I like
>> the $15 Adafruit ItsyBitsy M4 modules, which are programmable with the
>> Arduino IDE, but have a 120MHz clock, 32 bit timers, floating point
>> hardware, and two 1Mhz 12bit adc's.  Their processor is an ATSAMD51 (Cortex
>> M4).  The original Uno is very limited for precision timing.
>> >
>> > -- Ralph
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] 60's vintage position feedback.. (GE Accupins)

[Sam Sokolik]

https://youtu.be/7HtqwcKDlCk

On Sun, Jan 23, 2022, 6:47 PM Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> This
>
> On Sun, Jan 23, 2022 at 4:30 PM andy pugh  wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 22 Jan 2022 at 04:49, Chris Albertson  >
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Arduino?   Too slow to coune pulses if they happen every 0.0001 inch
> > unless
> > > the table moves slow.
> >
> > As long as it gets a couple of samples every 0.1" it should be fine.
> > Between the pins it's an absolute encoder, like a multi-turn resolver.
> >
> > Though I would still suggest using one of the M4 or M0 boards from
> > Adafruit, as the clock rate and floating point performance are just
> > orders of magnitude higher, for about twice the cost.
> >
>
> That is about what I suggested. "Pico" is a dual core M0. Adafruit has them
> for $4 each.
> https://www.adafruit.com/product/4864
> So yes, orders of magnitude better but half, not twice the cost.
>
> The price is so low that it is little different from free.   That for two
> M0 cores at 125 MHz and 8 of those programmable state machine, also at
> 125MHz. and 2 MB of flash.  Very good documentation.
>
> Works with Arduino IDE and runs most Arduio code but you can program it
> with Python too.
>
>
>
>
> > --
> > atp
> > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > lunatics."
> > — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
>
> --
>
> Chris Albertson
> Redondo Beach, California
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Stepper PID

[Sam Sokolik]

Could you post your configs?  Could your hal functions be out of order?  I
run pid steppers with RPI and don't notice this.

Sam

On Wed, Feb 2, 2022, 3:01 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Wed, 2 Feb 2022 at 07:44, Thaddeus Waldner  wrote:
>
> > 2) why is servo thread jitter even making into the stepper pulse train
> with a Mesa Ethernet card and no communication errors? Do I have anything
> misconfigured?
>
> The idea of using a PID is that it compensates for the fact that the
> servo thread updates don't get to the card exactly every servo period.
> Sometimes the feedback - calculate - send of the required step rate
> will run early, sometimes late.
>
> I am hoping that PCW might pop up to explain exactly why the PID helps
> here. It's not something I have paid that much attention to as I
> rarely use steppers.
>
> It might be interesting to try a non-pid config. (or just set P to
> zero which has about the same effect)
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Stepper PID

[Sam Sokolik]

I don't see the configs..  Did I miss something?

On Wed, Feb 2, 2022 at 8:32 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Wed, 2 Feb 2022 at 14:22, Thaddeus Waldner  wrote:
>
> > Here is a short video that illustrates the problem.
> > https://youtu.be/DdYYpdC51Vs
>
> Admittedly I watched it with the sound off, but the P=100 looks "softer".
>
> Maybe try going back to P=1000 but drop the axis, joint and stepgen
> maxaccel down a bit.
>
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Probably a silly question about G76 and G33

[Sam Sokolik]

That is very odd.  Never seen that and the code base hasn't been touched
for a while..  Can you post your hal config?

sam

On Wed, Feb 9, 2022 at 9:04 AM Leonardo Marsaglia 
wrote:

> NOTE: I retire that thing about the problem not happening for larger
> pitches. It happens with any pitch I try. Only the first revolution works
> well.
>
> El mié, 9 feb 2022 a las 11:56, Leonardo Marsaglia ( >)
> escribió:
>
> > Hello guys,
> >
> > First of all I hope you're doing well and sorry for not being that active
> > here. Lots of things to do but thankfully everything goes pretty well.
> >
> > Today I first tried to use the Mazak lathe we converted to LCNC to do
> some
> > single point threading and I find I have a really strange behaviour.
> >
> > So here goes the problem:
> >
> > Let's say I program a 5 mm pitch thread or a 5 mm increment synchronized
> > move. No problem, the tool positions itself in the right starting point
> and
> > waits for the index to trigger. When that happens, the Z axis moves the 5
> > mm per revolution but only for the first revolution of the spindle (I
> > checked this turning the spindle by hand). After that the motion gets
> > ridiculously slow as if the scale of the encoder no longer is the same. I
> > noticed that this doesn't not happen for larger pitches.
> >
> > I double checked my spindle.0.revs and went up to 1 for a full revolution
> > and then resets to 0 to start over again. (positive values for clockwise
> > rotation).
> >
> > I'm using Linuxcnc 2.8.0 pre1-5538-g21d7db0 on that particular machine.
> > Didn't bother to upgrade because it worked perfectly for everything else.
> > Could this be a bug in that particular pre release?
> >
> > Thanks as always.
> >
> >
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Pi4 with LinuxCNC and MESA 7i92H

[Sam Sokolik]

I still have the pi and 7i92 running on the green machine.  I don't
remember the last time I got a realtme error.  But I run

Idle=poll isolcpus = 1,2,3 (going from memory)

Force turbo = 1

And I think I have a bit of an overclock.


On Sun, Mar 6, 2022, 6:24 AM Jérémie Tarot  wrote:

> Le dim. 6 mars 2022 à 12:40, Robin Szemeti via Emc-users <
> emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net> a écrit :
>
> >
> > Any bright ideas on how to add a second ethernet port to the Pi?
> >
>
>
> An USB ethernet adapter should solve your problem easily!
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Pi4 with LinuxCNC and MESA 7i92H

[Sam Sokolik]

hey - I have the configs / Pi files here

https://electronicsam.com/images/greenmachine/config/

sam

On Sun, Mar 6, 2022 at 12:16 PM Chris Albertson 
wrote:

> On Sun, Mar 6, 2022 at 3:40 AM Robin Szemeti via Emc-users <
> emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote:
>
> > The Pi4 and a Mesa ethernet card seemed like a brilliant idea when I
> bought
> > mine ... I now regret it.  The networking nightmare it has caused is
> > painful.  There is no WiFi down in my shed, only wired ethernet, so I had
> > to put in a WiFi to ethernet bridge, connectivity is odd, sometimes it
> > appears on the network, sometimes it doesn't.
> >
> > Any bright ideas on how to add a second ethernet port to the Pi?
> >
>
> First off to you really need the Pi to be on the Internet while it is
> cutting metal?  If not the simple solution is to connect the Pi, Mesa board
> and home Ethernet to a switch and pull the plug on the home ethernet when
> the Pi is cutting metal.
>
> If you want a more elegant solution then buy a "managed" switch then allows
> you to define a V-LAN and have the switch basically remove the
> external Ethernet when you don't want it.  doing the same thing as
> unplugging it.  You would need to write a script to reconfigure the switch.
>
> But you could add a second Ethernet port using a USB3-Ethernet dongle like
> this amazon.com/TP-Link-Ethernet-UE306-...
> <
> https://www.amazon.com/TP-Link-Ethernet-UE306-Foldable-10-11-10-15/dp/B09GRL3VCN/ref=asc_df_B09GRL3VCN/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=563598683736&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=7967367747260015957&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031026&hvtargid=pla-1457086693568&th=1
> >
>
> Using a second Ethernet port does not remove the processing the Pi has to
> do to look at the packets on the second port.  The manages switch or
> simply unplugging the cable completely solves the issue
>
>
>
> >
> > On Sun, 6 Mar 2022 at 02:19, gene heskett  wrote:
> >
> > > On Saturday, 5 March 2022 19:12:45 EST John Dammeyer wrote:
> > > > I had to clean off my workbench for another project so the Pi4 has
> been
> > > > boxed for a short while.  But in mentioning LCNC to a friend who was
> > > > buying a used PC (Intel NUC7i5BNH) that he should download the latest
> > > > LinuxCNC Image and run the latency test to see how well it would work
> > > > for LCNC.
> > > >
> > > > I then mentioned I'd had my Pi4 running it but also told him about
> the
> > > > one time latency message I get every time I boot it.  That I suspect
> > > > it's due to also have the WiFi running in addition to the Ethernet to
> > > > 7i92H.
> > > >
> > > > So that's the background.
> > > >
> > > > Now the question.
> > > >
> > > > If LCNC has been ported over to a Pi4 should there even be a latency
> > > > issue?  It's a fixed hardware platform so that message on start-up
> has
> > > > always puzzled me but since it's just for playing around on the bench
> > > > and not doing real machining I've never really cared.
> > > >
> > > I've been running an old sheldon I rebuilt with ball screws etc. I have
> > > beem told that the hardware of the pi does not make use of the isolcpus
> > > command in the same manner that x86 hdwe does which may explain my
> > > latency testing results being in the 12 u-sec territory which my setup
> > > with a 7i90 using the spi interface seems to tolerate very well until I
> > > fire up FF while the test is running, and FF is a hog, quickly pushing
> > > the latency out to the 200 u-sec territory. However I have run a 50
> loop
> > > repeat of the lathe_pawn.ngc program, carving air while I browsed the
> > > news sites and I can count on one hnd the number of times my lathe
> > > actually stuttered in half and hours fooling around.
> > >
> > > I used the 7i90 and the spi interface to it, in order to preserve the
> > > pi's internet connectivity. The speed of the spi interface is amazing
> and
> > > I watched it on a 4 channel, 350mhz scope for hours trying to spot a
> com
> > > timing error that caused a repeat transmission going either way.  It
> > > hasn't happened. There has been zero com errors.
> > >
> > > That protocol uses 3 gpio lines as a serial port, sending data in 32
> bit
> > > packets to the 7i90, and getting its reply's back, sending and
> receiving
> > > clocks logged as it initializes the card at lcnc startup:
> > > hm2_rpspi: SPI0/CE0 clock rate: 41666000/2500 Hz, VPU clock rate:
> > > 5 Hz
> > > hm2_rpspi: SPI0/CE0 write clock rate calculated: 4166 Hz
> (clkdiv=12)
> > > hm2_rpspi: SPI0/CE0 read clock rate calculated: 2500 Hz (clkdiv=20)
> > > Note pleaase thats sending at 41.66 megahertz, and receiver the
> cards
> > > answers at 25.00 megahertz
> > >
> > > I'll submit that we do NOT have in the wintel cpu family, a com speed
> > > capable of moving data at 10% of that speed/bandwidth product. And has,
> > > as near as I can tell, zero effect on network performance while its
> doing
> > > it. So my goal of not 

Re: [Emc-users] Pi4 with LinuxCNC and MESA 7i92H

[Sam Sokolik]

I have been using one of those heatsink cases with passive cooling..

On Mon, Mar 7, 2022 at 9:31 AM Peter C. Wallace  wrote:

> On Mon, 7 Mar 2022, John Dammeyer wrote:
>
> > Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2022 00:00:41 -0800
> > From: John Dammeyer 
> > Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> > 
> > To: "'Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)'" <
> emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Pi4 with LinuxCNC and MESA 7i92H
> >
> > Thanks Gene,
> > Didn't even think to look there.  Was logged in remotely in the pi user
> folder and don't have access to the /boot.  (Just haven't given
> permission).  Went to the system and found it in /boot just as you said.
> >
> > console=serial0,115200 console=tty1 root=PARTUUID=f1b66b19-02
> rootfstype=ext4 elevator=deadline fsck.repair=yes isolcpus=3 idle=poll
> rootwait quiet splash plymouth.ignore-serial-consoles
> >
> > This site talks about
> >
> https://www.linuxtopia.org/online_books/linux_kernel/kernel_configuration/re46.html
> >
> > isolcpus=1,2,3
> > makes no difference.  The latency error still shows up.
> >
> > Here's some info on the ForceTurbo
> >
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/27-driver-boards/42413-rpi4-7i96-improving-ping-times
> >
> > But this implies the stock RPi4 will _not_ run LCNC without heatsin+fan
> plus boosting above stock.
> >
> > John
> >
>
> Force Turbo or the equivalent is needed for almost any real time operation,
> regardless of CPU type. Dynamic changing of CPU speeds almost always
> involves
> very long delays (sometimes many ms) so all such schemes must be disabled
> (SpeedStep, C1 states > 1, cool and quiet etc etc)
>
> I have a RPI4 thats been running LinuxCNC for a couple of years without a
> fan
> and without latency errors (but with a small stick-in heat sink) Without a
> heat
> sink, the RPI4's CPU speed will always be throttled when it gets too hot.
>
>
>
> Peter Wallace
> Mesa Electronivs
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Pi4 with LinuxCNC and MESA 7i92H

[Sam Sokolik]

FF?

On Mon, Mar 7, 2022 at 12:03 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> What 'FF' that isn't running?
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: gene heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
> > Sent: March-07-22 4:19 AM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Pi4 with LinuxCNC and MESA 7i92H
> >
> > On Monday, 7 March 2022 03:00:41 EST John Dammeyer wrote:
> > > Thanks Gene,
> > > Didn't even think to look there.  Was logged in remotely in the pi user
> > > folder and don't have access to the /boot.  (Just haven't given
> > > permission).  Went to the system and found it in /boot just as you
> > > said.
> > >
> > > console=serial0,115200 console=tty1 root=PARTUUID=f1b66b19-02
> > > rootfstype=ext4 elevator=deadline fsck.repair=yes isolcpus=3 idle=poll
> > > rootwait quiet splash plymouth.ignore-serial-consoles
> > >
> > > This site talks about
> > >
> https://www.linuxtopia.org/online_books/linux_kernel/kernel_configurati
> > > on/re46.html
> > >
> > > isolcpus=1,2,3
> > > makes no difference.  The latency error still shows up.
> >
> > Yup, the arms are a different beast. I get a very consisten 12 u-secs
> > here as long as FF isn't running, its an IRQ pig.
> >
> > > Here's some info on the ForceTurbo
> > >
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/27-driver-boards/42413-rpi4-7i96-improving-p
> > > ing-times
> > >
> > > But this implies the stock RPi4 will _not_ run LCNC without heatsin+fan
> > > plus boosting above stock.
> >
> > True, but an old 12 volt video card fan, re-oiled and running on 5 volts
> > from the same 5A supply running the pi, toss the wall wart, its not big
> > enough and it will crash, a half inch from those stick on heat sinks is
> > all the coolant mine has ever needed, and I don't think I'm boosting the
> > pi4's clock. Some of my hand controls to jog it, since a human is pretty
> > slow, are running on a 200hz thread to reduce the load on the 1 kilohertz
> > servo-thread, but I have experimentally run the servo-thread at 4
> > kilohertz w/o any problems for a couple weeks. Basically, the rpi3 has
> > its tongue dragging on the floor doing this, very little left when LCNC
> > is running, but the rpi4 has enough extra speed that even 4khz isn't a
> > problem. And 200hz is plenty fast enough for the hand controls.
> > >
> > > John
> > >
> > > > -Original Message-
> > > > From: gene heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
> > > > Sent: March-06-22 9:57 PM
> > > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Pi4 with LinuxCNC and MESA 7i92H
> > > >
> > > > On Sunday, 6 March 2022 23:20:41 EST John Dammeyer wrote:
> > > > > Hi Sam,
> > > > > I cannot find the equivalent of cmdline.txt on my Pi4 LinuxCNC
> > > > > system.
> > > > > This is the file that has the Idle=poll etc.  Does this mean it's
> > > > > not
> > > > > part of the default LinuxCNC implementation for a Pi4?
> > > > >
> > > > > So where does it go and how is it accessed?  Is there a how to
> > > > > document for this? Thanks
> > > > > John
> > > >
> > > > You probably didn't look in the right place John, if thats a raspios
> > > > install, aka raspian back in buster days, its in the /boot partition.
> > [...]
> > Take care and stay well John.
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> > --
> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
> >  - Louis D. Brandeis
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mes7pFZ90Fg

Have the x axis ball screw mostly figured out...

https://photos.app.goo.gl/ddodLA6dFu7Cdamv9

https://photos.app.goo.gl/9Wmha6zWBcSewhLv8

The ball nut flange needs a bit removed...

sam

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

Thought about it...  :)

On Fri, Mar 18, 2022 at 4:50 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 at 03:11, Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> >
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mes7pFZ90Fg
>
> If you fitted linear scales you could potentially have manual rapids
> by disengaging the half-nuts.
>
>
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

Haven't actually machined anything with the rotary axis yet.  Got side
tracked again...  No issues so far though..



On Sat, Mar 19, 2022 at 9:18 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> Hey Sam,
> Speaking of finishing things.  Do you ever use your 3D printed reduction
> drive? You did all the testing that ensured it was tough and reliable.
> Just wondering if it's now a permanent tool.
>
> John
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: March-17-22 8:07 PM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel
> lathe conversion.
> >
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mes7pFZ90Fg
> >
> > Have the x axis ball screw mostly figured out...
> >
> > https://photos.app.goo.gl/ddodLA6dFu7Cdamv9
> >
> > https://photos.app.goo.gl/9Wmha6zWBcSewhLv8
> >
> > The ball nut flange needs a bit removed...
> >
> > sam
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

Groan...  ;)

On Sun, Mar 20, 2022, 6:02 PM Ralph Stirling 
wrote:

> Sam, when you finish the lathe project we'll give you the Nebel prize.
>
> -- Ralph
>
> On Mar 18, 2022 7:33 AM, Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> email system.
>
>
> Thought about it...  :)
>
> On Fri, Mar 18, 2022 at 4:50 AM andy pugh  wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 18 Mar 2022 at 03:11, Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> > >
> > >
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Dmes7pFZ90Fg&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7C8d6e90e3bcac4a82508b08da08ec387c%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C1%7C637832107926025651%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=oPrGMdVC%2BNxOQEWA3q8SROJWCwju8%2BTSFUUK3JVYtFY%3D&reserved=0
> >
> > If you fitted linear scales you could potentially have manual rapids
> > by disengaging the half-nuts.
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > atp
> > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > lunatics."
> > — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7C8d6e90e3bcac4a82508b08da08ec387c%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C1%7C637832107926025651%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=%2Brr%2FME0qr5Sbo1LtzJ4Lu%2Fy2TkKGgPdllyJeThdp45A%3D&reserved=0
> >
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7C8d6e90e3bcac4a82508b08da08ec387c%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C1%7C637832107926025651%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=%2Brr%2FME0qr5Sbo1LtzJ4Lu%2Fy2TkKGgPdllyJeThdp45A%3D&reserved=0
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

Dad ground the ball screw nut..   everything fits nicely under the cross
slide it seems..  Found a bit of aluminium to make a simple bearing block
for 2 angular contact bearings..

https://photos.app.goo.gl/NcW1fxrBGBgXH1SPA
https://photos.app.goo.gl/jWwKR5Fvz9ae4bbR7
https://photos.app.goo.gl/jWwKR5Fvz9ae4bbR7

On Sun, Mar 20, 2022 at 5:56 PM gene heskett  wrote:

> On Sunday, 20 March 2022 18:07:01 EDT John Dammeyer wrote:
> > Gene,
> > The replacement ball bearing fan isn't on the bed fan duct but cools
> > the top part of the hot end where the filament enters the PTFE lined
> > feed pipe.
> >
> Ah, PTFE lined hot end. Needs tubing replaced as even at 200c nozzle
> temps, the stuff eventually goes away or leaks badly. Feed it PETG at
> 240C, goes away in 2 days. All metal hot ends are better, titainium heat
> breaks even better. Better yet I suspect is the copperhead copper/
> titainium combo but like the PCD nozzle, bring real money.
>
> > Problem solved which the new blower duct, now not aimed at the hot end,
> > did not completely fix.
>
> should be aimed at or just below the nozzle tip.
> >
> > Wrapped hot end block in insulating paper and Krylon tape.   Now nice
> > flat curves and no drop in temperature even with 98% bed fan speed.
> >
> > John
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: gene heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
> > > Sent: March-20-22 2:50 PM
> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything...
> > > Nebel lathe conversion.>
> > > On Sunday, 20 March 2022 16:46:17 EDT John Dammeyer wrote:
> > > > Story of my life.  Fan failed on 3D printer.  Repaired feed tube
> > > > and
> > > > replaced with ball bearing fan I had from power supply
> > > > manufacturing
> > > > inventory.   Almost 1 week later still not working quite the way it
> > > > was and the way I want. John
> > >
> > > ball bearing fans start easier, leads to over cooling the early
> > > layers. Change the min speed so its stopped for the 1st layer like
> > > it used to be at 25% power. Sleeve bearing fans often don't start at
> > > all till the mid 30% range.
> > >
> > > Try zero for the first layer or even as high as the third layer
> > > before
> > > the fan actually starts. I have a ball bearing fan on my BIQU BX and
> > > it runs plenty fast enough at 30% of max in cura for PETG which
> > > needs far less cooling than PLA. I don't mess with PLA at all, too
> > > brittle.
> > >
> > > I've also put a diamonback .4mm PCD nozzle in mine so I can use the
> > > carbon fiber filled PETG but haven't yet seen the need for its
> > > improved strength. I'm running the nozzle at 252C and the bed at 90C
> > > and my printed air manifold is air tight. Bed adhesion is only a
> > > problem getting stuff loose. Its almost too good. If the nozzle is
> > > slobbering, check how tight it is, then reduce the flow 2% at a time
> > > to stop the overflow, this PCD nozzle conducts heat into the
> > > filament better than brass, melting it better which can increase the
> > > flow. At 245C the part will not be airtight if you need that. At
> > > 252C the part gets noticably glossier because its more liquid and
> > > bonds well to the next layer down before it cools and solidify's.
> > >
> > > Take care and stay well John. And my teeny version to be used as the
> > > B
> > > axis driver on my 6040 mill, the one that costs around a tenner to
> > > make, seems to be pretty solid, got several hundred hours on it now
> > > but it probably going to get another 200 running a hard maple stick
> > > for a woodworkers leg vise screw. I've got to make an idler yet to
> > > tighten the belt as that is the only backlash it it.
> > >
> > > Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> > > --
> > >
> > > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> > >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > >
> > > -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> > > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law
> > > respectable.>
> > >  - Louis D. Brandeis
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

Sorry -  meant to post
https://photos.app.goo.gl/yBNmiD9rRkPCoNgJ8

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 7:19 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Dad ground the ball screw nut..   everything fits nicely under the cross
> slide it seems..  Found a bit of aluminium to make a simple bearing block
> for 2 angular contact bearings..
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/NcW1fxrBGBgXH1SPA
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/jWwKR5Fvz9ae4bbR7
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/jWwKR5Fvz9ae4bbR7
>
> On Sun, Mar 20, 2022 at 5:56 PM gene heskett  wrote:
>
>> On Sunday, 20 March 2022 18:07:01 EDT John Dammeyer wrote:
>> > Gene,
>> > The replacement ball bearing fan isn't on the bed fan duct but cools
>> > the top part of the hot end where the filament enters the PTFE lined
>> > feed pipe.
>> >
>> Ah, PTFE lined hot end. Needs tubing replaced as even at 200c nozzle
>> temps, the stuff eventually goes away or leaks badly. Feed it PETG at
>> 240C, goes away in 2 days. All metal hot ends are better, titainium heat
>> breaks even better. Better yet I suspect is the copperhead copper/
>> titainium combo but like the PCD nozzle, bring real money.
>>
>> > Problem solved which the new blower duct, now not aimed at the hot end,
>> > did not completely fix.
>>
>> should be aimed at or just below the nozzle tip.
>> >
>> > Wrapped hot end block in insulating paper and Krylon tape.   Now nice
>> > flat curves and no drop in temperature even with 98% bed fan speed.
>> >
>> > John
>> >
>> > > -Original Message-
>> > > From: gene heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
>> > > Sent: March-20-22 2:50 PM
>> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
>> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything...
>> > > Nebel lathe conversion.>
>> > > On Sunday, 20 March 2022 16:46:17 EDT John Dammeyer wrote:
>> > > > Story of my life.  Fan failed on 3D printer.  Repaired feed tube
>> > > > and
>> > > > replaced with ball bearing fan I had from power supply
>> > > > manufacturing
>> > > > inventory.   Almost 1 week later still not working quite the way it
>> > > > was and the way I want. John
>> > >
>> > > ball bearing fans start easier, leads to over cooling the early
>> > > layers. Change the min speed so its stopped for the 1st layer like
>> > > it used to be at 25% power. Sleeve bearing fans often don't start at
>> > > all till the mid 30% range.
>> > >
>> > > Try zero for the first layer or even as high as the third layer
>> > > before
>> > > the fan actually starts. I have a ball bearing fan on my BIQU BX and
>> > > it runs plenty fast enough at 30% of max in cura for PETG which
>> > > needs far less cooling than PLA. I don't mess with PLA at all, too
>> > > brittle.
>> > >
>> > > I've also put a diamonback .4mm PCD nozzle in mine so I can use the
>> > > carbon fiber filled PETG but haven't yet seen the need for its
>> > > improved strength. I'm running the nozzle at 252C and the bed at 90C
>> > > and my printed air manifold is air tight. Bed adhesion is only a
>> > > problem getting stuff loose. Its almost too good. If the nozzle is
>> > > slobbering, check how tight it is, then reduce the flow 2% at a time
>> > > to stop the overflow, this PCD nozzle conducts heat into the
>> > > filament better than brass, melting it better which can increase the
>> > > flow. At 245C the part will not be airtight if you need that. At
>> > > 252C the part gets noticably glossier because its more liquid and
>> > > bonds well to the next layer down before it cools and solidify's.
>> > >
>> > > Take care and stay well John. And my teeny version to be used as the
>> > > B
>> > > axis driver on my 6040 mill, the one that costs around a tenner to
>> > > make, seems to be pretty solid, got several hundred hours on it now
>> > > but it probably going to get another 200 running a hard maple stick
>> > > for a woodworkers leg vise screw. I've got to make an idler yet to
>> > > tighten the belt as that is the only backlash it it.
>> > >
>> > > Cheers, Gene Heskett.
>> > > --
>> > >
>> > > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>> > >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>&g

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

That was a generic ball screw from ebay with the ends machine.   My
understanding is the shaft is only surface hardened and is pretty soft
underneath.  (have not tried filing various areas of the ball screw though)

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 8:53 AM Leonardo Marsaglia 
wrote:

> Sam, have you had to soften the final portion of the ballscrew to machine
> that thread? I've never done it and the ones I'm mounting in the router are
> fixed (rotating nut).
>
> El lun, 21 mar 2022 a las 10:15, Sam Sokolik ()
> escribió:
>
> > Sorry -  meant to post
> > https://photos.app.goo.gl/yBNmiD9rRkPCoNgJ8
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 7:19 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> >
> > > Dad ground the ball screw nut..   everything fits nicely under the
> cross
> > > slide it seems..  Found a bit of aluminium to make a simple bearing
> block
> > > for 2 angular contact bearings..
> > >
> > > https://photos.app.goo.gl/NcW1fxrBGBgXH1SPA
> > > https://photos.app.goo.gl/jWwKR5Fvz9ae4bbR7
> > > https://photos.app.goo.gl/jWwKR5Fvz9ae4bbR7
> > >
> > > On Sun, Mar 20, 2022 at 5:56 PM gene heskett 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >> On Sunday, 20 March 2022 18:07:01 EDT John Dammeyer wrote:
> > >> > Gene,
> > >> > The replacement ball bearing fan isn't on the bed fan duct but cools
> > >> > the top part of the hot end where the filament enters the PTFE lined
> > >> > feed pipe.
> > >> >
> > >> Ah, PTFE lined hot end. Needs tubing replaced as even at 200c nozzle
> > >> temps, the stuff eventually goes away or leaks badly. Feed it PETG at
> > >> 240C, goes away in 2 days. All metal hot ends are better, titainium
> heat
> > >> breaks even better. Better yet I suspect is the copperhead copper/
> > >> titainium combo but like the PCD nozzle, bring real money.
> > >>
> > >> > Problem solved which the new blower duct, now not aimed at the hot
> > end,
> > >> > did not completely fix.
> > >>
> > >> should be aimed at or just below the nozzle tip.
> > >> >
> > >> > Wrapped hot end block in insulating paper and Krylon tape.   Now
> nice
> > >> > flat curves and no drop in temperature even with 98% bed fan speed.
> > >> >
> > >> > John
> > >> >
> > >> > > -Original Message-
> > >> > > From: gene heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
> > >> > > Sent: March-20-22 2:50 PM
> > >> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > >> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish
> anything...
> > >> > > Nebel lathe conversion.>
> > >> > > On Sunday, 20 March 2022 16:46:17 EDT John Dammeyer wrote:
> > >> > > > Story of my life.  Fan failed on 3D printer.  Repaired feed tube
> > >> > > > and
> > >> > > > replaced with ball bearing fan I had from power supply
> > >> > > > manufacturing
> > >> > > > inventory.   Almost 1 week later still not working quite the way
> > it
> > >> > > > was and the way I want. John
> > >> > >
> > >> > > ball bearing fans start easier, leads to over cooling the early
> > >> > > layers. Change the min speed so its stopped for the 1st layer like
> > >> > > it used to be at 25% power. Sleeve bearing fans often don't start
> at
> > >> > > all till the mid 30% range.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Try zero for the first layer or even as high as the third layer
> > >> > > before
> > >> > > the fan actually starts. I have a ball bearing fan on my BIQU BX
> and
> > >> > > it runs plenty fast enough at 30% of max in cura for PETG which
> > >> > > needs far less cooling than PLA. I don't mess with PLA at all, too
> > >> > > brittle.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > I've also put a diamonback .4mm PCD nozzle in mine so I can use
> the
> > >> > > carbon fiber filled PETG but haven't yet seen the need for its
> > >> > > improved strength. I'm running the nozzle at 252C and the bed at
> 90C
> > >> > > and my printed air manifold is air tight. Bed adhesion is only a
> > >> > > problem getting stuff loose. Its almost too good. If the nozzle is
> > >> > > 

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

The nut, though felt, pretty hard.

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 9:22 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> That was a generic ball screw from ebay with the ends machine.   My
> understanding is the shaft is only surface hardened and is pretty soft
> underneath.  (have not tried filing various areas of the ball screw though)
>
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 8:53 AM Leonardo Marsaglia 
> wrote:
>
>> Sam, have you had to soften the final portion of the ballscrew to machine
>> that thread? I've never done it and the ones I'm mounting in the router
>> are
>> fixed (rotating nut).
>>
>> El lun, 21 mar 2022 a las 10:15, Sam Sokolik ()
>> escribió:
>>
>> > Sorry -  meant to post
>> > https://photos.app.goo.gl/yBNmiD9rRkPCoNgJ8
>> >
>> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 7:19 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>> >
>> > > Dad ground the ball screw nut..   everything fits nicely under the
>> cross
>> > > slide it seems..  Found a bit of aluminium to make a simple bearing
>> block
>> > > for 2 angular contact bearings..
>> > >
>> > > https://photos.app.goo.gl/NcW1fxrBGBgXH1SPA
>> > > https://photos.app.goo.gl/jWwKR5Fvz9ae4bbR7
>> > > https://photos.app.goo.gl/jWwKR5Fvz9ae4bbR7
>> > >
>> > > On Sun, Mar 20, 2022 at 5:56 PM gene heskett 
>> > wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> On Sunday, 20 March 2022 18:07:01 EDT John Dammeyer wrote:
>> > >> > Gene,
>> > >> > The replacement ball bearing fan isn't on the bed fan duct but
>> cools
>> > >> > the top part of the hot end where the filament enters the PTFE
>> lined
>> > >> > feed pipe.
>> > >> >
>> > >> Ah, PTFE lined hot end. Needs tubing replaced as even at 200c nozzle
>> > >> temps, the stuff eventually goes away or leaks badly. Feed it PETG at
>> > >> 240C, goes away in 2 days. All metal hot ends are better, titainium
>> heat
>> > >> breaks even better. Better yet I suspect is the copperhead copper/
>> > >> titainium combo but like the PCD nozzle, bring real money.
>> > >>
>> > >> > Problem solved which the new blower duct, now not aimed at the hot
>> > end,
>> > >> > did not completely fix.
>> > >>
>> > >> should be aimed at or just below the nozzle tip.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Wrapped hot end block in insulating paper and Krylon tape.   Now
>> nice
>> > >> > flat curves and no drop in temperature even with 98% bed fan speed.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > John
>> > >> >
>> > >> > > -Original Message-
>> > >> > > From: gene heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
>> > >> > > Sent: March-20-22 2:50 PM
>> > >> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
>> > >> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish
>> anything...
>> > >> > > Nebel lathe conversion.>
>> > >> > > On Sunday, 20 March 2022 16:46:17 EDT John Dammeyer wrote:
>> > >> > > > Story of my life.  Fan failed on 3D printer.  Repaired feed
>> tube
>> > >> > > > and
>> > >> > > > replaced with ball bearing fan I had from power supply
>> > >> > > > manufacturing
>> > >> > > > inventory.   Almost 1 week later still not working quite the
>> way
>> > it
>> > >> > > > was and the way I want. John
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > ball bearing fans start easier, leads to over cooling the early
>> > >> > > layers. Change the min speed so its stopped for the 1st layer
>> like
>> > >> > > it used to be at 25% power. Sleeve bearing fans often don't
>> start at
>> > >> > > all till the mid 30% range.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Try zero for the first layer or even as high as the third layer
>> > >> > > before
>> > >> > > the fan actually starts. I have a ball bearing fan on my BIQU BX
>> and
>> > >> > > it runs plenty fast enough at 30% of max in cura for PETG which
>> > >> > > needs far less cooling than PLA. I don't mess with PLA at all,
>> too
>> > >> > > brittle.
>> > >> > >
>> 

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

we wrapped the ball screw and nut with plastic - dad went outside and
ground it with an angle grinder.  Then finished it up on the belt sander.
He took a couple breaks mainly so it didn't get too hot.  (it barely got
hot to the touch.)

We had thought about milling out the slot - but didn't want to risk having
it change the shape of the saddle.

sam

On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 11:03 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 at 12:23, Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> >
> > Dad ground the ball screw nut.
>
> Inventive :-)
>
> I have used the RSH style a couple of times now.
>
> http://www.gtenballscrew.com.tw/Page/Product/ProductDetail.aspx?ProductCategoryNo=123&ProductNo=15
> Odd that the 16mm is smaller than the 12mm, but that might be
> explained by the 16mm having an external ball-return tube that isn't
> shown in the diagram.
>
> There is a pic of it here:
> https://bodgesoc.blogspot.com/2016/08/holbrook08.html
>
>
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Homebuilt encoder

[Sam Sokolik]

I am running a 48ish tooth gear with gear tooth sensors - it counts up to
10k with mesa.

http://electronicsam.com/images/greenmachine/20190401_150213.jpg
http://electronicsam.com/images/greenmachine/20190403_175734.jpg

sam



On Sun, Mar 27, 2022 at 4:27 PM dave engvall  wrote:

> At high rpm a resolver may make more sense ... and more $$. Depends. ??
>
> Dave
>
> On 3/27/22 2:03 PM, ken.stra...@gmail.com wrote:
> > Gene, do you have a part number for your high RPM Omron encoder? Maybe I
> can
> > snag one...
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: gene heskett 
> > Sent: March 27, 2022 4:49 PM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Homebuilt encoder
> >
> > On Sunday, 27 March 2022 15:45:48 EDT ken.stra...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> If you want spindle positioning (for more accurate probing of
> >> alignment for tool changes for examples) you'll need the encoder to
> >> follow the position at all speeds. Are there high RPM capable absolute
> >> encoders at a reasonable price?
> > The one I have on the rear end of that 1hp motor, an Omron 1000 ppr,
> cost me
> > $21 on fleabay 6 years ago. Its a differential model I'm converting to
> ttl
> > in a pair of rs485 to ttl interfaces that cost about $2 each, driving a
> 5i25
> > card. NO optics in that path. Absolute it is not, but if the encoder
> tracks,
> > who cares.
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> > --
> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
> >   - Louis D. Brandeis
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Homebuilt encoder

[Sam Sokolik]

I don't know - maybe over-thinking this a bit?  I have 2 machines using
gear tooth sensors.  Both rigid tap perfectly without issues.

http://electronicsam.com/images/matsuura/sensors1.jpg

On Thu, Mar 31, 2022 at 8:32 AM gene heskett  wrote:

> On Thursday, 31 March 2022 07:57:53 EDT andrew beck wrote:
> > For those interested I decided I really should start to use the forum
> > so people can search later for stuff hopefully I help someone.
> >
> > I have started on the gear sensor style encoder.
> >
> >
> > Hope it works.  Let me know your thoughts
> >
> > https://forum.linuxcnc.org/show-your-stuff/45498-linuxcnc-machine-shop->
> fun-thread
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Andrew
> >
> > On Sun, 27 Mar 2022, 22:21 Andy Pugh,  wrote:
> > > > On 27 Mar 2022, at 08:09, andrew beck 
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > And is bigger dia better for higher resolution?
> > >
> > > Probably not, as it will perhaps have more scope to oscillate at
> > > 10,000 rpm.
> > >
> > > Don’t neglect the purely mechanical design of this fast-spinning
> > > part.
> > >
> > > Have you considered optical sensors rather than inductive?
> > >
> > > What will be counting the pulses?
> > >
> > > LinuxCNC can lathe-thread with one sensor.
> > > But rigid-tapping is different as it needs to accurately detect the
> > > reversal point. So you need three channels for index and full
> > > quadrature.
>
> And this is the problem with useing an ats-667 gear sensor. It switches
> on the approach, so the switch point, in only watching one edge, will
> have a different switch point depending on the direction. Some day, I've
> got the fix that.  Needs a circuit from the quad detectors direction
> output, to dynamically switch the polarity of its pulse depending on
> which direction the quad detector says its turning. Thats active
> circuitry and needs to be MUCH faster than a hal thread. Probably in pure
> hardware. Ideally for that, an edge detector watching and firing on both
> edges with the first one "cocking" a trigger, and the second pulse then
> gated to the index circuit. That way the pulse seen as an index would be
> the one generated as the center of the trigger tooth is passing over the
> center of the ats-667. The ats-667 stays in that state until the next
> trigger is aproaching. So turning in one direction, its on 96% of the
> time, but in the other direction its off 96% of the time.
>
> > > Work out what error you can accept in the reversal point detection
> > > (as a fraction of thread pitch) and you can get a feel for how many
> > > slots you need.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] custom | stock bearing nut

[Sam Sokolik]

wow - I had a hard enough time finding  12mm x 1..  The local hardware
store actually  had 'jam nuts' in that pitch.  I can't say I have ever run
across .8  - are you sure? ;)

sam



On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 11:47 AM dave engvall  wrote:

> Hi all,
> I have a pair of ball screws: THK KX 71227 A
> These are new but older and as far as I can tell not on the THK site.
> They are threaded on one end to retain a bearing.
> M15 x 0.8 or close. Does anyone know of a bearing nut that would fit or
> am I stuck with
> having a pair custom made?
> I've spent a fair amount of time searching the web but maybe (probably)
> someone else's  google foo is better than mine.
> As always TIA
>
> Dave
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] custom | stock bearing nut

[Sam Sokolik]

look at that - they actually make a tap..

https://www.ebay.com/itm/255422311969?hash=item3b785b2e21:g:hmoAAOSwI4VdVsri

On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 11:57 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> wow - I had a hard enough time finding  12mm x 1..  The local hardware
> store actually  had 'jam nuts' in that pitch.  I can't say I have ever run
> across .8  - are you sure? ;)
>
> sam
>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 11:47 AM dave engvall  wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>> I have a pair of ball screws: THK KX 71227 A
>> These are new but older and as far as I can tell not on the THK site.
>> They are threaded on one end to retain a bearing.
>> M15 x 0.8 or close. Does anyone know of a bearing nut that would fit or
>> am I stuck with
>> having a pair custom made?
>> I've spent a fair amount of time searching the web but maybe (probably)
>> someone else's  google foo is better than mine.
>> As always TIA
>>
>> Dave
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

The cross slide has around 17 inches of travel... Crazy..

https://photos.app.goo.gl/Z4NKdazgTGVAkPtD8
https://photos.app.goo.gl/hjk4Wb4kbZAjTnRZ9

sam





On Thu, Mar 24, 2022 at 6:53 AM Stuart Stevenson  wrote:

> The only thing I would add to Andy's comments about machining hard steel
> with carbide is to get a green stone and remove the built up edge after
> every pass. Heat is what kills the cutter.
>
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2022 at 11:34 AM Leonardo Marsaglia  >
> wrote:
>
> > >
> > > I have machined a number of ballscrews. Typically I peel of the outer
> > > hardened layer with CBN-tipped tools, but mainly because I have some.
> > > It can be done with normal carbide, though you might need more than
> > > one.
> > > Very high surface speed and very light cuts is the way to go.
> > >
> > > https://youtu.be/SmuZXXP_hMY
> >
> >
> > Nice Andy! I have some sumitomo CBN inserts I purchased from ebay a while
> > back because they were really cheap but never used it because I'm always
> > lacking the tool holder...
> >
> > El lun, 21 mar 2022 a las 12:54, andy pugh ()
> > escribió:
> >
> > > On Mon, 21 Mar 2022 at 13:53, Leonardo Marsaglia <
> ldmarsag...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Sam, have you had to soften the final portion of the ballscrew to
> > machine
> > > > that thread? I've never done it and the ones I'm mounting in the
> router
> > > are
> > > > fixed (rotating nut).
> > >
> > > I have machined a number of ballscrews. Typically I peel of the outer
> > > hardened layer with CBN-tipped tools, but mainly because I have some.
> > > It can be done with normal carbide, though you might need more than
> > > one.
> > > Very high surface speed and very light cuts is the way to go.
> > >
> > > https://youtu.be/SmuZXXP_hMY
> > >
> > > --
> > > atp
> > > "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > > designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > > lunatics."
> > > — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
>
> --
> Addressee is the intended audience.
> If you are not the addressee then my consent is not given for you to read
> this email furthermore it is my wish you would close this without saving or
> reading, and cease and desist from saving or opening my private
> correspondence.
> Thank you for honoring my wish.
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

Most likely it needs that movement because it can spin 30 + inches ;)

sam

On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 5:46 AM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Wed, 6 Apr 2022 at 20:22, Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> >
> > The cross slide has around 17 inches of travel... Crazy..
>
> For gang-tooling perhaps?
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

X is almost ready to test...

https://photos.app.goo.gl/GzyjvC49J2rTXyaG8


On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 8:18 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Most likely it needs that movement because it can spin 30 + inches ;)
>
> sam
>
> On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 5:46 AM andy pugh  wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 6 Apr 2022 at 20:22, Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>> >
>> > The cross slide has around 17 inches of travel... Crazy..
>>
>> For gang-tooling perhaps?
>>
>> --
>> atp
>> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
>> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
>> lunatics."
>> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Coordinate systems for horizontal spindles

[Sam Sokolik]

Lol - I always make sure that when I am visualizing a piece of graph paper
on the machine - when I command a positive for both x and y - the tool
would move up and to the right on the paper..  (and Z negative gets the
tool closer to the part)

sam

On Mon, Apr 11, 2022 at 12:07 PM Todd Zuercher 
wrote:

> I bet that there are a lot of horizontals out there configured backwards.
> (Had never really thought about it myself, never worked with one.)
>
> Todd Zuercher
> P. Graham Dunn Inc.
> 630 Henry Street
> Dalton, Ohio 44618
> Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
>
> -Original Message-
> From: andy pugh 
> Sent: Monday, April 11, 2022 12:22 PM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
> Subject: [Emc-users] Coordinate systems for horizontal spindles
>
> [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.
>
> I realised last night that the coordinate system on my mill is incorrect
> when I run the horizontal spindle.
>
> Curiously nearly every diagram that I can find online also seems to be
> incorrect. Or, at least, ambiguous.
>
>
> https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.app.goo.gl%2FXuzUowMJyK3ffabD9&data=04%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgrahamdunn.com%7Ce7b1ea09f6664d3146e308da1bd7be7a%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0%7C0%7C637852910703088784%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=Vq2wnD%2FHC2j960X0o2xNMplBhRstQ%2FJggAdlnqtKTVE%3D&reserved=0
> = Ambiguous
>
> https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.app.goo.gl%2FiczsGEAgDueBfnCT9&data=04%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgrahamdunn.com%7Ce7b1ea09f6664d3146e308da1bd7be7a%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0%7C0%7C637852910703088784%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=N52HdspbmvhOdw%2BjnqoVksBY1VbGA%2B27UJjat8zG5ME%3D&reserved=0
> = Left-handed
>
> And:
> https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.app.goo.gl%2FdSkmwhBPRojMJXdx8&data=04%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgrahamdunn.com%7Ce7b1ea09f6664d3146e308da1bd7be7a%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0%7C0%7C637852910703088784%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=VxL%2B02cEd5j%2BqADBgGG5RdhINmX3rzvTBUrBBIXFLio%3D&reserved=0
> = Correct...
>
> It's taken me 10 years to notice, but I am going to have to reverse my X
> axis in horizontal mode.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
> - George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>
> https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgrahamdunn.com%7Ce7b1ea09f6664d3146e308da1bd7be7a%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0%7C0%7C637852910703088784%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=VZmWPRkt%2Bk4aO5svD96KFi8rTin3D8qzWKNHuEQiBjU%3D&reserved=0
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Coordinate systems for horizontal spindles

[Sam Sokolik]

I try to not look at the moving bits - that gets confusing..

On Mon, Apr 11, 2022 at 12:18 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Lol - I always make sure that when I am visualizing a piece of graph paper
> on the machine - when I command a positive for both x and y - the tool
> would move up and to the right on the paper..  (and Z negative gets the
> tool closer to the part)
>
> sam
>
> On Mon, Apr 11, 2022 at 12:07 PM Todd Zuercher 
> wrote:
>
>> I bet that there are a lot of horizontals out there configured backwards.
>> (Had never really thought about it myself, never worked with one.)
>>
>> Todd Zuercher
>> P. Graham Dunn Inc.
>> 630 Henry Street
>> Dalton, Ohio 44618
>> Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: andy pugh 
>> Sent: Monday, April 11, 2022 12:22 PM
>> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
>> Subject: [Emc-users] Coordinate systems for horizontal spindles
>>
>> [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.
>>
>> I realised last night that the coordinate system on my mill is incorrect
>> when I run the horizontal spindle.
>>
>> Curiously nearly every diagram that I can find online also seems to be
>> incorrect. Or, at least, ambiguous.
>>
>>
>> https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.app.goo.gl%2FXuzUowMJyK3ffabD9&data=04%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgrahamdunn.com%7Ce7b1ea09f6664d3146e308da1bd7be7a%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0%7C0%7C637852910703088784%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=Vq2wnD%2FHC2j960X0o2xNMplBhRstQ%2FJggAdlnqtKTVE%3D&reserved=0
>> = Ambiguous
>>
>> https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.app.goo.gl%2FiczsGEAgDueBfnCT9&data=04%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgrahamdunn.com%7Ce7b1ea09f6664d3146e308da1bd7be7a%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0%7C0%7C637852910703088784%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=N52HdspbmvhOdw%2BjnqoVksBY1VbGA%2B27UJjat8zG5ME%3D&reserved=0
>> = Left-handed
>>
>> And:
>> https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.app.goo.gl%2FdSkmwhBPRojMJXdx8&data=04%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgrahamdunn.com%7Ce7b1ea09f6664d3146e308da1bd7be7a%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0%7C0%7C637852910703088784%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=VxL%2B02cEd5j%2BqADBgGG5RdhINmX3rzvTBUrBBIXFLio%3D&reserved=0
>> = Correct...
>>
>> It's taken me 10 years to notice, but I am going to have to reverse my X
>> axis in horizontal mode.
>>
>> --
>> atp
>> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed
>> for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
>> - George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>>
>> https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgrahamdunn.com%7Ce7b1ea09f6664d3146e308da1bd7be7a%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0%7C0%7C637852910703088784%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=VZmWPRkt%2Bk4aO5svD96KFi8rTin3D8qzWKNHuEQiBjU%3D&reserved=0
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

Mark - I will have to use that as an excuse..  :)

2 axis moving!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tItdEEDYy2g

On Sun, Apr 10, 2022 at 11:10 AM Mark Johnsen  wrote:

> Cool!
>
> On a side note, I just finished listening to Walter Isaacson's biography on
> Leonardo Da Vinci and wanted to inform you that you're in good company
> because he had serious issues finishing projects.  Of course, humanity got
> the worse end of that by him not publishing his work.   But, when you start
> to dwell on a project that you haven't finished, just think, "Oh yeah,
> Leonardo didn't finish many of his projects either."
>
> On Sat, Apr 9, 2022 at 7:25 PM gene heskett  wrote:
>
> > On Saturday, 9 April 2022 21:27:26 EDT Sam Sokolik wrote:
> > > X is almost ready to test...
> > >
> > > https://photos.app.goo.gl/GzyjvC49J2rTXyaG8
> >
> > Looking good Sam, similar to what I did to my Sheldon, but my motor mount
> > is a sliding plate on the front of a much bigger 1/2" apron so I can
> > screw drive the belt tension, and with stepper/servo's, only a 2/1 ratio
> > stepdown. X speed max is just over 60" a minute with a 2NM 3 phase
> > stepper motor. The rest of my apron has the encoder dials to drive it by
> > hand. Seemed the ideal place to put them. Put them near where the cranks
> > used to be.  Feels natural. I sealed up the tunnel the x screw is in, top
> > and bottom so swarf can't get to it unless its past center going in.  And
> > I put bellows on the z screw on both sides of the nut for its swarf
> > protection. I even drilled two of the nuts 6 holes all the way thru so
> > rapid z movements could let the air get from one bellows to the other w/o
> > sucking in contaminents.
> >
> > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 8:18 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> > > > Most likely it needs that movement because it can spin 30 + inches ;)
> >
> > If it can spin 30", what is the max spindle speed?
> > > > sam
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2022 at 5:46 AM andy pugh  wrote:
> > > >> On Wed, 6 Apr 2022 at 20:22, Sam Sokolik 
> wrote:
> > > >> > The cross slide has around 17 inches of travel... Crazy..
> > > >>
> > > >> For gang-tooling perhaps?
> > > >>
> > > >> --
> > > >> atp
> > > >> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> > > >> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> > > >> lunatics."
> > > >> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> ___
> > > >> Emc-users mailing list
> > > >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> > --
> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
> >  - Louis D. Brandeis
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

Yes - acme for z.  (No key way).   We need to make covers for x.  It would
be nice to get a ball screw for z but have not found one yet.   The acme
will work fine for now.

On Mon, Apr 18, 2022, 6:54 AM gene heskett  wrote:

> On Monday, 18 April 2022 04:48:37 EDT John Dammeyer wrote:
> > I was asking Sam. From his video it looks like ACME.
>
> Yup, looks like the OEM screw complete with keyway. Looks like a Ball on
> x though. And its wide open to be wrecked by swarf.
>
> Needs a pair of smaller bellows similar to what I did for z on the
> Sheldon. Cheap 1450mm long c7 grade screw, works good enough for the
> girls I go with. Under $200 delivered on my front deck. If its off by the
> C7 grade specs, I haven't found where yet. I bought a 12" digital caliper
> & checked the first foot from the chuck, its as accurate as the caliper.
> I'm not equipt to do interferomter measurements.
>
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: gene heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
> > > Sent: April-18-22 12:59 AM
> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything...
> > > Nebel lathe conversion.>
> > > On Sunday, 17 April 2022 22:19:58 EDT John Dammeyer wrote:
> > > > Nice!
> > > >
> > > > Was the Z axis lead screw also a ball screw or did you leave that
> > > > as
> > > > ACME?  Has it an anti-backlash nut if still ACME? John
> > >
> > > Who are you asking John?
> > >
> > > > > -Original Message-
> > > > > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> > > > > Sent: April-17-22 6:47 PM
> > > > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish
> > > > > anything...
> > > > > Nebel lathe conversion.
> > > > >
> > > > > Mark - I will have to use that as an excuse..  :)
> > > > >
> > > > > 2 axis moving!
> > > > >
> > > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tItdEEDYy2g
> > > > >
> > > > > On Sun, Apr 10, 2022 at 11:10 AM Mark Johnsen 
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > Cool!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On a side note, I just finished listening to Walter Isaacson's
> > > > > > biography on Leonardo Da Vinci and wanted to inform you that
> > > > > > you're in good company because he had serious issues finishing
> > > > > > projects.  Of course, humanity got the worse end of that by him
> > > > > > not publishing his work.   But, when you start to dwell on a
> > > > > > project that you haven't finished, just think, "Oh yeah,
> > > > > > Leonardo
> > > > > > didn't finish many of his projects either."
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Sat, Apr 9, 2022 at 7:25 PM gene heskett
> > > > > > 
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > > On Saturday, 9 April 2022 21:27:26 EDT Sam Sokolik wrote:
> > > > > > > > X is almost ready to test...
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > https://photos.app.goo.gl/GzyjvC49J2rTXyaG8
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Looking good Sam, similar to what I did to my Sheldon, but my
> > > > > > > motor mount is a sliding plate on the front of a much bigger
> > > > > > > 1/2" apron so I can screw drive the belt tension, and with
> > > > > > > stepper/servo's, only a 2/1 ratio stepdown. X speed max is
> > > > > > > just
> > > > > > > over 60" a minute with a 2NM 3 phase stepper motor. The rest
> > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > my apron has the encoder dials to drive it by hand. Seemed
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > ideal place to put them. Put them near where the cranks used
> > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > be.  Feels natural. I sealed up the tunnel the x screw is in,
> > > > > > > top and bottom so swarf can't get to it unless its past
> > > > > > > center
> > > > > > > going in.  And I put bellows on the z screw on both sides of
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > nut for its swarf protecti

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

Front side of the cross slide protected..  (1/8 neoprene..)

https://photos.app.goo.gl/g8kzRGZWxxDzQRAA8

On Mon, Apr 18, 2022 at 12:31 PM gene heskett  wrote:

> On Monday, 18 April 2022 10:34:45 EDT Sam Sokolik wrote:
> > Yes - acme for z.  (No key way).   We need to make covers for x.
> I just inlaid a strip of paneling in the carriage slot in front the tool
> post base, ditto for the bottom below the screw. My drive is a new shaft
> and bearing in the front where the crank was.  The rear is still open.
> And its open behind the tool post carrier when at center so I keep a rag
> taped to the rear of the tool post base. I have a rear cover for it, but
> have been too lazy to put it back on after finding the screw was long
> enough to touch it and had to mill a thin spot to clear the end of the
> screw.
>
> I had to get a 2NM motor for the front mount, the 3NM was too long to
> clear the bed casting.  Even a 2 is overkill for that teeny screw, I
> think its an 8mm screw.  Finding screws small enough for x drive on a
> lathe is difficult, the nuts are too big the clear the bed. It was real
> fun doing that on my 7x12, finally giving up and putting the motor on the
> rear, where its too heavy lifting the front vway so I had to do the
> kruger tapered gibs thing. That finally made a real lathe out of it. The
> motors I took off the 6040 are quite a bit smaller, but still big enough
> for the 7x12, so I may eventually put one of them on the back of the
> 7x12.
>
> If I don't fall over first, I'm 87 now.  The older I get, the better I
> WAS. ;o)
>
> Take care and stay well Sam.
>
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

First cuts...

https://youtu.be/bpqFL3rZKBA

On Fri, Apr 22, 2022, 3:27 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Front side of the cross slide protected..  (1/8 neoprene..)
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/g8kzRGZWxxDzQRAA8
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2022 at 12:31 PM gene heskett 
> wrote:
>
>> On Monday, 18 April 2022 10:34:45 EDT Sam Sokolik wrote:
>> > Yes - acme for z.  (No key way).   We need to make covers for x.
>> I just inlaid a strip of paneling in the carriage slot in front the tool
>> post base, ditto for the bottom below the screw. My drive is a new shaft
>> and bearing in the front where the crank was.  The rear is still open.
>> And its open behind the tool post carrier when at center so I keep a rag
>> taped to the rear of the tool post base. I have a rear cover for it, but
>> have been too lazy to put it back on after finding the screw was long
>> enough to touch it and had to mill a thin spot to clear the end of the
>> screw.
>>
>> I had to get a 2NM motor for the front mount, the 3NM was too long to
>> clear the bed casting.  Even a 2 is overkill for that teeny screw, I
>> think its an 8mm screw.  Finding screws small enough for x drive on a
>> lathe is difficult, the nuts are too big the clear the bed. It was real
>> fun doing that on my 7x12, finally giving up and putting the motor on the
>> rear, where its too heavy lifting the front vway so I had to do the
>> kruger tapered gibs thing. That finally made a real lathe out of it. The
>> motors I took off the 6040 are quite a bit smaller, but still big enough
>> for the 7x12, so I may eventually put one of them on the back of the
>> 7x12.
>>
>> If I don't fall over first, I'm 87 now.  The older I get, the better I
>> WAS. ;o)
>>
>> Take care and stay well Sam.
>>
>>
>> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
>> --
>> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
>> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>>  - Louis D. Brandeis
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Blown BOB and ???

[Sam Sokolik]

that looks crispy...


On Mon, May 2, 2022 at 2:25 PM Alan Condit  wrote:

> Andy, Chris, Dave and Jon,
>
> Here is a link to the photo .
> I guess it was too big to post directly.
>
> Alan
>
>
> On Mon, May 2, 2022 at 11:18 AM Alan Condit  wrote:
>
> > Chris, Andy, and Dave,
> >
> > I guess I didn’t give enough info. I built this controller in 2005 for my
> > lathe. I used it on my lathe until a couple of years ago when I added
> > another drive and switched this controller over to my PCBmill and X2 Mini
> > mill. I built a new controller for my lathe using a Mesa 5i25/7i76 pair
> so
> > I could control spindle speed. The picture shows the two blown out parts.
> > This controller worked for 15 years before letting the smoke out. I agree
> > Andy, that it is difficult for a fault to continue to generate steps but
> > that is what happened. It is possible that there was a design flaw but it
> > worked for 15 years.
> >  In the program where things went bad the X-axis should not have been
> > moving but it was. I was cutting a bushing for a keyway broach. For quite
> > awhile everything was going fine and then suddenly it began to cut into
> the
> > X direction when it was traveling in the Y direction. Then I saw smoke
> > coming out of the controller box.
> > Jon Elson suggested that I may have blown out the parallel port which
> > seems likely to me now that I think about the way it is behaving now.
> >
> > Alan
> >
> >
> >
> >> -- Forwarded message --
> >> From: Alan Condit 
> >> To: EMC-Users 
> >> Cc:
> >> Bcc:
> >> Date: Sun, 1 May 2022 09:49:43 -0500
> >> Subject: [Emc-users] Blown BOB and ???
> >> Hi Guys,
> >>
> >> I was machining a part on my X2 Minimill. Suddenly it left the
> programmed
> >> track (spoiled the part) and didn’t respond to Estop. I powered the
> system
> >> off manually raised the Z axis and tried turning it on so I could home
> it,
> >> smoke started coming from the controller. So I powered everything down
> and
> >> started troubleshooting.
> >> There were two chips on the CandCNC Mini-IO BOB that had let out the
> >> magic smoke. I had a spare BOB that I built using the Gecko G540
> schematic.
> >> So I replaced the other BOB with it. The drives in the controller are
> >> Superior Electric SS2000MD4 drives.
> >>
> >> When I got everything put back together and checked the wiring
> everything
> >> looked good so I tried powering it up. When I tried homing it the traces
> >> move in AXIS but there is no movement on the machine. The motors hold
> >> position so the output of the drives is active. Is it likely that I blew
> >> out the inputs on the drives?
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Alan
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -- Forwarded message --
> >> From: Chris Albertson 
> >> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" <
> emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
> >> Cc:
> >> Bcc:
> >> Date: Sun, 1 May 2022 08:59:53 -0700
> >> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Blown BOB and ???
> >> There is a good chance there was a wiring error in you original setup.
> >> The
> >> fact the E-stop did not work tells me there was a design error.  E-Stop
> >> should never fail, or rather if it does fail, the machine stops.  If the
> >> inputs on the drivers are blown, that says the same thing.  Smaething
> was
> >> wrong as that should never happen.
> >>
> >> Diagnosing a system that has a design fault is really hard because our
> >> brain tends to think of how a correct machine would function or how the
> >> machine we THOUGHT we built should function.
> >>
> >> The best plan is to ignore LCNC the BOB and all for now and see if you
> can
> >> drive the motor drivers with a simple signal generator and no computer.
> >>  If this does not work, you need to replace or repair the drivers before
> >> you think about reconnecting a computer.   If you need to buy some test
> >> equipment, now is the time.At least a cheap square wave signal
> >> generator and a cheap $12 logic analyzer t go with your multimeter.
> >>
> >> Finally, you should draw a schematic of how you propose to connect the
> >> computer and post it here for others to review.   They will check if
> >> nothing else the e-stop design to see that it is failsafe and also check
> >> that you have the power and computer parts properly isolated.   It seems
> >> this may not have been the case in the past, and you don't want to
> simply
> >> put it back the way it was.
> >>
> >> First step is to verify the motors and drivers work independently of
> >> computer control.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Chris Albertson
> >> Redondo Beach, California
> >>
> >> -- Forwarded message --
> >> From: andy pugh 
> >> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" <
> emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net>
> >> Cc:
> >> Bcc:
> >> Date: Sun, 1 May 2022 21:23:48 +0100
> >> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Blown BOB and ???
> >> On Sun, 1 May 2022 at 15:53, Alan Condit  wrote:
> >>
> >> > I was machining a part on my X2 Minimill. S

Re: [Emc-users] Because I can't seem to finish anything... Nebel lathe conversion.

[Sam Sokolik]

gearing up for threading...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgtVG0S7OGs

On Sun, Apr 24, 2022 at 7:32 PM John Figie  wrote:

> Looks good. I need to catch up with my Clausing NC retrofit.
>
> John Figie
>
> On Sun, Apr 24, 2022 at 4:54 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> >
> > First cuts...
> >
> > https://youtu.be/bpqFL3rZKBA
> >
> > On Fri, Apr 22, 2022, 3:27 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
> >
> > > Front side of the cross slide protected..  (1/8 neoprene..)
> > >
> > > https://photos.app.goo.gl/g8kzRGZWxxDzQRAA8
> > >
> > > On Mon, Apr 18, 2022 at 12:31 PM gene heskett 
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> On Monday, 18 April 2022 10:34:45 EDT Sam Sokolik wrote:
> > >> > Yes - acme for z.  (No key way).   We need to make covers for x.
> > >> I just inlaid a strip of paneling in the carriage slot in front the
> tool
> > >> post base, ditto for the bottom below the screw. My drive is a new
> shaft
> > >> and bearing in the front where the crank was.  The rear is still open.
> > >> And its open behind the tool post carrier when at center so I keep a
> rag
> > >> taped to the rear of the tool post base. I have a rear cover for it,
> but
> > >> have been too lazy to put it back on after finding the screw was long
> > >> enough to touch it and had to mill a thin spot to clear the end of the
> > >> screw.
> > >>
> > >> I had to get a 2NM motor for the front mount, the 3NM was too long to
> > >> clear the bed casting.  Even a 2 is overkill for that teeny screw, I
> > >> think its an 8mm screw.  Finding screws small enough for x drive on a
> > >> lathe is difficult, the nuts are too big the clear the bed. It was
> real
> > >> fun doing that on my 7x12, finally giving up and putting the motor on
> the
> > >> rear, where its too heavy lifting the front vway so I had to do the
> > >> kruger tapered gibs thing. That finally made a real lathe out of it.
> The
> > >> motors I took off the 6040 are quite a bit smaller, but still big
> enough
> > >> for the 7x12, so I may eventually put one of them on the back of the
> > >> 7x12.
> > >>
> > >> If I don't fall over first, I'm 87 now.  The older I get, the better I
> > >> WAS. ;o)
> > >>
> > >> Take care and stay well Sam.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> > >> --
> > >> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> > >>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > >> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> > >> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law
> respectable.
> > >>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> ___
> > >> Emc-users mailing list
> > >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >>
> > >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] Cute lathe running css and fpr...

[Sam Sokolik]

Making a few chuck adaptors for some random chucks we have..  (this one is
on the big size but will come in handy...)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlEGmAbvuZs

https://electronicsam.com/images/emco/PXL_20220702_233820082.jpg

https://electronicsam.com/images/emco/PXL_20220703_224600927.jpg

https://electronicsam.com/images/emco/PXL_20220703_224901039.jpg

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Cute lathe running css and fpr...

[Sam Sokolik]

BTW - that is a little 440w spindle motor...

On Mon, Jul 4, 2022 at 9:29 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Making a few chuck adaptors for some random chucks we have..  (this one is
> on the big size but will come in handy...)
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlEGmAbvuZs
>
> https://electronicsam.com/images/emco/PXL_20220702_233820082.jpg
>
> https://electronicsam.com/images/emco/PXL_20220703_224600927.jpg
>
> https://electronicsam.com/images/emco/PXL_20220703_224901039.jpg
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] Playing with G70/71 turning cycles..

[Sam Sokolik]

First real try playing with turning cycles.  Great work! - It took me a
couple trys to get the path to do what I wanted - but not too painful.  Did
get linuxcnc into an infinite loop once.  Other than that.

I write a lot of gcode by hand - this makes lathe work really easy.  create
a simple profile - pass it though to G70,70,72..  easy peasy..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzk0wM1HERY

Oh - short video of CSS and FPR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlEGmAbvuZs

sam

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Playing with G70/71 turning cycles..

[Sam Sokolik]

This is mostly the file - the one on the lathe I changed it to FPR and CSS

g64p.001
G54 G18

O100 SUB
G0x.5z.1
g1x.2811z0
x.4047z-.8788
x.3425z-.9409
x.3425z-1.0246
x.3691z-1.0512
x.3691z-1.1279
x.3232z-1.2075
x.3232z-2.3886
G0x.5z-2.6
O100 ENDSUB


G71 Q100 X.51 Z.1 D.01 I.02 R.03f10
G70 Q100 X.51 Z.1 E0 D0.005 P2
m30

On Mon, Jul 18, 2022 at 10:42 AM John Dammeyer 
wrote:

> Hi Sam,
> Would you please post the code for that?  I'd like to try and walk through
> it to figure out what you did.
> Thanks
> John
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: July-16-22 9:07 AM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: [Emc-users] Playing with G70/71 turning cycles..
> >
> > First real try playing with turning cycles.  Great work! - It took me a
> > couple trys to get the path to do what I wanted - but not too painful.
> Did
> > get linuxcnc into an infinite loop once.  Other than that.
> >
> > I write a lot of gcode by hand - this makes lathe work really easy.
> create
> > a simple profile - pass it though to G70,70,72..  easy peasy..
> >
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzk0wM1HERY
> >
> > Oh - short video of CSS and FPR
> >
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlEGmAbvuZs
> >
> > sam
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc OEM?

[Sam Sokolik]

I think CandCNC uses a modified version of linuxcnc..  Commandercnc

sam

On Tue, Jul 19, 2022 at 11:53 AM Todd Zuercher 
wrote:

> Any one know if there are any machine builders (besides Tormach) using or
> offering Linuxcnc as a control option?  (More interested in a large router
> than a milling machine, lathe , or plasma cutter.)
>
> Todd Zuercher
> P. Graham Dunn Inc.
> 630 Henry Street
> Dalton, Ohio 44618
> Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc OEM?

[Sam Sokolik]

Charles!   How is it going?

On Wed, Jul 20, 2022, 9:21 PM Charles Steinkuehler 
wrote:

> I'm not sure of their international shipping details, but Probotix sells
> LCNC based routers:
>
> https://www.probotix.com/
>
> On 7/19/2022 8:13 AM, Todd Zuercher wrote:
> > Any one know if there are any machine builders (besides Tormach) using
> or offering Linuxcnc as a control option?  (More interested in a large
> router than a milling machine, lathe , or plasma cutter.)
> >
> > Todd Zuercher
> > P. Graham Dunn Inc.
> > 630 Henry Street
> > Dalton, Ohio 44618
> > Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
> --
> Charles Steinkuehler
> char...@steinkuehler.net
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc OEM?

[Sam Sokolik]

I thought (and maybe I am wrong) that nist was trying to make a
standardized control to give to all of their military manufacturers so
anyone could run a standard gcode program to make part x..

sam

On Thu, Jul 21, 2022 at 9:53 AM  wrote:

> On 2022-07-21 04:32, andy pugh wrote:
> > On Thu, 21 Jul 2022 at 03:22, Charles Steinkuehler
> >  wrote:
> >>
> >> I'm not sure of their international shipping details, but Probotix
> >> sells
> >> LCNC based routers:
> >>
> >> https://www.probotix.com/
> >
> > Which mentions that they have (amusingly) sold LinuxCNC systems to
> > NIST. :-)
>
> The circle of life...
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc OEM?

[Sam Sokolik]

And - OMG - Hi Matt!!

On Thu, Jul 21, 2022 at 9:57 AM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> I thought (and maybe I am wrong) that nist was trying to make a
> standardized control to give to all of their military manufacturers so
> anyone could run a standard gcode program to make part x..
>
> sam
>
> On Thu, Jul 21, 2022 at 9:53 AM  wrote:
>
>> On 2022-07-21 04:32, andy pugh wrote:
>> > On Thu, 21 Jul 2022 at 03:22, Charles Steinkuehler
>> >  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> I'm not sure of their international shipping details, but Probotix
>> >> sells
>> >> LCNC based routers:
>> >>
>> >> https://www.probotix.com/
>> >
>> > Which mentions that they have (amusingly) sold LinuxCNC systems to
>> > NIST. :-)
>>
>> The circle of life...
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] Printer ports are not dead yet! (linuxcnc closing the servo loop with $10 pci card)

[Sam Sokolik]

Little Emco lathe with some pittman servos...   Amc drive that takes
PWM+Dir.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUz5ZZyf2LU

Of course caveats..
-with the input scale of 50800/inch - speed limited to about 35ipm.
(probably fast enough for me)
-Tuning has to be good - because if there is an oscillation - it
oscillates faster than the computer can count..

Other than that.Seems like it would work ok...

(a mesa card like the 7i92 would be way better)  but this shows that you
could get into basic closed loop servo control for the price of a printer
port - you can still get them and pci-e is still a thing..

sam

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Printer ports are not dead yet! (linuxcnc closing the servo loop with $10 pci card)

[Sam Sokolik]

The spindle motor is a brushed dc.  I am planning on using another amc
drive to drive it...

On Tue, Aug 23, 2022, 4:33 PM  wrote:

> On 2022-08-23 19:29, Sam Sokolik wrote:
> > Little Emco lathe with some pittman servos...   Amc drive that takes
> > PWM+Dir.
> >
>
> Looks pretty smooth to me.
> What Pittman servos are those?
> What will you do with the spindle drive motor? Servo?
>
> Marcus
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] Printer ports are not dead yet! (linuxcnc closing the servo loop with $10 pci card)

[Sam Sokolik]

some mansplaining..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWXCAxUzXK0

On Tue, Aug 23, 2022 at 4:40 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> The spindle motor is a brushed dc.  I am planning on using another amc
> drive to drive it...
>
> On Tue, Aug 23, 2022, 4:33 PM  wrote:
>
>> On 2022-08-23 19:29, Sam Sokolik wrote:
>> > Little Emco lathe with some pittman servos...   Amc drive that takes
>> > PWM+Dir.
>> >
>>
>> Looks pretty smooth to me.
>> What Pittman servos are those?
>> What will you do with the spindle drive motor? Servo?
>>
>> Marcus
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] rtapi_app: caught signal 8 - dumping core

[Sam Sokolik]

Bary - Could we get all the files?
custompanel.xml
postgui_call_list.hal
custom.hal

I just built RIP on buster and ran the config (remarking out the missing
files)
I have an encoder in pin 10 and 11 and it seems to work with no crash.

sam


On Thu, Sep 1, 2022 at 9:45 PM Bari  wrote:

> Brand new setup using stepconf.   if I spin the spindle encoder quickly
> by hand I get: rtapi_app: caught signal 8 - dumping core
>
> Even if the machine is still in e-stop.   Simple config using stepconf
> LINUXCNC - 2.9.0~pre0
>
> All default settings other than manual edit of LPT base address and
> changed   setp encoder.0.position-scale 4000.00Default is like
> 100 vs 4000
>
> Any ideas what causes this error?
>
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/1324/simple.ini
>
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/1324/simple.hal
>
> The only mention of a similar error:
> forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/358...hercat-lcec?start=10
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] rtapi_app: caught signal 8 - dumping core

[Sam Sokolik]

I can get it to do it in a freshly built 2.9.0~pre0 - doesn't seem to do it
in 2.8.2

rtapi_app: caught signal 8 - dumping core

exiting linuxcnc gets you
Shutting down and cleaning up LinuxCNC...
task: 2145 cycles, min=0.07, max=0.013650, avg=0.009993, 0 latency
excursions (> 10x expected cycle time of 0.01s)
USRMOT: ERROR: command timeout
Waited 3 seconds for master.  giving up.
Note: Using POSIX realtime
pwmgen: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
Note: Using POSIX realtime
lowpass: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
Note: Using POSIX realtime
scale: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
Note: Using POSIX realtime
abs: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
Note: Using POSIX realtime
encoder: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
Note: Using POSIX realtime
stepgen: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
Note: Using POSIX realtime
hal_parport: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
Note: Using POSIX realtime
motmod: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
Note: Using POSIX realtime
trivkins: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
Note: Using POSIX realtime
homemod: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
Note: Using POSIX realtime
tpmod: not loaded
:0: exit value: 255
:0: rmmod failed, returned -1
:0: unloadrt failed
Note: Using POSIX realtime



On Thu, Sep 1, 2022 at 10:42 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> Bary - Could we get all the files?
> custompanel.xml
> postgui_call_list.hal
> custom.hal
>
> I just built RIP on buster and ran the config (remarking out the missing
> files)
> I have an encoder in pin 10 and 11 and it seems to work with no crash.
>
> sam
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 1, 2022 at 9:45 PM Bari  wrote:
>
>> Brand new setup using stepconf.   if I spin the spindle encoder quickly
>> by hand I get: rtapi_app: caught signal 8 - dumping core
>>
>> Even if the machine is still in e-stop.   Simple config using stepconf
>> LINUXCNC - 2.9.0~pre0
>>
>> All default settings other than manual edit of LPT base address and
>> changed   setp encoder.0.position-scale 4000.00Default is like
>> 100 vs 4000
>>
>> Any ideas what causes this error?
>>
>> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/1324/simple.ini
>>
>> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/1324/simple.hal
>>
>> The only mention of a similar error:
>> forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/358...hercat-lcec?start=10
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] rtapi_app: caught signal 8 - dumping core

[Sam Sokolik]

oh - I think we are both running buster too...  (it happens with just those
to files (ini and hal)  when spinning an encoder hooked to pin 10 and 11 of
the printer port.  (happens pretty quick)

sam

On Thu, Sep 1, 2022 at 11:25 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:

> I can get it to do it in a freshly built 2.9.0~pre0 - doesn't seem to do
> it in 2.8.2
>
> rtapi_app: caught signal 8 - dumping core
>
> exiting linuxcnc gets you
> Shutting down and cleaning up LinuxCNC...
> task: 2145 cycles, min=0.07, max=0.013650, avg=0.009993, 0 latency
> excursions (> 10x expected cycle time of 0.01s)
> USRMOT: ERROR: command timeout
> Waited 3 seconds for master.  giving up.
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> pwmgen: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> lowpass: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> scale: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> abs: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> encoder: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> stepgen: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> hal_parport: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> motmod: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> trivkins: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> homemod: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
> tpmod: not loaded
> :0: exit value: 255
> :0: rmmod failed, returned -1
> :0: unloadrt failed
> Note: Using POSIX realtime
>
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 1, 2022 at 10:42 PM Sam Sokolik  wrote:
>
>> Bary - Could we get all the files?
>> custompanel.xml
>> postgui_call_list.hal
>> custom.hal
>>
>> I just built RIP on buster and ran the config (remarking out the missing
>> files)
>> I have an encoder in pin 10 and 11 and it seems to work with no crash.
>>
>> sam
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 1, 2022 at 9:45 PM Bari  wrote:
>>
>>> Brand new setup using stepconf.   if I spin the spindle encoder quickly
>>> by hand I get: rtapi_app: caught signal 8 - dumping core
>>>
>>> Even if the machine is still in e-stop.   Simple config using stepconf
>>> LINUXCNC - 2.9.0~pre0
>>>
>>> All default settings other than manual edit of LPT base address and
>>> changed   setp encoder.0.position-scale 4000.00Default is like
>>> 100 vs 4000
>>>
>>> Any ideas what causes this error?
>>>
>>> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/1324/simple.ini
>>>
>>> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/1324/simple.hal
>>>
>>> The only mention of a similar error:
>>> forum.linuxcnc.org/24-hal-components/358...hercat-lcec?start=10
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
>>> Emc-users mailing list
>>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>>
>>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users