Re: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests

2013-06-12 Thread Lance 
I'm not sure about this, but I *think* this might be what's called regressive 
infection. It's not as bad as it sounds. This is a new way of looking at cats 
we used to think threw off the virus. The paper 2008 AAFP Retrovirus 
Guidelines puts it this way:

Regressive infection is accompanied by an effective immune response, and virus 
replication is contained prior to or at the time of bone marrow infection. Cats 
with regressive infection are at little risk of developing FeLV-associated 
diseases. FeLV is integrated into the cat’s genome, but viral shedding does not 
occur (Peder- sen et al 1977, Lutz et al 1983, Flynn et al 2000, 2002). 

It seems possible that the cats we always used to say threw off the virus 
were actually infected, but that they don't shed virus and have a very low 
risk for getting sick.

That paper is available online. Just Google for the title. All in all, while it 
might not be the best news, regressive infection would seem to indicate a 
normal life is ahead for your cats, and you shouldn't have to be concerned 
about them.

Would you mind describing the exposure you think your cats might have 
undergone? Was it a short interaction with a FeLV+ or a long period of time 
spent with a positive cat or cats? Also, how is Cole doing? I know he didn't 
eat well one day recently, and you were concerned.

Best wishes to you and the five negative kitties,

Lance

On Jun 12, 2013, at 12:33 PM, Karen Harshbarger harshbargerka...@yahoo.com 
wrote:

 I had my 5 cats tested for feline leukemia when believed to be exposed.  
 First test 4 tested positive and yesterday (90 days later) all 5 tested 
 negative.  my vet said retest in 45 days and see what we get.  If two test 
 with same diagnosis then that is the results.  Has anyone ever had this 
 and/or what do you have to say about what is going on with my guys?  He used 
 the quick in house test---for get the name---not the send out lab test that 
 takes longer for results.  Thanks Karen
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Re: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests

2013-06-12 Thread Margo 



Hi Karen,

How long ago was the suspected exposure, and how did it happen? In house testing is usually an Elisa.

 There's a chart on the FeLV.org site, but it is titled "Sick Cat Chart". My thought is that some of yours are not showing any symptoms?

 http://www.felineleukemia.org/felvsick.html 

 The chart suggests immediate re-testing, but I think I'd wait the 45 days, and test by IFA. If you are planning on seperating them by result, then I'd do an IFA now, and see what that shows.

 But I still don't know exactly what that means :( I keep reading different things from different sources. To the point that I won't be testingmy "exposed" cats unless they show symptoms. So far, we're one for one. In addition to my original positive Gribble, now Makohas testedpositive as well. His only symptoms were ocular, a recurrent runny eye, and transient anisocoria. Right now, after treatment, he's symptom free. As is Gribble. (Knocking madly on wood).

Not much help, huh?

Margo





-Original Message- From: Karen Harshbarger Sent: Jun 12, 2013 1:33 PM To: "felvtalk@felineleukemia.org" Subject: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests 

I had my5 cats tested for feline leukemia when believed to be exposed. First test 4 tested positive and yesterday (90 days later) all 5 tested negative. my vet said retest in 45 days and see what we get. If two test with same diagnosis then that is the results. Has anyone ever had this and/or what do you have to say about what is going on with my guys? He used the quick in house test---for get the name---not the send out lab test that takes longer for results. Thanks Karen

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Re: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests

2013-06-12 Thread Margo 



Hi Lance,

 Thanks! I don't know if I have that or not, but it sounds interesting G. And it does give me some hope.

All the best,

Margo

-Original Message- From: Lance <lini...@fastmail.fm>Sent: Jun 12, 2013 1:55 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests 
I'm not sure about this, but I *think* this might be what's called regressive infection. It's not as bad as it sounds.This is a "new" way of looking at cats we used to think threw off the virus. The paper "2008 AAFP Retrovirus Guidelines" puts it this way:

Regressive infection is accompanied by an effective immune response, and virus replication is contained prior to or at the time of bone marrow infection. Cats with regressive infection are at little risk of developing FeLV-associateddiseases. FeLV is integrated into the cat’s genome, but viral shedding does not occur (Peder- sen et al 1977, Lutz et al 1983, Flynn et al 2000, 2002).

It seems possible that the cats we always used to say "threw off" the virus were actually "infected", but that they don't shed virus and have a very low risk for getting sick.

That paper is available online. Just Google for the title. All in all, while it might not be the best news, regressive infection would seem to indicate a normal life is ahead for your cats, and you shouldn't have to be concerned about them.

Would you mind describing the exposure you think your cats might have undergone? Was it a short interaction with a FeLV+ or a long period of time spent with a positive cat or cats? Also, howis Cole doing? I know he didn't eat well one day recently, and you were concerned.

Best wishes to you and the five negative kitties,

Lance


On Jun 12, 2013, at 12:33 PM, Karen Harshbarger harshbargerka...@yahoo.com wrote:


I had my5 cats tested for feline leukemia when believed to be exposed. First test 4 tested positive and yesterday (90 days later) all 5 tested negative. my vet said retest in 45 days and see what we get. If two test with same diagnosis then that is the results. Has anyone ever had this and/or what do you have to say about what is going on with my guys? He used the quick in house test---for get the name---not the send out lab test that takes longer for results. Thanks Karen___Felvtalk mailing listFelvtalk@felineleukemia.orghttp://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org

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Re: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests

2013-06-12 Thread Beth 
Karen -

What your vet suggested is what I would suggest  what we do at the shelter.
You would do an IFA only if they test positive on the in-house SNAP test. The 
IFA would tell you if the virus cannot be thrown off.

Beth


 
Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
 



 From: Karen Harshbarger harshbargerka...@yahoo.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Wednesday, June 12, 2013 1:33 PM
Subject: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests
 


I had my 5 cats tested for feline leukemia when believed to be exposed.  First 
test 4 tested positive and yesterday (90 days later) all 5 tested negative.  my 
vet said retest in 45 days and see what we get.  If two test with same 
diagnosis then that is the results.  Has anyone ever had this and/or what do 
you have to say about what is going on with my guys?  He used the quick in 
house test---for get the name---not the send out lab test that takes longer for 
results.  Thanks Karen
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Re: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests

2013-06-12 Thread Lance 
Yeah, it does show that persistent infection isn't necessarily inevitable when 
a cat is exposed and infected. It's sad that we don't know more about how often 
regressive vs. persistent happens. There are a lot of things I think we need 
with regard to information. For Christmas, I'd like some tangibles:

* an immediate treatment that can hit the virus right after exposure.

Even if it's only useful for 48 hours, that would allow people with bitten cats 
to treat immediately, rather than to wait on the disease process. Perhaps this 
is unrealistic or even science fiction. I think some folks have used AZT in 
these cases, but that seems potentially dangerous. 

* a long-term treatment that allows for FeLV+ cats (and FIV+ cats) to live with 
their illness in a similar way to how more people are able to live with HIV 
infections. 

This is going to require lots of funding, but we need feline-friendly 
antiretrovirals that are less toxic. Imagine someone getting an FeLV+ diagnosis 
for his or her cat in the (hopefully) not-too-distant future, and while they 
are saddened, they know that their cat can live a full life with the right 
drugs–the virus will be relatively under control.

* a vaccine that doesn't cause vax site sarcomas. 

How hard can this possibly be? Why do we not understand how this happens better 
after a decade of dealing with it? Why is their less vax site sarcoma 
prevalence in the UK and Europe vs. America, when both sides use pretty much 
the same vax?

In my family's case, I think I would have advocated for our girl now of 
questionable status to be vaccinated if I didn't have to feel like I was 
putting her at risk for an aggressive cancer. But, my FeLV+ was isolated, and 
the few accidental meet-ups that they'd had were always quick and easily 
curtailed, so putting Callie at risk of the sarcoma didn't seem right. I'm 
regretting that now.


On Jun 12, 2013, at 2:20 PM, Margo toomanykitti...@earthlink.net wrote:

 
 Hi Lance,
  
  Thanks! I don't know if I have that or not, but it sounds 
 interesting G. And it does give me some hope.
  
 All the best,
  
 Margo
  
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Re: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests

2013-06-12 Thread Amanda K. Payne 
Lance,

I could totally get behind your Christmas Wish List.  I rescued my first
FeLV+ kitten ten years ago. In that decade, there seems to be little to no
progress made in FeLV prevention and/or treatment.  Instead, the
information I come across is more confusing than it was when I first heard
of FeLV. I understand that a lack of funding and red tape slow down
scientific progress, but come on!  There's a huge difference between slow
down and standstill.

It may be too late for my Polli, but I look forward to the day that FeLV is
treatable instead of something that only supportive care is available for.

-Amanda


On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 12:44 PM, Lance lini...@fastmail.fm wrote:

 Yeah, it does show that persistent infection isn't necessarily inevitable
 when a cat is exposed and infected. It's sad that we don't know more about
 how often regressive vs. persistent happens. There are a lot of things I
 think we need with regard to information. For Christmas, I'd like some
 tangibles:

 * an immediate treatment that can hit the virus right after exposure.

 Even if it's only useful for 48 hours, that would allow people with bitten
 cats to treat immediately, rather than to wait on the disease process.
 Perhaps this is unrealistic or even science fiction. I think some folks
 have used AZT in these cases, but that seems potentially dangerous.

 * a long-term treatment that allows for FeLV+ cats (and FIV+ cats) to live
 with their illness in a similar way to how more people are able to live
 with HIV infections.

 This is going to require lots of funding, but we need feline-friendly
 antiretrovirals that are less toxic. Imagine someone getting an FeLV+
 diagnosis for his or her cat in the (hopefully) not-too-distant future, and
 while they are saddened, they know that their cat can live a full life with
 the right drugs–the virus will be relatively under control.

 * a vaccine that doesn't cause vax site sarcomas.

 How hard can this possibly be? Why do we not understand how this happens
 better after a decade of dealing with it? Why is their less vax site
 sarcoma prevalence in the UK and Europe vs. America, when both sides use
 pretty much the same vax?

 In my family's case, I think I would have advocated for our girl now of
 questionable status to be vaccinated if I didn't have to feel like I was
 putting her at risk for an aggressive cancer. But, my FeLV+ was isolated,
 and the few accidental meet-ups that they'd had were always quick and
 easily curtailed, so putting Callie at risk of the sarcoma didn't seem
 right. I'm regretting that now.


 On Jun 12, 2013, at 2:20 PM, Margo toomanykitti...@earthlink.net wrote:


 Hi Lance,


  Thanks! I don't know if I have that or not, but it sounds
 interesting G. And it does give me some hope.


 All the best,


 Margo




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Re: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests

2013-06-12 Thread Margo 



Hi Lance,

 I can't help with most of this, (wish I could) but I'm pretty comfortable with the rFeLV vaccine by Merial. I made my Vet miserable by insisting I had to have it for one cat, because I could not risk FISS/VAS with him, he's down to three legs already. Long story, but he will be best off in my special needs bunch, and that includes my FeLV boys. He is fed seperately, and has his own room at night G. It was the best I could do to give him the best life I can.

https://www.navta.net/press/new-molecular-technology-provides-improved-potency

-Original Message- From: Lance <lini...@fastmail.fm>Sent: Jun 12, 2013 3:44 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests 
Yeah, it does show that persistent infection isn't necessarily inevitable when a cat is exposed and infected. It's sad that we don't know more about how often regressive vs. persistent happens. There are a lot of things I think we need with regard to information. For Christmas, I'd like some tangibles:

* an immediate treatment that can hit the virus right after exposure.

Even if it's only useful for 48 hours, that would allow people with bitten cats to treat immediately, rather than to wait on the disease process. Perhaps this is unrealistic or even science fiction. I think some folks have used AZT in these cases, but that seems potentially dangerous.

* a long-term treatment that allows for FeLV+ cats (and FIV+ cats) to live with their illness in a similar way to how more people are able to live with HIV infections.

This is going to require lots of funding, but we need feline-friendly antiretrovirals that are less toxic. Imagine someone getting an FeLV+ diagnosis for his or her cat in the (hopefully) not-too-distant future, and while they are saddened, they know that their cat can live a full life with the right drugs–the virus will be relatively under control.

* a vaccine that doesn't cause vax site sarcomas.

How hard can this possibly be? Why do we not understand how this happens better after a decade of dealing with it? Why is their less vax site sarcoma prevalence in the UK and Europe vs. America, when both sides use pretty much the same vax?

In my family's case, I think I would have advocated for our girl now of questionable status to be vaccinated if I didn't have to feel like I was putting her at risk for an aggressive cancer. But, my FeLV+ was isolated, and the few accidental meet-ups that they'd had were always quick and easily curtailed, so putting Callie at risk of the sarcoma didn't seem right. I'm regretting that now.


On Jun 12, 2013, at 2:20 PM, Margo toomanykitti...@earthlink.net wrote:


Hi Lance,

 Thanks! I don't know if I have that or not, but it sounds interesting G. And it does give me some hope.

All the best,

Margo


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Re: [Felvtalk] feline leukemia tests

2013-06-12 Thread Lance 
I've been wrestling with these thoughts a lot lately. I wrote to Marley Fund to 
see if they'd ever advocated for trials, but it sounds like it's outside of 
their mission. Maybe no one advocates for trials, but I was under the 
impression that something like that was done for HIV/AIDS. 

I wrote Virbac earlier today to find out where Virbagen Omega approval for the 
US market is. I'll bet I can tell you before I even hear back from them.

On Jun 12, 2013, at 2:53 PM, Amanda K. Payne amandak.pa...@gmail.com wrote:

 Lance,
 
 I could totally get behind your Christmas Wish List.  I rescued my first 
 FeLV+ kitten ten years ago. In that decade, there seems to be little to no 
 progress made in FeLV prevention and/or treatment.  Instead, the information 
 I come across is more confusing than it was when I first heard of FeLV. I 
 understand that a lack of funding and red tape slow down scientific progress, 
 but come on!  There's a huge difference between slow down and standstill. 
 
 It may be too late for my Polli, but I look forward to the day that FeLV is 
 treatable instead of something that only supportive care is available for.
 
 -Amanda
 


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