subject:"\[Flashcoders\] JavaFX released"

I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would work well; 
yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have a pretty 
decent system.


Eric E. Dolecki wrote:

On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll the page, that player UI flickers on and
off. Pretty lame.

On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Jim Robson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  

I checked out the drag-able component sample on javafx.com and it
didn't work. If you're interested in the details, I put them in a
comment on Sten Andersen's blog here:

http://blogs.citytechinc.com/sanderson/?p=49#comment-714

hth
Jim
___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders






  


___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released

Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for 
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.

And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace wrote:
I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would work 
well; yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have a 
pretty decent system.


Eric E. Dolecki wrote:
On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll the page, that player UI flickers 
on and

off. Pretty lame.

On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Jim Robson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 

I checked out the drag-able component sample on javafx.com and it
didn't work. If you're interested in the details, I put them in a
comment on Sten Andersen's blog here:

http://blogs.citytechinc.com/sanderson/?p=49#comment-714

hth
Jim
___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders






  


___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders



___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released


What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT do this.
I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic more and 
more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what desctop is 
concerned.
c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning it has 
all you need for web based systems.

d) Its open source
e) Serious corporations DO use Java for their networks and with Flex 
Adobe is trying to become more mature to be recognized by those 
companies (SAP, etc)
d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer out there 
then flash developers - so a hugh audience.

e) etc etc

I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it has 
great power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?




Latcho schrieb:
Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for 
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.

And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace wrote:
I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would work 
well; yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have a 
pretty decent system.


Eric E. Dolecki wrote:
On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll the page, that player UI flickers 
on and

off. Pretty lame.

On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Jim Robson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 

I checked out the drag-able component sample on javafx.com and it
didn't work. If you're interested in the details, I put them in a
comment on Sten Andersen's blog here:

http://blogs.citytechinc.com/sanderson/?p=49#comment-714

hth
Jim
___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders






  


___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders



___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders




___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released


Hi Dr. Ache,
It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market 
penetration and providing newcomers a solid entry point.  Furthermore ...
The level of complexity that flash can have now can be harder on 
starters;  AS3, compilers, design patterns and so on will be are no out 
of the box toys. The main difference for me is that you can start easy 
and animation friendly via the flash IDE and it's fine documentation.
The historical super technical java docs, silly examples. the packaging, 
the badly documented differences between compiling for online and local 
aps, and a missing IDE or compiler gui pulled me from going further 
after some experimenting with it. Just now, nearly half a decade later, 
after being mentored by good tutorials, a very communicative and a 
helpful flash and AS community from a simple video editor up to a 
design-pattern-level coder, just now I would have the courage to check 
it out again.
By the way:  processing providde me with a nice wrapper and support to 
get visual stuff done for starters;  I loved it and it's betst part - : 
the java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.

http://processing.org/

Latcho


dr.ache wrote:

What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT do this.
I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic more 
and more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what desctop is 
concerned.
c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning it 
has all you need for web based systems.

d) Its open source
e) Serious corporations DO use Java for their networks and with Flex 
Adobe is trying to become more mature to be recognized by those 
companies (SAP, etc)
d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer out 
there then flash developers - so a hugh audience.

e) etc etc

I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it has 
great power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?




Latcho schrieb:
Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for 
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.

And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace wrote:
I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would work 
well; yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have 
a pretty decent system.


Eric E. Dolecki wrote:
On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll the page, that player UI 
flickers on and

off. Pretty lame.

On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Jim Robson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:


 

I checked out the drag-able component sample on javafx.com and it
didn't work. If you're interested in the details, I put them in a
comment on Sten Andersen's blog here:

http://blogs.citytechinc.com/sanderson/?p=49#comment-714

hth
Jim
___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders






  


___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders



___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders




___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders



___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

[Fwd: Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released]

Sorry for the typo's and bad structured mail. I wrote it too fast.

 Original Message 
Subject:Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released
Date:   Sat, 06 Dec 2008 22:27:03 +0100
From:   Latcho [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To:   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Flash Coders List flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
References: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Hi Dr. Ache,
It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market 
penetration and providing newcomers a solid entry point.  Furthermore ...
The level of complexity that flash can have now can be harder on 
starters;  AS3, compilers, design patterns and so on will be are no out 
of the box toys. The main difference for me is that you can start easy 
and animation friendly via the flash IDE and it's fine documentation.
The historical super technical java docs, silly examples. the packaging, 
the badly documented differences between compiling for online and local 
aps, and a missing IDE or compiler gui pulled me from going further 
after some experimenting with it. Just now, nearly half a decade later, 
after being mentored by good tutorials, a very communicative and a 
helpful flash and AS community from a simple video editor up to a 
design-pattern-level coder, just now I would have the courage to check 
it out again.
By the way:  processing providde me with a nice wrapper and support to 
get visual stuff done for starters;  I loved it and it's betst part - : 
the java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.

http://processing.org/

Latcho

dr.ache wrote:

What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT do this.
I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic more 
and more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what desctop is 
concerned.
c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning it 
has all you need for web based systems.

d) Its open source
e) Serious corporations DO use Java for their networks and with Flex 
Adobe is trying to become more mature to be recognized by those 
companies (SAP, etc)
d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer out 
there then flash developers - so a hugh audience.

e) etc etc

I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it has 
great power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?

Latcho schrieb:
Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for 
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.

And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace wrote:
I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would work 
well; yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have 
a pretty decent system.

Eric E. Dolecki wrote:
On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll the page, that player UI 
flickers on and

off. Pretty lame.

On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Jim Robson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

I checked out the drag-able component sample on javafx.com and it
didn't work. If you're interested in the details, I put them in a
comment on Sten Andersen's blog here:

http://blogs.citytechinc.com/sanderson/?p=49#comment-714

hth
Jim
___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released

2008-12-06 Thread Ashim D'Silva

I'll back processing. It's an incredible tool. Relatively simple and pretty
damn powerful. I got facial recognition going (with a library) for a 3D
scene you can look around and I've seen a good amount of excellent stuff
come out of it.
As for Java, yes, it's the original, yes, it's a more powerful engine, but
as far as front-end web work goes, both those don't matter too much, ease of
production, I think, trumps them. And with Flash 10 (CS4) artists and
developers have an incredible platform, with simple 3D, inverse kinematics
with soft skinning, and a shit load more all ready to go. I don't see Java
competing with that too easily. Java always seemed to have its own space,
which I knew nothing about; Fx is confusing me.

That said, I'd back open source if its got a chance.

2008/12/7 Latcho [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Hi Dr. Ache,
 It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market penetration
 and providing newcomers a solid entry point.  Furthermore ...
 The level of complexity that flash can have now can be harder on starters;
  AS3, compilers, design patterns and so on will be are no out of the box
 toys. The main difference for me is that you can start easy and animation
 friendly via the flash IDE and it's fine documentation.
 The historical super technical java docs, silly examples. the packaging,
 the badly documented differences between compiling for online and local aps,
 and a missing IDE or compiler gui pulled me from going further after some
 experimenting with it. Just now, nearly half a decade later, after being
 mentored by good tutorials, a very communicative and a helpful flash and AS
 community from a simple video editor up to a design-pattern-level coder,
 just now I would have the courage to check it out again.
 By the way:  processing providde me with a nice wrapper and support to get
 visual stuff done for starters;  I loved it and it's betst part - : the
 java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.
 http://processing.org/

 Latcho



 dr.ache wrote:

 What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT do this.
 I find its pretty obvious.

 a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic more and
 more with every release.
 b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what desctop is
 concerned.
 c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning it has
 all you need for web based systems.
 d) Its open source
 e) Serious corporations DO use Java for their networks and with Flex Adobe
 is trying to become more mature to be recognized by those companies (SAP,
 etc)
 d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer out there
 then flash developers - so a hugh audience.
 e) etc etc

 I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it has great
 power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?



 Latcho schrieb:

 Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for
 online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.
 And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

 Anthony Pace wrote:

 I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would work well;
 yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have a pretty
 decent system.

 Eric E. Dolecki wrote:

 On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll the page, that player UI flickers on
 and
 off. Pretty lame.

 On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Jim Robson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:



 I checked out the drag-able component sample on javafx.com and it
 didn't work. If you're interested in the details, I put them in a
 comment on Sten Andersen's blog here:

 http://blogs.citytechinc.com/sanderson/?p=49#comment-714

 hth
 Jim
 ___
 Flashcoders mailing list
 Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
 http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders









 ___
 Flashcoders mailing list
 Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
 http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders


 ___
 Flashcoders mailing list
 Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
 http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders



 ___
 Flashcoders mailing list
 Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
 http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders


 ___
 Flashcoders mailing list
 Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
 http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders




-- 
The Random Lines
My online portfolio
www.therandomlines.com
___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released


I dont get your point.
First you said: Dunno why they put energy in this.
Then I pointed out what makes me think there decision is obvious and 
even more: a good step from a java perspective.


What does that mean: It's not about it's power. It's also about 
marketing and market penetration and providing newcomers a solid entry 
point.


That is a totally different story. They do not copy flash they just 
expand there platform in a way that you build more
modern RIAs on it. When you want to make a comparison then with flex. In 
a way both of them (Flex and Java FX) seem
to mimic each other. The first one adopts the language structure, the 
later admits that there is more then forms and tables.


I agree with a lot of points from you but its another discussion. There 
are good reasons for the Java world to open up,

its just getting more multimedia.




Latcho schrieb:

Hi Dr. Ache,
It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market 
penetration and providing newcomers a solid entry point.  Furthermore ...
The level of complexity that flash can have now can be harder on 
starters;  AS3, compilers, design patterns and so on will be are no 
out of the box toys. The main difference for me is that you can start 
easy and animation friendly via the flash IDE and it's fine 
documentation.
The historical super technical java docs, silly examples. the 
packaging, the badly documented differences between compiling for 
online and local aps, and a missing IDE or compiler gui pulled me from 
going further after some experimenting with it. Just now, nearly half 
a decade later, after being mentored by good tutorials, a very 
communicative and a helpful flash and AS community from a simple video 
editor up to a design-pattern-level coder, just now I would have the 
courage to check it out again.
By the way:  processing providde me with a nice wrapper and support to 
get visual stuff done for starters;  I loved it and it's betst part - 
: the java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.

http://processing.org/

Latcho


dr.ache wrote:

What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT do this.
I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic more 
and more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what desctop is 
concerned.
c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning it 
has all you need for web based systems.

d) Its open source
e) Serious corporations DO use Java for their networks and with Flex 
Adobe is trying to become more mature to be recognized by those 
companies (SAP, etc)
d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer out 
there then flash developers - so a hugh audience.

e) etc etc

I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it has 
great power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?




Latcho schrieb:
Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for 
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.

And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace wrote:
I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would work 
well; yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have 
a pretty decent system.


Eric E. Dolecki wrote:
On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll the page, that player UI 
flickers on and

off. Pretty lame.

On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Jim Robson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:


 

I checked out the drag-able component sample on javafx.com and it
didn't work. If you're interested in the details, I put them in a
comment on Sten Andersen's blog here:

http://blogs.citytechinc.com/sanderson/?p=49#comment-714

hth
Jim
___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders






  


___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders



___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders




___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders



___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders




___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released


I did not say anything else. No one says that it's a direct opponent to
flash. but I am pretty sure that this is gonna steal the show for flex 
in the

business line. When you have to build really huge applications enterprise
developer are the first who can manage that - and now with the ability of
a front-end extension to their OWN language and environment (which includes
everything that is still lacking in flex and flash or is at most in the 
beginning
of development like unit tests, dependencies visualisation, 
blablabla...) they
do not need to switch to things like flex. they just need to learn that 
package

like some flash developers need to learn , whatever.. Tweenlite ;-)

Just to remember. I just say, there IS a good reason for them to further 
develop java fx


Ashim D'Silva schrieb:

As for Java, yes, it's the original, yes, it's a more powerful engine, but
as far as front-end web work goes, both those don't matter too much, ease of
production, I think, trumps them. And with Flash 10 (CS4) artists and
developers have an incredible platform, with simple 3D, inverse kinematics
with soft skinning, and a shit load more all ready to go. I don't see Java
competing with that too easily. Java always seemed to have its own space,
which I knew nothing about; Fx is confusing me.

That said, I'd back open source if its got a chance.

2008/12/7 Latcho [EMAIL PROTECTED]

  

Hi Dr. Ache,
It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market penetration
and providing newcomers a solid entry point.  Furthermore ...
The level of complexity that flash can have now can be harder on starters;
 AS3, compilers, design patterns and so on will be are no out of the box
toys. The main difference for me is that you can start easy and animation
friendly via the flash IDE and it's fine documentation.
The historical super technical java docs, silly examples. the packaging,
the badly documented differences between compiling for online and local aps,
and a missing IDE or compiler gui pulled me from going further after some
experimenting with it. Just now, nearly half a decade later, after being
mentored by good tutorials, a very communicative and a helpful flash and AS
community from a simple video editor up to a design-pattern-level coder,
just now I would have the courage to check it out again.
By the way:  processing providde me with a nice wrapper and support to get
visual stuff done for starters;  I loved it and it's betst part - : the
java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.
http://processing.org/

Latcho



dr.ache wrote:



What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT do this.
I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic more and
more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what desctop is
concerned.
c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning it has
all you need for web based systems.
d) Its open source
e) Serious corporations DO use Java for their networks and with Flex Adobe
is trying to become more mature to be recognized by those companies (SAP,
etc)
d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer out there
then flash developers - so a hugh audience.
e) etc etc

I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it has great
power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?



Latcho schrieb:

  

Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.
And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace wrote:



I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would work well;
yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have a pretty
decent system.

Eric E. Dolecki wrote:

  

On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll the page, that player UI flickers on
and
off. Pretty lame.

On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Jim Robson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:





I checked out the drag-able component sample on javafx.com and it
didn't work. If you're interested in the details, I put them in a
comment on Sten Andersen's blog here:

http://blogs.citytechinc.com/sanderson/?p=49#comment-714

hth
Jim
___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders



  






___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders


  

___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders





___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released


http://channelsun.sun.com/video/software/javafx/1915439297

Check this out... you know it is kind of funny that they are selling the 
idea of javaFX through the use of flash hahaha





dr.ache wrote:

I did not say anything else. No one says that it's a direct opponent to
flash. but I am pretty sure that this is gonna steal the show for flex 
in the

business line. When you have to build really huge applications enterprise
developer are the first who can manage that - and now with the ability of
a front-end extension to their OWN language and environment (which 
includes
everything that is still lacking in flex and flash or is at most in 
the beginning
of development like unit tests, dependencies visualisation, 
blablabla...) they
do not need to switch to things like flex. they just need to learn 
that package

like some flash developers need to learn , whatever.. Tweenlite ;-)

Just to remember. I just say, there IS a good reason for them to 
further develop java fx


Ashim D'Silva schrieb:
As for Java, yes, it's the original, yes, it's a more powerful 
engine, but
as far as front-end web work goes, both those don't matter too much, 
ease of

production, I think, trumps them. And with Flash 10 (CS4) artists and
developers have an incredible platform, with simple 3D, inverse 
kinematics
with soft skinning, and a shit load more all ready to go. I don't see 
Java
competing with that too easily. Java always seemed to have its own 
space,

which I knew nothing about; Fx is confusing me.

That said, I'd back open source if its got a chance.

2008/12/7 Latcho [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 

Hi Dr. Ache,
It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market 
penetration

and providing newcomers a solid entry point.  Furthermore ...
The level of complexity that flash can have now can be harder on 
starters;
 AS3, compilers, design patterns and so on will be are no out of the 
box
toys. The main difference for me is that you can start easy and 
animation

friendly via the flash IDE and it's fine documentation.
The historical super technical java docs, silly examples. the 
packaging,
the badly documented differences between compiling for online and 
local aps,
and a missing IDE or compiler gui pulled me from going further after 
some
experimenting with it. Just now, nearly half a decade later, after 
being
mentored by good tutorials, a very communicative and a helpful flash 
and AS
community from a simple video editor up to a design-pattern-level 
coder,

just now I would have the courage to check it out again.
By the way:  processing providde me with a nice wrapper and support 
to get
visual stuff done for starters;  I loved it and it's betst part - : 
the

java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.
http://processing.org/

Latcho



dr.ache wrote:

   
What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT do 
this.

I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic more 
and

more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what desctop is
concerned.
c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning 
it has

all you need for web based systems.
d) Its open source
e) Serious corporations DO use Java for their networks and with 
Flex Adobe
is trying to become more mature to be recognized by those companies 
(SAP,

etc)
d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer out 
there

then flash developers - so a hugh audience.
e) etc etc

I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it has 
great

power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?



Latcho schrieb:

 

Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.
And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace wrote:

   
I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would work 
well;
yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have a 
pretty

decent system.

Eric E. Dolecki wrote:

 
On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll the page, that player UI 
flickers on

and
off. Pretty lame.

On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 1:15 PM, Jim Robson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:



   

I checked out the drag-able component sample on javafx.com and it
didn't work. If you're interested in the details, I put them in a
comment on Sten Andersen's blog here:

http://blogs.citytechinc.com/sanderson/?p=49#comment-714

hth
Jim
___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders



  






___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders


  

___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released

I only said they had the tools for years (java) and the examples (cool 
nerd applets, processing) to make that shift earlier and to create the 
atmosphere and invitations to a multimedia minded crowd (how old is 
that word now).
How come that for ex the videoplayer war was on real, ms and qt ? Where 
was java, where were the java api's, tutorials on video and codec 
support? Where were the tools and the starter kits.
Some where in underground  hackersland maybe. Thats what I imply. That's 
why Java always missed the boat, to get the wright buzz out on the 
wright time; It just always looked so java, and the dev's thought it was 
all good with thre new skin toolkit end the sun was shining.
How much time does it take to get that nickel dropping ? And how much 
time will they need to catchup if we merge into a another cycle witch 
requires new tools and sets new expectations ? And for that reason I'm 
not encouraged to jump on their boat. 
They managed to release some-200X-thing and it was about time. Time for 
the nickel to fall.


Latcho



dr.ache wrote:

I did not say anything else. No one says that it's a direct opponent to
flash. but I am pretty sure that this is gonna steal the show for flex 
in the

business line. When you have to build really huge applications enterprise
developer are the first who can manage that - and now with the ability of
a front-end extension to their OWN language and environment (which 
includes
everything that is still lacking in flex and flash or is at most in 
the beginning
of development like unit tests, dependencies visualisation, 
blablabla...) they
do not need to switch to things like flex. they just need to learn 
that package

like some flash developers need to learn , whatever.. Tweenlite ;-)

Just to remember. I just say, there IS a good reason for them to 
further develop java fx


Ashim D'Silva schrieb:
As for Java, yes, it's the original, yes, it's a more powerful 
engine, but
as far as front-end web work goes, both those don't matter too much, 
ease of

production, I think, trumps them. And with Flash 10 (CS4) artists and
developers have an incredible platform, with simple 3D, inverse 
kinematics
with soft skinning, and a shit load more all ready to go. I don't see 
Java
competing with that too easily. Java always seemed to have its own 
space,

which I knew nothing about; Fx is confusing me.

That said, I'd back open source if its got a chance.

2008/12/7 Latcho [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 

Hi Dr. Ache,
It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market 
penetration

and providing newcomers a solid entry point.  Furthermore ...
The level of complexity that flash can have now can be harder on 
starters;
 AS3, compilers, design patterns and so on will be are no out of the 
box
toys. The main difference for me is that you can start easy and 
animation

friendly via the flash IDE and it's fine documentation.
The historical super technical java docs, silly examples. the 
packaging,
the badly documented differences between compiling for online and 
local aps,
and a missing IDE or compiler gui pulled me from going further after 
some
experimenting with it. Just now, nearly half a decade later, after 
being
mentored by good tutorials, a very communicative and a helpful flash 
and AS
community from a simple video editor up to a design-pattern-level 
coder,

just now I would have the courage to check it out again.
By the way:  processing providde me with a nice wrapper and support 
to get
visual stuff done for starters;  I loved it and it's betst part - : 
the

java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.
http://processing.org/

Latcho



dr.ache wrote:

   
What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT do 
this.

I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic more 
and

more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what desctop is
concerned.
c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning 
it has

all you need for web based systems.
d) Its open source
e) Serious corporations DO use Java for their networks and with 
Flex Adobe
is trying to become more mature to be recognized by those companies 
(SAP,

etc)
d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer out 
there

then flash developers - so a hugh audience.
e) etc etc

I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it has 
great

power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?



Latcho schrieb:

 

Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.
And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace wrote:

   
I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would work 
well;
yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have a 
pretty

decent system.

Eric E. Dolecki wrote:

 
On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll the page, that player

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released

If you still need to have downloaded the JRE in order to use javaFX, 
then it still has the same issue it always had... most people are 
impatient and can't stand waiting for such a large download to complete; 
especially, when they are using a 56k modem.


Latcho wrote:
I only said they had the tools for years (java) and the examples (cool 
nerd applets, processing) to make that shift earlier and to create the 
atmosphere and invitations to a multimedia minded crowd (how old is 
that word now).
How come that for ex the videoplayer war was on real, ms and qt ? 
Where was java, where were the java api's, tutorials on video and 
codec support? Where were the tools and the starter kits.
Some where in underground  hackersland maybe. Thats what I imply. 
That's why Java always missed the boat, to get the wright buzz out on 
the wright time; It just always looked so java, and the dev's thought 
it was all good with thre new skin toolkit end the sun was shining.
How much time does it take to get that nickel dropping ? And how much 
time will they need to catchup if we merge into a another cycle witch 
requires new tools and sets new expectations ? And for that reason I'm 
not encouraged to jump on their boat. They managed to release 
some-200X-thing and it was about time. Time for the nickel to fall.


Latcho



dr.ache wrote:

I did not say anything else. No one says that it's a direct opponent to
flash. but I am pretty sure that this is gonna steal the show for 
flex in the
business line. When you have to build really huge applications 
enterprise
developer are the first who can manage that - and now with the 
ability of
a front-end extension to their OWN language and environment (which 
includes
everything that is still lacking in flex and flash or is at most in 
the beginning
of development like unit tests, dependencies visualisation, 
blablabla...) they
do not need to switch to things like flex. they just need to learn 
that package

like some flash developers need to learn , whatever.. Tweenlite ;-)

Just to remember. I just say, there IS a good reason for them to 
further develop java fx


Ashim D'Silva schrieb:
As for Java, yes, it's the original, yes, it's a more powerful 
engine, but
as far as front-end web work goes, both those don't matter too much, 
ease of

production, I think, trumps them. And with Flash 10 (CS4) artists and
developers have an incredible platform, with simple 3D, inverse 
kinematics
with soft skinning, and a shit load more all ready to go. I don't 
see Java
competing with that too easily. Java always seemed to have its own 
space,

which I knew nothing about; Fx is confusing me.

That said, I'd back open source if its got a chance.

2008/12/7 Latcho [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 

Hi Dr. Ache,
It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market 
penetration

and providing newcomers a solid entry point.  Furthermore ...
The level of complexity that flash can have now can be harder on 
starters;
 AS3, compilers, design patterns and so on will be are no out of 
the box
toys. The main difference for me is that you can start easy and 
animation

friendly via the flash IDE and it's fine documentation.
The historical super technical java docs, silly examples. the 
packaging,
the badly documented differences between compiling for online and 
local aps,
and a missing IDE or compiler gui pulled me from going further 
after some
experimenting with it. Just now, nearly half a decade later, after 
being
mentored by good tutorials, a very communicative and a helpful 
flash and AS
community from a simple video editor up to a design-pattern-level 
coder,

just now I would have the courage to check it out again.
By the way:  processing providde me with a nice wrapper and support 
to get
visual stuff done for starters;  I loved it and it's betst part - 
: the

java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.
http://processing.org/

Latcho



dr.ache wrote:

  
What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT do 
this.

I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic 
more and

more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what desctop is
concerned.
c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning 
it has

all you need for web based systems.
d) Its open source
e) Serious corporations DO use Java for their networks and with 
Flex Adobe
is trying to become more mature to be recognized by those 
companies (SAP,

etc)
d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer out 
there

then flash developers - so a hugh audience.
e) etc etc

I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it 
has great

power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?



Latcho schrieb:



Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.
And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released

Sorry couldn't see the content:

TypeError: Error #1009: Cannot access a property or method of a null
object reference.
at
Omniture_Utility/onTemplateReady()[/Applications/MAMP/htdocs/flex/Omniture_Utility/Omniture_Utility.as:59]

at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEventFunction()
at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEvent()
at
com.brightcove.fl.federated.api.modules::ExperienceAPI/onTemplateReady()

at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEventFunction()
at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEvent()
at com.brightcove.fl.federated::Template/onContentLoad()
at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEventFunction()
at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEvent()
at com.brightcove.fl.federated.content::ContentManager/onContentLoad()
at com.brightcove.fl.federated.services::PersistentResponder/onResult()

Anthony Pace wrote:

http://channelsun.sun.com/video/software/javafx/1915439297

Check this out... you know it is kind of funny that they are selling
the idea of javaFX through the use of flash hahaha

dr.ache wrote:

I did not say anything else. No one says that it's a direct opponent to
flash. but I am pretty sure that this is gonna steal the show for
flex in the
business line. When you have to build really huge applications
enterprise
developer are the first who can manage that - and now with the
ability of
a front-end extension to their OWN language and environment (which
includes
everything that is still lacking in flex and flash or is at most in
the beginning
of development like unit tests, dependencies visualisation,
blablabla...) they
do not need to switch to things like flex. they just need to learn
that package

like some flash developers need to learn , whatever.. Tweenlite ;-)

Just to remember. I just say, there IS a good reason for them to
further develop java fx

Ashim D'Silva schrieb:
As for Java, yes, it's the original, yes, it's a more powerful
engine, but
as far as front-end web work goes, both those don't matter too much,
ease of

production, I think, trumps them. And with Flash 10 (CS4) artists and
developers have an incredible platform, with simple 3D, inverse
kinematics
with soft skinning, and a shit load more all ready to go. I don't
see Java
competing with that too easily. Java always seemed to have its own
space,

which I knew nothing about; Fx is confusing me.

That said, I'd back open source if its got a chance.

2008/12/7 Latcho [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Hi Dr. Ache,
It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market
penetration

and providing newcomers a solid entry point. Furthermore ...
The level of complexity that flash can have now can be harder on
starters;
AS3, compilers, design patterns and so on will be are no out of
the box
toys. The main difference for me is that you can start easy and
animation

friendly via the flash IDE and it's fine documentation.
The historical super technical java docs, silly examples. the
packaging,
the badly documented differences between compiling for online and
local aps,
and a missing IDE or compiler gui pulled me from going further
after some
experimenting with it. Just now, nearly half a decade later, after
being
mentored by good tutorials, a very communicative and a helpful
flash and AS
community from a simple video editor up to a design-pattern-level
coder,

just now I would have the courage to check it out again.
By the way: processing providde me with a nice wrapper and support
to get
visual stuff done for starters; I loved it and it's betst part -
: the

java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.
http://processing.org/

Latcho

dr.ache wrote:

What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT do
this.

I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic
more and

more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what desctop is
concerned.
c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning
it has

all you need for web based systems.
d) Its open source
e) Serious corporations DO use Java for their networks and with
Flex Adobe
is trying to become more mature to be recognized by those
companies (SAP,

etc)
d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer out
there

then flash developers - so a hugh audience.
e) etc etc

I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it
has great

power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?

Latcho schrieb:

Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.
And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace wrote:

I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would
work well;
yet, the applications seem to take forever to load and I have a
pretty

decent system.

Eric E. Dolecki wrote:

On my Mac in Firefox when I scroll

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released

Hehe...i had to laugh about this to - BUT : go to flash sites listed on
FWA, alot of them have bugs like this to.

Latcho schrieb:

Sorry couldn't see the content:

TypeError: Error #1009: Cannot access a property or method of a null
object reference.
at
Omniture_Utility/onTemplateReady()[/Applications/MAMP/htdocs/flex/Omniture_Utility/Omniture_Utility.as:59]

at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEventFunction()
at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEvent()
at
com.brightcove.fl.federated.api.modules::ExperienceAPI/onTemplateReady()

at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEventFunction()
at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEvent()
at com.brightcove.fl.federated::Template/onContentLoad()
at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEventFunction()
at flash.events::EventDispatcher/dispatchEvent()
at com.brightcove.fl.federated.content::ContentManager/onContentLoad()
at
com.brightcove.fl.federated.services::PersistentResponder/onResult()

Anthony Pace wrote:

http://channelsun.sun.com/video/software/javafx/1915439297

Check this out... you know it is kind of funny that they are selling
the idea of javaFX through the use of flash hahaha

dr.ache wrote:

like some flash developers need to learn , whatever.. Tweenlite ;-)

Just to remember. I just say, there IS a good reason for them to
further develop java fx

Ashim D'Silva schrieb:
As for Java, yes, it's the original, yes, it's a more powerful
engine, but
as far as front-end web work goes, both those don't matter too
much, ease of

which I knew nothing about; Fx is confusing me.

That said, I'd back open source if its got a chance.

2008/12/7 Latcho [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Hi Dr. Ache,
It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market
penetration

just now I would have the courage to check it out again.
By the way: processing providde me with a nice wrapper and
support to get
visual stuff done for starters; I loved it and it's betst part -
: the

java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.
http://processing.org/

Latcho

dr.ache wrote:

What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT
do this.

I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic
more and

more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what
desctop is

concerned.
c) Java was meant to be the internet language ever since. Meaning
it has

etc)
d) Just a guess, but I would say there are more Java developer
out there

then flash developers - so a hugh audience.
e) etc etc

I dont think JavaFX will replace something like flash... but it
has great

power and this is the first release... do you remember flash 1?

Latcho schrieb:

Dunno why they put energy in this. Java, they had their chances for
online animation-focussed penetration, too late now I guess.
And the site crashed my pretty stable FF3.

Anthony Pace wrote:

I am sure if better coders provided better examples it would
work well;
yet, the applications

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released

This is going to fade.. JavaFX will never be used for an online ad 
banner or some little blending
effects on pictures. It has the same audience like Flex RIAs and due to 
this fact the expectations
change. When you are forced to wait for 2MB of pictures just to see them 
blend on top of a page

mixed with the content you really have been after - that sucks.
But if you have an ebay RIA (for example) in which you can handle 
multiple auctions at the same time and
modify your auction pictures in a photoshop like environment - hey this 
is just an example, I just mean
more an application instead of a dynamic webpage) you do want to wait 
for this additional amount of

time. It only depends on your expectations...

Anthony Pace schrieb:
If you still need to have downloaded the JRE in order to use javaFX, 
then it still has the same issue it always had... most people are 
impatient and can't stand waiting for such a large download to 
complete; especially, when they are using a 56k modem.


Latcho wrote:
I only said they had the tools for years (java) and the examples 
(cool nerd applets, processing) to make that shift earlier and to 
create the atmosphere and invitations to a multimedia minded crowd 
(how old is that word now).
How come that for ex the videoplayer war was on real, ms and qt ? 
Where was java, where were the java api's, tutorials on video and 
codec support? Where were the tools and the starter kits.
Some where in underground  hackersland maybe. Thats what I imply. 
That's why Java always missed the boat, to get the wright buzz out on 
the wright time; It just always looked so java, and the dev's thought 
it was all good with thre new skin toolkit end the sun was shining.
How much time does it take to get that nickel dropping ? And how much 
time will they need to catchup if we merge into a another cycle witch 
requires new tools and sets new expectations ? And for that reason 
I'm not encouraged to jump on their boat. They managed to release 
some-200X-thing and it was about time. Time for the nickel to fall.


Latcho



dr.ache wrote:

I did not say anything else. No one says that it's a direct opponent to
flash. but I am pretty sure that this is gonna steal the show for 
flex in the
business line. When you have to build really huge applications 
enterprise
developer are the first who can manage that - and now with the 
ability of
a front-end extension to their OWN language and environment (which 
includes
everything that is still lacking in flex and flash or is at most in 
the beginning
of development like unit tests, dependencies visualisation, 
blablabla...) they
do not need to switch to things like flex. they just need to learn 
that package

like some flash developers need to learn , whatever.. Tweenlite ;-)

Just to remember. I just say, there IS a good reason for them to 
further develop java fx


Ashim D'Silva schrieb:
As for Java, yes, it's the original, yes, it's a more powerful 
engine, but
as far as front-end web work goes, both those don't matter too 
much, ease of

production, I think, trumps them. And with Flash 10 (CS4) artists and
developers have an incredible platform, with simple 3D, inverse 
kinematics
with soft skinning, and a shit load more all ready to go. I don't 
see Java
competing with that too easily. Java always seemed to have its own 
space,

which I knew nothing about; Fx is confusing me.

That said, I'd back open source if its got a chance.

2008/12/7 Latcho [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 

Hi Dr. Ache,
It's not about it's power. It's also about marketing and market 
penetration

and providing newcomers a solid entry point.  Furthermore ...
The level of complexity that flash can have now can be harder on 
starters;
 AS3, compilers, design patterns and so on will be are no out of 
the box
toys. The main difference for me is that you can start easy and 
animation

friendly via the flash IDE and it's fine documentation.
The historical super technical java docs, silly examples. the 
packaging,
the badly documented differences between compiling for online and 
local aps,
and a missing IDE or compiler gui pulled me from going further 
after some
experimenting with it. Just now, nearly half a decade later, after 
being
mentored by good tutorials, a very communicative and a helpful 
flash and AS
community from a simple video editor up to a design-pattern-level 
coder,

just now I would have the courage to check it out again.
By the way:  processing providde me with a nice wrapper and 
support to get
visual stuff done for starters;  I loved it and it's betst part - 
: the

java displaying power and the easy applet pubishing.
http://processing.org/

Latcho



dr.ache wrote:

 
What I am concerned I do not see any reason why they should NOT 
do this.

I find its pretty obvious.

a) They do already have a language actionscript tries to mimic 
more and

more with every release.
b) They do have the power flash is lacking especially what 
desctop is

concerned.
c) Java was meant to be

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released

2008-12-06 Thread Paul Andrews

- Original Message - 
From: Anthony Pace [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Flash Coders List 
flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com

Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 3:30 AM
Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released

If you still need to have downloaded the JRE in order to use javaFX, then 
it still has the same issue it always had... most people are impatient and 
can't stand waiting for such a large download to complete; especially, 
when they are using a 56k modem.

This isn't going to be a barrier for use in a corporate environment or for 
deployment on an intranet. Clearly JavaFX is very much at a disadvantage 
compared with flash in the wider world, but in a corporate environment with 
an existing java development culture, it would be seen as a very useful 
tool.

Paul 

___
Flashcoders mailing list
Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders

Re: [Flashcoders] JavaFX released