Re: G4 Power Mac OSX10.3 / classic with OS9.2.1
On Thu, Feb 18, 2010 at 10:42 PM, Kasey Smith wrote: > > On Feb 18, 2010, at 11:25 AM, Liam Proven wrote: > >> [3] Tiger: I would recommend this strongly. It is a little bigger and >> slower than Panther, but some of the new facilities, such as Exposé >> and Dashboard are rather good. Actually, these days, 10.4 is pretty > > Just some info, but Panther has Exposé already ;) Oops! Er, Dashboard and Spotlight, then. TBH, myself, Spotlight is the only one I really use. Spotlight I use many times a day, Exposé once a season and Dashboard only when demoing the machine... -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 Power Mac OSX10.3 / classic with OS9.2.1
On Thu, Feb 18, 2010 at 3:13 PM, Gene Henley wrote: > > I was given a G4 Power Mac digital audio. I think about 700 Mhz.I`m new to > Mac. I recognized the click of death in the HD, and replaced it with a 80 > gig. I used the restore disk with the three install disks that came with it.I > replaced the cd drive with a Samsung SH-S214D.So far. So good. The Samsung > does not burn. Burn not supported. Reads DVD and CD fine. I suspect that I > need unsupplied drivers and/or patches from third party.I`m looking for toast > 6 and/or toast on ebay. I don`t want to upgrade to Tiger. Not Yet.The Mac is > not on internet. My idea is to download files to a PC and transfer > appropriate files by flash drive to the Mac. I don`t want to hub the Mac or > rout it with the PC yet. If I can use the Samsung Lightscribe,I`d like to do > so. > OK. I`m open :-) PC to Mac! > > Gene Sounds like you're willing to fiddle, so I think you're off to a good start! Suggestions: [1] I would connect it to the Internet as soon as possible. You don't need to worry about antivirus software or anything - Macs are not prone to such problems. [2] To get your CD drive burning disks, a little program called Patchburn will probably sort you out. It's free. http://www.patchburn.de/ Lightscribe, I don't know. I guess you'd need a burning program such as Toast. [3] Tiger: I would recommend this strongly. It is a little bigger and slower than Panther, but some of the new facilities, such as Exposé and Dashboard are rather good. Actually, these days, 10.4 is pretty dated itself and the latest versions of many free programs (e.g. Growl or VLC) will no longer work on it. However, your machine is below the spec to officially run Leopard (10.5). You can coax it on with a program called "LeopardAssist", however. But note, if you do go to 10.5, tyou will lose the ability to run MacOS 9.x under Classic - this was removed. [4] USB Flash drive - yes, this should work, so long as the drive is formatted with FAT32. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Leopard or Tiger?
On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 8:49 PM, Kris Tilford wrote: > I don't agree with this article. My experience is that the hit on > performance is closer to the 15-20% range for any PPC Mac running > Leopard as compared to the faster Tiger. I have only tried 10.5 on a single PowerPC Mac - my 20" iMac G5 - but the machine felt significantly slower under 10.5 than with 10.4. Not massively but I agree, 10% orso sounds plausible to me. Unfortunately, on my 10.4-only iBook G4, I am starting to find apps that only support 10.5+ now - such as Growl. I may be forced to upgrade just to be able keep my apps current. :¬( I'd go with 10.4 for any PPC box, unless the latest versions of the apps you want don't run under it. Obviously, if you need Classic, it has to be 10.4. > EXACTLY! And this is the problem with the article you cited above. The > comparison was done on the same Mac, BUT, the problem is that only one > HD was used, and it was a triple booting (three partitions) of one > single HD. The difference between partitions on one HD can be in the > 10-15% or greater range, so if the Leopard OS was on a fast partition > and the Tiger on a slow partition, the results would be skewed. In > order to do a valid comparison you'd need to install a clean OS onto > one HD or partition and run the test; then erase that HD or partition > and install the other OS onto the SAME HD or partition and rerun the > test. I believe if you run the tests on IDENTICAL setups you'll see > that Leopard is 15-20% slower than Tiger. I agree, in principle, but I have to say, from my own benchmarking days - back when I did performance evaluation for a living, 13-14y ago - position of stuff on disk made no measurable difference in tests. Yes, it's a theoretical factor, but in practice, the difference was too small to measure. That means, on my old tests, <0.1% difference. I think perhaps it may be like Windows 7 versus Vista. Win7 has been heavily tuned for responsiveness and everyone who uses it tends to say that it *feels* faster than before, but actually, in benchmark tests, actually Vista tends to win. Benchmarks do not measure how responsive a system "feels", they measure the raw execution speed of apps or processes, so they tend to penalise multi-core machines and so on. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
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On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 4:16 AM, Kasey Smith wrote: > > On Nov 29, 2009, at 6:12 PM, Liam Proven wrote: > >> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 10:45 PM, Kasey Smith >> wrote: >>> >>> ok the Rev.2 ones have 16MB of video RAM (use system profiler.) >> >> Um.B&W G3s use a separate graphics card, so there could be any sorts >> of card in there and thus any amount of VRAM, so that is no guide. For >> instance, mine has a Radeon 7000 in there, so I can use Quartz >> Extreme. > The stock video cards are 16MB, and most people don't replace them That is an absurd generalisation and not a safe guide. >>> And finally, they can run Tiger. (btw >>> thats what im on, a 400MHz one.) >> >> Mine too. And it's a Rev 1. Both types can run 10.4 - all you need is >> a Firewire DVD drive and XPostFacto to kick off the installer (B&W's >> can't boot off Firewire.) > > I meant that all the B&W's can do this... [Shrug] It seemed to me that you were saying that only Rev 2s could. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Multiple HDs & os x
On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 8:12 AM, bkprolix wrote: > > I have a sawtooth 400, 1gig ram. I have a 12 gig drive & a 40 gig > drive. I am running out of space on the 12 & would like to either move > everything to the 40, or at least the user & Applications folders. I > have dragged them to the 40, but it just copied them, leaving me with > the same space problem as before. I have tried to reconfigure the pins > on the 40, but it is not recognized as a bootable drive.The forty was > taken out of an old dell & reformatted.I am running 10.4.11 You can move to a different drive by holding down Shift as you drag & drop. Try various combinations of Cmd, Shift, Opt, and 2 at once; you can make OS X either move, copy or make aliases as you wish by holding down the right combinations as you D&D. Very handy. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
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On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 10:45 PM, Kasey Smith wrote: > > ok the Rev.2 ones have 16MB of video RAM (use system profiler.) Um.B&W G3s use a separate graphics card, so there could be any sorts of card in there and thus any amount of VRAM, so that is no guide. For instance, mine has a Radeon 7000 in there, so I can use Quartz Extreme. > And finally, they can run Tiger. (btw > thats what im on, a 400MHz one.) Mine too. And it's a Rev 1. Both types can run 10.4 - all you need is a Firewire DVD drive and XPostFacto to kick off the installer (B&W's can't boot off Firewire.) In fact, I installed an old Apple-firmware DVD-ROM drive in mine (got for nothing off my local Freecycle group) and it boots & loads Tiger off the internal drive just fine now. No config changes necessary at all, it Just Worked™. :-) > Oh, as for CPU upgrades, you unclip > the heatsink , list the lever, and lift the CPU out. True, but then you have to muck around hacking the firmware to enable a G4 to be used, which is a real pain. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Upgrading a Beige
On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 2:10 AM, John Ruschmeyer wrote: > > > On Sep 14, 2009, at 7:51 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: > >> 'overclocking' is making a CPU go at faster than the CPU's rated >> speed. Putting in a CPU rated at a higher speed is, well, pretty much >> exactly what you just did on the B&W :-) >> >> The speed jumper settings on the Beige are different steps than on the >> B&W, so you will have to play with them a bit; you may not get 400 MHZ >> exactly out of it. Other World Computing used to have a good guide to >> setting the jumpers. >> > > Actually, on a beige, you can get exact 400mhz... it's a 6x > multiplier of the 66mhz bus. > > John Oh, that's great news. Thanks, folks! I shall give it a try soon... -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Upgrading a Beige
On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 12:47 AM, Gorka Martinez Mezo wrote: > >> I recently put a Sonnet G4 in my Blue&White. Works fine now I've >> sorted the firmware - Sonnet's tool for this didn't work, but one from >> someone else did. > > Liam, do you have the G4 enabler CD? I got a Sonnet G4 card for my beige G3 > but without the CD! > > Would you be interested in a deal?? I didn't get a CD either, actually. I downloaded the Sonnet tool but I couldn't get it to work. You have to use the programmers' switch to enable flashing mode or something and my machine did not want to cooperate. I am not at home so can't check on my B&W but I *think* I used the NewerTech firmware enabler from here: http://eshop.macsales.com/tech_center/processors.cfm (Look right at the bottom of the page). I'll check again when I get home & let you know! -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Upgrading a Beige
I recently put a Sonnet G4 in my Blue&White. Works fine now I've sorted the firmware - Sonnet's tool for this didn't work, but one from someone else did. This means my old G3/400MHz is now free. Can one upgrade a Beige to a 400MHz chip? I overclocked my old 300 to 333, but I've never tried going this far... -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: B&W won't boot off firewire?
2009/8/14 ronaldo : > > So... an unmodified G3 'Smurf' can't boot through either Firewire or > USB ports... without XPost Facto tricks. But what about a G3 upgraded > with a Sonnet G4 400 Mhz card... can anyone pronounce definitively on > that? If a car cannot fly, it does not matter how big an engine you fit, it still will not fly. Changing the CPU does not magically enable a motherboard to do something it cannot. What devices are bootable is a function of the firmware, not the processor. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Java on PowerMac G5
2009/8/10 Mac User #330250 : > > Hi! > > There is a PowerPC version of Java from IBM, available for Linux, AIX and > z/OS. > http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/java/jdk/ > You need to register for a download. > > The Linux version works okay on Gentoo Linux, at least it did on my previous > system, a Power Mac G4 MDD. > Available is 1.4, 1.5 and 1.6 in both 32-bit and in 64-bit versions. > > If such a port will also work in the underlaying Unix of Mac OS X I don't > know. No, it won't. [a] OS X is Unix but it's not Linux. Linux binaries will not run on OS X. [b] OS X has its own GUI, Aqua, which is totally different from X.11 as used on Linux. Also OS X Java is extended to support calls into NextStep objects. You need an OS X version of Java for OS X. AFAIK, Sun does not produce one, as Apple does. > It is clear though that Sun's version and Apple's versions of Java 1.6 are > Intel-only (x86 and maybe x86-64). > > Anyway, I'd also be interested in ways to get Java 1.6 on Mac OS X/PPC. > Andreas aka Mac User #330250 Unfortunately Apple is dropping support for the PowerPC and so PPC users are stuck with whatever version of Java Apple provides and this means 1.5. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: iBook G3/700 & Ubuntu experiment
2009/8/8 Arnel Tuazon : > > Well I thought I'd give my old iBook G3 some new life by installing Jaunty > Jackalope as I kept hearing about Ubuntu and how great it is. All I can say > is if you're a regular Joe computer user, Linux is still not for you IMHO. > I don't understand how an OS (Linux) after all these years and with all the > past hype still seems like it's in the beta stages as an OS for the masses. > Ease of use it ain't (well maybe just for Ubuntu as I haven't tried YDL in 4 > years). I'm sorry to hear you say that, but as a Linux user and occasional evangelist for 13y now, I have to admit that *as a modern Internet desktop OS* it is essentially an x86 OS. As a server, it can be just fine on various non-x86 machines, including PowerPC. The problem is that although Linux itself is open source, some of the fairly critical parts of the GUI desktop are not; they are proprietary binary blobs supplied as freeware by large commercial companies like Adobe. This applies to a number of things you might reasonably want, such as the Flash player and Skype and drivers for quite a variety of hardware. Some other bits, such as Adobe Reader, one can more happily live without. Without these, you will have a sub-optimal experience, to say the least - and alas there is little chance of them ever appearing. On a very basic x86 PC, Linux is entirely capable of being installed and used by a non-expert user these days. Indeed it can be better for "newbies" than for those with a little PC experience. A common problem is people thinking that they know how to do things on a computer, when actually, all they know is how /Windows/ does something. So, for instance, if they want to play RealPlayer, they think "ah! I need RealPlayer. I'll go to the Real site, download it, install it and I'll be running." The snag is, that's not the way it works on Linux, and that method will be very hard, complex, failure-prone and probably won't work. If they simply stuck "how to play realplayer video on ubuntu" into Google and followed the instructions, they'd be fine. Either way, sadly, for a modern distro like Ubuntu, a 700MHz machine is a low spec. My 1.6GHz PC laptop struggles with Ubuntu! Frankly, if your Mac can run OS X, you're better off with OS X than any flavour of Linux. The only exception is if you're trying to build a server and either can't afford OS X Server or it is not suitable for the requirement. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Mail directory "broken"? PBG4 10.5.7
2009/8/4 Dan : > > At 10:14 PM -0400 8/3/2009, Stanton Mitrany wrote: >>the Dock's Mail icon bouncing attracted my attention. I clicked on >>it and was informed that (or something like this) "directory is >>broken. To fix it, you need to quit Mail." > > Hate it when that happens. > >>I obeyed, and then re-launched Mail. I was confronted with what >>appeared to be an Apple set-up application, which asked me to begin >>what looked to be a multi-step process to locate, if I remember >>correctly, something like my Mail database. > > Quit Mail. > > Launch Disk Utility, and run a Verify Disk pass on your HD - makes > sure everything is ok from the file system's point of view. If it > finds any errors, repair them. > > Backup "~/Library/Mail" -- just in case. > > Move "~/Library/Mail/Envelope Index" to your desktop. > > Launch Mail and let it re-index things. > > That "Envelope Index" is a sqlite database that gets corrupted easily. All good points, but I would also suggest a reboot in Safe Boot mode, which will fsck the main hard disk automatically. Journalling notwithstanding, errors do accumulate. This is the easiest way to check the boot drive. It's that or boot an OS X install CD & run Disk Utility from there - more work - or rely on a dual-boot machine with 2 or more copies of OS X, which few people have. > Personally, I would never let any inbox grow to over a few hundred > messages. Organize things - Mail supports folders with multiple > mailboxes. That seems a bit much! I have hundreds of folders inside folders, but still, I archive all my email (except spam). I have a 3GB+ mailbox in T'bird with all my mail since 1996 in it. Hard to keep that to under "a few hundred messages per folder"! -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: help in upgrading powermac quick silver 733
2009/8/4 mlitwin3797 : > > This processor had three pieces to it,a vent looking thing,a processor > "board" and one other.The ad said the Hs was included,whatever that is. "H/S" or "HSF" means "heatsink and fan". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_sink It's probably the "vent-looking thing." :¬) -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: help in upgrading powermac quick silver 733
2009/8/3 ll : > > I have a Powermac Quick Silver 733 with a 30 gig hard drive and > 1.3 gig ram. I just purchased a 933 processor for this on ebay for > $40. I want to replace the hard drive but am having problems finding > one on the internet.I have been using hard drive for quick silver with > no luck. > I would like to get at least a 60 hd or 80 if the machine will > take it and costs will allow.I understand I will have to purchase the > os before I finish the upgrade.It will take a while to get this for a > reasonable price.I have leopard 10.7 on the machine.It came with that. > I hope this is the right group. Two groups have told me I have > contacted the wrong one. This machine is a G4 of course. > > Do I need to get the os dvds before I have the 933 processor put > in?If I have the 933 processor put in,will it be easier to fool the > machine to reinstall leopard when I increase the hard drive? The > installed hard drive is a Quantum Fireball and not the original for > the computer. > Someone has suggested correctly that,the upgrades I propose will > make the computer close to to a Mac mini in cost. That may be true > but I don't want a Mac Mini with Intel. What Andreas said! Yes, this is a good place. No, you don't particularly need to reinstall the OS before or after changing the CPU. If you copy the contents of the old HD onto the new one, you don't even need to do it then. Disk Utility has a "restore" function that will duplicate a whole volume in one operation for you, or you can use the free Carbon Copy Cloner. A Quicksilver should be fine with any EIDE disk up to 120GB. Above 128GB, it might work, it might not. You can try it and see - you will not harm either computer or drive if it doesn't work, the Mac just might not see all the capacity of the drive. You can get new 120GB EIDE 3.5" drives here in the UK for around £30. That's under US$50. Personally, I have tried 10.5 on a G5 and found it a bit slow and unresponsive. I suspect 10.4 will be faster, but soon that goes out of support. This may be a problem for you, or it may not. You can still use newer apps on 10.4 for now - the latest versions of iTunes, Quicktime, Safari and so on from Apple all work on 10.4 as far as I know. So does Firefox 3.5 and other new browsers and apps. In a year or 2, though, it will probably start to get hard to find apps. I understand preferring a "proper" PowerMac to a "MacIntel", but it must be said - the Intel machines are /much/ faster, especially if you have native apps. I almost never use any Classic apps any longer, and of course, with 10.5, you can't anyway. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Window position assignment drives us nuts
2009/8/1 iJohn : > > On Fri, Jul 31, 2009 at 10:52 PM, Jonas Lopez wrote: >> ... so you tug the window off to the side and open a new window, search >> Google, >> get the info you wanted and now move the email window back to the main >> position >> and paste it into the email. > > Slightly off topic (again) and mentioned (again) just FWIW ... have > you tried expose and/or spaces? That's what I was going to say, too. Jonas, if you're /that/ fussy & particular about window positions, then use Spaces and have different windows on different desktops, all exactly where you want them and never move them. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Blues & White CPU Upgrade Woo's
2009/7/23 Clark Martin : > PS I'd have the blues too if I was wooing a computer upgrade. :) Yeah, I wondered about that, too. :¬) Perhaps it was meant to be "woes" but with an extra "grocer's apostrophe". -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Blue and White G3 Ethernet problems
2009/7/8 Chance Reecher : > > All I had to do to install 10.4 server was swap my CD-ROM with a > DVD-ROM, and put in 512MB of RAM. The DVD booted and installed fine. > Is your firmware up to date on your B&W? That might have kept 10.4 > from installing. Hmmm. Interesting. What version of OS X Server is on your DVD? Mine is the 10.4.7 Universal DVD. This requires a G4 or better. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Return to PowerPC?
2009/7/8 Mullin9 : > OOPS I though I could fit the ROM to PS3, and give it more RAM, It > didn't work like I expected it would, > I wanted to Make a Faster-than-G5 PPC Computer, it was a dud. too > mismatched to work at all To be honest, if you even *thought* that such things could be done, you don't have anything /approaching/ the level of knowledge to even attempt to do it. One instance out of hundreds: what do you think the code in a system's ROM *does*? What is it actually there for? The code in a computer's firmware is there to initialise the hardware in the system, test it and then bring it to a known state, then load an operating system from storage and start it running. This means that you can't simply take the ROMs out of one machine and put them in another, because the code will not work on hardware other than that which it is designed for. To give a facetiously trivial example, if the Mac firmware expects the graphics card's framebuffer to be located at &86F in the memory map, and it doesn't find the framebuffer there, it will fail. There is little to no resemblance between the hardware of a PS3 and that of a Mac G5. Porting the OS from one to the other would be a massive undertaking involving many man-years of effort. But even setting aside all this, you seem to believe that the Cell processor is faster than the G5. It isn't. Cell is a very specialised tool and not a terribly good fit for a videogame console, for starters. It's not a very fast PowerPC. It's not PowerPC at all; it's merely a relative. It couples a PowerPC-like core with a bunch of very simple, very specialised sub-processors called SPs. These are not PowerPCs; they are very much simpler than that and can only run certain simple specialised tasks. They cannot run PowerPC code. Cell can be very capable for certain types of task where the calculation can be split up into 6-8 little chunks which can run in parallel on the SPs. Most ordinary computer code cannot, though. You can think of Cell as being a little like one fairly low-powered chip, similar to a PowerPC, coupled with a tiny computer grid of half a dozen ARM processors, which can be used to accelerate a few specific tasks such as MP3 coding, movie transcoding and stuff like that - and *nothing else*. For general purposes, they are useless. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Return to PowerPC?
2009/7/8 Mullin9 : > Some one did it, it is on youtube > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cEkebFzlgQ Don't believe everything you see without analysing it. All that shows is an emulator running under Linux. You can emulate anything on anything; that is the lesson of the Turing machine. With the right emulator, a PS3 could be a PC, a Sinclair Spectrum, a Gameboy or an IBM System 360 mainframe running MVS. Doesn't mean it's natively running any of those OSs. Emulators are *slow*. Incidentally, that is remarkable - the single most amateurish video I've yet to see on YouTube. The loud breathing, wobbly camera, poor focus, poor lighting. Impressively bad. :¬) -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Blue and White G3 Ethernet problems
2009/7/8 Chance Reecher : > > I recently set up an old 350mhz B&W G3 tower as a Mac OS X server > running 10.4.11. I've been having an issue with its ethernet > connectivity. Out of the blue it completely drops it's network > connection. I can't see it in Finder, and can't ping it with network > utility. However, the link light on my network switch is still lit up, > meaning the connection is still active. I can only access it again > after a restart. It happens regardless of whether I use the built-in > ethernet or a PCI ethernet card. Any idea what could be causing this, > or how I can fix it? The firmware on it is up to date, as is 10.4 > Server. > Thanks, > Chance R. I've just put OS X Server on my B&W, so I will let you know if I see similar problems. How did you get it to install, though? I had to buy a G4 upgrade to get the boot DVD to get past the 1st screen. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Return to PowerPC?
2009/7/7 Bruce Johnson : > > > On Jul 7, 2009, at 7:10 AM, Liam Proven wrote: > >> IBM had problems? Not as I recall. POWER was doing great. PowerPC was >> merely an adaptation of the high-end POWER multi-chip processors into >> a lower-end single-chip device utilising the Motorola 88000 bus, >> designed for PC-type kit. > > > IBM never managed a low power G5, and Moro couldn't get more > performance outof the PPC series. Apple (along with all the other PC > manufacturers) live and die by their laptop lines, and the inability > of either Moto or IBM to deliver low power, high performance chips > suited for laptops was strangling Apple there. I presume that the first "Moro" = "Moto"? Well, the thing is, there I was talking about the genesis of the PowerPC in the early 1990s and you're talking about its effective end in the mid-noughties. The problems that caused its creation were unrelated to those that caused its demise. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Return to PowerPC?
2009/7/7 Bruce Johnson : > > > On Jul 7, 2009, at 7:00 AM, Liam Proven wrote: > >> Well, true, but for how long under Oracle's reign? > > A while I'd think. > > This was a valuable part of Sun to Oracle, (they bought Sun because > Oracle is completely dependent on Java now, and has been since the > 8i-9 transition, this way they control that bit.) > > LOTS of big-iron Oracle databases run on Sun clusters. This way they > can sell the whole widget: an industrial-sized Oracle appliance. Personally, I think Sun's /hardware/ was wanted & will be valuable to Oracle. But remember that Sun also makes AMD and Intel x86-64 kit. I reckon /that/ is what the new owners will be interested in. SPARC doesn't offer a significant performance boost now unless your apps need lots of threads, where the Niagara chips have a distinct edge - for now. But that kind of code is fairly rare. > Plus Sun was dirt-cheap. (I laugh, thinking back to the days when all > the pundits were breathlessly suggesting that Sun buy Apple.) Indeed. Very sad. > I'm more concerned about all the OSS that Sun was nurturing: > VirtualBox, OpenOffice, Java, etc. > > Unless Oracle's looking to take a run at the utopian dream of the thin > client, and take on Microsoft in Microsoft's home court, I suspect > those things will eventually be spun off, or simply dropped off > outside Sourceforge, with a note attached "Please take care of this > orphaned Open Source". Good point; I agree. I think Larry Ellison /really/ hates Gates & Microsoft, and will do what he can to twist the knife, /so long as/ it doesn't cost him money or business. And FOSS is a useful anti-MS weapon. So they might well embrace it. I hope so, anyway. One thing Sun could assemble, fairly readily, would be a killer large-enterprise messaging solution. A far more scalable back-end server than Exchange, coupled via an instant-push-delivery protocol to a premium-grade client app. This would not actually be hard to do, but nobody's ever done it. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Return to PowerPC?
2009/7/7 John Martz : > > On Tue, Jul 7, 2009 at 10:10 AM, Liam Proven wrote: >> AMD are really struggling now. The Sledgehammer µarch was stunning and >> killed Itanium; it moved the x86 world onto 64-bit, although 99% of >> machines still run 32-bit S/W, just like for a decade, 99% of the >> 32-bit 386 machines ran 16-bit S/W. > > I assume you're using 99% in a "wave your hands" sort of way. [...] > None of this will immediately change the fact that a majority of the > x86-64 systems out there will *still* be running in 32-bit mode. I'm > just saying that a lot more than 1% of them will move to 64-bit mode. All right, it's a fair cop. Perhaps 90-95% might have been a more reasonable guesstimate. Although I would note that OS X86 is essentially a 32-bit OS with extensions to provide the facility to run 64-bit apps, which is actually quite a sensible way of doing things... > It took a long time to build up momentum, but I think from this point > on the switch over is only going to move faster. Probably, yes. If only to allow personal computers to simply and easily access >4GB of RAM. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Return to PowerPC?
2009/7/7 Alex Smith (K4RNT) : > > P.A. Semi's flagship product before they were acquired was the > PWRficient processor, a PPC dual-core 2.0GHz processor that only > consumed <4W power. I know. Thus my comment. > I even contacted them for information on an evaluation kit (too bad it > was $1495!) Owww... > The PowerPC and POWER lines will live on - I'm just hoping Apple will > still be part of the PowerPC program, even in an embedded market... POWER is fine for now. Few people seem to have registered that, along with the divestment of the laptop & desktop lines to Lenovo a few years back, IBM has done the same with x86 servers more recently. PowerPC, though? Specialised chips in consoles, maybe, but they're not really PPC. In battery-powered roles, it's being outcompeted and outperformed by ARM. Perhaps in the embedded market, but if so, we'll never see them, and that is /so/ not Apple's playground. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Return to PowerPC?
2009/7/7 Mullin9 : > > OOPS > > I grabbed a PS3 but Swapped the 256MB RAM, with 4 GB RAM stick, > wired/ > soldered in a 2005 Apple ROM not the EFI, and installed OS X v 10.5 > and with 3.2 GHz PPC Cell CPU It Screams. Nope, I don't believe it. I don't believe you could readily adapt Apple's firmware to a PS3. I don't see much point - OS X on PPC is dead, anyway. And finally, Cell isn't /that/ quick - SP-to-RAM access is dismal, in particular - & OS X couldn't use the SPs anyway. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Return to PowerPC?
2009/7/6 PeterH : > > On Jul 5, 2009, at 9:49 PM, Mullin9 wrote: > >> Will Apple return to PPC processors? > > A year or so ago, Apple purchased a fab-less designer and > manufacturer of multi-core PPC processors. > > It is conceivable that Apple may use PPC processors in some future > products, but the investment in Intel-based products for the desktop > and laptop has been high, and has been largely successful. > > Snow Leopard will NOT be a universal system: it will be Intel only; > so a return to PPC is not bloody likely for MacOS, ever. > > However another product which is based upon PPC, or another processor > which can make effective use of the power-saving technology which was > acquired in that Apple purchase of a PPC company seems likely. > > Perhaps a set-top box or a hand-held box? No, I still don't believe it. The costs of keeping OS X current on 3 architectures - x86, ARM *and* PowerPC - would outweigh the hypothetical benefits of PPC. I think PAsemi's strengths lie in fast multicore RISC. I think the ARM has lots of potential that current implementations, aimed mostly at cellphones, aren't exploiting. I suspect Apple will turn PAsemi over to making very fast, maybe multi-gigahertz, multicore ARM chips. Things that can scream along on mains power and also tick along on a tenth of a Watt when you're on batteries. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Return to PowerPC?
2009/7/7 tortoise : > > IBM had problems with their design which was why they teamed up with > APPLE. at the time theirs was the worst performing and selling. Don't > forget Motorola was in there too, coming in especially with the G4. IBM had problems? Not as I recall. POWER was doing great. PowerPC was merely an adaptation of the high-end POWER multi-chip processors into a lower-end single-chip device utilising the Motorola 88000 bus, designed for PC-type kit. The 680x0 was going nowhere, the 88000 was dead in the water, and both Apple & Motorola needed something new. For IBM it was just a chance to get into another segment of the market. > Sun and SGI always had the better designs in the 90s but pricey too. > Nevertheless SGI cornered the movie business and Sun the web server > market. The g5 got apple into the big time. > > But I think that they have blown it now. Intel centers on the lower > end of the market now with their low power cpus. For high end machines > clearly IBM and AMD excel. These are the cpus preferred by scientists > and engineers -- they are not the same as the consumer versions > admittedly but those benefit from this research. I know Bruce will > argue with this but I am speaking statistically of course. AMD are really struggling now. The Sledgehammer µarch was stunning and killed Itanium; it moved the x86 world onto 64-bit, although 99% of machines still run 32-bit S/W, just like for a decade, 99% of the 32-bit 386 machines ran 16-bit S/W. But Intel turned on a dime - very impressive for such a large company - moved the Netburst µarch P4s onto x86-64 then released the really very good Core2 line based on the Pentium III (ergo, Pentium Pro) µarch. AMD retained a big lead in memory bandwidth through HyperTransport, but Intel has had a big edge in raw CPU power. Now, with Core i7 and soon Core i5, Intel is racing up on memory bandwidth too. And it's cleaning up at the low end with the Atom chip, too. Frankly, unless AMD pulls off a miracle, I think it's looking /very/ bad for it. Even Via's Nano has disappointed in the market. Perhaps an unholy AMD/Via/nVidia merger will happen, with very-lower-power-but-good-graphics ARM cores, low-power Via cores and some kind of hybrid-multicore CPU/GPU beast for the consumer market. It would be interesting, at least. > Clearly apple is a consumer company. Although the video industry > helps, many specialists have complained the intel macs are not so good > for them as the g5 was. (Intel centric) Benchmarks aside, this is user > experience. Even SSE4 can't match Altivec, it's true - at least from what I've heard - but few people really need SIMD instructions. They were a marketing ploy, a way to use extra CPU acreage. The real benefits came from growing onboard caches, not from all the SIMD stuff. > By the way they have POWER5+ intellistations on closeout for $5000. > 2x2ghz dual core, 4GB RAM, 32MB Cache on-chip, dual SCSI drives, and > free monitor. > (G5 is Power4). No OS. Put Linux on and run Leopard with MOL. Sounds nice! I always wished IBM did a deal and ported OS X Server to its POWER servers. Apple once sold AIX boxes; I see no reason a reverse deal couldn't have worked. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Return to PowerPC?
2009/7/6 PeterH : > > > On Jul 5, 2009, at 10:27 PM, MaGioZal wrote: > >> The RISC had a lot of promises, but many times hadn't delivered them. > > It's not the processor, it's the implementation. > > IBM is making huge quantities of PPC RISCs. > > Sun is still making its RISCs. Well, true, but for how long under Oracle's reign? I wouldn't bet on it. At best, SPARC will be offloaded to Fujitsu or spun out. > Intel's CISCs are doing well. To say the least. But one might point out that in a sense, the modern Core2/i5/i7 etc. chips, all derivatives of the Pentium Pro, are in a way superscalar chips that actually run RISC micro-ops underneath, merely with on-the-fly translation from x86 into µops. > And, perhaps the oldest architecture in continuous use, the IBM > System/360/370/390 (also called z/System), also a CISC, is now in its > 45-th year, and shows no signs of being gone any time soon. IBM is a little cagey on this but aren't the modern z9 CPUs based in some way on POWER? -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: B&W startup error
2009/7/6 glen : >> >> >I've just bought a Sonnet Encore G4/500 upgrade for my elderly but >> >100% reliable Rev 1 B&W G3/400. (I want to try Mac OS X Server 10.4 on >> >it, and this requires a G4 CPU.) >> > >> >Snag is, when I fit the new chip, the Mac won't boot. I don't get a >> >Sad Mac or a crash tone or anything, just 5 short clear beeps from the >> >speaker. It sounds much more like a PC error beep than a Mac one! >> >> Did you update the firmware on your B&W? Be sure that you follow >> installation directions exactly or the Sonnet will not work. You >> should have gotten a CD from Sonnet when you bought your upgrade. >> The CD contains an installer that will upgrade the firmware on your >> Mac, and this must be done before you install the Sonnet Encore G4. >> > > Sonnet has downloads of the Firmware Updater Installer and the SonnetCache > Enabler at: > <http://www.sonnettech.com/support/downloads/processorupgradecards.html> I tried both the MacOS 9 & OS X versions of this. The OS X one just caused a kernel panic, every single time. The MacOS 9 one ran but the instructions for getting into firmware programming mode were incorrect, & when I googled up the correct ones, it didn't run. > OWC has the Blue & White G4 Enabler at: > <http://eshop.macsales.com/tech_center/software.cfm> > > One or the other firmware patches should do the trick. The G4 Enabler needs > to be applied in OS 9, not sure about the Sonnet Updater. --glen This one, thankfully, did work fine and got my chip working, after 2-3hr of fiddling. So many thanks! Unfortunately my mere 500MHz G4 came up with overheating warnings almost immediately and I had to shut the Mac down, sharpish. I've cleaned & remounted the Apple heatsink with some fresh TIM and mounted an old Pentium II fan on top. Now it runs nice & cool, but the fan is too big & I can't close the Mac... [*Sigh*] However, it's working, and Mac OS X Server 10.4.7 is now happily installing on a mirror pair of 17GB UltraSCSI 3 disks. I also plan to hook up an external cabinet with 4 x 37GB UltraSCSI 3 disks for network storage. I'm hoping that OS X server will let me make a true RAID of these, as opposed to the stripe set which is all that ordinary OS X 10.4 would create. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: B&W startup error
On 06/07/2009, glen wrote: >> Did you update the firmware on your B&W? Be sure that you follow >> installation directions exactly or the Sonnet will not work. You >> should have gotten a CD from Sonnet when you bought your upgrade. >> The CD contains an installer that will upgrade the firmware on your >> Mac, and this must be done before you install the Sonnet Encore G4. Well, I have no CD, as I bought the chip from a very pleasant chap on the LEMswaps list, 2nd hand. > Sonnet has downloads of the Firmware Updater Installer and the SonnetCache > Enabler at: > <http://www.sonnettech.com/support/downloads/processorupgradecards.html> Wonderful! Many thanks - and to the others who have posted to enlighten me about my rookie mistake. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
B&W startup error
I've just bought a Sonnet Encore G4/500 upgrade for my elderly but 100% reliable Rev 1 B&W G3/400. (I want to try Mac OS X Server 10.4 on it, and this requires a G4 CPU.) Snag is, when I fit the new chip, the Mac won't boot. I don't get a Sad Mac or a crash tone or anything, just 5 short clear beeps from the speaker. It sounds much more like a PC error beep than a Mac one! I power on, it goes BIP BIP BIP BIP BIP and then just sits there. Replacing the G3, it works fine again. Any ideas, anyone? -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Best Browser for iBook G4
2009/5/14 Patrick Moore : > > I'm new to this list and know only enough about computers to get > myself into trouble by trying to improve things. Here is question #1. > > 1.33 mhz, 1.25 G, OX 10.4.11. Camino was fast but beta-like > (superimposed text, eg); Firefox is slow and does things like extend > the text I am typing in gmail out of sight to the east on my screen; > and loading attachments in gmail is very slow. Safari? I've not used > it, but is it faster than FF and does it have its electronic act > together better than Camino? > > I use a Mac because I need Word for my work (no, I can't use Open > Office, tho' I wish I could) and dislike MS; otherwise I'd use Ubuntu > where Firefox gave me no problems. > > Disclaimer: despite my professed antipathy to MS, I do have a cute > little HP Mini 1000 with XP -- again, would use Ubuntu x/c I need > Word. > > Thanks. > > Patrick Moore Well, FWIW, I used Firefox on 10.4 with no issues whatsoever. I advise AdBlock+ as a mandatory add-on, to get rid of most banner adverts - not only do these clutter up a page visually, they slow it down. FlashBlock is also helpful - Flash isn't quick on an older Mac, though G4s are less of a problem than G3s, which are crippled by it. For AJAX apps, like Gmail, you need fast JavaScript. You could try Firefox 3.5, still in beta but fairly usable, but the fastest JS implementation on Mac OS X is currently Safari 4. I found Safari 3 to be clunky and unpleasant but v4 is a lot more usable. With Safari, the simplest counterpoint to AdBlock+ is Privoxy, which works a treat and is excellent. Personally I use 2 browsers at once: I leave Gmail open in Safari (on Macs) or Chrome (on Windows), and Firefox for all other general browsing stuff. Then if Gmail is busy, it doesn't slow down your general browsing. Personally, although I liked Camino, I see no point any more, as F'fox 3 is pretty seamless on OS X, plus you get add-ins. Same goes for Shiira and Webkit if you have Safari 4. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • LiveJournal/Twitter: lproven MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: PPC G4 Won't Upgrade from Panther to Tiger
2008/12/11 Charles Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Is this your only Mac? > Is there another Mac available, I.E. within driving/ lugging distance? > If there is, dismount the 10GB drive, and go visiting. > mount the 10GB drive in the other machine, Nuke & Pave with a CC or > SuperDuper! clone of a working OSX.4.? system, dis-mount 10GB drive, > go home & re-install in your G4. --- Probably a good idea to do the > upgrade to X.4.11 while there. > > Doesn't answer the question directly, but it gets you there [OSX.4.11 > on your system]. > > HTH > > Chuck D. > Go on then. Tell us, how can he tell which specific model of Mac that recovery disk is from, and how do you propose he locates someone with that exact model of machine who's prepared to let him temporarily disconnect its own hard disk and fit his? Because that's the only way your advice will work, you do realize that? -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: PPC G4 Won't Upgrade from Panther to Tiger
2008/12/10 JimInStuttgart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Hello all, I wonder if anyone has encountered this problem: When I > attempt to upgrade from 10.3.9 to 10.4, the auto-check program tells > me "System 10.4 cannot be installed on this computer." No further > reason given. > > I own a Power PC G4 which started life as a G4/400. I've installed a > Sonnet processor upgrade that took it to 1.8Ghz. I've maxed the RAM > (insofar as I know) at 1.5G. I've added USB 2.0; I've replaced the > original CD-ROM with a DVD burner. I have the original internal HD of > 10Gig and an added one of 700Gig. > > I bought the Tiger system disks at eBay. The iMac install for 10.4.2 > are original; There is what looks to be a burned copy of 10.4.11 that > reads "Update PPC only." > > As far as I can tell, 10.4 should install; but the neither the disc > marked "10.4.11 for PPC only" nor the "10.4.2" for iMac will install. > Both give the same error message. > > Can anyone assist? I've read through several forums and Tiger appears > to work on G4 "Sawtooth" models. Should work on mine, I think. Or am > I better off just going to 10.5? > > There's still plenty of life left in this computer, if I can get the > software to work. > > Thanks very much, As others said, I reckon you've been suckered. That's not a retail 10.4 install disk you've bought but one bundled with one specific Mac, and that Mac is all it will work on. The 2nd CD just contains the patch update from Apple. It's no help or use to you. I don't know of any way of forcing a model-specific disk to install on a different model. I'd ask for your money back, or go buy a *retail* CD in *retail* packaging. That, or go look on ISOHunt and places like that for a downloadable image you can get via Bittorrent of a generic 10.4 PPC install DVD. Be prepared for a few gig of transfer though. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Leopard on a G5
2008/12/9 Bruce Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > > On Dec 9, 2008, at 12:11 PM, Liam Proven wrote: > >> I don't know what to do. I don't think there's anything wrong with my >> installation. My CPU usage goes up and down but the machine is often >> only doing 50-75%. > > "Only 50-75%" is a pretty hefty load, but I don't think this is your > problem. > > >> I have loads of memory. I am not doing anything >> CPU-intensive like compiling code or running big Photoshop filters. >> The iMac dual-boots into Tiger and that's not noticeably quicker. > > You mention 'a dozen plus tabs open in Firefox' as a normal > occurrence, plus webkit at the same time. I'll wager if you install a > flash blocker in Firefox and Safari it'll help things. Flash is the > king of all CPU-suckers. > > Look in Activity Monitor and see what's hogging the CPU and memory. Worth a try. Yes, lots of tabs is normal for me - I'm a journalist, so I am usually fossicking around online looking for stories and leads. I run AdBlock+ in both Firefox and Safari/Webkit as a matter of course, so I don't normally see a lot of Flash. I used to use FlashBlock on my G3. Flash is one of the few programs I've seen that genuinely seems to use Altivec and it was dog-slow on a G3 CPU, so I blocked it. I will try it and see! -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Leopard on a G5
I know, it's not an unsupported machine... but I have a question for the assembled. This this just me? Here's the deal... I've just got my iMac G5 back from repair, thanks to Apple generously arranging a small warranty extension for me, as my machine has a known PSU problem. Just before it died, I upgraded it from 1GB of RAM to 2GB. It's a 20" model, 2GHz CPU, on its stock 250GB SATA hard disk. I have a second 19" monitor plugged in as well. The thing is, I've just been catching up on LowEndMac and I've been reading all these articles about people running 10.5 on below-spec G4s and commenting on how nice and fast they are, and how high-end G4s are still pleasant machines. While my Mac was away, I tried shifting back to a borrowed 1.5GHz G4 mini with my old copy of Tiger on it. I couldn't work on it - it was just too sluggish. So, I stripped down, cleaned and rebuilt my PC, which was replaced by the iMac. It's an Athlon XP 2800 with 1G of RAM and 120 & 60GB hard disks. I tried Vista for a while, but I didn't like it. I was using the cut-down "TinyVista" distribution, which actually runs acceptably on a "low-spec" PC such as a just-under-3GHz box with "only" a gig of RAM. It worked all right, was usably quick, but it adds nothing to XP and I missed some small XP features like the tree view in Explorer. So when Vista timed out and started demanding to be activated, I gave up and put a fresh install of the newly-released version of Ubuntu on it. And lo, with a bit of mucking around to import my home directory and settings from my old copy of Ubuntu 7.04, it all works fine. Ubuntu on a 32-bit Athlon 2800 is pleasant, quick and responsive. It's not a blisteringly quick PC by modern standards but it's entirely usable. The biggest let-down on Ubuntu is OpenOffice, which is a bit sluggish, but usable - it's mainly just starting it and opening documents that takes a few seconds. Now I have the Mac back and I've switched back to Leopard, which I prefer as an OS to Linux, even though my Linux desktop is more customisable. The thing is, I am finding it distinctly sluggish. It's nowhere *near* as quick as my Ubuntu machine. This was a clean install of Leopard maybe 6mth ago. I don't use it heavily. I need Firefox, Skype, Adium, Thunderbird and Word 2004 to work. Firefox feels so sluggish with a dozen-plus tabs open in a couple of windows that I've started keeping Safari open too, just for Gmail, as that's an intensive web page and slows down Firefox. To get a quicker version of Safari, I'm running the nightly build of Webkit. It can barely keep up with me typing this message in Gmail; the cursor lags a fraction of a second behind as I type. (I do about 80wpm.) I often have things like iTunes open in the background, streaming some ambient internet radio station like Sofaspace or DidgheadRadio. I may have a console open or a copy of Preview. BOINC is my screensaver but I don't let it run in the background. But this machine really drags its feet. It is not pleasant to use; it's really frustrating to have to wait several seconds for Firefox to start responding to mouse clicks, or to hit backspace half a dozen times before Gmail notices and deletes a word all in one go and maybe overshoots. If so many people are happy with Leopard on a G4, why is my G5 so disappointing? I don't know what to do. I don't think there's anything wrong with my installation. My CPU usage goes up and down but the machine is often only doing 50-75%. I have loads of memory. I am not doing anything CPU-intensive like compiling code or running big Photoshop filters. The iMac dual-boots into Tiger and that's not noticeably quicker. I really wish there was some way I could upgrade my machine to an Intel motherboard, but I believe all the innards are different. They're only the same on the outside. I'm tempted to build a Hackintosh and try that out. My PC is elderly and lacks the horsepower to do stuff like virtualisation of modern OSs, which would be useful to me. But this iMac is >< that close to being relegated to my TV set and movie player or something, which would be a shame and a waste of what ought to be a nice machine. Comments? Thoughts? -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.s
Re: Video card for G4 (AGP Graphics model)
2008/10/31 Paul <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > My G4 Gigabit tower has a Rage 128 Pro video card, but it has an ADC > plug on it as well as a regular VGA plug. Will this card work in the > earlier G4 AGP Graphics model? What I'm afraid of is that the power > supply changed between these two models, and I think it was changed to > support the ADC interface. That may mean that the card won't work, but > this topic is new and esoteric to me, so I'm hoping someone here > already knows about it. >From what I've read, the *card* will work, but the ADC port will not. The other port should be fine. But do some Googling. I have never tried - my only G4 tower is dead. :( -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Adding New HD
2008/10/28 Kris Tilford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > On Oct 27, 2008, at 9:53 PM, Wilton Shaw wrote: > >>> I installed my new external HD, partitioned it into two partitions, >>> made the first one the same size as my internal drive (80gb ). I >>> called it "MAC HD BACKUP" and copied my internal HD on to it, using >>> SuperDuper which then supposedly made it bootable. When I went to >>> System Preferences and clicked on startup disks it did not show up. > >>> What happened? It is a Firewire drive, isn't it? PowerPC Macs generally won't boot from USB. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: iMag G5 that eats PSUs
2008/10/26 Wallace Adrian D'Alessio <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 11:36 AM, Liam Proven <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> Hey folks >> >> I have an iMac G5 - 20", 2GHz - that had a PSU fault which required >> warranty replacement. Twice. It starts just randomly turning off, >> especially when first turned on or when waking from sleep. Doesn't >> seem to make much difference if it's warmed up or been off for days. >> >> Its former owner gave it to me for free in light of the fault. >> >> Snag is, 6mth on, it's destroyed its 3rd PSU and now I can't use it. >> And it's become my main machine. >> >> Is there any known problem with G5 iMacs that can cause this? I don't >> want to keep replacing PSUs indefinitely... It's going to get >> expensive. Now of course it's long out of warranty... > > Have you ever done a Google of the keywords? Yes, with nothing concrete as a result. Some do it, yes, but I found no reports of a known problem or anything like that. > It sounds like there might be something wrong on the mobo. Have you > looked at it? Any evidence of burning around the power port or, > burned odor? > > Do any components look like they were moved or tipped? Any sign of > loose solder joints? I've inspected it as closely as I can without stripping down the machine, and it looks fine. Pretty clean for a 3yo machine, in fact. No sign of any blown or failing capacitors or anything. However, remarkably enough, I am very happy to say that Apple has agreed to fix it for me. Apparently there was a warranty extension programme on these machines, mine was in the range of affected serial numbers, and although the extension ended in May this year, they've agreed to an exception. So hurrah for Apple! :-) -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Drive Question
2008/10/27 Amanda Ward <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Hi All... > > I've been using some USB drives (Flash and "Real" Hard Discs) and > something caught my attention. In disc utility a USB drive has 2 > entries... the first shows the drive with the manufacturer's name > ie... Hitachi and it has a MS-DOS FAT Volume Format, the second entry > seems to be like a partition that can have any format. The disc > utility entry for the drive looks like this... (Missing the drive > icons and comments, of course!) > > 18.6 GB HITACHI_DK23CA-20 Media <-Can't erase >USB Portable <- Can erase > > When I try to erase the actual drive, the top level, it never works... > reverting to MS-DOS FAT. I can format the "partition" to anything Disc > utility has to offer. > > Is this normal? It's no big thing... just trying to understand the > nature of the beast! :-) > > Amanda A hard disk can't be used "raw". It must be partitioned first, then the /partition/ is formatted and that's where your data goes. You're not seeing 2 entries side by side, you're seeing one inside the other. One is the physical drive, the other is the partition on that drive. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Question about PCI-SATA or PCI-ATA cards and G3 Beige Macs
2008/10/27 MaGioZal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Hi there, > > > Is it possible to boot a Beige G3 (ROM revision B) from a HD attached > to PCI-SATA or a PCI-ATA cards "made for PC"? > > Does it depend on the kind of chipset? > > I am asking this question because most current HDs are both SATA and > bigger than the 128GB-limit of the Beige G3 original ATA bus. I don't know for sure, but I would expect that the answer is "no". I use an Ahard Acard UltraIDE RAID card in my B&W G3. This is a Mac-specific card with Mac firmware. It works nicely and is bootable under both OS 9 and OS X. Whereas you might have a very long shot at getting a PC card to work for driving secondary disks, I'd not expect a Mac to boot off anything without Mac firmware on it. I don't know how much Mac SATA cards are now, but probably, for the age and spec of a Beige, you could buy an old slow G4 on eBay for around the same cost as a SATA host adaptor. I'm seeing them going for under £30 these days and they're cheaper in the US. I'd expect well under $50. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Which OS X install discs will work with a G4?
2008/10/27 Charles Lenington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Also, be careful I ended up with 3 copies from same seller that appear > to be copies. Most of my original disks are black but these have a blue > or purple tint. So I had to find an original to back these up and call > these backups. I have umpteen Mac recovery disks lying around. They don't only come in black at all: I have grey ones and blue ones as well. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Mac OS on PC?
2008/10/25 Doctor K <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Hi, I saw a message the other day which mentioned that a PC can run a > Mac OS. > My beloved Smurf bit it a while ago, and I've been using a Toshiba > Satellite laptop, which I found as an unbelievable bargain ($20.00 > plus a $25.00 ebay power supply) at a garage sale this summer. > I've been using this laptop for a month or so now, and am getting > comfortable with it, but there > are still a lot of things that I did with my Mac, that I don't know > how to do with this (I did install Safari though!). > Anyway, I'd appreciate any info on how to run OS X on it. This has > a 60 gig HD. If possible, I'd like to keep the existing Windows XP on > it, but would not hesitate to wipe the drive and install a Mac OS, if > it is necessary. > Thanks in advance for your thoughts. > John Realistically, no. To be honest, an old maxim applies here: if you have to ask, you don't know enough to try do it. Sorry. I've tried it on several machines: it's tricky and fiddly and doesn't work all that well. The result is called a Hackintosh. You can't apply Apple OS upgrades, various things don't work, it's completely unsupported and it's against the Apple licence. Suggestion: try TinyXP or even TinyVista if you have a 2GHz+ machine and >=1G RAM. And that's all the hints I'll give you, as if that is not enough to go on, then all you are going to do is screw up your PC and end up with a dead or non-working laptop. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
iMag G5 that eats PSUs
Hey folks I have an iMac G5 - 20", 2GHz - that had a PSU fault which required warranty replacement. Twice. It starts just randomly turning off, especially when first turned on or when waking from sleep. Doesn't seem to make much difference if it's warmed up or been off for days. Its former owner gave it to me for free in light of the fault. Snag is, 6mth on, it's destroyed its 3rd PSU and now I can't use it. And it's become my main machine. Is there any known problem with G5 iMacs that can cause this? I don't want to keep replacing PSUs indefinitely... It's going to get expensive. Now of course it's long out of warranty... -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Free Entrega USB-to-Mac-Serial convertor
I've got one of these, nearly as-new, boxed and everything. Snag is, it only comes with drivers for MacOS 8 or thereabouts. I reckon it'd work fine with MacOS 9 but OS X doesn't know what it is, rendering it a bit useless to me. Anyone want it? Free for the cost of postage from London, UK, or come collect in person if you're in the neighbourhood. -- Liam Proven • Profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/liamproven Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AOL/AIM/iChat: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • MSN/Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo: [EMAIL PROTECTED] • Skype: liamproven • ICQ: 73187508 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
