Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
I agree, who knows eventurally the machines will rule the world and us as their slaves and we may not mind that much. At 08:46 a.m. 27/10/2014, you wrote: We have caller ID so that we know who is calling us, and we have answering machines either built into the phone or as a service from our provider so that we don't have to answer the phone. We have spell checkers so that we don't have to know how to spell. Screen readers and audio books replace the need for braille so we don't need to know how to read. Possibly, in the future, voice dictation and visual gestures may take the place of keyboards so we won't need to know how to type. With all of the skills that will be lost due to not being needed, is this a good thing? It's the dumbing down of humanity, getting worse and worse. Now, am I serious, or not?? To a degree, yes. Oh, I almost forgot one more: Calculators make learning math unnecessary. How many people do math in their heads anymore, or even know how to make change at a supermarket? What would they do if the cash register's power fails and they have to do anything manually? --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 2:04 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech Hi Phil, I suppose that is always possible. I'm seeing more and more voice dictation all the time, and although I can't really use it myself I do see the mainstream using it as a replacement for keyboard input in a few years. I hadn't thought about that issue before, but as voice dictation improves people are naturally going to use that over physical input devices like keyboards and touchscreens. Cheers! On 10/26/14, Phil Vlasak phi...@bex.net wrote: Hi Thomas, Keyboards? Soon they will be as obsolete as a film camera. Most people in a few years will be using dictation, letting their laptop or tablet do the typing. Most games will use voice input and output, or physical gesture identification. Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
my issue is with braille devices even if you are able to afford them to get one serviced heck to get any tech serviced especially accss tech like braille devices costs a lot and may entale getting another device. At 02:13 p.m. 27/10/2014, you wrote: I guess if you want a braille display or embosser you have to buy one on ebay and hope that it works. On 10/26/2014 7:18 PM, tim wrote: If it wasn't for these so called machine doing the reading. Than thousands of books wouldn't be available for those to read even if you know brail. Because not all books are transferred to brail and not all readers have access to those books. That is why these machines do brail translation for those that want them.. At 05:30 PM 10/26/2014, you wrote: Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
well at uni I used a cheaker because everything was fast paced. when I stopped using it for everything I found me umable to spell or even write properly and this was for barely 6 months of doing this. At 11:42 a.m. 27/10/2014, you wrote: If you dictate and use a spell checker, you won't retain any sills at spelling that you may have been taught. Why write or type something when you can just say it? Same with reading. Why read when someone or something can read to you? Making change rather than relying on a machine to do it for long enough, and you won't be able to do it anymore. After all, why bother? Calculators decrease math skills. Let machines do everything for us, and we won't be able to do without them, and if they break, we're sunk more quickly than a torpedoed Lone Wolf sub Marine. By the way, on purpose, I made some spelling miss steaks in this message. Some were corrected by a spell checker, some weren't, because they are legitimate words that went through with no problems. If you were doing the reading, you caught them, but if you were listening, you probably didn't. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: dark d...@xgam.org To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 4:30 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards,was Throwaway Tech Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
I'm not a moderator, but I do think I remember Thomas politely asking that this topic be closed. I just thought I'd bring that up. Best Regards, Hayden -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of shaun everiss Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 8:42 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech my issue is with braille devices even if you are able to afford them to get one serviced heck to get any tech serviced especially accss tech like braille devices costs a lot and may entale getting another device. At 02:13 p.m. 27/10/2014, you wrote: I guess if you want a braille display or embosser you have to buy one on ebay and hope that it works. On 10/26/2014 7:18 PM, tim wrote: If it wasn't for these so called machine doing the reading. Than thousands of books wouldn't be available for those to read even if you know brail. Because not all books are transferred to brail and not all readers have access to those books. That is why these machines do brail translation for those that want them.. At 05:30 PM 10/26/2014, you wrote: Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
As I recall, Freedom Scientific patented the technology that would let them make displays for a couple hundred dollars. As a result, nobody else can use that method of automatically creating them, and still has to do everything by hand (which is why they cost so much). -- From: Josh k joshknnd1...@gmail.com Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 9:13 PM To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech or if we had much cheaper braille displays then we would have more access to braille. for all the complaining the nfb does about pushing braille literacy, they are not doing anything to make braille printers and braille displays more affordable. On 10/26/2014 7:18 PM, tim wrote: If it wasn't for these so called machine doing the reading. Than thousands of books wouldn't be available for those to read even if you know brail. Because not all books are transferred to brail and not all readers have access to those books. That is why these machines do brail translation for those that want them.. At 05:30 PM 10/26/2014, you wrote: Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
oh well, cheap fs displays are better than no cheap ones at all I guess. On 10/27/2014 6:33 AM, john wrote: As I recall, Freedom Scientific patented the technology that would let them make displays for a couple hundred dollars. As a result, nobody else can use that method of automatically creating them, and still has to do everything by hand (which is why they cost so much). -- From: Josh k joshknnd1...@gmail.com Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 9:13 PM To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech or if we had much cheaper braille displays then we would have more access to braille. for all the complaining the nfb does about pushing braille literacy, they are not doing anything to make braille printers and braille displays more affordable. On 10/26/2014 7:18 PM, tim wrote: If it wasn't for these so called machine doing the reading. Than thousands of books wouldn't be available for those to read even if you know brail. Because not all books are transferred to brail and not all readers have access to those books. That is why these machines do brail translation for those that want them.. At 05:30 PM 10/26/2014, you wrote: Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and
[Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
We have caller ID so that we know who is calling us, and we have answering machines either built into the phone or as a service from our provider so that we don't have to answer the phone. We have spell checkers so that we don't have to know how to spell. Screen readers and audio books replace the need for braille so we don't need to know how to read. Possibly, in the future, voice dictation and visual gestures may take the place of keyboards so we won't need to know how to type. With all of the skills that will be lost due to not being needed, is this a good thing? It's the dumbing down of humanity, getting worse and worse. Now, am I serious, or not?? To a degree, yes. Oh, I almost forgot one more: Calculators make learning math unnecessary. How many people do math in their heads anymore, or even know how to make change at a supermarket? What would they do if the cash register's power fails and they have to do anything manually? --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 2:04 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech Hi Phil, I suppose that is always possible. I'm seeing more and more voice dictation all the time, and although I can't really use it myself I do see the mainstream using it as a replacement for keyboard input in a few years. I hadn't thought about that issue before, but as voice dictation improves people are naturally going to use that over physical input devices like keyboards and touchscreens. Cheers! On 10/26/14, Phil Vlasak phi...@bex.net wrote: Hi Thomas, Keyboards? Soon they will be as obsolete as a film camera. Most people in a few years will be using dictation, letting their laptop or tablet do the typing. Most games will use voice input and output, or physical gesture identification. Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
I know how to use an abacus so I'll survive. On 10/26/2014 3:46 PM, Charles Rivard wrote: We have caller ID so that we know who is calling us, and we have answering machines either built into the phone or as a service from our provider so that we don't have to answer the phone. We have spell checkers so that we don't have to know how to spell. Screen readers and audio books replace the need for braille so we don't need to know how to read. Possibly, in the future, voice dictation and visual gestures may take the place of keyboards so we won't need to know how to type. With all of the skills that will be lost due to not being needed, is this a good thing? It's the dumbing down of humanity, getting worse and worse. Now, am I serious, or not?? To a degree, yes. Oh, I almost forgot one more: Calculators make learning math unnecessary. How many people do math in their heads anymore, or even know how to make change at a supermarket? What would they do if the cash register's power fails and they have to do anything manually? --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 2:04 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech Hi Phil, I suppose that is always possible. I'm seeing more and more voice dictation all the time, and although I can't really use it myself I do see the mainstream using it as a replacement for keyboard input in a few years. I hadn't thought about that issue before, but as voice dictation improves people are naturally going to use that over physical input devices like keyboards and touchscreens. Cheers! On 10/26/14, Phil Vlasak phi...@bex.net wrote: Hi Thomas, Keyboards? Soon they will be as obsolete as a film camera. Most people in a few years will be using dictation, letting their laptop or tablet do the typing. Most games will use voice input and output, or physical gesture identification. Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
yes I can use an abacus slate and stylus and perkins brailler very well. On 10/26/2014 3:46 PM, Charles Rivard wrote: We have caller ID so that we know who is calling us, and we have answering machines either built into the phone or as a service from our provider so that we don't have to answer the phone. We have spell checkers so that we don't have to know how to spell. Screen readers and audio books replace the need for braille so we don't need to know how to read. Possibly, in the future, voice dictation and visual gestures may take the place of keyboards so we won't need to know how to type. With all of the skills that will be lost due to not being needed, is this a good thing? It's the dumbing down of humanity, getting worse and worse. Now, am I serious, or not?? To a degree, yes. Oh, I almost forgot one more: Calculators make learning math unnecessary. How many people do math in their heads anymore, or even know how to make change at a supermarket? What would they do if the cash register's power fails and they have to do anything manually? --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 2:04 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech Hi Phil, I suppose that is always possible. I'm seeing more and more voice dictation all the time, and although I can't really use it myself I do see the mainstream using it as a replacement for keyboard input in a few years. I hadn't thought about that issue before, but as voice dictation improves people are naturally going to use that over physical input devices like keyboards and touchscreens. Cheers! On 10/26/14, Phil Vlasak phi...@bex.net wrote: Hi Thomas, Keyboards? Soon they will be as obsolete as a film camera. Most people in a few years will be using dictation, letting their laptop or tablet do the typing. Most games will use voice input and output, or physical gesture identification. Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
If you dictate and use a spell checker, you won't retain any sills at spelling that you may have been taught. Why write or type something when you can just say it? Same with reading. Why read when someone or something can read to you? Making change rather than relying on a machine to do it for long enough, and you won't be able to do it anymore. After all, why bother? Calculators decrease math skills. Let machines do everything for us, and we won't be able to do without them, and if they break, we're sunk more quickly than a torpedoed Lone Wolf sub Marine. By the way, on purpose, I made some spelling miss steaks in this message. Some were corrected by a spell checker, some weren't, because they are legitimate words that went through with no problems. If you were doing the reading, you caught them, but if you were listening, you probably didn't. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: dark d...@xgam.org To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 4:30 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards,was Throwaway Tech Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
If it wasn't for these so called machine doing the reading. Than thousands of books wouldn't be available for those to read even if you know brail. Because not all books are transferred to brail and not all readers have access to those books. That is why these machines do brail translation for those that want them.. At 05:30 PM 10/26/2014, you wrote: Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
lets see we went from feather and ink well to pencil and ink pen to computer print. Looks like progress, because it wasn't dummies that built these devices. So only those that can't handle change grip the most about it. At 03:46 PM 10/26/2014, you wrote: We have caller ID so that we know who is calling us, and we have answering machines either built into the phone or as a service from our provider so that we don't have to answer the phone. We have spell checkers so that we don't have to know how to spell. Screen readers and audio books replace the need for braille so we don't need to know how to read. Possibly, in the future, voice dictation and visual gestures may take the place of keyboards so we won't need to know how to type. With all of the skills that will be lost due to not being needed, is this a good thing? It's the dumbing down of humanity, getting worse and worse. Now, am I serious, or not?? To a degree, yes. Oh, I almost forgot one more: Calculators make learning math unnecessary. How many people do math in their heads anymore, or even know how to make change at a supermarket? What would they do if the cash register's power fails and they have to do anything manually? --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 2:04 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech Hi Phil, I suppose that is always possible. I'm seeing more and more voice dictation all the time, and although I can't really use it myself I do see the mainstream using it as a replacement for keyboard input in a few years. I hadn't thought about that issue before, but as voice dictation improves people are naturally going to use that over physical input devices like keyboards and touchscreens. Cheers! On 10/26/14, Phil Vlasak phi...@bex.net wrote: Hi Thomas, Keyboards? Soon they will be as obsolete as a film camera. Most people in a few years will be using dictation, letting their laptop or tablet do the typing. Most games will use voice input and output, or physical gesture identification. Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
Hello Charles, Please, let's not start this debate all over again. I do believe we have had similar debates like this on the list before and it serves no point or purpose to bring it up again. Plus it is really drifting away from the topic of games. While I note your concern of people being dumbed down by technology honestly there isn't anything you or I can do about it. I also don't believe technology necessarily is the enemy or the problem here. It is people who are willing to rely exclusively on the technology instead of reinforcing their own capabilities who are the real problem. There are and probably always will be lazy people who will avoid manually doing anything if they can help it, and there will always be people who don't mind a little manual labor here and there. Getting on this list debating weather or not humanity is too dependent on modern technology isn't the way to deal with the situation in my opinion. So let's focus on gaming. Cheers! On 10/26/14, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: We have caller ID so that we know who is calling us, and we have answering machines either built into the phone or as a service from our provider so that we don't have to answer the phone. We have spell checkers so that we don't have to know how to spell. Screen readers and audio books replace the need for braille so we don't need to know how to read. Possibly, in the future, voice dictation and visual gestures may take the place of keyboards so we won't need to know how to type. With all of the skills that will be lost due to not being needed, is this a good thing? It's the dumbing down of humanity, getting worse and worse. Now, am I serious, or not?? To a degree, yes. Oh, I almost forgot one more: Calculators make learning math unnecessary. How many people do math in their heads anymore, or even know how to make change at a supermarket? What would they do if the cash register's power fails and they have to do anything manually? --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
I do a lot of math in my head... Also, have you ever seen some of the things spell check just happily skips right over? -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 3:46 PM To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards,was Throwaway Tech We have caller ID so that we know who is calling us, and we have answering machines either built into the phone or as a service from our provider so that we don't have to answer the phone. We have spell checkers so that we don't have to know how to spell. Screen readers and audio books replace the need for braille so we don't need to know how to read. Possibly, in the future, voice dictation and visual gestures may take the place of keyboards so we won't need to know how to type. With all of the skills that will be lost due to not being needed, is this a good thing? It's the dumbing down of humanity, getting worse and worse. Now, am I serious, or not?? To a degree, yes. Oh, I almost forgot one more: Calculators make learning math unnecessary. How many people do math in their heads anymore, or even know how to make change at a supermarket? What would they do if the cash register's power fails and they have to do anything manually? --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 2:04 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech Hi Phil, I suppose that is always possible. I'm seeing more and more voice dictation all the time, and although I can't really use it myself I do see the mainstream using it as a replacement for keyboard input in a few years. I hadn't thought about that issue before, but as voice dictation improves people are naturally going to use that over physical input devices like keyboards and touchscreens. Cheers! On 10/26/14, Phil Vlasak phi...@bex.net wrote: Hi Thomas, Keyboards? Soon they will be as obsolete as a film camera. Most people in a few years will be using dictation, letting their laptop or tablet do the typing. Most games will use voice input and output, or physical gesture identification. Phil --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
Never mind the $1 pricetag for some books. Doesn't matter how much you hate having something read to you on the computer, unless you're a milionaire, there's no way you're going to get the same reading list in hardcopy. -- From: tim z200...@gmail.com Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 7:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech If it wasn't for these so called machine doing the reading. Than thousands of books wouldn't be available for those to read even if you know brail. Because not all books are transferred to brail and not all readers have access to those books. That is why these machines do brail translation for those that want them.. At 05:30 PM 10/26/2014, you wrote: Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
Na, I was listening (eloquence at 80%) and caught a bunch of them just fine. Its all about how much attention you pay. -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 6:42 PM To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards,was Throwaway Tech If you dictate and use a spell checker, you won't retain any sills at spelling that you may have been taught. Why write or type something when you can just say it? Same with reading. Why read when someone or something can read to you? Making change rather than relying on a machine to do it for long enough, and you won't be able to do it anymore. After all, why bother? Calculators decrease math skills. Let machines do everything for us, and we won't be able to do without them, and if they break, we're sunk more quickly than a torpedoed Lone Wolf sub Marine. By the way, on purpose, I made some spelling miss steaks in this message. Some were corrected by a spell checker, some weren't, because they are legitimate words that went through with no problems. If you were doing the reading, you caught them, but if you were listening, you probably didn't. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: dark d...@xgam.org To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 4:30 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards,was Throwaway Tech Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
To me that is a narrow definition of reading charlse. If an author wrote the words and I understand them, I've read them, heck even when I used to read books in braille I always imagined the sound of the words in my brain rather than just picking up on the letters. For a sighted person, it is slightly different, but given the time it takes to read something in braille why take the time? If you think these old skills are so valuable, well do you have central heating in your home or do you go out, chop down trees and put them on a fire? Do you go out and hunt creatures in the forest with a spear? sinse hay, what would you do without electricity. Unless tactile display can catch up with technology, (which I hope it does), I don't personally see braille surviving as a medium sinse the majority of things it can do for conveying information can be done far more easily and cheaply by a screen reader. As regards speaking, well as I said I could see a problem if the software is too dictatorial, but if you could for example specify your punctuation and spell your fantasy names to the software so you would have the same creative freedom with your text as you would when typing, well what is the problem? Beware the Grue! dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
I guess if you want a braille display or embosser you have to buy one on ebay and hope that it works. On 10/26/2014 7:18 PM, tim wrote: If it wasn't for these so called machine doing the reading. Than thousands of books wouldn't be available for those to read even if you know brail. Because not all books are transferred to brail and not all readers have access to those books. That is why these machines do brail translation for those that want them.. At 05:30 PM 10/26/2014, you wrote: Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
or if we had much cheaper braille displays then we would have more access to braille. for all the complaining the nfb does about pushing braille literacy, they are not doing anything to make braille printers and braille displays more affordable. On 10/26/2014 7:18 PM, tim wrote: If it wasn't for these so called machine doing the reading. Than thousands of books wouldn't be available for those to read even if you know brail. Because not all books are transferred to brail and not all readers have access to those books. That is why these machines do brail translation for those that want them.. At 05:30 PM 10/26/2014, you wrote: Hi Charlse. We have had the Braille vs screen reader debate before and I still disagree, if a person is listening to an audio book that is still reading if you ask me. likewise, if a person in the future writes a book vvia dictation that's still writing. It's content that matters. Is a great sheff today any the less of a sheff because they do not cut sticks, lay a fire, use a refrigerator, need to turn a spit, use a bellows to keep the fire going or anyth of the other things which in the past were necessary to cook? Heck no. If they are a great sheff we judge them by what they produce, not how they produce it. For me, a far greater concern is the standardization of methods of production and disemination which could influence creativity. In the same way as a sheff who only had access to tinned goods would not be as good a sheff as a sheff who could put their own individual stamp on fresh ingredience, I am concerned that kitbox creation methods and standardization (not to mention need to appeal to an increasingly small number of corporations which is a hole other debate), might have an adverse affect on creativity. If for example the dictation software couldn't handle fantasy names, or unusual punctuation that could be a major creative issue. That is why I personally believe written language and letters will continue sinse use of letters and punctuation allows the greatest diversity in creation, whether that's writing, coding or whatever, and why, while I don't agree about braille, I do not like the idea of everyone devolving into text speak sinse limitation of language also involves limitation of thought. I also get concerned over tools like madlibs, rhyming dictionary programs or synonym creators, and (to bring this back to games), if game creation became too limited. For example if the only thing on offer was customizations of console games based on choice, eg, creating a character by selecting from a huge bunch of elements, rather than allowing a platform where people could program their own games, or even create their own elements in a scripting language. Whether in the future the letters are typed, brailled, written with a pen, or selected from some sort of efficient on screen keyboard doesn't seem to matter to me, same with programming so long as the choice still exists and the end product can be as individualized. Ironically, a friend of mine who is a student of literature said people actually thought the same of the printing press. The arguement was if copies of a book could be instantly created by printing rather than painstakingly copied out by hand, this made the book less valuable and encouraged laziness on the part of the authors, as well as devaluing of the book on the part of the reader. Indeed apparently some holy orders forbade religious books to be printed, and the gutenberg Bible was actually banned in some parts of Europe. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
how can a synthesizer teach you spelling? On 10/26/2014 8:13 PM, dark wrote: To me that is a narrow definition of reading charlse. If an author wrote the words and I understand them, I've read them, heck even when I used to read books in braille I always imagined the sound of the words in my brain rather than just picking up on the letters. For a sighted person, it is slightly different, but given the time it takes to read something in braille why take the time? If you think these old skills are so valuable, well do you have central heating in your home or do you go out, chop down trees and put them on a fire? Do you go out and hunt creatures in the forest with a spear? sinse hay, what would you do without electricity. Unless tactile display can catch up with technology, (which I hope it does), I don't personally see braille surviving as a medium sinse the majority of things it can do for conveying information can be done far more easily and cheaply by a screen reader. As regards speaking, well as I said I could see a problem if the software is too dictatorial, but if you could for example specify your punctuation and spell your fantasy names to the software so you would have the same creative freedom with your text as you would when typing, well what is the problem? Beware the Grue! dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
Dark, I think likening reading via braille to chopping down firewood is a rather absurd and unrealistic analogy. If I am sighted, how do I read eMails or webpages? I most probably look at my computer screen, a method clearly analogous to braille. And despite what you seem to be implying here, there are most certainly concrete uses for braille. For instance, I am a lector at my church. I shutter at even the thought of taking an audio book player up there and repeating back the text that way. Even repeating back what a screenreader tells you is inefficient since it is usually stilted and without any inflection or feeling. Best Regards, Hayden -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of dark Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 7:13 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech To me that is a narrow definition of reading charlse. If an author wrote the words and I understand them, I've read them, heck even when I used to read books in braille I always imagined the sound of the words in my brain rather than just picking up on the letters. For a sighted person, it is slightly different, but given the time it takes to read something in braille why take the time? If you think these old skills are so valuable, well do you have central heating in your home or do you go out, chop down trees and put them on a fire? Do you go out and hunt creatures in the forest with a spear? sinse hay, what would you do without electricity. Unless tactile display can catch up with technology, (which I hope it does), I don't personally see braille surviving as a medium sinse the majority of things it can do for conveying information can be done far more easily and cheaply by a screen reader. As regards speaking, well as I said I could see a problem if the software is too dictatorial, but if you could for example specify your punctuation and spell your fantasy names to the software so you would have the same creative freedom with your text as you would when typing, well what is the problem? Beware the Grue! dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech
yes I am glad I know how to use my slate and stylus and perkins brailler and cranmer abacus from APH american printing house for the blind. On 10/26/2014 9:45 PM, hayden presley wrote: Dark, I think likening reading via braille to chopping down firewood is a rather absurd and unrealistic analogy. If I am sighted, how do I read eMails or webpages? I most probably look at my computer screen, a method clearly analogous to braille. And despite what you seem to be implying here, there are most certainly concrete uses for braille. For instance, I am a lector at my church. I shutter at even the thought of taking an audio book player up there and repeating back the text that way. Even repeating back what a screenreader tells you is inefficient since it is usually stilted and without any inflection or feeling. Best Regards, Hayden -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of dark Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2014 7:13 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] is it really progress? - Re: end of keyboards, was Throwaway Tech To me that is a narrow definition of reading charlse. If an author wrote the words and I understand them, I've read them, heck even when I used to read books in braille I always imagined the sound of the words in my brain rather than just picking up on the letters. For a sighted person, it is slightly different, but given the time it takes to read something in braille why take the time? If you think these old skills are so valuable, well do you have central heating in your home or do you go out, chop down trees and put them on a fire? Do you go out and hunt creatures in the forest with a spear? sinse hay, what would you do without electricity. Unless tactile display can catch up with technology, (which I hope it does), I don't personally see braille surviving as a medium sinse the majority of things it can do for conveying information can be done far more easily and cheaply by a screen reader. As regards speaking, well as I said I could see a problem if the software is too dictatorial, but if you could for example specify your punctuation and spell your fantasy names to the software so you would have the same creative freedom with your text as you would when typing, well what is the problem? Beware the Grue! dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
