Re: [h-cost] Viking alternate history--14thC/15thC Vinland?
What kinds of fibers would the scraelings have had to weave with? They didn't have sheep for wool, did they? And linen is an Old World crop and cotton doesn't grow that far north, as far as I know. I am completely ignorant of Native American costume from that region, so what would they have made clothes and blankets out of? Tea Rose -- Message: 6 Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 13:02:26 -0400 From: Elena House exst...@gmail.com To: Historical Costume h-cost...@indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] Viking alternate history--14thC/15thC Vinland? Message-ID: 9ec4d8740909291002l509cddb0h8ce2c303b28a4...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 2009/9/29 K?the Barrows kay...@gmail.com: And I was thinking how they would look by the 21st century. [snip] I'm thinking especially of leather; there's been a lot of discussion of leather being used for this, that, or the other historical garment, and the general concensus seems to be either, shyeah, right or later on, maybe once in a blue moon, but not typically. Right now I'm picturing a deerskin redingote (or better yet, schaube) and liking it... -E House ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Women in armor
Hi all, I was wondering if anyone here collects pictures of women in armor? I'm thinking of making a suit for a doll, so fantasy or Saintswear is perfectly fine, from any European period. I know there are a couple of Roman de la Rose manuscripts that have pictures of a woman in armor, though I've never found out what her story is. Any others? And what would be a good book to use for a source for Gothic or Renaissance armor? Thanks in advance, Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Costumed tableware
Hello everyone, I found this artist who makes ceramic tableware with drawings of people in historical costume on it, and I thought you guys might find it amusing. They're probably pretty pricey, since they're handmade in the USA, but just think: now you don't have to go to the movies to pick apart costume inaccuracies! You can do it at dinner in your own home! (Actually, I haven't looked hard enough to tell if the drawings are accurate, but since they're made to order, I'm sure the artist would be happy to add some inaccuracies if you asked!) You can quiz your guests! Drill your kids! Lol. Check it out at: http://www.wolfwaretableware.com/ Tea Rose, who is apparently in a silly mood today www.needleandclay.wordpress.com ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Origin of velvet
Okay, I know this is going to be one of those simple questions with a complicated answer, but I was just curious about when and where velvet was invented? Specifically, would velvet or something similar have been available, even to the very rich, in Constantinople around 800 AD? If not, when and where do we first have evidence of it? This is for a story I'm writing rather than a costume I'm building, so any information would be useful. Thanks for your collective wisdom and generosity! Tea Rose More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] lacing rings
What do you guys use for lacing rings? I just found this vendor: http://www.etsy.com/view_listing.php?listing_id=6029520 Can't beat that price! Tea Rose AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re:16th-century short pants????
Thanks, Mike. That makes sense, as both of these examples are Dutch, and you do see a lot of German styles there, especially on soldiers. Do you have any other pictures of this style? Or could you point me to a website that discusses it? Tea Rose, who is still amused by those knobbly knees. From: michael tartaglio [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] 16th-century short pants Hi, All. The man (Uriah) in the painting is wearing typical Landsknecht style clothing. The full joined hose of the late 15th C. have become upper and nether hose. The upper will develop into breeches later on. You could make them for an overheated person, but to be correct, the uppers will be woolen with a linen lining, cut on the bias, and the lowers (nethers) just woolen. There exists a pair of linen hosen (full, joined) from somewhere in Germany or Holland, I can't remember offhand. I have seen the illos showing the strange points at the knees, some looking like the point is a lining or perhaps a long shirt, I'm not sure. On the one shown, the material is all blue, making it look like the hose or the lining (not a shirt, definitely). All this is, then, is the hose of the 15th C. separated at the knee into what becomes breeches and stockings. Cheers, Mike T. AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: 16th-century short pants????
That's what I originally thought about the Bruegel field workers, or that they were worn-out hosen that had been cut off below the knees. That's why I did a double-take when I saw the Bathsheba picture, because that guy is clearly not in his drawers, or about to do any field work. Maybe, for the reasons previously mentioned, the artist was painting that guy in a gussied-up version of a peasant style. Or maybe the Bruegel drawings, which are thirty years later, show peasants wearing the castoffs of a flash-in-the-pan noble style. One reason I brought it up was to see if anyone else had any pictures of the same thing. I think it's especially interesting that Bruegel clearly shows a seam above the knee. I had even wondered if the knee parts were the tails of his undershirt drawn through, though that hardly seems practical. One leg of the guy in the Bathsheba image appears to also have this seam, so maybe it was just the way it was done. Anyway, glad I could share something surprising with you guys. It amuses me no end to see those knobbly knees in that painting. Tea Rose From: David S. Mallinak [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] 16th-century short pants To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] Has anyone consider that the short pants under-drawers? Especial the Bruegel details show workers trying to keep cool working in the hot autumn weather. Your humble and obedient servant, David S Mallinak AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] 16th-century short pants????
Somebody tell me this guy is NOT showing off his barenaked knees in the background of this painting: http://www.formfunction.org/temp/1530dutchcalendar11bathsheba.jpg Bruegel drew some fieldworkers wearing similar shorts: http://albums.photo.epson.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=4293000a=31783828f= but I had assumed this was a comfort thing rather than a style thing. But notice they have the same points over the knees as in the painting above. Please give me a plausible explanation, before my perpetually-overheated husband finds out and demands I make him a pair! Tea Rose AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: fabric selection advice
Thanks for all the input, guys! So, a ribbed silk, like faille or ottoman, would be okay for a Tudor court dress. Does taffeta fall into this category? Are there other names for it? Another thing I've been wondering about though: what characteristics should I look for in a wool fabric? I have never worked with wool (okay, only once, for my pirate coat) and I have no idea what it should look like for a period garment. Someone suggested worsted gabardine, which is what I used for my pirate coat, but I thought it seemed awfully, I dunno, hard? Like I said, I have no idea what it's supposed to look like. Thanks again to everyone who responded. Tea Rose ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: medieval book with pictures
Can anyone make some similar recommendations for the sixteenth century? I'm especially fond of England and Flanders between 1530 and 1580, but anything from about 1470 to 1600 interests me as well. I have a copy of the German Housebook and Holbein's Dance of Death, which are really cool, but I'd love to know of anything else out there. Tea Rose Robin Netherton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 23 Feb 2007, Zuzana Kraemerova wrote: P.S.: If someone knew of a manuscript such as the codex manesse reprinted in a book, it would be very nice:-)) There are hundreds of such manuscript reprints, too many to list unless you can cite a specific time/place. Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: historic academic professional robes
Matthew, Have you seen Holbein's Dance of Death woodcuts? They're small, but there are several men wearing the style of robes you describe. Here's a link to the online version: http://www.godecookery.com/macabre/holdod/holdod.htm Look at the Judge, the Advocate, the Physician, etc. The pictures are much clearer in the book I have; the originals are pretty small, I think, which is why they're so fuzzy online. Does anybody have any other books of Holbein woodcuts? I always hear that he was so famous for his woodcuts in his lifetime, but I can't seem to get my hands on any of them besides The Dance of Death. Hope this helps, Tea Rose == Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 18:08:52 + (GMT) From: julian wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] historic academic robes - robes for 15th/16th C. Barber Surgeons, Chirugeons, Notaries REQUEST FOR HELP, PLEASE Gentles of the Historical Costume List, can any Listers direct me to clear contemporary illustrations of the over-robes worn for normal day wear by late-medieval professionals such as Barber-Surgeons, Chirugeons, and Notaries? YIS, Matthew Baker, isolated from the SCA mainstream in old Jersey. Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: in search of fake fur
If you haven't already seen it, the March issue of Taunton's Threads magazine has a cover story about faux fur. There are lots of sources listed inside. I can transcribe them if people are interested. Also, it reviews a book that people on this list might find interesting. It's called Clothing and Textile Collections in the United States. It lists more than 2,600 collections in museums, historic sites and universities, and it's published by Texas Tech University Press. HTH, Tea Rose Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 09:49:43 -0600 (CST) From: Pixel, Goddess and Queen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] in search of fake fur Specifically, something that closely resembles ermine. I can find thicker stuff--if I wanted to line something with mink or fitch I'd be set--but I haven't been able to find something that is as low pile as ermine. Everything I've found is too thick and heavy. Would a white minky fabric be what I'm looking for? Many thanks, /Jen Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: aprons
Sorry I'm a little late commenting on this subject, but Brueghel (Flemish 1530s-40s) portrays aprons that seem to be a big rectangle of linen tucked into a belt. http://tinyurl.com/2ded6x I have a book with a really good copy of this painting and other Brueghels, and up close you can see the women have tiny little narrow belts that seem to be leather. Some women wear more than one belt. Their aprons are usually tucked into a belt or sometimes their overskirts are flipped up and tucked into the belt, although I don't know if that's in lieu of an apron or just to show off the contrasting lining. Hope this helps, Tea Rose Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Shops in York, England
My husband and I went to York on our honeymoon two years ago, and we enjoyed the Castle Museum, which included exhibits about mourning in Victorian England and a clothing exhibit. Those exhibits might not be there anymore, but in the gift shop they had a booklet about two Victorian gowns in their collection. They also had a display of booklets that appeared to be local productions about things like the history of candlemaking or stuff like that. I loved York. We spent two days there and we didn't see half of what there was to see. It was much more enjoyable than London for us. Tea Rose Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:04:40 -0800 (PST) From: REBECCA BURCH [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] Shops in York, England If anybody has any suggestions for places he can go while he is there, it would be greatly appreciated. I've instructed him to buy any postcards that have clothing or portraits on them, but we will see if he remembers. Rebecca Burch Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Movies and ancient costume
Since we're talking about ancient costume, and somebody mentioned Jewish, does anybody know any reliable books on Biblical costume? I've always wanted to sculpt a Nativity scene, but I have no idea as to what appropriate costumes would look like. I did an admittedly shallow search a couple of years ago and couldn't turn up anything more credible than Racinet. I did read that it was a difficult subject because the Hebrews, like the Muslims, didn't believe in using human figures in their artwork. But given the dearth of information out there, I wouldn't be surprised if even that was a false statement. I suppose for the Nativity I could just dress them as Romans, or do a medieval theme or something, but if there is accurate information to be had, I'd like to know. Tea Rose p.s. Robin, I intend to be at CostumeCon for your lecture, but I haven't registered yet. I hope there's still room; I'm really excited about it! Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] Schaube
If you want one like the Henry VIII robe, there's a pattern in the Tudor Tailor book. Here are some dress diaries for women's schaubes: http://www.curiousfrau.com/Diaries/Schaube.htm http://myra.hem.nu/costume/DressDairies/Schaube/Schaube_Dairy.htm http://catrijn.blogspot.com/search/label/schaube Hope this helps! Tea Rose Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume
I have heard about that theory, but I didn't know the name of the historian. It makes a lot of sense to me; I've seen replicas of those ancient split-level houses on TV. Regarding the resonance of the scene in the barn, you have a point. I guess the modern concept of a Nativity scene is a descendent of the fictional costumes depicted in Medieval art, huh? Just like Saint Catherine and her sideless surcoat. I'd still like to know if there was any accurate information, though. Tea Rose In a message dated 1/5/2007 9:07:14 P.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:16:00 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Movies and ancient costume To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] From what I hear, the costume would be the least of the difficulty in creating an accurate scene. There are also questions about what the setting really was like, given the architecture and living arrangements of the time. . But a Nativity Scene in the barn has a lot of history and resonance to it, and so you could legitimately use a medieval-ish costuming theme that would be consistent with the idea of the traditional nativity setting. --Robin ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] CostumeCon (was: Movies and ancient costume)
Actually, the main draw for me is that it's within driving distance of where I live. I SO wish there was more costuming stuff near Kansas City. (Is a Dickens Fair too much to ask?) But I'll be happy to tell them it's all about the historical lectures. :) Dawn and I wanted to go last year when it was in Des Moines, but I was dealing with a broken foot and the attendant medical bills and couldn't spare the price of registration. We drove up and visited the vendor hall, but I have a feeling we missed all the fun stuff. Tea Rose In a message dated 1/5/2007 9:07:14 P.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:33:47 -0600 (CST) From: Robin Netherton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] CostumeCon (was: Movies and ancient costume) To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) For those of you who decide to to attend the whole con (well worth it!) primarily because you want to come to my lectures, it would be useful if you noted along with your sign-up that my presence was a draw for you to attend the con, if only to ease their minds that yes, having me there really is helping broaden their audience. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: striped skirt
Ooo, a whole book about it! Thanks! Pixel, is there any way of knowing if the sumptuary laws meant woven-in stripes, applied stripes or pieced stripes? That painting with Mary Magdalen looked like they might be applied. Thanks to everyone who responded! I love this kind of conversation with you guys! Tea Rose Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2006 19:12:03 -0500 From: Lauren Walker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: striped skirt Here's a book about the theory: http://www.amazon.com/Devils-Cloth-History-Stripes/dp/0743472578/ sr=1-9/qid=1165363714/ref=sr_1_9/002-1662157-1188053?ie=UTF8s=books _The Devil's Cloth: A History of Stripes_ by Michel Pastoreau, translated by Jody Gladding Have fun. Lauren --- Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2006 20:56:37 -0600 (CST) From: Cat Dancer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: striped skirt I've just come off teaching a class on social distinctions in dress 1100-1500, and at least in the visual corpus, stripes are usually only seen on musicians or servants or people who are in some way social inferiors. There's at least one sumptuary law requiring prostitutes to wear rayed (striped) cloth*, for instance. [1351 London. Also 1351, in Castile, female 'companions' of the clergy required to wear striped cloth. That's all I've got in my sumptuary research about stripes.] Pixel Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: striped skirt
Wow, thanks for the info, guys. So, Bella, are those images all Italians? Are stripes ever found anywhere outside of Italy? I usually do English/Flemish, and my friend Dawn (of DawnPages, who posts on this list) pointed out that you never see woven-in stripes in northern Europe. I noticed some stripes in some Brueghel paintings (sermon of John the Baptist is one, I think) but they're always in paintings that are supposed to be in the Holy Land. So I was kind of wondering if stripes could be considered a Middle Eastern or Mediterranean influence. TR Date: Sat, 2 Dec 2006 22:18:04 EST From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] striped skirt _http://www.renaissancewoman.net/realmofvenus/wardrobe/Dance1565.jpg_ (http://www.renaissancewoman.net/realmofvenus/wardrobe/Dance1565.jpg) Just an idle question here -- in the image above, the woman with her back turned to us has a skirt that appears to be striped. Would this be a brocaded or patterned fabric of some sort, or an embellishment like embroidery or couching? Tea Rose Date: Sun, 3 Dec 2006 00:35:00 -0800 (PST) From: Bella [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] striped skirt I believe those particular stripes to be brocaded/woven in. These... http://www.renaissancewoman.net/realmofvenus/wardrobe/LadyWithHeron.jpg are barely visible, but I believe that they too are woven in. Then there is this... http://www.renaissancewoman.net/realmofvenus/wardrobe/Veronese1560.jpg The stripes there could be either woven in or applied, but my guess is woven in. However these stripes http://www.renaissancewoman.net/realmofvenus/wardrobe/Fasolo.JPG ...although they could very well be woven-in, look much more like they are applied. These next are definitely woven-in I think http://www.renaissancewoman.net/realmofvenus/wardrobe/ForniGirolamoVicenza.jpg ...as are the next...almost looks like corduroy, but is probably a voided velvet. http://www.renaissancewoman.net/realmofvenus/wardrobe/Marietta1580-90.jpg Hope that helps some. Bella The Realm of Venus http://realmofvenus.renaissancewoman.net/ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] striped skirt
_http://www.renaissancewoman.net/realmofvenus/wardrobe/Dance1565.jpg_ (http://www.renaissancewoman.net/realmofvenus/wardrobe/Dance1565.jpg) Just an idle question here -- in the image above, the woman with her back turned to us has a skirt that appears to be striped. Would this be a brocaded or patterned fabric of some sort, or an embellishment like embroidery or couching? Or is it artistic license? I haven't seen a skirt like that on a realistic 16th century person before (only allegorical or foreigners), but then these seem to be Italians, and I don't do Italian (not yet, anyway). Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Fabric question
I'm sure someone on this list can answer this question for me: What the heck is silk gazar fabric? http://www.fashionfabricsclub.com/catalog_itemdetail.aspx?ItmID=M162_ Thanks! Tea Rose Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: French Hood (was Tudor Tailor review)
Wow, that is some really cool information, Melanie. So, does that allow you to draw any conclusions about the gable headdress?( http://www.tudor-portraits.com/UnknownLady5.jpg) It almost looks like it could be the same hood, only with the fall(s) attached on the bottom instead of the top (and, of course, there were two falls). I've always thought that if someone made a timeline of images showing how the gable and French hood headdresses evolved from earlier fashions, it would help us figure out what's under there. But then, maybe you would need to know what was under there before you could make such a timeline. Tea Rose Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 12:55:05 -0600 From: Melanie Schuessler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tudor Tailor -- another review You can see what is probably a similar construction in those hoods that appear in profile in Jane Malcolm-Davies's useful online effigies database, for example http://www.jmdsrv1.dyndns.org/tudoreffigies/browse/view.asp?id=73 http://www.jmdsrv1.dyndns.org/tudoreffigies/browse/view.asp?id=92 and on Antoinette de Fontette, whose effigy is image 436 on page 221 of my edition of Boucher's _20,000 Years of Fashion_. The same shape appears in every profile image I have found so far, from 1530 on. Melanie Schuessler Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Fourfoottwo myth; 1690 skirts
Thanks for posting that link, Beth! That was really interesting. The dead-at-forty thing is something I'm always arguing with people, too. Just because your life expectancy at birth was thirty-five doesn't mean thirty-five-year-olds had gray hair and hobbled around on canes! Bjarne, thanks for answering my question about the 1690 skirts. That was the answer I wanted to hear! :) Tea Rose = Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 13:05:57 -0500 From: Beth Chamberlain [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [h-cost] Catherine's waist measure This doesn't give waist measurements but it does give average heights. IF super small waits were in fashion the portraits of the day would look wildly out of proportion to us. I'm shorter than the average of the time you're looking at and at my thinnest had a barely over 21 waist. Even is I had been corset trained I can't imagine taking 8 inches off, my hips would have jutted out like shelves! http://www.plimoth.org/learn/history/myth/fourfttwomyth.asp Beth Chamberlain Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] skirt shape in 1690
Okay, if anyone's forgotten, I'm planning this hunting gown from the 1690s ( http://www.costumes.org/history/leloir/vol10/48_1692.jpg ), and I have another question. Do the skirts in this time pretty much follow the natural hip line, or are they still padded in the sides and back like in the 16th century? In other words, if I wanted to use a Tudor/Elizabethan petticoat under the skirt, and it had padded pleats, would the shape be wrong? Tea Rose Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] 1690s hunting gown
Hi guys. I'm in the planning stages of a 1690s hunting gown, and I was wondering if anyone could help me figure out the sleeves. In this engraving: http://www.kipar.org/period-galleries/engravings/1690/1690f1.jpg , what is the purpose of the tasseled ribbon tied around her wrist? And isn't her Steinkirk backwards? I've been trying to figure out the cuffs on this one: http://www.marquise.de/en/1600/pics/1690_1.shtml . I think what I'm seeing is a big dog-eared cuff that belongs to the overcoat, a flat, notched cuff that belongs to the waistcoat, and a big puffy chemise sleeve with one ruffle. The chemise goes almost to the wrist, but the other two sleeves go just past the elbow. Is this correct, or are the two outer sleeves pushed up? And is the ruffle on the chemise made of the same fabric as the chemise, or would it be wide lace? None of the pictures I've found confirm that gloves would be worn with this outfit, but surely you wore gloves to go hunting? I found these pictures: http://tinyurl.com/ygo7lr and: http://tinyurl.com/ync28z of extant gloves, but are these women's gloves? Would either pair go with a hunting gown? Thanks for your help! Tea Rose Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
And exactly when did the historical Hercules live? Come on -- mythology is the original sci-fi/fantasy! For my addition to the horrible costuming hall of shame, I'd like to submit several episodes of Charmed which involved traveling back in time. One of them, I think, was called Viking vixens. I'll grant you, that show was in the scifi/fantasy category, but they could at least have made an effort! Tea Rose Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 13:09:31 EDT From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies God! Xena is OK because she's a complete fantasy [for some in more ways than one...wink wink] But what about the other show these producers did: HERCULES! Yikes! It looks like Xena! Where the hell are the Greeks?? Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] 1690s undergarments
Hi guys! I just bought this pattern: _www.reconstructinghistory.com_ (http://www.reconstructinghistory.com) (_http://www.reconstructinghistory.com/patterns/ridingoutfit.html_ (http://www.reconstructinghistory.com/patterns/ridingoutfit.html) ) . So far it looks great, but it doesn't include the undergarment, which I'm going to assume is a high-necked chemise with a collar like a man's shirt. Can someone show me what kind of collar I need for this look? The version I'm making is from 1692 France; it's the one on the right in that link, with the foofy hat. (What? Isn't that the technical term?) :) Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: aesthetic dress
Thanks, Gail -- but darn it, I even have a copy of The Man Who Was Thursday, but no illustrations. Oh well. Thanks for all your input, guys, I really enjoy this kind of discussion. That tea dress pattern is totally yummy! And I'm going to have some fun looking up all those links and reading them. Tea Rose, who likes to imagine she bears a resemblance to that redhead in all those Waterhouse paintings. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Men' Flemish Garb
Pyotr's Men's Flemish Peasant diary: http://tinyurl.com/gqapm Some pictures I scanned from my super-cool Brueghel book: http://tinyurl.com/gsajq Hope this helps! Tea Rose Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and IM. All on demand. Always Free. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Period for Heidi
Thanks for the input, guys. I'm making a fantasy character, so Hollywood Historical is close enough. But I thought little girls sometimes wore high-waisted gowns when they weren't in style for adults? Tea Rose Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and IM. All on demand. Always Free. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Period for Heidi
Hi all! Does anyone know the decade that the Heidi story is supposed to be set in? I'm especially interested in the orange dress here: _http://tinyurl.com/qfsak_ (http://tinyurl.com/qfsak) Is there a name for this type of little-girl dress? Is the petticoat underneath probably just a skirt, or would it be a whole dress? The reason I'm asking is that I'm making a doll and this is just the kind of dress I had pictured for her. I will be making the rest of her family later and I suppose I should think about making them all match. :) Thanks! Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] German or Dutch headdress web page
Thanks, Michaela, that first link looks like it might be the right seamstress, if not the right web page. And, by the way, the link from your linen Cleves page to the documentation page seems to be broken. Thanks! Tea Rose Date: Thu, 20 Jul 2006 19:31:49 +1200 From: michaela [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] German or Dutch headdress web page http://theflemishgirl.livejournal.com/ http://costumes.glittersweet.com/sca/k/2cleveshat.htm http://costumes.glittersweet.com/sca/k/3cleves.htm No idea if any of these are what you are after. Michaela de Bruce http://glittersweet.com Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and IM. All on demand. Always Free. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 525
Zuzana, Here's a link to another site selling reproductions of the costumes, including the cape in question: http://www.bytheswordinc.com/acatalog/Kingdom_of_Heaven_Clothing.html Apparently there was a documentary on the costumes on the 4-disk director's cut version of the movie: http://imdb.com/title/tt0815448/ Maybe you can rent it. HTH, Tea Rose Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 03:03:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Zuzana Kraemerova [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] kingdom of heaven: blue surcoat and cape Hi all, Someone has just asked me to make for him a costume from the Kingdom of heaven, the blue surcoat and the blue cape which Orlando B. is wearing. The thing I can't figure out is the cloak or something Orlando has around the neck (first picture). Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and IM. All on demand. Always Free. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Slightly OT -- pattern art
Ever wondered what to do with those defunct pattern pieces? Need just the right piece of art for your sewing room wall? Take a look at this website. http://esart.com/paintings/showwork.php?s=pattern My favorites are the rockpiles. :) Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Leather dyeing
Hi all-- Can one of you dye experts out there tell me if Procion dyes work on leather? I'm about to take the leap into dyeing my own fabrics for my dolls, and it would be cool if I could buy a bleached hide and dye my own leather for their shoes, too. Thanks! Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: cloak hoods
I think Folkwear's Kinsale Cloak is similar to the one you're describing. http://www.folkwear.com/romantic.html Their Burnoose pattern is also similar, but without the gathering on the back: http://www.folkwear.com/caravan.html Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: organizing (was: My copy of the Tudor Tailor arrived!)
I'll come help organize your stash if you come help organize mine! :) Tea Rose Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2006 07:17:32 -0400 From: Becky [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] My copy of The Tudor Tailor arrived! To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] Now, How do I organize it all so I can find something. that is the next major task I need to get done one day soon. Any one able to come help me do that? ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Eyelet insertion trim
I haven't ordered from these guys yet, but I'm planning to soon: http://www.sewbizfabrics.com/ They have a big selection of trim and lace and the prices are great. Tea Rose === Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 22:30:50 -0700 From: Sylvia Rognstad [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] Eyelet insertion trim Does anyone have any good online trim resources besides Jay Trims and Cheaptrims? I am looking for black eyelet insertion or dyeable white and can't seem to find it anywhere. Sylrog ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Tudor costumes for dummies
Nicole, Check out this web site for a very nice lady's Tudor made with commercial patterns: http://photos.ladybrooke.com/sca/gowns/velvetgown/gettingstarted.htm Here's a page for reenactors, though it looks like mostly peasant stuff: http://freespace.virgin.net/f.lea/index.htm Listmember Dawn has some simple and easy patterns which may be useful to you: http://www.reddawn.net/costume/patterns.htm And she also has a list of commercial costume patterns with reviews of each. One or two of these are pretty good for men's Tudor, if made in the right fabrics: http://www.reddawn.net/costume/costpat.htm Check out eBay for out-of-print patterns. Hope this helps. Tea Rose P.S. I LOVE your Madam Scarlet pictures! Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2006 22:05:26 + From: Nicole Kipar [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] Tudor costumes for dummies? Help for a theatrical group Can anyone, please pleae please point me into the right direction of where to start getting a really good feel for Tudor period costumes and, most importantly, which patterns could be adapted (I have Margo Anderson's Lady's wardrobe and Man's wardrobe) and if I can even use some commercial big companies patterns, because those are usually quite easy. Nicole If you think education is expensive, try ignorance. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Cable ties and corsets
Hi all, I have a question for those who use cable ties in their corsets. I'm making my first 18th-century corset, and it turns out that because some of the channels run diagonally and the bank is so high, my cable ties aren't long enough. So, I'm wondering, will it really be that bad if the bones aren't continuous? I tried tying two bones together, but they made a lump that looked like it might be uncomfortable. Should I go and buy enough ridgeline to fill in the long channels? Thanks! Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Book on Lace Question
Alex, I'd love to see your historical doll images! Would you be so kind as to share them? Tea Rose Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2006 14:45:49 -0600 From: Alexandria Doyle [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Book on Lace Question I am looking to find out who the images are of or who the artists of these images are, to see if they're something I already have, or if I need to get a copy of this book so I can add those to my doll image collection. thanks alex ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 259 (Factions and Roman colors)
That's very interesting. I'm technically studying late antique Byzantium, so I hadn't come across that bit of information yet. Thanks! Tea Rose From: Jean Waddie [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 250 To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] I believe the word factio originally referred to the chariot-racing teams, and then the supporters of each team banded together for social welfare etc, and the modern meaning of faction as a political grouping grew out of that. Jean ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: German water--attn dyers
I'm not a dyer (yet!) but I doubt it's flouride; we don't have it in the water where I live (Independence, Missouri) and I haven't noticed anything like that. Well, we do have a teensy bit that occurs naturally, but it's not artificially added like in most municipal water supplies. I read an article once about how Europeans are always quick to adopt new stuff for their laundry but Americans are more reluctant to buy new products. Could it be something about the detergent she's using? Tea Rose === From: E House [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] German water--attn dyers To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] Any idea what might be in German water/missing from German water that wouldn't be in/missing from US water? Could it be flouride? -E House ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Toga trim in Gladiator
Ooh! I was just reading about this! The Roman hippodrome had four stables which each had a different color associated with it: red, green, blue, and white. They were like different teams, so maybe the filmmakers assumed people would have dressed in their teams' colors just like modern sports fans (and I wouldn't be surprised if they were right). Those four colors were also associated with the four political factions that served as labor unions/guilds/political machines for the city of Rome, and later Constantinople, so alternatively, they could have been implying that those people were supporters of those factions. I haven't found out yet if the stables were associated with the factions, but in Constantinople, the emperor Justinian was nearly overthrown by an alliance of the four factions at the end of a chariot race in the hippodrome, which seems to have been used by the factions to whip the crowd into a suitably revolutionary frenzy. I hope this helps! Tea Rose --- Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2006 06:07:04 -0700 From: WickedFrau [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] Toga trim in Gladiator.. I was rewatching Gladiators this weekend and wondered if there were some color system to the toga trims. In some scenes there seemed to be groups of black trim, red and I think blueanyone aware of any historical information for this? Thanks, Sg ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: double post
Oops, sorry for the double post! Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 250
Ooh! I was just reading about this! The Roman hippodrome had four stables which each had a different color associated with it: red, green, blue, and white. They were like different teams, so maybe the filmmakers assumed people would have dressed in their teams' colors just like modern sports fans (and I wouldn't be surprised if they were right). Those four colors were also associated with the four political factions that served as labor unions/guilds/political machines for the city of Rome, and later Constantinople, so alternatively, they could have been implying that those people were supporters of those factions. I haven't found out yet if the stables were associated with the factions, but in Constantinople, the emperor Justinian was nearly overthrown by an alliance of the four factions at the end of a chariot race in the hippodrome, which seems to have been used by the factions to whip the crowd into a suitably revolutionary frenzy. I hope this helps! Tea Rose --- Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2006 06:07:04 -0700 From: WickedFrau [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] Toga trim in Gladiator.. I was rewatching Gladiators this weekend and wondered if there were some color system to the toga trims. In some scenes there seemed to be groups of black trim, red and I think blueanyone aware of any historical information for this? Thanks, Sg ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re:Equestrian costuming other period tack
So, since this is a hunting costume, is that really long train at the back intended to drape over the horse as in the other two portraits that were posted to the list? Tea Rose, who is planning a loose interpretation of a gown just like this. In a message dated 3/11/2006 1:01:46 P.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2006 07:50:43 -0800 (PST) From: Joannah Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Equestrian costuming other period tack Would this be the portrait, Bjarne? http://www.kipar.org/period-galleries/paintings/1700/bourgogne.jpg ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Equestrian costuming and other period tack
In both of these paintings, there seems to be a piece of cloth covering the horse to its ankles underneath the ladies' gowns. Was this a standard part of saddlery, or was it specific to lady riders? (To protect their skirts, maybe?) Tea Rose, who has ridden horses exactly twice in her life From: Melanie Schuessler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Equestrian costuming and other period tack Here are a couple from the 17th century, courtesy of Web Gallery of Art: VELÁZQUEZ, Diego Rodriguez de Silva y Queen Isabel of Bourbon Equestrian http://www.wga.hu/art/v/velazque/05/0506vela.jpg VELÁZQUEZ, Diego Rodriguez de Silva y Queen Margarita on Horseback http://www.wga.hu/art/v/velazque/05/0503vela.jpg ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] short sleeved kirtle, air filter hat
I recently came across this excellent web page covering both of these subjects: http://www.uvm.edu/~hag/sca/15th/ Scroll down to the kirtle heading for images of short-sleeved kirtles from just before the Tudor time period. In the first image of her transition dress section, you can see a dress that looks remarkably like a Tudor gown, only the outermost layer has short, fur-lined sleeves and the big bell sleeves are on the underdress. To me, it seems like it would be the next step to wear the big sleeves on the outside and the short-sleeved gown underneath. You can also see that she has a third, narrow sleeve under the other two, which must have evolved into the slashed faux sleeves of the Tudor dress. If you scroll down below that, there's a heading of Other Headdresses which includes several other images of the mysterious air filter hat. Hope this helps! Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re:corded corsets
I made a corded corset (in fact, there used to be a picture of me on the website you referenced) using hemp cord and cotton duck, which is a type of canvas, and I don't remember that the cords shrank the pattern all that much. The only bad thing was that the first time I washed it, it smelled like ship rigging for a week! Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] need some 18th century corset advice
Hi folks! I'm about to embark on my first post-elizabethan corset. I'd prefer to draft it myself, but since I don't have time for that, I'm making it from the Butterick pattern, which I believe is a mid-18th century corset. (http://store.sewingtoday.com/cgi-bin/butterick/shop.cgi?s.item.B4254=xTI='corset'page=1) But I have a few questions. Last night I measured all the pieces and found that there is only about an inch difference between the bustline and the waist. Is this correct? I thought the silhouette for that period was supposed to be conical. Given my own measurements, cylindrical doesn't sound at all comfortable for me. I know that in Elizabethan corsetry, one takes two inches off for the squish factor, but the manufacturers have four to five inches of squish, according to their sizing chart. This could be accounted for if the corset, which has front and back lacing, were to be left open two inches at each closure, but the pattern, of course, doesn't have instructions for wearing the corset, just making it. And the pictures suggest it should be laced completely closed. Finally, I bought some linen to make the corset out of, but the weave doesn't seem sturdy enough to hold the cable ties in, so I bought some cotton duck to line and interline it. Should I sew the boning channels through all three layers, or sew through the lining only and cover the outside with the linen? Maybe I shouldn't put so much effort into a corset for a pirate costume, but I've always wanted a colonial dress, so if I had the underpinnings for one, I'd have an excuse to make it, right? :) Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: clothing for the reluctant husband
If you're thinking about 16th century Bruegel peasant, don't miss this web site: http://www.houseofpung.net/cgi-bin/clothes.cgi/flemish/man/index.html I didn't think my husband would go for the tights, either, but when I showed him the pictures at the above site of a real modern-day guy wearing the outfit, he decided it was okay. I think some guys secretly want to dress up but are afraid to admit it. Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: DATE FOR pirates o' de Carib
I believe the verdict has been that although many of the characters are well-dressed for their time period, each character seems to have a different time period, ranging from the 1680s through the 1750s or thereabouts. And the pirate characters have a mix of lovely authentic garments mixed with completely fantasy ones in the same outfits. Here are a couple of good sites about the costumes: http://www.kipar.org/piratical-resources/potc-costumes.html http://www.costumersguide.com/cr_potc.shtml http://www.outnow.ch/Media/Img/2003/PiratesOfTheCaribbean/ And don't forget www.gentlemenoffortune.com for some real research into what pirates would have worn. Tea Rose P.S. My friends and I are going to be pirates for Costume Con. If you'd like a list of resources and vendors we're using for our costumes, let me know off-list. From: Althea Turner [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] DATE FOR Pirates o' de Carib Does anyone know what time the Pirates of the Caribbean was supposedly set in? ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: 17th Century chemise
Hi all -- This is for my pirate costume again. What did chemises look like in the 1690s? Were they any different from the Elizabethan ones? Thanks! Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Byzantine Dress
Has anyone heard about this Byzantine Dress book, or its author, Jennifer Ball? http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1403967008/103-0624918-7671817?v=glancen=283155 It seems to have just been published. I sure wish I could afford it, although it's slightly later than my precise period of interest. Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Tudor roses
Becky -- I don't know where to get child-sized patterns; you may have to draft them yourself (it's not hard, really, with little kids); but here are two sites which may help you -- http://photos.ladybrooke.com/sca/gowns/velvetgown/gettingstarted.htm This is a dress diary that discusses where and how to get the patterns for a Tudor gown like the one you've chosen for your daughter. http://www.reddawn.net/costume/costpat.htm And here's a site that reviews commercial costume patterns for their historicity. Hope this helps! Tea Rose === Date: Wed, 15 Feb 2006 07:57:44 -0500 From: Becky [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Tudor roses It had lots of details but not what I wanted... suggested patterns. I have patterns to use for parts and I guess it'll be a pick-and-choose to get it all like I want. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: colonial
Just out of curiosity -- are the flowers in this lady's hair and corsage supposed to be real, and if not, how would they be made? http://www.nga.gov/cgi-bin/pimage?32697+0+0 Thanks! Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Roman women's hairstyles
Hi, Can anyone point me to a reference for how to dress Roman ladies' hair? I've found a some simple styles, but wasn't there a period when they wore really tall, complicated hairstyles? Oh, and has anyone seen this book: Daring Do's: History of hairstyles by Trasko? Is it any good? Thanks! Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] RE: Roman women's hairstyles
Thanks for the links, guys! These will help. So, are these hairnets made from sprang? http://www.vroma.org/images/mcmanus_images/hairnet2.jpg http://www.vroma.org/images/mcmanus_images/hairnet1.jpg And I know that they did use hairpieces and wigs, but I still would like to see them so I can figure out how it's done. The fun thing about making art dolls is that I get to make it all: costumes, shoes, hats and hairstyles! Of course, sometimes that's the hard part, too... :) Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Child-friendly sword
These are inexpensive and plastic, but look pretty good: http://www.anytimecostumes.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc? Don't forget the question mark, it's part of the url. Tea Rose -- From: Shane Sheridan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] Child-friendly sword -- Snip to relevent question: On another note, friends of mine are looking for a safe dagger / short sword for the enjoyment of their young son. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: tricorn decoration (was another question)
Bjarne, could you put a cockade over the ends of your bobbin lace? http://www.jastown.com/hats/th-905a.htm http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cockade Tea Rose Message: 2 Date: Sat, 4 Feb 2006 20:49:20 +0100 From: Bjarne og Leif Drews [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] another question, To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Sorry i keep you buisy. but i was thinking also about making the trimming for a tricorne. Make it in gold bobbin lace. I have some lovely thick gold gimp i could use. Does any of you have any good ideas i could do with the ends of the bobbin lace. I cant sew away all the threads so i get an invisible joint. What could i place at the joint to hide it? A button? Would it be two much to make a looped lace flower? Any idears would be greatfull apreciated! Bjarne ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: my first glove!
Having seen Dawn's glove in person, I can attest that it's every bit as droolworthy as it looks in the picture. However, regarding the sizing of the pattern, I thought I'd point out that Dawn's hands are long and narrow, while mine are short and wide, and when I tried on the glove it was obviously sized for someone of her hand shape and not mine. It was much too narrow across the knuckles and the fingers were way too long for me -- a problem I often have with commercial gloves. That won't stop me from putting a pair of gloves on my list of things to make after my pirate costume, though! Those are too cool to resist. Tea Rose - Message: 13 Date: Fri, 03 Feb 2006 09:29:35 -0600 From: Dawn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] my first glove! To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed I used Vogue 7949 on some embroidered suede fabric. It's a little narrow on my hand, but not unwearable for costume purposes. (There's no method of sizing the pattern included despite the S-M-L claim) Overall I'm fairly pleased with the outcome: www.reddawn.net/costume/art/pirate/glove.jpg Dawn ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Wool
I'm in the planning stages of what will be my first ever wool garment. Is there anything I need to know about sewing with it? Do any of you guys pre-wash wool? It's a gabardine fabric, which I know isn't terribly period, but it's what I could afford, and I'm making my late-17th-century pirate coat out of it. Thanks for any advice you can give me. Being from South Texas originally, wool was excluded from my sewing education. :) Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re:Here's my show and tell
Kristin, that dress looks like a great start. The fabric for your bodice doesn't look out of period to me, although I'm not an expert on that period. And I think cotton's okay for 18th Century United States, although it was illegal to import it in most of Europe. Are you hand-quilting the skirt? What a clever idea, to base the quilting pattern on the fabric print! Tea Rose P.S. Bjarne, I think $100 is a steal for your work. Lots of women spend that kind of money on handbags which were not handmade by an artist. Fancy handbags are in right now, so you could charge a lot more than that, if you wanted to. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] 16th century Men's trades person shoe
I recommend these: http://www.bornshoes.com/asp/shoepage.asp?itemid=M4250 Not particularly period, but generic enough not to distract, and affordable. I have the ladies' version (http://www.bornshoes.com/asp/shoepage.asp?itemid=W2021), and I find them very comfortable. I bought them because I needed something I could slip on and off while wearing a corset, and I can't afford real period shoes, but I find myself wearing my Borns around the house all the time. Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: h-costume Digest, Vol 5, Issue 68
David, Can you point us to some pictures of what you're trying to reproduce? You might find something useful here: http://www.costumes.org/HISTORY/100pages/HATS.HTM Tea Rose Message: 2 Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2006 14:11:58 -0500 From: David Serxner [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] Italian peasant headdresses To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Good Afternoon All: I am doing a production of Pagliacci and need to find information on 19th century Italian peasant headdresses. I have the engravings from Racinet, but no idea of how to recreate the things I see. I am open for suggestions! Thanks! David -- David Serxner NCSU Libraries Acquisitions Dept. Serials and Electronic Resources Campus Box 7111 Raleigh, NC 27695-7111 919-513-3355 office 919-515-7292 fax ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: 17th Century French hunting dress
Thanks for the responses! I have another question, though. How is the skirt constructed for this period? Does the fullness still go in the back, like in Elizabethan times? I suppose I could borrow Patterns of Fashion or something. ::Looks hopefully at Dawn:: Albertcat, thanks for the overview. I had noticed the scarf through the buttonhole in other drawings too. I think it's very dapper, but I don't think I'll be wearing a scarf, so that's probably out. I'm also not planning to do the train, but just out of curiosity, would it have been part of the skirt with the bands across the front, or a separate overskirt? Yes, that is her mask in her right hand. I have to confess that I'm going to wear this outfit as a pirate costume, so I'm not worried if it's a masque costume or not. Does anyone know where to get a cheap but good-looking flint lock pistol prop? Or a falchion? I just saw a show on the History Channel about early firearms. Would this be a matchlock rifle she's got? Thanks! Tea Rose P.S. I love where my underwear question has gone! I learn so much from you guys! ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] 17th Century French hunting dress
Hi guys. I'm making a loose interpretation of this outfit, and I know nothing about this period: http://www.costumes.org/history/leloir/vol10/48_1692.jpg Can someone tell me about the sash she's wearing? What's it made of? Did it have a purpose, or did it just look pretty? Also, the skirt appears to be divided in the center front. Is it open to reveal a petticoat, or is this a split skirt or culottes? Thanks! Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Italian Underwear
Huh, so where did the drawers originate, then? Italy? Moorish women wore pants under their dresses; was it adapted from them, maybe? And you're probably right about warmth being a matter of perspective (I grew up in South Texas, about a day's drive from the tropics), but I also know it was supposed to be colder back then. Tea Rose Message: 12 Date: Mon, 09 Jan 2006 01:49:06 -0600 From: Danielle Nunn-Weinberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Re: Italian Underwear To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Drawers arrived in England during Elizabeth's reign but were considered novelties and foreign. They weren't adopted as regular wear until later. I've lived in England (as well as Canada and the US) and didn't find it that cold at all, so I think it is all a matter of perspective. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Italian Underwear
Um, I have a rank newbie question. I was always told that ladies didn't wear drawers in this period. Is that a myth, or a regional thing, possibly? I usually do English. And I've always suspected that it couldn't be true. I've BEEN to England. It gets COLD there. Thanks for your forbearance, Tea Rose In a message dated 1/6/2006 9:34:23 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Date: Fri, 6 Jan 2006 07:48:17 -0500 (EST) From: Kathy Page [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] Italian Underwear I am gearing up for my visit to the Met to document their 16th century Sicilian Bride underpinning collection and a pair of chopines. This delay has proven fortuitous in that the curator, knowing how much we are trying to cover in a short period of time, gave us an additional 2 hours with the collection, totalling 6 hours of delerious pleasure with 2 pairs of drawers, 2 chemises, a shirt, a pair of stockings and a pair of chopines. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Christmas presents
Bjarne, I think you're a little mixed up. I sent you your gift, but you were supposed to send a gift to someone else. You sent it before I e-mailed you, so I'm sure the correct person got the lovely little purse... sigh I got a wonderful Elizabethan hat, though! I think it's called a tall hat with an arched brim. It's made of black velvet, and it may be just the spur I need to finally make myself an upper-class Elizabethan. I also got some gorgeous fabric scraps and some great pictures of my Santa and some costumes she has made. Unfortunately, I'm at work as I write this and the stuff with her name on it is at home, so I've forgotten who it was. I do plan to send her a nice long e-mail of thanks, just as soon as my in-laws go home. :) Tea Rose/Tara Broadway ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: holliday exchange gifts.
Figures, I missed the digest with Bjarne's reply to my gift before I sent my last message. Oh well. I'm glad you like the book, Bjarne! I wanted to get you something American, and the local reenactors' shop is mainly American Civil War, which is too late for your period of interest, so that book was the only thing they had that I thought you would like. And I believe the capote pattern is within your period, so if you ever get bored with court dress and want to do a Native American costume, or if you have to dress an eccentric character, you'll have something to start with. If not, at least it's probably something you hadn't seen before. :) Happy Holidays! Tea Rose/Tara Broadway == Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 15:06:13 +0100 From: Bjarne og Leif Drews [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] holliday exchange gifts. To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Today i received my gift from Tara Broadway. A wonderfull book: Thoughts on Mens Shirts in America 1750- 1900. and also a Blanket Capote Pattern. The shirt book has lots of gorgeous patterns, this came in right after my heart. Thankyou soo much Tara for the wonderfull gifts. Bjarne ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Planning my first Tudor, need feedback on my plan
Elinor -- I'll let people more knowledgeable than I am answer most of your questions, but I thought I'd offer two links you might find interesting, if you haven't seen them yet: http://photos.ladybrooke.com/sca/gowns/velvetgown/gettingstarted.htm This is kind of a dress diary for a gorgeous Tudor outfit that includes where to get patterns for everything, and most of them are available for free on the Internet. http://www.fabric.com/apparel-fashion-fabric-just-arrived-fashion-fabric-cotton-velvet-fabric.aspx Fabric.com has cotton velvet for $9.95 a yard, which is no more expensive than velveteen. I don't know if that's in your price range or not, but they've got several interesting shades of red. Hope this helps, Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: OT vacuums
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 21:25:48 -0500 From: E House [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] OT vacuums I can't be the only one with this problem--little threads, all over my carpet, and a vacuum that just can't handle 'em. I have one of those rubber-bristled brooms like you see on TV, and it works great for getting cat hair and my long hairs up off the carpet. I haven't tried it for threads or lint, since I have wood floors in my sewing room, but since you mentioned cat hairs I had to recommend it. My vacuum never gets jammed with hair anymore because I use the rubber broom before I vacuum. It also works great for getting into the grout lines between tiles. Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: pleated smocks/shifts
The teacher of the class last weekend had pictures showing a progression. In the earlier stuff, you see really tiny pleats sewn to a band of trim, starting in the 1490s, as I recall. Then the embroidery moved from the band of trim to the pleatwork itself. I think she said the stitches resembled naalbinding and were used to hold the pleats in place. She had several examples of where she'd done some of this work and gotten results that looked just like the paintings. In later periods, in order to get more fabric to pleat to the high necks, they moved the sleeves down the body, forgot about shoulder seams entirely, and pleated the torso part of the shirt right into the neck. That's what those Henry VIII portraits show. After that, during Elizabeth's reign, the need for more fabric to pleat and less bulk under more form-fitting styles led to the creation of separate collars and cuffs, and pleatwork pretty much went out of style. This teacher had a three-inch binder full of full-page images of what she was talking about. She had blown some of the pictures up to life-size and figured out how many pleats per inch and how much fabric would have had to go into the necklines of these smocks, and it was yards and yards pleated into a 16-inch neckline. She said she couldn't get linen fine enough to do that, so her smocks were made of cotton lawn. She really ought to write a book. She had done a lot of work, and it was fascinating. Regarding the Mary of Hungary dress, that smocked blouse looks like it would have a pattern like the one on Dawn's website: http://www.reddawn.net/costume/chemise.htm. According to this teacher's timeline, this pattern would have been developed in order to get more fabric to pleat across the front. I don't think she had any extant examples of the Henry VIII shirt, but she did have references to other historians who thought the same thing she did, and it sure made a lot of sense the way she presented it, as one of the final stages of an evolution. ::disclaimer:: I'm a rank newbie reporting what I learned last weekend, so I apologize if I got any of it wrong. I'll get my materials from the class this weekend and make a better report. Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: KWCS report?
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 14:37:50 -0500 From: Marc Carlson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [h-cost] RE: KWCS report? I have now gotten to meet Kass face to face, which was nice since we've intermittantly corresponded for years (we'd been at MTA one year at the same time, but didn't know who the other was). Marc, I should warn you that in her German class, Kass said, Marc's going to make me a pair of shoes. He might not know it yet, but he's going to. :) Tea Rose P.S. I'll get the pleatwork info up this weekend; I don't have it with me here at work. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: KWCS report?
So, can someone who went to KWCS in Kansas this weekend tell us how it went? --Robin = I went with Dawn, and I had a blast. I got to do Marc Carlson's shoe demo, which was awesome. Not that I'll ever attempt to make a medieval shoe, mind you, but his class was great and the shoes he had as examples were beautiful. And now I know what grave wax is. :) I took Kass McGann's German class, which was very entertaining and informative. I'm a complete newbie to German clothes, so some of it was a little over my head, but it was worthwhile anyway. And I absolutely couldn't believe it when Dawn told me Kass had done all the cutwork on her costume by hand. Totally droolworthy. Later that afternoon I was in the other German class. I can't remember the instructor's name but she said she used to be a member of this list. She disagreed with some of Kass's conclusions, but she had several really cool books to look at and reconstructions of her version of the famous Cranach dress. And finally, the pleatwork class was really great. She should write a book. Someone on this list was asking about pleated smocks a few months ago -- something about the way the sleeves were placed so there wasn't a shoulder seam but the torso part was pleated into the neck. Whoever that was, e-mail me, and I'll give you the contact info for the teacher of this class, because she had documentation of what you were talking about. Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: trousers vs. hose
Thanks for your replies. I was looking for the modern usage, I guess. I was reading something that said that trousers were introduced to Europe by northern barbarians sometime after the fall of the Western Roman Empire, and I remembered we'd just had a discussion about some early extant trousers on this list, so I was just wondering what the exact definition was. Sounds like the author of the article meant that the Romans wore two-piece leg coverings and the northerners liked to sew them together, no doubt because it can be a little drafty up there in Scandinavia. :) The bad thing about being self-educated is that one learns the meaning of specialized terms like extant but may miss basic words like trousers. Thanks again, Tea Rose, who can draft patterns but has never set a zipper. -- Message: 15 Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 23:03:44 -0400 From: RON CARNEGIE [EMAIL PROTECTED] Like many things on this list, some specification is needed. Do you mean how are the words used today, in which I would agree with Joan, though I try to use period terms when I can, and if not, when is the period in question? Ron Carnegie ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] trousers vs. hose
I would like your expert opinions on what the official difference is between trousers and leggings or hose. Is it just that trousers aren't as fitted in the legs? Or are trousers one piece while leggings are two? Tea Rose ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] Re: Ouches (was Elizabethan dress trim question)
This word appears in the King James Bible (Numbers, I think, in the description of the Ephod), with apparently the same meaning; so how's that for a source? Tea Rose Message: 5 Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 23:35:57 -0400 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] elizabethan dress trim question To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Kimiko wrote: I also need ouches or something similar for the hats I am working on OK, I'll bite- what are ouches? -Helen/Aidan That's what the creator (Steve Millingham) of the jewelry replicas calls dress jewels (ouches) . I am not sure why he calls them that, as in I haven't seen a source for the name other than at his site. http://www.tudorjewels.com/princess%20elizabeth.htm First jewelry pic you come across. It's what I want for the jewelry I am looking to get. Steve Millingham got the word from my customer who got it from me, who got it from Annie the Pedlar who did the research for my Elizabeth figure. I imagine she has sources for it, as she did a great deal of research before making the jewellery for me. Suzi = KP wrote: It's not just his term: http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionaryva=ouch Very cool. A new, accurate, but obsolete, word. Thanks, -Helen/Aidan ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
