Re: Detect Tape Volume Switch

[Chris Cantrell]

Thanks Steve. The program is currently written in COBOL. I was hoping I could 
get to a storage area that I could examine after each read to determine if the 
volumw has changes. I don't mind having an assembler called routine. However, 
I'm the only one in my area that knows any assmebler.

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Alan Altmark]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 11:20:16 -0800, Ed Jaffe  wrote:
>The 3584 has numbered SCSI element numbers for every slot, including
>those occupied by the drives themselves. Moving a tape from its current
>location in the library to the correct SCSI element effectively mounts
>it in the drive!!!
>
>If this is documented in the 3584 Operations guide, I never found it. It
>should be CLEARLY documented there as well as in the DSS stand-alone
>restore procedures section under "Using a Tape Library". I will submit
>an RCF to get the z/OS pub updated.

Ed, I don't think it's up to z/OS  to document how to move cartridges around in 
every tape library, nor appropriate for it to do so.  The procedure will vary 
with each generation or even model of the hardware.  Rather, z/OS should be 
very, clear, that you must MANUALLY mount the volume via the tape 
library-provided management interface, which may be via a local console, web 
browser, or a physical panel on the machine.   There is no more "get the tape 
and put it in the drive" (under normal circumstances) and all prose that 
assumes that should be changed.

What I found confusing in the 3584 book is that it you "move" a tape, you don't 
"mount" it.   Once I realized what it meant to move a tape, I rapidly honed in 
on the right procedure.

I think that the tape library books should all include phrases like 
- manual mount   ("You perform a manual mount by ...")
- manually mount ("You manually mount or move a tape to a drive by ...")
- manually move
At least in the index.

Finally, most (all?) of the IBM tape library books are horrible (IMO) at 
documenting the actual procedure (pull down, select, right click) or showing 
mockups of the windows.   Unless you are logged into the device and can click 
on HELP or the actual buttons, you're going to have problems.   You can't 
advise someone how to do it without actually doing it since you can't visualize 
what's going on!  (The z Systems HMC/SE HELP files have made their trek to 
Knowledge Center, and life is somewhat better.) 

Alan Altmark
IBM

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Re: Can date be changed under z/OS USS environment?

[Charles Mills]

You want to change the date, like change February 5 to March 5?

You're not talking about the time zone and local time adjustment?

I'm surprised that USS and legacy MVS are getting dates from different places, 
but anything is possible in the wonderful world of VM.

Charles

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Jasi Grewal
Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 2:35 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Can date be changed under z/OS USS environment?

Greetings, We did a small test of changing dates within z/OS Guest System and 
we were able to change under TSO but under Unix Environment, it continues to 
show z/VM Host date and when I type in date under USS environment.

Is that because of UTC? and we cannot change date under Unix environment.
Any information would be greatly appreciate it.

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Re: Ancient History (OS's) - was : IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Anne & Lynn Wheeler]

linda.lst...@comcast.net (Linda) writes:
> I had an Apple ][ with an acoustic coupler. It auto dialed over a
> regular telco dial tone line using a program loaded from a cassette
> player, or if one could afford it, from an early floppy drive. The
> college I went to had a Univac 90/70d. The were 4 student dialup
> numbers. I could get into one of those much like the scene from War
> Games.  It was fun.


TYMSHARE made their CMS-based online computer conferencing available free
to SHARE as VMSHARE starting in Aug1976 ... archives:
http://vm.marist.edu/~vmshare

In the 70s, I started trying to get IBM to let me put all the VMSHARE
files up on internal systems ... including the world-wide
sales support HONE system. One of the biggest battles I had
with IBM was the lawyers were afraid that customer information would
contaminate IBM employees.

My brother was Apple regional marketing rep at the time (largest
physical region in CONUS) and I started trying to get him to setup up an
apple that would do terminal emulation for copying all the files down
from TYMSHARE ... he never quite got around to doing it ... although
over the years ... when he would come into town for business meetings I
would get invited to dinners ... and even got to argue with the MAC
developers about design (before MAC was announced).

I eventually had to resort to getting montly tapes mailed from TYMSHARE
... that dumped all VMSHARE files (later added all PCSHARE
files). misc. old email
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/lhwemail.html#vmshare

-- 
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Skip Robinson]

I apologize for totally missing the context of the question. I was thinking 
recovery. We had the same problem when we installed new z12s in our brand-new 
data center in 2013. We actually waited (months!) to get DWDM DASD mirroring in 
operation so we could populate our DASD that way. It did not appear at the time 
that STK/Oracle had a solution, but we were not desperate then because of the 
mirroring technology just over the horizon. 

.
.
.
J.O.Skip Robinson
Southern California Edison Company
Electric Dragon Team Paddler 
SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager
323-715-0595 Mobile
jo.skip.robin...@att.net

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Crispin Hugo
> Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 11:58 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: [Bulk] Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
> 
> I have not tried this personally but IBM System Storage TS3500 Tape Library
> GUI under section  Cartridges allows one to select cartridge in Library and
> move it to a specific slot,  the slot can be any of the cartridge drives in 
> the
> Library. I assume then that one could IPL from the cartridge drive.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe
> Sent: 05 February 2016 07:38
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
> 
> On 2/4/2016 9:58 PM, Skip Robinson wrote:
> > I'd like to suggest an alternative recovery strategy...
> >
> > Instead of standalone restore, plan to recover a system rather than a volume
> or two. You don't need to restore sysres. You should have at least two sysres
> volumes anyway that you swap between for maintenance. Would you really
> lose both of them? IPL from the alternate. What you really need is a single
> volume for critical components: master catalog, RACF, spool, PROC/PARMLIBs,
> whatever it takes to get a sysprog logged on to run actual recovery jobs. It
> does not have to be pretty, just minimally functional for a SME who knows
> how to put Humpty Dumpty back together again. That volume is always
> available and can be tested periodically to make sure it works. Just a 
> thought.
> 
> There is no alternate sysres or existing system of any kind. (If there was, we
> would use it.)
> 
> What we have is a brand new zBC12 CEC, with an unformatted DS8xxx DASD
> box, in a brand new location twelve hundred miles away, with no starter or
> bootstrap system of any kind. As Paul Robichaux would say, "We're starting
> from dirt!"
> 
> Our plan is to send a sysprog carrying a tape to the new location with SA DSS
> RESTORE on file #1, a DASD volume with SA DSS RESTORE IPL text as file #2,
> and enough other volumes on files #3 through #n to bring up a simple MVS
> system that can then restore everything else -- including z/VM, zLinux, z/VSE,
> etc.
> 
> We need to test the process here to be sure it all works before anyone flies
> halfway across the country to do it for real. The problem is, we can't figure 
> out
> how to mount the tape. Talk about "dirt!" :-0
> 
> --
> Edward E Jaffe
> Phoenix Software International, Inc
> 831 Parkview Drive North
> El Segundo, CA 90245
> http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Restore at DR site when no mirroring was Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Clark Morris]

On 4 Feb 2016 21:58:50 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote:

>I'd like to suggest an alternative recovery strategy. Once upon a time it made 
>sense to devote a tape or two to standalone restore. We kept a couple of 
>cartridges in a drawer just in case. Two problems evolved over time.
>
>1. What would we restore? There are so many different components required to 
>get a system running. We would need an IPLable resvol, a RACF volume, a JES 
>volume; a PARMLIB, PROCLIB, and who knows what else. Just to get a system 
>capable of accepting logons. Missing just one of those could be insurmountable.
>
>2. Tape technology has totally transformed. I haven't held a cartridge in my 
>hand for years. What would I do with one anyway? Tape here is completely 
>virtual except for a few 'real drives' that hold data offloaded from virtual. 
>There is literally no place to insert and read a DSS recovery volume. 

For those who don't mirror to an off-site location, how would they
restore the system to another box at the DR location except by using
physical media?

Clark Morris
>
>Instead of standalone restore, plan to recover a system rather than a volume 
>or two. You don't need to restore sysres. You should have at least two sysres 
>volumes anyway that you swap between for maintenance. Would you really lose 
>both of them? IPL from the alternate. What you really need is a single volume 
>for critical components: master catalog, RACF, spool, PROC/PARMLIBs, whatever 
>it takes to get a sysprog logged on to run actual recovery jobs. It does not 
>have to be pretty, just minimally functional for a SME who knows how to put 
>Humpty Dumpty back together again. That volume is always available and can be 
>tested periodically to make sure it works. Just a thought.
>
>
>
>.
>.
>.
>J.O.Skip Robinson
>Southern California Edison Company
>Electric Dragon Team Paddler 
>SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager
>323-715-0595 Mobile
>jo.skip.robin...@att.net
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
>> On Behalf Of Anthony Thompson
>> Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 09:10 PM
>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>> Subject: [Bulk] Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
>> 
>> Not sure if this helps... we don't have any such advanced gear.
>> 
>> http://www-01.ibm.com/support/docview.wss?uid=nas8N1015538
>> 
>> Ant.
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
>> On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe
>> Sent: Friday, 5 February 2016 12:58 PM
>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>> Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
>> 
>> On 2/4/2016 7:17 PM, Mike Schwab wrote:
>> > Is there any way to log in to issue a mount command within the tape 
>> > library?
>> 
>> Not that I can find. http://publibfp.dhe.ibm.com/epubs/pdf/a3205604.pdf
>> 
>> --
>> Edward E Jaffe
>> Phoenix Software International, Inc
>> 831 Parkview Drive North
>> El Segundo, CA 90245
>> http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/
>
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Re: Restore at DR site when no mirroring was Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Mike Schwab]

We mirror VTAPE, no DASD.  We have a single DASD rescue system up.  We
restore a volume with a catalog of our backup tapes.  Then we restore
our non-sms system volumes using the catalog, init sms volumes for
logical restores.  IPL with DR parmlib, restore data sets.

On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 8:51 AM, Clark Morris  wrote:
> On 4 Feb 2016 21:58:50 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote:
>
>>I'd like to suggest an alternative recovery strategy. Once upon a time it 
>>made sense to devote a tape or two to standalone restore. We kept a couple of 
>>cartridges in a drawer just in case. Two problems evolved over time.
>>
>>1. What would we restore? There are so many different components required to 
>>get a system running. We would need an IPLable resvol, a RACF volume, a JES 
>>volume; a PARMLIB, PROCLIB, and who knows what else. Just to get a system 
>>capable of accepting logons. Missing just one of those could be 
>>insurmountable.
>>
>>2. Tape technology has totally transformed. I haven't held a cartridge in my 
>>hand for years. What would I do with one anyway? Tape here is completely 
>>virtual except for a few 'real drives' that hold data offloaded from virtual. 
>>There is literally no place to insert and read a DSS recovery volume.
>
> For those who don't mirror to an off-site location, how would they
> restore the system to another box at the DR location except by using
> physical media?
>
> Clark Morris
>>
>>Instead of standalone restore, plan to recover a system rather than a volume 
>>or two. You don't need to restore sysres. You should have at least two sysres 
>>volumes anyway that you swap between for maintenance. Would you really lose 
>>both of them? IPL from the alternate. What you really need is a single volume 
>>for critical components: master catalog, RACF, spool, PROC/PARMLIBs, whatever 
>>it takes to get a sysprog logged on to run actual recovery jobs. It does not 
>>have to be pretty, just minimally functional for a SME who knows how to put 
>>Humpty Dumpty back together again. That volume is always available and can be 
>>tested periodically to make sure it works. Just a thought.
>>
>>
>>
>>.
>>.
>>.
>>J.O.Skip Robinson
>>Southern California Edison Company
>>Electric Dragon Team Paddler
>>SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager
>>323-715-0595 Mobile
>>jo.skip.robin...@att.net
>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
>>> On Behalf Of Anthony Thompson
>>> Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 09:10 PM
>>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>>> Subject: [Bulk] Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
>>>
>>> Not sure if this helps... we don't have any such advanced gear.
>>>
>>> http://www-01.ibm.com/support/docview.wss?uid=nas8N1015538
>>>
>>> Ant.
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
>>> On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe
>>> Sent: Friday, 5 February 2016 12:58 PM
>>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>>> Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
>>>
>>> On 2/4/2016 7:17 PM, Mike Schwab wrote:
>>> > Is there any way to log in to issue a mount command within the tape 
>>> > library?
>>>
>>> Not that I can find. http://publibfp.dhe.ibm.com/epubs/pdf/a3205604.pdf
>>>
>>> --
>>> Edward E Jaffe
>>> Phoenix Software International, Inc
>>> 831 Parkview Drive North
>>> El Segundo, CA 90245
>>> http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/
>>
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>
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-- 
Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA
Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all?

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Re: Question about secondary maintenance companies

[Longabaugh, Robert E]

At Sterling Software Storage Management Division, we used SMS in Irvine, CA 
from around 1997-2001.   The only concern was that they didn't consider our 
work "production", even though that is where we created our distribution tapes. 
 Fortunately we were able to drive down there from San Bernardino and meet them 
in person.   After that, they were a lot more responsive.  Since they gave 
production priority, I don't think anyone besides another software development 
shop would have a similar experience.  

After Sterling Software was acquired by Computer Associates (as we were then 
named) in 2000, we migrated to the in-house data center.

Bob Longabaugh
CA Technologies
Storage Management

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of John McKown
Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 2:07 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Question about secondary maintenance companies

On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 1:50 PM, Lopez, Sharon  wrote:

> Does anyone have any experiences (good or bad) with secondary 
> maintenance type companies that will support IBM mainframes?
>
> Thanks to everyone in advance.
>

​We've had a company called SMS for years. I've liked the employees and they 
are competent. ​The only machine that gives them any problems is our 3584, 
which we got pretty much the instant it was announced. This monster is used by 
both the z/OS system _and_ our LAN environment.

https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.sysmaint.com_=CwIFaQ=_hRq4mqlUmqpqlyQ5hkoDXIVh6I6pxfkkNxQuL0p-Z0=_pjUpH7SxKBkB6gBZH_r7a7W1q59Nzy5lPxFUOMH-UM=yEn4IoSYy7YmxauLkdmuVvsGFItKv3cR-Vp-8q5Wg_g=HSatsT0AKKugblLHjBdHllp5kzhLSmrzDbZqHopTq5w=
 

--
Werner Heisenberg is driving down the autobahn. A police officer pulls him 
over. The officer says, "Excuse me, sir, do you know how fast you were going?"
"No," replies Dr. Heisenberg, "but I know where I am."

Computer Science is the only discipline in which we view adding a new wing to a 
building as being maintenance -- Jim Horning

Schrodinger's backup: The condition of any backup is unknown until a restore is 
attempted.

He's about as useful as a wax frying pan.

Maranatha! <><
John McKown

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Tom Brennan]

I used cat/grep/awk because I saw it used so often by people in the 
unix/linux team I used to work with.  Maybe it was just a quirk of that 
group, or like our JCL where once someone codes it everyone else copies it.


Bill Woodger wrote:
Tom, 


I think if you use that cat to grep to awk as an example, you'll get confusion from the 
students. They'll say "why don't you just do it in awk?" or even reel off an 
obscure Perl one-liner.

Using ls into grep into tail may be more realistic.

On Thursday, 4 February 2016 20:00:36 UTC, Tom Brennan  wrote:

That's great stuff, and how mainframe methods need to be taught today. 
College students understand unix and windows, and need to know the (can 
I say odd?) differences they will see on the mainframe, along with a bit 
of history.


I'm currently trying to write up some notes for some (possible) new 
mainframers who already know unix, and this is one of my comparisons:


Unix Style:

cat /etc/passwd | grep ^ted013: | awk -F':' '{print $3}'

JCL Style:

//CAT  EXEC PGM=CAT
//SYSUT1   DD   DSN=SYS1.ETC.PASSWD,DISP=SHR
//SYSUT2   DD   DSN=,DISP=(NEW,PASS),SPACE=(CYL,(1,1))
//*
//GREP EXEC PGM=GREP
//SYSUT1   DD   DSN=,DISP=(OLD,DELETE)
//SYSUT2   DD   DSN=,DISP=(NEW,PASS),SPACE=(CYL,(1,1))
//SYSINDD   *
 ^ted013:
/*
//AWK  EXEC PGM=AWK
//SYSUT1   DD   DSN=,DISP=(OLD,DELETE)
//SYSUT2   DD   SYSOUT=*
//SYSINDD   *
 awk -F':' '{print $3}'
/*

Of course we don't normally have MVS programs named CAT/GREP/AWK but I'm 
hoping to show how we chain programs together using JCL, and relate that 
to unix commands that a student today already knows well.  Then I just 
have to try and explain why it takes 16 lines of JCL to do the same 
thing as one line in unix :)





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Re: Catalog VVDS confusion

[Peter Ten Eyck]

I was unable to find an exact answer to my question, but I found a number of 
references that in general suggest possible lurking problems.

Introduction to Catalogs in manual z/OS DFSMS Managing Catalogs:

"To successfully perform all possible operations on a cataloged data set using 
the catalog, all three elements, the VVDS, BCS, and VTOC, must be synchronized."

Analyzing a Catalog for Synchronization Errors in manual z/OS DFSMS Managing 
Catalogs:

"Catalog entries might become unsynchronized, so that information about the 
attributes and characteristics of a data set are different in the BCS, VVDS, 
and VTOC. These differences may make a data set inaccessible or otherwise 
unusable."

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IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Bill Woodger]

I like using lines, I like to be able to read the code.

 SORT FIELDS=COPY 
 OMIT COND=(1,80,SS,EQ,C'ted03') 
 INREC PARSE=(%=(ENDBEFR=BLANKS, 
   FIXLEN=30, 
   STARTAT=NONBLANK,
   STARTAFT=BLANKS),
  %=(ENDBEFR=BLANKS, 
   FIXLEN=30), 
  %03=(ENDBEFR=BLANKS, 
   FIXLEN=30)), 
   BUILD=(%03) 

OMIT has been around a long time, but you might want to look up SS as a 
field-type.

PARSE you may not know, but I think you'll be able to follow without the manual 
- and if not, there's always the manual.

I think the BUILD is OK too.

Is there anything genuinely obscure here?

On Friday, 5 February 2016 14:36:54 UTC, Paul Gilmartin  wrote:
> On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 06:55:25 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote:
> 
> >Tom, 
> >
> >I think if you use that cat to grep to awk as an example, you'll get 
> >confusion from the students. They'll say "why don't you just do it in awk?" 
> >or even reel off an obscure Perl one-liner.
> > 
> Or DFSORT.  /* ( but not in one line.)  */

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Tom Marchant]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 06:43:59 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote:

>the original "IBM PC-type" (although pre-dating the IBM PC) operating system 
>from Microsoft.

There was no operating system from Microsoft that predated the IBM PC.

-- 
Tom Marchant

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Mike Schwab]

CP/M 86 was available but IBM couldn't get a license.  They hired
Microsoft to write DOS and they bought QDOS to get started.

On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 11:56 AM, Bill Woodger  wrote:
> Well, two things: Yes there were, and with several names, and I'd now only 
> say possibly MS-DOS. Although MS-DOS possibly/probably wouldn't have existed 
> without IBM; the much later appearance of the IBM PC in the UK than in the US 
> also influenced my typing, as there were any number of MS-DOS-based machines 
> available before the IBM PC was on sale in the UK (there were even "grey 
> market" imports to satisfy demand in the UK). It is the latter that made me 
> type that, rather than any detailed knowledge on exactly what appeared first.
>
>
> On Friday, 5 February 2016 17:36:58 UTC, Tom Marchant  wrote:
>> On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 06:43:59 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote:
>>
>> >the original "IBM PC-type" (although pre-dating the IBM PC) operating 
>> >system from Microsoft.
>>
>> There was no operating system from Microsoft that predated the IBM PC.
>>
>> --
>> Tom Marchant
>>
>
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-- 
Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA
Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all?

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Steve Finch]

We do the manual cartridge move from a slot to a tape drive on a regular basis. 
 Never tried the IPL part 

Steve Finch
Recovery Point Systems

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Ed Jaffe
Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 3:18 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

On 2/4/2016 11:58 PM, Crispin Hugo wrote:
> I have not tried this personally but IBM System Storage TS3500 Tape Library  
> GUI under section  Cartridges allows one to select cartridge in Library and 
> move it to a specific slot,  the slot can be any of the cartridge drives in 
> the Library. I assume then that one could IPL from the cartridge drive.

An interesting approach! I will research to see if feasible...

Thanks!

--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Ed Jaffe]

On 2/5/2016 10:56 AM, Steve Finch wrote:

We do the manual cartridge move from a slot to a tape drive on a regular basis. 
 Never tried the IPL part


II   
II   
IITT
IITT
IITT
IITT
IITT
IITT
IITT
IITT
IITT
IITT


WWWW    RRR   KKKK   SS
WWWW      KK   KK   
WWWW  OOOO  RRRR  KK  KKSSSS
WWWW  OOOO  RRRR  KK KK SS
WWWW  OOOO  RRRR  KKKK  SSS
WWWW  OOOO    KKKS
WW   WW   WW  OOOO  RRR   KKK S
WW    WW  OOOO  RRRR  KKKK   SSS
WW WW  WW WW  OOOO  RR RR KK KK   SS
  OOOO  RR  RRKK  KKSSSS
WWW  WWW    RR   RR   KK   KK   
WWWW    RRRR  KKKK   SS


The 3584 has numbered SCSI element numbers for every slot, including 
those occupied by the drives themselves. Moving a tape from its current 
location in the library to the correct SCSI element effectively mounts 
it in the drive!!!


If this is documented in the 3584 Operations guide, I never found it. It 
should be CLEARLY documented there as well as in the DSS stand-alone 
restore procedures section under "Using a Tape Library". I will submit 
an RCF to get the z/OS pub updated.


Many thanks to Crispin Hugo and Steve Finch for suggesting and 
confirming the technique!


--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Bill Woodger]

Well, two things: Yes there were, and with several names, and I'd now only say 
possibly MS-DOS. Although MS-DOS possibly/probably wouldn't have existed 
without IBM; the much later appearance of the IBM PC in the UK than in the US 
also influenced my typing, as there were any number of MS-DOS-based machines 
available before the IBM PC was on sale in the UK (there were even "grey 
market" imports to satisfy demand in the UK). It is the latter that made me 
type that, rather than any detailed knowledge on exactly what appeared first.


On Friday, 5 February 2016 17:36:58 UTC, Tom Marchant  wrote:
> On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 06:43:59 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote:
> 
> >the original "IBM PC-type" (although pre-dating the IBM PC) operating system 
> >from Microsoft.
> 
> There was no operating system from Microsoft that predated the IBM PC.
> 
> -- 
> Tom Marchant
> 

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Tom Marchant]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 11:53:00 -0600, John McKown wrote:

>On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 11:36 AM, Tom Marchant <
>000a2a8c2020-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 06:43:59 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote:
>>
>> >the original "IBM PC-type" (although pre-dating the IBM PC) operating
>> system from Microsoft.
>>
>> There was no operating system from Microsoft that predated the IBM PC.
>>
>
>​According to
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_DOS_operating_systems PC-DOS 1.0
>was released in 1981 but in ​1979 - MS made a licensed version of Xenix for
>the 8086
>ref:
>http://www.softpanorama.org/People/Torvalds/Finland_period/xenix_microsoft_shortlived_love_affair_with_unix.shtml

I stand corrected. But Xenix was not a "PC-type operating system", but a 
port of Unix.

-- 
Tom Marchant

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[John McKown]

On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 12:13 PM, Tom Marchant <
000a2a8c2020-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 11:53:00 -0600, John McKown wrote:
>
> >On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 11:36 AM, Tom Marchant <
> >000a2a8c2020-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> >
> >> On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 06:43:59 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote:
> >>
> >> >the original "IBM PC-type" (although pre-dating the IBM PC) operating
> >> system from Microsoft.
> >>
> >> There was no operating system from Microsoft that predated the IBM PC.
> >>
> >
> >​According to
> >https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_DOS_operating_systems PC-DOS
> 1.0
> >was released in 1981 but in ​1979 - MS made a licensed version of Xenix
> for
> >the 8086
> >ref:
> >
> http://www.softpanorama.org/People/Torvalds/Finland_period/xenix_microsoft_shortlived_love_affair_with_unix.shtml
>
> I stand corrected. But Xenix was not a "PC-type operating system", but a
> port of Unix.
>

​Ah. Difference in viewpoint. My machines at home run Linux. And they are
Intel based (core i7 & Xeon), and most call them a "PC". So, is Windows a
"PC-type operating system"? I truly am curious about people's ideas in this
area. I don't know of anybody who runs a "PC-type operating system" if by
that you mean something like MS-DOS. Hum, even my smartphone's Android
system is more advanced than MS-DOS. So is my lobotomized turtle (no, I
don't have one of those. I just read that phrase in a book as a "put down"
about a intelligence of a mobster's "goon". )​



>
> --
> Tom Marchant
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
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-- 
Werner Heisenberg is driving down the autobahn. A police officer pulls
him over. The officer says, "Excuse me, sir, do you know how fast you
were going?"
"No," replies Dr. Heisenberg, "but I know where I am."

Computer Science is the only discipline in which we view adding a new wing
to a building as being maintenance -- Jim Horning

Schrodinger's backup: The condition of any backup is unknown until a
restore is attempted.

He's about as useful as a wax frying pan.

Maranatha! <><
John McKown

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Ed Jaffe]

On 2/5/2016 9:40 AM, Gibney, David Allen,Jr wrote:

Have your DS8xxx brought to your current location, hook it up and populate, 
power down, disconnect and ship it to the new place


Haha! I didn't see the winking smiley ( ;-) ) but I assume it's there:

1. Purchase and install new FICON channel(s) on our local machine.
2. Pay Time & Materials cost to uninstall and ship the DASD box 1200 miles.
3. Pay Time & Materials cost to install the DASD locally.
4. Format the DASD. Put data on it. IT IS NOT ENCRYPTED DASD!
5. Pay Time & Materials cost to uninstall and ship the DASD box 1200
   miles -- incurring the risks of travel-related data loss.
6. Pay Time & Materials to re-install the DASD at the remote location
   and hope it still works.
7. If there is significant travel-related data loss, repeat steps 1-6.


--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Skip Robinson]

One more point on standalone restore. IPLing from a tape volume basically 
assumes that the tape is non-labelled. That is, the first record read is 
expected to be a bootstrap record. If a tape has labels, the first load will 
fail, but the tape will be positioned at the next block. So IPL again (and 
maybe again) until the bootstrap record is read. 

All of this hinges on being able to use a vanilla uninitialized tape system. I 
have no idea whether a drive in an IBM virtual tape system can function without 
support software. I suspect that it will work if the IOCDS includes the drive 
and chpid connections. That's what you'll need to test in your current 
environment.

.
.
.
J.O.Skip Robinson
Southern California Edison Company
Electric Dragon Team Paddler 
SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager
323-715-0595 Mobile
jo.skip.robin...@att.net


> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Steve Finch
> Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 10:57 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: [Bulk] Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
> 
> We do the manual cartridge move from a slot to a tape drive on a regular
> basis.  Never tried the IPL part
> 
> Steve Finch
> Recovery Point Systems
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 3:18 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
> 
> On 2/4/2016 11:58 PM, Crispin Hugo wrote:
> > I have not tried this personally but IBM System Storage TS3500 Tape Library
> GUI under section  Cartridges allows one to select cartridge in Library and
> move it to a specific slot,  the slot can be any of the cartridge drives in 
> the
> Library. I assume then that one could IPL from the cartridge drive.
> 
> An interesting approach! I will research to see if feasible...
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> --
> Edward E Jaffe
> Phoenix Software International, Inc
> 831 Parkview Drive North
> El Segundo, CA 90245
> http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: Ancient History (OS's) - was : IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[John McKown]

On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 1:02 PM, Lester, Bob  wrote:

> Hi John,
>
>  Commodore 64 anyone?  :-)
>
>  Do you know what OS it ran?
>

​Some variant of Microsoft BASIC, in ROM.​



>
>  Was the HW an x86?  Motorola?  Apple?
>

​Motorola 8 bit​ 6510 CPU.

Apple ][ was the 6502(?). And don't forget the Atari 800 (and lesser 400),
which was 6502 based. Or, the one that I had: Tandy / Radio Shack's TRS-80
(affectionately known as the "trash-80") which was Zilog Z-80 (superset of
Intel 8080) based. Oh, and the grandfather of them all (immortalized in
"War Games" - how did they get an acoustic coupled modem to autodial?)
was the Imsai 8080. Not to mention many other CP/M-80 machines, such as
Comemco and Altair 8800. These latter two had the "feature" of being able
to toggle individual bytes into memory via switches on the box. Damn, I'm
old.



>
>  I had a buddy (years ago, of course), that did strange and wonderful
> (at the time) things with several of them connected together.  No cases,
> wires everywhere,  but pretty cool anyhow for the time.
>
>  TGIF, else I'd be in trouble.  :-)
>
> BobL
>
>

-- 
Werner Heisenberg is driving down the autobahn. A police officer pulls
him over. The officer says, "Excuse me, sir, do you know how fast you
were going?"
"No," replies Dr. Heisenberg, "but I know where I am."

Computer Science is the only discipline in which we view adding a new wing
to a building as being maintenance -- Jim Horning

Schrodinger's backup: The condition of any backup is unknown until a
restore is attempted.

He's about as useful as a wax frying pan.

Maranatha! <><
John McKown

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Gibney, David Allen,Jr]

Have your DS8xxx brought to your current location, hook it up and populate, 
power down, disconnect and ship it to the new place

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Skip Robinson
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 9:13 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
> 
> I apologize for totally missing the context of the question. I was thinking
> recovery. We had the same problem when we installed new z12s in our
> brand-new data center in 2013. We actually waited (months!) to get DWDM
> DASD mirroring in operation so we could populate our DASD that way. It did
> not appear at the time that STK/Oracle had a solution, but we were not
> desperate then because of the mirroring technology just over the horizon.
> 
> .
> .
> .
> J.O.Skip Robinson
> Southern California Edison Company
> Electric Dragon Team Paddler
> SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager
> 323-715-0595 Mobile
> jo.skip.robin...@att.net
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-
> m...@listserv.ua.edu]
> > On Behalf Of Crispin Hugo
> > Sent: Thursday, February 4, 2016 11:58 PM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: [Bulk] Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
> >
> > I have not tried this personally but IBM System Storage TS3500 Tape
> > Library GUI under section  Cartridges allows one to select cartridge
> > in Library and move it to a specific slot,  the slot can be any of the
> > cartridge drives in the Library. I assume then that one could IPL from the
> cartridge drive.
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-
> m...@listserv.ua.edu]
> > On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe
> > Sent: 05 February 2016 07:38
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
> >
> > On 2/4/2016 9:58 PM, Skip Robinson wrote:
> > > I'd like to suggest an alternative recovery strategy...
> > >
> > > Instead of standalone restore, plan to recover a system rather than
> > > a volume
> > or two. You don't need to restore sysres. You should have at least two
> > sysres volumes anyway that you swap between for maintenance. Would
> you
> > really lose both of them? IPL from the alternate. What you really need
> > is a single volume for critical components: master catalog, RACF,
> > spool, PROC/PARMLIBs, whatever it takes to get a sysprog logged on to
> > run actual recovery jobs. It does not have to be pretty, just
> > minimally functional for a SME who knows how to put Humpty Dumpty
> back
> > together again. That volume is always available and can be tested
> periodically to make sure it works. Just a thought.
> >
> > There is no alternate sysres or existing system of any kind. (If there
> > was, we would use it.)
> >
> > What we have is a brand new zBC12 CEC, with an unformatted DS8xxx
> DASD
> > box, in a brand new location twelve hundred miles away, with no
> > starter or bootstrap system of any kind. As Paul Robichaux would say,
> > "We're starting from dirt!"
> >
> > Our plan is to send a sysprog carrying a tape to the new location with
> > SA DSS RESTORE on file #1, a DASD volume with SA DSS RESTORE IPL text
> > as file #2, and enough other volumes on files #3 through #n to bring
> > up a simple MVS system that can then restore everything else --
> > including z/VM, zLinux, z/VSE, etc.
> >
> > We need to test the process here to be sure it all works before anyone
> > flies halfway across the country to do it for real. The problem is, we
> > can't figure out how to mount the tape. Talk about "dirt!" :-0
> >
> > --
> > Edward E Jaffe
> > Phoenix Software International, Inc
> > 831 Parkview Drive North
> > El Segundo, CA 90245
> > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-
> 3A__www.phoenixsoftwar
> > e.com_=CwIFaQ=C3yme8gMkxg_ihJNXS06ZyWk4EJm8LdrrvxQb-
> Je7sw=u9g8rU
> >
> evBoyCPAdo5sWE9w=PPTcuRHAPyVkjUxCeajHve2SKJPFpaS97Z7iaWfM-
> gU=835J7
> > qytII8PNNhMGh2dZL3k-Owo_H05nuyeaR_0CBI=
> 
> --
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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[John McKown]

On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 11:36 AM, Tom Marchant <
000a2a8c2020-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 06:43:59 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote:
>
> >the original "IBM PC-type" (although pre-dating the IBM PC) operating
> system from Microsoft.
>
> There was no operating system from Microsoft that predated the IBM PC.
>

​According to
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_DOS_operating_systems PC-DOS 1.0
was released in 1981 but in ​1979 - MS made a licensed version of Xenix for
the 8086
ref:
http://www.softpanorama.org/People/Torvalds/Finland_period/xenix_microsoft_shortlived_love_affair_with_unix.shtml


> --
> Tom Marchant
>


-- 
Werner Heisenberg is driving down the autobahn. A police officer pulls
him over. The officer says, "Excuse me, sir, do you know how fast you
were going?"
"No," replies Dr. Heisenberg, "but I know where I am."

Computer Science is the only discipline in which we view adding a new wing
to a building as being maintenance -- Jim Horning

Schrodinger's backup: The condition of any backup is unknown until a
restore is attempted.

He's about as useful as a wax frying pan.

Maranatha! <><
John McKown

--
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Re: Catalog VVDS confusion

[Gerry Tracey]

Hi,

I have had problems with Rocket Softwares CSL doing a Repro Mergecat when the 
backward pointer was incorrect.

Sent from my iPhone

> On 5 Feb 2016, at 10:29, Peter Ten Eyck  wrote:
> 
> I was unable to find an exact answer to my question, but I found a number of 
> references that in general suggest possible lurking problems.
> 
> Introduction to Catalogs in manual z/OS DFSMS Managing Catalogs:
> 
> "To successfully perform all possible operations on a cataloged data set 
> using the catalog, all three elements, the VVDS, BCS, and VTOC, must be 
> synchronized."
> 
> Analyzing a Catalog for Synchronization Errors in manual z/OS DFSMS Managing 
> Catalogs:
> 
> "Catalog entries might become unsynchronized, so that information about the 
> attributes and characteristics of a data set are different in the BCS, VVDS, 
> and VTOC. These differences may make a data set inaccessible or otherwise 
> unusable."
> 
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IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Bill Woodger]

awk can do everything itself. grep can take a (single) file as input. No 
*nix-person is going to do cat of one file into grep and then into awk. cat of 
two files would be good, (concatenation in the JCL) and that would be fine 
input for grep, but then head, or tail, or something else like that.

If you use an example something they wouldn't use, it won't have the same bite.

On Friday, 5 February 2016 16:41:08 UTC, Tom Brennan  wrote:
> I used cat/grep/awk because I saw it used so often by people in the 
> unix/linux team I used to work with.  Maybe it was just a quirk of that 
> group, or like our JCL where once someone codes it everyone else copies it.
> 

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[John McKown]

On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 12:02 PM, Bill Woodger 
wrote:

> awk can do everything itself. grep can take a (single) file as input. No
> *nix-person is going to do cat of one file into grep and then into awk. cat
> of two files would be good, (concatenation in the JCL) and that would be
> fine input for grep, but then head, or tail, or something else like that.
>
> If you use an example something they wouldn't use, it won't have the same
> bite.
>

​The OP's UNIX/Linux team could be nominated for the "useless use of cat"
award, I guess. ​I'm amazed by the number of times I've seen people "cat" a
file which they then pipe into the next command. E.g. "cat file.txt | od
-tcx1" instead of "od -tcx1 
> On Friday, 5 February 2016 16:41:08 UTC, Tom Brennan  wrote:
> > I used cat/grep/awk because I saw it used so often by people in the
> > unix/linux team I used to work with.  Maybe it was just a quirk of that
> > group, or like our JCL where once someone codes it everyone else copies
> it.
> >
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>



-- 
Werner Heisenberg is driving down the autobahn. A police officer pulls
him over. The officer says, "Excuse me, sir, do you know how fast you
were going?"
"No," replies Dr. Heisenberg, "but I know where I am."

Computer Science is the only discipline in which we view adding a new wing
to a building as being maintenance -- Jim Horning

Schrodinger's backup: The condition of any backup is unknown until a
restore is attempted.

He's about as useful as a wax frying pan.

Maranatha! <><
John McKown

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
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Re: Catalog VVDS confusion

[Tom Marchant]

On Thu, 4 Feb 2016 09:33:31 -0600, Peter Ten Eyck wrote:

>In z/OS 1.13 we have "usable" dataset (currently used by a CICS region) that 
>has its 
>VVDS entry pointing to a different user catalog than the one related to by its 
>master 
>catalog alias.
>
>This is not correct. Under what circumstances is this a problem?

Many years ago, I had a colleague run REPOR MERGECAT as a way of creating a 
backup 
copy of some catalogs. I didn't notice the caution in the manual that says that 
the old 
catalog should not be used to access the VSAM data sets after the MERGECAT 
operation.

The result was that the VVDS entries for all of the VSAM data sets in the 
catalogs had been 
updated to point to the new catalog. The aliases were not changed, so the 
system continued 
to use the old catalogs. There were a lot of data sets in the same condition 
that you describe.

I don't remember what the problem was that this caused. Perhaps it had to do 
with restoring a 
data set from a backup. Art called me the following week to tell me about the 
problem and ask 
for suggestions as to what he should do to fix it.

Maybe Art remembers what problems were caused by it. We both learned a lot from 
the 
experience.

-- 
Tom Marchant

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Jerry Whitteridge]

Ed - I forget if you have any z/VM systems. You might be able to use the z/VM 
starter DVD to ipl a /zVM system to then access the tape library libraries and 
do your restores of the z/OS pack

Jerry Whitteridge
Manager Mainframe Systems & Storage
Albertsons - Safeway Inc.
925 738 9443
Corporate Tieline - 89443

If you feel in control
you just aren't going fast enough.




-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Ed Jaffe
Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 12:18 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

On 2/4/2016 11:58 PM, Crispin Hugo wrote:
> I have not tried this personally but IBM System Storage TS3500 Tape Library  
> GUI under section  Cartridges allows one to select cartridge in Library and 
> move it to a specific slot,  the slot can be any of the cartridge drives in 
> the Library. I assume then that one could IPL from the cartridge drive.

An interesting approach! I will research to see if feasible...

Thanks!

--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Skip Robinson]

The DASD route is unrealistic on several grounds as noted. I think tape has to 
be the solution. Could IBM (or intermediate reseller) loan a 'standalone' tape 
machine just for installation? We get loaner hardware on (rare) occasions as 
needed. This is a one-time problem that needs a one-time solution. The 
architecture vendor should be willing to step up. If the cartridge management 
strategy works, then your problem is solved.

You will also need an IOCDS. I've done this several times for brand new 
machines. You can create a standalone version of IOCDS via HCD on your current 
system and store it on a USB drive. Insert the USB at the new location, build a 
new IOCDS, store it into the appropriate location, then POR. I believe you have 
to do this at the SE rather than a network connected HMC. I made many trips to 
our new data center for this purpose, but I may not have had a 'distant' 
connection at that point. Check the doc on how to build a standalone IOCDS. 

.
.
.
J.O.Skip Robinson
Southern California Edison Company
Electric Dragon Team Paddler 
SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager
323-715-0595 Mobile
jo.skip.robin...@att.net


> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe
> Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 10:44 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: [Bulk] Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
> 
> On 2/5/2016 9:40 AM, Gibney, David Allen,Jr wrote:
> > Have your DS8xxx brought to your current location, hook it up and
> > populate, power down, disconnect and ship it to the new place
> 
> Haha! I didn't see the winking smiley ( ;-) ) but I assume it's there:
> 
>  1. Purchase and install new FICON channel(s) on our local machine.
>  2. Pay Time & Materials cost to uninstall and ship the DASD box 1200 miles.
>  3. Pay Time & Materials cost to install the DASD locally.
>  4. Format the DASD. Put data on it. IT IS NOT ENCRYPTED DASD!
>  5. Pay Time & Materials cost to uninstall and ship the DASD box 1200
> miles -- incurring the risks of travel-related data loss.
>  6. Pay Time & Materials to re-install the DASD at the remote location
> and hope it still works.
>  7. If there is significant travel-related data loss, repeat steps 1-6.
> 
> 
> --
> Edward E Jaffe
> Phoenix Software International, Inc
> 831 Parkview Drive North
> El Segundo, CA 90245
> http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[John McKown]

On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Mike Schwab 
wrote:

> CP/M 86 was available but IBM couldn't get a license.  They hired
> Microsoft to write DOS and they bought QDOS to get started.
>
>
​Yeah. Worst mistake Gary Kindall ever made. Just think, if he'd hadn't
"blown off" IBM, I'd be cursing his memory (he's deceased) instead of Bill
Gates. Or maybe not, I ran CP/M-80 back in the day. I really enjoyed it.
But, then, I enjoyed everything more back then.  everything was
bright, shiny, and new ​



-- 
Werner Heisenberg is driving down the autobahn. A police officer pulls
him over. The officer says, "Excuse me, sir, do you know how fast you
were going?"
"No," replies Dr. Heisenberg, "but I know where I am."

Computer Science is the only discipline in which we view adding a new wing
to a building as being maintenance -- Jim Horning

Schrodinger's backup: The condition of any backup is unknown until a
restore is attempted.

He's about as useful as a wax frying pan.

Maranatha! <><
John McKown

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Ancient History (OS's) - was : IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Lester, Bob]

Hi John,

 Commodore 64 anyone?  :-)

 Do you know what OS it ran?  

 Was the HW an x86?  Motorola?  Apple?

 I had a buddy (years ago, of course), that did strange and wonderful (at 
the time) things with several of them connected together.  No cases, wires 
everywhere,  but pretty cool anyhow for the time.

 TGIF, else I'd be in trouble.  :-)

BobL

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of John McKown
Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 11:54 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So 
Funny? [ EXTERNAL ]

On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 12:47 PM, Mike Schwab 
wrote:

> CP/M 86 was available but IBM couldn't get a license.  They hired 
> Microsoft to write DOS and they bought QDOS to get started.
>
>
​Yeah. Worst mistake Gary Kindall ever made. Just think, if he'd hadn't "blown 
off" IBM, I'd be cursing his memory (he's deceased) instead of Bill Gates. Or 
maybe not, I ran CP/M-80 back in the day. I really enjoyed it.
But, then, I enjoyed everything more back then.  everything was bright, 
shiny, and new ​



--
Werner Heisenberg is driving down the autobahn. A police officer pulls him 
over. The officer says, "Excuse me, sir, do you know how fast you were going?"
"No," replies Dr. Heisenberg, "but I know where I am."

Computer Science is the only discipline in which we view adding a new wing to a 
building as being maintenance -- Jim Horning

Schrodinger's backup: The condition of any backup is unknown until a restore is 
attempted.

He's about as useful as a wax frying pan.

Maranatha! <><
John McKown

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Ed Jaffe]

On 2/4/2016 11:58 PM, Crispin Hugo wrote:

I have not tried this personally but IBM System Storage TS3500 Tape Library  
GUI under section  Cartridges allows one to select cartridge in Library and 
move it to a specific slot,  the slot can be any of the cartridge drives in the 
Library. I assume then that one could IPL from the cartridge drive.


An interesting approach! I will research to see if feasible...

Thanks!

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Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
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Re: Count smf type 30-5 records

[Elardus Engelbrecht]

Sri h Kolusu wrote :

>>If you want DFSORT to extract the values from Raw SMF data then what fields 
>>correspond to Userid, Jobname(SMF30JBN ??) and Date from the SMF-30 Record 
>>mapping? Remember the raw smf have variable length segments where the offset 
>>and the length are stored in the record ...

In 'Identification Section' :

Userid = SMF30RUD 
Group = SMF30GRP 
Jobname = SMF30JBN

>and you need dynamically access the information which would require an 
>addition pass of data.

And taking in account that some segments are NOT there. (Offset = 0, Length = 0 
and Quantity = 0 for that segment)


and Robert A. Rosenberg wrote:

>Due to the variable length segment issue, just using Sort Cards to map the 
>file is not going to fly well. 

Both of you are right. My ICETOOL example a$$umed the records were written 
correctly and I have dumped those records to verify that the DFSORT jobs can 
handle them. Any part of the record next to the standard header is just random 
in terms of quantity, length and contents. You have to scan from left to right, 
checking your Type and SubType and then work out those subtypes with their 
offsets, lengths and quantities.


>IMO, the simplest way of extracting the needed fields is to just have someone 
>who is capable of writing simple Assembler code to just write a program to 
>extract the fields and output a simple file with them. 

Agreed. I have some Assembler programs handling those segments. You quickly 
re-learn how to count. ;-)


>I know that you are looking for a way to have sort handle all the work, but 
>doing the record selection/parsing is better delegated to something that can 
>locate the data. 

Agreed. DFSORT is a general purpose tool. For more specific handling or further 
subsetting of records, you need to use something else or invent a new wheel.

Groete / Greetings
Elardus Engelbrecht

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Crispin Hugo]

Please let me know how it goes !

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Ed Jaffe
Sent: 05 February 2016 08:18
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

On 2/4/2016 11:58 PM, Crispin Hugo wrote:
> I have not tried this personally but IBM System Storage TS3500 Tape Library  
> GUI under section  Cartridges allows one to select cartridge in Library and 
> move it to a specific slot,  the slot can be any of the cartridge drives in 
> the Library. I assume then that one could IPL from the cartridge drive.

An interesting approach! I will research to see if feasible...

Thanks!

--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

[Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh]

Thanks Roberto, I can use JOBID to get this working too!

– Vignesh
Mainframe Infrastructure

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Roberto Halais
Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 2:01 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

/* REXX */
ascb = C2D(Storage(224,4))
assb = C2D(Storage(D2X(ascb+336),4))
jsab = C2D(Storage(D2X(assb+168),4))
jbnm = Storage(D2X(jsab+28),8)
jbid = Storage(D2X(jsab+20),8)
usid = Storage(D2X(jsab+44),8)
Say 'JOBNAME='jbnm' JOBID='jbid' USERID='usid

Maybe you can get from here. This is working code.

On Thu, Feb 4, 2016 at 9:14 AM, Elardus Engelbrecht < 
elardus.engelbre...@sita.co.za> wrote:

> Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh wrote:
>
>
> >I'm looking to add a REXX logic to the beginning of an ad-hoc STC.
> >Runs twice in an hour. Problem is, sometimes some instances just hang
> around due to an XCOM issue.
> >Yes, the *real* answer is to fix the XCOM issue but I'm just handing
> >one
> thing at a time.
>
> XCOM? Hmmm, smells like a TCP/IP and/or a firewall problem.
>
> >So my idea of handling this is to add a starting step to the STC that
> does the following in REXX:
> >1. Issue D A,
> >2. Find if there are active instances, apart from itself 3. Cancel
> >all active instances (sometimes, I found instances from many
> days ago just hanging around doing nothing)
> >4. REXX exits cleanly so that a new instance runs
>
> Good. Point 2+3 will not work for your attempt.
>
> Check Mark Zelden's website for his REXX utility which lists ALL ASIDs
> currently running. Using the output will help you to locate ALL the
> instances and get rid of them.
>
> HTH!
>
> Groete / Greetings
> Elardus Engelbrecht
>
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MARKSANDSPENCER.COM

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Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

[Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh]

Thanks Elardus.

Please ignore my verbal incompetence. What I meant hopefully came through 
though - cancel all ASID's except the active one.
There is an fix from CA for this already but I'm just taking as an opportunity 
to learn something, hopefully by not having to spend way too much time digging 
into mainframe memory!

– Vignesh
Mainframe Infrastructure

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Elardus Engelbrecht
Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 1:56 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh wrote:

>Yup, I have a copy of Mark's program available. Was hoping to find a
>simpler/shorter block of code that would work :)

;-D

>2+3 won't work... why?

Simply, because you initially said in your first post, if your program is 
running in batch, it should shows the ASID of itself. Same for your TSO 
session, it should says same for the TSO session.

This will not work because you said ('Find if there are active instances, apart 
from itself ') later you want all instances to get rid of. Thus you need 
something to check all running ASIDs and then get rid of them.

>The XCOM bit works 99% of the time, there are just some times that it doesn't 
>work. The next run that happens within half an hour goes OK, in most cases.

If that is repeatable, you should check with the sysprogs and vendor. They 
can't make their problem yours...

Groete / Greetings
Elardus Engelbrecht

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London
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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Lindy Mayfield]

You may find this of interest.  Fred Brooks talks about JCL. I couldn't find 
the original online, but I probably could if I tried harder.  

http://lilliana.eu/downloads/jcltalk.txt

Cheers,
Lindy

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Ed Gould
Sent: torstaina 4. helmikuuta 2016 19.52
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

http://destinationz.org/Mainframe-Solution/Trends/What-the-Heck-Is- 
JCL-and-Why-Does-It-Look-So-Funny


What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?
It's important to give job control language its due respect helping  
others
- See more at: http://destinationz.org/Mainframe-Solution/Trends/What- 
the-Heck-Is-JCL-and-Why-Does-It-Look-So-Funny#sthash.TRwMFSIg.dpuf


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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Gibney, David Allen,Jr]

Well, it is a bit more complicated :) and I'm glad you found a better way. 
Further below.

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 10:44 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
> 
> On 2/5/2016 9:40 AM, Gibney, David Allen,Jr wrote:
> > Have your DS8xxx brought to your current location, hook it up and
> > populate, power down, disconnect and ship it to the new place
> 
> Haha! I didn't see the winking smiley ( ;-) ) but I assume it's there:
> 
>  1. Purchase and install new FICON channel(s) on our local machine.

Well, I've got four FICON. If it was important enough, I could spare one for 
the time required :)

>  2. Pay Time & Materials cost to uninstall and ship the DASD box 1200 miles.
>  3. Pay Time & Materials cost to install the DASD locally.

Delorean or Tardis. Have it shipped to your current site first. :)

>  4. Format the DASD. Put data on it. IT IS NOT ENCRYPTED DASD!

Just a sandbox rescue system. Nothing sensitive.

>  5. Pay Time & Materials cost to uninstall and ship the DASD box 1200
> miles -- incurring the risks of travel-related data loss.
>  6. Pay Time & Materials to re-install the DASD at the remote location
> and hope it still works.
>  7. If there is significant travel-related data loss, repeat steps 1-6.

Lloyd's of London :)

> 
> 
> --
> Edward E Jaffe
> Phoenix Software International, Inc
> 831 Parkview Drive North
> El Segundo, CA 90245
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-
> 3A__www.phoenixsoftware.com_=CwICaQ=C3yme8gMkxg_ihJNXS06Zy
> Wk4EJm8LdrrvxQb-
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> NhxS6S66QrsoXI=9P2Vm0O3LjdvcSvQvPm2kuhi1EwXOni3aG-f7S0AeFE=
> 
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Re: Catalog VVDS confusion

[Gibney, David Allen,Jr]

There is a VVDSFIX (not officially supported/use at own risk) available from 
IBM.

Also, the two ISV catalog tools (Dino and CR+) can fix these errors.

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Gerry Tracey
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 9:53 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Catalog VVDS confusion
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I have had problems with Rocket Softwares CSL doing a Repro Mergecat when
> the backward pointer was incorrect.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> > On 5 Feb 2016, at 10:29, Peter Ten Eyck
>  wrote:
> >
> > I was unable to find an exact answer to my question, but I found a number
> of references that in general suggest possible lurking problems.
> >
> > Introduction to Catalogs in manual z/OS DFSMS Managing Catalogs:
> >
> > "To successfully perform all possible operations on a cataloged data set
> using the catalog, all three elements, the VVDS, BCS, and VTOC, must be
> synchronized."
> >
> > Analyzing a Catalog for Synchronization Errors in manual z/OS DFSMS
> Managing Catalogs:
> >
> > "Catalog entries might become unsynchronized, so that information about
> the attributes and characteristics of a data set are different in the BCS, 
> VVDS,
> and VTOC. These differences may make a data set inaccessible or otherwise
> unusable."
> >
> > --
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Re: Detect Tape Volume Switch

[Steve Thompson]

On 02/05/2016 04:44 PM, Chris Cantrell wrote:

Thanks Steve. The program is currently written in COBOL. I was hoping I could 
get to a storage area that I could examine after each read to determine if the 
volumw has changes. I don't mind having an assembler called routine. However, 
I'm the only one in my area that knows any assmebler.

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Depending on the COBOL compiler, you may be able to check labels. 
So, if you get control for labels a second time, you are probably 
in the process of changing volumes.


Regards,
Steve Thompson

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Ed Jaffe]

On 2/5/2016 12:09 PM, Robert Haimowitz wrote:

You no longer need an ICKDSF IPL tape with the current DFDSS.  Bob


Excellent. And, since this is z/OS 2.2 it should work fine... :-\

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Ed Finnell]

How about a virtual training aid that has Tape Gui and Internal Library  
stack? Seems like a summer project for an intern.
 
In a message dated 2/5/2016 3:49:17 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
alan_altm...@us.ibm.com writes:
 
and can  click on HELP or the actual buttons, you're going to have  
problems.   You can't advise someone how to do it without actually  doing it 
since 
you can't visualize what's going on!  (The z Systems  HMC/SE HELP files have 
made their trek to Knowledge Center, and life is  somewhat better.) 


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Can date be changed under z/OS USS environment?

[Jasi Grewal]

Greetings, We did a small test of changing dates within z/OS Guest System and 
we were able to change under TSO but under Unix Environment, it continues to 
show z/VM Host date and when I type in date under USS environment.

Is that because of UTC? and we cannot change date under Unix environment.
Any information would be greatly appreciate it.

Thank you in advance,
Jasi Grewal.

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Ed Jaffe]

On 2/5/2016 1:49 PM, Alan Altmark wrote:
Ed, I don't think it's up to z/OS to document how to move cartridges 
around in every tape library, nor appropriate for it to do so.


Perhaps not, but that's what they do. Don't worry, I won't send the same 
RCF in for z/VM.


Your comment got me to wondering if z/VM documents a similar procedure 
for its DDRXA utility. Turns out, the answer is no. It just says:


o If DDRXA resides on a tape, mount the tape on a compatible tape drive.
o Using your processor complex's system console, IPL the DDRXA program.

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Tom Marchant]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 12:28:13 -0600, John McKown > I stand corrected. But Xenix was not a "PC-type operating system", but a
>> port of Unix.
>>
>
>​Ah. Difference in viewpoint. My machines at home run Linux.

I run Gnu/Linux too. What I meant was that Xenix was not like MS-DOS. And the 
post that I 
originally responded to made the claim that Microsoft had an operating system 
that predated 
MS-DOS and that implemented pipes using temporary files. I don't think Xenix 
fits that 
description.

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Re: Ancient History (OS's) - was : IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Tom Marchant]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 19:02:30 +, Lester, Bob wrote:

>Commodore 64 anyone?  :-) 

>Do you know what OS it ran?   

>Was the HW an x86?  Motorola?  Apple?

No. No, and no.

The C-64 used an MOS Technology 6510. It was essentially the same processor as 
the 6502 
used in the Apple II and Atari 400 and 800, with the addition of onboard I/O 
ports.

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Re: Can date be changed under z/OS USS environment?

[Paul Gilmartin]

On 2016-02-05 15:35, Jasi Grewal wrote:
> Greetings, We did a small test of changing dates within z/OS Guest System and 
> we were able to change under TSO but under Unix Environment, it continues to 
> show z/VM Host date and when I type in date under USS environment.
> 
> Is that because of UTC? and we cannot change date under Unix environment.
> Any information would be greatly appreciate it.
>  
What's your object/motivation?

What collateral damage do you expect?

How did you manage to change the date for part of the system,
but not the remainder?

-- gil

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Ed Jaffe]

On 2/5/2016 11:15 AM, Skip Robinson wrote:

One more point on standalone restore. IPLing from a tape volume basically 
assumes that the tape is non-labelled. That is, the first record read is 
expected to be a bootstrap record. If a tape has labels, the first load will 
fail, but the tape will be positioned at the next block. So IPL again (and 
maybe again) until the bootstrap record is read.


Fifth time's the charm! Thanks, Skip!

--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Lindy Mayfield]

I found it here, at about 1:50.
http://www.computerhistory.org/revolution/mainframe-computers/7/162/2270

-Lindy

-Original Message-
From: Lindy Mayfield 
Sent: perjantaina 5. helmikuuta 2016 20.44
To: 'IBM Mainframe Discussion List' 
Subject: RE: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So 
Funny?

You may find this of interest.  Fred Brooks talks about JCL. I couldn't find 
the original online, but I probably could if I tried harder.  

http://lilliana.eu/downloads/jcltalk.txt

Cheers,
Lindy

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Ed Gould
Sent: torstaina 4. helmikuuta 2016 19.52
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

http://destinationz.org/Mainframe-Solution/Trends/What-the-Heck-Is- 
JCL-and-Why-Does-It-Look-So-Funny


What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?
It's important to give job control language its due respect helping  
others
- See more at: http://destinationz.org/Mainframe-Solution/Trends/What- 
the-Heck-Is-JCL-and-Why-Does-It-Look-So-Funny#sthash.TRwMFSIg.dpuf


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Re: Ancient History (OS's) - was : IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Anne & Lynn Wheeler]

bles...@ofiglobal.com (Lester, Bob) writes:
> ​Yeah. Worst mistake Gary Kindall ever made. Just think, if he'd hadn't
> "blown off" IBM, I'd be cursing his memory (he's deceased) instead of
> Bill Gates. Or maybe not, I ran CP/M-80 back in the day. I really
> enjoyed it.  But, then, I enjoyed everything more back then. 
> everything was bright, shiny, and new ​

before ms/dos
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS-DOS
there was seattle computer
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle_Computer_Products
before seattle computer there was cp/m,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CP/M
before cp/m, kildall worked with cp67/cms (precursor to vm370) at npg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_Postgraduate_School

other trivia ... after 64, commodore did amiga ... which ran ARexx
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARexx

ARexx is an implementation of the REXX language for the Amiga, written
in 1987 by William S. Hawes, with a number of Amiga-specific features
beyond standard REXX facilities. Like most REXX implementations, ARexx
is an interpreted language. Programs written for ARexx are called
"scripts", or "macros"; several programs offer the ability to run ARexx
scripts in their main interface as macros.

... snip ...

more trivia ... acorn group in Boca kept claiming that they wouldn't
going to do any software and an IBM group was formed in silicon valley
to write software for acorn. Then at some point the Boca group changed
their mind and wanted responsibility for all software ...  if necessary
contracting with outside groups (some viewed as eliminating internal
competition).

some past mentioning acorn
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002g.html#79 Coulda, Woulda, Shoudda moments?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2003d.html#19 PC history, was PDP10 and RISC
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2005q.html#24 What ever happened to Tandem and 
NonStop OS ?
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2005r.html#8 Intel strikes back with a parallel x86 
design
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2006y.html#29 "The Elements of Programming Style"
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2007e.html#5 Is computer history taugh now?

reference
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Personal_Computer#Project_Chess

-- 
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970

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Detect Tape Volume Switch

[Chris Cantrell]

I have a process which determines the VOLSERs belong to a file and then 
dynamically allocates each tape individually to determine exactly what data is 
on each of the individual VOLSERs. Our system programers implemented a change 
last year which caused z/OS (2.01) to add the missing VOLSERs to the DD when 
EOV is reached. Therefore eliminating the possibility of just opening a single 
volume and reading it until EOF is reached. It now 'fixes' my 'error' and 
forces me to read all of the volumes at once.

Is there a way I can detect when EOV is reached and the tape is changed? I want 
to force the EOV to work like an EOF.

Thanks for any help you can provide.

Chris.

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Clifford McNeill]

Also don't forget the stand alone ICKDSF IPL tape to init the disk drives 
before a stand alone DFDSS IPL to restore the tapes.
Cliff McNeill


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
Skip Robinson 
Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 1:15 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

One more point on standalone restore. IPLing from a tape volume basically 
assumes that the tape is non-labelled. That is, the first record read is 
expected to be a bootstrap record. If a tape has labels, the first load will 
fail, but the tape will be positioned at the next block. So IPL again (and 
maybe again) until the bootstrap record is read.

All of this hinges on being able to use a vanilla uninitialized tape system. I 
have no idea whether a drive in an IBM virtual tape system can function without 
support software. I suspect that it will work if the IOCDS includes the drive 
and chpid connections. That's what you'll need to test in your current 
environment.

.
.
.
J.O.Skip Robinson
Southern California Edison Company
Electric Dragon Team Paddler
SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager
323-715-0595 Mobile
jo.skip.robin...@att.net


> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Steve Finch
> Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 10:57 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: [Bulk] Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
>
> We do the manual cartridge move from a slot to a tape drive on a regular
> basis.  Never tried the IPL part
>
> Steve Finch
> Recovery Point Systems
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 3:18 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
>
> On 2/4/2016 11:58 PM, Crispin Hugo wrote:
> > I have not tried this personally but IBM System Storage TS3500 Tape Library
> GUI under section  Cartridges allows one to select cartridge in Library and
> move it to a specific slot,  the slot can be any of the cartridge drives in 
> the
> Library. I assume then that one could IPL from the cartridge drive.
>
> An interesting approach! I will research to see if feasible...
>
> Thanks!
>
> --
> Edward E Jaffe
> Phoenix Software International, Inc
> 831 Parkview Drive North
> El Segundo, CA 90245
> http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[John Eells]

Bob beat me to it!  But I'll add this:

...when you specify NOVERIFY (or NVFY) on the RESTORE command.

Robert Haimowitz wrote:

You no longer need an ICKDSF IPL tape with the current DFDSS.  Bob




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IBM Poughkeepsie
ee...@us.ibm.com

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Re: Detect Tape Volume Switch

[Steve Thompson]

On 02/05/2016 03:45 PM, Chris Cantrell wrote:

I have a process which determines the VOLSERs belong to a file and then 
dynamically allocates each tape individually to determine exactly what data is 
on each of the individual VOLSERs. Our system programers implemented a change 
last year which caused z/OS (2.01) to add the missing VOLSERs to the DD when 
EOV is reached. Therefore eliminating the possibility of just opening a single 
volume and reading it until EOF is reached. It now 'fixes' my 'error' and 
forces me to read all of the volumes at once.

Is there a way I can detect when EOV is reached and the tape is changed? I want 
to force the EOV to work like an EOF.

Thanks for any help you can provide.

Chris.

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If this is assembly language, I'd look at an EOV exit on the DCB.

Regards,
Steve Thompson

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Re: Ancient History (OS's) - was : IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Elardus Engelbrecht]

Lester, Bob wrote:
 
> Commodore 64 anyone?  :-) 

I owned one then - with speed of 1.0?? MHz. Played games, learned myself 
Assembler, prolog, basic (slow and yucky!), logo (?spelling? that turtle thing 
language - actually a vector based drawing program). 

There were a lots of new things+terms like sprites, garbage collection, game 
cartridges, etc.

And I remember the weird data handling by magnetic tapes - you could overcome 
that weirdo design and more than double up your tape reading/writing times by 
using a much published + free TURBO software.

For more info - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodore_64

 
> Do you know what OS it ran?   

Own kernel owned by Commodore and Commodore BASIC. You need to use Poke/Peek to 
disable Basic and then go have fun with Assembler.

I am still sorry that when I sold my C64,  I also sold that 300+ pages book 
which gives a detailed line by line overview of that kernel and basic 
interpreter.


> Was the HW an x86?  Motorola?  Apple? 

8 bit MOS Technology 6510 with 64KB memory - Loosely based on Motorola AFAIK. 

I'm not sure what the motherboard was and what chips were on that beside a VIC 
graphics and SID soundchip.

Sound chip was a SID chip invented by an engineer who is also a musician. It 
was a sound synthesizer with 4 'waves' enveloped in 
Attack/Decay/Sustain/Release. It was then at that time the only home computer 
capable playing organ music with all its vibrato + drum effects. ;-)

Game, Sinbad the Sailor, was one of the first games which has a speech 
synthetics used for in-game dialogs by those characters.

You can download a C64 emulator to use on your windoze PC. That worked like a 
charm which I used to replay Manic Miner! (a version of JetSet Willy type game)
 

> I had a buddy (years ago, of course), that did strange and wonderful (at 
> the time) things with several of them connected together.  No cases, wires 
> everywhere,  but pretty cool anyhow for the time. 

Connected? How? I only know analog modems and bbs you used for that.
 
> TGIF, else I'd be in trouble.  :-) 

You will never get in trouble and not get any flames! ;-D

Groete / Greetings
Elardus Engelbrecht

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Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

[Robert Haimowitz]

You no longer need an ICKDSF IPL tape with the current DFDSS.  Bob


Robert Haimowitz
IBM Development Support Team (DST) Poughkeepsie
IBM z Systems and z/OS Enablement
Phone: 1-919-486-3288 (tie line 526-3288)
Internet: ha...@us.ibm.com



From:   Clifford McNeill 
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Date:   02/05/2016 02:43 PM
Subject:Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
Sent by:IBM Mainframe Discussion List 



Also don't forget the stand alone ICKDSF IPL tape to init the disk drives 
before a stand alone DFDSS IPL to restore the tapes.
Cliff McNeill


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf 
of Skip Robinson 
Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 1:15 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??

One more point on standalone restore. IPLing from a tape volume basically 
assumes that the tape is non-labelled. That is, the first record read is 
expected to be a bootstrap record. If a tape has labels, the first load 
will fail, but the tape will be positioned at the next block. So IPL again 
(and maybe again) until the bootstrap record is read.

All of this hinges on being able to use a vanilla uninitialized tape 
system. I have no idea whether a drive in an IBM virtual tape system can 
function without support software. I suspect that it will work if the 
IOCDS includes the drive and chpid connections. That's what you'll need to 
test in your current environment.

.
.
.
J.O.Skip Robinson
Southern California Edison Company
Electric Dragon Team Paddler
SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager
323-715-0595 Mobile
jo.skip.robin...@att.net


> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Steve Finch
> Sent: Friday, February 5, 2016 10:57 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: [Bulk] Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
>
> We do the manual cartridge move from a slot to a tape drive on a regular
> basis.  Never tried the IPL part
>
> Steve Finch
> Recovery Point Systems
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 3:18 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Stand-Alone DSS RESTORE with 3584 Library - How??
>
> On 2/4/2016 11:58 PM, Crispin Hugo wrote:
> > I have not tried this personally but IBM System Storage TS3500 Tape 
Library
> GUI under section  Cartridges allows one to select cartridge in Library 
and
> move it to a specific slot,  the slot can be any of the cartridge drives 
in the
> Library. I assume then that one could IPL from the cartridge drive.
>
> An interesting approach! I will research to see if feasible...
>
> Thanks!
>
> --
> Edward E Jaffe
> Phoenix Software International, Inc
> 831 Parkview Drive North
> El Segundo, CA 90245
> http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: Error ICE007A on ICETOOL OMIT sentence

[Sri h Kolusu]

Hilario,

As Bill pointed out you cannot have both INCLUDE and OMIT COND in the same 
step. If you want both you need to move one of them to OUTFIL.

Check this link which illustrates the processing order for record 
handling, exits, statements, and options. Use this diagram with the text 
following it to understand the order DFSORT uses to run your job.

http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/ICE1CA60/1.5.4

Elardus Engelbrecht has shown a way to add the exclude list to your 
include cards and here is another way of doing it. You would also need 
VLSCMP not VLSHRT(as it is used for SORTING) for the include/omit to cond 
to work as there can be short records

//VLSHCNTL DD * 
  OPTION VLSCMP
  INCLUDE COND=((006,1,BI,EQ,30,AND,   $ TYPE-30 
 178,1,CH,EQ,X'05'),AND,   $ SUB-TYPE 
(239,3,SS,NE,C'IBM,JOB,AUT,SYS'))  $ EXCLUDE LIST
//* 

Further if you have questions please let me know

Thanks,
Kolusu
DFSORT Development
IBM Corporation

IBM Mainframe Discussion List  wrote on 
02/05/2016 06:13:33 AM:

> From: Hilario Garcia 
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Date: 02/05/2016 06:13 AM
> Subject: Error ICE007A on ICETOOL OMIT sentence
> Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I need to omit records with some users that are located on SMF type 
> 30 records.
> 
> The code that I have is:
> 
> //STEP0010EXEC  PGM=ICETOOL 
> //TOOLMSGDD  SYSOUT=* 
> //DFSMSG  DD  SYSOUT=* 
> //VLSHCNTL   DD  * 
>  OPTION COPY,VLSHRT 
>  INCLUDE COND=(6,1,CH,EQ,X'1E',AND, 
>   178,1,CH,EQ,X'05') 
> ** 
> ** OMIT RECORDS
> ** 
>  OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR, 
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR, 
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR, 
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR, 
>  
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS')
> 
> I always receive the error ICE007A on all the OMIT but not in the 
> first. If I put in the same line two OMIT it works only on the first
> line but not in the rest and the error is always ICE007A. I have try
> so much examples but allways I receive the error.
> 
> Some additional info:
> 
>   **  
>OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR, 
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS')  
>  $  
> ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR  
> ICE146I 0 END OF STATEMENTS FROM VLSHCNTL - PARAMETER LIST STATEMENTS 
FOLLOW
>   DEBUG NOABEND,ESTAE 
> 
> 
-
> 
>OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR, 
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR, 
>  $ 
> ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR 
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS',OR, 
>  $ 
> ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR 
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR, 
>  $ 
> . 
> 
> 
> I read the DFSORT manual but I follow the code restriction or I thik so.
> 
> May anybody help me ?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Hilario 
> 
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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Joel C. Ewing]

On 02/05/2016 11:56 AM, Bill Woodger wrote:
> Well, two things: Yes there were, and with several names, and I'd now only 
> say possibly MS-DOS. Although MS-DOS possibly/probably wouldn't have existed 
> without IBM; the much later appearance of the IBM PC in the UK than in the US 
> also influenced my typing, as there were any number of MS-DOS-based machines 
> available before the IBM PC was on sale in the UK (there were even "grey 
> market" imports to satisfy demand in the UK). It is the latter that made me 
> type that, rather than any detailed knowledge on exactly what appeared first.
>
>
> On Friday, 5 February 2016 17:36:58 UTC, Tom Marchant  wrote:
>> On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 06:43:59 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote:
>>
>>> the original "IBM PC-type" (although pre-dating the IBM PC) operating 
>>> system from Microsoft.
>> There was no operating system from Microsoft that predated the IBM PC.
>>
>> -- 
>> Tom Marchant
>>
My recollection of history is that Bill Gates implied to IBM he had an
Operating System for the 8086 and contracted to supply IBM an Operating
system  for their new IBM PC in 1981 when in fact he had no 8086
Operating System to supply (perhaps a little dubious, but turned out to
be a VERY profitable gamble).  He then proceeded to try to find an
existing 8086 Operating System to purchase as a starting point.  The
first contact he tried was out of town, so instead he hired the author
of 86-DOS (originally named QDOS) and bought the rights to 86-DOS from
Seattle Computer Products for only $75K, enhanced it just enough to meet
IBM's requirements, and MS-DOS was born. 

There definitely was no MS-DOS prior to the IBM PC because it was a
renamed version of 86-DOS, created specifically for Microsoft's contract
to supply IBM with an IBM PC Operating System, and was first offered by
IBM with the IBM PC as PC DOS in 3Q 1981. Within a year variants of
MS-DOS were licensed by Microsoft for many non-IBM 8086 platforms. 
Perhaps IBM-PC-compatible hardware with MS-DOS may have been available
in the UK prior to the IBM-PC, but that would be a marketing issue. 
MS-DOS was a single-user system created for the IBM-PC, and this was the
first 8086 Operating System produced by Microsoft.  Prior to MS-DOS
Microsoft  marketed a "Unix" Operating System XENIX which initially was
Version 7 Unix from AT, but it was a totally different code base and
design philosophy, and also wasn't  ported to the 8086 platform until 1982.


-- 
Joel C. Ewing,Bentonville, AR   jcew...@acm.org 

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Re: IGD17279I due to insufficient space

[Neil Duffee]

Caveat:  as a daily digester, my responses are always behind-the-times...

The messages are perfectly correct and expected.  Your culprit is MB(86000) 
which would be similar to requesting CYL(11).  None of the listed volumes 
have the required 86Gb of free space.  Rather they all show 27176309K (27Gb) 
available.  You need to specify a primary that is less than 27Gb or something 
like MB(26000 26000).

Advice/Suggestion:  You could eliminate the VOLUMES() option since 
DataClas(Extended) has VolCount=255 & SMS is going to ignore your request for 
USER13.  Personally, I leave all my DataClas's with small, reasonable VolCounts 
for typical allocations ie. 1-5, and use DynVolCount as the big limit.  Why?  
If you remove the Volumes() option, the catalogue will list 255 (VolCount) 
eligible volumes (yes, mostly asterisks).  If you retain the Volumes() option, 
you can't expand beyond the 5 volumes listed.  With DynVolCount, SMS uses 
Volumes('*' x VolCount) at initial allocation but allows as many volumes as 
desired (to max=DynVolCount) both during initial creation and at any time in 
the future.  The Catalogue entry will only list the actual volumes without 
additional, extraneous asterisks.  DynVolCount also helps to treat x37 problems 
in constrained pools. (or those of us who are stuck at Mod-3s for hysterical 
reasons)

>  signature = 8 lines follows  <
Neil Duffee, Joe Sysprog, uOttawa, Ottawa, Ont, Canada
telephone:1 613 562 5800 x4585  fax:1 613 562 5161
mailto:NDuffee of uOttawa.ca http:/ /aix1.uOttawa.ca/ ~nduffee
"How *do* you plan for something like that?"  Guardian Bob, Reboot
"For every action, there is an equal and opposite criticism."
"Systems Programming: Guilty, until proven innocent"  John Norgauer 2004
"Schrodinger's backup: The condition of any backup is unknown until a restore 
is attempted."  John McKown 2015


-Original Message-
From: Mike Geiger [mailto:mi...@opentext.com] 
Sent: February 4, 2016 12:09
Subject: IGD17279I due to insufficient space

Looking for some insight.  I am configuring our new z/OS 2.2 ADCD at RSU1508 
system(already have a 2.1, 1.13 and 1.11) Why is the following define failing?  
Everything looks ok to me. Adequate space is available.

All multi-volume allocations of any type fail.  SMS seems to be attempting to 
define all the space on a single volume.

 DEFINE CLUSTER (NAME(USER.SPACE.ZFS) -
VOLUMES(USER13 * * * *)  -
DATACLASS(EXTENDED)-
LINEAR MB(86000)  SHAREOPTIONS(3)) 

IGD17226I THERE IS AN INSUFFICIENT NUMBER OF VOLUMES IN THE ELIGIBLE STORAGE 
GROUP(S) TO SATISFY THIS REQUEST FOR DATA SET USER.SPACE.ZFS 

IGD17290I THERE WERE 1 CANDIDATE STORAGE GROUPS OF WHICH THE FIRST 1 WERE 
ELIGIBLE FOR VOLUME SELECTION.
THE CANDIDATE STORAGE GROUPS WERE:DEFAULT 

IGD17279I 5 VOLUMES WERE REJECTED BECAUSE OF INSUFF TOTAL SPACE 

IGD17219I UNABLE TO CONTINUE DEFINE OF DATA SET USER.SPACE.ZFS 

IDC3003I FUNCTION TERMINATED. CONDITION CODE IS 12


STORGRP  TYPESYSTEM= 1
DEFAULT  POOL+
  SPACE INFORMATION:
  TOTAL SPACE = 132775MB USAGE% = 18 ALERT% = 0
  TRACK-MANAGED SPACE = 132775MB USAGE% = 18 ALERT% = 0
VOLUME   UNITSYSTEM= 1   STORGRP NAME
USER10   0AA9+ DEFAULT
USER11   0AAA+ DEFAULT
USER12   0AAB+ DEFAULT
USER13   0AAE+ DEFAULT
USER14   0AAF+ DEFAULT

VOLUME FREE   % ALLOC  FRAG   LARGESTFREE INDEX FREE
 FREE
SERIAL SPACE  FREE  SPACE  INDEX  EXTENT EXTENTS  STATUSDSCBS   
 VIRS
-(2)-- ---(3)---  (4)-  ---(5)---  -(6)-  ---(7)---  --(8)--  --(9)---  -(10)-- 
 -(11)--
USER10 27176309K99 15771K  0  27176309K1  ENABLED  4446 
 909
USER11 27176032K99 16048K  0  27176032K1  ENABLED  4445 
 909
USER12 27187376K99  4704K  0  27184609K2  ENABLED  1446 
 909
USER13 27176309K99 15771K  0  27176309K1  ENABLED  4446 
 909
USER14 27176309K99 15771K  0  27176309K1  ENABLED  4446 
 909
[snip]

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IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Bill Woodger]

On Thursday, 4 February 2016 22:08:31 UTC, Paul Gilmartin  wrote:
> No, they are not; not even as RAM disk files.  A pipe communicates directly
> between processes (like "tasks").  A DOS partisan once explained his
> misunderstanding of pipes to me that way:
> 
> CAT reads /etc/passwd and writes to temporary file TEMP1.
> When CAT terminates, GREP reads TEMP1 and writes TEMP2
> When GREP terminates, AWK reads TEMP2 and writes to stdout.
> 

Paul,

MS-DOS/PC-DOS didn't have true pipes, and the "piping" provided was exactly as 
your DOS partisan described (writing to a temporary dataset, first process 
completes before second starts, reading the temporary file, etc). Command using 
piping "looked like" it may look in a Unix, but didn't operate the Unix way.

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Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

[Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh]

Thanks Lucas, this looks like NetView REXX (?).
I have this part ready and waiting for the ASID-identifying bit :)
I can now make it work with Roberto's snippet to get the JOBID.

– Vignesh
Mainframe Infrastructure

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Lucas Rosalen
Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 2:04 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

Maybe you could try this REXX with some adjustments:

trace Off

 'pipe MVS D A,CIC*',

   '! corrwait 5',

   '! sep',

   '! loc /A=/',

   '! stem result.'



 if result.0 > 0 then

   do i = 1 to result.0

say 'task:' word(result.i,1) 'asid:' word(result.i,6)=> this "6"
might change

   end

return


With small enhancements, this would let you get the "MVS C taskname,A="
command issued

---
*Lucas Rosalen*
Emails: rosalen.lu...@gmail.com / *lrosa...@pl.ibm.com
*
LinkedIn: http://br.linkedin.com/in/lrosalen
Phone: +48 792 809 198


2016-02-04 14:55 GMT+01:00 Elardus Engelbrecht <
elardus.engelbre...@sita.co.za>:

> Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh wrote:
>
> >Yup, I have a copy of Mark's program available. Was hoping to find a
> simpler/shorter block of code that would work :)
>
> ;-D
>
> >2+3 won't work... why?
>
> Simply, because you initially said in your first post, if your program
> is running in batch, it should shows the ASID of itself. Same for your
> TSO session, it should says same for the TSO session.
>
> This will not work because you said ('Find if there are active
> instances, apart from itself ') later you want all instances to get
> rid of. Thus you need something to check all running ASIDs and then get rid 
> of them.
>
> >The XCOM bit works 99% of the time, there are just some times that it
> doesn't work. The next run that happens within half an hour goes OK,
> in most cases.
>
> If that is repeatable, you should check with the sysprogs and vendor.
> They can't make their problem yours...
>
> Groete / Greetings
> Elardus Engelbrecht
>
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Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

[Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh]

Thanks Lizette,
I believe I'm signed up to that list as well, just forgot I could post there!

– Vignesh
Mainframe Infrastructure

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Lizette Koehler
Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 5:09 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

If you were not aware, there is a TSO REXX list that could also be very help in 
all things REXX.

To join, if you have not done so, 
TSO REXXhttp://www2.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?TSO-REXX

Lizette


> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] 
> On Behalf Of Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 6:00 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX
> 
> Yup, I can understand that much! But my expertise is way too limited 
> to even try to go chasing after memory addresses.
> 
> – Vignesh
> Mainframe Infrastructure
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] 
> On Behalf Of Elardus Engelbrecht
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 12:56 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX
> 
> Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh wrote:
> 
> >Sorry, I don't understand.
> >I'm looking this up now, hoping it's not an assembler way!
> 
> You use the REXX functions like C2D and STORAGE, etc. to chase those pointers.
> 
> Groete / Greetings
> Elardus Engelbrecht
> 
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send 
> email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> 
> MARKSANDSPENCER.COM
> 
>  Unless otherwise stated above:
> Marks and Spencer plc
> Registered Office:
> Waterside House
> 35 North Wharf Road
> London
> W2 1NW
> 
> Registered No. 214436 in England and Wales.
> 
> Telephone (020) 7935 4422
> Facsimile (020) 7487 2670
> 
> www.marksandspencer.com

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Ed Gould]

Bill:

There was a product from IBM called PCF and it would let you string  
out tso commands with a ";" between each command and you could do  
what you are talking about I just remembered it a 445A . ex:  alloc  
(systut1)da(in.contl) shr;alloc (sysut2) da(out.data) new sp(1 1)  
trk;alloc fi(sysin) dummy;alloc fi(sysprint) da(*);call 'sys1.linklib 
(iebgener)'

Is this what you are talking about?

Ed


It did a lot of things for a small package to bad it was discontinued.

Ed

On Feb 5, 2016, at 3:11 AM, Bill Woodger wrote:


On Thursday, 4 February 2016 22:08:31 UTC, Paul Gilmartin  wrote:
No, they are not; not even as RAM disk files.  A pipe communicates  
directly

between processes (like "tasks").  A DOS partisan once explained his
misunderstanding of pipes to me that way:

CAT reads /etc/passwd and writes to temporary file TEMP1.
When CAT terminates, GREP reads TEMP1 and writes TEMP2
When GREP terminates, AWK reads TEMP2 and writes to stdout.



Paul,

MS-DOS/PC-DOS didn't have true pipes, and the "piping" provided was  
exactly as your DOS partisan described (writing to a temporary  
dataset, first process completes before second starts, reading the  
temporary file, etc). Command using piping "looked like" it may  
look in a Unix, but didn't operate the Unix way.


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Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

[Steve Horein]

Towards the bottom of this list of documents there are titles with "Data
Area" in them.
http://www-03.ibm.com/systems/z/os/zos/library/bkserv/v2r2pdf/#IEA
They will (indirectly) explain why/how that bit of Rexx works.

The journey always begins at home:
"The PSA maps the storage that starts at location 0 for the
related processor."

On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 5:35 AM, Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh <
vignesh.v.sankaranaraya...@marks-and-spencer.com> wrote:

> Good news!
>
> I plunged into the "depths" of the ASCB and found what I needed..
>
> /* REXX */
> ascb = C2D(Storage(224,4))
> ascbasid = C2X(Storage(D2X(ascb+36),2))
> Say 'ascbasid='ascbasid
>
> LOL, can't believe it was this easy.
>
> – Vignesh
> Mainframe Infrastructure
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On
> Behalf Of Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 8:46 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX
>
> Thanks Lizette,
> I believe I'm signed up to that list as well, just forgot I could post
> there!
>
> – Vignesh
> Mainframe Infrastructure
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On
> Behalf Of Lizette Koehler
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 5:09 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX
>
> If you were not aware, there is a TSO REXX list that could also be very
> help in all things REXX.
>
> To join, if you have not done so,
> TSO REXXhttp://www2.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?TSO-REXX
>
> Lizette
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> > On Behalf Of Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh
> > Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 6:00 AM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX
> >
> > Yup, I can understand that much! But my expertise is way too limited
> > to even try to go chasing after memory addresses.
> >
> > – Vignesh
> > Mainframe Infrastructure
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
> > On Behalf Of Elardus Engelbrecht
> > Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 12:56 PM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX
> >
> > Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh wrote:
> >
> > >Sorry, I don't understand.
> > >I'm looking this up now, hoping it's not an assembler way!
> >
> > You use the REXX functions like C2D and STORAGE, etc. to chase those
> pointers.
> >
> > Groete / Greetings
> > Elardus Engelbrecht
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send
> > email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
> > MARKSANDSPENCER.COM
> > 
> >  Unless otherwise stated above:
> > Marks and Spencer plc
> > Registered Office:
> > Waterside House
> > 35 North Wharf Road
> > London
> > W2 1NW
> >
> > Registered No. 214436 in England and Wales.
> >
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> > Facsimile (020) 7487 2670
> >
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Re: Java (was: DFSORT - SMF Records - GMT To EST)

[Scott Chapman]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 11:41:52 +1100, Andrew Rowley  
wrote:

>I am using JZOS to run Java as a batch job, and these are my tests for
>general processing of SMF data rather than time zone conversion
>specifically. It wouldn't surprise me if the batch job is better than
>running under the shell.

Tests I did a few years ago seemed to indicate that there was some additional 
overhead from running under JZOS vs. BPXBAT*

Workload #1:
   Average CPU secs (multiple runs)
  zAAPn  GCP
BPXBATCH   0.500.20
JZOS   0.730.12
BPXBATSL   0.520.14

I figured that maybe that was just a minor startup difference, but surprisingly 
a much longer workload followed the same pattern:

Workload #2:
   Average CPU secs (multiple runs)
  zAAPn  GCP
BPXBATCH 141.72  0.52
JZOS 153.49  0.39
BPXBATSL 142.09  0.45

But the JZOS launcher is more convenient, and unless you're very sensitive 
about the consumed zAAP (now likely zIIP) time, the difference probably doesn't 
matter. 

This was under Java 6, but I don't recall what the exact processor model was. 
My guess is that it was a z10 5xx.

Interestingly, IBM Java 7 seemed to add a little additional overhead. That was 
somewhat expected for short-running tasks, but it seemed to be there for 
long-running started tasks too, which was unexpected. It was in the single 
digit percentage range, but it was consistent across multiple different 
workloads. I never did get that difference understood to my satisfaction.

Scott Chapman

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Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

[Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh]

Good news! 

I plunged into the "depths" of the ASCB and found what I needed..

/* REXX */ 
ascb = C2D(Storage(224,4)) 
ascbasid = C2X(Storage(D2X(ascb+36),2))
Say 'ascbasid='ascbasid

LOL, can't believe it was this easy. 

– Vignesh
Mainframe Infrastructure

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh
Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 8:46 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

Thanks Lizette,
I believe I'm signed up to that list as well, just forgot I could post there!

– Vignesh
Mainframe Infrastructure

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf 
Of Lizette Koehler
Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 5:09 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX

If you were not aware, there is a TSO REXX list that could also be very help in 
all things REXX.

To join, if you have not done so, 
TSO REXXhttp://www2.marist.edu/htbin/wlvindex?TSO-REXX

Lizette


> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] 
> On Behalf Of Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 6:00 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX
> 
> Yup, I can understand that much! But my expertise is way too limited 
> to even try to go chasing after memory addresses.
> 
> – Vignesh
> Mainframe Infrastructure
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] 
> On Behalf Of Elardus Engelbrecht
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2016 12:56 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Obtaining current ASID in REXX
> 
> Sankaranarayanan, Vignesh wrote:
> 
> >Sorry, I don't understand.
> >I'm looking this up now, hoping it's not an assembler way!
> 
> You use the REXX functions like C2D and STORAGE, etc. to chase those pointers.
> 
> Groete / Greetings
> Elardus Engelbrecht
> 
> --
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> Waterside House
> 35 North Wharf Road
> London
> W2 1NW
> 
> Registered No. 214436 in England and Wales.
> 
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> Facsimile (020) 7487 2670
> 
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IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Bill Woodger]

Ed,

I'm fairly sure Paul was referring to the original "IBM PC-type" (although 
pre-dating the IBM PC) operating system from Microsoft.

This had "pipes" but they weren't really pipes. Instead of passing each piece 
of output to the next process, so that multiple processes are all active, 
greatly reducing the elapsed time, MS-DOS, when using a pipe, would write all 
output from the first process to a temporary file, which, once the first 
process was complete, would be used as input to the second process, and so on.


On Friday, 5 February 2016 10:58:09 UTC, Ed Gould  wrote:
> Bill:
> 
> There was a product from IBM called PCF and it would let you string  
> out tso commands with a ";" between each command and you could do  
> what you are talking about I just remembered it a 445A . ex:  alloc  
> (systut1)da(in.contl) shr;alloc (sysut2) da(out.data) new sp(1 1)  
> trk;alloc fi(sysin) dummy;alloc fi(sysprint) da(*);call 'sys1.linklib 
> (iebgener)'
> Is this what you are talking about?
> 
> Ed
> 
> 
> It did a lot of things for a small package to bad it was discontinued.
> 
> Ed
> 

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IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Bill Woodger]

Tom, 

I think if you use that cat to grep to awk as an example, you'll get confusion 
from the students. They'll say "why don't you just do it in awk?" or even reel 
off an obscure Perl one-liner.

Using ls into grep into tail may be more realistic.

On Thursday, 4 February 2016 20:00:36 UTC, Tom Brennan  wrote:
> That's great stuff, and how mainframe methods need to be taught today. 
> College students understand unix and windows, and need to know the (can 
> I say odd?) differences they will see on the mainframe, along with a bit 
> of history.
> 
> I'm currently trying to write up some notes for some (possible) new 
> mainframers who already know unix, and this is one of my comparisons:
> 
> Unix Style:
> 
> cat /etc/passwd | grep ^ted013: | awk -F':' '{print $3}'
> 
> JCL Style:
> 
> //CAT  EXEC PGM=CAT
> //SYSUT1   DD   DSN=SYS1.ETC.PASSWD,DISP=SHR
> //SYSUT2   DD   DSN=,DISP=(NEW,PASS),SPACE=(CYL,(1,1))
> //*
> //GREP EXEC PGM=GREP
> //SYSUT1   DD   DSN=,DISP=(OLD,DELETE)
> //SYSUT2   DD   DSN=,DISP=(NEW,PASS),SPACE=(CYL,(1,1))
> //SYSINDD   *
>   ^ted013:
> /*
> //AWK  EXEC PGM=AWK
> //SYSUT1   DD   DSN=,DISP=(OLD,DELETE)
> //SYSUT2   DD   SYSOUT=*
> //SYSINDD   *
>   awk -F':' '{print $3}'
> /*
> 
> Of course we don't normally have MVS programs named CAT/GREP/AWK but I'm 
> hoping to show how we chain programs together using JCL, and relate that 
> to unix commands that a student today already knows well.  Then I just 
> have to try and explain why it takes 16 lines of JCL to do the same 
> thing as one line in unix :)
> 

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Re: Sort Job

[Ron Thomas]

ok that is fine bill, i was able to code the required sort card .  Thanks!

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 00:02:37 -0600, Ed Gould wrote:
>
>-SNIP-
>The three jobsteps can be cut down to one if you use the "new"
>control cards in sort.
>Ask the sort people too show you how.
> 
But does that make a good beginners' introduction to JCL?

-- gil

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Error ICE007A on ICETOOL OMIT sentence

[Bill Woodger]

From the DFSORT Application Programming Guide description of INCLUDE:

"You can specify either an INCLUDE statement or an OMIT statement in the same 
DFSORT run, but not both"

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Re: Error ICE007A on ICETOOL OMIT sentence

[Lizette Koehler]

Did you look at the syntax diagram for continuing control cards in DFSORT?  
What did it say?

https://www-304.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/SSLTBW_2.1.0/com.ibm.zos.v2r1.icea100/ice2ca_Continuation_lines.htm?lang=en

Or Tiny URL
http://tinyurl.com/jce63eh



Check the control statements for syntax errors. Some of the more common syntax 
errors are:

Unbalanced parenthesis
Missing comma
Embedded blank
Invalid format type
Invalid operator
Invalid constant
Continuation of DFSPARM PARM options using the continuation column.
Symbol used where it is not allowed
Parsed field (%nnn, %nn or %n) used where it is not allowed.

Lizette


> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On
> Behalf Of Hilario Garcia
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2016 6:14 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Error ICE007A on ICETOOL OMIT sentence
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I need to omit records with some users that are located on SMF type 30
> records.
> 
> The code that I have is:
> 
> //STEP0010EXEC  PGM=ICETOOL
> //TOOLMSGDD  SYSOUT=*
> //DFSMSG  DD  SYSOUT=*
> //VLSHCNTL   DD  *
>  OPTION COPY,VLSHRT
>  INCLUDE COND=(6,1,CH,EQ,X'1E',AND,
>   178,1,CH,EQ,X'05')
> **
> ** OMIT RECORDS
> **
>  OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR,
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,
>  
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS')
> 
> I always receive the error ICE007A on all the OMIT but not in the first. If I
> put in the same line two OMIT it works only on the first line but not in the
> rest and the error is always ICE007A. I have try so much examples but allways
> I receive the error.
> 
> Some additional info:
> 
>   **
>OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR,
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS')
>  $
> ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR
> ICE146I 0 END OF STATEMENTS FROM VLSHCNTL - PARAMETER LIST STATEMENTS FOLLOW
>   DEBUG NOABEND,ESTAE
> 
> --
> ---
> 
>OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR,
>  $
> ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS',OR,
>  $
> ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,
>  $
> .
> 
> 
> I read the DFSORT manual but I follow the code restriction or I thik so.
> 
> May anybody help me ?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Hilario

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Re: Error ICE007A on ICETOOL OMIT sentence

[Elardus Engelbrecht]

Hilario Garcia wrote:

>//STEP0010EXEC  PGM=ICETOOL
>//TOOLMSGDD  SYSOUT=* 
>//DFSMSG  DD  SYSOUT=* 
>//VLSHCNTL   DD  *
> OPTION COPY,VLSHRT 
> INCLUDE COND=(6,1,CH,EQ,X'1E',AND, 
>  178,1,CH,EQ,X'05')
>**  
>** OMIT RECORDS
>**  
> OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,   
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR,
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,
> 
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS')


What about this one?

 INCLUDE COND=(6,1,CH,EQ,X'1E',AND,178,1,CH,EQ,X'05',AND,
  (239,3,CH,NE,C'IBM',OR,   
   239,3,CH,NE,C'JOB',OR,
   239,3,CH,NE,C'AUT',OR,
...
   239,3,CH,NE,C'SYS'))

Groete / Greetings
Elardus Engelbrecht

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Error ICE007A on ICETOOL OMIT sentence

[Hilario Garcia]

Hello,

I need to omit records with some users that are located on SMF type 30 records.

The code that I have is:

//STEP0010EXEC  PGM=ICETOOL
//TOOLMSGDD  SYSOUT=* 
//DFSMSG  DD  SYSOUT=* 
//VLSHCNTL   DD  *
 OPTION COPY,VLSHRT 
 INCLUDE COND=(6,1,CH,EQ,X'1E',AND, 
  178,1,CH,EQ,X'05')
**  
** OMIT RECORDS
**  
 OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,   
  239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR,
  239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,
  239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,
 
  239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS')

I always receive the error ICE007A on all the OMIT but not in the first. If I 
put in the same line two OMIT it works only on the first line but not in the 
rest and the error is always ICE007A. I have try so much examples but allways I 
receive the error.

Some additional info:

  **
   OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR,
 239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS') 
 $  
ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR  
ICE146I 0 END OF STATEMENTS FROM VLSHCNTL - PARAMETER LIST STATEMENTS FOLLOW
  DEBUG NOABEND,ESTAE   

-

   OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,  
 239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR,   
 $   
ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR   
 239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS',OR,   
 $   
ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR   
 239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,   
 $  
. 
  

I read the DFSORT manual but I follow the code restriction or I thik so.

May anybody help me ?

Thanks in advance.

Hilario 

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Error ICE007A on ICETOOL OMIT sentence

[Bill Woodger]

You can't have both INCLUDE and OMIT in the same step. You'll need to work your 
omissions into the INCLUDE or your inclusions into the OMIT.

On Friday, 5 February 2016 13:13:41 UTC, Hilario Garcia  wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I need to omit records with some users that are located on SMF type 30 
> records.
> 
> The code that I have is:
> 
> //STEP0010EXEC  PGM=ICETOOL
> //TOOLMSGDD  SYSOUT=* 
> //DFSMSG  DD  SYSOUT=* 
> //VLSHCNTL   DD  *
>  OPTION COPY,VLSHRT 
>  INCLUDE COND=(6,1,CH,EQ,X'1E',AND, 
>   178,1,CH,EQ,X'05')
> **  
> ** OMIT RECORDS
> **  
>  OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,   
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR,
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,
>  
>   239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS')
> 
> I always receive the error ICE007A on all the OMIT but not in the first. If I 
> put in the same line two OMIT it works only on the first line but not in the 
> rest and the error is always ICE007A. I have try so much examples but allways 
> I receive the error.
> 
> Some additional info:
> 
>   **
>OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR,
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS') 
>  $  
> ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR  
> ICE146I 0 END OF STATEMENTS FROM VLSHCNTL - PARAMETER LIST STATEMENTS FOLLOW
>   DEBUG NOABEND,ESTAE   
> 
> -
> 
>OMITCOND=(239,3,CH,EQ,C'IBM',OR,  
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'JOB',OR,   
>  $   
> ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR   
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'SYS',OR,   
>  $   
> ICE007A 0 SYNTAX ERROR   
>  239,3,CH,EQ,C'AUT',OR,   
>  $  
> . 
>   
> 
> I read the DFSORT manual but I follow the code restriction or I thik so.
> 
> May anybody help me ?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Hilario 
> 

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Re: Count smf type 30-5 records

[Hilario Garcia]

Hello Elardus,


Thank you very much for your solutions. It's works fine.


Kind Regards.

Hilario

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 00:16:41 -0600, Ed Gould wrote:
>
>The part I think you are missing is that cat and grep and awk are
>system commands and as such are included in UNIX
>Z/OS has no real equivalence (unless you are talking OE then that is
>a whole separate discussion). 
>
Actually, IEBGENER for "cat"; ISRSUPC SRCHFOR for "grep"; and IRXJCL
for "awk".  Tom's example was schematic, intended to use language
with which UNIX partisans would be familiar.

>Please compare apple to apples. Not your wish list.
> 
I believe I contrasted the behavior of JCL with UNIX shell.  The statement
in the material you quoted that might most readily be seen as a "wish"
was: "I do see lack of temporary data sets as a design flaw of UNIX."
Is that what you were referring to?


>On Feb 4, 2016, at 4:08 PM, Paul Gilmartin wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 4 Feb 2016 15:30:53 -0600, Ed Gould wrote:
>>
>>> On Feb 4, 2016, at 2:00 PM, Tom Brennan wrote:

 Unix Style:

 cat /etc/passwd | grep ^ted013: | awk -F':' '{print $3}'

 JCL Style:

 //CAT  EXEC PGM=CAT
 //SYSUT1   DD   DSN=SYS1.ETC.PASSWD,DISP=SHR
 //SYSUT2   DD   DSN=,DISP=(NEW,PASS),SPACE=(CYL,(1,1))
 //*
 //GREP EXEC PGM=GREP
 //SYSUT1   DD   DSN=,DISP=(OLD,DELETE)
 //SYSUT2   DD   DSN=,DISP=(NEW,PASS),SPACE=(CYL,(1,1))
 //SYSINDD   *
  ^ted013:
 /*
 //AWK  EXEC PGM=AWK
 //SYSUT1   DD   DSN=,DISP=(OLD,DELETE)
 //SYSUT2   DD   SYSOUT=*
 //SYSINDD   *
  awk -F':' '{print $3}'
 /*
 unix :)-SNIP-
>>>
>>> To be fair to zOS There are "probably" the same files needed for UNIX
>>> its just they are "assumed".
>>>
>> No, they are not; not even as RAM disk files.  A pipe communicates directly
>> between processes (like "tasks").  A DOS partisan once explained his
>> misunderstanding of pipes to me that way:
>>
>> CAT reads /etc/passwd and writes to temporary file TEMP1.
>> When CAT terminates, GREP reads TEMP1 and writes TEMP2
>> When GREP terminates, AWK reads TEMP2 and writes to stdout.
>>
>> Tom's JCL is actually:
>>
>> cat /etc/passwd >temp1; grep ^ted013 temp2; awk -F':'
>> '{print $3}'; rm temp1 temp2
>>
>> In Tom's UNIX example, the stages run concurrently.  This can make
>> a big
>> difference if the first stage is long-running: you see output
>> before it terminates
>> (subject to some annoying buffer latency).
>>
>> I could (and have) connected Classic OS programs with POSIX pipes
>> in Rexx.
>> That takes more than 16 lines.  (You could omit the comments and
>> endfiles.)
>>
>> I do see lack of temporary data sets as a design flaw of UNIX.

-- gil

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 03:11:34 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote:
>
>> ...  A DOS partisan once explained his
>> misunderstanding of pipes to me that way:
>> 
>> CAT reads /etc/passwd and writes to temporary file TEMP1.
>> When CAT terminates, GREP reads TEMP1 and writes TEMP2
>> When GREP terminates, AWK reads TEMP2 and writes to stdout.
>
>MS-DOS/PC-DOS didn't have true pipes, and the "piping" provided was exactly as 
>your DOS partisan described (writing to a temporary dataset, first process 
>completes before second starts, reading the temporary file, etc). Command 
>using piping "looked like" it may look in a Unix, but didn't operate the Unix 
>way.
> 
My DOS colleague's "misunderstanding" was that he expected UNIX pipes
to be implemented in a similar way.

-- gil

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 04:57:49 -0600, Ed Gould wrote:
>
>There was a product from IBM called PCF and it would let you string
>out tso commands with a ";" between each command and you could do
>what you are talking about I just remembered it a 445A . ex:  alloc
>(systut1)da(in.contl) shr;alloc (sysut2) da(out.data) new sp(1 1)
>trk;alloc fi(sysin) dummy;alloc fi(sysprint) da(*);call 'sys1.linklib
>(iebgener)'
>Is this what you are talking about?
> 
No.  As I understand it, he was talking about MS-DOS/PC-DOS.


>On Feb 5, 2016, at 3:11 AM, Bill Woodger wrote:
>>
>> MS-DOS/PC-DOS didn't have true pipes, and the "piping" provided was
>> exactly as your DOS partisan described (writing to a temporary
>> dataset, first process completes before second starts, reading the
>> temporary file, etc). Command using piping "looked like" it may
>> look in a Unix, but didn't operate the Unix way.

-- gil

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Re: IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 06:55:25 -0600, Bill Woodger wrote:

>Tom, 
>
>I think if you use that cat to grep to awk as an example, you'll get confusion 
>from the students. They'll say "why don't you just do it in awk?" or even reel 
>off an obscure Perl one-liner.
> 
Or DFSORT.  /* ( but not in one line.)  */

>Using ls into grep into tail may be more realistic.
>
Lately I did "vi $( find ... | ls -rt | tail -1)" to edit the most recent
matching file.  But that can not be translated into a JCL teaching
example.

JCL partisans are free to rebut with, "UNIX provides no means to
specify the RECFM, LRECL, or BLKSIZE of a UNIX file."

-- gil

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Re: Ancient History (OS's) - was : IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Tom Marchant]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 13:19:25 -0600, John McKown wrote:

>the grandfather of them all ...
>was the Imsai 8080. Not to mention many other CP/M-80 machines, such as
>Comemco and Altair 8800.

ITYM Cromemco.

The IMSAI was a clone of the Altair. If you want to think of one as the 
"Grandfather", it 
would be the Altair. Or what about the Mark-8? Based upon an Intel 8008, the 
design was 
published in Radio Electronics. I knew someone who built one. That would have 
been 
about 42 years ago.

-- 
Tom Marchant

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Re: Ancient History (OS's) - was : IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Linda]

I had an Apple ][ with an acoustic coupler. It auto dialed over a regular telco 
dial tone line using a program loaded from a cassette player, or if one could 
afford it, from an early floppy drive. The college I went to had a Univac 
90/70d. The were 4 student dialup numbers. I could get into one of those much 
like the scene from War Games.  It was fun. 

Linda

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 5, 2016, at 11:19 AM, John McKown  wrote:
> 
>> On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 1:02 PM, Lester, Bob  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi John,
>> 
>> Commodore 64 anyone?  :-)
>> 
>> Do you know what OS it ran?
> 
> ​Some variant of Microsoft BASIC, in ROM.​
> 
> 
> 
>> 
>> Was the HW an x86?  Motorola?  Apple?
> 
> ​Motorola 8 bit​ 6510 CPU.
> 
> Apple ][ was the 6502(?). And don't forget the Atari 800 (and lesser 400),
> which was 6502 based. Or, the one that I had: Tandy / Radio Shack's TRS-80
> (affectionately known as the "trash-80") which was Zilog Z-80 (superset of
> Intel 8080) based. Oh, and the grandfather of them all (immortalized in
> "War Games" - how did they get an acoustic coupled modem to autodial?)
> was the Imsai 8080. Not to mention many other CP/M-80 machines, such as
> Comemco and Altair 8800. These latter two had the "feature" of being able
> to toggle individual bytes into memory via switches on the box. Damn, I'm
> old.
> 
> 
> 
>> 
>> I had a buddy (years ago, of course), that did strange and wonderful
>> (at the time) things with several of them connected together.  No cases,
>> wires everywhere,  but pretty cool anyhow for the time.
>> 
>> TGIF, else I'd be in trouble.  :-)
>> 
>> BobL
> 
> -- 
> Werner Heisenberg is driving down the autobahn. A police officer pulls
> him over. The officer says, "Excuse me, sir, do you know how fast you
> were going?"
> "No," replies Dr. Heisenberg, "but I know where I am."
> 
> Computer Science is the only discipline in which we view adding a new wing
> to a building as being maintenance -- Jim Horning
> 
> Schrodinger's backup: The condition of any backup is unknown until a
> restore is attempted.
> 
> He's about as useful as a wax frying pan.
> 
> Maranatha! <><
> John McKown
> 
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Re: Ancient History (OS's) - was : IBM Destination z - What the Heck Is JCL and Why Does It Look So Funny?

[Tom Marchant]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 14:00:29 -0600, Elardus Engelbrecht wrote:

>8 bit MOS Technology 6510 with 64KB memory - Loosely based on Motorola AFAIK.

Depends on what you mean by "based on". The 6502 was designed by some of the 
same 
people who designed the 6800 at Motorola, but it was a rather different design.

The 6501 and 6502 were designed concurrently. The 6501 was pin-compatible with 
the 6800 
and, like the 6800, required a two-phase clock input. The idea was that the 
6501 could be 
plugged into an existing circuit board designed for the 6800. The instruction 
set and the 
internal architecture were different, though, so they couldn't run the same 
software. The 6502 
has an on-chip two-phase clock generator, simplifying system design. The 6501 
and 6502 
were also quite inexpensive, compared to other processors of the time. The 
price for the 6502 
was $25 for one.

MOS Technology produced the KIM-1 (Keyboard Input Monitor) evaluation board for 
the 6502. 
It included a 6 digit,7-segment LED display, and a hex keypad, as well as a 
teletype interface 
and an audio cassette interface for storing and retrieving data. It had 2K of 
ROM with code to 
operate all of that, and 1K + 128 bytes of RAM. I bought mine in the spring of 
1976, just a 
couple of months before the announcement of the Apple-1.

I expanded the KIM-1 with an additional 24K of memory, as well as a video 
interface. I also 
bought an early Shugart Technology 5MB 5 1/4 inch hard drive for it. That was 
before Shugart 
Associates sued Al Shugart over the use of his name, and Shugart Technology 
changed their 
name to Seagate. 

When I bought my second computer, an Atari 800, I was working on a dual port 
memory card 
for it so that the KIM-1 could access the hard drive and the drive could access 
memory 
directly without slowing down the processor.

The Atari was intended as my travel machine. I worked for Amdahl at the time 
and was on the 
road all the time. I packed the Atari in some cheap luggage and took it with me 
as checked 
baggage on hundreds of flights. No doubt it suffered a lot of abuse, but it 
never failed.

What does this have to do with mainframes? Nothing.

-- 
Tom Marchant

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