Re: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL]
Thanks, Dave! Not quite the answer I wanted but the answer I needed. :-) Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Dave Betten Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2022 4:42 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL] Nothing has changed regarding DFSORT's zIIP exploitation. It only exploits zIIP when called by Db2 Utilities. And the new zSORT capability on z15 does not exploit zIIP but instead leverages the accelerator. Dave Betten Senior z/OS Performance Specialist IBM Z Technical Sales -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- The information contained in this message is confidential, protected from disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or action omitted in reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to this message and destroy the material in its entirety, whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question
Nothing has changed. DFSORT still only exploits zIIP when invoked by Db2 Utilities. On z15, when using zSORT, it does not use zIIP but instead exploits the accelerator. PS - sorry if this is a dupe. I replied earlier but didn't see it appear in the list. Dave Betten Senior z/OS Performance Specialist IBM Z Technical Sales -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL]
Nothing has changed regarding DFSORT's zIIP exploitation. It only exploits zIIP when called by Db2 Utilities. And the new zSORT capability on z15 does not exploit zIIP but instead leverages the accelerator. Dave Betten Senior z/OS Performance Specialist IBM Z Technical Sales -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL]
SMF16 records for DFSORT show how much cpu time was zIIP eligible and how much was actually dispatched on zIIP. You can check your own system to see what relevance it has for your workload. In the past only Db2 Utilities workload was zIIP eligible in DFSORT, but that may have changed recently (I don't know if IBM finally did it). Lots of other non-Db2 zIIP exploitation is out there. On Tue, Apr 5, 2022 at 7:45 AM Pommier, Rex wrote: > Thanks, Paul. That definitely answers my second question. I haven't seen > the Redbook so this clears up whether ZSort uses a zIIP. Kind of makes me > wonder if SyncSort's (OK, "Precisely's") ZPSaver would take advantage of > the new instructions. Best of both worlds on a significantly sub-capacity > machine. Use new instructions that accelerate sorting on a full speed > zIIP. :-) > > Back to my original question since I don't have a z15, does DFSort exploit > zIIP at all? I'm guessing "no" since I've seen nothing current about it. > > Thanks again, > > Rex > > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf > Of Feller, Paul > Sent: Monday, April 4, 2022 4:09 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Subject: Re: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL] > > Rex, on a z15 there is an "Integrated Accelerator for Z Sort" which has > nothing to do with zIIPs or general CPs. > > From an IBM Redbook - IBM z15 (8561) Technical Guide IBM Integrated > Accelerator for Z SORT Sorting data is a significant part of IBM Z > workloads including batch workloads, database query processing, and utility > processing. The amount of data stored and processed on Z continues to grow > at a high rate driving an ever-increasing sort workload. IBM z15 processor > adds special hardware to significantly accelerate frequently used > functions. The IBM Integrated Accelerator for Z sort has been implemented > on each core and it provides new architected instructions for sorting data > to speed up sorting operations. It supports multiple active sorts in > parallel and it is designed to: > > • Optimize elapsed time and CPU time > • Shorten the batch window (primarily targeting existing batch type > sort workloads > • Improve select database functions, such as reorganization to help > reorganize data more frequently as sorted data is faster to access in > interactive use > > > Paul Feller > GTS Mainframe Technical Support > > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf > Of Pommier, Rex > Sent: Monday, April 4, 2022 3:22 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Subject: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL] > > Hello list, > > The subject line summarizes my question. We're running a z14 (so the > SORTL stuff doesn't apply according to the doc I've read) and z/OS 2.4. > Does DFSort support offloading to a zIIP processor for non Db2 sorting? I > know I could purchase db2sort which is Syncsort under the covers for db2 > sorts but I'm wondering about regular batch EXEC PGM=SORT usage of DFSort. > I found a hit from about 8 years ago where at that point they didn't > exploit a zIIP but was wondering if anything has changed. > > On a second subject, if we ever migrate beyond the z14, is the SORTL stuff > available on the z15 and above (presumably) using zIIP or is it merely > doing other acceleration on the general purpose engines? > > TIA, > > Rex > > -- > The information contained in this message is confidential, protected from > disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this message is > not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible for > delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified > that any disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or action > omitted in reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If > you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately > by replying to this message and destroy the material in its entirety, > whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you. > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email > to lists...@listserv.ua.edu<mailto:lists...@listserv.ua.edu> with the > message: INFO IBM-MAIN > > -- > Please note: This message originated outside your organization. Please > use caution when opening links or attachments. > > > -- > For IBM-M
Re: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL]
Thanks, Paul. That definitely answers my second question. I haven't seen the Redbook so this clears up whether ZSort uses a zIIP. Kind of makes me wonder if SyncSort's (OK, "Precisely's") ZPSaver would take advantage of the new instructions. Best of both worlds on a significantly sub-capacity machine. Use new instructions that accelerate sorting on a full speed zIIP. :-) Back to my original question since I don't have a z15, does DFSort exploit zIIP at all? I'm guessing "no" since I've seen nothing current about it. Thanks again, Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Feller, Paul Sent: Monday, April 4, 2022 4:09 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL] Rex, on a z15 there is an "Integrated Accelerator for Z Sort" which has nothing to do with zIIPs or general CPs. From an IBM Redbook - IBM z15 (8561) Technical Guide IBM Integrated Accelerator for Z SORT Sorting data is a significant part of IBM Z workloads including batch workloads, database query processing, and utility processing. The amount of data stored and processed on Z continues to grow at a high rate driving an ever-increasing sort workload. IBM z15 processor adds special hardware to significantly accelerate frequently used functions. The IBM Integrated Accelerator for Z sort has been implemented on each core and it provides new architected instructions for sorting data to speed up sorting operations. It supports multiple active sorts in parallel and it is designed to: • Optimize elapsed time and CPU time • Shorten the batch window (primarily targeting existing batch type sort workloads • Improve select database functions, such as reorganization to help reorganize data more frequently as sorted data is faster to access in interactive use Paul Feller GTS Mainframe Technical Support -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Pommier, Rex Sent: Monday, April 4, 2022 3:22 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL] Hello list, The subject line summarizes my question. We're running a z14 (so the SORTL stuff doesn't apply according to the doc I've read) and z/OS 2.4. Does DFSort support offloading to a zIIP processor for non Db2 sorting? I know I could purchase db2sort which is Syncsort under the covers for db2 sorts but I'm wondering about regular batch EXEC PGM=SORT usage of DFSort. I found a hit from about 8 years ago where at that point they didn't exploit a zIIP but was wondering if anything has changed. On a second subject, if we ever migrate beyond the z14, is the SORTL stuff available on the z15 and above (presumably) using zIIP or is it merely doing other acceleration on the general purpose engines? TIA, Rex -- The information contained in this message is confidential, protected from disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or action omitted in reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to this message and destroy the material in its entirety, whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu<mailto:lists...@listserv.ua.edu> with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Please note: This message originated outside your organization. Please use caution when opening links or attachments. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- The information contained in this message is confidential, protected from disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or action omitted in reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to this message and destroy the material in its entirety, whether in electr
Re: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL]
Rex, on a z15 there is an "Integrated Accelerator for Z Sort" which has nothing to do with zIIPs or general CPs. From an IBM Redbook - IBM z15 (8561) Technical Guide IBM Integrated Accelerator for Z SORT Sorting data is a significant part of IBM Z workloads including batch workloads, database query processing, and utility processing. The amount of data stored and processed on Z continues to grow at a high rate driving an ever-increasing sort workload. IBM z15 processor adds special hardware to significantly accelerate frequently used functions. The IBM Integrated Accelerator for Z sort has been implemented on each core and it provides new architected instructions for sorting data to speed up sorting operations. It supports multiple active sorts in parallel and it is designed to: • Optimize elapsed time and CPU time • Shorten the batch window (primarily targeting existing batch type sort workloads • Improve select database functions, such as reorganization to help reorganize data more frequently as sorted data is faster to access in interactive use Paul Feller GTS Mainframe Technical Support -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Pommier, Rex Sent: Monday, April 4, 2022 3:22 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question [EXTERNAL] Hello list, The subject line summarizes my question. We're running a z14 (so the SORTL stuff doesn't apply according to the doc I've read) and z/OS 2.4. Does DFSort support offloading to a zIIP processor for non Db2 sorting? I know I could purchase db2sort which is Syncsort under the covers for db2 sorts but I'm wondering about regular batch EXEC PGM=SORT usage of DFSort. I found a hit from about 8 years ago where at that point they didn't exploit a zIIP but was wondering if anything has changed. On a second subject, if we ever migrate beyond the z14, is the SORTL stuff available on the z15 and above (presumably) using zIIP or is it merely doing other acceleration on the general purpose engines? TIA, Rex -- The information contained in this message is confidential, protected from disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or action omitted in reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to this message and destroy the material in its entirety, whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu<mailto:lists...@listserv.ua.edu> with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Please note: This message originated outside your organization. Please use caution when opening links or attachments. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
non Db2 DFSort and zIIP question
Hello list, The subject line summarizes my question. We're running a z14 (so the SORTL stuff doesn't apply according to the doc I've read) and z/OS 2.4. Does DFSort support offloading to a zIIP processor for non Db2 sorting? I know I could purchase db2sort which is Syncsort under the covers for db2 sorts but I'm wondering about regular batch EXEC PGM=SORT usage of DFSort. I found a hit from about 8 years ago where at that point they didn't exploit a zIIP but was wondering if anything has changed. On a second subject, if we ever migrate beyond the z14, is the SORTL stuff available on the z15 and above (presumably) using zIIP or is it merely doing other acceleration on the general purpose engines? TIA, Rex -- The information contained in this message is confidential, protected from disclosure and may be legally privileged. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, distribution, copying, or any action taken or action omitted in reliance on it, is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to this message and destroy the material in its entirety, whether in electronic or hard copy format. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT with zIIP
> I'd like to know if DFSORT makes use of zIIP as SYNCSORT does. Gilson, DFSORT can off-load to zIIP processors on behalf of DB2 utilities, but NOT otherwise. At this time, IBM has NO plan for enabling DFSORT to exploit zIIP for regular DFSORT jobs. IBM realizes DFSORT remains a prominent component of our customers' batch workloads. However, the added controls that would need to be implemented in order to maintain our high standards for performance, reliability and system integrity are not justified in view of estimations that there is a low off-load potential and the value to clients may be marginal. IBM will continue to focus its DFSORT development efforts on the enhanced function, performance, reliability and service items that we believe provide the most value to our clients. The foregoing represents IBM's current intent and is subject to change. Thanks, Sri Hari Kolusu DFSORT Development IBM Corporation -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
DFSORT with zIIP
Dear list: I'd like to know if DFSORT makes use of zIIP as SYNCSORT does. Please do not consider DFSORT with DB/2 utilities where zIIP is used. If anyone could help I really appreciate that. Thanks !! Regards, Gilson -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT and zIIP
One more thing - The license from IBM, at least ours, prevents a program running on a ZIIP from executing, or causing to be executed, user code on the z/IIP. Chris Blaicher Technical Architect Mainframe Development Syncsort Incorporated 50 Tice Boulevard, Woodcliff Lake, NJ 07677 P: 201-930-8234 | M: 512-627-3803 E: cblaic...@syncsort.com www.syncsort.com -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2016 1:30 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: DFSORT and zIIP On 7/21/2016 10:07 AM, Elardus Engelbrecht wrote: > Ed Jaffe wrote: > >> They probably don't want to call E15/E35 exits in SRB mode, ... > Excellent catch! Running an exit while sitting on zIIP is an interesting > scenario. H, very very interesting, what will happens when you try out > that little trick? > > And if you're sitting in a micro code while running some things in zIIP, what > will happens? Exit the zIIP and running from CPU while using those micro code > and jump back to zIIP? Just to be clear, zIIP is not a different kind of hardware. It's the same architecture as a CP. When you're dispatched on a zIIP, you're executing exactly the same instructions you would execute on a CP. You're not running "micro code" or anything like that. SORT probably doesn't want to call E15/E35 is SRB mode because the environment is too restrictive for a typical E15/E35 exit. For example: a) the call will be in supervisor state -- that could also be an integrity exposure b) the code is not able to issue SVCs or perform "normal" I/O activities (GET, PUT, EXCP, etc.) -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN ATTENTION: - The information contained in this message (including any files transmitted with this message) may contain proprietary, trade secret or other confidential and/or legally privileged information. Any pricing information contained in this message or in any files transmitted with this message is always confidential and cannot be shared with any third parties without prior written approval from Syncsort. This message is intended to be read only by the individual or entity to whom it is addressed or by their designee. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are on notice that any use, disclosure, copying or distribution of this message, in any form, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and/or Syncsort and destroy all copies of this message in your possession, custody or control. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT and zIIP
On 7/21/2016 10:07 AM, Elardus Engelbrecht wrote: Ed Jaffe wrote: They probably don't want to call E15/E35 exits in SRB mode, ... Excellent catch! Running an exit while sitting on zIIP is an interesting scenario. H, very very interesting, what will happens when you try out that little trick? And if you're sitting in a micro code while running some things in zIIP, what will happens? Exit the zIIP and running from CPU while using those micro code and jump back to zIIP? Just to be clear, zIIP is not a different kind of hardware. It's the same architecture as a CP. When you're dispatched on a zIIP, you're executing exactly the same instructions you would execute on a CP. You're not running "micro code" or anything like that. SORT probably doesn't want to call E15/E35 is SRB mode because the environment is too restrictive for a typical E15/E35 exit. For example: a) the call will be in supervisor state -- that could also be an integrity exposure b) the code is not able to issue SVCs or perform "normal" I/O activities (GET, PUT, EXCP, etc.) -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT and zIIP
Ed Jaffe wrote: >They probably don't want to call E15/E35 exits in SRB mode, ... Excellent catch! Running an exit while sitting on zIIP is an interesting scenario. H, very very interesting, what will happens when you try out that little trick? And if you're sitting in a micro code while running some things in zIIP, what will happens? Exit the zIIP and running from CPU while using those micro code and jump back to zIIP? Any doumentation available discussing above scenarios? Groete / Greetings Elardus Engelbrecht -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT and zIIP
On 7/20/2016 11:25 PM, Timothy Sipples wrote: To my knowledge, no. zIIP exploitation sometimes makes technical sense, and sometimes it doesn't. Even within the same general product category. Subject to periodic review as technologies change and evolve. Assuming they're constrained by the same "Enclave SRB Only" restriction placed upon ISV zIIP exploiters, then a lot depends on how many task mode-only system services are being invoked by the code. Switching back and forth from task to SRB mode is expensive -- not just because of the extra path length, but also because of cache considerations. They probably don't want to call E15/E35 exits in SRB mode, but it seems like they should be able to load the data in task mode, sort the data in SRB mode, and then write the data back out in task mode. -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: AW: Re: DFSORT and zIIP
On 7/20/2016 10:45 PM, Peter Hunkeler wrote: I'm longing for the day when also the zIIPs disappear again and IBM has found a better way to charge software license fees. I agree it would be GREAT(!) if kneecapping of CPs was removed and replaced with PER CORE software charging like other platforms use. Until that day arrives, specialty engines are the only way for small and medium-sized companies to fully experience the current awesomeness of z Systems processor technology. BTW, some recent performance studies have shown that kneecapping can actually improve performance in larger shops by increasing the number of dispatch points. For example, take a look at the results enumerated in this "Best Session Award" presentation from SHARE in San Antonio: http://share.confex.com/data/handout/share/126/Session_18345_handout_8753_0.pdf -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT and zIIP
W dniu 2016-07-21 o 08:25, Timothy Sipples pisze: Paul Gilmartin wrote: I find it hard to believe that optimization of revenue was not a consideration. To my knowledge, no. zIIP exploitation sometimes makes technical sense, and sometimes it doesn't. Even within the same general product category. Subject to periodic review as technologies change and evolve. In general zIIP exploitation is for financial reasons. By definition. It is still the same CPU as CP, with somehow limited functionality to support some workloads, approved by IBM. -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland -- Tre tej wiadomoci moe zawiera informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wycznie do uytku subowego adresata. Odbiorc moe by jedynie jej adresat z wyczeniem dostpu osób trzecich. Jeeli nie jeste adresatem niniejszej wiadomoci lub pracownikiem upowanionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, e jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne dziaanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i moe by karalne. Jeeli otrzymae t wiadomo omykowo, prosimy niezwocznie zawiadomi nadawc wysyajc odpowied oraz trwale usun t wiadomo wczajc w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorized to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. mBank S.A. z siedzib w Warszawie, ul. Senatorska 18, 00-950 Warszawa, www.mBank.pl, e-mail: kont...@mbank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2016 r. kapita zakadowy mBanku S.A. (w caoci wpacony) wynosi 168.955.696 zotych. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT and zIIP
Paul Gilmartin wrote: >I find it hard to believe that optimization of revenue was not a consideration. To my knowledge, no. zIIP exploitation sometimes makes technical sense, and sometimes it doesn't. Even within the same general product category. Subject to periodic review as technologies change and evolve. Timothy Sipples IT Architect Executive, Industry Solutions, IBM z Systems, AP/GCG/MEA E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
AW: Re: DFSORT and zIIP
>For DB2 Sort for z/OS, zIIP -- Peter Hunkeler >exploitation makes technical sense. For DFSORT -- except for exploiting >zIIPs on behalf of DB2 utilities and in other ancillary ways -- it doesn't >seem to make technical sense. All this speciality engine thing never made any *techincal* sence to me at all. It's a pure financial thing. >Maybe in the future, as the technologies change and evolve, it will. I'm longing for the day when also the zIIPs disappear again and IBM has found a better way to charge software license fees. -- Peter Hunkeler -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFsort and zIIP
A place (long ago and far away) used both. For cost savings we decided on DFSORT (long story omitted). What we found was that for *some small percent* the control cards weren’t compatible. This was long before zIIP and once we got the control card issue resolved we were happy with DFSORT. The users were more or less “who cares” as long as the job got done. I must say the DFSORT team (on here) any way makes a valuable contribution to “How do I do this”. The Syncsort people were always happy to answer such questions when asked. Ed > On Jul 20, 2016, at 6:35 AM, White, Andy <awh...@metlife.com> wrote: > > This was exactly why I asked the question we run both in house dfsort and > syncsort, don’t ask why. But because syncsort can take advantage of the zIIP > engines. We are leaning more towards that and not drive MSU costs if we > thought about converting the other way. At this point we are were just > looking at it as a savings. Both seem to work fine for our customers its just > the extra expense if we used DFSORT when it comes to the processor and our > software costs. > > > > Andy > > The largest benefit is a financial one: you don't pay the zIIP MSUs. > A performance benefit can come from the fact that the zIIP is always running > at full speed, while your CP's can run at lower speeds. > > Kees. > > > >>> DFSORT can use zIIP on behalf of DB2 utilities, but not otherwise. >>> Here's more information: >>> >>> At this time, IBM has no plan for enabling DFSORT to exploit the >>> system z9 Integrated Information Processor (zIIP). IBM realizes >>> DFSORT remains a prominent component of our customers' batch >>> workloads. However, the added controls that would need to be >>> implemented in order to maintain our high standards for performance, >>> reliability and system integrity are not justified in view of >>> estimations that there is a low offload potential and the value to >>> clients may be marginal.[snip] >> >> I seem to remember that SyncSort offers an Add-On package that allows >> certain SyncSort processing to be offloaded to zIIPs. The above >> statement suggest that SyncSort's perfocmance is suffering from using >> zIIPs (simplified and exagerated, I know). > > I understood "there is a low offload potential and the value to clients may > be marginal" as meaning that there would not be much benefit in using zIIP. > Not that it would be worse. > > -- > Tom Marchant > > > The information contained in this message may be CONFIDENTIAL and is for the > intended addressee only. Any unauthorized use, dissemination of the > information, or copying of this message is prohibited. If you are not the > intended addressee, please notify the sender immediately and delete this > message. > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT and zIIP
IOW, if enough customers were to switch to a competitive zIIP-enabled sort product, the technical issues might magically be solved ;-) Kirk Wolf Dovetailed Technologies http://dovetail.com On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 10:14 AM, Paul Gilmartin < 000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote: > On Wed, 20 Jul 2016 14:47:49 +0800, Timothy Sipples wrote: > > >Different products mean different technical considerations and > >optimizations. It's just that simple. For DB2 Sort for z/OS, zIIP > >exploitation makes technical sense. For DFSORT -- except for exploiting > >zIIPs on behalf of DB2 utilities and in other ancillary ways -- it doesn't > >seem to make technical sense. Maybe in the future, as the technologies > >change and evolve, it will. > > > I find it hard to believe that optimization of revenue was not a > consideration. > Andy White's post following yours suggests that, and that the choice may > have been counterproductive. > > -- gil > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT and zIIP
If you have a highly kneecapped CP, almost any workload on a zIIP would greatly help the CP. Unless the instruction sequences are very short. On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 10:14 AM, Paul Gilmartin <000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote: > On Wed, 20 Jul 2016 14:47:49 +0800, Timothy Sipples wrote: > >>Different products mean different technical considerations and >>optimizations. It's just that simple. For DB2 Sort for z/OS, zIIP >>exploitation makes technical sense. For DFSORT -- except for exploiting >>zIIPs on behalf of DB2 utilities and in other ancillary ways -- it doesn't >>seem to make technical sense. Maybe in the future, as the technologies >>change and evolve, it will. >> > I find it hard to believe that optimization of revenue was not a > consideration. > Andy White's post following yours suggests that, and that the choice may > have been counterproductive. > > -- gil > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT and zIIP
On Wed, 20 Jul 2016 14:47:49 +0800, Timothy Sipples wrote: >Different products mean different technical considerations and >optimizations. It's just that simple. For DB2 Sort for z/OS, zIIP >exploitation makes technical sense. For DFSORT -- except for exploiting >zIIPs on behalf of DB2 utilities and in other ancillary ways -- it doesn't >seem to make technical sense. Maybe in the future, as the technologies >change and evolve, it will. > I find it hard to believe that optimization of revenue was not a consideration. Andy White's post following yours suggests that, and that the choice may have been counterproductive. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFsort and zIIP
This was exactly why I asked the question we run both in house dfsort and syncsort, don’t ask why. But because syncsort can take advantage of the zIIP engines. We are leaning more towards that and not drive MSU costs if we thought about converting the other way. At this point we are were just looking at it as a savings. Both seem to work fine for our customers its just the extra expense if we used DFSORT when it comes to the processor and our software costs. Andy The largest benefit is a financial one: you don't pay the zIIP MSUs. A performance benefit can come from the fact that the zIIP is always running at full speed, while your CP's can run at lower speeds. Kees. >>DFSORT can use zIIP on behalf of DB2 utilities, but not otherwise. >>Here's more information: > > >>At this time, IBM has no plan for enabling DFSORT to exploit the >>system z9 Integrated Information Processor (zIIP). IBM realizes >>DFSORT remains a prominent component of our customers' batch >>workloads. However, the added controls that would need to be >>implemented in order to maintain our high standards for performance, >>reliability and system integrity are not justified in view of >>estimations that there is a low offload potential and the value to >>clients may be marginal.[snip] > >I seem to remember that SyncSort offers an Add-On package that allows >certain SyncSort processing to be offloaded to zIIPs. The above >statement suggest that SyncSort's perfocmance is suffering from using >zIIPs (simplified and exagerated, I know). I understood "there is a low offload potential and the value to clients may be marginal" as meaning that there would not be much benefit in using zIIP. Not that it would be worse. -- Tom Marchant The information contained in this message may be CONFIDENTIAL and is for the intended addressee only. Any unauthorized use, dissemination of the information, or copying of this message is prohibited. If you are not the intended addressee, please notify the sender immediately and delete this message. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFSORT and zIIP
Different products mean different technical considerations and optimizations. It's just that simple. For DB2 Sort for z/OS, zIIP exploitation makes technical sense. For DFSORT -- except for exploiting zIIPs on behalf of DB2 utilities and in other ancillary ways -- it doesn't seem to make technical sense. Maybe in the future, as the technologies change and evolve, it will. Timothy Sipples IT Architect Executive, Industry Solutions, IBM z Systems, AP/GCG/MEA E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFsort and zIIP
Overloading zIIPs consists of 2 phases. 1. work is getting queued for the zIIP, delaying the work. 2. when queuing is getting to large, the CPs are asked to assist in processing zIIP work (if allowed by IEAOPT parameters) The first phase is not reported externally. The second phase is visible, because this CPU is reported as zIIP-eligible CPU. This CPU will also be charged as license CP MSUs. So when you have zIIP-elibible CPU, you know you have problems of the second category and you already had the problems of the first category before. Some DB2 problems due to zIIP work queuing were resolved by disabling the zIIP, at the cost of CP MSUs of course. Kees. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Peter Hunkeler Sent: 19 July, 2016 19:51 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: AW: Re: DFsort and zIIP >You are correct that the ZIIP dispatcher is not as sophisticated as the >regular dispatcher. I dare to contradict, not intending to question you expertise. It is my understanding that there is only one dispatcher in MVS. It handles work on the CP WUQ as well as work on the zIIP WUQ. The reason for the wait time mechanism is explained in Init Ref, IEAOPTxx. -- Peter Hunkeler -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN For information, services and offers, please visit our web site: http://www.klm.com. This e-mail and any attachment may contain confidential and privileged material intended for the addressee only. If you are not the addressee, you are notified that no part of the e-mail or any attachment may be disclosed, copied or distributed, and that any other action related to this e-mail or attachment is strictly prohibited, and may be unlawful. If you have received this e-mail by error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, and delete this message. Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij NV (KLM), its subsidiaries and/or its employees shall not be liable for the incorrect or incomplete transmission of this e-mail or any attachments, nor responsible for any delay in receipt. Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij N.V. (also known as KLM Royal Dutch Airlines) is registered in Amstelveen, The Netherlands, with registered number 33014286 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
AW: Re: DFsort and zIIP
>You are correct that the ZIIP dispatcher is not as sophisticated as the >regular dispatcher. I dare to contradict, not intending to question you expertise. It is my understanding that there is only one dispatcher in MVS. It handles work on the CP WUQ as well as work on the zIIP WUQ. The reason for the wait time mechanism is explained in Init Ref, IEAOPTxx. -- Peter Hunkeler -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFsort and zIIP
You are correct that the ZIIP dispatcher is not as sophisticated as the regular dispatcher. If a ZIIP request is made and no ZIIP engine is available the dispatcher will wait a period of time, see ZIIPAWMT parameter in IEAOPTxx, which if none is available by the end of that time, it will dispatch it on a GP engine rather than a ZIIP engine. This creates ZIIP_ON_CP time in your SMF data. Because of this wait time, especially if it is large, you can elongate the elapsed time of whatever is running trying to use the ZIIP engines. By default that time is 3.2ms. The trick is to know when you are getting held up too much by ZIIP dispatch and skip trying to use it. I cannot remember right now the ROT for ZIIP percent active, but you cannot redline a ZIIP engine the way you can a GP engine. Chris Blaicher Technical Architect Mainframe Development Syncsort Incorporated 50 Tice Boulevard, Woodcliff Lake, NJ 07677 P: 201-930-8234 | M: 512-627-3803 E: cblaic...@syncsort.com www.syncsort.com -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Jesse 1 Robinson Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2016 11:47 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: DFsort and zIIP There is one potential zIIP performance problem that we learned about as we moved to DB2 V10, which enabled more zIIP processing than was available in V9. The scenario went something like this. zIIP dispatching was not as sophisticated as GP dispatching. If available zIIPs got overloaded, DB2 performance could be severely impacted by a thrashing condition. We actually added another zIIP engine in advance of the V10 cutover. I have no idea what might have happened otherwise. Was a bullet really dodged or merely imagined? I don't believe that this issue had anything specifically to do with SORT. . . . J.O.Skip Robinson Southern California Edison Company Electric Dragon Team Paddler SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager 323-715-0595 Mobile 626-302-7535 Office robin...@sce.com -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Vernooij, CP (ITOPT1) - KLM Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2016 7:42 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: (External):Re: DFsort and zIIP The largest benefit is a financial one: you don't pay the zIIP MSUs. A performance benefit can come from the fact that the zIIP is always running at full speed, while your CP's can run at lower speeds. Kees. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Tom Marchant Sent: 19 July, 2016 16:39 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: DFsort and zIIP On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 08:26:45 +0200, Peter Hunkeler wrote: >>DFSORT can use zIIP on behalf of DB2 utilities, but not otherwise. >>Here's more information: > > >>At this time, IBM has no plan for enabling DFSORT to exploit the >>system z9 Integrated Information Processor (zIIP). IBM realizes >>DFSORT remains a prominent component of our customers' batch >>workloads. However, the added controls that would need to be >>implemented in order to maintain our high standards for performance, >>reliability and system integrity are not justified in view of >>estimations that there is a low offload potential and the value to >>clients may be marginal.[snip] > >I seem to remember that SyncSort offers an Add-On package that allows >certain SyncSort processing to be offloaded to zIIPs. The above >statement suggest that SyncSort's perfocmance is suffering from using >zIIPs (simplified and exagerated, I know). I understood "there is a low offload potential and the value to clients may be marginal" as meaning that there would not be much benefit in using zIIP. Not that it would be worse. -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN ATTENTION: - The information contained in this message (including any files transmitted with this message) may contain proprietary, trade secret or other confidential and/or legally privileged information. Any pricing information contained in this message or in any files transmitted with this message is always confidential and cannot be shared with any third parties without prior written approval from Syncsort. This message is intended to be read only by the individual or entity to whom it is addressed or by their designee. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are on notice that any use, disclosure, copying or distribution of this message, in any form, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and
Re: DFsort and zIIP
There is one potential zIIP performance problem that we learned about as we moved to DB2 V10, which enabled more zIIP processing than was available in V9. The scenario went something like this. zIIP dispatching was not as sophisticated as GP dispatching. If available zIIPs got overloaded, DB2 performance could be severely impacted by a thrashing condition. We actually added another zIIP engine in advance of the V10 cutover. I have no idea what might have happened otherwise. Was a bullet really dodged or merely imagined? I don't believe that this issue had anything specifically to do with SORT. . . . J.O.Skip Robinson Southern California Edison Company Electric Dragon Team Paddler SHARE MVS Program Co-Manager 323-715-0595 Mobile 626-302-7535 Office robin...@sce.com -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Vernooij, CP (ITOPT1) - KLM Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2016 7:42 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: (External):Re: DFsort and zIIP The largest benefit is a financial one: you don't pay the zIIP MSUs. A performance benefit can come from the fact that the zIIP is always running at full speed, while your CP's can run at lower speeds. Kees. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Tom Marchant Sent: 19 July, 2016 16:39 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: DFsort and zIIP On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 08:26:45 +0200, Peter Hunkeler wrote: >>DFSORT can use zIIP on behalf of DB2 utilities, but not otherwise. >>Here's more information: > > >>At this time, IBM has no plan for enabling DFSORT to exploit the >>system z9 Integrated Information Processor (zIIP). IBM realizes >>DFSORT remains a prominent component of our customers' batch >>workloads. However, the added controls that would need to be >>implemented in order to maintain our high standards for performance, >>reliability and system integrity are not justified in view of >>estimations that there is a low offload potential and the value to >>clients may be marginal.[snip] > >I seem to remember that SyncSort offers an Add-On package that allows >certain SyncSort processing to be offloaded to zIIPs. The above >statement suggest that SyncSort's perfocmance is suffering from using >zIIPs (simplified and exagerated, I know). I understood "there is a low offload potential and the value to clients may be marginal" as meaning that there would not be much benefit in using zIIP. Not that it would be worse. -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFsort and zIIP
The largest benefit is a financial one: you don't pay the zIIP MSUs. A performance benefit can come from the fact that the zIIP is always running at full speed, while your CP's can run at lower speeds. Kees. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Tom Marchant Sent: 19 July, 2016 16:39 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: DFsort and zIIP On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 08:26:45 +0200, Peter Hunkeler wrote: >>DFSORT can use zIIP on behalf of DB2 utilities, but not otherwise. Here's >>more information: > > >>At this time, IBM has no plan for enabling DFSORT to exploit the system z9 >>Integrated Information Processor (zIIP). IBM realizes DFSORT remains a >>prominent component of our customers' batch workloads. However, the >>added controls that would need to be implemented in order to maintain our >>high standards for performance, reliability and system integrity are not >>justified in view of estimations that there is a low offload potential and >>the value to clients may be marginal.[snip] > >I seem to remember that SyncSort offers an Add-On package that allows >certain SyncSort processing to be offloaded to zIIPs. The above statement >suggest that SyncSort's perfocmance is suffering from using zIIPs (simplified >and exagerated, I know). I understood "there is a low offload potential and the value to clients may be marginal" as meaning that there would not be much benefit in using zIIP. Not that it would be worse. -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN For information, services and offers, please visit our web site: http://www.klm.com. This e-mail and any attachment may contain confidential and privileged material intended for the addressee only. If you are not the addressee, you are notified that no part of the e-mail or any attachment may be disclosed, copied or distributed, and that any other action related to this e-mail or attachment is strictly prohibited, and may be unlawful. If you have received this e-mail by error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, and delete this message. Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij NV (KLM), its subsidiaries and/or its employees shall not be liable for the incorrect or incomplete transmission of this e-mail or any attachments, nor responsible for any delay in receipt. Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij N.V. (also known as KLM Royal Dutch Airlines) is registered in Amstelveen, The Netherlands, with registered number 33014286 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFsort and zIIP
On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 08:26:45 +0200, Peter Hunkeler wrote: >>DFSORT can use zIIP on behalf of DB2 utilities, but not otherwise. Here's >>more information: > > >>At this time, IBM has no plan for enabling DFSORT to exploit the system z9 >>Integrated Information Processor (zIIP). IBM realizes DFSORT remains a >>prominent component of our customers' batch workloads. However, the >>added controls that would need to be implemented in order to maintain our >>high standards for performance, reliability and system integrity are not >>justified in view of estimations that there is a low offload potential and >>the value to clients may be marginal.[snip] > >I seem to remember that SyncSort offers an Add-On package that allows >certain SyncSort processing to be offloaded to zIIPs. The above statement >suggest that SyncSort's perfocmance is suffering from using zIIPs (simplified >and exagerated, I know). I understood "there is a low offload potential and the value to clients may be marginal" as meaning that there would not be much benefit in using zIIP. Not that it would be worse. -- Tom Marchant -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFsort and zIIP
IBM markets DB2SORT, which is Syncsort/MFX with modifications to specifically work with and enhance sorting performed for DB2 Utilities and offloads portions of its processing to z/IIP engines when possible. Syncsort/MFX also offloads portions of its processing to z/IIP engines. Syncsort ZPSAVER offloads significant portions of its processing to z/IIP engines. I am not aware of any of these products' "performance suffering from using zIIPs" in either billable TCB time or elapsed time. Many years of research and development have gone into creating these products and I am proud to have been a small part of it. Chris Blaicher Technical Architect Mainframe Development Syncsort Incorporated 50 Tice Boulevard, Woodcliff Lake, NJ 07677 P: 201-930-8234 | M: 512-627-3803 E: cblaic...@syncsort.com www.syncsort.com -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Peter Hunkeler Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2016 2:27 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: AW: Re: DFsort and zIIP >DFSORT can use zIIP on behalf of DB2 utilities, but not otherwise. >Here's more information: > >At this time, IBM has no plan for enabling DFSORT to exploit the system >z9 Integrated Information Processor (zIIP). IBM realizes DFSORT >remains a prominent component of our customers' batch workloads. >However, the added controls that would need to be implemented in order >to maintain our high standards for performance, reliability and system >integrity are not justified in view of estimations that there is a low >offload potential and the value to clients may be marginal.[snip] Interesting statement. I seem to remember that SyncSort offers an Add-On package that allows certain SyncSort processing to be offloaded to zIIPs. The above statement suggest that SyncSort's perfocmance is suffering from using zIIPs (simplified and exagerated, I know). Also "IBM Sort for DB2 for z/OS" (can't remember the exact name), is offloading to zIIPs, if I remember correctly. This procuct is based on SyncSort code as far as I understand. -- Peter Hunkeler -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN ATTENTION: - The information contained in this message (including any files transmitted with this message) may contain proprietary, trade secret or other confidential and/or legally privileged information. Any pricing information contained in this message or in any files transmitted with this message is always confidential and cannot be shared with any third parties without prior written approval from Syncsort. This message is intended to be read only by the individual or entity to whom it is addressed or by their designee. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are on notice that any use, disclosure, copying or distribution of this message, in any form, is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and/or Syncsort and destroy all copies of this message in your possession, custody or control. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
AW: Re: DFsort and zIIP
>DFSORT can use zIIP on behalf of DB2 utilities, but not otherwise. Here's >more information: > >At this time, IBM has no plan for enabling DFSORT to exploit the system z9 >Integrated Information Processor (zIIP). IBM realizes DFSORT remains a >prominent component of our customers' batch workloads. However, the >added controls that would need to be implemented in order to maintain our >high standards for performance, reliability and system integrity are not >justified in view of estimations that there is a low offload potential and >the value to clients may be marginal.[snip] Interesting statement. I seem to remember that SyncSort offers an Add-On package that allows certain SyncSort processing to be offloaded to zIIPs. The above statement suggest that SyncSort's perfocmance is suffering from using zIIPs (simplified and exagerated, I know). Also "IBM Sort for DB2 for z/OS" (can't remember the exact name), is offloading to zIIPs, if I remember correctly. This procuct is based on SyncSort code as far as I understand. -- Peter Hunkeler -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: DFsort and zIIP
Andy, DFSORT can use zIIP on behalf of DB2 utilities, but not otherwise. Here's more information: At this time, IBM has no plan for enabling DFSORT to exploit the system z9 Integrated Information Processor (zIIP). IBM realizes DFSORT remains a prominent component of our customers' batch workloads. However, the added controls that would need to be implemented in order to maintain our high standards for performance, reliability and system integrity are not justified in view of estimations that there is a low offload potential and the value to clients may be marginal. IBM will continue to focus its DFSORT development efforts on the enhanced function, performance, reliability and service items that we believe provide the most value to our clients. The foregoing represents IBM's current intent and is subject to change. DB2 Utilities Suite for z/OS uses a small set of DFSORT sort function. Worldwide, there has been a tremendous increase in DB2 for z/OS activity (due to such things as database consolidations, remote connectivity, business intelligence, and specialty engine exploitation). This increase in DB2 activity has led to an increase in database maintenance workloads which often drive bursts of parallel utility processing during scheduled maintenance windows. As a result, additional offload by DB2 Utilities Suite for z/OS is supported. Thanks, DFSORT Development IBM Corporation IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> wrote on 07/18/2016 12:24:23 PM: > From: "White, Andy" <awh...@metlife.com> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Date: 07/18/2016 12:24 PM > Subject: DFsort and zIIP > Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU> > > Does anyone know does DFSORT take advantage of zIIP engines if they > are installed? I read online where they do for DB2 invoking DFSORT > but wondering in general if it does or planned on utilizing them. > > Thanks > > Andy > > > > The information contained in this message may be CONFIDENTIAL and is > for the intended addressee only. Any unauthorized use, > dissemination of the information, or copying of this message is > prohibited. If you are not the intended addressee, please notify > the sender immediately and delete this message. > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
DFsort and zIIP
Does anyone know does DFSORT take advantage of zIIP engines if they are installed? I read online where they do for DB2 invoking DFSORT but wondering in general if it does or planned on utilizing them. Thanks Andy The information contained in this message may be CONFIDENTIAL and is for the intended addressee only. Any unauthorized use, dissemination of the information, or copying of this message is prohibited. If you are not the intended addressee, please notify the sender immediately and delete this message. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
