KR> Wings Dings and Things!

[Larry H]

Many years ago I did a lot of research on, lift, drag & aerodynamics in general 
trying to figure out what good cool stuff to do to a airplane design. I've 
always been interested in fast, cheap to fly efficient airplanes. I looked into 
the lift thing, boy oh boy are there differing opinions on that subject! The 
two theories most aerodynamists believed before and at the time was as most of 
us have heard. Below theory #1 & #2
1: Wings are flat on the bottom, curved or rounded on top. The theory is as the 
air molecules are separated at the leading edge the bottom of wing molecules 
just lolly gag sauntering along with no worries at all heading for the trailing 
edge of the wing, right?
The molecules that headed over the top of the wing are really different from 
the lazy bottom molecules. The top molecules have to be the serious workers 
racing really fast over the longer distance curved top of the wing so they can 
meet back up with their buddy molecules they used to be next to before they 
took the easy, lazy short route across the bottom of the wing. Because the top 
speedy molecules are racing faster they create a vacuum or LIFT!!
This theory number one is what we've all heard of course.
I've wondered then and since, if this is true then a guy flying upside down 
(many have and do) is getting lifted or sucked towards the ground right!
I've thought what about the guy flying a pure symmetrical wing, heck he's 
getting equally sucked up and down. That poor wing has to decide if it likes 
being high or on the ground ! I'm surprised the pilot can make his symmetrical 
wing obey and take him skyward!

2. Some believe that the downward force of air off of the trailing edge of the 
wing creates the lifting force. They say the molecules on top racing to meet 
back up with their bottom buddy molecules is the most ignorant thing they've 
ever heard. 
If you look at a Dr Whittcomb (sp) GAW2 (I think that stood for General 
Aviation Wing # 2 of the series.) I know he had a 1 and 2 but I'm not sure if 
he went further or not with the series. Anyone is welcome to correct me you 
won't hurt my feelings too bad!
When you look at the #2 airfoil you will see the bottom near the trailing edge 
curves upward but then back downward at the trailing edge. The top line where 
it meets the bottom is below the chord line not on the chord line. It looks as 
though Dr Whittcomb had the downward thrust of air creates the lift theory 
going here. I think the Glassair aircraft used this airfoil but could have been 
the GAW 1, I don't remember for sure now.

It's possible that the belly boards on planes KRs especially in this 
conversation are throwing, pushing, forcing air downward which is creating 
additional lift then the turbulence is creating drag and a vacuum on the back 
side of the belly board to help slow the plane while lifting it a little.

This is my theory and I'm sticking to it tonight. I may have a new theory 
tomorrow!!LOL

Larry Howell

KR> gluing foam

[Larry H]

I forgot to mention taking a dremel with an abrasive blade, cut around the 
wood, delaminated glass off of the foam, then you will have narrow strips of 
glass to delaminated off of the wood. For example a two and half inch wide 
strip off the spar caps.

Larry H



> On Sep 6, 2014, at 9:19 AM, peter via KRnet  wrote:
> 
> Larry; I have to strip polyester/glass from wood/foam where the bonding is 
> failing. Does heat help? Anything you can suggest? I'll replace the laminate 
> with epoxy/glass. Thanks, Peter
> 
> 
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KR> gluing foam

[Larry H]

You can try a safe place with heat and see. To get hot enough to help will 
probably damage foam or? In the area. Best to attempt to delaminated off 
without tearing out any wood. Nasty sanding off the wood will be an option. If 
urethane foam was used the glass cloth will easily delaminated/tear off of that.

Larry H



> On Sep 6, 2014, at 9:19 AM, peter via KRnet  wrote:
> 
> Larry; I have to strip polyester/glass from wood/foam where the bonding is 
> failing. Does heat help? Anything you can suggest? I'll replace the laminate 
> with epoxy/glass. Thanks, Peter
> 
> 
> ___
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KR> Gathering 2015/Tripple Tree Fly In

[Larry H]

Larry H



>  "Teate, Stephen wrote:
> 
> You obviously didn't see my touch and goes last weekend at KLUD!
> 
> That airport designation sounds like a place to make perfect landings!
   "KLUD" or K-Lud
> 
> 
> 
> The information in this email is confidential and may be legally privileged. 
> If you are not an intended recipient, you should delete this message. 
> Access to this email by anyone else is unauthorized, and any disclosure, 
> copying, distribution or action taken or omitted in reliance on it is 
> prohibited 
> and may be unlawful. 
> 
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KR> Colin Hales World Tour

[Larry H]

You are welcome Mike.

I have sent several more photos to Mark Langford. I think he is going to post 
them on his website. 

I had left my good camera at our campsite because of rain earlier or the threat 
of rain so I was using my iPhone for photos. I had filled the remaining space 
on my iPhone with the first start of the Zenith One Week Wonder 750 I believe 
it was. By the way I helped build that plane as did my wife. We each pulled one 
rivet in one of the wings! Our names are written beside our rivets to prove it. 
Heehee
I met up with my wife as the Thunderbirds were doing their thing. She was 
heading back to camp after their performance, so I borrowed her telephone to 
take the photos of Colin's KR2 and other planes. After thinking about it I may 
now know why Colin didn't need my help. My wife's phone cover is Pink. Pink? I 
must be a confident male or a stupid man to be on a airport taking pictures of 
airplanes with a pink covered phone? Come to think of it after my visit with 
Colin I sat with a dignified gentleman from Australia for more than an hour 
watching planes depart from the convention. I also took a lot more photos with 
that pink phone but this is another story!

Colin had a rectangular auxiliary tank built sitting in his passenger seat. 
There was a little electric fuel pump mounted on top of it. His map was 
laminated in plastic I think or at least it looked like it to me. I asked him 
if he had any close calls of running low on fuel while over water. That's when 
he pulled out his map and started pointing to little islands and such where he 
flew to avoid too long distances over water. He continued his story I mentioned 
in the last post about places he didn't go to and places he did go to. When 
Mark posts the pictures of his map you can see his planned route and look at 
where his finger is pointing to see where he ended up going instead. Most of 
the cities were unknown to me. I wish I would have had a voice recorder going 
so I could give more details but it all just happened too quickly. I was just a 
typical pilot talking to another pilot about his plane and a little about his 
trip getting there.

Larry H



> On Aug 20, 2014, at 1:09 AM, Mike Stirewalt via KRnet  list.krnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Thanks for the great post and pictures!
> 
> Mike Stirewalt
> KSEE
> 
> 
> The #1 Worst Carb Ever?
> Click to Learn #1 Carb that Kills Your Blood Sugar Dont Eat 
> This!
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/53f43c07df1d63c0714c8st03vuc
> 
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KR> ADS-B Installation

[Larry H]

I may find that I am
misinformed but rumor at Oshkosh is that the FAA may help finance the upcoming 
equipment requirement. Someone else may have more information on this plan if 
it is true. 

Larry H



> On Aug 4, 2014, at 12:31 AM, Mike T via KRnet  wrote:
> 
> Could you please go into a little detail about what you had to install to
> set up for ADS-B and what it cost? As I mentioned earlier, the cost seemed
> so high I was thinking of going without an electrical system so I wouldn't
> have to install ADS-B Out (though maybe you mean you have "in" without
> "out").  But if it's getting more affordable, that would be great.
> 
> Mile Taglieri
> On Jul 26, 2014 7:05 PM, "Jeff Scott via KRnet" 
> wrote:
> 
>> Pardon me if this is a repeat email.  My email program is acting wonky
>> today...
>> 
>> I took the KR out again this morning for the express purpose of getting
>> some screen shots of the ADS-B traffic as displayed on the iFly 720.  I
>> took a number of shots and posted them on my web site along with some
>> explanations.
>> <http://jeffsplanes.com>.  We have some weather moving in tomorrow.  If I
>> get a chance, I'll grab some weather screen shots to post to my site
>> tomorrow.
>> 
>> -Jeff Scott
>> Los Alamos, NM
>> 
>> ___
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KR> OSH camping info

[Larry H]

I noticed a lot more people camping at the seaplane base this year. Word must 
be spreading, so the calm quiet may be ending one year soon !

Larry H



> PM, peter via KRnet wrote:
> 
> Camp at the seaplane base. Quiet and small, with a shuttle to all 

KR> KR Forum-gear placement

[Larry H]

All I know is that when my friend ordered the new trigear set from Diehl we 
were sent the one side taper one side straight set. I assumed they were all 
like that.
If I had a choice who wouldn't want the double taper!   LOL

Larry H



> On Jul 10, 2014, at 2:23 PM, "Steve G. via KRnet"  
> wrote:
> 
> The TD version still has the straight leading edge and rear taper. Tri gear 
> is tapered on both sides. 
> 
> Steve Glover
> 
> 

KR> FOAM THICKNESS

[Larry H.]

?

Pete and all, obviously many have used this type of foam over the years . It 
provides as a filler to form a shape just as does the rigid urethanes most have 
used for their wings. Yes urethanes sand fast and easy but again it too is 
easily delaminated as many have found out over the years. The klegicell foams 
are a many times superior foam for aircraft structures and was not available 
when Ken Rand designed the KR aircraft. He used what was available but now that 
we know of superior products why wouldn't we use them? 
I wish I could talk everyone in this group into purchasing one piece of 
klegicell type foam, do a one or two ply layer of bid on a 12" X 12" piece then 
do the same on the Home Depot blue or pink and the same on the green or tan 
urethane. Let them all cure for a day then get a hold of?a corner and see if 
you can take the cured cloth off.
The pink and blue will immediately delaminate and come off? easily as it will 
the green or tan urethane. You will not be able to take it off of the klegicell 
it is a tough more structural type foam. It is the same type of foam Dan Diehl 
used in his pre molded wing skins. Just try this, it will make you cry if your 
serious about long term airframes, especially wing skins. My friend that found 
the aluminum WAFs in his KR wings found them because his wing skins had 
delaminated from the green or tan urethane foam his wings had been built from. 
I didn't see it, he told me about it.
The Varieze? fuselage floor sidewalls and nose were made from the green 
urethane 2" thick foam sanded to shape with four spruce longerons? one in each 
of the four corners?lengthwise in the fuselage?like a KR and it has a aircraft 
grade?plywood firewall and?bulkhead which was the instrument panel but no other 
sticks Inbetween like a KR. The wings on Ezes are Dow styrofoam not expanded 
polystyrene. This type of Polystyrene is what white cheap ice chests are made 
from as is the same type in?sheets used in packaging for shipping,??most people 
call that styrofoam but its not.? Dow Styrofoam is much stronger and is what 
solid core wings are made of in?Rutan?canard?types of airplanes. It is easily 
hot wired to shape. 
The Longeze uses the klegicell foam for all structure floor?sidewalls seat 
backs, instrument panel, fuel cells?and the canard attach structure with 
certain numbers of layers of bid or uni on all of course. The solid core wings 
and winglets are made from Dow Styrofoam. I believe it is a extruded product 
but came in 8 or 10" thick billets. it has a tough outer skin on it when in 
this form. it used to be sold in 7 or 8" thick by 10 or 12" wide sawed out 
pieces without the extruded skins on them.

Pete you are probably fine for your canopy frame, most Eze canopy frames were 
made using the green or tan urethane because it sands easily. Rutan's designs 
relied upon a carefully designed layup schedule? of unidirectional and 
bidirectional cloths for strength but he switched to klegicell foams as soon as 
he found out about it over 30 years ago now Wow I'm getting old! If my 
memory serves me I believe klegicell was developed and manufactured in Sweden 
originally.
On canopy attach points like latches?you need to remove a small area of the 
foam, replace it with hard points made from high density klegicell, wood, or 
hard blocks made from multiple layers of bid cloth. All of these need to get 
floxed in place then glassed over by overlapping the surrounding already 
glassed area by at least one inch on all sides to form a structural connection. 
The ideal thing is to flox these hard points into the shaped foam before it is 
glassed in the beginning.
I don't think anyone is going to die but obviously if you were to have a high 
speed air penetration/delamination under a wing skin for example one could be 
in serious trouble quickly. We will pray that never happens.
Hope this helps

Larry Howell


Pete Klapp  wrote:

> Larry
> I did use some of the pink foam when constructing my canopy frame. While it 
> is not a structural component such as a control surface, do you think this 
> will be a problem? There are three to four layers of kr glass covering the 
> foam to create a box beam like member that the canopy was then glued to with 
> flox. Should I consider building a new frame or wait and watch to see if 
> there will be an issue?
> Pete Klapp
> 
>> 

KR> Surface temps & paint

[Larry H]

My company used to make prepreg parts. For any who don't know what I'm talking 
about. We purchased fiberglass cloth and carbon fiber uni cloth that already 
had epoxy resin in it. We could through testing determine how much resin we 
wanted in the cloth and order it that way. The percentage of resin to cloth as 
compared to wet hand layup is considerable. Much weight can be saved in the 
manufactured parts as compared to hand laid up. These rolls of prepreg cloth 
had to be kept refrigerated. If you did not the resins could melt/soften enough 
to stick together throughout the roll. If that happened then you were left with 
a log of glass or carbon. A very expensive mistake! 
We cured our parts above 225 degrees F. If we needed to soften a cured part 
(which we did occasionally) we had to raise the temperature above or hotter 
than the original curing temperature.
The point to this is the hotter you can cure your parts the better it will be 
for your wings for example sitting out in the hot summer. I say this because of 
a situation I saw many years ago at Oshkosh during the EAA Convention.
I was with a friend of mine from Anchorage Alaska during the afternoon air 
show. While sitting, standing, guarding his airplane from careless lookers/tire 
kickers he had stood up placed his elbows on top of his canard leaning over 
with his hands holding his head as we stood there watching the airshow. After a 
little while he turned to talk to me and moved his elbows. I was a couple feet 
to his left and two indentions were left in the top of his canard on his Rutan 
Defiant. I immediately knew what had happened. His plane or at least his canard 
had been built during the cooler temperatures in Alaska and then during that 
hot year in Wisconsin the temperatures had caused his wing skins to get hotter 
than they were originally cured so the resin began to soften. His plane was 
built with Safety Poxy which most Long Ezes and Defiants were built with up 
until the change to the new version of Safetypoxy.
A common practice that was used for post curing composite structures back in 
the day was to build a temporary wood structure over your work table and 
fiberglassed parts, cover the frame with black plastic, roll the table out into 
the sun. An option is to do the same thing but put a heater under the plastic 
if you are in cool temps or cant go outside with your table. This would cause 
the temps inside to get very hot like an oven which was good. Curing hotter 
than the finished painted product will see or reach later out in the elements 
is the goal in a 100% composite structure.
Wings are not as critical in a KR2 because it has wooden structure spars unlike 
a LongEze that has resin and S glass spars that you don't need or Want to 
soften. My company made prepreg carbon fiber tubular spars that went into the 
Quickie Q200 canards for one reason. The reason is as described above. Those 
little planes were all hand layup structures. When sitting out in the hot sun 
that canard wing was also the landing gear. There were cases when the hand laid 
up resins softened just enough while holding the 0-200 Continental, fuselage, 
fuel etc that they sagged down enough to cause major problems. That was when we 
were asked to remedy the problem with stiff carbon fiber spars for them.
Another thing I have seen happen on the S glass Eze landing gear is melting of 
the resins by the axle. This usually happens when a new Eze pilot spends too 
much time doing high speed taxi tests. The pilot has to use brake steering to 
drive or steer a Vari or Long Eze. Those brake disks get very hot when under 
high speed stops then steering back to do it again. Get the picture? When the 
brake disk axle transfer enough heat to the fiberglass landing gear, the resin 
melts, the whole thing gives up and the outer end of axle goes up the end of 
the gear drops down or twists. I have seen two of these in my area. What a mess 
to attempt to repair.
Just my experience with this subject.


Larry Howell

KR> WHY? ALUMINUM WAFS?

[Larry H]

While at a fly in over the weekend I was talking to a fellow KR2 owner. Several 
years back he had purchased someone else's KR2. He did some work to it, I'm not 
sure what all he did. He did get it flying however. He flew it a few times and 
then noticed his wing skins were delaminating all over. (Crummy Green Foam)
He decided to take the wings off, take them home for a Major Overhaul. Guess 
what? Did you read the title? Yep, some idiot had used aluminum strips for the 
WAFs. I have seen a lot of wrong doings on KR2s over the years like aluminum 
screen door turnbuckles for flight controls. I have no idea what is wrong with 
some people and their airplane building practices. If any of you reading this 
want to risk killing yourself then have at it but don't sell your kiddy 
playground crap to someone else pretending its a real airplane. Every time I 
mention KR2s to pilots at air shows I usually get snickers from them because 
they have seen the junky crap like this.

Larry H

KR> release agent

[Larry H]

I guess a guy can use whatever trick he desires but typically in a production 
Facility the mold is waxed multiple times as a safety barrier first, then PVA 
is sprayed over the top of the wax every time you prepare the mold for making a 
new part in the same mold. If you are just going to make a very few parts then 
just use whatever technique you desire as long as the epoxy doesn't stick to 
your mold. I have used many gallons of PVA over the years mostly many years 
ago. Water will wash or melt it off of any parts you may get it on. Easy to 
use. It is almost clear in color and almost seems like water. Use a small cheap 
paint spray gun that can be purchased at harbor freight, lowes lumber, Home 
Depot etc. spray a wet coat on your waxed mold, let it dry for a few minutes 
and spray another or several coats for mental insurance. Once it is dry, get 
after making your parts. If you were using polyester resin and going to make a 
boat for example, the next step after PVA would be to spray on a thick coat of 
gel coat which basically is polyester resin that is colored white or whatever 
color the outside color of your boat hull will be, next would be wetted out 
cloth to form the hull structure. Then cross bracing bulkheads etc. Screw down 
a floor, upholster side walls, bolt down your lawn chair, add your old riding 
mower steering wheel, steal your neighbors boat motor? Mount it go pull your 
wife on water skies! Hey easy wasn't it?? Just hurry summer will be over before 
you know it.

Larry H



 Jeff Lange wrote:

> Brian, 
> 
> I supposed you could do it that way but the PVA would come off with the 
> finished part. I waxed on top of it and the final part was easily removed 
> with the PVA remaining attached to the plug. 
> 
> Jeff Lange
> Race 64 - Skye Racer
> Blog: http://schmleff.blogspot.com
> Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/schmleff
> 
> brian wrote:
> 
>> You are supposed to wax and then PVA.
>> 
>>  Original Message 
>> Subject: Re: KR> release agent
>> 
>> 
>> Mike,
>> 
>> Having used all sorts of things as mold release (and having just made
>> a new nose bowl for my cowl), I have found polyvinyl alcohol (PVA) to
>> be very easy. Its basically a sprayable rubber. Spray on a few coats
>> as you would paint, wax it three times and nothing will stick to 

KR> torque wrenches

[Larry H.]

I recommend having your torque wrench certified before a major project. If you 
do this then you usually can believe what it says. I like to take the tension 
off of mine when I am finished using one of them.
JMHO
Larry H.



Believing a torque wrench can have some serious consequences .
i just believed one and set head torque on an engine to find i had over torqued 
it .
phill

KR> PHOTOS FROM GATHERING?

[Larry H.]

Bob, thank you for the photos, really great to see everyone. Marc Baca thank 
you for the video it was great to see as well.
I sure missed seeing all of you guys but I did get to see some of you at 
Oshkosh. I hate good times missed but I will be there next year.
Larry H.


Larry H asked:

<< Has anyone posted any photos anywhere? >>

The photos I took are on the KRGathering.org site in the 2011 gallery.

You can click on any thumbnail photo to see the full sized image.

The direct link is:

http://krgathering.org/gathering2011.htm

Regards,


Bob Lee
N52BL  KR2
Suwanee, GA  USA
92% done only 67% to go! 

KR> KRs AT GATHERING

[Larry H.]

I just checked the GATHERING Pre Registration page at   http://krgathering.org/ 
  
 
16 KR Airplanes with their pilots have signed up to come this year and show us 
KR wanabeez how to!
Make your plans to come and see.
 
Larry H.

KR> KR2S Progress report.

[Larry H.]

Mike, as hot as it has been here in Texas, if you were to drag your pile of 
sticks outside you wouldn't need any matches, the whole pile would go off with 
spontaneous combustion. If you changed your mind at the last minute, that being 
two minutes after you drug it outside, then you would need a fire truck QUICK!
Keep up the good work and don't drag it outside until you are ready to mount 
the wings and fly the sucker!
Larry H.

From: MICHAEL SYLVESTER <shagste...@hotmail.com>
To: KRNET <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2011 7:25 PM
Subject: KR> KR2S Progress report.


I just want to catch you guys up on what I've been doing in the KR2S category. 
The wings are finally  completed, after having to rebuild a twisted aileron. I 
even have the gap covers made. This is a huge milestone for me. I know you 
haven't heard a lot from me lately but rest assured, I've been doing a little 
something almost every night. I also check the net every evening to see what 
everyone else is doing and I'm a little concerned that a lot of the people who 
were building seem to have faded away. I can see why, there has been times when 
I wanted to drag this thing outside and set fire to it. Fortunately I can never 
seem to find matches when I need them. LOL. Anyway guys, keep pushing through 
the tough spots and if I can help anyone, just call.  

Mike Sylvester 
kr2s builder 
Birmingham,AL.

Cell no.205-966-3854                         
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KR> Re: Exfoliation and trim tabs

[Larry H.]

Several years ago it was discovered on VariEzes that the aluminum wing attach 
fittings had corrosion like this and some of the aluminum canard elevator 
torque 
tubes in Longezes and Variezes had a corrosion problem. The highly recommended 
solution was to have these aluminum parts anodized before installation to help 
prevent this problem.
Take note that most of the problems were with airplanes that had been built and 
spent most of their lives in coastal places like Florida, near sea shores where 
salty air can be a problem for aluminum and especially aluminum airplanes.
Ever since I have been in the airplane owning game, all the old guys that 
taught 
me always warned me to not purchase any airplanes that had spent time in 
coastal 
areas. Might be an old wives tale but it makes sense to me so I have always 
followed that advice.
Larry Howell

KR> Peel Ply / Slurry

[Larry H.]

Pat Russo wrote

 I generally use Styrofoam, (blueboard),
applying a wet resin layer, then a slurry layer followed by fabric and
stippling ending with a squeegeeing of excess resin

The whole idea of using slurry is to make the piece you are building weigh 
less. 
The glass balls (microspheres) take up space and weigh less than pure resin. 
The 
idea in the old days was for this mixture of  resin and microspheres (slurry) 
to 
be as thick with microspheres as you could spread without tearing up the foam 
you were covering. The more microspheres that is added to resin the thicker it 
gets and the mixture weighs less but the slurry mixture can reach a point of 
being so thick that spreading it is almost impossible without tearing up your 
nicely sanded foam surface. The idea is to add as much microspheres as you can 
to the resin but still be able to spread it onto your foam without tearing up 
your foam of course! This mixture was developed to penetrate the pores of rigid 
urethane foam which is very porous and later the klegicel foams that are 
now used, thus less weight parts as compared to parts made with pure 
resin filling the pores of the foam.

Step one should be the slurry mixture on the foam (if you use pure resin first 
you are filling the pores of the foam and making the part heavier)
Step two add your cloth of choice 
Step three add only as much resin as it takes to wet out the cloth of choice. 
Any extra resin only makes the part heavier not stronger.

If you are using insulation foam that has a nonporous solid surface, I would 
not 
recommend that foam but I am not totally sure what good the slurry is doing if 
it is nonporous foam.
Just my opinion.
Larry H.



 

KR> JACK COX PAST EAA EDITOR

[Larry H.]

I was contacted yesterday by Marie Brock. She told me that Jack Cox has died 
from complications after being hospitalized.
I have had a lot of contact with him in years past. Jack was a caring nice 
human 
being, I enjoyed our conversations over the years and appreciated him checking 
on me and a friend daily after an accident during Oshkosh in the 1980s. He will 
be missed by me and many others.
For any who don't know, Jack and Golda were the editors of the EAA Magazine for 
30 years or more. They researched and wrote many of the articles that appeared 
in the magazine over those years.
God Bless Jack and Golda his wife.

Larry Howell

KR> 14.7 AFR gauges

[Larry H.]

Mark L.

If you were going to have only one EGT probe on a Corvair engine, which 
cylinder 
would be the most beneficial to place it on? I still have some of the one cyl 
EGTs and see some for sale occasionally really cheap.
When I first started flying in 1969 (dinosaur days) most private planes did not 
have EGTs, just the cool guys were starting to have them and then usually only 
one probe/cylinder EGTs. Alcor was the best at the time and then later 
developed 
the first multi cyl EGTs that I remember. Those gages had one needle readout 
and 
a dial to switch to 4 different probes/cylinders. The pilot could only see a 
readout on one cylinder at a time, dial, see cyl #1, dial see cyl #2 etc. If 
you 
developed a problem on a cylinder that you weren't switched to then you missed 
it, unless something bad happened of course. Things have changed dramatically 
since those days thank goodness.
Larry H.

KR> wings

[Larry H.]

This technique could easily be used for a KR wing but most of us picked the KR 
design for a reason. Maybe it was to build it sorta similar to a KR!    ; )

In making my statement below more clear: The  Wittman Tailwind ribs are regular 
old style made up ribs from strips of wood, you know, the truss type. The 
strips 
are 1/2" wide by 1/4" thick.
The main and rear spars are solid spruce, the ribs are made with a slot for 
slipping onto the spars. They are spaced accordingly and glued into place. Then 
pieces of wood the width of the spars are glued on top of the spar caps as 
spacers between the ribs and aligns with the surface of the ribs. This is done 
so the plywood wing skins can be glued to the entire top surface of the spar 
and 
extra wide rib surfaces.
One more thing to answer the one question someone had. I would definitely not 
attempt to glue plywood to urethane foam ribs, as usually used in the wings of 
a 
KR. Most of you have discovered or will discover that urethane foam has almost 
no tensile strength. Plywood would pull away from urethane foam in a blink of 
an 
eye in that case.

Larry H.






The Wittman Tailwind wings were originally built with wooden ribs, covered with 
aircraft grade plywood and then covered with the old fabric and dope technique. 
Now most people cover the plywood with a light layer of fiberglass and use 
epoxy 

resin as the glue and stiffener for the glass cloth. Most in the Tailwind 
community now use the West Epoxy System for this purpose. As most of you know 
West System was originally developed for the boating industry. It was developed 
specifically to adhere glass cloth and wood together or for wood to wood in 
boats.
Most of us in the KR community use T88 Epoxy for gluing our wooden structures 
together as does many in the Tailwind community. There are some in the Tailwind 
community of builders who use the West System for gluing all their ribs 
together, gluing ribs to the spars, gluing the plywood to the ribs and for 
gluing the fiberglass cloth onto the outside of the plywood wing surfaces.
Wooden wings are great, metal wings are great, the way we make our wings is 
just 

great as well. All of these techniques work as long as they are built properly.

Larry H.





I wonder if anyone has done a foam rib with ply skin attached directly to
the foam? Would that even work?



Fred Johnson
Reno, NV
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KR> wings

[Larry H.]

The Wittman Tailwind has a constant chord wing. The wooden ribs that slip onto 
the main spar are made from 1/2" wide strips of wood instead of a typical 
1/4" wide strips of wood so there is more gluing surface, rib to plywood. I 
personally would not want to glue wood skins to foam ribs unless the foam was 
PVC foam with a layer of glass on each side of the ribs and I am still not sure 
I would consider that technique. Well I might.
There was a fellow here in my area that purchased a Wittman Tailwind a few 
years 
ago that someone else had started. The wings were already supposedly finished 
and closed. This fellow finished the airplane, it was beautiful. I think he had 
made more than one flight, anyway just after takeoff on his last flight one or 
both of his wing/s came apart and of course this guy was instantly killed. The 
investigation revealed that the ribs were not glued together properly or glued 
to the spars. I can't remember if the ribs were glued to the plywood or just 
tacked down. My point is be careful with someones craftsmanship that you don't 
know or are unable to inspect.

The Wittman Tailwind wings were originally built with wooden ribs, covered with 
aircraft grade plywood and then covered with the old fabric and dope technique. 
Now most people cover the plywood with a light layer of fiberglass and use 
epoxy 
resin as the glue and stiffener for the glass cloth. Most in the Tailwind 
community now use the West Epoxy System for this purpose. As most of you know 
West System was originally developed for the boating industry. It was developed 
specifically to adhere glass cloth and wood together or for wood to wood in 
boats.
Most of us in the KR community use T88 Epoxy for gluing our wooden structures 
together as does many in the Tailwind community. There are some in the Tailwind 
community of builders who use the West System for gluing all their ribs 
together, gluing ribs to the spars, gluing the plywood to the ribs and for 
gluing the fiberglass cloth onto the outside of the plywood wing surfaces.
Wooden wings are great, metal wings are great, the way we make our wings is 
just 
great as well. All of these techniques work as long as they are built properly.

Larry H.





I wonder if anyone has done a foam rib with ply skin attached directly to
the foam? Would that even work?



Fred Johnson
Reno, NV

KR> KR-2 project for sale skin removal

[Larry H.]

 KR-2 project for sale skin removal


One way to remove the skins while leaving the skeleton ready for new skins 
might 
be to use a router. Set the cutting blade the depth of the skin and get a blade 
for the router the width of the skeleton sticks.
Rout down the skins over the skeleton sticks, unless you intend to re-use the 
skins. If so then forget this idea!
Just a thought ?
Larry H.

KR> KR-2 project for sale skin removal

[Larry H.]

One way to remove the skins while leaving the skeleton ready for new skins 
might 
be to use a router. Set the cutting blade the depth of the skin and get a blade 
for the router the width of the skeleton sticks.
Rout down the skins over the skeleton sticks, unless you intend to re-use the 
skins. If so then forget this idea!
Just a thought ?
Larry H.

KR> Here's something to ponder

[Larry H.]

From: Craig Williams kr2seaf...@yahoo.com


Not sure if the aerodynamics would be the same but if you have seen the baggage 
pods on LongEzes (Rutan design pusher) there is very little if any airspeed 
difference while using them to carry extra baggage. These pods are attached 
with 
a few screws, fairly easy to take off or install after initial installation.
Maybe your on to something, engine quits, need to crash land, eject the pods 
before touchdown, maybe at least get rid of a possible fire! There's a wild 
idea 
for you!! LOL

Larry H.
  

More crazy ideas from the Sea Fury guy.  I got a million of them.  LOL
I hav

Soo, what about using drop tanks on my 
Seafury. Craig
www.kr2seafury.com


Craig, I hope I am not on the ground in your flight path when you decide to 
drop 
your drop tanks!   ;-) LOL

KR> (no subject)

[Larry H.]

KR2 still in the unopened original box. It needs an engine. Asking $ 2,500.00 
Mrs Robert W Bargo. 1125 Yearsly Drive, Dover, DE 19902 (302) 674-2437

I saw this ad in a local eaa chapter newsletter. Thought someone might be 
interested.
Larry H.

KR> aileron linkage

[Larry H.]

I have seen a couple of KRs where this linkage (the rod) was bent to accomodate 
the proper angle for that plane. I am not saying that this is the best thing to 
do, just saying that I have seen that done before.
I am not sure if it matters, but I don't think I would bend mine unless it was 
absolutely necessary. Mark is right, usually this linkage is about 6 inches 
long 
on a plans built system.
Larry H.





From: Mark Langford n5...@hiwaay.net


Since the rod was aluminum, it might have been 1/4-28 threads, now that I 
think about it.  Somebody's probably got a pair of these somewhere...

Mark Langford
n5...@hiwaay.net
website www.n56ml.com

KR> Vinyl Ester

[Larry H.]

What canard guys are you talking about? Not the eze and cozy boys!
Larry H.



From: Tim t...@telus.net

Subject: Re: KR> Vinyl Ester

They must, Canard guy's been suing it in their fuel cells, for 
decades

CldLk-tim

KR> KR2 ARTICLE-KITPLANES NOV 2010

[Larry H.]

From: Michael Taglieri 


Mike,
I am not sure anyone on this list is concerned about the wing attach fittings 
and bolts, we know better. I think what some are aggrevated about is the 
mis-information or mis-representation about the wings in general. The writer 
should have done more research on that subject before he just threw that out 
there. A lot of builders spend a lot of money building KR2s then when 
mis-information is put out there from a writer/test pilot, many will assume he 
knows what he is talking about. This mis-information may then turn some away 
from buying a used KR or it may cause them to just build a different airplane 
because they are afraid their wings will fall off if they were to build a KR. 
All of this makes the KR line less valuable. I think this is the issue, or at 
least it is with me, any KR owner and anyone like Steve Glover who probably has 
a big investment into the KRs now. 
This is my impression on the article, or at least would be my thinking if I 
were 
to be looking at building a KR and I did not know the history or anything about 
them other than I liked the look and the option of non kit ability to build. 
Remember the V-tail Bonanza? Many are still afraid of those. I own a 1947 
Bonanza, it is a V-tail. There has never been a tail failure on one of these 
because it has a smaller tail than the 3 or 4 year newer Bonanzas that have a 
larger V-tail. The newer Bonanzas have lost tails because of pilot error. A 
repair on the leading edge root/fuselage intersection was required to fix this 
problem. But since it is in the head of some people that the tails fall off of 
Bonanzas they will never have one. The same could apply to any aircraft once 
someone throws the scare out in an article such as this one.

Just my calm thoughtful opinion
Larry Howell   I think people may be getting too concerned about that line 
about the 

wing-attack bolts.  On the whole, the article was VERY favorable, 
Mike Taglieri  miket_...@verizon.net

KR> KR2 Kitplanes Article

[Larry H.]

I almost forgot to mention that there is also a short article about Steve 
Glover 
and his company nVAero http://www.nvaero.com/  that supplies parts for the KR 
series inserted into the KR2 article that is in Nov 2010 Kitplanes.

Larry H.

KR> KR2 ARTICLE-KITPLANES NOV 2010

[Larry H.]

There is an article written by Bob Grimstead about KR2s and specifically about 
one he flew that is owned and built by Allen Buzza. The article is a little 
bland, as far as building excitement for the KR series in my opinion. This 
airplane has the original retract landing gear. It looks pretty good in the 
photos that accompany the article.
He did mention that there was some sort of problem with wing attach fittings 
and 
bolts. His exact words are as follows:  "The KR2's outer wing panels detach, 
leaving a short center section (out to just past the main gear legs) integral 
with the fuselage. The wing bolts and attach plates can be problem areas, and 
the originally specified bolts were not truly big enough, so it pays to be 
careful here".
I had no idea that the bolts specified for the wing attachments were 
insufficient, maybe that was before my plans which I purchased around 1979 or 
80 
or maybe this fellow is misinformed. Fair and balanced, you decide!

Larry H.

KR> Interval between the bolts of the hinges belong to aileron

[Larry H.]

About an hour! just kidding.
Better ask that question one more time!
Larry H.





From: Dubi Gefen <dub...@maanit.org.il>
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Sun, September 5, 2010 2:23:01 PM
Subject: KR> Interval between the bolts of the hinges belong to aileron

Hello Kr-forum



What is the interval between the bolts which connecting the hinges to the
wing in one side and the aileron in the other side?



Regards Dubi Gefen

KR2s 4X-OLD Builder

+972-54-4921263

dub...@maanit.org.il

http://www.dubigefen.50megs.com <http://www.dubigefen.50megs.com/> 










This mail was sent via Mail-SeCure System.


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KR> Tachometer probelm

[Larry H.]

I agree with Larry, look out the window! or go to the Auto Parts Store (Auto 
Zone) NAPA (National Airplane Parts America) and get a cheap tach for the 
Gathering!
Larry H.





From: Larry Flesner fles...@verizon.net

At 01:04 PM 9/5/2010, you wrote:
>. My Gathering curse is determined
>again this year to keep my KR from being there. I doubt my broken 
>foot heals in
>time for me to fly but a fellow KR pilot and friend will get it 
>there if we can
>get it put right in time. Very anxious for your help.
++


Check around the airport to see if someone has one of the little hand 
held digital tach's and use that for the Gathering.  The other option 
is look out the window and see if the propeller is spinning. :-)

Larry Flesner


___

KR> Re: KRnet Digest, Vol 352, Issue 241

[Larry H.]

>> It's hard to out lie the guy next to you when you're stone cold sober.

John wrote:

As my wife once said "If you are going to lie, at  least get your facts 
straight!"


John Milland  (Arizona)

___
The facts and truth are easy to remember. It is said that you can not remember 
a 
lie because it is like a dream. 

The one good thing about liars is, their stories never get redundant! LOL
Larry H.

KR> YouTube - R22-12 year old training

[Larry H.]

Great Dave! we need more young blood in aviation. You should be proud.
Larry H.





From: Dave Dunwoodie ddunw...@fnwusers.com





 
Seriously OFF TOPIC, but I thought everybody would enjoy this.  The 
video is of my 12 year old granddaughter learning to fly helicopters.

 now she has to master a tail-dragger KR2!!

The video was made at E66 and 65G, where we will have the fly-in the 
weekend after Labor Day.

Dave.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5H3JtVcMRE

KR> Sunday Morning Flight

[Larry H.]

Some states have Bow Hunting season
Some states have Muzzle Load Season
Some states have Rifle season
Some states have KR season.
Is it KR season in Wisconsin yet?   ; )

Larry H.





From: Mark Jones flyk...@charter.net

I woke up to a beautiful clear day this past Sunday morning. At 6:30 am I was 
pulling my Deer Slayer KR out of the hanger.

KR> UP-COMING KR GATHERING

[Larry H.]

OK Mr Jones, how many days until the Gathering? Whats the scoop?

Go to this link to sign up for some fun!
http://krgathering.org/

Larry H.

KR> GATHERING & Whatever happened to videoBob?

[Larry H.]

I am one of the guys who had decided to miss the Gathering this year for 
several 
reasons. After reading Mark's post with Video Bob's description of his life 
since last fall I decided that I will be coming to the Gathering after all. We 
are all getting older and never know when our last time to see one another or 
attend a get together will be. I decided that while capable I had better get 
myself there. Trust me, I have plenty of reasons to stay at home like all of 
you 
who have decided not to attend but maybe some of you can re-think that and come 
on anyway. This thing is only once per year and the host goes to a lot of pains 
to arrange the thing for everyone.
Think about it, lots of friends, lots of fun, lots to learn and KR aircraft to 
see and touch. Please come and be a participant!
Larry H.

 




From: Mark Langford n5...@hiwaay.net
 Whatever happened to videoBob?

The Gathering is coming up soon, and it's inevitable that somebody will ask 
about videos of the Gathering, maybe if videos of past Gatherings were 
available yet, and eventually, "whatever happened to Video Bob"?.  He 
answers that below.  It reminds me of something William Wynne says often, 
"every day that passes, you're one day closer to losing your medical".  Bob 
is one of those guys with infectious good humour...he's always smiling, has 
something positive to say, and is happy to see you.  Let's keep Bob in mind 
at the Gathering this year, and we'll expect him at MVN (or wherever) next 
year...

From: "Bob Vermeulen" <omega...@att.net>


> Hi Mark,
>
> It's been a long time since I've seen you or been able to talk with you. 
> Once again I won't be able to make it to Oshkosh or to the Gathering.  I 
> know I'm going to miss a lot of good things and not see a lot of my old 
> friends.  Sorry about that.  I still get the KRNet digest and usually read 
> it everyday.  So now to bring you up to date.  As you may know several 
> years ago I sold my KR project to Keith Crawford.  I loved that project, 
> but when Sport Pilot came on the scene, I realized that it might be a good 
> way for me to go.  I mean, my blood pressure was going up and I realized 
> that passing a physical may not always be something automatic for me. 
> Anyway I built a MiniMax.  Put a Citroen engine in it, flew it and loved 
> it.  A couple of years ago I also bought a Kolb MK III that had been 
> balled up in a hard landing and rebuilt it. It turned out real nice and I 
> was very proud of it.  Nice plane.  My business thrived over the past ten 
> years.  I normally worked 70 to 80 hours a week.  Work was nuts!!  Anyway 
> I turned 62 at the end of November 2009.  My plan was to retire (or 
> seriously cut back my business) on December 1, 2009.  I figured this would 
> give me more time to do what I wanted to do.  Flying low and slow. 
> Getting to Osh, Sun n' fun and the KR Gathering.  Retirement was something 
> I was looking forward to.  I worked hard for it and I was READY.
>
> Dec 3rd was a good day, but in the evening I became sick.  Serious 
> throwing up and sharp pain in my stomach.  I had had the sharp pain in my 
> stomach all last summer and while I mostly grounded my flying activity, I 
> didn't let it slow me down.  My doc thought I probably had a hiatal 
> hernia.  Made sense to me.  I deserved ulcers and anything else that might 
> come along.  I also had high blood pressure.  It was out of control. 
> Anyway around midnight on Dec.3 My wife dragged me to the Emergency Room. 
> They rolled me in as I argued with them about what was happening.  To me 
> it was a hiatal hernia.  The docs at the Heart Center said I was having a 
> very serious heart attack.  I don't remember too much after that.  In the 
> days that followed, the doctors told me I had a 100 percent blockage of 
> the LAD (Lateral anterior descending artery)  This one is also known as 
> the "widow maker".  He informed me that he had never had anybody survive a 
> 100 percent blockage of the LAD.  He worked on me till he got two stents 
> in the artery.  Open heart "bypass" surgery was out of the question 
> because of the weakened heart.  They took good care of me and I am 
> greatful to all the docs and to God for saving my life.  Well, after a 
> weeks stay in the hospital they finally let me go home.  I worked the next 
> day to tie up a few loose odds and ends.  My business associate suggested 
> that I didn't look too good and that maybe I should go home.  I went home. 
> Can't be too cautious can we.  A few hours later  I'm kicked back in my 
> LazyBoy  and I am having a strange sensation.  I see my hands and my feet, 
> but I don't know who they belong too.  I felt like I was outside of my 
> body.  STRANGE.  Hard to explain.  Sharon (my wife)

KR> forward sweep

[Larry H.]

Mooneys don't have forward swept wings, they have forward swept trailing edges 
on the main wing and the horizontal tail and both have straight leading edges , 
except the Mooneys inboard first 3 feet are tapered rearward, then outboard of 
that they are straight perpendicular to the fuselage centerline.
Mooneys are very stable.
Larry Howell







Then I guess every Mooney out there must be terribly unstable

Bill Zorc
Vero Beach, FL
RV-8 N2046F

KR> FORWARD SWEEP OR CONSTANT CHORD WING

[Larry H.]

I talked to a hot shot NASA Aeronautical Engineer some years back who had been 
involved heavily in studying and testing different wing shapes on real 
airplanes. He said if your airplane design would not exceed 250 miles per hour 
that tapering a wing might look cool but it gained you absolutely nothing. He 
said you may as well make it easy on yourself and build a CONSTANT CHORD WING 
AIRPLANE. While we can dream and wish, guys like him actually had our tax 
dollars and lots of people on their teams to actually go and do this testing.
I know why all the early models if not all Vans aircraft models have a 
rectangular constant chord wing, easy to make parts!

He also talked about drag in the engine compartment. I do not remember the 
percentage now but the largest drag on a piston powered airplane, probably all 
others as well is in the engine compartment. Figure out a way to move the 
engine 
cooling air through the engine compartment less draggy and more efficiently and 
you will use less fuel for same speed or go faster.

Larry Howell

KR> Polyester fuel tanks

[Larry H.]

If you want to take a look at the link below, it is at Bass Pro Shops. You may 
or may not know that they have a lot of hunting, fishing and boating things. 
One 
of my friends just purchased one of these fuel tanks to put in the back of his 
small pickup for extended trips. His truck has a fiberglass top over the back 
so 
the sun will not affect it, not sure that it would have anyway. Also do a 
search, there are many places that sell tanks like these of all kinds of 
shapes. 
MOELLER is the manufacurer of these and as I said there are a lot of dealers 
for 
this company's tanks.

Look down the list of sizes and you may find a tank that suits your needs for a 
KR, these tanks are lite weight and very tough, his came with a fuel level 
sender, I have no idea whether they have baffles in them or not, I did not 
check, I guess a guy could add fire proof fuel tank foam as a baffle if they do 
not have baffles. An installation option for a smaller tank could be like a 
Wittman Tailwind. As most of you may know, the fuselage is made from steel 
tubing covered with fabric. They have a steel tube that runs across the 
fuselage 
just behind the instrument panel and of course one across the the top of the  
firewall. They use at least two wide straps covered on top with rubber between 
the strap and tank typically, the straps run front to rear under the fuel tank 
from the top firewall tube to the tube that crosses the fuselage just behind 
the 
instrument panel. Hope this makes sense. 


Just for further information on my friends tank installation in the back of his 
truck.
He installed a small electric pump he purchased from Spruce so he could flip a 
switch in his cab while traveling and pump fuel into his regular truck fuel 
tank 
(yes he is a pilot). He brazed a tube into the side of his filler neck below 
the 
plate that holds the spring loaded door for the fuel station pump nozzle so the 
fuel would just enter the tank where you normally put fuel in. He vented out 
the 
bottom under the truck bed.
When he tested it the first time he found that once he turned on the fuel tank 
and pumped some gas into the truck fuel tank inlet to test it while traveling 
down the road and then turned it off the siphon system took over and continued 
to siphon fuel through the electric pump out of his tank until it filled his 
tank and the fillerneck and put the brazed in entry tube in fuel. He is now 
looking for a fuel pump that will not let fuel pass when turned off.

The second thing that happened, his vent out of the auxilary tank caused his 
engine light to come on, so he has now T'd his auxilary tank vent line into the 
trucks factory vent line. That should fix the truck engine light problem but I 
guess we will see after he tests it. This may also fix his siphon problem but I 
really have not seen what he did so I have no idea. I may give a further report 
if anyone is interested.

Larry Howell


http://www.basspro.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10151_-1_10001_90762_225012001_22500_225012000?cmCat=CROSSSELL_SEARCH






From: Mike Taglieri 
To: KRnet 
Sent: Mon, July 5, 2010 8:11:15 PM
Subject: Re: KR> Update from the archives - Polyester fuel tanks

For the main tank, I've been wondering if the molded polyethylene tank used 
in the Sonex could be used in a KR, since it seems roughly the same size. 
Polyethylene is extremely durable, and is used in some dirt-bike gas tanks. 

KR> Update KR2S N1852Z

[Larry H.]

Rob,
Your airplane still looks great, happy it is going again, and I love the 
landing 
photo with the cattle in the background but the American Flag photo is really a 
good one.
Thanks for the update
Larry Howell





From: "robert7...@aol.com" robert7...@aol.com

 http://www.robert7721.com   if anyone is interested.  
 
Thought I'd send an update on my plane since I've made a few changes 
www.robert7721.com

KR> Air Filter

[Larry H.]

For sure Revmaster in California has those filters
Larry H




From: Randy Powell <randywpow...@verizon.net>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 7:47:12 PM
Subject: Re: KR> Air Filter

Can you send a picture and or dimensions of the air filter that you have ?. 
I may be able to help cross reference it to something that is easily 
available.  My email for sending pictures or info is as follows 
randywpow...@verizon.net

- Original Message - 
From: "Lee Van Dyke" <l...@vandyke5.com>
To: "KRnet" <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Friday, July 02, 2010 3:13 PM
Subject: Re: KR> Air Filter


> Checker auto, auto zone,or a vw shop
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jun 30, 2010, at 2:33 PM, Dave Dunwoodie <ddunw...@fnwusers.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Time for a new air filter and I can't find it anywhere.  It is for the
>> Revmaster 2100 with ram air.  Hose clamp at each end.
>>
>> Can anybody help?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Dave.
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp
>> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
>> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
>>
>
> ___
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> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html






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KR> New airplane build

[Larry H.]

Thanks for the update, now we know what to expect at the Gathering Dana, a 
whatchamacallit by Dana ! like the rest of ours  LOL
Larry Howell





From: Dana Overall <bo12...@hotmail.com>
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Mon, June 28, 2010 10:24:26 AM
Subject: KR> New airplane build


> Date: Mon, 28 Jun 2010 06:22:39 -0700
> From: 
lah...@yahoo.com

> Dana,
> Which airplane are you 
building now? or is it a secret?
> Larry H.

Larry, how bout it's a KR variant but different, a little longer, a little 
wider 
a bigger engine.just kinda a little bigger to meet my needs.  The good 
thing 
about building my KR and then my RV-7 is I have a pretty good idea of what I 
want.now:-)  Let the intrigue begin:-).heck, it should be pretty 
obvious I enjoy the build process.

Dana Overall 

1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host
Richmond, KY i39

RV-7 slider "Black Magic" 
Flying..well sorta, useta, kinda
Barrett Precision O 360 A1A
Hartzell C2YR-1BFP/F7497-2 
http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackmagic.jpg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMi05-WU2D0#GU5U2spHI_4
http://rvflying.tripod.com

do not archive 





                        
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KR> A Ride To The KR Thing Of Dana's

[Larry H.]

Dana,
Which airplane are you building now? or is it a secret?
Larry H.





From: Dana Overall bo12...@hotmail.com



BTW, I should have some progress to show at the gathering of my new airplane 
build...

Dana Overall 

KR> JONES

[Larry H.]

Happy to hear you are able to fly and make it to Oshkosh, sad to know you dread 
and have to check into the repair shop !

Larry H.





From: Mark Jones <flyk...@charter.net>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Mon, June 28, 2010 8:01:19 AM
Subject: Re: KR> JONES

>Mark Jones, what is the update on your health and ability to fly soon? Hope 
>you
>are doing well.

>Larry Howell

Thanks for asking Larry. I had the MRI done last week and the results are 
simply that I have a badly torn rotor cuff in my left shoulder which 
requires surgery to repair. I had rotor cuff surgery a year and a half ago 
on my right shoulder and I am dreading having to go through this type 
surgery again. I have flown only twice since I injured my shoulder back on 
June 3rd. The problem is having to push up with my left arm to exit the KR. 
Too bad we don't have side doors for handicapped and old folks to easily get 
in and out of a KR. I have not scheduled the surgery yet but my doctor says 
the sooner we get it done the better off I will be. I am thinking the first 
week in August so I can go to Oshkosh and hopefully will be recovered enough 
to fly to the Gathering.

Mark Jones (N886MJ)
Stevens Point, WI
E-mail: flyk...@charter.net
Web: www.flykr2s.com

- Original Message - 
From: "Larry H." <lah...@yahoo.com>
To: "KRNET" <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 11:19 PM
Subject: KR> BATTERY RESTORE EQUIPMENT/ JONES


Some months or years back, someone mentioned a battery charger/restore type
gizmo. I think it would restore a shorted out battery or revive a battery 
that
would normally be traded in. Anyone have info on such a gadget or remember 
when
it was talked about. I looked in the archives but did not find anything so 
far.

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KR> Firewall Stainless and Insulation

[Larry H.]

Hi Dan,

Have not tried the method listed at the bottom but:

On the LONGEZE we were to use Fiberfrax on the firewall covered over with Type 
301 or 302  .016 Stainless Steel Sheet

Larry Howell

 




From: Dan Heath da...@windstream.net


Has anyone used this method?  It looks good to me for getting the mount
directly on the firewall, but I imagine that the stainless would be terribly
deformed.  The engine on the Black Bird, and the one on the Little Beast,
were mounted on top of all the layers as I had never given any thought to
the issues that may bring about.

KR> don't give up.

[Larry H.]

I hope you are paying more attention to your aircraft plans than you did in 
history class !! LOL
Larry Howell







Hey Guys, I've been down in the airplane factory(basement) working on my 
project 
and I realized that three years has gone by. Even though every day brings me 
closer to completion, sometimes I wonder why I ever started this project. 
That's 
when I have to give myself a little pep talk for inspiration
We can't be quitters if we're ever going to see these planes fly.  Did we 
Americans quit after the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor ? Did General Patton quit 
at Little Big Horn ? Did Abraham Lincoln quit after crossing the Delaware ? I 
think not. My point is, Reach down, Grab another gear and let's push on.  
Anything that I can do for anyone that needs a little help, just call.        
Mike Sylvester 

kr2s builder
Birmingham,AL.

Cell no.205-966-3854

                        
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KR> BATTERY RESTORE EQUIPMENT/ JONES

[Larry H.]

This could be what was mentioned and what I am looking for.

http://www.siliconchip.com.au/cms/A_104827/article.html

Larry Howell

KR> BATTERY RESTORE EQUIPMENT/ JONES

[Larry H.]

Some months or years back, someone mentioned a battery charger/restore type 
gizmo. I think it would restore a shorted out battery or revive a battery that 
would normally be traded in. Anyone have info on such a gadget or remember when 
it was talked about. I looked in the archives but did not find anything so far.

Mark Jones, what is the update on your health and ability to fly soon? Hope you 
are doing well.

Larry Howell

KR> Engine Update / Roy's Fifth Bearing

[Larry H.]

Dear Mark,
You have shown all of us what persistence is, as EAA says, The Can Do Spirit. 
I, like you, think Roy has a real winner with his 5th bearing, machining and 
engine building skills. I hope you will be flying consistently for many years 
to come with no more engine distractions.
Larry H.





From: Mark Jones flyk...@charter.net


Mark Jones (N886MJ)
Stevens Point, WI
E-mail: flyk...@charter.net
Web: www.flykr2s.com

Ladies and Gents,
  Last evening was a beautiful time to go for a flight here in Wisconsin so I 
took to the air about 6 PM and climbed to 8,500' and played around on top of 
the clouds for an hour and a half. Being on top in a KR rates among the highest 
forms of entertainment in my play book. 

KR> fittings

[Larry H.]

Jeff Scott, our aircraft engine GURU emailed me with the below information, so 
forgive me if I mis informed anyone.
Thanks Jeff,
Larry Howell




Larry,

I believe you'll find the A.D. that you referenced to be for the prop control 
line, which requires steel fittings (not stainless), although the oil transfer 
line can be stainless. Aluminum and brass are not acceptable.  However the oil 
pressure in the prop control line from the prop governor can exceed 400 psi.  
Aluminum fittings are routinely used (and are the standard) on most oil lines 
like those to the oil cooler or oil filter.  Those lines should never exceed 
100 psi and typically run at 70 psi.  I doubt that the Corvairs run any more 
oil pressure than that, so an aluminum fitting should be perfectly acceptable.

Best regards,

Jeff Scott


-- Original Message --
From: "Larry H." <lah...@yahoo.com>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Subject: Re: KR> Beginning of Test Installation of the New Corvair Engine
List-Post: krnet@list.krnet.org
Date: Mon, 31 May 2010 16:19:16 -0700 (PDT)

Hi Dan,
The only thing I would suggest is?putting stainless steel fittings in the 5th 
bearing if it is not and in the oil filter adapter that the 5th bearing oil 
line is attached to. It may not be as critical on the Corvair engine as 
compared to a Lycoming. I know years ago ADs were issued on Lycomings that had 
brass or aluminum fittings screwed in because they can break more easily, plus 
some did which caused the ADs. If that were to happen I would imagine your oil 
supply could be depleted fairly quickly. I mentioned that to Roy at Oshkosh or 
the KR Gathering last year and he agreed that would be a good idea.


?




From: Dan Heath <da...@windstream.net>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>; Corvair engines for homebuilt aircraft 
<corvaircr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Mon, May 31, 2010 1:57:43 PM
Subject: KR> Beginning of Test Installation of the New Corvair Engine

I have started installing the new Corvair Engine on the Little Beast, which
is being parted out, except the fuselage.? So while it is still in the shop
on the gear, I am putting her to good use as a test bed for the installation
of the new Corvair engine.



You can see the full story at:



http://krbuilder.org/CorvairInstallation/index.html



I am going to the Corvair site now to see if I can find the instructions for
installing the distributor.? I brought them home with me from CC 17, but
cannot locate them now.



Any and all comments are appreciated as I need all the help I can get, but
unless they are for the good of the Corvair community, please send them to
me at the e-mail link below.



Thanks,



Daniel R. Heath

da...@windstream.net



See N64KR at? <http://krbuilder.org/> http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on
the pics 

See you at the 2010 - KR Gathering in Richmond, Ky - I39







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KR> Beginning of Test Installation of the New Corvair Engine

[Larry H.]

Hi Dan,
The only thing I would suggest is putting stainless steel fittings in the 5th 
bearing if it is not and in the oil filter adapter that the 5th bearing oil 
line is attached to. It may not be as critical on the Corvair engine as 
compared to a Lycoming. I know years ago ADs were issued on Lycomings that had 
brass or aluminum fittings screwed in because they can break more easily, plus 
some did which caused the ADs. If that were to happen I would imagine your oil 
supply could be depleted fairly quickly. I mentioned that to Roy at Oshkosh or 
the KR Gathering last year and he agreed that would be a good idea.


 




From: Dan Heath 
To: KRnet ; Corvair engines for homebuilt aircraft 

Sent: Mon, May 31, 2010 1:57:43 PM
Subject: KR> Beginning of Test Installation of the New Corvair Engine

I have started installing the new Corvair Engine on the Little Beast, which
is being parted out, except the fuselage.  So while it is still in the shop
on the gear, I am putting her to good use as a test bed for the installation
of the new Corvair engine.



You can see the full story at:



http://krbuilder.org/CorvairInstallation/index.html



I am going to the Corvair site now to see if I can find the instructions for
installing the distributor.  I brought them home with me from CC 17, but
cannot locate them now.



Any and all comments are appreciated as I need all the help I can get, but
unless they are for the good of the Corvair community, please send them to
me at the e-mail link below.



Thanks,



Daniel R. Heath

da...@windstream.net



See N64KR at   http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on
the pics 

See you at the 2010 - KR Gathering in Richmond, Ky - I39







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KR> Bends in Fiberglass Construction

[Larry H.]

Dan, none is good at making 90 degree bends. That is why going over 90 degree 
bends at 45 degree angles is best. I would think that a very light ounce weight 
cloth would do it the easiest but it still will not want to lay down properly 
over a 90 degree bend. A heavier weight cloth would of course be more difficult 
to force over a 90 degree bend. If you can just go over at a 45 degree angle 
and it will lay down just fine.
Larry Howell



From: Dan Heath 
Subject: KR> Bends in Fiberglass Construction

Is there a glass that is "the best" at making a 90 degree bend.  I am
assuming BID, but I am also assuming that there is something that is better.



Daniel R. Heath

KR> 90 degrees

[Larry H.]

Darren is correct Mike, you need to be rolling glass around at 45 degree 
angles. When I have built Rutan designs, all sharp corner layups are with uni 
running at 45 degree angles and or bid running at 45 degree angles. Just turn 
and cut your bid so it rolls over corners at a 45 degree angle.
Larry Howell

PS: I have made some 90 degree bends like you are talking about in small areas 
before, but you have to have extra unwetted glass cloth to tape down away from 
your layup area or weight it down with something or you have to just stay with 
it until the resin begins to setup. Meaning you have to just keep it pulled 
down, stippling etc until it setsup to the point that you do not have to watch 
it any longer. This way is a real pain. Remember the fibers are strongest in 
straight lines, that is why it does not want to bend/kink in a 90 degree bend 
over.





From: MICHAEL SYLVESTER 
To: KRNET 
Sent: Thu, May 6, 2010 10:21:03 PM
Subject: KR> 90 degrees


One more question.. If I'm having trouble with glassing a 90 degree bend, how 
am I going to glass the aileron spar that is more than 90 degrees ?

Mike Sylvester 
kr2s builder 
Birmingham,AL.

Cell no.205-966-3854

                        
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KR> Removing canopy covering

[Larry H.]

I called my buddy, Jeff Rogers at Airplane Plastics Co in Ohio. He said that 
the plastic that usually comes on canopies has a water based glue. He suggested 
putting a little water under the edge, let it sit a few minutes and see if it 
loosened any. The chemicals that you can use on acrylic canopies is: isopropyl 
alcohol, mineral spirits, white gas, kerosene, naptha
Jeff and I began to talk about another method to remove the old plastic. High 
pressure washer! we laughed about him cleaning his dirty four wheelers and 
washing off the warning labels and me cleaning my sailboat with pressure 
washers. We think that might be the fastest and easiest way to get it off. Take 
it to the car wash and give it a try. Start with an area that might get cut off 
or covered up with fiberglass when you get ready to install it to make sure 
this method is OK.
Larry Howell

KR> 3733 v 7533 fiberglass

[Larry H.]

One thing to keep in mind about fiberglass strand, carbon strand etc. It is 
strongest in straight lines. When it is woven, it loses some strength, (I like 
unidirectional, biaxial, and triaxial cloths for this reason) for KR purposes 
woven cloth is fine. If the one supplier is correct in their evaluation, I 
might take the flat weave over the twisted weave. Just my opinion.

Larry Howell






beside them having differnet #'s.  sorry too funny not to send to you.  Try 
looking at composit ones web site to see if they can give you some info. 
http://www.compositesone.com/

Lee Van Dyke


- Original Message - 
From: 
To: "KRnet" 
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 12:14 PM
Subject: KR> 3733 v 7533 fiberglass


Can someone out there in KR land tell me the difference between 3733 and 
7533 fiberglass? All the specs look the same for both but the 3733 is less 
expensive than 7533.  Thanks in advance guys.

John Godwin
jg7...@mindspring.com
EarthLink Revolves Around You.
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KR> APRS/SLOWER LANDING SPEED

[Larry H.]

Too bad we have to worry about even having ELTs. If we can concentrate on 
developing our aircraft with slower, more survivable landing speeds, then the 
correct radio could be used once on the ground to contact the ham guys to come 
and get us. We may have to give up some top speed to have a lot slower landing 
airplane but the trade off might be more comforting while flying over hostile 
terrain. Then there is the airframe failure, landing speed does not matter, a 
parachute would be ones only chance. I suppose a parachute like the Cirrus 
incorporates would be another thing to consider. I do know we have discussed 
that before so go take a look at the opinions on that subject in the archives.
I have noticed the hills and trees below your airplane Mark L in those 
beautiful flying photos. LOL
Around my area there are a lot of flat fields but when flying west the terrain 
gets bad, fly east and miles and miles of forests. I would rather land at 30 
miles per hour in trees or rough terrain than 50 or 60 mph. Maybe then I might 
still be able to call for help or walk away. Someone might know but the human 
body can only take so much, so each 10 mph we can slow landing speed will 
increase our chances of survivability.
A passer by landed here on my airport 15 or 20 years ago. He was flying a 
Cessna 182 and had come here from the Denver CO area to sell his 182 to a 
broker. I took him to my house and offered for him to stay with us but he 
wanted to go to a motel. I took him for dinner and then to the motel and picked 
him up the next day and spent the day with him. We became friends and stayed in 
touch, we wrote regularly. He was building a T18 and was really excited about 
it.
One day when I checked my mail box, there was a letter with his return address 
but it wasn't in his handwriting as usual. I knew immediately before opening 
the envelope that he had been killed. His wife wrote me the letter telling of 
how he got the T18 ready and on one of the first few flights, his engine quit 
just after takeoff. Because of the hostile terrain around there, no place was 
available for him to safely land. At the speed he had to maintain in order to 
prevent a stall, there just was no chance for him to survive. Stories like this 
is what makes me wonder why we do not take more time to explore lower landing 
speeds. I am just as bad as anyone at wanting to have a, as fast as possible, 
airplane but it only takes one miscue to have our wife writing that letter.
As my mother used to tell us while learning to drive and pulling out into 
traffic, "just take your time, because you have a lot more time than lives".

Larry Howell



 

KR> APRS / ELT

[Larry H.]

If one is worried about it, just fly the highways and byways, if a problem 
arises, just crash where everyone else crashes!
Larry H.

KR> APRS

[Larry H.]

Mark
I noticed when I placed the pointer on one of the block data points, a purple 
line appears in a direct line to an airport. What is that all about? I noticed 
that the airport it points to is not necessarily the closest airport?
Larry Howell





From: Mark Langford 
To: KRnet 
Sent: Fri, February 19, 2010 9:55:56 PM
Subject: Re: KR> APRS

Glenn Martin wrote:

> Getting the Technician Class Amateur Radio license to use the APRS
> system is a relatively easy matter of basic knowledge

Of course I'd never brag, but I probably studied 8 hours and made an easy 
100 on the Technician exam, so don't think this is rocket science either. I 
suspect I could have passed it "cold", but I didn't want to look stupider 
than I already am by squeaking by with a 70.  The test probably took 5 
minutes at a local community college, and the cost was something like $13. 
I bought a Micro-Trak 8000FA from www.byonics.com, spent 10 minutes 
configuring it, and went flying.  Grand total weight (including wire) is 
under 5 ounces, total cost under $300 (and it can be done cheaper).  The 
APRS comes online with the rest of my flight instruments,  so it's always 
broadcasting position real time, hands off.  I never have to think about it, 
which is how I like it.  Today's flight is at
http://aprs.fi/?call=n56ml , and tomorrow night it'll show a quick trip to 
Kentucky and back.  It'll be a great day for flying in the Southeast...

Mark Langford
N56ML "at" hiwaay.net
website at http://www.N56ML.com
 


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KR> ELT's

[Larry H.]

The ELT has to be a self activating type. These turn themselves on when a high 
enough g load is applied.(as in a crash or hard enough landing occurs)
Here are some examples at Aircraft Spruce

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/av/elt.html


Larry Howell





From: Larry Knox la...@lebanair.com

Subject: RE: KR> ELT's

Spot does not and neither does a personal ELT. la...@lebanair.com my
understanding.




Lee Van Dyke wrote:
> Is an ELT required in  all aircraft in the USA.  ie even the KR?  

Does "Spot" qualify as an acceptable ELT? 

Jay W. Hughes

N128JH 

American by Birth - A Texan by the Grace of  God


In God we  trust!
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KR> Bye Bye 100LL/ Swift Fuel

[Larry H.]

Here is a wikipedia article that will shed a lot of light on fuels, especially 
Swift fuel along with leads to maybe the article you are looking for.
Larry Howell

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avgas





From: Larry Knox 
Subject: RE: KR> Bye Bye 100LL/ Swift Fuel

I can't find the article but one of the magazine editors flew to swift and
filled up and flew it home. A really good article if I can find it. I would
sure buy all the stock I could get if it was for sale. la...@lebanair.com

KR> Antenna Questions/Carbon Fibre/Graphite

[Larry H.]

My thoughts were that the carbon tube would be the exact same length as the 
copper tape required according to RST. I just thought since everyone says that 
pretty much only carbon arrows are now available, besides aluminum arrows that 
if they would work then OK. As I originally thought, on a KR the wooden spar as 
Mark mentioned would be a safe place for the copper tape antenna. Many 
composite airplanes copper antennas were laid into a slightly routed, dug, or 
scraped out trough into the foam of the winglet, tail etc before the initial 
glass covering was applied. 
I am now wondering what a guy with an all graphite covered structure would do? 
besides an external antenna of course. Would he glue the copper tape onto the 
surface of the graphite frame, then lay-up a layer of light fiberglass cloth? 
If that will work then the graphite arrow shaft should work.
Mark I am in favor of you conducting (no pun intended LOL) the test you 
mentioned when time permits.
Larry Howell





From: Mark Langford 
To: KRnet 
Sent: Tue, February 9, 2010 8:57:21 PM
Subject: Re: KR> Antenna Questions/Carbon Fibre/Graphite

I said it was pointless to debate this, but I'm going to debate AGAINST 
myself.  An analogy that makes carbon fiber less than attractive as 
something to wrap an antenna around is this:  If you had a 3' aluminum tube 
from an old FM antenna and put a layer of shrink tubing around it to 
insulate, and then stuck the 21.3" copper tape to it for one leg of the 
dipole, you'd have a reflector that's longer than the element, and that 
would be Glenn's "extraneous loss".  You'd have to cut the aluminum antenna 
(or carbon fiber shaft as the case may be) to the same length as the copper 
tape, and even then there MIGHT be problems, so I'm back to what's been 
mentioned several times already (including me), just use something else to 
stick your copper tape to and get in the air that much quicker...

Mark Langford
N56ML "at" hiwaay.net
website at http://www.N56ML.com
 


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KR> Antenna Questions/Carbon Fibre/Graphite

[Larry H.]

After the previous questions concerning carbon and fiberglass arrow rods for 
making com antennas and the mention of carbon fibre/graphite rods I began to 
think more about it. My first inclination was, of course I wouldn't use carbon 
but now I would like to have this one question answered. 

My thinking created only one question in my mind for those who know for sure.

If one were to take a graphite arrow rod for example, place copper tape 
lengthwise on the arrow shaft, wrap the tape completely around it, attach 
appropriate toroids, soldering and wiring to radio of course. Would the 
graphite tube in the center, (which we all know is conductive and reflective) 
reflect the radio signal in a 360 degree radius, (which is what we would want) 
away from the arrow shaft or would it (the shaft) just screw up the ability of 
the copper tape to be an antenna? I do know the copper could not come in 
contact with the graphite, hopefully the resin which makes up the arrow shaft 
will keep the copper seperated from the graphite fabric.
Just wondering? if anyone knows for sure I would like to read your thoughts.
Below is the link to RSTs airplane antenna kits which include all the supplies 
you need to fabricate your own antenna.

http://www.rst-engr.com/rst/catalog/airplane_antenna.html


Here is a link to the type of antennas a lot of composite aircraft guys used 15 
or 20 years ago. I glued one of these in the fiberglass wingtip of my neighbors 
RV6A many years ago and it worked really well. I think Aircraft Spruce sells 
these as well. A little pricey compared to making your own from a RST kit.

http://www.advancedaircraft.com/

Larry Howell

KR> Bye Bye 100LL/ Swift Fuel

[Larry H.]

Dan,
I took a look at the Swift Fuel web site.   

http://www.swiftenterprises.net/Swift%20Fuel.html

Hey it all sounds Wonderful to me. I wish for them  all the success they can 
achieve in their desired final product, who wouldn't? 

The information I gave in my earlier post was according to a fellow involved in 
the chemical industry who is involved with a alternative development group 
himself, maybe Swift for all I know. He sure is Very Aware of what is happening 
with the Swift Fuel people and their lack of capability to this point. I passed 
along his statements about them and what is going on with the development of 
alternative unleaded aircraft fuels, Not my thoughts. He was not hopeful at all 
that they were going to be successful. That is all I know about it. Also 
according to him I do not think they have been able to produce very many 
gallons to test to this point. I am fairly sure that the $62.00 per gallon 
figure is what he said it would cost for that fuel based on current mfg 
capability. According to him, Swift is planning to sell shares of stock. If he 
is a big liar, then I can't help it.
I did use the term laughable because according to this fellow they have only 
produced a few gallons so far. IF he is wrong then what can I say?

One more time, all of this is according to him, not me, so please do not accuse 
me, the messenger as being the Negative One. I have seen a lot of people come 
along in my adult life time with all kinds of Fantastic ideas that never panned 
out, we can just hope, right?

Larry Howell



From: Dan Heath 
To: KRnet 
Sent: Mon, February 8, 2010 4:40:22 PM
Subject: RE: KR> Bye Bye 100LL/ Swift Fuel


 I really thought that the
KRNetters were better than this.


Daniel R. Heath - Lexington, SC


Why is it that there always has to be someone who finds it necessary to be
negative even about something that could be so good?  I don't get it. 

KR> Bye Bye 100LL/ Swift Fuel

[Larry H.]

Funny that this subject has come up. At our last local EAA Chapter meeting one 
of our members who is a chemical engineer spoke on the subject of alternative 
fuels. Looks like what might be coming our way will be fuel that causes at the 
least a 5% drop in horsepower for our engines. He is involved with a group 
attempting to develop an alternative aviation fuel. He said there are 10 
refineries in our country that produce 100LL and that the total production is 
something like .02 percent of all fuel production. In other words producing 
100LL or any aviation fuel might just be a thorn in the side of most of them, 
then again if they can make enough money producing it, maybe they are happy 
doing it.
If I heard correctly, I believe the Swift fuel would cost about $62.00 per 
gallon right now and that the quantiy that they have been able to produce to 
this point is laughable (as in just a few gallons) I think Swifts big goal 
right now is to sell shares of stock to suckers !!

Larry Howell





Dan wrote:

>>There is some really good news about a replacement for 100LL, at this site.
>>The interview by AOPA, was very informative to me.



>>http://swiftenterprises.net/



>>Daniel R. Heath

Hey guys,
I signed up with swift this summer at OSH with the hopes of being part of a 
test group. This has not materialized nor does it appear that they are even 
close to being able to produce at any kind of quantity. They do send an email 
up date about every 6 weeks or so. The last information that they sent me 
indicated that they were still trying to get a refinery to try to ramp up and 
even then the quantities would be limited. They also talked about the FAA 
certification process although I don't remember the details my impression was 
that it was better than a year away at the very best. They also mentioned at 
that time that the initial costs may be more than the current costs of 100LL 
supposedly until they got to full production -- again i read into that that the 
cost and availability will not make it very desirable for a number of years. 
But, hey I've been wrong before. I may have the emails saved somewhere.
Joe Horton
Coopersburg, Pa.

KR> (no subject)

[Larry H.]

Pete,
You can sandwich the copper tape between a couple of layers of fiberglass 
cloth, let them set up and then glue the rig in wherever you feel like. Bury 
the copper tape directly in the foam of your vertical or glue it directly onto 
your vertical stabilizer if it is already glassed and cover over with a layer 
of fiberglass cloth if you feel like fairing it in! The best way is to place it 
on your foam before you cover it with fiberglass to begin with. 

Larry Howell








Netters



I'm trying to duplicate Mark Langford's comm antenna installation using a arrow 
shaft to support the lower half of the dipole.

So far, all the local sporting goods stores and hobby shops only carry carbon 
fiber arrow shafts. Can they be used in lieu of fiberglass? Somewhere, I 
thought I read that carbon fiber would hamper transmission of any radio 
signal? 



I await responses from those with any info.



Thanks,



Pete Klapp, building KR-2S N729PK,

Canton, Ohio

KR> Tail Wheel and Spring

[Larry H.]

I think the Chevrolet Astro Van carbon/glass springs that Bob Polgreen has 
talked about would work perfectly for tail springs. Look in the archives for 
use as main landing gear struts and posts by Bob. My recollection is that they 
are readily available at your local wrecked car graveyard for cheap prices. One 
could make several tail springs with a set of these springs. Just a thought.
Larry H.

 




From: Dan Heath da...@windstream.net

Carbon, I understand, can be brittle and I need spring.  Other than that, no
reason, except that my friend let me bum all the cloth that I needed for it.

See N64KR at http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on the pics 
See you at the 2010 - KR Gathering in Richmond, Ky - I39
There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for Flying
has begun.
Daniel R. Heath - Lexington, SC

KR> DA dual action sander

[Larry H.]

This is a little more explanation for those who have never used a DA. A DA has 
a round pad that holds your sanding paper or buffing pad for polishing that 
spins in a circle for sanding or polishing. Along with the spinning in a 
circle, the shaft that carries the round pad is being moved side ways 
eccentrically, kinda like a left right and or up and down sanding motion along 
with the circular sanding motion of the round disk, there by the two way. An 
easy way to think of it is like using a hand held metal grinder which of course 
has a grinding disk that spins in a circle. When grinding a large flat surface 
typically one will move the grinder left and right and up and down to keep from 
grinding down into the metal surface. With a DA the left and right are 
automatic, but you do still have to move it from place to place to keep from 
buffing all of your paint off in one spot or grinding through your fiberglass 
in one spot.
I have a Boshe sander that will just spin in a circle or can be switched to the 
dual motion at the same time. This tool has a switch to change from one to both 
operations. I have used mine mostly to buff my boat with wax. You do get extra 
vibration in your hands with the eccentric movement of the shaft that carries 
the spinning disk.
Hope I didn't confuse anyone, but it is almost 2 am here. Guess maybe it is 
time to grind to a halt!
Larry Howell





DA is short for "dual action" sander.  It is body shop  lingo to describe 
the air powered sander that has been around a long time. 
Kevin Golden
Harrisonville, MO




In a message dated 12/6/2009 8:42:50 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
le62...@yahoo.com writes:

A DA  sander is an air sander.  It is usually with a six inch pad for six 
inch  wet or dry sandpaper.  When you sand the clear coat you want to use it  
wet.  This keeps the paper from clogging.  I use the DA sander on  flat 
surfaces only when sanding clearcoats.  It is easy to sand through  the clear 
coat on sharp edges so I do the sharp edges and turns by hand  with a foam 
sanding block.  A DA sander is a round sander which is  adjustable to 
different speeds.  It makes sanding and finishing a much  easier job.

--- On Sun, 12/6/09, j...@aol.com   wrote:


From: j...@aol.com 
Subject: Re:  KR> Paint :Imron
To: kr...@mylist.net
List-Post: krnet@list.krnet.org
Date: Sunday, December 6, 2009,  4:43 PM




In a message dated 12/4/2009 5:23:45 P.M. Central  Standard Time,  
le62...@yahoo.com writes:

We do  some  antiques and street cars and we will put as high as four
or five  coats  of clear and DA sand them with 1500 grit, 2000 grit and 
then  
3000 grit and  buff several times to get the desired finish.  Ultra fine 
sanding takes  out all the orange peel and any contamiants  that settle in 
the 
clear top  coat.



What does "DA  sand" mean, and do people use powered orbital  sanders for 
finishing  without worrying about glass separation from the foam or  wood?  

Jay W. Hughes
N128JH
American by Birth - A Texan by the Grace  of  God


In God we  trust!
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KR> Update from the archives - Polyester fuel tanks

[Larry H.]

In the statement below, are you talking about tip tanks?

Larry Howell






 We are working on a Bonanza that never burned
auto fuel at any time, that is leaking in several places because of pin
holes and delamination. 

KR> Update from the archives - Polyester fuel tanks

[Larry H.]

Hi Todd,
I have used something like you describe below to coat the inside of a metal 
(steel) motorcycle tank that had rusted years ago. The kit came with an acid 
for cleaning and etching the inside of the tank for adhesion. The stuff I had 
was a two part I think, white in color and looked like white liquid ceramic. As 
directed, once the tank was as clean as I could get it and etched with the 
acid, I poured the liquid in and and rotated the tank around and around to make 
sure all of the inside was coated. Once set up the inside was kind of shiny 
like glass. I could stick my finger in the fill opening and feel of it and it 
felt smooth as glass. It worked very well. I am not sure I would have faith in 
using that product in a resin based fuel tank. I will admit that I have no idea 
whether it would stick properly but I would guess it wouldn't work that well 
but I was wrong once!   LOL

AS for PRC, I think that is the same stuff I coated the inside seams of my 
Mooneys fuel tank with. Jeff can probably speak to this, but that was one night 
mare job cleaning all of the old stuff out of the whole tank through the too 
small openings and then cleaning and cleaning and cleaning and, well you get 
the picture. Bottom line is all oil residue has to be gone or the new sealer 
may not stick properly. I see that as one of the main objectives of coating a 
used tank that has had oil in it.

Larry Howell







Hi Folks,

I have noticed the recurring discusion about tank sealers, and their 
susceptability to problems when using MOGAS with Ethanol. I have had some 
experiences in the past with metal Motorcycle fuel tanks which rusted through 
due to poor maintenance, namely allowing water from condensation to sit on the 
botttom of the tank (for years appearantly.) While large leaks required welding 
to fix the problem, if caught early they are often fixed by coating the inside 
of the tank with an aftermarket product called KREEM TANK SEALER.  It's 
available at many Motorcycle Parts Suppliers, and even JC Whitney, in various 
sizes for between $20 for a 16 oz kit and less then $60 for a gallon kit.  I 
have a number of classic and antique motorcycles, and after treatment with this 
product have not had any of them develope new leaks after years of use.  I 
usually use the cheapest gas I can find, and often it is part Ethanol, and 
seems to have no effect on the sealer.  As a
 product that is specifically designed as a fuel tank sealer, it might be worth 
it to you guys looking for something that will stand up to Ethanol to research 
it.

Happy Flying,

Todd Thelin
Spanaway, WA

KR> KR: to weld or braze

[Larry H.]

Fred, after reading Kent's site that I sent you, sounds like brazing aluminum 
is not reliable according to Kent. Sounds easy enough if one follows the 
directions and might require the correct flux. I know, nothing is as easy as it 
sounds but if you have ever watched Kent weld, it sure looks varieze.
Larry Howell






Can anyone tell me if brazing and aluminum tank is acceptable as welding it?
I have my fears about welding aluminum myself but know that I can braze it
easily enough with silver bearing braze compound.

Thanks.

Fred Johnson
Reno, NV

KR> KR: to weld or braze

[Larry H.]

Look at Kent Whites site below. I have sat in some of his forums at Oshkosh in 
years past. He showed where all the old world war 2 airplane fuel tanks were 
gas welded. I do not remember if they were welded, brazed, or a combination of 
the two, but this guy will know for sure.
Larry H.

http://metalshapers.org/tips/white/aluminum-welding/index.htm






Can anyone tell me if brazing and aluminum tank is acceptable as welding it?
I have my fears about welding aluminum myself but know that I can braze it
easily enough with silver bearing braze compound.

Thanks.

Fred Johnson
Reno, NV

KR> mounting fuel tank ?

[Larry H.]

Built into the wing itself would be 6 lbs lighter weight !   LOL
Larry H.





From: MICHAEL SYLVESTER <shagste...@hotmail.com>
To: KRNET <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Mon, November 9, 2009 7:39:17 PM
Subject: KR> mounting fuel tank ?


Hey Guys, Let me tell you what I was planning and then if I need to regroup I 
will. The bottom of the stub wing has been glassed with 2 layers of KR Glass 
inside and out. The tanks that I am using are very rigid, I don't expect any 
distortion from the tank itself (even under a high G load.) The tanks will only 
hold 6 gallons of fuel and only weighs about 6 lbs. My plan was to let the tank 
rest on the inner bottom glass while filling all voids with foam, Doing the top 
this way also Sounded like a good plan at first, Now I'm scratching my 
head. Why would this be any different than 10 gallons of fuel built into the 
wing itself ?

Mike Sylvester 
kr2s builder 
Birmingham,AL.

Cell no.205-966-3854

                        
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KR> Harness attach & seat failure

[Larry H.]

Hello Guys, 
 
 
By the way, I notice in Jacks webpage of Gene Byrd's crash that "His lap belt 
attached to the rear spar broke free from the spar".
 
Regards
Tom

Along these lines, when my friend crashed his KR2, he was sitting in his sling 
seat per plans, upon impact the top of the rear spar, because of it's smaller 
size, sheered/broke off leaving the sling seat only attached to the front spar. 
The guy that had built this plane had a piece of oak lumber across the back 
side of the rear spar along the bottom, from side longeron to the opposite side 
longeron and I believe it was about 2" wide X 3/4" thick that his seat belt 
attachments were bolted through. They did not come loose. When I intially 
looked at the system at the time, I thought the 1X2 oak across the aft side of 
the rear spar might be an overkill but maybe something there is a good idea. I 
would probaly just use an aluminum strap across the backside of the rear spar 
if I were going to beef it up. As others say, your mileage may vary.
Larry H.

KR> Gascolator Cooling

[Larry H.]

My friends plane had been flying several years before his problem arose, who 
would of thought a flying plane could develop problems under the wrong 
circumstances. I also forgot to suggest what Larry Flesner stated and that is 
to add fireproof temperature insulating covers to all fuel lines in the cowling 
that are near the engine if possible.
Vapor lock caused by a hot engine was common on a Cessna 210 fuel injected 
aircraft I once owned when I would stop for fuel. It happens.
Larry H.





From: Phillip Matheson <phillipmathe...@bigpond.com>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Tue, October 13, 2009 3:23:36 PM
Subject: Re: KR> Gascolator Cooling

and my KR2 without a Gascolator at all

I have over 200 hours on my KR2, without gascolator cooling, to date, not 
fuel problems.


Phil Matheson
SAAA Ch. 20  http://www.saaa20.org/
VH-PKR
Australia

EMAIL:  phillipmathe...@bigpond.com
KR Web Page: www.philskr2.50megs.com


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KR> Gascolator Cooling

[Larry H.]

I agree with Dan, cooling your gascolator in a tightly enclosed cowling is 
important. A friend of mine crashed his KR because of vapor lock, he did not 
have cooling to his gascolator and was doing touch and goes. Not enough cooling 
air flowing to save him.
Larry H.





From: Dan Heath <da...@windstream.net>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Tue, October 13, 2009 4:30:48 AM
Subject: RE: KR> Gascolator Cooling

Cooling the gascolator ( fuel system in general ) is a good idea.  I cool my
gascolator with a 1/2 SCAT tube coming off the air in the baffled area.  I
see no reason why your NACA inlet won't work, but don't put any stock in
that.  Check http://www.vansaircraft.com/index.htm
For NACA vents and other things.  They have good prices on stuff.

See N64KR at http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on the pics 
See you at the 2009 - KR Gathering in Mt. Vernon, Ill
There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for Flying
has begun.
Daniel R. Heath - Lexington, SC



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KR> Wet Wings-Outer Wing Fuel Tanks

[Larry H.]

Dan,
I have considered wing tanks like you are talking about myself. There are many 
ways to go about building them as you already know. One way would be to have a 
sheet metal shop bend some aluminum to a tapered rectangle ends shape you 
desire.  One end may be 2 or 3 inches tall and the other end may be 4 or 5 
inches tall by whatever length you decide to make your tanks. You will have to 
decide how many gallons you want in each of these tanks. Leave one long top 
edge/corner of the bent sheet aluminum as the weld together edge/corner or 
overlap for proseal pop rivet like Mark Jones tank was done and then weld or 
proseal the two end caps in like Mark Jones.
Use wide strapping screwed or bolted through the front and rear spars to 
support the tank in multiple places, put rubber or something between the 
strapping and the tank to prevent a hole or corrosion. You could also place 
ribs on each end of the tank that fit from the front to the rear spar as 
additional supports. Flox it into place as additional support while intalling. 
Once you decide how you want to build your tanks, the dimensions etc, then just 
build them, test them, make sure they are leak proof. At that point you can 
decide if you have enough time to install them before spring flying time. If 
so, cut into the wing, place the tank, flox and strap it in and repair the 
bottom surface skin and go fly.
Sounds easy, doesn't it?
Larry H.





From: Dan Heath <da...@windstream.net>
Wet Wings

I was going to build my wet wings with aluminum, so I could build them
outside the wing and then test and install.  I may still do this, but am
concerned about getting them the right size and not interfering with the
twist of the wing as they are going in the outboard wing.  I am not sure
that this is even a factor.



So, I am thinking that I might build glass wings in the wing, but would want
to go in from the bottom so I would not have to repair the top of the wing.
I am concerned about support for this type of tank built into the wing.



I have studied both Marks' sites on the fuel tanks, but will welcome any
pros and cons that you may have to offer.  I am very apprehensive about
assaulting these nice wings that I have now.  FYI, they are RAF48 Diehl
skins.  I am just in the planning stage now, and won't get around to this
till winter for sure.  I don't want to be down for spring flying.

KR> Trip notes

[Larry H.]

I think I heard at the banquet Steve Glover say that a gentleman named Steve 
Starwell flew in from San Diego, California

 so someone with a gps handy can see how many miles it is in a straight line 
from SanDiego, CA to Mt Vernon, IL
Larry H.



From: Willie van der Walt <touri...@intekom.co.za>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 11:49:56 PM
Subject: Re: KR> Trip notes

What was the distance? ..Just so that those us that could not go can 
share

- Original Message - 
From: "Art Bruce" <kr2fl...@mchsi.com>
To: "'KRnet'" <kr...@mylist.net>; <laser...@juno.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:38 AM
Subject: RE: KR> Trip notes


Mike,
Just a note to let you know that at the banquet on Saturday night, you won
the award for the longest distance flown to the Gathering. Contact Larry
Flesner to claim your prize!!!

Art Bruce
Bainbridge, GA

-Original Message-
From: krnet-boun...@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-boun...@mylist.net] On Behalf
Of laser...@juno.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2009 7:19 PM
To: kr...@mylist.net
Subject: KR> Trip notes

After leaving MVN for Naples, Fl on Saturday
Mike - KSEE



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KR> MADE IT HOME

[Larry H.]

I left the airport at 5:30pm Sunday, drove to northern edge of Memphis before 
stopping for the night then finished the trip arriving home Monday evening. 
While still in route home, my mother in law called me just after I had left 
Memphis TN Monday morning, she asked me if my youngest son was OK. I had no 
idea what she was talking about. She was watching Fox news when they reported 
the Rockwall Heath High school Swim team bus had crashed.(I was panicked 
initially) I called my wife, who is a school teacher, she said my son was fine, 
since she knew he was OK she decided not to panic anyone else, like me for 
instance. The story according to my son, the school bus traveling about 55mph 
down a farm market road after leaving the new aquatic center in route to his 
school when it suddenly took an immediate right hand turn off the road, in the 
process it leaned like it was going to turn over but it didn't, it was bouncing 
through the ditch and kids were
 bouncing all over the bus, he said it then suddenly got smooth and calm (that 
was because the whole bus went air-born, it had vaulted up and off of the side 
of a large pond bank) and when it came crashing down out into the pond nose 
first, the windshield exploded back into the bus along with thousands of 
gallons of water. My son said he had braced himself between his seat and the 
one in front of himself. According to him one girl was up against the top of 
the bus as she flew past him and he said others flew forward as well. Lots of 
other stuff in the bus flew forward past him also. He said girls were just 
screaming and crying once the bus came to a stop, then one young man who plans 
to be a Navy seal started screaming at them to shut up and get out of the bus. 
Kids were diving out of the windows and swimming to shore. Lots of cuts 
bruises, broken fingers etc but no life threatening injuries except the driver 
who had a heart attack, which caused all of
 this. I have no idea what his condition is as I write this. Now I can say, at 
least the bus with the swimming team aboard was the correct bus to end up out 
in the middle of a pond if a bus load of kids had to be there. LOL
The one part I thought was really funny. When my son went to his first class he 
was kinda dirty I guess. One of the kids in his class asked him what is wrong, 
my son said what do you mean. The kid said, you are not clean and tidy like you 
usually are. My son said that is because my bus went flying into a pond and I 
had to swim to shore. The kid said Right! whatever and turned away. My son said 
the same thing happened later in another class. All of the rest of the kids who 
were on the bus, parents had picked them up and taken them home, so no one knew 
about the drama. My kid was the only one in school today that had been on the 
pond bus because his daddy went to the KR Gathering and was still driving home 
and his mommy had to take care of the heathens at her school, so no one was 
available to pick my son up.
Sorry to elaborate but I know other members have kids that ride school buses as 
well.
The Gathering was fun except the crashes on Thursday put a real damper on 
things that evening. I am not sure if someone else mentioned it but both pilots 
were lucky to have the air ambulance handy there on the airport. Especially the 
pilot of the second KR to go down short of the airport was unfortunate and very 
fortunate at the same time. The careflight helicopter that is stationed at the 
Mt Vernon airport had just lifted off on its way to take a patient from one 
hospital to another or something to that order when the pilot heard the KR 
pilot make the transmission that he was not going to make it to the airport. 
The pilot and staff in the helicopter spotted the KR, watched him go down, they 
immediately landed beside the wreckage, removed him and immediately 
flew/transported him to a hospital. I thought that was an amazing coincidence 
and lucky for the pilot. The KR planes that came in all looked good and the 
pilots spent a lot of time explaining
 things to KR lookers and builders as they usually do. I enjoyed spending time 
with all of you who came and I am thankful for everyone making it home safely 
and also I am thankful to know the two injured KR pilots are in good hands 
right now. Many thanks to Larry Flesner for all of his hard work hosting the 
Gatherings in Mt Vernon and also thanks to Chris the airport manager for all of 
his hard work and efforts to make sure we all are happy and taken care of. I 
just can't imagine a better airport manager than Chris.
Larry H.

KR> Gathering Weather

[Larry H.]

Indian will power!





From: "Teate, Stephen" 
To: KRnet 
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 11:29:37 AM
Subject: KR> Gathering Weather

Wow Larry I just checked the latest guess. Whatever you are doing, it is
working. 



See you Thursday,



Stephen Teate

Paradise, Texas

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KR> Gathering weather

[Larry H.]

Woa, I am getting off balance and dizzy going backwards! but I think it is 
working. 
Larry H.





From: Larry H. <lah...@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: KR> Gathering weather



I have a lot of American Indian blood in me, guess I will have to be the one to 
do the un-rain dance!
Larry H.




I've been checking the weather for the Gathering and it has gone from 
rain to sunny and back to "iffy" with chance of rain.  Someone needs 
to make a sacrifice to the weather Gods. :-(  Who's going to step up 
to the alter? :-)

Larry Flesner


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KR> Gathering weather

[Larry H.]

I have a lot of American Indian blood in me, guess I will have to be the one to 
do the un-rain dance!
Larry H.




I've been checking the weather for the Gathering and it has gone from 
rain to sunny and back to "iffy" with chance of rain.  Someone needs 
to make a sacrifice to the weather Gods. :-(  Who's going to step up 
to the alter? :-)

Larry Flesner


___

KR> Corvair Head Studs

[Larry H.]

Ross,
I think there is a tool you can buy that will split those nuts apart. I seem to 
remember a circular thing that went around the nuts and then sharp wedges 
tightened down to cut through the outside then towards the center (or maybe I 
dreamed that-LOL) or you can maybe figure out how to cut them with a small 
dremel grinding head without damaging the studs.
Larry H.





From: Ross Aldrich <rra_...@hotmail.com>
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 8:52:51 AM
Subject: RE: KR> Corvair Head Studs


No, I was the buffoon here.  I meant to say, "the head stud NUTS" rather the 
the head studs themselves.  I don't know what kind of trouble I would get into 
if I were to strain or break a stud, but I have a hunch I don't want to find 
out.

What I've done so far is to break the nuts loose - that is just barely turn 
them - and then tried to back them off.  I could only turn them a few degrees 
before the torque wrench read 40 lb-ft - the maximum that William suggests.  

I had previously soaked the tips of the studs and the nuts in two different 
kinds of penetrating rust solvent.  In addition, I had Q-tipped nitric acid 
along the annular ring between the stud and nut threads.  HNO3 reacts with 
("dissolves") rust.  So far I still pull 40 lb-ft of torque with no further 
movement on the "loosened" nuts.

I have heard of a high frequency nut-only electronic heating device, but a) I 
don't have one, b) I don't know anyone who does, c) most of the nuts are in a 
location that might preclude the use of such a device anyway.  It's amazing in 
that it heats the bolt to red-hot without heating the stud.  Of course, you 
must work quickly before too much head is transferred from the nut to the stud.

Any suggestions out there would be greatly appreciated.

Ross Aldrich

> Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2009 07:10:47 -0700
> From: lah...@yahoo.com
> Subject: Re: KR> Corvair Head Studs
> To: kr...@mylist.net
>
> Sorry if I mis-spoke, I am talking about the studs that hold the heads to the 
> block I believe.
> Larry H.
>
>
>
>
> 
> From: Larry H. 
> To: KRnet 
> Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2009 8:59:15 AM
> Subject: Re: KR> Corvair Head Studs
>
> William says not to remove them. Do you need to remove them?
> Larry H.
>
>
>
>
> 
> From: Ross Aldrich 
> To: kr...@mylist.net
> Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2009 8:45:37 AM
> Subject: KR> Corvair Head Studs
>
>
> I am having one heck of a time trying to remove Corvair head studs without 
> ruining them. Anybody have any experience with this problem? Any suggestions?
> Ross Aldrich
> ___
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> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
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KR> Corvair Head Studs

[Larry H.]

Sorry if I mis-spoke, I am talking about the studs that hold the heads to the 
block I believe.
Larry H.





From: Larry H. <lah...@yahoo.com>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2009 8:59:15 AM
Subject: Re: KR> Corvair Head Studs

William says not to remove them. Do you need to remove them?
Larry H.





From: Ross Aldrich <rra_...@hotmail.com>
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2009 8:45:37 AM
Subject: KR> Corvair Head Studs


I am having one heck of a time trying to remove Corvair head studs without 
ruining them.  Anybody have any experience with this problem?  Any suggestions?
Ross Aldrich
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KR> Corvair Head Studs

[Larry H.]

William says not to remove them. Do you need to remove them?
Larry H.





From: Ross Aldrich <rra_...@hotmail.com>
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2009 8:45:37 AM
Subject: KR> Corvair Head Studs


I am having one heck of a time trying to remove Corvair head studs without 
ruining them.  Anybody have any experience with this problem?  Any suggestions?
Ross Aldrich
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KR> One week to the Gathering!

[Larry H.]

I would say keep track of your trip with your GPS, I recall the question, "who 
flew the furthest to get here?"  I don't remember them saying how far is it to 
your house !   LOL
Larry H.





From: Jeff Scott <jscott.pi...@juno.com>
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 2:17:04 PM
Subject: Re: KR> One week to the Gathering!

I'll be launching in the KR tomorrow morning on a week+ of vacation with a 
planned stop for the KR Gathering next weekend.  Do I get farthest flown if I 
fly in to Mt Vernon, on a circle route via IA and MN?  ;o)

-Jeff Scott
Los Alamos, NM


-- Original Message --
KRnetHeads,

It just occured to me that we're down to a week away from the KR Gathering.  
Diehards will show up on Thursday.  I certainly intend to, weather permitting. 
More Gathering details are at http://www.krgathering.org/ .

Also, I was checking KRnet links and ran across Jeff Scott's modification page, 
which I hadn't seen for a while.  Very interesting stuff, and his wing root 
fairing is about as light as you could make one, and as simple and easy to make 
as I could imagine.  It's at http://www.vla.com/jscott/kr/2005mods.html with 
links on the page.

See y'all at the Gathering...

Mark Langford



Best Weight Loss Program - Click Here!
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTFoYbmOeG0j4Y8QnEOUv9AL84Q47tUCz6sjfw4bM1rCgPkwlKES1C/

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KR> Re: KRnet Digest, Vol 351, Issue 260

[Larry H.]

Take a look here for past photos and current dates.
Larry H.
http://krgathering.org/

 




From: Robert Wiehe <bob.wi...@centurytel.net>
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 10:44:20 AM
Subject: KR> Re: KRnet Digest, Vol 351, Issue 260

Hi Again...WHAT ARE THE GAT5HERING DATES?- Original Message - 




From: <krnet-requ...@mylist.net>
To: <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 11:00 PM
Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 351, Issue 260


> Send KRnet mailing list submissions to
> kr...@mylist.net
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> krnet-requ...@mylist.net
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> krnet-ow...@mylist.net
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>  1.  Vinylester vs T-88 (Diehl skins) (laser...@juno.com)
>  2.  RE: Vinylester vs T-88 (Joe Beyer)
>  3. Re:  Progress! (Larry H.)
>  4. Re:  Progress! (Larry H.)
>  5.  Gathering weather (Larry Flesner)
>  6.  Winning the lottery (Dan Heath)
>  7. Re:  Progress! (Mark Jones)
>  8.  Dave Mullins (joe.kr2s.buil...@juno.com)
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2009 12:54:07 -0700
> From: laser...@juno.com
> Subject: KR> Vinylester vs T-88 (Diehl skins)
> To: kr...@mylist.net
> Message-ID: <20090907.125407.3488.0.laser...@juno.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
>
>>The instructions for the Diehl wing skins are at
> http://www.diehlaero.com/wings.htm
>
> He has a video of the process too.  My plane (Ken Cottle's KR-1½) is used
> as the demonstration plane.
>
> Mike
> KSEE
> 
> Best Weight Loss Program - Click Here!
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTFoYcwEuEP7UM71Yalj59euTBQbfPNd6Dk9tTDFTxD7TMQwyQTKC0/
>
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2009 14:01:31 -0700
> From: "Joe Beyer" <joe2387...@gmail.com>
> Subject: KR> RE: Vinylester vs T-88
> To: <kr...@mylist.net>
> Message-ID: <D08CA04734CD46D68F60F7080CF71E9A@JoeBeyer>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I used Hysol that you can buy at Wicks or Aircraft Spruce to attach some
> Diehl wing skins. We used that stuff over at Lancair for assembly of wings
> and fuselages. It's strong and has a long pot life.
>
> Joe
> Scappoose, Ore.
>
>> Message: 20
>> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2009 18:08:23 GMT
>> From: "electr...@netzero.net" <electr...@netzero.net>
>> Subject: KR> Vinylester vs T-88
>> To: kr...@mylist.net
>> Message-ID: <20090907.140823.1016...@webmail04.dca.untd.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>>
>> What planes flying with T-88 ? I've been advised to use
>> Vinylester for attaching Diehl Wingskins. However can some
>> people be alergic to Vinylester ?
>> Is Vinylester more difficult to work ?
>>
>> PM in AUS told me, years ago, that the preference is Vinylester.
>>
>> Phil Visconti
>> Marlborough, MA
>
>
>
>
> ------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2009 14:04:55 -0700 (PDT)
> From: "Larry H." <lah...@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: KR> Progress!
> To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
> Message-ID: <666219.59685...@web30006.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> David, that is great, we will be looking forward to hearing your progress 
> reports, good for you, now you can have some real fun.
> Larry H.
>
>
>
>
> 
> From: David Lininger <kb0...@gmail.com>
> To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
> Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 2:37:01 PM
> Subject: KR> Progress!
>
> A few minutes ago I put my fuselage sides on the work table. "Big deal"
> you say? It is for me. We moved down here 11 years ago, and I didn't
> have a garage or shop. All I had was a storage shed, 8' x 12' out side
> dimensions. A year ago we finally got a garage with attached shop built.
> While little interior finishing has been done, I FINALLY have a place
> to work! I can actually walk all around the table AND I have lights.
>
> My goal now is to put in at least a couple of hours each week during the
> school year, and more on vacations.
>
>
> -- 
> 

KR> Re: KRnet Digest, Vol 351, Issue 260

[Larry H.]

Take a look here for past photos and current dates.
Larry H.
http://krgathering.org/





From: Robert Wiehe <bob.wi...@centurytel.net>
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 10:44:20 AM
Subject: KR> Re: KRnet Digest, Vol 351, Issue 260

Hi Again...WHAT ARE THE GAT5HERING DATES?- Original Message - 




From: <krnet-requ...@mylist.net>
To: <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Monday, September 07, 2009 11:00 PM
Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 351, Issue 260


> Send KRnet mailing list submissions to
> kr...@mylist.net
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> krnet-requ...@mylist.net
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> krnet-ow...@mylist.net
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>  1.  Vinylester vs T-88 (Diehl skins) (laser...@juno.com)
>  2.  RE: Vinylester vs T-88 (Joe Beyer)
>  3. Re:  Progress! (Larry H.)
>  4. Re:  Progress! (Larry H.)
>  5.  Gathering weather (Larry Flesner)
>  6.  Winning the lottery (Dan Heath)
>  7. Re:  Progress! (Mark Jones)
>  8.  Dave Mullins (joe.kr2s.buil...@juno.com)
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2009 12:54:07 -0700
> From: laser...@juno.com
> Subject: KR> Vinylester vs T-88 (Diehl skins)
> To: kr...@mylist.net
> Message-ID: <20090907.125407.3488.0.laser...@juno.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
>
>>The instructions for the Diehl wing skins are at
> http://www.diehlaero.com/wings.htm
>
> He has a video of the process too.  My plane (Ken Cottle's KR-1½) is used
> as the demonstration plane.
>
> Mike
> KSEE
> 
> Best Weight Loss Program - Click Here!
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/fc/BLSrjpTFoYcwEuEP7UM71Yalj59euTBQbfPNd6Dk9tTDFTxD7TMQwyQTKC0/
>
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2009 14:01:31 -0700
> From: "Joe Beyer" <joe2387...@gmail.com>
> Subject: KR> RE: Vinylester vs T-88
> To: <kr...@mylist.net>
> Message-ID: <D08CA04734CD46D68F60F7080CF71E9A@JoeBeyer>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I used Hysol that you can buy at Wicks or Aircraft Spruce to attach some
> Diehl wing skins. We used that stuff over at Lancair for assembly of wings
> and fuselages. It's strong and has a long pot life.
>
> Joe
> Scappoose, Ore.
>
>> Message: 20
>> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2009 18:08:23 GMT
>> From: "electr...@netzero.net" <electr...@netzero.net>
>> Subject: KR> Vinylester vs T-88
>> To: kr...@mylist.net
>> Message-ID: <20090907.140823.1016...@webmail04.dca.untd.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>>
>> What planes flying with T-88 ? I've been advised to use
>> Vinylester for attaching Diehl Wingskins. However can some
>> people be alergic to Vinylester ?
>> Is Vinylester more difficult to work ?
>>
>> PM in AUS told me, years ago, that the preference is Vinylester.
>>
>> Phil Visconti
>> Marlborough, MA
>
>
>
>
> ------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 2009 14:04:55 -0700 (PDT)
> From: "Larry H." <lah...@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: KR> Progress!
> To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
> Message-ID: <666219.59685...@web30006.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> David, that is great, we will be looking forward to hearing your progress 
> reports, good for you, now you can have some real fun.
> Larry H.
>
>
>
>
> 
> From: David Lininger <kb0...@gmail.com>
> To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
> Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 2:37:01 PM
> Subject: KR> Progress!
>
> A few minutes ago I put my fuselage sides on the work table. "Big deal"
> you say? It is for me. We moved down here 11 years ago, and I didn't
> have a garage or shop. All I had was a storage shed, 8' x 12' out side
> dimensions. A year ago we finally got a garage with attached shop built.
> While little interior finishing has been done, I FINALLY have a place
> to work! I can actually walk all around the table AND I have lights.
>
> My goal now is to put in at least a couple of hours each week during the
> school year, and more on vacations.
>
>
> -- 
> David Lininge

KR> Progress!

[Larry H.]

That reminds me, isn't the KR Gathering next week? Jones, how many days?
Larry H.





From: Larry H. lah...@yahoo.com

 now you can have some real fun.
Larry H.





From: David Lininger <kb0...@gmail.com>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 2:37:01 PM
Subject: KR> Progress!

A few minutes ago I put my fuselage sides on the work table. "Big deal" 
you say? It is for me. We moved down here 11 years ago, and I didn't 
have a garage or shop. All I had was a storage shed, 8' x 12' out side 
dimensions. A year ago we finally got a garage with attached shop built. 
  While little interior finishing has been done, I FINALLY have a place 
to work!  I can actually walk all around the table AND I have lights.

My goal now is to put in at least a couple of hours each week during the 
school year, and more on vacations.


-- 
David Lininger, kb0zke
EM37kt
Rev. 2:10
kb0...@gmail.com

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KR> Progress!

[Larry H.]

David, that is great, we will be looking forward to hearing your progress 
reports, good for you, now you can have some real fun.
Larry H.





From: David Lininger <kb0...@gmail.com>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 2:37:01 PM
Subject: KR> Progress!

A few minutes ago I put my fuselage sides on the work table. "Big deal" 
you say? It is for me. We moved down here 11 years ago, and I didn't 
have a garage or shop. All I had was a storage shed, 8' x 12' out side 
dimensions. A year ago we finally got a garage with attached shop built. 
  While little interior finishing has been done, I FINALLY have a place 
to work!  I can actually walk all around the table AND I have lights.

My goal now is to put in at least a couple of hours each week during the 
school year, and more on vacations.


-- 
David Lininger, kb0zke
EM37kt
Rev. 2:10
kb0...@gmail.com

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KR> Vinylester vs T-88

[Larry H.]

Vinylester is the resin that was used to make Diehl wing skins. That would be 
the choice to make. Vinylester exotherms more quickly than most epoxies so be 
prepared to work quickly and it would be best to have as many helpers as you 
can round up. Be sure and follow the Diehl plans carefully, be sure and rough 
sand all mating areas on the skins, especially the spar cap areas. Be sure to 
paint resin on the skins where flox is to be used as well as all adjoining 
areas. I bought a KR years back that had Diehl wing skins already installed. I 
knew they were not attached correctly because I could see clearly the wood 
grain on most of the spar cap areas plus there was no resin on parts and 
certainly no flox at all. I sold that plane to a fellow on this list, I 
suggested that he take those skins off and redo the process. He was able to 
easily delaminate and take the skins apart easily. It is scary to me to think 
that someone could have painted those wings and
 everyone would have assumed they were done properly then later someone could 
have been killed. It is imperative that one knows what he is doing and if not 
get help from someone who does know what they are doing. Wear protective 
gloves, keep it off of your skin and for one day of gluing your wing skins on a 
allergy should not form, if it does you will already be finished!  LOL  Just 
make sure you have plenty of fresh air with open doors when using any chemicals.
T88 is an epoxy that is used for gluing wood together, not for Diehl wing skins.
Larry Howell





From: "electr...@netzero.net" 
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 1:08:23 PM
Subject: KR> Vinylester vs T-88

What planes flying with T-88 ? I've been advised to use Vinylester for 
attaching Diehl Wingskins. However can some people be alergic to Vinylester ?
Is Vinylester more difficult to work ?

PM in AUS told me, years ago, that the preference is Vinylester.

Phil Visconti
Marlborough, MA


Handyman Franchises. Click Here.
http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2231/fc/BLSrjnxaAguoE9gNxRbSlS9qIME4Uay3XeD6U6cNaMd8v0OZglQVCj74nkc/

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KR> w.a.f. Help.

[Larry H.]

According to my plans the four front (forward side of spar) (rear spar wafs) 
have a bend at .62 from the center of the last hole on the side of the waf 
closest to the end of the spar, then .38 from that bend point to the center of 
the  wing bolt up hole. 
The rear side of the spars fittings are .62 and .44 respectively so the 4 back 
side of rear spar wafs have an extra .06 further from the bend point dimension. 
So depending on which one of the dimensions you used to make your 8 rear spar 
wafs Mike, you should only need four wafs instead of 8.
Larry H.

KR> Road hazzards to the gathering

[Larry H.]

I would hate to see you having to buy two of those little stickers for each 
side of your car fenders!   LOL
Larry H.





From: Mark Jones <flyk...@charter.net>
To: KRnet <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 10:37:33 AM
Subject: Re: KR> Road hazzards to the gathering


> Mark:
> Watch out for deer in your headlights.




What, you mean like the one I busted May 15, 2008.
http://www.flykr2s.com/photo.html


Mark Jones (N886MJ)
Stevens Point, WI
E-mail: flyk...@charter.net
Web: www.flykr2s.com



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KR> RE: Peel ply

[Larry H.]

Correct me if I am wrong, but don't you also have to use PolyTak at least 
around the perimeter of the fabric to stick it down? or any fabric overlaps?
Larry H.





From: Joe Beyer <joe2387...@gmail.com>
To: kr...@mylist.net
Sent: Sunday, September 6, 2009 10:20:11 AM
Subject: KR> RE: Peel ply

I used 1.8 oz. Dacron glider fabric over the wood on my KR. No sanding at
all. Just stits poly brush over the wood and iron it to remove the rinkles. 

Joe
Scapoose Ore.

> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2009 18:43:24 -0400
> From: "Dan Heath" <da...@windstream.net>
> Subject: RE: KR> Peel ply
> To: "'KRnet'" <kr...@mylist.net>
> Message-ID: <000401ca2e7a$476e28d0$d64a7a70$@net>
> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> Using Peel Ply is never "Required".  It is good when you will 
> need to add another layer, or just to bring the resin up to 
> the top to eliminate a lot of the sanding and pin holes.  
> Larry is right on the Deck Cloth.  I agree on everything 
> except on using it on the wood as I think this is unnecessary 
> work for very little if any benefit.  "MY OPINION".
> 
> See N64KR at http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on the pics 
> See you at the 2009 - KR Gathering in Mt. Vernon, Ill There 
> is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for 
> Flying has begun.
> Daniel R. Heath - Lexington, SC
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Subject: KR> Peel ply
> 
> If using deck cloth, is peel ply necessary


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KR> Was CHT , Now Mixture Meter

[Larry H.]

Are the mixture meters the problem or the probe? How long will the meters last? 
and how long will the probes last?
Thanks
Larry H.





From: Mark Jones <flyk...@charter.net>
I am replacing mine tonight. They have a life of about 100 hours with leaded 
fuel.


Mark Jones (N886MJ)
Stevens Point, WI
E-mail: flyk...@charter.net
Web: www.flykr2s.com

KR> Gathering Corvair Crank Drilling and Tapping

[Larry H.]

Someone built and brought a jig to the 2007 Gathering for accurately tapping 
the Corvair crank for the WW safety shaft. Will that jig be available this 
year? Anyone know?
Thanks
Larry H.

KR> another KR Gathering "Performance Evaluation"

[Larry H.]

Mark, now that you have your own oxygen supply, I can see how you would feel 
this way !!    LOL
Larry Howell





From: Mark Langford n5...@hiwaay.net

Rest assured that if you want to hold it on the moon, you'll have no complaints 
from me  

Mark Langford
N56ML "at" hiwaay.net
website at http://www.N56ML.com


NetHeads,


It's  probably time to remind folks that if you'd like to host the Gathering 
next year (2010),

KR> another KR Gathering "Performance Evaluation"

[Larry H.]

That looks like a little four point buck that Jones could easily take out !!!  
LOL
Larry H.





Who needs enemies when you have friends like these? 

Mark Langford
N56ML "at" hiwaay.net
website at http://www.N56ML.com

I was looking through some pictures from last year's Gathering and came across 
this one at http://www.krnet.org/misc/070923069.jpg

KR> Build Time

[Larry H.]

What would be a good practice is to consider each part of the airplane as mini 
projects to finish. Wings, fuselage boat, horizontal tail, etc. As you finish 
each of these mini projects you will have a better guess as to your time frame. 
Yes a boat builder and his experience will be most helpful during a project 
like the KR2S. Your time frame you are alloting will accomplish a lot, but 
there is also a lot of time invested in looking at and thinking about the 
project that many do not consider. If you start making little changes to the 
design then the project will slow down. As stated by others, just take your 
time and make sure you are accurate at every phase of the construction process. 
Good luck, have fun and don't burn yourself out while attempting your desired 3 
month time frame.
Larry H.
 




From: Dave Capamagian seekingd...@gmail.com


Hi all,

Well I am new to the KR Net so firstly "HI"

I am looking to build a KR2S which I will be buying the plans for in the
next few weeks, my question is:

How short a time can I take to build a KR2S?

I have allocated three months with myself and my Dad ( A retired boat
builder ) full time to this project and would like to think We can have the
bulk of the work done in this time frame.

I will look to purchase the Canopy kit and turtle deck from Rand to speed
construction and will also look to getting the new wings made while we are
busy on the body.

Do you guy's think this time frame is realistic as you have the experience
in building these aircraft?

Looking forward to hearing your comments.

Dave
seekingd...@gmail.com