Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-10 Thread Klaus Bergmann
It is strange. Rick types lscss and expects zLinux to give him the right
information. He gets

Device   Subchan.  DevType CU Type Use  PIM PAM POM  CHPIDs
--
0.0.01B0 0.0.000A  3390/0C 3990/E9 yes  FF  FF  FF   444BA0B1 A1B06F4D

which is wrong. zLinux says Yes, it is wrong, but nobody informed me and I
didn't care to inform myself.

Now Rich goes ahead and types chchp -v 0 b1 which triggers zLinux to
inform itself and then, after lscss, returns the right answer:

Device   Subchan.  DevType CU Type Use  PIM PAM POM  CHPIDs
--
0.0.01B0 0.0.000A  3390/0C 3990/E9 yes  FF  E4  FF   444BA0B1 A1B06F4D

It is a rare case of humans having to instruct the computer how to deliver
the right answer and not the computer doing it by itself in the first
place.

I have been in the first row of that movie a long time ago and have given
up. Couldn't convince anybody to correct this. All the best, Rick, hope
your Service Request has more luck.

Klaus

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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-10 Thread David Boyes
 -Original Message-
 From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU] On Behalf Of
 Bruce Hayden
 This is also why OPTION CHPIDVIRTUALIZATION ONE (and also the
 GLOBALOPTS
 statement) was invented, so that relocating guests don't see the real paths
 or care if the paths on the LPAR they move to change.  [snip] and also
 This option should be specified only when the guest is going to be
 relocated. In addition to virtualizing the CHPID numbers, CHPIDV ONE results
 in DASD path group ID virtualization.
 I'm not sure why it is suggested that this option is only used for relocating
 guests.  It seems that it would have been useful to you if your Linux guests
 had this option in effect before you started changing the paths!

Seems like it should be the default I mean, except in very very specific 
cases, should the virtual machine EVER care about the hardware details?

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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-10 Thread Rick Troth
 Seems like it should be the default
 I mean, except in very very specific cases,
 should the virtual machine EVER care about the hardware details?

Yeah ... David makes an excellent point.
Seems like a virtualization violation, in the pure sense.
Have always found it odd that guests can see certain aspects about
the real I/O subsystem.

I would have liked to see this CHPIDVIRTUALIZATION option years ago.

-- R; 



On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 9:58 AM, David Boyes dbo...@sinenomine.net wrote:
 -Original Message-
 From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU] On Behalf Of
 Bruce Hayden
 This is also why OPTION CHPIDVIRTUALIZATION ONE (and also the
 GLOBALOPTS
 statement) was invented, so that relocating guests don't see the real paths
 or care if the paths on the LPAR they move to change.  [snip] and also
 This option should be specified only when the guest is going to be
 relocated. In addition to virtualizing the CHPID numbers, CHPIDV ONE results
 in DASD path group ID virtualization.
 I'm not sure why it is suggested that this option is only used for relocating
 guests.  It seems that it would have been useful to you if your Linux guests
 had this option in effect before you started changing the paths!

 Seems like it should be the default I mean, except in very very specific 
 cases, should the virtual machine EVER care about the hardware details?

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-- R;   

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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-09 Thread Marcy Cortes
Are you using zHPF?

We did have a chpid problem in ourr DR environment  that resulted in weirdness 
like r/o filesystems.   Are any HCP messages occuring?  Do all paths show 
online in q paths?   There have been a few apars around correct behavior for 
bad chpid recovery in the last 6 months or so.  I think it is woth opening a 
PMR. 


Marcy.  Sent from my BlackBerry. 


- Original Message -
From: Rick Barlow [mailto:rrhbar...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2013 12:19 AM Central Standard Time
To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
Subject: Re: [LINUX-390] Where does Linux store path information for dasd 
devices?

Thanks Marcy.  That is a good thought.  Unfortunately, EREP doesn't even
log errors unless there are 10 consecutive failures.  So intermittent
errors can go unrecorded.  Depending on how Linux counts, that could be
possible.

We had issues on about a dozen Linux guests spread across 4 z/VM LPARs that
share this DASD subsystem.  There are over 500 Linux guests on these
LPARs.  This does not make much sense.  I am supposed to make the same kind
of change on our production systems but I can't take a risk of this kind of
problem.  This is not good!

Rick


On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:04 AM, Marcy Cortes
marcy.d.cor...@wellsfargo.comwrote:

 Do you have any errors on any of these new paths?   I recently learned
 linux will switch to read only after 256 failed i/o. Any erep records
 generated?


 Marcy.  Sent from my BlackBerry.


 - Original Message -
 From: Rick Barlow [mailto:rrhbar...@gmail.com]
 Sent: Monday, July 08, 2013 10:42 PM Central Standard Time
 To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
 Subject: Re: [LINUX-390] Where does Linux store path information for dasd
 devices?

 That is what I thought too.  However, some guests are having issues.  Some
 parts of lvm groups switched to r/o.  Some page errors.  It is not
 consistent.  I'm confused!

 Rick Barlow
 Nationwide


 On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 11:34 PM, Scott Rohling scott.rohl...@gmail.com
 wrote:

  I would think this would be transparent to a guest  it's path will be
  the minidisk ..  which won't change - unless I misunderstand what you
 mean
  by switches.  Are you presenting the DASD as minidisks, or attaching
 them?
  Either way I don't see the pathing changing at the Linux level.
 
  Scott Rohling
 
 
  On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 8:12 PM, Rick Barlow rrhbar...@gmail.com wrote:
 
   I have many Linux guests running on z/VM.  We are in the process of
   migrating ECKD DASD from old switches to new switches.  I am trying to
  find
   out how Linux stores the paths information, how to display what Linux
   thinks and whether there is a way to tell Linux to re-validate its path
   information.
  
   Thanks,
   Rick Barlow


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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-09 Thread Rick Barlow
As far as I know, zHPF is disabled.  However, I do not know how to confirm
that.

We have 8 FICON paths to the DASD subsystem shared through switches to 2
z196 machines each having 8 FICON paths to the switches.  Of the 8 paths, 4
have been offline from all 8 LPARs for a couple of months while we waited
for IODF changes and physical cabling changes to move those 4 paths from
old switches to newer switches.  Last evening, I varied on the 4 paths that
were moved to all 8 LPARs and verified that they were online to the DASD.
I only spot checked the paths and not all 1800 volumes.  After I confirmed
that all 8 paths were online to the DASD, I took the other 4 paths
offline.  Shortly after that, the small subset of Linux guests began having
problems.  We only saw issues on about 20 of over 500 Linux guests.

I am going to open a PMR and find out how to capture documentation to
better understand what is happening.

Thank you to all who suggested possible solutions.

Rick Barlow

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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-09 Thread Peter Oberparleiter

On 09.07.2013 13:39, Rick Barlow wrote:

We have 8 FICON paths to the DASD subsystem shared through switches to 2
z196 machines each having 8 FICON paths to the switches.  Of the 8 paths, 4
have been offline from all 8 LPARs for a couple of months while we waited
for IODF changes and physical cabling changes to move those 4 paths from
old switches to newer switches.  Last evening, I varied on the 4 paths that
were moved to all 8 LPARs and verified that they were online to the DASD.
I only spot checked the paths and not all 1800 volumes.  After I confirmed
that all 8 paths were online to the DASD, I took the other 4 paths
offline.  Shortly after that, the small subset of Linux guests began having
problems.  We only saw issues on about 20 of over 500 Linux guests.


The recommended procedure for performing maintenance on a CHPID looks
like this:

1. Vary CHPID off in Linux (chchp -v 0 CHPID)
2. Vary path off in z/VM
3. Vary CHPID off in z/VM
4. Perform maintenance
5. Vary CHPID on in z/VM
6. Vary path on in z/VM
7. Vary CHPID on in Linux (chchp -v 1 CHPID)

If necessary, step 7 can be used after the fact to tell Linux to update
status information for all paths of all devices using that CHPID.


Regards,
  Peter Oberparleiter

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Linux on System z Development - IBM Germany

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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-09 Thread Jonathan Quay
This may not be of much help, but  In our non mainframe environment
where we present NAS as SCSI, our filesystems drop into read only when they
experience time outs due to dasd controller performance and contention
issues, or underlying netiwork issues.  You can see it in the kernel
message ring buffer.  Perhaps you are experiencing similar problems with
your new disk subsystem?


On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 7:39 AM, Rick Barlow rrhbar...@gmail.com wrote:

 As far as I know, zHPF is disabled.  However, I do not know how to confirm
 that.

 We have 8 FICON paths to the DASD subsystem shared through switches to 2
 z196 machines each having 8 FICON paths to the switches.  Of the 8 paths, 4
 have been offline from all 8 LPARs for a couple of months while we waited
 for IODF changes and physical cabling changes to move those 4 paths from
 old switches to newer switches.  Last evening, I varied on the 4 paths that
 were moved to all 8 LPARs and verified that they were online to the DASD.
 I only spot checked the paths and not all 1800 volumes.  After I confirmed
 that all 8 paths were online to the DASD, I took the other 4 paths
 offline.  Shortly after that, the small subset of Linux guests began having
 problems.  We only saw issues on about 20 of over 500 Linux guests.

 I am going to open a PMR and find out how to capture documentation to
 better understand what is happening.

 Thank you to all who suggested possible solutions.

 Rick Barlow

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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-09 Thread Rick Barlow
Thank you Peter!

Apparently, use of chchp on any path causes Linux to validate all of the
CHPIDs.

Using lscss, I found that many guests still show status like this:
Device   Subchan.  DevType CU Type Use  PIM PAM POM  CHPIDs
--
0.0.01B0 0.0.000A  3390/0C 3990/E9 yes  FF  FF  FF   444BA0B1 A1B06F4D

After chchp -v 0 b1, the output changed to:
Device   Subchan.  DevType CU Type Use  PIM PAM POM  CHPIDs
--
0.0.01B0 0.0.000A  3390/0C 3990/E9 yes  FF  E4  FF   444BA0B1 A1B06F4D

Linux apparently found that 4 paths are actually offline.  This
circumvention whould help to avoid the problem we encountered.

So, there are 2 issues remaining.

1) Of my 500+ Linux guests, only about 20 had issues that caused file
system problems even though all show the issue using lscss.
2) Why doesn't Linux receive and handle pathing issues when they occur?  It
is not an unusual situation to take DASD paths off and back on.

I am not going to pursue this further on the list.  I will be opening a
Service Request to investigate this further.

Rick Barlow
Nationwide

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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-09 Thread Bruce Hayden
This is also why OPTION CHPIDVIRTUALIZATION ONE (and also the GLOBALOPTS
statement) was invented, so that relocating guests don't see the real paths
or care if the paths on the LPAR they move to change.  The notes in the CP
planning guide say A single, virtualized CHPID is presented to the guest
for dedicated devices and minidisks, independent of the real system CHPID.
All online paths will still be used to support the guest I/O. This option
is a requirement for a guest to be eligible for live guest relocation. and
also This option should be specified only when the guest is going to be
relocated. In addition to virtualizing the CHPID numbers, CHPIDV ONE
results in DASD path group ID virtualization.

I'm not sure why it is suggested that this option is only used for
relocating guests.  It seems that it would have been useful to you if your
Linux guests had this option in effect before you started changing the
paths!


On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 11:31 AM, Rick Barlow rrhbar...@gmail.com wrote:

 Thank you Peter!

 Apparently, use of chchp on any path causes Linux to validate all of the
 CHPIDs.

 Using lscss, I found that many guests still show status like this:
 Device   Subchan.  DevType CU Type Use  PIM PAM POM  CHPIDs
 --
 0.0.01B0 0.0.000A  3390/0C 3990/E9 yes  FF  FF  FF   444BA0B1 A1B06F4D

 After chchp -v 0 b1, the output changed to:
 Device   Subchan.  DevType CU Type Use  PIM PAM POM  CHPIDs
 --
 0.0.01B0 0.0.000A  3390/0C 3990/E9 yes  FF  E4  FF   444BA0B1 A1B06F4D

 Linux apparently found that 4 paths are actually offline.  This
 circumvention whould help to avoid the problem we encountered.

 So, there are 2 issues remaining.

 1) Of my 500+ Linux guests, only about 20 had issues that caused file
 system problems even though all show the issue using lscss.
 2) Why doesn't Linux receive and handle pathing issues when they occur?  It
 is not an unusual situation to take DASD paths off and back on.

 I am not going to pursue this further on the list.  I will be opening a
 Service Request to investigate this further.

 Rick Barlow
 Nationwide

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--
Bruce Hayden
z/VM and Linux on System z ATS
IBM, Endicott, NY

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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-09 Thread Sebastian Ott
On Tue, 9 Jul 2013, Rick Barlow wrote:
 2) Why doesn't Linux receive and handle pathing issues when they occur?

It does (after receiving a notification from the hardware/firmware or
hypervisor, or after beeing triggered by the admin). But it looks like it
didn't receive a notification that something changed.

Regards,
Sebastian

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Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-08 Thread Rick Barlow
I have many Linux guests running on z/VM.  We are in the process of
migrating ECKD DASD from old switches to new switches.  I am trying to find
out how Linux stores the paths information, how to display what Linux
thinks and whether there is a way to tell Linux to re-validate its path
information.

Thanks,
Rick Barlow
Nationwide

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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-08 Thread Scott Rohling
I would think this would be transparent to a guest  it's path will be
the minidisk ..  which won't change - unless I misunderstand what you mean
by switches.  Are you presenting the DASD as minidisks, or attaching them?
Either way I don't see the pathing changing at the Linux level.

Scott Rohling


On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 8:12 PM, Rick Barlow rrhbar...@gmail.com wrote:

 I have many Linux guests running on z/VM.  We are in the process of
 migrating ECKD DASD from old switches to new switches.  I am trying to find
 out how Linux stores the paths information, how to display what Linux
 thinks and whether there is a way to tell Linux to re-validate its path
 information.

 Thanks,
 Rick Barlow
 Nationwide

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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-08 Thread Rick Barlow
That is what I thought too.  However, some guests are having issues.  Some
parts of lvm groups switched to r/o.  Some page errors.  It is not
consistent.  I'm confused!

Rick Barlow
Nationwide


On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 11:34 PM, Scott Rohling scott.rohl...@gmail.comwrote:

 I would think this would be transparent to a guest  it's path will be
 the minidisk ..  which won't change - unless I misunderstand what you mean
 by switches.  Are you presenting the DASD as minidisks, or attaching them?
 Either way I don't see the pathing changing at the Linux level.

 Scott Rohling


 On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 8:12 PM, Rick Barlow rrhbar...@gmail.com wrote:

  I have many Linux guests running on z/VM.  We are in the process of
  migrating ECKD DASD from old switches to new switches.  I am trying to
 find
  out how Linux stores the paths information, how to display what Linux
  thinks and whether there is a way to tell Linux to re-validate its path
  information.
 
  Thanks,
  Rick Barlow


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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-08 Thread David Kreuter
Perhaps the UUID' s of the DASD got changed or mangled  at the CP level? 
David Kreuter

 Original message 
From: Rick Barlow rrhbar...@gmail.com 
Date:  
To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU 
Subject: Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices? 
 
That is what I thought too.  However, some guests are having issues.  Some
parts of lvm groups switched to r/o.  Some page errors.  It is not
consistent.  I'm confused!

Rick Barlow
Nationwide


On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 11:34 PM, Scott Rohling scott.rohl...@gmail.comwrote:

 I would think this would be transparent to a guest  it's path will be
 the minidisk ..  which won't change - unless I misunderstand what you mean
 by switches.  Are you presenting the DASD as minidisks, or attaching them?
 Either way I don't see the pathing changing at the Linux level.

 Scott Rohling


 On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 8:12 PM, Rick Barlow rrhbar...@gmail.com wrote:

  I have many Linux guests running on z/VM.  We are in the process of
  migrating ECKD DASD from old switches to new switches.  I am trying to
 find
  out how Linux stores the paths information, how to display what Linux
  thinks and whether there is a way to tell Linux to re-validate its path
  information.
 
  Thanks,
  Rick Barlow


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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-08 Thread Rick Troth
inline: velologo.gifinline: Facebook.jpginline: LinkedIn.jpginline: TwitterL.jpginline: XingButt.jpg

Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-08 Thread Marcy Cortes
Do you have any errors on any of these new paths?   I recently learned linux 
will switch to read only after 256 failed i/o. Any erep records generated?


Marcy.  Sent from my BlackBerry. 


- Original Message -
From: Rick Barlow [mailto:rrhbar...@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, July 08, 2013 10:42 PM Central Standard Time
To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
Subject: Re: [LINUX-390] Where does Linux store path information for dasd 
devices?

That is what I thought too.  However, some guests are having issues.  Some
parts of lvm groups switched to r/o.  Some page errors.  It is not
consistent.  I'm confused!

Rick Barlow
Nationwide


On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 11:34 PM, Scott Rohling scott.rohl...@gmail.comwrote:

 I would think this would be transparent to a guest  it's path will be
 the minidisk ..  which won't change - unless I misunderstand what you mean
 by switches.  Are you presenting the DASD as minidisks, or attaching them?
 Either way I don't see the pathing changing at the Linux level.

 Scott Rohling


 On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 8:12 PM, Rick Barlow rrhbar...@gmail.com wrote:

  I have many Linux guests running on z/VM.  We are in the process of
  migrating ECKD DASD from old switches to new switches.  I am trying to
 find
  out how Linux stores the paths information, how to display what Linux
  thinks and whether there is a way to tell Linux to re-validate its path
  information.
 
  Thanks,
  Rick Barlow


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Re: Where does Linux store path information for dasd devices?

2013-07-08 Thread Rick Barlow
Thanks Marcy.  That is a good thought.  Unfortunately, EREP doesn't even
log errors unless there are 10 consecutive failures.  So intermittent
errors can go unrecorded.  Depending on how Linux counts, that could be
possible.

We had issues on about a dozen Linux guests spread across 4 z/VM LPARs that
share this DASD subsystem.  There are over 500 Linux guests on these
LPARs.  This does not make much sense.  I am supposed to make the same kind
of change on our production systems but I can't take a risk of this kind of
problem.  This is not good!

Rick


On Tue, Jul 9, 2013 at 1:04 AM, Marcy Cortes
marcy.d.cor...@wellsfargo.comwrote:

 Do you have any errors on any of these new paths?   I recently learned
 linux will switch to read only after 256 failed i/o. Any erep records
 generated?


 Marcy.  Sent from my BlackBerry.


 - Original Message -
 From: Rick Barlow [mailto:rrhbar...@gmail.com]
 Sent: Monday, July 08, 2013 10:42 PM Central Standard Time
 To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
 Subject: Re: [LINUX-390] Where does Linux store path information for dasd
 devices?

 That is what I thought too.  However, some guests are having issues.  Some
 parts of lvm groups switched to r/o.  Some page errors.  It is not
 consistent.  I'm confused!

 Rick Barlow
 Nationwide


 On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 11:34 PM, Scott Rohling scott.rohl...@gmail.com
 wrote:

  I would think this would be transparent to a guest  it's path will be
  the minidisk ..  which won't change - unless I misunderstand what you
 mean
  by switches.  Are you presenting the DASD as minidisks, or attaching
 them?
  Either way I don't see the pathing changing at the Linux level.
 
  Scott Rohling
 
 
  On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 8:12 PM, Rick Barlow rrhbar...@gmail.com wrote:
 
   I have many Linux guests running on z/VM.  We are in the process of
   migrating ECKD DASD from old switches to new switches.  I am trying to
  find
   out how Linux stores the paths information, how to display what Linux
   thinks and whether there is a way to tell Linux to re-validate its path
   information.
  
   Thanks,
   Rick Barlow


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