[Herzelinux] Thinking in Drupal by Lior Kesos, Linnovate
Hi all, Another rare treat this week at Herzelinux - Lior Kesos on Drupal, this Thursday, Feb 19 at 18:30 in Hi Tech Collage - Maskit 27 Herzliya Pituach, Israel (free entrance, free parking, free cookies coffee). If you ever build anything for the web you really should come hear this lecture on how web apps are built in the 21st century using the Open Source Drupal framework from the Israeli Drupal Guru himself. Abstract: Drupal (and cms's at large) present a new way of assembling web sites and applications. In the lecture we will try to introduce what it means to Think in Drupal, Changing the way you approach web based software development. This is done by using the award winning drupal development framework and it's widely used contributed modules (cck, view, nodequeue, flag, services, actions etc.. ) In addition to Lior lecture, we have the following line up of upcoming lectures: - Thu March 21 18:30: Code control using ther GNU linker by Raviv haim - Thu April 12 18:30: Lissa Sterling about developing Cellular applications. - Thu April 23 18:30: Do Android Dream of Electronic Sheep, or Dude! there's a firewall on my cellphone...by Gilad Ben-Yossef I would like to take this opportunity to thank our volunteer presenters without which Herzelinux would not have been possible and to invite people reading this consider joining their ranks - so drop me a note with your preferred Open Source or Linux topic today :-) Herzel-what? Herzelinux is a Linux Linux user group. It's aim is to try to bridge the gap between professional Linux programmers working for Hi tech companies and the Linux Open Source community and bring them into the fold. As such: - The meeting topics will tend towards the advance technical stuff which is of interest to professional programmers. - The meeting takes place in Herzelia Pituch (Maskit 27, In hi-tech College - there's a map on the site), a short walking distance from most of Silicon Wadi companies, to the pleasure of the lazy Hi Tech bums :-) Other then that it's just yet anther LUG, like Haifux and Telux, whose format we're basically mimicking (read: most sincere form of flattery and so on...) Needless to say, it's free, both in speech and in coffee (not very good coffee but it's provided for free by Hi tech College so we shouldn't complain) and you are all invited. In fact, I'd truly appreciate if you can spread the word and invite fellow programmers working on Linux which are not alpha Linux geeks. For more details: http://tuxology.net/herzelinux To get updates of club meeting by RSS: http://tinyurl.com/herzelinux To get updates of club meeting via Google Calender: http://tinyurl.com/Herzelinux-cal To get updates the club meetings via iCal feed: http://tinyurl.com/Herzelinux-ical For Facebook lovers - join our group on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Herzliya-Israel/Herzelinux/10832254949 See you there, Gilad -- Gilad Ben-Yossef Chief Coffee Drinker Codefidence Ltd. The code is free, your time isn't.(TM) Web:http://codefidence.com Email: gi...@codefidence.com Office: +972-8-9316883 ext. 201 Fax:+972-8-9316885 Mobile: +972-52-8260388 The Doctor: Don't worry, Reinette, just a nightmare. Everyone has nightmares. Even monsters from under the bed have nightmares, don't you, monster? Reinette: What do monsters have nightmares about? The Doctor: Me! ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
gmail manager
Hi, Many users here on this list use GMail Manager extension and few people might be surprised (since yesterday) to find that Firefox will give them a redirect loop message when they will try to open GMail from the GMail Manager. Apparently, a bug in the addon causes this issue. If you have this problem or installed GMail Manager 0.5.7, please upgrade to 0.5.7.1 from this URL: http://www.longfocus.com/firefox/gmanager/releases/gmanager0571.xpi Thanks, Hetz -- Skepticism is the lazy person's default position. my blog (hebrew): http://benhamo.org ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: gmail manager
You don't have to. The 0.5.7.1 version is already on AMO, and your extension will automatically update itself. Please don't point people directly to the XPI file, as it won't give users the ability to always get the latest version, and point them instead to the extension page on AMO which is more secured and trusted. https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/1320 On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 12:00, Hetz Ben Hamo het...@gmail.com wrote: Many users here on this list use GMail Manager extension and few people might be surprised (since yesterday) to find that Firefox will give them a redirect loop message when they will try to open GMail from the GMail Manager. Apparently, a bug in the addon causes this issue. If you have this problem or installed GMail Manager 0.5.7, please upgrade to 0.5.7.1 from this URL: http://www.longfocus.com/firefox/gmanager/releases/gmanager0571.xpi -- Tomer Cohen http://tomercohen.com Mike Ditka - If God had wanted man to play soccer, he wouldn't have given us arms. ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
Hi all! Yesterday we held a meeting where Zvi Devir gave his Windows Refund HOWTO, which was an interesting presentation about a widely-discussed topic, that received a lot of publicity. I publicised this meeting on several mailing lists, as well as on whatsup, linmagazine, and other forums. We also have some feeds, and a Google calendar for the events (also in iCal format) if people wish to subscribe to them exclusively. However, despite all that, only 5-6 people (including the presenter and me) came to hear the talk. The question is why? Zvi already advised me that next times I should approach TAU-specific channels and publicise it there. I'll talk with Eddie Aronovich, who is our contact in the university about it. However, it still doesn't explain why many previous Telux attendees, who are not associated with the university did not come. So: 1. What is the reason you did not come? 2. I set up a page about how you can help the club: http://wiki.osdc.org.il/index.php/OSDClub_-_How_You_Can_Help Please read it and any additions or suggestions will be welcome. - Would you prefer to deprecate Telux, and to announce that it was good while it lasted, but there's no point in organising further presentations? I'm tired of being the only one who cares and volunteers. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- - Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ http://www.shlomifish.org/humour/ways_to_do_it.html maukeI'm not interested in what you're doing; what are you trying to achieve? PerlJam mauke: I'm trying to achieve world peace and this regex is the last thing standing in my way! ;) ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Netvision: The early-disconnect fees! 40 NIS * 11 months = 800 NIS fees!
As I have written earlier, I am leaving Netvision because after three days of no one taking an interest in my frequent disconnects, I took up service with Bezeq Beinleumi. Now I have spoken with several senior representatives at Netvision and they think that: 1) Having a promise of a technician to call me on Wednesday and a technician actually returning my call on Friday is to return the call within 24 hours. 2) Having a promise of a technician to call me on Wednesday and a technician actually returning my call on Friday is perfectly normal and that I would receive the same service elsewhere. 3) A customer that cannot connect to the internet for two weeks is not a reason to start looking for another ISP (The representative's example, not mine!). 4) If there is a problem affecting the infrastructure's service, then that releases the ISP from checking other possible causes of frequent disconnects. Even if the infrastructure's problem is not affecting the area that I live in, and even if I manage to connect without problems with another ISP. 5) Calling repeatedly for three days, and for _hours_ begging technicians to check my connection, to check my configuration, to do _something_ is not making an effort to have the ISP resolve my problems. Even if the technician's answer was always there is nothing to do. 6) A 800 NIS fee is a reasonable way out of a 40 NIS * 11 month contract (that the company itself broke after only two weeks of service). The senior representative insists that anything less is a charity. Actually, at this point she attacked me and asked if I think that Netvision is a charity. This is not the first time that a Netvision rep was rude with me on the phone. To be fair, I have also been rude to Netvision representatives, though that was after much begging. Avoid Netvision. They lost me as customer not because of the inability for me to get a reliable connection. They lost me as a customer for one year (the time I must stay with Bezeq Beinleumi) because they refuse to even check if there was a problem on their end. But they lost me as a customer for life because they insist on taking my money even after all of this. I had canceled my credit card constant payment to them, and when I called to let them know that, they insist that they will _still_ try to charge my card, and that I will have a compound debt to them. I don't care if Bezeq Beinleumi is more expensive, and I don't care that Bezeq Beinleumi may (or my not) have more outages. When I call them they jump to help me. Even before I gave them an agora and committed to them, they gave me a temporary name and password to connect to check if I even _could_ connect, knowing full well that I am a Netvision customer. Bezeq Beinleumi has the best service, and actively _tries_ to get it's customers (and Netvision's customers) connected to the Internet. They have my business. -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-נ-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת ا-ب-ت-ث-ج-ح-خ-د-ذ-ر-ز-س-ش-ص-ض-ط-ظ-ع-غ-ف-ق-ك-ل-م-ن-ه-و-ي А-Б-В-Г-Д-Е-Ё-Ж-З-И-Й-К-Л-М-Н-О-П-Р-С-Т-У-Ф-Х-Ц-Ч-Ш-Щ-Ъ-Ы-Ь-Э-Ю-Я а-б-в-г-д-е-ё-ж-з-и-й-к-л-м-н-о-п-р-с-т-у-ф-х-ц-ч-ш-щ-ъ-ы-ь-э-ю-я ä-ö-ü-ß-Ä-Ö-Ü ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
1. What is the reason you did not come? It's in Tel Aviv, I am in Haifa. So that there will be no mistake, I think that the subject is both interesting and important, even if few people show up it is _still_ important. -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-נ-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת ا-ب-ت-ث-ج-ح-خ-د-ذ-ر-ز-س-ش-ص-ض-ط-ظ-ع-غ-ف-ق-ك-ل-م-ن-ه-و-ي А-Б-В-Г-Д-Е-Ё-Ж-З-И-Й-К-Л-М-Н-О-П-Р-С-Т-У-Ф-Х-Ц-Ч-Ш-Щ-Ъ-Ы-Ь-Э-Ю-Я а-б-в-г-д-е-ё-ж-з-и-й-к-л-м-н-о-п-р-с-т-у-ф-х-ц-ч-ш-щ-ъ-ы-ь-э-ю-я ä-ö-ü-ß-Ä-Ö-Ü ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
I am sorry I could not come although I really wanted to come. I had some personal problems that prevented me from going yesterday. Everything is Ok now. I myself satisfied with the way Shlomi advertises the activities, however it seems we need to find more advertising channels. -- Ori Idan On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 1:07 PM, Shlomi Fish shlo...@iglu.org.il wrote: Hi all! Yesterday we held a meeting where Zvi Devir gave his Windows Refund HOWTO, which was an interesting presentation about a widely-discussed topic, that received a lot of publicity. I publicised this meeting on several mailing lists, as well as on whatsup, linmagazine, and other forums. We also have some feeds, and a Google calendar for the events (also in iCal format) if people wish to subscribe to them exclusively. However, despite all that, only 5-6 people (including the presenter and me) came to hear the talk. The question is why? Zvi already advised me that next times I should approach TAU-specific channels and publicise it there. I'll talk with Eddie Aronovich, who is our contact in the university about it. However, it still doesn't explain why many previous Telux attendees, who are not associated with the university did not come. So: 1. What is the reason you did not come? 2. I set up a page about how you can help the club: http://wiki.osdc.org.il/index.php/OSDClub_-_How_You_Can_Help Please read it and any additions or suggestions will be welcome. - Would you prefer to deprecate Telux, and to announce that it was good while it lasted, but there's no point in organising further presentations? I'm tired of being the only one who cares and volunteers. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- - Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ http://www.shlomifish.org/humour/ways_to_do_it.html maukeI'm not interested in what you're doing; what are you trying to achieve? PerlJam mauke: I'm trying to achieve world peace and this regex is the last thing standing in my way! ;) ___ Telux mailing list te...@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/telux ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
Shlomi, Shlomi Fish wrote: Yesterday we held a meeting where Zvi Devir gave his Windows Refund HOWTO, which was an interesting presentation about a widely-discussed topic, that received a lot of publicity. I publicised this meeting on several mailing lists, as well as on whatsup, linmagazine, and other forums. We also have some feeds, and a Google calendar for the events (also in iCal format) if people wish to subscribe to them exclusively. However, despite all that, only 5-6 people (including the presenter and me) came to hear the talk. The question is why? Please don't take it so hard. It's just normal artifact of a club meeting that requires no RSVP. In Herzelinux we've just had two very interesting lectures, one three weeks after the other: 6 people showed up to the first and over 25 to the second (we ran out of chairs in the room...). It just depends on a bazillion things going on in people's life. Maybe there was a good soccer match yesterday :-) I'd suggest adding an RSVP option to meetings and only doing the meeting if enough people RSVP but I sort of doubt that this will work... Gilad -- Gilad Ben-Yossef Chief Coffee Drinker Codefidence Ltd. The code is free, your time isn't.(TM) Web:http://codefidence.com Email: gi...@codefidence.com Office: +972-8-9316883 ext. 201 Fax:+972-8-9316885 Mobile: +972-52-8260388 The Doctor: Don't worry, Reinette, just a nightmare. Everyone has nightmares. Even monsters from under the bed have nightmares, don't you, monster? Reinette: What do monsters have nightmares about? The Doctor: Me! ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Netvision: The early-disconnect fees! 40 NIS * 11 months = 800 NIS fees!
2009/2/16 Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com As I have written earlier, I am leaving Netvision because after three days of no one taking an interest in my frequent disconnects, I took up service with Bezeq Beinleumi. Now I have spoken with several senior representatives at Netvision and they think that: A web site just for this kind of ranting... http://tluna.co.il/companies/company.asp?companyID=131 Good luck with getting back your money and a nice compensation... The problem in Israel is that there only about two(?) real options for home users, aren't there? Cheers, --Amos ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Netvision: The early-disconnect fees! 40 NIS * 11 months = 800 NIS fees!
A web site just for this kind of ranting... http://tluna.co.il/companies/company.asp?companyID=131 Actually, I think that I'll just post a message about his at every faculty and bus stop in the Technion. Very influential people go there. It is my responsibility to let them know. Good luck with getting back your money and a nice compensation... When they try to charge my card that is canceled, I suppose that they will take me to court. I'll let you know how it turns out. The problem in Israel is that there only about two(?) real options for home users, aren't there? Smoke signals, and what else? -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-נ-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת ا-ب-ت-ث-ج-ح-خ-د-ذ-ر-ز-س-ش-ص-ض-ط-ظ-ع-غ-ف-ق-ك-ل-م-ن-ه-و-ي А-Б-В-Г-Д-Е-Ё-Ж-З-И-Й-К-Л-М-Н-О-П-Р-С-Т-У-Ф-Х-Ц-Ч-Ш-Щ-Ъ-Ы-Ь-Э-Ю-Я а-б-в-г-д-е-ё-ж-з-и-й-к-л-м-н-о-п-р-с-т-у-ф-х-ц-ч-ш-щ-ъ-ы-ь-э-ю-я ä-ö-ü-ß-Ä-Ö-Ü ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Netvision: The early-disconnect fees! 40 NIS * 11 months = 800 NIS fees!
AFAIK legally, no matter what is written in the contract, they can not fine you by 800 nis, if you would have payed them only 11*40 if you stayed. this is not resonable as is required by section 15a of hok hahozim - trufot. as i recall, there is a presedance on it, but i can't remember. don't quote me on that, but that what i remember from Diney hozim i learned around 10 years ago. On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 1:42 PM, Amos Shapira amos.shap...@gmail.comwrote: 2009/2/16 Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com As I have written earlier, I am leaving Netvision because after three days of no one taking an interest in my frequent disconnects, I took up service with Bezeq Beinleumi. Now I have spoken with several senior representatives at Netvision and they think that: A web site just for this kind of ranting... http://tluna.co.il/companies/company.asp?companyID=131 Good luck with getting back your money and a nice compensation... The problem in Israel is that there only about two(?) real options for home users, aren't there? Cheers, --Amos ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Netvision: The early-disconnect fees! 40 NIS * 11 months = 800 NIS fees!
On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 10:42:10PM +1100, Amos Shapira wrote: The problem in Israel is that there only about two(?) real options for home users, aren't there? I want to preface this with I have been a happy customer of Netvision since the day IBM stopped accepting Israeli credit cards, around the year 2000. I also want to preface this with IMHO BBL is the scum of the earth, part of the BEZEQ, BBL, Pelephone trio who threatens you with jail time if you don't agree to their bills. The two for landlines I know of are QOS (www.qos.co.il) who is the consumer division of BYNET. I don't know more about them than they exist. The other is Orange. Orange has a deal where you provide your own line (aDSL/cable), they provide a router, 2.5m download speed ISP service and a VoIP line with 600 minutes a month to all Israeli phones for 139 NIS. IMHO it's not a good deal unless you make lots of calls to cell phones. If you a home phone switch and can route cellular calls via it, you could save a lot of money, routing your other calls to a cheaper alternative. Cell-Com has a deal for 130 NIS a month, including modem (18 month commitment) for cellular based, unlimited Internet access. It's designed for laptops, but if you can figure out how to use it with a home network, it would be a good alternative. People using it say they get better than 2.5m download speeds. Orange has a similar, cheaper deal, 80 NIS a month, with a 5 GB limit. There is a 36 month payout on the modem (20 NIS a month) and no commitment on the service (60 NIS a month). Geoff. -- Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel g...@mendelson.com N3OWJ/4X1GM ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
Hi, I have found that people intend to subscribe to mailing lists more than to read RSS or visit some websites every few days. Unless you are going to advertise the lectures in sites such as Slashdot, I think most of the audience would prefer a mailing list, open for announcements only, and will advertise every single talk, on every subject, by every local user group all over to country. If things will go well this way, you may be able to use more advanced methods (such as a Wordpress installation with categories feed) in the future. Tomer 2009/2/16 Ori Idan o...@helicontech.co.il I am sorry I could not come although I really wanted to come. I had some personal problems that prevented me from going yesterday. Everything is Ok now. I myself satisfied with the way Shlomi advertises the activities, however it seems we need to find more advertising channels. -- Tomer Cohen http://tomercohen.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Netvision: The early-disconnect fees! 40 NIS * 11 months = 800 NIS fees!
On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 02:05:53PM +0200, Dotan Cohen wrote: Actually, I think that I'll just post a message about his at every faculty and bus stop in the Technion. Very influential people go there. It is my responsibility to let them know. Since the new consumer protection law went into effect Jan 1, you may have new legal rights. IMHO you should call/fax/email the CEO of Netvision. Stop dealing with flunkies. Maybe the new government will have a communications minister who cares about such things, until then a complaint to them still may do something. Geoff. -- Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel g...@mendelson.com N3OWJ/4X1GM ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
On Monday 16 February 2009 13:18:48 Dotan Cohen wrote: 1. What is the reason you did not come? It's in Tel Aviv, I am in Haifa. Fair enough. Haifa Residents weren't exactly my audience in asking this question. So that there will be no mistake, I think that the subject is both interesting and important, even if few people show up it is _still_ important. Right, but I would prefer if more did. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- - Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ Funny Anti-Terrorism Story - http://xrl.us/bjn7t maukeI'm not interested in what you're doing; what are you trying to achieve? PerlJam mauke: I'm trying to achieve world peace and this regex is the last thing standing in my way! ;) ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
On Monday 16 February 2009 13:22:04 Ori Idan wrote: I am sorry I could not come although I really wanted to come. I had some personal problems that prevented me from going yesterday. I see. Everything is Ok now. I myself satisfied with the way Shlomi advertises the activities, however it seems we need to find more advertising channels. Right. The question is which? The Israeli forums such as Tapuz, Nana, Walla, etc. are popular, but I personally cannot stand using them. I'd be happy to aid anyone who volunteers to post there, but so far no one volunteered. If someone can give me a script to post there (that accepts HTML or something as input), that would also be good, and I can make a good use of it. I may have been missing some Israeli Linux sites such as zulo or linux.israel.net. Furthermore, does NRG or YNet accept such announcements? Zvi suggested publicising using TAU-specific resources such as the students' association. I'll have to ask Eddie about that. I recall running into many forums on various Israeli sites that may allow posting to them. I personally don't frequent any of them, but others. Otherwise, why don't people blog about such events on their blogs? Regards, Shlomi Fish -- - Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ Why I Love Perl - http://xrl.us/bjn88 maukeI'm not interested in what you're doing; what are you trying to achieve? PerlJam mauke: I'm trying to achieve world peace and this regex is the last thing standing in my way! ;) ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
On Monday 16 February 2009 13:47:35 Tomer Cohen wrote: Hi, I have found that people intend to subscribe to mailing lists more than to read RSS or visit some websites every few days. Unless you are going to advertise the lectures in sites such as Slashdot, I think most of the audience would prefer a mailing list, open for announcements only, and will advertise every single talk, on every subject, by every local user group all over to country. If things will go well this way, you may be able to use more advanced methods (such as a Wordpress installation with categories feed) in the future. Sounds like a good suggestion. Shachar (CCed to this message) - may you please set up an eve...@hamakor.org.il mailing list, making it restricted to posts only by admins (and/or a selected group of email addresses), without a reply- to-address, and making me an admin capable of making other people able to post? I should also note that my request to have a new mailing list for the people who administer the web-sites and other infrastructure (which you agreed to) is long overdue. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- - Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ Understand what Open Source is - http://xrl.us/bjn82 maukeI'm not interested in what you're doing; what are you trying to achieve? PerlJam mauke: I'm trying to achieve world peace and this regex is the last thing standing in my way! ;) ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
On Monday 16 February 2009 13:44:34 Nadav Vinik wrote: On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 1:07 PM, Shlomi Fish shlo...@iglu.org.il wrote: Hi all! Yesterday we held a meeting where Zvi Devir gave his Windows Refund HOWTO, which was an interesting presentation about a widely-discussed topic, that received a lot of publicity. I publicised this meeting on several mailing lists, as well as on whatsup, linmagazine, and other forums. We also have some feeds, and a Google calendar for the events (also in iCal format) if people wish to subscribe to them exclusively. However, despite all that, only 5-6 people (including the presenter and me) came to hear the talk. The question is why? Zvi already advised me that next times I should approach TAU-specific channels and publicise it there. I'll talk with Eddie Aronovich, who is our contact in the university about it. However, it still doesn't explain why many previous Telux attendees, who are not associated with the university did not come. So: 1. What is the reason you did not come? The same reasons for the rest of the lectures which I didn't come: It's start to early in 6:30 and need to go out from work even earlier.. We've had similar discussions before. The problems with starting it later is: 1. The building gets closed at 20:30-21:00 . So we won't have a lot of time. 2. People tend to become tired so late into the night. 3. Some people have to return home early. (like K12 students, etc.) --- Note that getting to the meeting later is probably better than not coming at all. And I should note that other people and I have voiced our sentiments against the current practices of many weekly hours of work: http://xrl.us/begfcc . Regards, Shlomi Fish -- - Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ Best Introductory Programming Language - http://xrl.us/bjn84 maukeI'm not interested in what you're doing; what are you trying to achieve? PerlJam mauke: I'm trying to achieve world peace and this regex is the last thing standing in my way! ;) ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
On Monday 16 February 2009 13:41:45 Gilad Ben-Yossef wrote: Shlomi, Shlomi Fish wrote: Yesterday we held a meeting where Zvi Devir gave his Windows Refund HOWTO, which was an interesting presentation about a widely-discussed topic, that received a lot of publicity. I publicised this meeting on several mailing lists, as well as on whatsup, linmagazine, and other forums. We also have some feeds, and a Google calendar for the events (also in iCal format) if people wish to subscribe to them exclusively. However, despite all that, only 5-6 people (including the presenter and me) came to hear the talk. The question is why? Please don't take it so hard. It's just normal artifact of a club meeting that requires no RSVP. Maybe. But I've noticed a gradual dwindling in the number of Telux attendees in the past months, and it makes me unhappy. In Herzelinux we've just had two very interesting lectures, one three weeks after the other: 6 people showed up to the first and over 25 to the second (we ran out of chairs in the room...). It just depends on a bazillion things going on in people's life. Maybe there was a good soccer match yesterday :-) I realise there are fluctuations. But like I said we've been on a negative trend. I'd suggest adding an RSVP option to meetings and only doing the meeting if enough people RSVP but I sort of doubt that this will work... You can already RSVP to the event using Facebook. Not sure how many people bother doing that, or are on facebook, etc. And I still would rather have a meeting with a small attendance, than no meeting at all. And like you said requiring people to RSVP probably won't work. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- - Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ http://www.shlomifish.org/humour/ways_to_do_it.html maukeI'm not interested in what you're doing; what are you trying to achieve? PerlJam mauke: I'm trying to achieve world peace and this regex is the last thing standing in my way! ;) ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Linux spam on wikipedia.
Quoting Ira Abramov, from the post of Sun, 15 Feb: If anyone asks you about Jaya, The Linux Group, Miky Barzilay or the little community conference he's organizing, just give them a heads up. It may be a legitimate, professional business, but the guy practices dirty marketing, so he's got a black point in my book. My mistake everyone. false alarm. It's the good old linux-israel.net site with a new design. -- Thanking and leaving Yeruham Ira Abramov http://ira.abramov.org/email/ ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
Quoting Shlomi Fish, from the post of Mon, 16 Feb: Please don't take it so hard. It's just normal artifact of a club meeting that requires no RSVP. Maybe. But I've noticed a gradual dwindling in the number of Telux attendees in the past months, and it makes me unhappy. Well, I can tell you that my favorite channel for event updates these days is an ical subscription to my Google Calendar. that way I can see it in my calendar, get a (free!) SMS reminder before the event and/or an Email to remind me a few hours or days before it (no need for mailing list) or as RSS (no need for you to feed me). However, since Google is starting to irk me lately, that may change in favor of T-bird+lightning (I haven't tested how it handles ical subscriptions) I'm not on FB and won't be on it for the near future, so that's not a good option for advertising to me. requiring people to RSVP probably won't work. Can't require, but you can always ask, so see if ANYONE is intending to come. if more than 5 reply, you know you are good. if none reply you may still get 5-10 people showing up, but you will know when you can lower expectations (and buy less cookies) I realise there are fluctuations. But like I said we've been on a negative trend. Now you know how I felt back in 2000... -- Boy genious Ira Abramov http://ira.abramov.org/email/ ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Netvision: The early-disconnect fees! 40 NIS * 11 months = 800 NIS fees!
Geoff, I will start with thanking you for giving the other alternative - I believe though that those are not very good alternatives, as you stated they mainly talk about phone oriented services, rather than Internet oriented services - I didn't see any mentioning of HOT aren't they a good alternative (never tried them)? What bothers me is the fact that you have stated that BBL are scum of the earth and Netvision is the greatest. This kind of comment is redundant, as Dotan didn't try to convince you to move, he just stated what he thinks. When you write the opposite from him, you are just degrading what he is saying, and it sounds like you are trying to protect your opinion, but again Dotan didn't say Geoffrey thinks otherwise... what a fool, he just stated how unhappy he is, it is his right. On Monday 16 February 2009 14:10:52 Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote: On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 10:42:10PM +1100, Amos Shapira wrote: The problem in Israel is that there only about two(?) real options for home users, aren't there? I want to preface this with I have been a happy customer of Netvision since the day IBM stopped accepting Israeli credit cards, around the year 2000. I also want to preface this with IMHO BBL is the scum of the earth, part of the BEZEQ, BBL, Pelephone trio who threatens you with jail time if you don't agree to their bills. The two for landlines I know of are QOS (www.qos.co.il) who is the consumer division of BYNET. I don't know more about them than they exist. The other is Orange. Orange has a deal where you provide your own line (aDSL/cable), they provide a router, 2.5m download speed ISP service and a VoIP line with 600 minutes a month to all Israeli phones for 139 NIS. IMHO it's not a good deal unless you make lots of calls to cell phones. If you a home phone switch and can route cellular calls via it, you could save a lot of money, routing your other calls to a cheaper alternative. Cell-Com has a deal for 130 NIS a month, including modem (18 month commitment) for cellular based, unlimited Internet access. It's designed for laptops, but if you can figure out how to use it with a home network, it would be a good alternative. People using it say they get better than 2.5m download speeds. Orange has a similar, cheaper deal, 80 NIS a month, with a 5 GB limit. There is a 36 month payout on the modem (20 NIS a month) and no commitment on the service (60 NIS a month). Geoff. -- Noam Rathaus CTO no...@beyondsecurity.com http://www.beyondsecurity.com Know that you are safe. ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
No noobs?
While referring a new Linux user to the Linux-il mailing list, I found this text on the page: No newbie questions (use gnubies-il instead). Can the lists be merged? This list is low enough traffic that doubling it should not be a problem, and the separation of noobs and gurus means that few gurus see the noobs posts, and they never get the help that they need. -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-נ-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת ا-ب-ت-ث-ج-ح-خ-د-ذ-ر-ز-س-ش-ص-ض-ط-ظ-ع-غ-ف-ق-ك-ل-م-ن-ه-و-ي А-Б-В-Г-Д-Е-Ё-Ж-З-И-Й-К-Л-М-Н-О-П-Р-С-Т-У-Ф-Х-Ц-Ч-Ш-Щ-Ъ-Ы-Ь-Э-Ю-Я а-б-в-г-д-е-ё-ж-з-и-й-к-л-м-н-о-п-р-с-т-у-ф-х-ц-ч-ш-щ-ъ-ы-ь-э-ю-я ä-ö-ü-ß-Ä-Ö-Ü ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Linux experts do not want to be bothered with newbie questions! (was: Re: No noobs?)
The split between Linux-IL and gnubies-il was made in order to spare the Linux experts from having to waste their time deleting newbie questions. Before the split was made, newbie questions caused flame wars and people to leave Linux-IL altogether. I strongly oppose re-unifying them. However, I propose an alternative solution. My proposed solution to the problem is to have the Linux-IL old timers volunteer to field gnubies-il questions, according to a schedule. I volunteer to field gnubies-il questions sent on Mondays between 00:00-11:59, with response time of 24 hours. However, I do not want to be overwhelmed with gnubies-il messages sent at other times. Other volunteers, please choose your convenient times (even if they overlap mine) for volunteering. Can the gnubies-il administrator/s arrange time/schedule based subscriptions for volunteers, so that the volunteers will receive only messages sent at certain times? Contact me privately if you need help adding this feature to the mailing list management software being used. --- Omer On Tue, 2009-02-17 at 01:09 +0200, Dotan Cohen wrote: While referring a new Linux user to the Linux-il mailing list, I found this text on the page: No newbie questions (use gnubies-il instead). Can the lists be merged? This list is low enough traffic that doubling it should not be a problem, and the separation of noobs and gurus means that few gurus see the noobs posts, and they never get the help that they need. -- May the holy trinity of $_, @_ and %_ be hallowed. My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/ My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone. They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which I may be affiliated in any way. WARNING TO SPAMMERS: at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Netvision: The early-disconnect fees! 40 NIS * 11 months = 800 NIS fees!
On Mon, 16 Feb 2009 15:18:58 +0200 Noam Rathaus no...@beyondsecurity.com wrote: Geoff, I will start with thanking you for giving the other alternative - I believe though that those are not very good alternatives, as you stated they mainly talk about phone oriented services, rather than Internet oriented services - I didn't see any mentioning of HOT aren't they a good alternative (never tried them)? Hot is not an ISP they are infrastructure, so they are posed against bezeq, not internet zahav/bezeq int and I'm not sure who's who of the others (there are more names than actual companies if I'm not mistaken). As a infrastructure, I've heard horrors about trying to disconnect and they did play a dirty trick with me when connecting regarding connection charges (make sure that if they tell on the phone that the connection is free that it is actually free). I've also had some line problems but mostly with the phone, can't recall much problems with the Internet infrastructure. On the upside they sent a guy every time we had problems (regrettably a few) trying to solve the connection issue, they've replaced two phone modems, one Internet modem, and couple of splitters all at no cost at my house. They have also been very helpful over the phone trying to solve problems (one time the technician brought a new modem but didn't have a power supply and I had to leave so he left the modem, came back when I wasn't there, let the power supply in through the cat's door and when there was a problem with the registration of the modem the girl from support did everything over the phone without telling me to wait for a call back (I did have to call back since I didn't have the right authentication details at first but I don't hold that against them). and I'm not a cable subscriber, just phone (almost no bill) and Internet (only 750kb), plus I live somewhat out off the main roads so I'm not what you would call a very attractive customer. As a contrast, what I mentioned in earlier post, my neighbor is connected to nezeq, they weren't too helpful over the phone, tried to convince me that the wrong things are at fault and sent a 70 year old woman 45 minutes by three buses to replace a modem that may or may not be at fault to make sure that it is not the line and that they need to send a technician. As for the internet provider, I'm connected through barak. Mostly parve, I have the occational off time and at the time when my router was a beige g3 mac running debian stable they had no idea how to help since it wasn't windows and thus they couldn't look up the error code in the book because it wasn't indexed according to exact errors ... but they usually tried usually Had a terrible experience with 012 a few years back when most of the world was still connected with 56k modems but I don't know where they are now. What bothers me is the fact that you have stated that BBL are scum of the earth and Netvision is the greatest. This kind of comment is redundant, as Dotan didn't try to convince you to move, he just stated what he thinks. When you write the opposite from him, you are just degrading what he is saying, and it sounds like you are trying to protect your opinion, but again Dotan didn't say Geoffrey thinks otherwise... what a fool, he just stated how unhappy he is, it is his right. On Monday 16 February 2009 14:10:52 Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote: On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 10:42:10PM +1100, Amos Shapira wrote: The problem in Israel is that there only about two(?) real options for home users, aren't there? I want to preface this with I have been a happy customer of Netvision since the day IBM stopped accepting Israeli credit cards, around the year 2000. I also want to preface this with IMHO BBL is the scum of the earth, part of the BEZEQ, BBL, Pelephone trio who threatens you with jail time if you don't agree to their bills. The two for landlines I know of are QOS (www.qos.co.il) who is the consumer division of BYNET. I don't know more about them than they exist. The other is Orange. Orange has a deal where you provide your own line (aDSL/cable), they provide a router, 2.5m download speed ISP service and a VoIP line with 600 minutes a month to all Israeli phones for 139 NIS. IMHO it's not a good deal unless you make lots of calls to cell phones. If you a home phone switch and can route cellular calls via it, you could save a lot of money, routing your other calls to a cheaper alternative. Cell-Com has a deal for 130 NIS a month, including modem (18 month commitment) for cellular based, unlimited Internet access. It's designed for laptops, but if you can figure out how to use it with a home network, it would be a good alternative. People using it say they get better than 2.5m download speeds. Orange has a similar, cheaper deal, 80 NIS a month, with a 5 GB limit. There is a 36 month payout on the modem (20 NIS a month) and no commitment
Re: Linux experts do not want to be bothered with newbie questions! (was: Re: No noobs?)
2009/2/17 Omer Zak w...@zak.co.il: The split between Linux-IL and gnubies-il was made in order to spare the Linux experts from having to waste their time deleting newbie questions. Before the split was made, newbie questions caused flame wars and people to leave Linux-IL altogether. I strongly oppose re-unifying them. However, I propose an alternative solution. My proposed solution to the problem is to have the Linux-IL old timers volunteer to field gnubies-il questions, according to a schedule. I volunteer to field gnubies-il questions sent on Mondays between 00:00-11:59, with response time of 24 hours. However, I do not want to be overwhelmed with gnubies-il messages sent at other times. Other volunteers, please choose your convenient times (even if they overlap mine) for volunteering. Can the gnubies-il administrator/s arrange time/schedule based subscriptions for volunteers, so that the volunteers will receive only messages sent at certain times? Contact me privately if you need help adding this feature to the mailing list management software being used. --- Omer Thanks, Omer, I see your point. I'm no guru, so I won't pull shifts on the noobs list, but I will subscribe and answer questions whenever I can. -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-נ-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת ا-ب-ت-ث-ج-ح-خ-د-ذ-ر-ز-س-ش-ص-ض-ط-ظ-ع-غ-ف-ق-ك-ل-م-ن-ه-و-ي А-Б-В-Г-Д-Е-Ё-Ж-З-И-Й-К-Л-М-Н-О-П-Р-С-Т-У-Ф-Х-Ц-Ч-Ш-Щ-Ъ-Ы-Ь-Э-Ю-Я а-б-в-г-д-е-ё-ж-з-и-й-к-л-м-н-о-п-р-с-т-у-ф-х-ц-ч-ш-щ-ъ-ы-ь-э-ю-я ä-ö-ü-ß-Ä-Ö-Ü ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: No noobs?
On Tue, 17 Feb 2009 01:09:57 +0200 Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com wrote: While referring a new Linux user to the Linux-il mailing list, I found this text on the page: No newbie questions (use gnubies-il instead). Can the lists be merged? This list is low enough traffic that doubling it should not be a problem, and the separation of noobs and gurus means that few gurus see the noobs posts, and they never get the help that they need. I have to admit that I didn't even know that list exists, assuming that also a few other experienced people. As far as I'm concerned this list is ideal for noobs and if you do know what you are doing its a no issue filtering unwanted threads. You could try to ask them to put noob question in the title so people who really don't like help can filter the messages more easily (or add an header stating how long the user has been on the list ...) ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Netvision: The early-disconnect fees! 40 NIS * 11 months = 800 NIS fees!
I have been connected with Hot cable for Internet and phone for four years, and I am both happy and unhappy with them. They do have a _lot_ of problems, but in general they do send a tech almost each time and they are very helpful on the phone. But the techs are opnly a few months in the field on average, as opposed to the years of experience Bezeq techs have. It shows, too, both in the quality of their work and in their confidence to start working on unusual situations. I love talking to Bezeq techs and learning new things. With Hot techs, I felt that I had to teach them! Another aspect of that is that they would often come in pairs, I suppose that is how they grow (add new techs for expanding markets). I left Hot because there were outages on average once a month. It was getting to be too much. Many people have had better luck with them, from what I understand. And they were a lot less expensive than Bezeq. -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-נ-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת ا-ب-ت-ث-ج-ح-خ-د-ذ-ر-ز-س-ش-ص-ض-ط-ظ-ع-غ-ف-ق-ك-ل-م-ن-ه-و-ي А-Б-В-Г-Д-Е-Ё-Ж-З-И-Й-К-Л-М-Н-О-П-Р-С-Т-У-Ф-Х-Ц-Ч-Ш-Щ-Ъ-Ы-Ь-Э-Ю-Я а-б-в-г-д-е-ё-ж-з-и-й-к-л-м-н-о-п-р-с-т-у-ф-х-ц-ч-ш-щ-ъ-ы-ь-э-ю-я ä-ö-ü-ß-Ä-Ö-Ü ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: How You Can Help the Tel Aviv Open Source Club
1) At its current state, I think the only importance of telux is having a suitable place to meet if the need arise. 2) I won't have a presentation in telux (and not else where too) in the foreseeable future. 3) I doubt if I will come to a meeting in telux (and not else where too) in the foreseeble future 4) I will understand, and won't take it against you, if you stop. I'm tired of being the only one who cares and volunteers. Shlomi Fish How can you say that when others come to hear and give talks? Didn't you meant to say that you are tired of the poor results and low return of your many efforts? ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
כתבה על Gcompris בעיתון הארץ
http://www.haaretz.co.il/captain/spages/1064799.html -- Noam Rathaus CTO no...@beyondsecurity.com http://www.beyondsecurity.com Know that you are safe. ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
[METADISCUSSION] Re: No noobs?
On Tue, 2009-02-17 at 02:10 +0200, Micha Feigin wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2009 01:09:57 +0200 Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com wrote: While referring a new Linux user to the Linux-il mailing list, I found this text on the page: No newbie questions (use gnubies-il instead). Can the lists be merged? This list is low enough traffic that doubling it should not be a problem, and the separation of noobs and gurus means that few gurus see the noobs posts, and they never get the help that they need. I have to admit that I didn't even know that list exists, assuming that also a few other experienced people. As far as I'm concerned this list is ideal for noobs and if you do know what you are doing its a no issue filtering unwanted threads. You could try to ask them to put noob question in the title so people who really don't like help can filter the messages more easily (or add an header stating how long the user has been on the list ...) No, asking newbies to do anything suitable on the title is not helpful. They usually do not know enough to follow any proper protocol. The only thing which helps is to refer them to newbies' mailing list and for us to take turns volunteering to answer there. I am rather worried that the experts' Linux-IL mailing list will be swamped by questions like Why does Linux refuse to execute my Python script when it turns out that he did not give it execute permission, wrote mypythonscript.py rather than ./mypythonscript.py and misformatted the bang-exclamation line (#!/usr/bin/python). --- Omer -- By running MS-Windows XP on your PC, you are probably a multi-zombie. My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/ My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone. They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which I may be affiliated in any way. WARNING TO SPAMMERS: at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Netvision: The early-disconnect fees! 40 NIS * 11 months = 800 NIS fees!
On Mon, Feb 16, 2009 at 03:18:58PM +0200, Noam Rathaus wrote: I will start with thanking you for giving the other alternative - I believe though that those are not very good alternatives, as you stated they mainly talk about phone oriented services, rather than Internet oriented services - I didn't see any mentioning of HOT aren't they a good alternative (never tried them)? Thank you. I was commenting on BBL because of the dealings I have had with them to be blunt, it took me a year of back and forth between me, my lawyer, the City of Jerusalem Consumer Advocate and others to resolve a billing dispute that ended up with them accepting a payment plan they offered at the beginning of a phone call and refused to accept by the end. In plain English IMHO they are not viable service providers. The same with Pelephone, I had to threaten Roy Disney, who was a partial owner of them at the time with a lawsuit because they decided to charge me 1300 NIS for a phone, which had nothing (blank space) in the contract. If I had not worked for a major news agency at the time, and used my work email, he probably would have ignored me too, like the CEO, etc. In the process my bank canceled my credit card because I kept charging the phone to it, although they told me they would not. When it was all resolved I canceled my accounts with them. They continued to charge my horat keva for one phone and never sent me a bill. When I stopped working and the account the payments came out of stopped paying them, they ignored me. Four years later they threatened to sue me. Since I am disabled and still out of work, it was easier to pay them the 233 NIS than go to court in Tel Aviv. So, IMHO BBL and Pelephone are not viable alternatives, no matter what people say about them. That's why I said that. I then went on to describe the other alternatives. What bothers me is the fact that you have stated that BBL are scum of the earth and Netvision is the greatest. I also never said Netvision was the greatest. I just said that I had no trouble with them. Did I actually say scum? I may think that, put I generally don't actually call them that in public. Speaking of being bothered, was this necessary to send this publicly? What did you expect to achieve? Dotan is not going to change his mind, I'm not going to change mine, and a request for a clarification could have been worded in a way which would reflect better upon you to a future customer googling you. My experiences with both are well documented on public lists, so there is no reason to hide them. Someone is not going to read this later and have it affect their opinion of me. This kind of comment is redundant, as Dotan didn't try to convince you to move, he just stated what he thinks. When you write the opposite from him, you are just degrading what he is saying, and it sounds like you are trying to protect your opinion, but again Dotan didn't say Geoffrey thinks otherwise... what a fool, he just stated how unhappy he is, it is his right. No, not at all. I think he is right to complain, and if Netvision treated him that way, he should complain. I also in another email offered some suggestions on IMHO how to deal with them. I'm sorry you missed my point, but it was that there are plenty of alternatives, but in my experience BBL and Pelephone are not viable ones. Orange, Cell-Com, QOS, 012, Netvision are. I've mentioned HOT in several emails in the last few months. They went from no outages for months, to several a week, with one or two a month lasting for several hours. Remmeber the whole thread on redundant multiple connections via different ISP and infrastructure providers? Geoff. -- Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel g...@mendelson.com N3OWJ/4X1GM ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: No noobs?
On Tue, Feb 17, 2009 at 01:09:57AM +0200, Dotan Cohen wrote: Can the lists be merged? This list is low enough traffic that doubling it should not be a problem, and the separation of noobs and gurus means that few gurus see the noobs posts, and they never get the help that they need. IMHO they should stay that way. I don't want to add more emails I'm going to ignore to my life. If the person writing the question writes in Hebrew it does not belong here, and if they can write it in English there are lots of better places for them to ask. The worst case I can see is someone asking, quite seriously, which distro should I use?, which will start another distro war and turn them off from the list in specific and Linux in general. Besides, do you want to subject noobs to our discussions. Some of them do get out of hand. :-) If you want to answer linux noob questions, I suggest you subscribe to that list and help out. I don't, I prefer to spend my online time helping new and prospective olim, so I don't. Geoff. -- Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel g...@mendelson.com N3OWJ/4X1GM ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Linux experts do not want to be bothered with newbie questions! (was:Re: No noobs?)
Hi Can we make the gnubies-il actually an alias (or what ever) to linux-il, and configured things that every message sent to gnubies-il will have in the subject [GNUBIES]. This will: - be easy to filter gnubies questions - give the gnunies a look on more advanced subjects - give an easy was for advanced users to select which questions to answer without having to subscribe to gnubies-il. this may help make Linux more popular among new users Shahar - Original Message - From: Omer Zak To: linux-il Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 1:32 AM Subject: Linux experts do not want to be bothered with newbie questions! (was:Re: No noobs?) The split between Linux-IL and gnubies-il was made in order to spare the Linux experts from having to waste their time deleting newbie questions. Before the split was made, newbie questions caused flame wars and people to leave Linux-IL altogether. I strongly oppose re-unifying them. However, I propose an alternative solution. My proposed solution to the problem is to have the Linux-IL old timers volunteer to field gnubies-il questions, according to a schedule. I volunteer to field gnubies-il questions sent on Mondays between 00:00-11:59, with response time of 24 hours. However, I do not want to be overwhelmed with gnubies-il messages sent at other times. Other volunteers, please choose your convenient times (even if they overlap mine) for volunteering. Can the gnubies-il administrator/s arrange time/schedule based subscriptions for volunteers, so that the volunteers will receive only messages sent at certain times? Contact me privately if you need help adding this feature to the mailing list management software being used. --- Omer On Tue, 2009-02-17 at 01:09 +0200, Dotan Cohen wrote: While referring a new Linux user to the Linux-il mailing list, I found this text on the page: No newbie questions (use gnubies-il instead). Can the lists be merged? This list is low enough traffic that doubling it should not be a problem, and the separation of noobs and gurus means that few gurus see the noobs posts, and they never get the help that they need. -- May the holy trinity of $_, @_ and %_ be hallowed. My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/ My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone. They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which I may be affiliated in any way. WARNING TO SPAMMERS: at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Linux experts do not want to be bothered with newbie questions! (was:Re: No noobs?)
On Tue, Feb 17, 2009 at 09:21:11AM +0200, Shahar Dag wrote: - give an easy was for advanced users to select which questions to answer without having to subscribe to gnubies-il. this may help make Linux more popular among new users Seriously, will it? There are times that reading this list makes Windows/XP seem a lot easier to use. We tend to concentrate on the things that DON'T WORK on Linux (and how to fix them), most of which will scare off new users. Although this email is being written in MicroEmacs called by Mutt, on a Linux system, I don't like Linux desktops. The actual computer I'm sitting at is a dual boot XP and a BSD variant (because I like the user interface). To be honest, it has XP because it came with it, and I occasionaly have to do things with it that can not be done anywhere else. I don't think I've booted it in well over a week, but it is there. I'm not sure that explaining that to a new user is really going to inspire confidence, no matter who nicely it is put. Geoff. -- Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel g...@mendelson.com N3OWJ/4X1GM ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Linux experts do not want to be bothered with newbie questions! (was:Re: No noobs?)
Shahar's suggestion addresses the problem, and lets busy Linux-IL oldtimers ignore the newbies' questions. However, I am concerned about newbies, who would be confused and post using linux-il rather gnubies-il, so their messages won't be flagged. Also, how do we ensure that answers by Linux-IL oldtimers are properly marked without having them subscribe also to gnubies-il? --- Omer On Tue, 2009-02-17 at 09:21 +0200, Shahar Dag wrote: Hi Can we make the gnubies-il actually an alias (or what ever) to linux-il, and configured things that every message sent to gnubies-il will have in the subject [GNUBIES]. This will: - be easy to filter gnubies questions - give the gnunies a look on more advanced subjects - give an easy was for advanced users to select which questions to answer without having to subscribe to gnubies-il. this may help make Linux more popular among new users Shahar - Original Message - From: Omer Zak To: linux-il Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 1:32 AM Subject: Linux experts do not want to be bothered with newbie questions! (was:Re: No noobs?) The split between Linux-IL and gnubies-il was made in order to spare the Linux experts from having to waste their time deleting newbie questions. Before the split was made, newbie questions caused flame wars and people to leave Linux-IL altogether. I strongly oppose re-unifying them. However, I propose an alternative solution. My proposed solution to the problem is to have the Linux-IL old timers volunteer to field gnubies-il questions, according to a schedule. I volunteer to field gnubies-il questions sent on Mondays between 00:00-11:59, with response time of 24 hours. However, I do not want to be overwhelmed with gnubies-il messages sent at other times. Other volunteers, please choose your convenient times (even if they overlap mine) for volunteering. Can the gnubies-il administrator/s arrange time/schedule based subscriptions for volunteers, so that the volunteers will receive only messages sent at certain times? Contact me privately if you need help adding this feature to the mailing list management software being used. --- Omer On Tue, 2009-02-17 at 01:09 +0200, Dotan Cohen wrote: While referring a new Linux user to the Linux-il mailing list, I found this text on the page: No newbie questions (use gnubies-il instead). Can the lists be merged? This list is low enough traffic that doubling it should not be a problem, and the separation of noobs and gurus means that few gurus see the noobs posts, and they never get the help that they need. -- Did you shave a yak today? My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/ My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone. They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which I may be affiliated in any way. WARNING TO SPAMMERS: at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
