mac getting hot when accessing a website

[gerrycook]

Hi everyone.  recently,  I went on to the SABC south african broadcasting 
corporation and listened to a group of radio stations 5 FM and FM 2000 ,  the 
macbookpro got quite hot so i’m wondering if i shouldn’t get on the SABC 
website at all if this is going to happen? if they are using an old version of 
flash? anyway just curious and some thoughts,, Thanks everybody All the best. 
cheers gerry have a nice day
Email: gerryc...@optusnet.com.au
Skype: gerry.cook1 
Twitter: @gerrycook52

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Re: my system is so big on Macbook pro, why?

[Tim Kilburn]

Hi,

Do you have Time Machine turned on, but do not have a drive always available 
for the backups.  If so, there could be snapshots of your drive stored while it 
waits for the ability to access the backup Time Machine drive.  You may also 
wish to look under the Apple menu, About This Mac, interact with the ToolBar 
and press on Storage.  See what it reveals there.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Apple Teacher
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On May 13, 2018, at 17:36, E.T.  wrote:

  You can try it, not sure how long the trial period is. Link is below. Its my 
opinion that free is not always worth the price



>From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  ancient.ali...@icloud.com
Many believe that we have been visited
in the past. What if it were true?

On 5/13/2018 4:27 PM, Ramy Moustafa wrote:
> Is there a free app?
>> On May 14, 2018, at 1:07 AM, E.T.  wrote:
>> 
>> Ramy,
>>   You might try CleanMyMac 3. I run this weekly and also use it to do clean 
>> uninstalls of apps.
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>   ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> Many believe that we have been visited
>> in the past. What if it were true?
>> 
>> On 5/13/2018 3:45 PM, Ramy Moustafa wrote:
>>> Hi all:
>>> I have High sierra on my macbook pro and my Macmini.
>>> on my macbook pro, only the system default apps + the Iwork apps + 
>>> protools. i found that my system is 105 GB in size, why is this?
>>> my mac mini with Protools and plug- ins and all of this, is about 40 GB, 
>>> can anyone tell me if there is a place other than the trash, that i can 
>>> empty, or something? or what can make my system so big?
>>> thanks in advance
>> 
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Re: Siri voices for voice over on Mac?

[Shawn Krasniuk]

Yeah as Matt said there's no way to use the new Siri voices on the Mac. 
Although I'm really looking forward to WWDC on June 4. Hopefully one of the new 
features of the next macOS whether it be 10.14 or the rumored macOS XI will be 
that we can use them system wide, not just with Voiceover.

Shawn
Sent From My New MacBook Air
Facebook Username: Shawn Krasniuk
Twitter Handle: shawnk_aka_bbs
Skype username: bbstheblindrapper
Facetime: bbssh...@icloud.com

> On May 13, 2018, at 8:17 PM, Matthew Dierckens  wrote:
> 
> Hi there,
> Unfortunately no, you cannot use the Siri voice is with the Mac.
> 
> God bless.
> Matthew Dierckens,
> Certified assistive technology specialist
> Macintosh, iOS, and windows Trainer
> Canadian phone: 519-962-9140
> U.S. phone: 573-401-1018
> 
> 
> On May 13, 2018, at 17:38, Leo Bado  > wrote:
> 
>> hi listers,
>> 
>> hope everybody is having a good time, now, my question is this,
>> 
>> What do I have to do exactly in order to get Siri voices working with voice 
>> over?
>> 
>> 
>> I love this new female voice that I use  in my iphone, pretty clear, but I  
>> can't find the way to do the same with my mac.
>> 
>> is this even possible?
>> 
>> using Macbook pro with High Sierra.
>> 
>> Thanks guys for any info.
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Leo Bado
>> 
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The Keys That Might Fix Your Mac - The New York Times

[Angus MacKinnon]

> 
> https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/11/technology/personaltech/mac-smc.html 
> 
> 
> The Keys That Might Fix Your Mac
> 
> If your Mac greets you with a black screen, the fan runs constantly or you 
> notice other power-related issues, a simple home solution might save you a 
> trip to the Genius Bar.
> 
> May 11, 2018
> TECH TIP
> 
> Q. The other day, my Mac laptop would not turn on when I pressed the power 
> button, but a technician was able to get it to start by holding down a bunch 
> of keys. What is this fix?
> 
> A. If a Mac does not respond to its power button after you have checked its 
> battery, connections and monitor, there might be a serious issue — but not 
> always. In this case, the computer’s original failure to react when you 
> pressed the power button was most likely a symptom of an issue with the 
> System Management Controller (S.M.C.), a microcontroller 
>  on the computer’s 
> logic board that handles various power, light and sensor functions for Macs 
> with Intel processors.
> 
> Holding down the Shift, Control and Option keys while pressing down on the 
> power button (or Touch ID button ) 
> for at least 10 seconds is a shortcut for resetting the S.M.C. on MacBooks 
> with sealed batteries. If this was the case, the laptop starts up normally 
> again when you press the power button again.
> 
> 
> If you have tried Apple's other troubleshooting steps and nothing works, 
> press the Shift, Control, Option and Power keys (all highlighted) for at 
> least 10 seconds to reset the Mac's System Management Controller.The New York 
> Times
> An S.M.C. reset may help if you notice things like the battery is not 
> charging properly, the Mac does not recognize devices plugged into its USB-C 
> port, the keyboard backlight is not working correctly or the sleep function 
> is out of whack. Other symptoms include the computer fan’s running at high 
> speed or the Mac’s acting sluggish, even if you are not using a lot of 
> processor-hogging programs.
> 
> Apple’s support site has a full guide to the S.M.C. reset process 
>  for all its Intel-based Macs, 
> including those with removable batteries and desktop models. The guide also 
> lists a series of things you should try before resetting the S.M.C. While 
> performing a reset does not generate an alert box or notification, you can 
> tell if you were successful if the odd Mac behavior stops. (You may also have 
> to redo any preferences for your display and power-management settings.)
> 
> Resetting the S.M.C. might fix erratic Mac behavior, although it will not 
> help with a damaged power supply or another major hardware problem.
> 
> Modern Macs also store some settings in an area of the system called the 
> nonvolatile random access memory (NVRAM); older Macs use parameter 
> random-access memory (PRAM) in a similar manner. If the Mac is not 
> maintaining its settings for volume level, display resolution, time-zone 
> information or preferred start-up disk, information held in the NVRAM may 
> have become corrupt.
> 
> You can reset the NVRAM  or PRAM by 
> shutting down the Mac and then starting it up again while holding down the 
> Option, Command, P and R keys all at once. When you hear the second start-up 
> tone  (or, on a Mac Pro, see a 
> second Apple logo appear and disappear), you can release the keys and let the 
> computer finish its start-up sequence.
> 
> Personal Tech invites questions about computer-based technology to 
> tech...@nytimes.com . This column will answer 
> questions of general interest, but letters cannot be answered individually.
> 
> J.D. Biersdorfer has been answering technology questions — in print, on the 
> web, in audio and in video — since 1998. She also writes the Sunday Book 
> Review’s “Applied Reading” column on ebooks and literary apps, among other 
> things.@jdbiersdorfer 

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Re: Google Accessibility Mailing List?

[Karen Lewellen]

Certainly.
Google has an official list.
I believe joining  at least via e-mail is to send a subscribe request to.
accessible+subscr...@googlegroups.com
Others can likely direct you to the web door.  a few of the members here 
are already there as well.

Karen



On Sun, 13 May 2018, Des Delgadillo wrote:


Hi all,

As a big fan of this list, I wonder if there’s a similar one for Google 
products? I have a few questions that I’d love to present but don’t want to 
veer this list away from its intended purpose. If anyone can suggest such a 
list, I’d be super appreciative.

Thanks,



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Re: Verification Schemes

[Karen Lewellen]

Hi Eric,
That is actually a nifty  idea.  I imagine however the problem here would 
be one   you referenced before I think dyslexia and other problems with the 
alphabet situations.  Likewise those experiencing cognitive uniqueness.

does not mean it would  not be a fun change though.
Karen



On Sun, 13 May 2018, Eric Oyen wrote:


the math tests are pretty good. However, one thing I just had an idea on: a 
fill in the blank quote test. take a quote (famous or slightly famous), pull 
out 1 word and put an edit box in it's place. that will generally foil most 
automated crawlers and any human can look up the actual quote and fill in the 
blank (and some of us might even know more than a few of those quotes by heart).

there are plenty of methods out there that can be used and are accessible as 
well.

-eric

PGP fingerprint: 6DFB D6B0 3771 90F1 373E 570C 7EA2 1FF3 6B68 0386

On May 13, 2018, at 2:07 PM, Jonathan Cohn wrote:


As Karen has pointed out, the W3C working groups has written a note about these 
systems. The note points out  the following very generally:
1. It can be fairly easy to cir circumnavigate these systems using low cost 
labor or even possibly Machine learning algorithms.
2. Better results can often be had by limiting initial posting policies and by 
using auto spam detection services.
3. Having universal authenticators like facebook or google accounts can help, 
though I expect after recent privacy revelations people are backing down from 
linking diverse account with their Google or Facebook accounts. (Last sentence 
is mine and not a summary of one could obtain from the W3C document).
4. Using two factor systems can help. (We have discussed here some of the 
issues with SMS already)
5. Use logic or math challenges but have enough of them that a bot can't earn 
the entire set
6. In all cases, there should be a way for a person to contact an administrator 
of the system in question if they are unable to answer the challenges.

Karen also mentioned honey pot solutions. These basically are URL that look 
like a authentication page, but only but are not. If you see requests to the 
honey pot site you can briefly blacklist the originating IP address from being 
able to create an account as it is probably a web-crawler or other bot.

The original article I read was here and if you are thinking of implementing 
such services a review of current literature would be recommended.
https://www.w3.org/TR/turingtest/

Jonathan Cohn






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Re: Phone recommendations

[Jessica Moss]

How exactly do the 8 models differ from the 7 models aside from that?
> On May 11, 2018, at 11:12 PM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Hi Jonathan,
> 
> Simple to me,
> 
> The 8 or 8+ will have a slightly longer life than the 7 does and the storage 
> capacity is slightly more in the 8 range than that of the 7 now.
> 
> I know it's more money but I'd go 8 myself.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
> Behalf Of Jonathan Cohn
> Sent: Saturday, 12 May 2018 2:52 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Phone recommendations
> 
> Hello,
> 
> Well my iPhone 6 s that was treating me quite well after getting the battery 
> replaced took a swim yesterday, so I won’t be able to wait until October to 
> buy a new phone.
> 
> Anybody out there have good arguments to get the iPhone 8 over the iPhone  7? 
> I see my vendor has some refurbished iPhone 7  for about two hundred dollars 
> less than a new iPhone 7, that is tempting except they have only a 90 day 
> warranty.
> 
> Also in the past, I had troubles getting iPhones purchased via anybody but my 
> Mobile carrier because I am on a “Special” ex-employee rate. I expect that 
> now most iPhones are sold at cost that I could also go to the Apple Store. 
> Are their leases or iPhone for life programs generally better than the 
> carriers?
> 
> Certainly with an Apple store just two blocks from my office, it is I know I 
> can get reasonable support there.
> 
> Thanks in advance for any feedback,
> 
> Jonathan Cohn 
> 
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Re: Siri voices for voice over on Mac?

[Matthew Dierckens]

Hi there,
Unfortunately no, you cannot use the Siri voice is with the Mac.

God bless.
Matthew Dierckens,
Certified assistive technology specialist
Macintosh, iOS, and windows Trainer
Canadian phone: 519-962-9140
U.S. phone: 573-401-1018


> On May 13, 2018, at 17:38, Leo Bado  wrote:
> 
> hi listers,
> 
> hope everybody is having a good time, now, my question is this,
> 
> What do I have to do exactly in order to get Siri voices working with voice 
> over?
> 
> 
> I love this new female voice that I use  in my iphone, pretty clear, but I  
> can't find the way to do the same with my mac.
> 
> is this even possible?
> 
> using Macbook pro with High Sierra.
> 
> Thanks guys for any info.
> 
> 
> -- 
> Leo Bado
> 
> -- 
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> 
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Google Accessibility Mailing List?

[Des Delgadillo]

Hi all,

As a big fan of this list, I wonder if there’s a similar one for Google 
products? I have a few questions that I’d love to present but don’t want to 
veer this list away from its intended purpose. If anyone can suggest such a 
list, I’d be super appreciative.

Thanks,



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Siri voices for voice over on Mac?

[Leo Bado]

hi listers,

hope everybody is having a good time, now, my question is this,

What do I have to do exactly in order to get Siri voices working with 
voice over?



I love this new female voice that I use  in my iphone, pretty clear, but 
I  can't find the way to do the same with my mac.


is this even possible?

using Macbook pro with High Sierra.

Thanks guys for any info.


--
Leo Bado

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Re: Verification Schemes

[Eric Oyen]

the math tests are pretty good. However, one thing I just had an idea on: a 
fill in the blank quote test. take a quote (famous or slightly famous), pull 
out 1 word and put an edit box in it's place. that will generally foil most 
automated crawlers and any human can look up the actual quote and fill in the 
blank (and some of us might even know more than a few of those quotes by heart).

there are plenty of methods out there that can be used and are accessible as 
well.

-eric

PGP fingerprint: 6DFB D6B0 3771 90F1 373E 570C 7EA2 1FF3 6B68 0386

On May 13, 2018, at 2:07 PM, Jonathan Cohn wrote:

> As Karen has pointed out, the W3C working groups has written a note about 
> these systems. The note points out  the following very generally:
> 1. It can be fairly easy to cir circumnavigate these systems using low cost 
> labor or even possibly Machine learning algorithms.
> 2. Better results can often be had by limiting initial posting policies and 
> by using auto spam detection services.
> 3. Having universal authenticators like facebook or google accounts can help, 
> though I expect after recent privacy revelations people are backing down from 
> linking diverse account with their Google or Facebook accounts. (Last 
> sentence is mine and not a summary of one could obtain from the W3C document).
> 4. Using two factor systems can help. (We have discussed here some of the 
> issues with SMS already)
> 5. Use logic or math challenges but have enough of them that a bot can't earn 
> the entire set
> 6. In all cases, there should be a way for a person to contact an 
> administrator of the system in question if they are unable to answer the 
> challenges.
> 
> Karen also mentioned honey pot solutions. These basically are URL that look 
> like a authentication page, but only but are not. If you see requests to the 
> honey pot site you can briefly blacklist the originating IP address from 
> being able to create an account as it is probably a web-crawler or other bot. 
> 
> The original article I read was here and if you are thinking of implementing 
> such services a review of current literature would be recommended.
> https://www.w3.org/TR/turingtest/
> 
> Jonathan Cohn 
>  
> 
> 
>  
>   
> 
> -- 
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possible to create a flow chart using voiceover?

[kary johns]

Hi all,
Does anyone know if theres an accessible way to make a flow chart on
mac using voiceover?
Thanks for any help.
Regards,
kari.

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Re: my system is so big on Macbook pro, why?

[E.T.]

   You can try it, not sure how long the trial period is. Link is 
below. Its my opinion that free is not always worth the price




From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   ancient.ali...@icloud.com
Many believe that we have been visited
in the past. What if it were true?

On 5/13/2018 4:27 PM, Ramy Moustafa wrote:

Is there a free app?


On May 14, 2018, at 1:07 AM, E.T.  wrote:

Ramy,
   You might try CleanMyMac 3. I run this weekly and also use it to do clean 
uninstalls of apps.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   ancient.ali...@icloud.com
Many believe that we have been visited
in the past. What if it were true?

On 5/13/2018 3:45 PM, Ramy Moustafa wrote:

Hi all:
I have High sierra on my macbook pro and my Macmini.
on my macbook pro, only the system default apps + the Iwork apps + protools. i 
found that my system is 105 GB in size, why is this?
my mac mini with Protools and plug- ins and all of this, is about 40 GB, can 
anyone tell me if there is a place other than the trash, that i can empty, or 
something? or what can make my system so big?
thanks in advance


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Re: my system is so big on Macbook pro, why?

[Ramy Moustafa]

Is there a free app?

> On May 14, 2018, at 1:07 AM, E.T.  wrote:
> 
> Ramy,
>   You might try CleanMyMac 3. I run this weekly and also use it to do clean 
> uninstalls of apps.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>   ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> Many believe that we have been visited
> in the past. What if it were true?
> 
> On 5/13/2018 3:45 PM, Ramy Moustafa wrote:
>> Hi all:
>> I have High sierra on my macbook pro and my Macmini.
>> on my macbook pro, only the system default apps + the Iwork apps + protools. 
>> i found that my system is 105 GB in size, why is this?
>> my mac mini with Protools and plug- ins and all of this, is about 40 GB, can 
>> anyone tell me if there is a place other than the trash, that i can empty, 
>> or something? or what can make my system so big?
>> thanks in advance
> 
> -- 
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Re: my system is so big on Macbook pro, why?

[E.T.]

Ramy,
   You might try CleanMyMac 3. I run this weekly and also use it to do 
clean uninstalls of apps.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   ancient.ali...@icloud.com
Many believe that we have been visited
in the past. What if it were true?

On 5/13/2018 3:45 PM, Ramy Moustafa wrote:

Hi all:

I have High sierra on my macbook pro and my Macmini.
on my macbook pro, only the system default apps + the Iwork apps + protools. i 
found that my system is 105 GB in size, why is this?
my mac mini with Protools and plug- ins and all of this, is about 40 GB, can 
anyone tell me if there is a place other than the trash, that i can empty, or 
something? or what can make my system so big?
thanks in advance



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my system is so big on Macbook pro, why?

[Ramy Moustafa]

Hi all:

I have High sierra on my macbook pro and my Macmini.
on my macbook pro, only the system default apps + the Iwork apps + protools. i 
found that my system is 105 GB in size, why is this?
my mac mini with Protools and plug- ins and all of this, is about 40 GB, can 
anyone tell me if there is a place other than the trash, that i can empty, or 
something? or what can make my system so big?
thanks in advance 

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cross platform journal

[Sarai Bucciarelli]

Hi:

 

I'm looking for an accessible cross platform journal app, that can be used
on iphone, ipad, mac, windows, and android.

Anything out there?

 

Sarai D Bucciarelli  
www.linkedin.com/in/SaraiDBucciarelli 

 

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Re: foot pedal

[Jonathan Cohn]

I am not familiar with these products, but a quick google search showed a USB 
based dictation pedal that claims to work with Mac and PC when used with the 
Express dictation software.

It sounds like these pedals just provide play/stop rewind  and fast forward 
functions. Certainly some USB head phones have equivalent buttons, so perhaps 
the pedals use the same protocol as headphones and would b just as plug and 
play.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On May 13, 2018, at 5:48 PM, jean parker  wrote:
> 
> Hello All:
> 
> Does anyone know if there are any dictation foot pedals that work with the 
> Mac? Would a generic off the shelf type work?
> 
> Dr. Jean Parker, Ph.D.
> Senior Research Fellow
> Trans4m Center For Integral Development
> Geneva, Switzerland
> 
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foot pedal

[jean parker]

Hello All:

Does anyone know if there are any dictation foot pedals that work with the Mac? 
Would a generic off the shelf type work?

Dr. Jean Parker, Ph.D.
Senior Research Fellow
Trans4m Center For Integral Development
Geneva, Switzerland

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Personal e-mail addresses

[Jonathan Cohn]

It has recently come to my attention that some members of this list do not want 
to receive personal messages from members of the list. The way GoogleGroups is 
designed, all members of a group can find any senders e-mail address.

May I suggest you use a sub-mail address or a second mail address with 
dedicated filters if you do  not want any direct communication.

 .

Let me state this very clearly, your email address that is being used for 
MacVisionaries can be seen by over 1000 people and if one goes to 
GoogleGroups.com  website every message has a reply 
directly to sender option built in.

Furthermore, it is my belief that this list encourages discussions that are of 
a more personal nature should be taken off list i.e. sent to the persons 
registered e-mail address.

Warmly,
Jonathan Cohn



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Re: Verification Schemes

[Jonathan Cohn]

As Karen has pointed out, the W3C working groups has written a note about these 
systems. The note points out  the following very generally:
1. It can be fairly easy to cir circumnavigate these systems using low cost 
labor or even possibly Machine learning algorithms.
2. Better results can often be had by limiting initial posting policies and by 
using auto spam detection services.
3. Having universal authenticators like facebook or google accounts can help, 
though I expect after recent privacy revelations people are backing down from 
linking diverse account with their Google or Facebook accounts. (Last sentence 
is mine and not a summary of one could obtain from the W3C document).
4. Using two factor systems can help. (We have discussed here some of the 
issues with SMS already)
5. Use logic or math challenges but have enough of them that a bot can't earn 
the entire set
6. In all cases, there should be a way for a person to contact an administrator 
of the system in question if they are unable to answer the challenges.

Karen also mentioned honey pot solutions. These basically are URL that look 
like a authentication page, but only but are not. If you see requests to the 
honey pot site you can briefly blacklist the originating IP address from being 
able to create an account as it is probably a web-crawler or other bot. 

The original article I read was here and if you are thinking of implementing 
such services a review of current literature would be recommended.
https://www.w3.org/TR/turingtest/ 

Jonathan Cohn 
 


 
  

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Re: Verification Schemes

[Eric Oyen]

hey Karon? I didn't take it personally at all. :)

I just happen to be Brash, Blunt and unfiltered.

anyway, back to technology talk…

-eric

PGP fingerprint: 6DFB D6B0 3771 90F1 373E 570C 7EA2 1FF3 6B68 0386

On May 12, 2018, at 8:57 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote:

> This is a list of one?
> My reply was to Eric's comment,  consider the concept of rule number 6..do 
> not   take things so personally.  At least unless unwelcome communications 
> sent privately etc. smiles.
> 
> 
> 
> On Sat, 12 May 2018, E.T. wrote:
> 
>>  Karen, consider the fact that we all want better accessibility. As you made 
>> clear, you are not me so if you cannot assist me in a forthright manner, 
>> please do not try so hard.
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>  ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> Many believe that we have been visited
>> in the past. What if it were true?
>> 
>> On 5/12/2018 8:08 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote:
>>> Consider as well the problem for those who do not read English.
>>> They are a mess for many, hands down.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Sat, 12 May 2018, Eric Oyen wrote:
>>> >  hey E.T.,
>>> >  Captcha is a big problem for far more than just us blind folks (although 
>>> > >  we probably notice it far more and far faster). There are some who 
>>> > have >  other print related disabilities that would make Captcha solving 
>>> > a >  nightmare. There are also those who are colorblind (both the 
>>> > red-green >  and the far rarer monochromatic type) and some of the images 
>>> > would not >  make any sense.
>>> > >  Now, I had a very big problem with dyslexia before I became blind and 
>>> > > I >  know for certain that it would have caused me no end of trouble >  
>>> > > (squiggly lines in among other squiggly lines supposedly mimicking >  
>>> > > letters would be highly confusing).  So, this problem is not strictly > 
>>> > >  one that exclusively targets the blind. Like I said upstairs, we just 
>>> > > >  notice it a lot faster.
>>> > >  -eric
>>> > >  PGP fingerprint: 6DFB D6B0 3771 90F1 373E 570C 7EA2 1FF3 6B68 0386
>>> > >  On May 12, 2018, at 4:35 PM, E.T. wrote:
>>> > > >Whups. (smiles) Let's get back on track here, Karen. Let's take a 
>>> > > > > >  more practical approach to this issue as blind/visually impaired 
>>> > > > > >  users. Like Captcha Be Gone, or Rumola. If I am not mistaken, 
>>> > > > neither > >  of these will handle what I believe are known as 
>>> > > > re-Captcha. Are you > >  aware of any blind friendly solutions?
>>> > > > >  From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>> > >ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>> > >  Many believe that we have been visited
>>> > >  in the past. What if it were true?
>>> > > > >  On 5/12/2018 3:21 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote:
>>> > > >  Mr. Cohn,
>>> > > >  may I ask what makes you an expert on my computing, to the point > > 
>>> > > > >  that you would call  me out in this thread?
>>> > > >  I make my  living professionally using computers as a part of my > > 
>>> > > > >  work.
>>> > > >  I have no issues getting the job done, but this is how I compute > > 
>>> > > > >  rooted in many factors.
>>> > > >  If I do not suggest everyone should use computers as I do, why do > 
>>> > > > > >  you feel justified in judging how I use them, never having met 
>>> > > > me, > > >  not paying my salary, nor last time I checked living my 
>>> > > > physical > > >  experience?
>>> > > > > >  On May 12, 2018, at 5:06 PM, Jonathan Cohn > > > > >  
>>> > > > > >  wrote:
>>> > > > > > > > > > >  The Google authenticator right now is the checkbox 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > labeled I am > > > > >  not a bot. I have had luck with 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > JAWS and NVDA and VoiceOver with > > > > >  these not 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > proceeding to the more traditional  puzzles. I > > > > 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > >  believe that Karen uses a browser with no ability to 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > work with > > > > >  JavaScript, so I am surprised that 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > she would be able to do most > > > > >  activities on 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > modern websites that use extensive CSS and > > > > >  
>>> > > > > > > > > > > JavaScript to allow less transfer of information 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > between > > > > >  computers and systems. If you want 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > to be fully safe at ensuring > > > > >  access to all, 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > then you will need a helpdesk service with the > > > > 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > >  ability to disable authenticators on a per account 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > basis > > > > >  (perhaps with a USB dongle with a 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > security certificate). In > > > > >  general security / 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > privacy tools don't trust the services needed > > > > > 
>>> > > > > > > > > > >  by accessibility. For example, the new Firefox 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > versions have a > > > > >  logo to indicate when 
>>> > > > > > > > > > > accessibility services are enabled with > > > > >  
>>> > > > > > > > > > > instructions that say if 

Re: Verification Schemes

[Eric Oyen]

slow?
you call it slow when there is actually a concerted effort to hold back? sure, 
the excuses are legion. They say it will cost too much money to redesign their 
site. Accessibility is too complicated, and on and on. the fact is that they 
are too damned lazy and we aren't united enough to hit them where it hurts.

and you wonder why it is there are those of us who are so militant in our point 
of view. Education is all fine and good, but when happens when you run up 
against the wall of ignorance?

anyway, as far as technology goes, it can be changed to work for us, but 
requires but a little effort. We just need to push, hard!

-eric

PGP fingerprint: 6DFB D6B0 3771 90F1 373E 570C 7EA2 1FF3 6B68 0386

On May 12, 2018, at 8:39 PM, E.T. wrote:

> Eric,
>   I have no doubt about that. We all want and need access. But its slow 
> coming.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>   ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> Many believe that we have been visited
> in the past. What if it were true?
> 
> On 5/12/2018 7:23 PM, Eric Oyen wrote:
>> hey E.T.,
>> Captcha is a big problem for far more than just us blind folks (although we 
>> probably notice it far more and far faster). There are some who have other 
>> print related disabilities that would make Captcha solving a nightmare. 
>> There are also those who are colorblind (both the red-green and the far 
>> rarer monochromatic type) and some of the images would not make any sense.
>> Now, I had a very big problem with dyslexia before I became blind and I know 
>> for certain that it would have caused me no end of trouble (squiggly lines 
>> in among other squiggly lines supposedly mimicking letters would be highly 
>> confusing).  So, this problem is not strictly one that exclusively targets 
>> the blind. Like I said upstairs, we just notice it a lot faster.
>> -eric
>> PGP fingerprint: 6DFB D6B0 3771 90F1 373E 570C 7EA2 1FF3 6B68 0386
>> On May 12, 2018, at 4:35 PM, E.T. wrote:
>>>   Whups. (smiles) Let's get back on track here, Karen. Let's take a more 
>>> practical approach to this issue as blind/visually impaired users. Like 
>>> Captcha Be Gone, or Rumola. If I am not mistaken, neither of these will 
>>> handle what I believe are known as re-Captcha. Are you aware of any blind 
>>> friendly solutions?
>>> 
>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>>   ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>> Many believe that we have been visited
>>> in the past. What if it were true?
>>> 
>>> On 5/12/2018 3:21 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote:
 Mr. Cohn,
 may I ask what makes you an expert on my computing, to the point that you 
 would call  me out in this thread?
 I make my  living professionally using computers as a part of my work.
 I have no issues getting the job done, but this is how I compute rooted in 
 many factors.
 If I do not suggest everyone should use computers as I do, why do you feel 
 justified in judging how I use them, never having met me, not paying my 
 salary, nor last time I checked living my physical experience?
>> On May 12, 2018, at 5:06 PM, Jonathan Cohn  wrote:
>> 
>> The Google authenticator right now is the checkbox labeled I am not a 
>> bot. I have had luck with JAWS and NVDA and VoiceOver with these not 
>> proceeding to the more traditional  puzzles. I believe that Karen uses a 
>> browser with no ability to work with JavaScript, so I am surprised that 
>> she would be able to do most activities on modern websites that use 
>> extensive CSS and JavaScript to allow less transfer of information 
>> between computers and systems. If you want to be fully safe at ensuring 
>> access to all, then you will need a helpdesk service with the ability to 
>> disable authenticators on a per account basis (perhaps with a USB dongle 
>> with a security certificate). In general security / privacy tools don't 
>> trust the services needed by accessibility. For example, the new Firefox 
>> versions have a logo to indicate when accessibility services are enabled 
>> with instructions that say if you are not using a screen reader or other 
>> accessibility application and you see this logo you might have an 
>> application that is a security risk.
>> 
>> Best wishes,
>> 
>> Jonathan Cohn
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On May 11, 2018, at 9:42 PM, E.T.  wrote:
>>> 
>>>   I've been playing email tag with someone who operates a web site that 
>>> uses the picture captcha for people who sign up.
>>> 
>>>   We talked about the 2-step verification method where one gets a code 
>>> via text message. He is of the opinion that this isn prone to hacks. He 
>>> chose to use the picture captcha after his site was overwhelmed with 
>>> bots that created thousands of fake accounts. He also mentioned Google 
>>> Authenticator and Authy. Anyone have experience with those?
>>> 
>>>   Of late I have 

Re: Verification Schemes

[Karen Lewellen]

Actually, some mail lists prevent the ability for unsolicited 
communication for  this very reason.
Your being a member of a e-mail list need not translate into open season 
on our e-mail address.
If someone has not asked permission for a private communication, then 
their communication, especially if following  public misinformation about 
me personally,  the case with MR. cohn, means that communication  is mine 
to do with as I wish.

Your millage clearly varies.



On Sun, 13 May 2018, alia robinson wrote:


LOL, this is the funniest thing I have ever read in my life!if you put out your 
email address to a public list you can be contacted by whomever whenever. you 
can choose to respond or not, yes, but just like junkmail at your home you are 
not afforded the ability to pick who contacts you. if your email out there it’s 
out there. if you don’t want anyone to know it get off public lists. you’re 
just like those people on twitter who put out public tweets then complain when 
people respond and say you weren’t talking to them. I for one pray you all take 
this private because it’s ridiculous.
On May 13, 2018, at 1:38 PM, Karen Lewellen  wrote:

I am afraid I am clueless as to your meaning.
My e-mail address, much as my home address belongs to me.
Therefore I decide what I will or will not allow in both places, clearly 
contingent on politeness and respect.

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Re: OK. Time for some understanding.

[Karen Lewellen]

Mr. Cohn,
Did you ask me on list for permission to write me privately before posting 
your  on list misstatements about my computing?

no.
I have no idea if your message was polite or not, I did not read  it since 
it came without respecting  me or my inbox.
Your choosing to send communications without permission, after your on 
list 
behavior meant that the message was mine to do with as I wished..share it 
where  it belonged.
Further I directed here, as I tend to direct in general, individuals to 
the w3c.  their web access initiative  drafts wacg 2.0 etc.  Their take on 
captcha is far more important for those seeking to navigate them than 
anything I  personally choose.  I suggest you consult their varied 
resources if you  wish to understand why I am apposed to them.
 As you still feel  slighted after violating the integrity of my inbox 
with a private 
unsolicited e-mail  after already making public comments, I will not 
expect you, nor ask you to apologize for that.  Had you not wanted your e-mail 
whatever it said shared, then your conduct should have been most different 
indeed in my opinion.
there is nothing further of benefit for this list regarding your efforts, 
and I have zero interest in engaging with you privately based on your 
illustrated lack of respect for me publicly.

I suggest you move on,



On Sun, 13 May 2018, Jonathan Cohn wrote:


Karen,

Since we are neither talking Macintosh or low vision access at this point,
the conversation is pretty much off topic. I was trying to understand your
point of view and attempting to ask you to help me appreciate why you have
on multiple times on multiple mailing lists gotten very defensive about the
web practice of using Captcha.


Your forwarding of my fairly polite personal message to the list was I
believe inappropriate, but I will not ask for an apology.

I do apologize for specifically calling you out as somebody who is not a
person who has taken the Apple kool-aid. (Smile ) I do sincerely want to
indicate no harm was intended toward you so I had trouble determining how
to write this on a public forum that is searchable by billions of people.


On Sat, May 12, 2018 at 11:04 PM Karen Lewellen 
wrote:


  Mr. Cohn,
The desire for understanding tends to be expressed prior to assumptions.
I have no desire nor inclination to satisfy your interest.
I dare say, since the list is where you started, this note was intended
for
there.  I certainly did not express a wish to hear from  you privately.



On Sat, 12 May 2018, Jonathan Cohn wrote:


  Hello Ms. Lewellen,

I use the Surname here in mirror to your remarks to me on the

MacVisionaries mailing list.  My memory of your web browser of choice
isLynx. I am not aware if this is your only browser and if the reason you
use it is directly related to any disability. I do have the personal view
that properly designed ARIA widgets that use Javascript to modify the DOM
have made my access to complex web sites significantly easier.  I used Lynx
briefly, but found myself leaning more toward using commercial screen
readers and standard web browsers as my vision decreased and support for
IBM's wonderful self voicing web browser disappeared.


Perhaps I mistaken about your web browsers of choice or perhaps I have

not understood why somebody would use Lynx for day to day browsing. A
Significant number of sites I visit and for that matter the systems I check
accessibility on professionally do not progressively degrade to a non
JavaScript environment and while 10 years ago I would often disable
JavaScript and Java plugins because of security concerns, today current
sandboxing technologies boast my confidence in the ability of browsers to
be more secure.


If you would like to provide feedback to the above thoughts I will

consider it carefully and use it to help my future design decisions.


Thanks for keeping the fires burning, I know you have done a lot for the

accessibility community.


Warmly,



Jonathan Cohn







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For more options, 

Re: Verification Schemes

[alia robinson]

LOL, this is the funniest thing I have ever read in my life!if you put out your 
email address to a public list you can be contacted by whomever whenever. you 
can choose to respond or not, yes, but just like junkmail at your home you are 
not afforded the ability to pick who contacts you. if your email out there it’s 
out there. if you don’t want anyone to know it get off public lists. you’re 
just like those people on twitter who put out public tweets then complain when 
people respond and say you weren’t talking to them. I for one pray you all take 
this private because it’s ridiculous.
On May 13, 2018, at 1:38 PM, Karen Lewellen  wrote:

I am afraid I am clueless as to your meaning.
My e-mail address, much as my home address belongs to me.
Therefore I decide what I will or will not allow in both places, clearly 
contingent on politeness and respect.

-- 
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Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
caraqu...@caraquinn.com

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Re: Verification Schemes

[Karen Lewellen]

I am afraid I am clueless as to your meaning.
My e-mail address, much as my home address belongs to me.
Therefore I decide what I will or will not allow in both places, clearly 
contingent on politeness and respect.
Speaking only for myself, such courtesy  where e-mail is concerned  begins 
with a public request to contact privately.
You did not do this.  Nor did mr. Cohn.  In your case, if my further 
fortifying a general thread was an issue for you personally, you need only 
ignore my post and answer  those directly important to your individual 
computing needs.  Since you are continuing to comment I am left to wonder 
just who cannot take whatever is intended.  Offense is a choice one I 
rarely indulge.
I did so in mr. Con's case because he made public statements about my 
computing  which had no baring on the thread, let alone little basics in 
fact...then he presumed I would have  a reason to communicate with him 
privately.  Without asking, and after  assuming in public.
I do not know Mr. Cohn, and would certainly not take such liberties 
were our  situations   reverse.
There is nothing for me to take, and if you have the list in mind, may I 
respectfully suggest you focus on your personal needs, without commenting 
on  what others can  or cannot take privately, otherwise, or whatsoever?

Just a thought,


On Sat, 12 May 2018, E.T. wrote:

  Look Karen, we are not here to stir the pot. If you can't take it private, 
too bad but spare the rest of the group. (smiles)


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  ancient.ali...@icloud.com
Many believe that we have been visited
in the past. What if it were true?

On 5/12/2018 8:57 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote:

 This is a list of one?
 My reply was to Eric's comment,  consider the concept of rule number
 6..do not   take things so personally.  At least unless unwelcome
 communications sent privately etc. smiles.



 On Sat, 12 May 2018, E.T. wrote:

>    Karen, consider the fact that we all want better accessibility. As 
>  you made clear, you are not me so if you cannot assist me in a 
>  forthright manner, please do not try so hard.
> 
>  From E.T.'s Keyboard...

>    ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>  Many believe that we have been visited
>  in the past. What if it were true?
> 
>  On 5/12/2018 8:08 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote:

> >   Consider as well the problem for those who do not read English.
> >   They are a mess for many, hands down.
> > 
> > 
> >   On Sat, 12 May 2018, Eric Oyen wrote:
> > 
> > >   hey E.T.,
> > >   Captcha is a big problem for far more than just us blind folks 
> >  (although >  we probably notice it far more and far faster). There 
> >  are some who have >  other print related disabilities that would make 
> >  Captcha solving a >  nightmare. There are also those who are 
> >  colorblind (both the red-green >  and the far rarer monochromatic 
> >  type) and some of the images would not >  make any sense.
> > > >   Now, I had a very big problem with dyslexia before I became 
> >  blind and I >  know for certain that it would have caused me no end 
> >  of trouble >  (squiggly lines in among other squiggly lines 
> >  supposedly mimicking >  letters would be highly confusing).  So, 
> >  this problem is not strictly >  one that exclusively targets the 
> >  blind. Like I said upstairs, we just >  notice it a lot faster.

> > > >   -eric
> > > >   PGP fingerprint: 6DFB D6B0 3771 90F1 373E 570C 7EA2 1FF3 6B68 
> > > > 0386

> > > >   On May 12, 2018, at 4:35 PM, E.T. wrote:
> > > > >     Whups. (smiles) Let's get back on track here, Karen. Let's 
> >  take a > >  more practical approach to this issue as blind/visually 
> >  impaired > >  users. Like Captcha Be Gone, or Rumola. If I am not 
> >  mistaken, neither > >  of these will handle what I believe are known 
> >  as re-Captcha. Are you > >  aware of any blind friendly solutions?

> > > > > >   From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> > > >     ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> > > >   Many believe that we have been visited
> > > >   in the past. What if it were true?
> > > > > >   On 5/12/2018 3:21 PM, Karen Lewellen wrote:
> > > > >   Mr. Cohn,
> > > > >   may I ask what makes you an expert on my computing, to the 
> > point > > >   that you would call  me out in this thread?
> > > > >   I make my  living professionally using computers as a part of 
> > my > > >   work.
> > > > >   I have no issues getting the job done, but this is how I 
> > compute > > >   rooted in many factors.
> > > > >   If I do not suggest everyone should use computers as I do, why 
> >  do > > >  you feel justified in judging how I use them, never having 
> >  met me, > > >  not paying my salary, nor last time I checked living 
> >  my physical > > >  experience?
> > > > > > >   On May 12, 2018, at 5:06 PM, Jonathan Cohn > > > > > 
> >   wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > >   The Google authenticator right now is the 
> >  checkbox labeled I am > > > > >  not a bot. I have had luck with JAWS 
> >  and NVDA and VoiceOver with > > > 

Re: OK. Time for some understanding.

[Jonathan Cohn]

Karen,

Since we are neither talking Macintosh or low vision access at this point,
the conversation is pretty much off topic. I was trying to understand your
point of view and attempting to ask you to help me appreciate why you have
on multiple times on multiple mailing lists gotten very defensive about the
web practice of using Captcha.


 Your forwarding of my fairly polite personal message to the list was I
believe inappropriate, but I will not ask for an apology.

I do apologize for specifically calling you out as somebody who is not a
person who has taken the Apple kool-aid. (Smile ) I do sincerely want to
indicate no harm was intended toward you so I had trouble determining how
to write this on a public forum that is searchable by billions of people.


On Sat, May 12, 2018 at 11:04 PM Karen Lewellen 
wrote:

>   Mr. Cohn,
> The desire for understanding tends to be expressed prior to assumptions.
> I have no desire nor inclination to satisfy your interest.
> I dare say, since the list is where you started, this note was intended
> for
> there.  I certainly did not express a wish to hear from  you privately.
>
>
>
> On Sat, 12 May 2018, Jonathan Cohn wrote:
>
> >   Hello Ms. Lewellen,
> >
> > I use the Surname here in mirror to your remarks to me on the
> MacVisionaries mailing list.  My memory of your web browser of choice
> isLynx. I am not aware if this is your only browser and if the reason you
> use it is directly related to any disability. I do have the personal view
> that properly designed ARIA widgets that use Javascript to modify the DOM
> have made my access to complex web sites significantly easier.  I used Lynx
> briefly, but found myself leaning more toward using commercial screen
> readers and standard web browsers as my vision decreased and support for
> IBM's wonderful self voicing web browser disappeared.
> >
> > Perhaps I mistaken about your web browsers of choice or perhaps I have
> not understood why somebody would use Lynx for day to day browsing. A
> Significant number of sites I visit and for that matter the systems I check
> accessibility on professionally do not progressively degrade to a non
> JavaScript environment and while 10 years ago I would often disable
> JavaScript and Java plugins because of security concerns, today current
> sandboxing technologies boast my confidence in the ability of browsers to
> be more secure.
> >
> > If you would like to provide feedback to the above thoughts I will
> consider it carefully and use it to help my future design decisions.
> >
> > Thanks for keeping the fires burning, I know you have done a lot for the
> accessibility community.
> >
> > Warmly,
> >
> >
> >
> > Jonathan Cohn
> >
> >
> >
>

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list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  
mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
caraqu...@caraquinn.com

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RE: TO upgrade, or to change platforms entirelyWWYDWhat would you do?

[Simon Fogarty]

Why not do it your self?

 The hdd isn't easy but it can be done.

Ram is so simple you'd be crazy not to do it yourself.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
Behalf Of Steve Matzura
Sent: Sunday, 13 May 2018 3:09 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: TO upgrade, or to change platforms entirelyWWYDWhat would you do?

I was thinking of doing that, but with the proliferation of computer repair 
joints, I don't know how I'd figure out which ones are reputable and which are 
not. I'm already thinking about where to go to have this stuff done. There's 
actually a place right down the street  from me that sells Apple stuff, but 
they're not an Apple Store store. I know that sounds gramatically in error, but 
you know what I mean I'm sure. I'm going to give them a call first to find out 
if they'll handle the third-party hardware aspect of this upgrade.


And thanks in advance for the research.


On 5/12/2018 3:54 AM, Nickus de Vos wrote:
> Hi Steve
> I’ll do some research on parts for your Mini and get back to you in a few 
> hours.
>
> Just one thing, if you want Apple to do the upgrade for you, as far as I know 
> they won’t allow you to buy your own SSD and RAM. They will quote you on 
> their parts and installation, even if the same parts you wanted to buy in the 
> first place, it will be a lot more expensive going threw Apple.
> If you want to buy your own parts you’ll have to get a third party shop to do 
> the installation for you. Ask around your area, usually there are a lot of 
> third party computer places willing and able to work on Apple hardware as 
> well at much better prices.
>
> Nick
>
>
>> On 12 May 2018, at 03:51, Steve Matzura  wrote:
>>
>> Nick,
>>
>>
>> If a new Mini is on the near horizon, then I can hold my breath and see what 
>> it's like when it arrives. But a disk upgrade could always be useful, even 
>> if I buy the new Mini later.
>>
>>
>> Re upgrading, memory and SSD are the highest of priorities. I already have 
>> my eyes on solutions for the disk. I don't think I'd want to waste one of 
>> four USB ports for a boot device, though, except if it was just for 
>> short-term testing and setup. I'm thinking of paying Apple the dollars, 
>> about a hundred fifty of them, to swap the drive and double the memory for 
>> me (plus parts, of course). I just have to obtain the correct sticks, as you 
>> say. Any advanced info before searching for info thereon would be most 
>> appreciated.
>>
>>
>> Re the external MyBook with TM backups and samples on it, the samples and 
>> other music production library stuff is all 100% duplicated on a drive on a 
>> Windows machine, and even if that breaks, it can all be re-downloaded from 
>> the sites from which it was purchased. Once the SSD is installed in the 
>> Mini, that data gets moved there, giving the whole 3TB MyBook drive over to 
>> TM.
>>
>> About the Mac Pro, I think I'm off that idea for good, and not just because 
>> of your explanation. Yes, the ones I'm seeing on eBay are 2013 build models, 
>> therefore not upgradable. But with eight cores and 32GB memory, I don't 
>> think any upgrading would even be necessary, with the exception of swapping 
>> the internal drive it comes with for an SSD. What kind of killed the whole 
>> idea for me is that I think these machines only have SATA2 interfaces.
>>
>> So let's talk more about booting from a USB-connected SSD. The 
>> specifications really say it all. Have you any recommendations for an 
>> adapter, caddy or enclosure for a SATA3 SSD? I don't really need one of 
>> those big three-and-a-half-inch enclosures, and I've never met one I really 
>> liked anyway. When I buy the SSD, I'll of course buy the two-and-a-half-inch 
>> form factor unit that will fit into the Mini, but I'd like to set it up and 
>> test with it before taking the Mini in for the permanent transplant, which 
>> is why I'd want the enclosure or adapter.
>>
>> Other than that, I don't think there are any other considerations to ponder 
>> before starting to order parts and make appointments to have the surgery 
>> done.
>>
>> On 5/11/2018 4:11 AM, Nickus de Vos wrote:
>>> Hi Steve
>>> Firstly when talking Mac Pro I presume you are referring to the cheese 
>>> grater, since that’s the only Mac Pro which is upgradable, the newer 
>>> trashcan isn’t at all upgradable when it comes to drives and RAM.
>>> The last cheese grater is already older than your current 2012 Mac Mini, 
>>> without some hacking the last model cheese grater can for example not run 
>>> High Sierra where your Mini is still officially supported. The other 
>>> problem with the cheese grater is the wifi and bluetooth on it which can’t 
>>> be upgraded very easily, same with the USB-2.
>>>
>>> I saw a post on another platform the other day of a guy who upgraded a 
>>> cheese grater, it took him a lot of tinkering and hacking, a lot of 
>>> searching